Are you ready for Bernie Sanders?

[BananaCucho]

I sure as hell am. I was considering voting for a third party candidate this go around (and realistically probably still will if Hillary wins the democratic nomination), until I started looking into Bernie. I said in the other Clinton/Bush thread that I wouldn't support either of those candidates, and want another viable option instead. Bernie is that option. I have hope that he can pull it off.

Are you ready for a Sanders presidency? What are your thoughts on his ideas?

https://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/...n-in-four-days

https://www.sanders.senate.gov/agenda/

[bwcPorscha]

Didn't look at your links, but from what I've seen of his ideals in other places, I'm highly interested in considering him for this election as well.

[Bruno]

ye bernie is op

[Brendan]

tl;dr
make weed legal and cut military budget thank you future president

[bwcPorscha]

doing only those 2 things would make us so much money. lol

[Orpz]

bernie's got me hooked with the free college idea. my nigga

Realistically, I'm expecting the country to commit political suicide in 2016 instead.

[Brendan]

college is an industry in this country and bernie is never going to be elected if he goes into his campaign with that idea. I imagine student loans generate most of the revenue for banks.

[Orpz]

college is an industry in this country and bernie is never going to be elected if he goes into his campaign with that idea. I imagine student loans generate most of the revenue for banks.

Yeah you're right. Still, he has his heart in the right place

[Mugy]

Never vote third party. >.>

[BananaCucho]

Never vote third party. >.>

The two parties are bought. Billionaires control the establishment and choose the candidates for us to choose between.

[AppleyNO]

Never vote third party. >.>

Not until we fix our broken fucking system to halt the spoiler effect in voting.

[Mugy]

The two parties are bought. Billionaires control the establishment and choose the candidates for us to choose between.

Not until we fix our broken fucking system to halt the spoiler effect in voting.

This.
Voting 3rd party is basically a vote for the party you least like. Heck, the republicans are probably funding the greens because the republicans aren't stupid.

[DarknessB]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAT_BuJAI70

This.
Voting 3rd party is basically a vote for the party you least like. Heck, the republicans are probably funding the greens because the republicans aren't stupid.

[BananaCucho]

This.
Voting 3rd party is basically a vote for the party you least like. Heck, the republicans are probably funding the greens because the republicans aren't stupid.

I don't like either party.

[Cryptonic]

two party system is flawed

[BananaCucho]

two party system is flawed

Yessir. Bernie is an independent. He's running as a democrat so he can participate in the debates

[Cryptonic]

Yea, Bernie is pretty awesome, and I'm not even American

[Bunny]

I heard they were bringing the colenol back to the restaraunts, I didn't know his name was Bernie though!

[thedougler]

smh at all of the full blown commies in here. Did nobody here actually read Mr. Sanders' twelve points? Let's take another look, shall we?

☭ Agenda for Amerika ☭
☭ 12 Steps Forward, Comrades, and not one step back! ☭

1. Rebuilding Our Already Adequate Infrastructure by Condemning Future Generations to Indentured Servitude Through Massive Borrowing
2. dust off the hackneyed climate hoax routine ("b-but... muh icecaps!")
3. Creating Worker C̶o̶-̶o̶p̶s̶ Communes
4. Growing the Trade Union Movement (no edit required, the communism is strong with this one)
5. ̶R̶a̶i̶s̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶M̶i̶n̶i̶m̶u̶m̶ ̶W̶a̶g̶e̶ Raising the Cost of Living Through INFLATION to a Commensurate Level With The Minimum Wage Hike AKA Leftist Economic Illiteracy
6. Pay Equity for Women Workers (srsly why aren't they in the kitchen?)
7. Trade Policies that Benefit American Workers... and pass the costs of high tariffs on imports onto the unsuspecting American consumer
8. Making Liberal Arts Educations Affordable for All And Even More DUMBED DOWN and WORTHLESS
9. Taking on Wall Street, the last bastion of America's dying spirit of entrepreneurship and individualism.
10. SOCIALIZED Health Care as a Right for All and as a reality for none. Ready yourself for the queues, waitlists, and GOVERNMENT EUTHANASIA PANELS. Because we should all trust BIG BROTHER to know when to pull the plug on grandma.
11. All Americans are Equal, but some Americans are more Equal than others
12. SOCIALIST Tax Reform, Militarizing the IRS, 100% top income tax brackets. Spread the wealth around, comrade! You didn't build that!

[BananaCucho]

I stopped reading once you put forth doubt in climate change. I can't take anyone who disregards blatant scientific evidence seriously in the political venue. The only ones who stand to gain from making people blindly deny human caused climate change are the multi billion dollar oil companies who don't want to lose their profit at the expense of the planet.

[Frog]

I find executive branch platforms as hilarious as they are pointless.

Remember... the president doesn't control the legislative branch. You know... where laws are created on those issues that 'mean so much' to you.

[SparkNuts]

I find executive branch platforms as hilarious as they are pointless.

Remember... the president doesn't control the legislative branch. You know... where laws are created on those issues that 'mean so much' to you.

This so much.

[BananaCucho]

I find executive branch platforms as hilarious as they are pointless.

Remember... the president doesn't control the legislative branch. You know... where laws are created on those issues that 'mean so much' to you.

Yes the president doesn't write the laws but he has power to sign into law things he agrees with and veto those he doesn't. One man can stop a destructive law that the lawmakers want to force down our throats. That's a pretty big deal.

Not to mention foreign affairs. Remember Bush Jr?

