Agave: 1-S2-1-6562611

[luffy123]

Account Name: Agave
Account ID: 1-S2-1-6562611
In-Game Name: Zuji Lijaro

Crimes Committed: Game-Throw

Your Account Name: Luffy
Summary: At the end of the game, it was clear who the town was, as I was BD and left my lw and other BD had bussed him twice. However he proceeded to skip the day then lecture the other player on manners the following night-Mafia- (170).SC2Replay

[IronMax]

Account Name: Agave
Account ID: 1-S2-1-6562611
In-Game Name: Zuqi Lijaro

Crimes Committed: Gamethrowing

Your Account Name: max
Summary:

He got jailor and executed randomly three nights in a row until he was out of executions.
He asks people questions like "what was beethovens only opera" and kills them when they don't answer correctly, no matter what their role is (not only in this game).

D5 only him, BD and SK were alive. The BD was confirmed and had swapped the jailor twice in a row, so Agave knew who the SK was.
He still voted up the BD (to troll) and even though he voted innocent, he refused to vote the SK up and skipped the day instead to "spice things up".
SK killed jailor, town lost.

maf.SC2Replay

[AIVION]

SC ID VERIFICATION

Agave: Correct. 1-S2-1-6562611

Respective Hotkeys
2

Was the Game Result altered?
Yes, the Town could of easily won this game if he chose to lynch the SK instead of leaving it to chance.

Previous Offenses
Lag Cheating (WL X3): https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...-s2-1-6562611; Griefing (WL x2): https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...-S2-1-6562611; Intentional Game-Throwing (Appealed): https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...1-S2-1-6562611

Player Offenses
Griefing

Summary
The game begins with 15(Agave) rolling jailor and choosing to jail 13.

Night 1: He asks 13 "Which French Monarch was also called "Sun King?" He answers correctly and then asks him what role he claims. 13 claims doc. He executes 13 based off his claim.

Day 2: 5 was killed by the SK and flips Judge. 12 was killed by the mafia and flips sheriff. 13 flips Kidnapper. 14 starts the day off by claiming lookout and saying 11 visited 12, accusing him of being the godfather. the town says "80% exe. Skip." And 11 claims 14 to be an exe as well. The day ends with no lynch and 15 choosing to jail 3.

Night 2: He asks "Which Island was Napoleon Bonaparte Exiled to in 1814." He doesn't answer this and claims investigator with his lw. He executes him "Because the answer was wrong." This, in my honest opinion, is toxic jailor behavior... +1 Griefing point.
Day 3: 6 was killed by the SK and flips Mayor. 11 was killed by the mafia and flips doctor. 3 ends up flipping Consigliere (Still doesn't excuse the way he went about executing him.) 7 claims to be vig and shot at 14. 14 claims 8 is evil and mafia. The day ends with a No Lynch and 15 choosing to jail 1.

Night 3: 15 asks "Name Beethovens only opera!" 1 claims Crier and says the crier isn't talking for a reason. He executes saying "That's Wrong. It's Fidelio of course." Again, toxic Jailor behavior. 1 even has a good role claim and proof of his role. +2 Griefing points.

Day 4: 7 was killed by the Mafia and flips Vigilante. 14 was shot by a vigilante and flips Jester. 1 flips Crier... 2 was killed by the SK and flips Sheriff. 15 then claims jailor and says he's siding with the SK. They vote up 10 who claims Bodyguard. he's pardoned on a 2-2 vote. 8 is then voted up and claims BD with a solid LW. he is pardoned on a 2-1 vote. they vote up 9 based on his voting patterns. 9 claims nothing. he is lynched on a 2-1 vote. no last words: he flips Godfather.

Day 5: 4 was killed by the sk and flips Bus Driver. 8 is immediately voted up. He claims to of swapped 15 twice in a row (True.) As his defense. He claims to of not been swapped, but votes innocent. he is pardoned on a 1-1 vote. 8 threatens to report 15. He says "Are you threatening me?" 8 responds and then 15 says "Okay, I see. Let's spice things up." And votes to skip.

In the end, 15 was killed and the Serial Killer won.


Conclusion: As you can see, Agave is a toxic individual in his Jailor tactics... his first jail seems legit if you looked past his Question. A doctor claim is an easy n1 execute. A lot of players would say they'd do the same. However, his last two were incredibly random in nature due to his nonsensual questions. People don't play Mafia to answer trivia, and deciding executes based off this is Griefing behavior to me.
Near the end with his refusal to lynch the sk doesn't exactly stem off of Game-throwing, but of Griefing as well. 8 was toxic towards his choice to vote him up. From any standpoint it looked like 15 genuinely forgot that he was a bus driver, despite his "I was never switched, guilty." 8 saying he'd report him triggered him in some way, which lead to him skipping. Wether this should be considered Game-throwing Behavior or Griefing behavoir is up to the Warden... but my vote stays on him Griefing this game, and Griefing hard.

Recommended Action
Watch ListX4

Additional Notes
Thank you for the reports! In the end I believe this is a clear example of Griefing, as stated in my conclusion. This isn't his first offense in Griefing, and the fact he has a Lag Cheating report also stapled to him brings me to recommending him be put on the Watch List for X4.

[nopro]

1-S2-1-6562611 6x Watchlist

His european account already got permabanned: https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ighlight=bernd

[ArtfulDodger]

Dont forget about these, NoPro:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...-2-S2-1-469953
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...2-S2-1-1274793


Edit: I dont see why you would 6x watchlist. Considering that punishments from EU dont transfer to NA, theres no apparent reason to punish me harder than suggested.

Appeal please.

[nopro]

I put you on 6x watchlist for your previous offenses on the NA account.

[ArtfulDodger]

I would still like to lodge an appeal.
The point being is that my "toxic jailor tactics", as AIVION called it and uses as a reason to increase the (recommended) punishment, is actually not griefing as he describes it to be. As you can see in the replay, Im carefully picking my targets based on chat behavior and voting patterns and whether it matches their names. For example, a guy called "I FUCK YOUR MOM YOU MODSCUM" is very suspicious if he doesnt talk, yet is eager to make the last vote to put somebody to trial. Those are the kind of people I jail and execute. The trivia questions are just for the lulz, Ive usually already decided to execute them before the night begins, unless they have a very good claim.

As for the SK win/Town loss, Im guilty as charged. I just cant resist triggering rude juveniles who think they can threaten me with reports. Its a bad habit, I suppose.

[AIVION]

I'm sorry, but I never actually stated that your punishment should be increased because of your Jailor tactics? I only stated they were toxic and shouldn't be used to decide executions. You're claiming you choose your targets wisely, This I can believe after looking through the replay. You'll have to excuse me here, since this replay isn't the only time you've done your same jailor act. There was a time you did it and executed 3 townies in a row (I was one of these townies) To alot of people this seems random.

Oh but no, you're on the watchlist for the "SK Win/Town loss." Mostly... the fact you're admitting to being "Guilty as charged." Only gives your appeal less value.

[ArtfulDodger]

Then what exactly do you mean by "Griefing points", how do they influence your recommended punishment and if they dont, why do you use that phrase at all?

[DarknessB]

Two points:

1. As AIVION has stated, you are really being punished for the intentional game-throw at the end, for which you admit guilt. You should be playing to win the game, not to trigger people who threaten to report you. Sure, it's not great manners to start threatening people in a LYLO situation with a game report, but you have yourself have strongly suggested (at best) and overtly admitted (at worst) that you threw this game on purpose because you were angry at a report being threatened against you. If anything, this could result in an increased punishment given intentional game-throwing carries a more severe punishment than griefing does.

2. I can't speak for AIVION, but I am assuming he processed this report in chronological order of what happened in the game. The game looks far more like griefing with the Jailor executes (you yourself admit to executing certain players based on their wrong answers and other self-confirmable players) up until the point where you intentionally game-throw at the end. It's somewhat hard for us to believe you had some strategy behind the scenes when you are literally telling players the opposite thing.

If I had processed this report in the first instance, I would have probably found you guilty of intentional game-throwing for what happened at the end of the game. For those reasons, I am denying this appeal unless you insist that we review again, but in that case, we would very likely up this to an intentional game-throw which would carry a ban list punishment given your extensive prior record. In my opinion, you got off lightly with just an extended watch list given what happened at the end of the game.

[Cryptonic]

Someone will review the replay again and give a proper appeal.

[DarknessB]

I am going to let someone else review this appeal to avoid the appearance of bias given the personal attack by Agave above.

[Lysergic]

Artful, stop attacking Darkness. If you repost that shit again, I'm going to 24 hour ban you. I will audit this tomorrow.

[ArtfulDodger]

Yes, sorry for attacking the Maifa Wiki Admin DarknessB, I genuinely regret it. Let me do it the good old fruity way and say I was just too high to take responsibility for my actions on the forums.

Edit: Of course his "title" magically changed to "Mafia Wiki Admin" within minutes :3

Second Edit: Since Lysergic took the liberty to scramble the letters of DarknessBs title in my original post, saying that he wanted to "fix it for me", I had to make sure the original wording is preserved. Thanks for the effort anyway, kind Sir.

[Lysergic]

In review.

[Lysergic]

Agave (1-S2-1-65562611) prefers Executioner, Jester, and Jailor at game start. He names himself Zuqi Lijaro and flips Jailor.

D1 (troll day) he jails 13, who is trolling a bit in day chat.

N1, jail chat is as follows:

Agave: Good evening, Sir. Which French monarch was also called "Sun King"?
13: ayy
13: louis the 14th
Agave: Very good!
Agave: So, what role do you claim?
13: doc
Agave: Doc is just too easy to claim.
Agave: And we both know it.
Agave: Whats your real role?
13: well thats my role
Agave: I dont think so.
Jailor will execute Randyll Tarly.

13 flips Kidnapper.

In day chat the next day, Agave pushes against a lynch on an early lead claim because "80% exe." A train begins based on the lead; Agave picks a jail target from that train.

Night 2 begins with 3 in jail.

Agave: Good evening, Sir. Which island was Napoleon Bonaparte exiled to in 1814?
3: invest
Agave: Is that your final answer?
3: yes
Agave: Okay then.
Agave: Sorry, its wrong.

At this point, I'd just like to mention that anyone who passed high school history should know the correct answer is Elba.

Agave: The right answer is Elba, of course.
Jailor will execute Cristiano the Trustworthy.
3: im invest
3: n1 14 nc

3 flips Consigliere. At day start, several people point out that the lead from yesterday was bullshit, that 14 (who gave the lead) was night immune according to Vigi claimer, and that he is likely now Jester given that his Exe target died. Some people, including 1, continue to push for a lynch on 14. Agave jails 1 after pointing this out. After this is pointed out, 1 switches and tried to push a lynch on the person claiming Vigi.

Night begins, and so does trivia.

Agave: Good evening, Sir. Name Beethovens only opera!
1: hi
1: im crier
Agave: Is that your final answer?
1: yes
1: is the price right
Agave: Thats wrong.
1: crkier isnt talking for a reason
Agave: It was Fidelio, of course.
1: im crier
1: >>
Jailor will execute Lord Helix.
1: ur jailing the only gov
1: failor

Agave is swapped by Bus Driver on this night.
At day start, he claims Jailor, says he is out of executions, and says who he executed. He does this before role flips, essentially confirming himself when 1's flip comes up.

At this point, there are 5 players alive:
Jailor (Agave), Bus Driver, SK, Bus Driver, and GF.

In day chat, Agave says "So, town lost anyway. Im siding with the SK."
He briefly argues with a Bus Driver about this, but then the SK randomly says "hi im bob" and gets trialed.
On trial, he claims Bodyguard. He is inno'd. The Bus Driver who swapped Agave is put up next and inno'd when his last will confirms him. 9, the GF, has been guiltying everyone, so he is lynched. The Bus Driver who swapped Agave asks for the other Bus to swap him in order to confirm.

That night, 4, the unconfirmed Bus, is killed by SK.

This leaves Agave, the confirmed Bus Driver (who swapped Agave twice), and the SK (who claimed Bodyguard).

Agave votes up the Bus Driver. On trial, the Bus Driver reminds him that he swapped Agave twice. Agave states "Ive never been swapped. Guilty." He then votes inno. The Bus Driver threatens to report him, so he gets mad and skips so that he can "spice things up."

He changes his last will to "I don't take shit from you 8 "

He also does not take a jail target. That night, SK kills him. He says in dead chat, "Looks like 8 chose wrong." Town loses.

So my thoughts then:

First of all, if the replay had ended before the final day, I would have said that Agave played magnificently. The whole trivia thing is clearly a bit of light trolling (NOT griefing as others have said). He simply uses his reads to select good targets and then executes regardless. The trivia thing is a way to make it more fun.

However, the game instead ended with Agave blatantly game throwing, a fact that he admits to in this very thread.

As such, I would like to amend the recommended punishment, given Agave's history (permabanned on EU, previous Watch List for both Lag Cheating and Griefing). I recommend Banlist x2. Note that this is still a fairly lenient punishment given his history. I recommend only a Banlist x2 instead of something more serious like an x4 or perma because the game throw was reactionary.

ArtfulDodger, given that you've been peramabanned on EU and watch listed several times, you ought to know better. Doesn't matter if you're "playing with noobs" - in this situation, you're the reason town lost. Without you, it would have been a certain win. I hope you make better choices in the future.

[Arrow]

1-S2-1-6562611: 2x Banlist

[ArtfulDodger]

Now that was a good review. Thank you very much, Lysergic.