[DarknessB]

Even further than that, Presidents (their staff at least) often coordinate closely with Congress on the creation of legislation, especially regarding non-controversial laws and when the same party controls Congress and the White House. Unless you're trying to make a political point (which sadly happens too often), it's very much necessary to get the President's input if you want a bill to be ultimately signed into law. Overriding a presidential veto is almost unheard of these days given the close division of power between the two parties -- no party has anywhere near a veto-proof majority and the president's party usually is very hesitant to embarrass him by helping to override a veto.

Also, don't forget that the executive branches ENFORCES the laws of the country -- that's the point of the alphabet soup of administrative agencies. It would be logistically impossible for Congress to write up every tiny detail regarding health care, for example, so when most laws get passed, they typically focus on the big picture. In turn, they contain provisions delegating authority to the executive branch's administrative agencies, which in turn promulgate regulations (the nuts and bolts that affect us). That's the real impact of the executive branch -- controlling the "administrative state", which has far more power than Congress does in terms of day-to-day matters which affect our lives.

TLDR -- Signing bills into law is important, but don't forget that the President is in charge of an entire branch of government which regulates countless aspects of daily behavior. I'd be far more worried, for example, about EPA regulations being weakened, under an excessively pro-industry president, than I would about passing new laws.

Yes the president doesn't write the laws but he has power to sign into law things he agrees with and veto those he doesn't. One man can stop a destructive law that the lawmakers want to force down our throats. That's a pretty big deal.

[SparkNuts]

Allowing the executive branch to get creative with how they enforce the laws is a very dangerous and slippery road to take. So is allowing agencies who were never voted on to have the power to regulate every aspect of our lives.

[DarknessB]

That may be (and there are plenty of critiques of the administrative state), but that's how the system works today, regardless of political party. This goes all the way back to FDR's New Deal when a large number of administrative agencies were put into place in order to help the country get out of the Depression with government spending / stimulus. It's not so much the executive branch being creative -- it's just the reality that the United States is a large and complicated country, and it's not at all feasible for Congress to be debating every single small issue, as opposed to delegating issues to government officials who are far more specialized and knowledgeable about a specific issue (like energy or health care or the environment, etc.)

Also, if it makes you feel better, think of it this way -- when you vote for the President, you're also voting for that President's vision of how the country's laws should be executed and what regulations should be put into place (or repealed) by that President's administrative agencies. Finally, there are many important positions in our government which are also not directly elected -- federal judges, for example, who are nominated by the President and approved by Congress. That's simply the nature of being a representative rather than a direct democracy.

Allowing the executive branch to get creative with how they enforce the laws is a very dangerous and slippery road to take. So is allowing agencies who were never voted on to have the power to regulate every aspect of our lives.

[SparkNuts]

It's not so much the executive branch being creative -- it's just the reality that the United States is a large and complicated country, and it's not at all feasible for Congress to be debating every single small issue.

This is why i'm a big advocate of individual state governments over one massive bloated federal government. Each state knows what is needed and how to run their own state much better then some bureaucrat in dc.

[DarknessB]

I think that's a completely defensible position and the major critique of the administrative state. Federal power has continuously grown over time and there's a fierce debate whether this is a good thing or not. Libertarians like yourself would clear think that it is not. Personally, I'm somewhere in the middle -- I think it's far too complicated for there to be a simple good or bad answer.

This is why i'm a big advocate of individual state governments over one massive bloated federal government. Each state knows what is needed and how to run their own state much better then some bureaucrat in dc.

[BananaCucho]

Thoughts from you two on Bernie Sanders in particular plz

[DarknessB]

Bernie Sanders isn't running for President to win -- practically speaking, he knows there's virtually no chance that he even gets the nomination given Hillary Clinton's dominant name-brand recognition. It also doesn't help Bernie's chances that he is technically an independent (albeit one who caucuses with Democrats in the Senate) and from a small state with comparatively limited influence -- i.e. he doesn't naturally have access to a fundraising machine or a large voter base.

Bernie's real function is going to be to force Hillary to embrace issues to the left of what she would normally be comfortable with (either in terms of personal beliefs or electability). Essentially, the hope is that Bernie forces Hillary to take more risks / make more interesting promises during the primary process so that she can be a more progressive candidate overall. One of the reason some Democrats are hesitant about Hillary is that she has a lot of ties to big business (for Democratic standards at least) -- Bernie is far more of an egalitarian, even socialist candidate (by his own admission), so he can force Hillary to be more populist than she would want to. If Hillary starts doing that in response to Bernie, then it will be difficult for her to flip flop later (for fear of losing credibility with the voters).

The cynical side of all this is as follows: the Republicans are actually eager for Bernie to give Hillary a strong primary challenge because it will force her to adopt more controversial positions that might not be as popular with the general electorate as they are with Democratic primary voters. In other words, Hillary has a very delicate balancing act if Bernie's candidacy picks up.

Thoughts from you two on Bernie Sanders in particular plz

[SparkNuts]

Well i'm a libertarian and he is basically the exact opposite of what I think we need. At least as far as third party candidates are concerned.

[Bruno]

Yay libertarians, wish we had a libertarian government.

No snow plows. No police and/or fire departments. People would starve to death thanks to no "hand outs"

A true American ideology

[Brendan]

Yay libertarians, wish we had a libertarian government.

No snow plows. No police and/or fire departments. People would starve to death thanks to no "hand outs"

A true American ideology

hnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnngh