S-FM 209: Surreptitious: The Game of Spies

[Titus]

.. that awkward moment when your mafia list consists of all towns...

I did that once. The masons forgot to claim in lylo so I followed the scum fake claiming investigates. I was so bad due to the lies, scum thought I was traitor.

[Klingoncelt]

Hidden mechanic.

Trust me today and lynch Never Unlucky. Dude is scum.

Why?

Evidence is necessary.

[Titus]

Looks like Titus has a code in that second sentence.

Scum?

Why were you willing to sheep me when I had no clue yesterday but not today?

[Titus]

Why?

Evidence is necessary.

Read on.

[Klingoncelt]

Klingon, I am calling the sheep time. NU dies today. Not a policy lynch.

Not without a good reason.

You're talking too much in code.

Not a good look.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Not without a good reason.

You're talking too much in code.

Not a good look.

What are your current thoughts on NU?

[Quick]

By the way,

8

For group.

:worried:

[Klingoncelt]

Klingoncelt, we know you don't write wall posts, but do you also refuse to read them?

Generally, yes.

The ones at MS make my eyes bleed.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Pump the fucking brakes. You were all "omg is duck pocketing me"(when i was defending yuki??) and now you are setting up a potential pocket on me. What made you flip your scum read on me when I have made like 4 content posts that can be read as AI. Don't even tell me its because of my being against NU because mafia will scum read their own teammates.
Don't defend me lol. I want my train only contain town, not sheeping mafia scum

[Titus]

Not without a good reason.

You're talking too much in code.

Not a good look.

I didn't realize plain English was code. You should stop speaking in code too. ;)

[JealousTL]

Dude are you having a terrible game or are scum?

Do you think NU is town?

NU's posts did not strike me quite as scummy as

1. DUCK's questionable role explanation, his distraction, his giving half-answers to questions that don't really add up based on the setup of the game,
2. Your jumping in to claim "hidden mechanic" to defend DUCK when you could have no possible knowledge as a regular townie about what hidden mechanics affect his role, your analysis of "evidence" on NU (neither of which I have seen - not analysis nor evidence), and your consequent jumping on him after scum had already NK'd in G3.
3. Yuki's consistent lack of contribution besides an overly blatant "trap" for scum or their ploy to make it seem like an overly blatant trap, their inability to answer questions, and seeing them post more than a single line of text and it's bandwagoning your motion.
4. secondpassing sheeping all of you and the seemingly fake in-fighting it has caused.

Addendum:

5. All of you being on simultaneously and sheeping a motion for which I have seen absolutely no post analysis or other strong evidence, all within a page.

So yea, there's that. Gonna mull it over before I go to sleep right now. Good night all.

[Titus]

Don't defend me lol. I want my train only contain town, not sheeping mafia scum

I am deaf. Was that a group 3 vote? Why I think it is. Needs better formatting.

[Klingoncelt]

I'm currently trying to battle the impression I'm getting of a DUCK/Titus/Yuki/secondpassing scumteam that these past few pages have given me -___-;

Funny, I was thinking along the same lines...

[secondpassing]

By the way,

8

For group.

:worried:
Psst Quick, I know I'm a needy player but.. Can you link day starts in OP? kk thx in advance.

[JealousTL]

Group 2

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Oh boy the donkey brigade is forming... here we go again.

[secondpassing]

Group 3

I've got work tomorrow. Just a heads up I won't be around as much. Ping me if you need me.

[Yukitaka Oni]

I didn't realize plain English was code. You should stop speaking in code too. ;)
During world war 2 and cold war. Languages become a code to counter enemy intelligence. America was the first country to use the language code, thanks to them they win Germany and Japan easily. Although they have tough time fighting against the Soviet Union, they are the one who victorious. Word......can.....KILL...
(Muffled Sin Of The Father Playing In The Distance)

[Titus]

Oh boy the donkey brigade is forming... here we go again.

We are getting hard defenses. Good for later. NU must be really important to scum.

[Yukitaka Oni]

I am deaf. Was that a group 3 vote? Why I think it is. Needs better formatting.
Group 3 not going anywhere. Not today
Group 3

[Klingoncelt]

Why were you willing to sheep me when I had no clue yesterday but not today?

My vote on Yuki was my own.

I sheeped your Gingerape vote because you acted like you saw a slip, although you never specified what it was.

Not going down that road twice.

[Quick]

Psst Quick, I know I'm a needy player but.. Can you link day starts in OP? kk thx in advance.

Done.

[Titus]

Group 3 not going anywhere. Not today
Group 3

I can hear again. It's a miracle. A miracle. Lookout world! Here comes Titus.

[JealousTL]

We are getting hard defenses. Good for later. NU must be really important to scum.

Presenting reasons vs. no reasons, obviously the former makes you scummier.

[Titus]

My vote on Yuki was my own.

I sheeped your Gingerape vote because you acted like you saw a slip, although you never specified what it was.

Not going down that road twice.

Did Ginger flip town and someone forget to tell the class?

[Klingoncelt]

What are your current thoughts on NU?

Null.

[Titus]

Presenting reasons vs. no reasons, obviously the former makes you scummier.

Nah, second passing gave reasons.

You gave whining about people defending your alleged scumread with reasons.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I can hear again. It's a miracle. A miracle. Lookout world! Here comes Titus.

Sometimes you just need somebody to have your back. Yuki is the hero we needed, not the one we deserved.

[Klingoncelt]

I didn't realize plain English was code. You should stop speaking in code too. ;)

Titus, no. Just no. The lighthouses and fishermen thing was ridiculous.

[Titus]

Sometimes you just need somebody to have your back. Yuki is the hero we needed, not the one we deserved.

I agree. We got her back. Thanks for watching while I get scum. It's really helpful.

[JealousTL]

Titus, no. Just no. The lighthouses and fishermen thing was ridiculous.

To be fair, why would scum use code if they have a private QT?

[JealousTL]

I agree. We got her back. Thanks for watching while I get scum. It's really helpful.

The circlejerk is real.

[Titus]

Titus, no. Just no. The lighthouses and fishermen thing was ridiculous.

Really? It was? You found it scummy? :( Poor Klingon. You drew scum. I has sads. You get rope tomorrow.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

To be fair, why would scum use code if they have a private QT?

We planned it this way so that when we spoke in code you would think deeply about it and come to this very conclusion, thus town reading us. However if you can't see NU is scum then maybe I misread you and you know I, and probably her are town and will scum read us regardless.

[Titus]

The circlejerk is real.

Can it be circle friends? I don't want to be a jerk.

You can join.

The power of mystic yellow eye compels you to follow us.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

The circlejerk is real.

Dude... we had 24 hours to fucking rehearse this shit.

Wait till the evening show, we have yuki and whoever else the fuck you said was our partner join us. Some Acrobatic shit incoming.

[JealousTL]

We planned it this way so that when we spoke in code you would think deeply about it and come to this very conclusion, thus town reading us. However if you can't see NU is scum then maybe I misread you and you know I, and probably her are town and will scum read us regardless.

Lol. That was an interesting set of mental leaps you made there, all hinging on the joke that you either planned it out-of-thread and therefore violated the rules or that you are scum, very funny, means that both possibilities are impossible right? I like this kind of humor. It's so silly.

[Titus]

Dude... we had 24 hours to fucking rehearse this shit.

Wait till the evening show, we have yuki and whoever else the fuck you said was our partner join us. Some Acrobatic shit incoming.

Ooh, I will walk the tightrope. So fun. All the scum look like ants from up there.

[Klingoncelt]

Did Ginger flip town and someone forget to tell the class?

If Ginger Scumslipped yesterday, why aren't you hardtunnelling her today?

That's completely wrong, Titus. Not like you at all.

[Titus]

Lol. That was an interesting set of mental leaps you made there, all hinging on the joke that you either planned it out-of-thread and therefore violated the rules or that you are scum, very funny, means that both possibilities are impossible right? I like this kind of humor. It's so silly.

Obey the power of the yellow eye.

[Titus]

If Ginger Scumslipped yesterday, why aren't you hardtunnelling her today?

That's completely wrong, Titus. Not like you at all.

The premise is inaccurate. I thought Yuki had but I was wrong and mistakenly attributed that to Ginger. When I read NU was obvious scum. Like I am never ever ever voting anyone else.

[Klingoncelt]

To be fair, why would scum use code if they have a private QT?

Because they only have Night Chat. With codes they can discuss stuff as it comes up during the Day.

[Titus]

Because they only have Night Chat. With codes they can discuss stuff as it comes up during the Day.

Did Quick put that in the setup?

[Klingoncelt]

Group 1

Go ahead and vote for Group 1 everybody, then vote for Titus.

I guarantee she's Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

Guarantee, I said.

[Klingoncelt]

Fo' realz.

[Quick]

OTHER MECHANICS:
Mafia share Night Chat

Please read the setup thread carefully.

[Titus]

Oh this ought to be good. You faking a guilty?

Or are you blowing hot air as NU's partner?

[Titus]

Please read the setup thread carefully.

Was tired forgot.

[Titus]

Well Grandma?

[JealousTL]

Because they only have Night Chat. With codes they can discuss stuff as it comes up during the Day.

Interesting, although seems almost painfully obvious even when considering this fact.

[Titus]

Good night.
Jealous, you are jealous of the cult of the Yellow Eye. :(

[Calix]

Legit question. Did anything important happen in the last ~150 posts or whatever? I didn't really see anything that interesting.

What is the case on NU again? I have yet to reread his posts due to time constraints (was very busy yesterday) but I didn't see anything particularly damning/ substantial.

I personally think Group 2 is the better choice for now. I'd like to clear up my read on SJ and given that Duck is now claiming to know his alignment, pressuring him now = optimal move imo.

Group 2


I am apparently making blunders all over the place.. Yes, Mafia do not have a special lynch mechanic in their votes, that would not be what the hidden mechanics are. Mafia can only NK from the group that was chosen the previous day. As such, if no group is chosen, then Mafia can NK anyone from any group and as soon as the timer is up for DP:I the day is over if a majority isn't chosen.

I honestly thought that the "mafia can only kill from G3" mechanic was something that either a) a hidden mechanic that happened when you No-Lynched or b) something that Quick had made up at the last minute :p


I'm liking DUCKK let's not lynch him. I could go for a SuperJack lynch too. Prefer Group 3 for NU though.

Why do you town-read Duck? In my opinion, he's more passive, has resorted to odd discredits which I see no town motivation for and cares more about doling out town-reads than aggressively pursuing his scum-reads. He's also ignored several posts regarding him (e.g., my theory on him being scum + Klingoncelt being town based on their interactions) which strikes me as being extremely out-of-character for him.

I also town-read Jealous/ you more. Scum in G2 is among Duck/ SJ. 50% chance is a chance I'll take.


.. that awkward moment when your mafia list consists of all towns...

Why are you more focused on town-clearing players than trying to scum-hunt this game?

Jealous, I do not agree that Duck/ Titus/ SP/ Yuki are a scum team. I don't think scum would all be so chummy with each other because if one of them flipped then the go-to response in most games I've read is to look at who defended them. Probably 2 scum at the most from that group.

[Gingerape]

good mornyan. I have to go to work, so I should be on and reviewed stuff in 2-3 horas.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Legit question. Did anything important happen in the last ~150 posts or whatever? I didn't really see anything that interesting.

What is the case on NU again? I have yet to reread his posts due to time constraints (was very busy yesterday) but I didn't see anything particularly damning/ substantial.

I personally think Group 2 is the better choice for now. I'd like to clear up my read on SJ and given that Duck is now claiming to know his alignment, pressuring him now = optimal move imo.

Group 2



I honestly thought that the "mafia can only kill from G3" mechanic was something that either a) a hidden mechanic that happened when you No-Lynched or b) something that Quick had made up at the last minute :p



Why do you town-read Duck? In my opinion, he's more passive, has resorted to odd discredits which I see no town motivation for and cares more about doling out town-reads than aggressively pursuing his scum-reads. He's also ignored several posts regarding him (e.g., my theory on him being scum + Klingoncelt being town based on their interactions) which strikes me as being extremely out-of-character for him.

I also town-read Jealous/ you more. Scum in G2 is among Duck/ SJ. 50% chance is a chance I'll take.



Why are you more focused on town-clearing players than trying to scum-hunt this game?

Jealous, I do not agree that Duck/ Titus/ SP/ Yuki are a scum team. I don't think scum would all be so chummy with each other because if one of them flipped then the go-to response in most games I've read is to look at who defended them. Probably 2 scum at the most from that group.

The posts I have ignored on day 2 were useless to argue as the person openly said they do not read wall posts. They scum read me from a day that everything I did was NAI. I feel it is better to just move on and solve the game.

Yesterday I had zero reason to pressure who I thought was scum. I did just enough to make sure I didn't accidentally lynch a potential teammate. My main goal was to make my town circle and go from there day 2. While I zero reason to pressure scum, i certainly have been scum hunting. Group 1 had too many no posters to accurately judge. Group 2 had two non posters who I read as scum by POE, not much I can do there. Group 3 I read kovath, ginger, and yuki as scum.

I am known for town circles and not scum hunting, so I do not why you see this as odd behavior. There is nothing I can do when I scum read someone, and reevaluate and find them town. I will go player by player that I flipped on.

Yuki- odd reaction to you, conformed to you pinging this odd, gave no information, no reads, etc. Train built up on him in a way I did not like (similar to clarence, and shifty unknown) so I am forced to defend him.
Gingerape- Breadcrumbs, but then on two separate occasions comes up with great logic, especially about the setup.
RLVG- His reasoning against me was fucking trash tier, and scummy as fuck. However, when I reevaluated on him I found his trolly and jokey follow ups to be more in line with tunnel town RLVG.
Kovath - Garbage start, I was trying to train him to save yuki. Extension allowed me to ISO him, and instead of burying him, I flipped my town read on him.

I have done an ISO on never unlucky and concluded he was scum. Granted it was EOD, and not written so I will have to go back and do a proper one, but based on POE, and my read I think it will be a hit. To say I have not been scum hunting on day 2 is laughable borderline crazy.

What did you mwan by resorting to odd discredits? Who have I tried to discredit, and have I ignored any posts besides the ones made by klingoncelt?

If you are town and think two of the the 4 on that list are scum I am going to go commit sodoku IRL.

[Calix]

The posts I have ignored on day 2 were useless to argue as the person openly said they do not read wall posts. They scum read me from a day that everything I did was NAI. I feel it is better to just move on and solve the game.

Don't you scum-read Klingoncelt...?

I was talking about ignoring posts on D1. You'll say "oh I could ignore them because I don't know my alignment" but your D1 posts/ meta are the only thing I know about you so no, I won't be writing it off because of that reasoning.


Yesterday I had zero reason to pressure who I thought was scum. I did just enough to make sure I didn't accidentally lynch a potential teammate. My main goal was to make my town circle and go from there day 2. While I zero reason to pressure scum, i certainly have been scum hunting. Group 1 had too many no posters to accurately judge. Group 2 had two non posters who I read as scum by POE, not much I can do there. Group 3 I read kovath, ginger, and yuki as scum.

I remain unimpressed by scum-reading 3/5 G3 players. Since when did you scum-read Yuki? What happened to "LOL HE SOFTED TPR DON'T EVER LYNCH"

I also don't consider Kovath to be a 'scum-read' as you said "oh I always scum-read him on D1"

I forget how you reacted to Ginger, will have to check.


I am known for town circles and not scum hunting, so I do not why you see this as odd behavior. There is nothing I can do when I scum read someone, and reevaluate and find them town. I will go player by player that I flipped on.

I'm not scum-reading you for town-clearing players. I scum-read you for doing it considerably more than you are scum-hunting. And no the "I didn't know my alignment card" does not hold up because trying to clear players is also going against the scum wincon. If that was a main concern then you would not have posted your thoughts as much as you did.


Yuki- odd reaction to you, conformed to you pinging this odd, gave no information, no reads, etc. Train built up on him in a way I did not like (similar to clarence, and shifty unknown) so I am forced to defend him.

Question. How do you actually read the individual voters on the Yuki train? I find your reasoning for defending a scum-read unconvincing as it stands.

Nobody is 'forcing' you to do anything. A scum-read is a scum-read.


Gingerape- Breadcrumbs, but then on two separate occasions comes up with great logic, especially about the setup.

Didn't he breadcrumb Citizen more-so than Traitor? I don't follow the 'but'. Good logic is not a town tell, especially not in relation to the setup, lol.


I have done an ISO on never unlucky and concluded he was scum. Granted it was EOD, and not written so I will have to go back and do a proper one, but based on POE, and my read I think it will be a hit. To say I have not been scum hunting on day 2 is laughable borderline crazy.

Everyone and their cat seems to scum-read NU at the moment. Hardly the pinnacle of scum-hunting, hun.


What did you mwan by resorting to odd discredits? Who have I tried to discredit, and have I ignored any posts besides the ones made by klingoncelt?

If you are town and think two of the the 4 on that list are scum I am going to go commit sodoku IRL.

My large catch-up post where I discussed your interactions with Klingoncelt on Day 1 discusses this. Why did you ignore that when I posted it?

Have fun.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Don't you scum-read Klingoncelt...?

I was talking about ignoring posts on D1. You'll say "oh I could ignore them because I don't know my alignment" but your D1 posts/ meta are the only thing I know about you so no, I won't be writing it off because of that reasoning.



I remain unimpressed by scum-reading 3/5 G3 players. Since when did you scum-read Yuki? What happened to "LOL HE SOFTED TPR DON'T EVER LYNCH"

I also don't consider Kovath to be a 'scum-read' as you said "oh I always scum-read him on D1"

I forget how you reacted to Ginger, will have to check.



I'm not scum-reading you for town-clearing players. I scum-read you for doing it considerably more than you are scum-hunting. And no the "I didn't know my alignment card" does not hold up because trying to clear players is also going against the scum wincon. If that was a main concern then you would not have posted your thoughts as much as you did.



Question. How do you actually read the individual voters on the Yuki train? I find your reasoning for defending a scum-read unconvincing as it stands.

Nobody is 'forcing' you to do anything. A scum-read is a scum-read.



Didn't he breadcrumb Citizen more-so than Traitor? I don't follow the 'but'. Good logic is not a town tell, especially not in relation to the setup, lol.



Everyone and their cat seems to scum-read NU at the moment. Hardly the pinnacle of scum-hunting, hun.



My large catch-up post where I discussed your interactions with Klingoncelt on Day 1 discusses this. Why did you ignore that when I posted it?

Have fun.

I didn't intentionally ignore any posts on day 1. I know you don't care for the "I was drunk/driving/hungover" excuse, but if I ignored a post I missed it. I have ignored specific posts on day 2 though.

If you aren't impressed by my scum reads you aren't impressed, w/e. (for the record it is "i am wrong on kovath day1" not "I scum read him".

If I reevaluate and think someone is town, then I put them as town. I don't need to have a list of town and scum. If I read 10 players and all are town, I have 10 town, it does not mean I don't scum hunt enough, it just means I am content with the players so far. Like I said today is the day I should have an extremely strong town circle.

Yuki is scummy in that he conformed his behavior when you noted a difference, and that he refused to work with town. This is not something you must lynch, and would only be slightly stronger than a policy lynch. Yesterday I specifically mentioned I townread 4 of the 5 voters ( I think it was about a vote on yuki and someone else, and the non town read was klingon). I don't scum read klingon because I have seen her be this useless as junkrat in overwatch, but she has done nothing town IMO. Yes they were forcing me to defend, because a miss lynch is a miss lynch regardless of my individual read. I scum read clarence and shifty on day 1 in both games and ended up not wanting either lynched.

Traitor breadcrumb is more damning in this save, and who really cares if someone breadcrumbs citizen. To me out of the box thinking is a town tell. Can scum do it? Yes, but it provides town with insight that help them solve the game. If I am mafia and I say "Kovath is town, he always opens with this question as town", that is something not every person might know, but helps town win. Ginger's setup talk gave me so much information on the setup that even if they are mafia and get a pass for it, town is in a better spot IMO.

Well I was one of the early people on the idea, and I am the only one to provide why the other 4 people in the group are not scum. You can say many people are scum reading him, but I am the only one approaching it from multiple angles.

Can you tell me a post number, I don't even know what you are referring to.

[Calix]

If you aren't impressed by my scum reads you aren't impressed, w/e. (for the record it is "i am wrong on kovath day1" not "I scum read him".

I'm pretty sure you said "I often scum-read him on D1 so he could be town" or something to that effect.

What even is your town circle at the moment anyway?


Yuki is scummy in that he conformed his behavior when you noted a difference, and that he refused to work with town. This is not something you must lynch, and would only be slightly stronger than a policy lynch. Yesterday I specifically mentioned I townread 4 of the 5 voters ( I think it was about a vote on yuki and someone else, and the non town read was klingon). I don't scum read klingon because I have seen her be this useless as junkrat in overwatch, but she has done nothing town IMO. Yes they were forcing me to defend, because a miss lynch is a miss lynch regardless of my individual read. I scum read clarence and shifty on day 1 in both games and ended up not wanting either lynched.

If you read OW then you'd see that she's saying similar things to what she said there. I disagree with the characterisation that Klingoncelt has been as useless this game as she was in OW - where did you get that impression from?

"I town-read 4/5 of the voters"
"I didn't like how the train built so I defended a scum-read because a ML is a ML"

I do not follow your logic. Please flesh out your reasoning here.


Traitor breadcrumb is more damning in this save, and who really cares if someone breadcrumbs citizen. To me out of the box thinking is a town tell. Can scum do it? Yes, but it provides town with insight that help them solve the game. If I am mafia and I say "Kovath is town, he always opens with this question as town", that is something not every person might know, but helps town win. Ginger's setup talk gave me so much information on the setup that even if they are mafia and get a pass for it, town is in a better spot IMO.

Why would scum soft-claim a role on Day 1 that early on? That's something I see town doing way more than scum because scum prefer to keep their options open. Like yeah, it's a CITIZEN claim and anyone can bullshit that but my reasoning still stands.

Are you claiming that Kovath's opening question is something he'd do as town? If not, why use it as an example?

Being useful...also not alignment-indicative.


Well I was one of the early people on the idea, and I am the only one to provide why the other 4 people in the group are not scum. You can say many people are scum reading him, but I am the only one approaching it from multiple angles.

Can you tell me a post number, I don't even know what you are referring to.

This wording pings me as somewhat opportunistic. ("the idea" perhaps? Can't really explain it) I don't expect a response to this since it's tone-based but I'm noting it.

POE isn't what I'd call a different angle. It's just POE and something that you claim isn't abnormal for your play.

#513. Some of the reasoning may be outdated by now, but I'm not sure if anyone even commented on it so the fact that you didn't acknowledge it stood out to me. Trying to ignore/ bury things in the thread is a valid scum strategy imo.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

in response to your 513 I completely fucking smashed that post you quoted to pieces. I would be surprised if she can even walk after what I did there. You literally quote my follow up troll posts and use that as a misrep and ignore my actual logic post... like what the fuck are you trying to accomplish here. I thought you were referring to me in that post as the person who made the reason why duck and calix cant be a scum team as I just got done explaining that very reason to jealoustl. I remember reading the post and rolling my eyes and then moving on with my life.

ill get to the rest of your post in a minute.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I'm pretty sure you said "I often scum-read him on D1 so he could be town" or something to that effect.

What even is your town circle at the moment anyway?



If you read OW then you'd see that she's saying similar things to what she said there. I disagree with the characterisation that Klingoncelt has been as useless this game as she was in OW - where did you get that impression from?

"I town-read 4/5 of the voters"
"I didn't like how the train built so I defended a scum-read because a ML is a ML"

I do not follow your logic. Please flesh out your reasoning here.



Why would scum soft-claim a role on Day 1 that early on? That's something I see town doing way more than scum because scum prefer to keep their options open. Like yeah, it's a CITIZEN claim and anyone can bullshit that but my reasoning still stands.

Are you claiming that Kovath's opening question is something he'd do as town? If not, why use it as an example?

Being useful...also not alignment-indicative.



This wording pings me as somewhat opportunistic. ("the idea" perhaps? Can't really explain it) I don't expect a response to this since it's tone-based but I'm noting it.

POE isn't what I'd call a different angle. It's just POE and something that you claim isn't abnormal for your play.

#513. Some of the reasoning may be outdated by now, but I'm not sure if anyone even commented on it so the fact that you didn't acknowledge it stood out to me. Trying to ignore/ bury things in the thread is a valid scum strategy imo.

Town circle in no order:
Group 1:
Eggy
Titus

Group 2:
Jealoustl
Calix
secondpassing

Group 3:
Ginger
Kovath

Exactly, she is saying similar things which have done nothing. Which is why I am not scum reading her, because she has shown this same level of play before as town.

My wording here was pretty garbage. the 4/5 votes was not specific to the yuki vote, but in reference to the question of my read on klingon and that is the only time on day1 i mentioned a town or non town read on her. IIRC it was basically the same vote on yuki anyway though so I would still argue the same point. It was more of the timing of the train and the reasoning used. I don't feel there was enough of a reason to justify a train against yuki at that stage in the game. I felt like Titus and Klingon were on different sides of the game ( not necessarily different alignments) and both voting on yuki also rang some alarm bells. The reasoning I saw was more under what would constitute a policy lynch, which at the time I thought it was possible to miss lynch and just lose the game off a policy lynch. I saw a bodyguard soft claim, which apparently wasn't one, but even without that I would have still defended him to the grave.

Cant really tell you why gingerape would or would not do something. In World Of Music I tried to tell iced he was our godfather by messaging him "you know we are bros right" "hey buddy glad we are really close". I don't think timing of a soft claim would be AI here. But hey I am glad we agree ginger is probably town.

What the fuck kind of question is this... I used it as an example to try and show that out of the box thinking can help town solve the game, so even if it is a mafia doing it to get townread, they are forced into giving town valuable information in the process. It does not make ginger town for using this kind of logic, but if she is not town she is helping town.

and being useless hurts skilled town players. Try and read between two people who post 0 times, good luck. Useless = help mafia win by hindering other town's ability to solve the game. Not alignment indicative though I agree.

Opportunistic? I was THE FIRST PERSON to ping never unlucky out (might want to fact check that, as that could be wrong actually) as scummy for his sheeping you and defending me very early onto the game. The reason I say one of the first few on the idea is because I town read him for his logic anyway and decided to look at different avenues. Between kovath pinging NU out to me and my own research I concluded NU was the scum of group 3.

How is it not a different angle? I not only scum read him based on my individual read, but corroborated it with my POE read. Mafia can cherry pick any fact they want and paint someone as scum. To say this read is opportunistic is a word I can't even think of right now, I am literally bereft of words.

[Calix]

in response to your 513 I completely fucking smashed that post you quoted to pieces. I would be surprised if she can even walk after what I did there. You literally quote my follow up troll posts and use that as a misrep and ignore my actual logic post... like what the fuck are you trying to accomplish here. I thought you were referring to me in that post as the person who made the reason why duck and calix cant be a scum team as I just got done explaining that very reason to jealoustl. I remember reading the post and rolling my eyes and then moving on with my life.

ill get to the rest of your post in a minute.

That wasn't a misrepresentation. I literally narrated how the progression in the conversation went and didn't see how your response meshed with how you were acting up until now.

I don't understand how the rest of your post relates back to my post since you're not very clear on what posts/ quotes you are referring to. If you mean "oh I read #513 and rolling my eyes and ignoring it" then I don't believe you. If something is such obvious crap in your eyes then you just call it out as being obvious crap and THEN move on. Thinking something is shitty doesn't equate to ignoring it.

You also don't refute my logic about discrediting me as you just used the "IT WAS TROLLING" defense (which I predicted) and you ignored this part entirely.


Why would you openly dissuade players from voting/ scum-reading a player this early on? If you had actually noted a PR claim, you'd keep it to yourself and look at who keeps pushing them. And no, I do not want your response to this to be "lol but Yuki's this role" because I do not give a shit.

This looks like a lazy attempt to deflect pressure more than legitimate "oh shit a town-read's about to get lynched" reaction. It is way too early to be pulling that shit.

For everyone's convenience, here's a link to #513 (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/37572-S-FM-210-Surreptitious-The-Game-of-Spies?p=634079&viewfull=1#post634079). Always good to have people check for themselves.

[Calix]

Group 2:
Jealoustl, Calix, secondpassing

Group 3: Ginger, Kovath

Shouldn't SJ be almost confirmed scum to you then? Why are you voting for G3 (where you only town-read 2/5 players) over G2? (where you should be town-reading 4/5 unless you are leaving yourself open as a possibility...which makes no sense) Wouldn't G2 = guaranteed scum lynch if you're confident in your town-reads?


Exactly, she is saying similar things which have done nothing. Which is why I am not scum reading her, because she has shown this same level of play before as town.

But my point is that she ISN'T playing the same way. OW!Klingoncelt was far more focused on complaining about the spam and was far more frustrated about that and since she isn't doing that and is trying (albeit feebly) to convince people to vote with her, I don't think she's being as useless.


My wording here was pretty garbage. the 4/5 votes was not specific to the yuki vote, but in reference to the question of my read on klingon and that is the only time on day1 i mentioned a town or non town read on her. IIRC it was basically the same vote on yuki anyway though so I would still argue the same point. It was more of the timing of the train and the reasoning used.

I still don't understand. Why would you refer to something non-specific to the Yuki vote when I specifically asked you for your thoughts on the individual voters? Like I don't get why Klingoncelt's being discussed in this context (I know she voted for Yuki but you don't seem to be discussing that here)

This conversation formatting is crap though so it might make more sense if I reread this conversation and pick up on shit I didn't the first time round. I have to leave soon so am rushing to get a response here and when I get back I'll reread and summarise my impressions of how it went or something.


I don't feel there was enough of a reason to justify a train against yuki at that stage in the game. I felt like Titus and Klingon were on different sides of the game ( not necessarily different alignments) and both voting on yuki also rang some alarm bells. The reasoning I saw was more under what would constitute a policy lynch, which at the time I thought it was possible to miss lynch and just lose the game off a policy lynch. I saw a bodyguard soft claim, which apparently wasn't one, but even without that I would have still defended him to the grave.

There wasn't much reasoning on anyone. Even though I find Kovath to be scummy I wouldn't say that anything he's done so far is enough to justify a train against him either and I still voted for him. I read the late stages of the Yuki train as an attempt to get ANY lynch off. Which could be scum trying to get a ML off but town would also want to have a flip for informative purposes so it's not something I'd consider scummy by itself.

Since he's refuted this soft-claim, which post gave you that impression? Also why did you think he'd soft a TPR when he said that he DIDN'T want to soft-claim a role this game. (I forget the timing of the two posts so if he said that AFTER your "lol never lynching Yuki today" post then this isn't a valid point)

Yeah I agree that Ginger is likely town given that.


What the fuck kind of question is this...

One that you avoided giving a direct answer to. Is Kovath's opening post something that he'd do as town? Y/ N

Reasoning for the question has been noted. I see nothing AI there so moving on.


Opportunistic? I was THE FIRST PERSON to ping never unlucky out (might want to fact check that, as that could be wrong actually)

"I WAS THE FIRST PERSON...oh wait I'm not actually sure there, someone should check."

I mean, I'm doing the same thing with my responses so I just find this funny more than anything, lmao.


as scummy for his sheeping you and defending me very early onto the game. The reason I say one of the first few on the idea is because I town read him for his logic anyway and decided to look at different avenues. Between kovath pinging NU out to me and my own research I concluded NU was the scum of group 3.

How is it not a different angle? I not only scum read him based on my individual read, but corroborated it with my POE read. Mafia can cherry pick any fact they want and paint someone as scum. To say this read is opportunistic is a word I can't even think of right now, I am literally bereft of words.

If you could go into more detail about 'your own research' and how exactly you concluded NU was obvscum among the G3 players then that would be appreciated.

The differences between "POE is a different angle" and "POE is just a part of scum-hunting" seems like it'll go into theory spec more than anything relevant so I'll save the time.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Was trying to finally sleep and I come across this facepalm.

a) No it does not not, it looks like what it is which is me explaining if he was mafia his play was good ( in response to "calix would laugh").
b) False. I am trying to convince everyone that IF I AM FAKE, I have been acting in a town manner, and in the interest of town. Huge difference. I have stated at least 100 times that I could be mafia please read the game before misrepping.

It is not bizarre because this very post. You claim her behavior is bizarre yet have done nothing about it to pressure her. Yeah she is so lynchable.

Do you just throw out random words? Talking about me is very relevant in relation to if I made some sub optimal play and how I relate to the people in group 3. However, I have stated that the focus should be shifted elsewhere until day 2, so I do not know why you do not let this point just get buried until day 2.

So I am deflecting off yuki, coaching my partner NU, and my teammate is calix. I can tell you for 100% fact you do not believe this, want to know why!? YOUR VOTE IS ON YUKI WHO CANT BE MAFIA IN THIS WORLD!! I am mafia protecting yuki and partners with calix/nu/x. Yuki CANNOT be mafia because the groups would be 0 in A, calix duck B, Yuki NU c.

sigh.


You use this “it’s a joke guise” thing a lot and I don’t really understand it. Someone mentioned your recent lynch accuracy as being bad, and my post was clearly a joke. It does not take a rocket scientist to realize me saying “but she lynched a town, then faked a red to lynch another town” is a joke. I do believe your previous games have been bad, but If I wanted to discredit you it would be off plays you made this game.
I didn’t call it out because I didn’t really care about anything other than my hangover. If you notice, I was constantly posting for the first 24 hours of the game, and I was asleep when you posted 513. My next post was 5 hours later and said “morning”. I did not feel well, and was not going to argue with someone who focused on the troll aspect of my posts and how it affects her while skipping the post I made that made points against her post....
I town shielded yuki, I do not want people voting him. I don’t care what you think on the matter, I think it was a bad lynch and will defend him just like I did unknown, and just like I did Clarence. I never said do not scum read them, as I scum read him, but I do not want him lynched. I can’t stop the town from lynching him, only can lead them to the water.

Let me cancel sleep and turn off my laptop so I can actually format posts on my other computer. Ill be back in a few.

[SuperJack]

Quick

I'm sorry I'm going to have to be replaced out. I'm a lot busier than expected going on holiday.

[Calix]

@Quick (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27344)

I'm sorry I'm going to have to be replaced out. I'm a lot busier than expected going on holiday.

Oh for fuck's sake.

At this rate, I'm just going to go back to G3. Trying to read an empty slot...lol.

[Calix]

Oh and even then that's risky because if we fuck up today then the Mafia can just kill a G3 townie tonight and we lose. Yeah yeah there's probably a BG but they'd have to guess correctly and I don't like those odds.

zzz

Anyway I'm off now. Guess I will just focus on G3.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Shouldn't SJ be almost confirmed scum to you then? Why are you voting for G3 (where you only town-read 2/5 players) over G2? (where you should be town-reading 4/5 unless you are leaving yourself open as a possibility...which makes no sense) Wouldn't G2 = guaranteed scum lynch if you're confident in your town-reads?


Jesus Christ I cant believe I got out of bed to respond to a post when the person has not read any of my real posts. You are literally the third person to have done this now (Klingon, JealousTl, Calix).

I AM VOTING FOR GROUP 3 BECAUSE TO SIMPLIFY I TOWNREAD 4/5 PLAYERS (rlvg is dead so its fucking four), (yuki is town read because of the lynch against him. I don't actually town read him so I did not want him in a town circle as of yet.), I town read ginger, and Kovath, leaving fucking NU who I have explained that I have wanted to lynch.

I also posted that SJ was likely scum, but that I had to be wrong on actually fuck it. I am not going to continue to waste my time if people are not going to read my posts and I sure as hell now know none of you fucking idiots will pay attention to my last will. ~duck out. I will not be posting again for the rest of this phase in the day.

[Gingerape]

-rubs my face sleepily-
I'm still busy but I'll throw my thoughts out real quick,
If I had to kill someone from group 3 it probably would've been NU first pick, then RLVG. And probably I would be 3rd.
idk that's what i would do~ I'm kinda worried that NU is scum now.

Also if we pick group 3 today and get it wrong, then it's 2v1 going into the night and then 1v1 in the morning essentially.
Then we lose like Catley said.

[Titus]

Ok, with people dropping it's rather important to be a little more direct.

Someone in me/duck/yuki/second passing is a lookout that saw NU kill RLVG.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Jesus Christ I cant believe I got out of bed to respond to a post when the person has not read any of my real posts. You are literally the third person to have done this now (Klingon, JealousTl, Calix).

I AM VOTING FOR GROUP 3 BECAUSE TO SIMPLIFY I TOWNREAD 4/5 PLAYERS (rlvg is dead so its fucking four), (yuki is town read because of the lynch against him. I don't actually town read him so I did not want him in a town circle as of yet.), I town read ginger, and Kovath, leaving fucking NU who I have explained that I have wanted to lynch.

I also posted that SJ was likely scum, but that I had to be wrong on actually fuck it. I am not going to continue to waste my time if people are not going to read my posts and I sure as hell now know none of you fucking idiots will pay attention to my last will. ~duck out. I will not be posting again for the rest of this phase in the day.
Most players read group 3 as a null. Kovath, me, Gingerape and read Never unlucky as a player who's trying to contribute something to (run) away from being called a null. But....that's also funny, because basically now the only reason we lynch group 3 is Panchiko machine (RLVG definition: Lottery) yep.....we're playing gamble lynch here.

[Titus]

And the chat goes dead..

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Ok, with people dropping it's rather important to be a little more direct.

Someone in me/duck/yuki/second passing is a lookout that saw NU kill RLVG.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz the whole point of me saying yuki softed bodyguard was so that they would attack yuki and the real bodyguard would protect him + get a check. Now they will know he is the lookout. We would have gotten NU lynched without you taking this direct approach.

@Yuki what made you watch rlvg?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Never Unlucky since you are here. On a scale of 1 to rip how rip do you rip?

[Titus]

I bet being a lookout and rlvg being consensus obvtown in group 3 is great. I mean, child's play.

I don't think NU would have. Scum are not bussing. Dropping the bomb here is best play.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I bet being a lookout and rlvg being consensus obvtown in group 3 is great. I mean, child's play.

I don't think NU would have. Scum are not bussing. Dropping the bomb here is best play.

You almost got yuki lynched yesterday lol. You realize had that vote passed we would have lost our town invest + not been able to force the lynch on scum neverlucky today.

FOlks this is why you town shield the scumuki. When we win this game I want a little asterik with the kevin durant meme saying "duck da real mvp"

[Calix]

I'm not even sure what is going on right now.

Given it's LYLO and I haven't seen many people defend NU today, a part of me thinks that scum could fake-claim a guilty to get an easy win in G3, blah blah blah. But I said a similar thing about RLVG not being attacked much and that was wrong, so maybe the scum just aren't doing anything this game.

And besides that, I don't really give a shit at this point even if I'm skeptical about this because half the players haven't even shown up yet so how do you get anything done? Might as well go for this route and put this game out of its misery if my paranoia is right.

I mean, if there's an actual guilty in a setup where TPRs are unique (if I recall correctly) then that is kind of stupid to gambit as scum.

Group 3

[Calix]

Uh, I mean MYLO if we pick G3. zzz

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I'm not even sure what is going on right now.

Given it's LYLO and I haven't seen many people defend NU today, a part of me thinks that scum could fake-claim a guilty to get an easy win in G3, blah blah blah. But I said a similar thing about RLVG not being attacked much and that was wrong, so maybe the scum just aren't doing anything this game.

And besides that, I don't really give a shit at this point even if I'm skeptical about this because half the players haven't even shown up yet so how do you get anything done? Might as well go for this route and put this game out of its misery if my paranoia is right.

I mean, if there's an actual guilty in a setup where TPRs are unique (if I recall correctly) then that is kind of stupid to gambit as scum.

Group 3

If you opened a thread for over 10 minutes where you were red checked as town would you be idle?

Maybe we give him the benefit of the doubt and say hes writing a novel.

[Titus]

You almost got yuki lynched yesterday lol. You realize had that vote passed we would have lost our town invest + not been able to force the lynch on scum neverlucky today.

FOlks this is why you town shield the scumuki. When we win this game I want a little asterik with the kevin durant meme saying "duck da real mvp"

We can quibble over MVP later. :)

[Calix]

If you opened a thread for over 10 minutes where you were red checked as town would you be idle?

Maybe we give him the benefit of the doubt and say hes writing a novel.

Well I did see him view the thread after that and then pop off so point taken.


We can quibble over MVP later. :)

>using MVP in a team game

:laugh:

Anyway so assuming that NU is scum, then my POE for scum-reads would be SJ/ Duck for G2 and Unknown/ Shapelog for G1. If anyone disagrees then I'd like to hear that case but I doubt it as everyone seems to be on the same page which I find pretty weird. It's like the scum aren't doing anything to cause chaos at all. My POE reads are mostly lurkers so maybe that's why.

Titus, since you know Klingoncelt's meta better than I do, how is she measuring up this game? Only played with her twice before so I'm not too sure here.

[Never Unlucky]

If you opened a thread for over 10 minutes where you were red checked as town would you be idle?

Maybe we give him the benefit of the doubt and say hes writing a novel.


Never Unlucky since you are here. On a scale of 1 to rip how rip do you rip?

Role-claim: Friendly Neighbour. Jealous knows I am town.

Nice attempt to fake-claim, Titus, but you've outted a town.

[Never Unlucky]

If you opened a thread for over 10 minutes where you were red checked as town would you be idle?

Maybe we give him the benefit of the doubt and say hes writing a novel.

It's called catching up with the 194 posts that have been made overnight.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Well I did see him view the thread after that and then pop off so point taken.



>using MVP in a team game

:laugh:

Anyway so assuming that NU is scum, then my POE for scum-reads would be SJ/ Duck for G2 and Unknown/ Shapelog for G1. If anyone disagrees then I'd like to hear that case but I doubt it as everyone seems to be on the same page which I find pretty weird. It's like the scum aren't doing anything to cause chaos at all. My POE reads are mostly lurkers so maybe that's why.

Titus, since you know Klingoncelt's meta better than I do, how is she measuring up this game? Only played with her twice before so I'm not too sure here.

I disagree on the account that you have 5 scum. I think your group 2 is fine, do not see how you got to unknown and shapelog though.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Role-claim: Friendly Neighbour. Jealous knows I am town.

Nice attempt to fake-claim, Titus, but you've outted a town.

Why did you choose jealoustl to claim to?

[Never Unlucky]

Why did you choose jealoustl to claim to?

Tone-read from content and tone. I'd have gone to Calix, but I might've gave her another free town-read this game. Going for my hardest T-R was the obvious choice.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Tone-read from content and tone. I'd have gone to Calix, but I might've gave her another free town-read this game. Going for my hardest T-R was the obvious choice.

From your POV titus is confirmed mafia then. WHo do you think she could be with (fucking rip me in that case LOL), and do you think she is able to go for the win today then?

[Calix]

I disagree on the account that you have 5 scum. I think your group 2 is fine, do not see how you got to unknown and shapelog though.

Oh I'm not saying that all five of them are scum, just that I think most/ all of the scum are among those five.

I town-read Eggy/ Klingoncelt/ Titus at the moment so the remaining two slots are more likely to be scum. Haven't actually used Unknown or Shapelog's posts for these reads.

I suppose we wait for Jealous to come in and respond to NU.

NU, how do you read Titus and her claim given your role?

[Titus]

I want to see if Jealous claims scum here. Interesting.

I don't see how you'd visit RLVG if claiming to Jealous.

Calix, Strong scumlean. Gotta hit the road soon will explain later.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

wait.... if never unlucky is fake, it is not the claim that would be going for the win because of the reactionary nature to a red check. Which means HE WOULD JUST CLAIM BODYGUARD and out a medic or die with chaos. The role he claimed just forces his teammate to vouch for him who was UNIVERSALLY town read.

Thoughts on this?

[Never Unlucky]

From your POV titus is confirmed mafia then. WHo do you think she could be with (fucking rip me in that case LOL), and do you think she is able to go for the win today then?

Not confirmed mafia. She could've fake-claimed to draw attention to me (Like what RLVG did in AI) and have players revise their read on me, but it is more probable that there are two scum in G3 and MLing G3 gives Titus a win. Following the latter theory, I think Yuki'd be the other town as Titus pushed for his lynch D1. That'd leave Kovath and GingerApe which goes along with my reads.


Tone-read from content and tone. I'd have gone to Calix, but I might've gave her another free town-read this game. Going for my hardest T-R was the obvious choice.

To clarify, I don't know myself if I town-read Calix or if I just prefer believing she's town and go with it.

[Titus]

wait.... if never unlucky is fake, it is not the claim that would be going for the win because of the reactionary nature to a red check. Which means HE WOULD JUST CLAIM BODYGUARD and out a medic or die with chaos. The role he claimed just forces his teammate to vouch for him who was UNIVERSALLY town read.

Thoughts on this?

I think bussing signal maybe. Could be Klingon fucking with me.

One of Jealous/Klingon is scum.

[Never Unlucky]

wait.... if never unlucky is fake, it is not the claim that would be going for the win because of the reactionary nature to a red check. Which means HE WOULD JUST CLAIM BODYGUARD and out a medic or die with chaos. The role he claimed just forces his teammate to vouch for him who was UNIVERSALLY town read.

Thoughts on this?

I wouldn't have claimed if I wasn't on the edge of being lynched, obviously. My role is easily confirmable.

So you're assuming that if I'm scum then JTL is scum too? Why would scum!NU draw his teammate in the dirt like that? Only possible scenario is if there are 2 scums in G3 including me and lynching me would lower scum's chances of winning with G3.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

It is possible that NU realizes he is dead and trying to make us doubt jealous when he denies the claim ( which if they were scum he would deny knowing he is town because that is a sinking ship for dos). If titus was "reaction testing" she always immediately rescinds, this counterclaim is not one that needs to be held to get information, it would be a snap rescind. If she holds it for any longer there is a different check between Never Unlucky and Titus.

[Calix]

wait.... if never unlucky is fake, it is not the claim that would be going for the win because of the reactionary nature to a red check. Which means HE WOULD JUST CLAIM BODYGUARD and out a medic or die with chaos. The role he claimed just forces his teammate to vouch for him who was UNIVERSALLY town read.

Thoughts on this?

Okay well aren't all TPRs unique? So if there's a Lookout/ Friendly Neighbour then they can easily counter-claim (in the case that the person who they're counter-claiming isn't being lynched) and that would basically confirm a mafia, right?

I agree that a scum!NU in this situation can only use his partner.

And if said person isn't in G1/ 3 then they cannot die straight away.

However we already have quite a lot of claims so I'm not sure wherever encouraging more is a great idea.


Not confirmed mafia. She could've fake-claimed to draw attention to me (Like what RLVG did in AI) and have players revise their read on me, but it is more probable that there are two scum in G3 and MLing G3 gives Titus a win. Following the latter theory, I think Yuki'd be the other town as Titus pushed for his lynch D1. That'd leave Kovath and GingerApe which goes along with my reads.



To clarify, I don't know myself if I town-read Calix or if I just prefer believing she's town and go with it.

From your POV, how the fuck is someone fake-claiming to push a MYLO situation NOT scummy to you?

There CANNOT be two groupscum in G3 without a Traitor...game would have ended already.

My play might be utter crap this game but it's still coming from town, mate.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Okay well aren't all TPRs unique? So if there's a Lookout/ Friendly Neighbour then they can easily counter-claim (in the case that the person who they're counter-claiming isn't being lynched) and that would basically confirm a mafia, right?

I agree that a scum!NU in this situation can only use his partner.

And if said person isn't in G1/ 3 then they cannot die straight away.

However we already have quite a lot of claims so I'm not sure wherever encouraging more is a great idea.



From your POV, how the fuck is someone fake-claiming to push a MYLO situation NOT scummy to you?

There CANNOT be two groupscum in G3 without a Traitor...game would have ended already.

My play might be utter crap this game but it's still coming from town, mate.

Do you find NU assessing a world where titus is fake and town is AI?

If I was titus and town did not follow me day 1, I fake a red check here on my scum read every time. I don't know enough about titus to know her play style other than it seemed more cookie cutter (just what I saw from overwatch), and that is not something she would do as town.

If NU is mafia why does he pick his most town read partner (who is more town read than TL right now?) and not someone expendable. Then again if hes doing this as mafia he is already doing the most sub-optimal claim if he loses the 1v1.

I was literally just on google picking out wood coffins.... I learned so many different colors for fucking nothing.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Never Unlucky since you are here. On a scale of 1 to rip how rip do you rip?
It's simple, we blame him for RLVG death, then we lynch him. Then we boil him, cook him, eat him. Ohhhhhhhh......yessssssss..........

[Never Unlucky]

I agree that a scum!NU in this situation can only use his partner.

Would scum!NU be possible if I'm only using my partner who's town-read by everyone?


From your POV, how the fuck is someone fake-claiming to push a MYLO situation NOT scummy to you?

There CANNOT be two groupscum in G3 without a Traitor...game would have ended already.

That would mean that scum!Titus KNOWS that the traitor is in G3. -> The fact that she was 100% willing to lynch Yuki yesterday and doesn't see a world in which she'd vote Yuki today means that she thinks that Yuki is the traitor. On what grounds? I don't know. Not scum-hunting? Pushing for a G3 vote day after day to win the game?

Group 1

This is in no way a pro-town move from Titus.

[Calix]

Do you find NU assessing a world where titus is fake and town is AI?

If I was titus and town did not follow me day 1, I fake a red check here on my scum read every time. I don't know enough about titus to know her play style other than it seemed more cookie cutter (just what I saw from overwatch), and that is not something she would do as town.

If NU is mafia why does he pick his most town read partner (who is more town read than TL right now?) and not someone expendable. Then again if hes doing this as mafia he is already doing the most sub-optimal claim if he loses the 1v1.

I was literally just on google picking out wood coffins.... I learned so many different colors for fucking nothing.

Scum have a harder time attacking their accusers (with regards to checks) because they know that the town is telling the truth, so you get the "you're fake-claiming but XYZ makes you town still" or the "Witch/ Framer did it" or my favourite, "HE'S EXECUTIONER" cliche defenses where both of them 'could' be town because you're downplaying the nature of the 1v1 situation.

So yes. I was going to say how I think town would react but NU hasn't done much so I don't want to give him ideas. Remind me later.

Titus would fake-claim as town so that wouldn't surprise me either although again, TPRs are unique and it forces a MYLO so it's exceptionally stupid.

I can't give an answer for that for I have no idea what I'd do if I fake-claimed Neighbour (lol) so I'll wait for Jealous to confirm or deny it.

Actually I'll just look at Jealous and his D2 posts and see if he town-read NU then.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Scum have a harder time attacking their accusers (with regards to checks) because they know that the town is telling the truth, so you get the "you're fake-claiming but XYZ makes you town still" or the "Witch/ Framer did it" or my favourite, "HE'S EXECUTIONER" cliche defenses where both of them 'could' be town because you're downplaying the nature of the 1v1 situation.

So yes. I was going to say how I think town would react but NU hasn't done much so I don't want to give him ideas. Remind me later.

Titus would fake-claim as town so that wouldn't surprise me either although again, TPRs are unique and it forces a MYLO so it's exceptionally stupid.

I can't give an answer for that for I have no idea what I'd do if I fake-claimed Neighbour (lol) so I'll wait for Jealous to confirm or deny it.

Actually I'll just look at Jealous and his D2 posts and see if he town-read NU then.

wait unique as in it is host confirmed there can not be 2 of the same roles?

[Calix]

wait unique as in it is host confirmed there can not be 2 of the same roles?

That's what I got from reading the setup thread but I could be wrong. I'd check that now in case he changed it. Also I'll ask:
Quick


Are scum PRs/ TPRs unique?

[Never Unlucky]

Scum have a harder time attacking their accusers (with regards to checks) because they know that the town is telling the truth, so you get the "you're fake-claiming but XYZ makes you town still" or the "Witch/ Framer did it" or my favourite, "HE'S EXECUTIONER" cliche defenses where both of them 'could' be town because you're downplaying the nature of the 1v1 situation.

C'mon, I'm a better player than that... zzz


Actually I'll just look at Jealous and his D2 posts and see if he town-read NU then.

He makes it pretty clear that I'm a confirmed town in his eyes.

Vote for Group 1. Titus hasn't admitted that it was a fake-claim like town would've, and there is very little possible town-motivation behind this claim. Titus is scum.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I want to see if Jealous claims scum here. Interesting.

I don't see how you'd visit RLVG if claiming to Jealous.

Calix, Strong scumlean. Gotta hit the road soon will explain later.

This honestly does not look like a lookout who has a red check. She almost seems like she is working with NU to find information rather than trying to fight him. I read this as a town fake claim.... (soooo after titus flips scum should I start picking out my favorite colored rope? )

[Calix]

which is a roundabout way of presenting a read if I saw one]

Hidden mechanic.

Trust me today and lynch Never Unlucky. Dude is scum.


I'm currently trying to battle the impression I'm getting of a DUCK/Titus/Yuki/secondpassing scumteam that these past few pages have given me -___-;


Dude are you having a terrible game or are scum?

Do you think NU is town?


NU's posts did not strike me quite as scummy as

1. DUCK's questionable role explanation, his distraction, his giving half-answers to questions that don't really add up based on the setup of the game,
2. Your jumping in to claim "hidden mechanic" to defend DUCK when you could have no possible knowledge as a regular townie about what hidden mechanics affect his role, your analysis of "evidence" on NU (neither of which I have seen - not analysis nor evidence), and your consequent jumping on him after scum had already NK'd in G3.
3. Yuki's consistent lack of contribution besides an overly blatant "trap" for scum or their ploy to make it seem like an overly blatant trap, their inability to answer questions, and seeing them post more than a single line of text and it's bandwagoning your motion.
4. secondpassing sheeping all of you and the seemingly fake in-fighting it has caused.

Addendum:

5. All of you being on simultaneously and sheeping a motion for which I have seen absolutely no post analysis or other strong evidence, all within a page.

So yea, there's that. Gonna mull it over before I go to sleep right now. Good night all.


[vote]Group 2


We are getting hard defenses. Good for later. NU must be really important to scum.


Presenting reasons vs. no reasons, obviously the former makes you scummier.


To be fair, why would scum use code if they have a private QT?


The circlejerk is real.


Lol. That was an interesting set of mental leaps you made there, all hinging on the joke that you either planned it out-of-thread and therefore violated the rules or that you are scum, very funny, means that both possibilities are impossible right? I like this kind of humor. It's so silly.


Interesting, although seems almost painfully obvious even when considering this fact.

NU, please explain where you got the impression that Jealous "made it pretty clear that [you] are confirmed town to [him]" please.

What made you change your stance from "Titus likely fake-claimed to draw attention to a scum-read" to "Titus is scum"?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

which is a roundabout way of presenting a read if I saw one]






















NU, please explain where you got the impression that Jealous "made it pretty clear that [you] are confirmed town to [him]" please.

What made you change your stance from "Titus likely fake-claimed to draw attention to a scum-read" to "Titus is scum"?

Eh I got the feeling something was up when TL overly defensive about NU getting pushed. I had a post typed about finding it odd how klingon and Jealous defending him was kind of but, that I think it would be odd for both mafia to defend a partner that quickly and obviously. This would make more sense. Keep in mind NU knows that Jealous knows his role, so he is more likely to see his posts as confirmation.

[Titus]

Had to drive someone to work in a carpool.

I do have a red check. Absolutely.

[Never Unlucky]

NU, please explain where you got the impression that Jealous "made it pretty clear that [you] are confirmed town to [him]" please.
Post 1011 #2 specifically. He says, "your analysis of "evidence" on NU (neither of which I have seen - not analysis nor evidence)" He knows there is no evidence against me as he knows for a fact that I am town, he has his counter-piece of evidence. This is why he thinks that everyone who's against me is scum.


What made you change your stance from "Titus likely fake-claimed to draw attention to a scum-read" to "Titus is scum"?

Analyzing the possible town motivation behind the fake-claim and coming to the conclusion that there is none + my previous lean-scum read on her from D1.

[Titus]

If Jealous vouches for NU, Jealous claims scum. Very low value play.

[Unknown1234]

This discussion feels like a TvT. I don't know why Titus would fake information, and I don't know why Jealous and NU would plan this so in advance as scum.

Double checking roles list.

[Titus]

Post 1011 #2 specifically. He says, "your analysis of "evidence" on NU (neither of which I have seen - not analysis nor evidence)" He knows there is no evidence against me as he knows for a fact that I am town, he has his counter-piece of evidence. This is why he thinks that everyone who's against me is scum.



Analyzing the possible town motivation behind the fake-claim and coming to the conclusion that there is none + my previous lean-scum read on her from D1.

Selling an alleged townread as confirmation. You're adorable but at least you came to play now.

[Titus]

This discussion feels like a TvT. I don't know why Titus would fake information, and I don't know why Jealous and NU would plan this so in advance as scum.

Double checking roles list.

NU is trying to sell Jealous as vouching for him. If NU gets lynched, scum are likely fucked.

[Never Unlucky]

Ok, with people dropping it's rather important to be a little more direct.

Someone in me/duck/yuki/second passing is a lookout that saw NU kill RLVG.

You mentioning the possible players who could be lookout when no one has soft-claimed something of the sort comes from absolutely fucking nowhere. If you were a lookout or if you were a town fake-claiming, you would've said that you saw me visit RLVG.

Plus, why are you naming THOSE players? Your suddent buddying of Yuki hasn't gone unnoticed.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

If Jealous vouches for NU, Jealous claims scum. Very low value play.

So I have been town reading you all game, but you have to understand what he just did if scum is either the worst thing in the history of mafia or conceding in a way that is meant to look like a rookie error that will force a miss lynch on a town read player or at least doubt cast on him. If he vouches for him why do we follow you? NU is extremely scummy, but the person vouching for him is the exact opposite, not to mention the play up until now has corroborated NU's claim. The only way for them to have planned this was "risk a bodyguard saving rlvg, and if the kill goes through we will set up a trail to go back on if a lookout watches him" which is extremely unlikely, but possible.

who the fuck knows at this point.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

You mentioning the possible players who could be lookout when no one has soft-claimed something of the sort comes from absolutely fucking nowhere. If you were a lookout or if you were a town fake-claiming, you would've said that you saw me visit RLVG.

Plus, why are you naming THOSE players? Your suddent buddying of Yuki hasn't gone unnoticed.

She hardclaimed earlier in "code". I also think she coded something about setting a trap after I asked her if she liked "soft shelled crabs", but I am not sure if that was a correct read on my part.

[Titus]

You mentioning the possible players who could be lookout when no one has soft-claimed something of the sort comes from absolutely fucking nowhere. If you were a lookout or if you were a town fake-claiming, you would've said that you saw me visit RLVG.

Plus, why are you naming THOSE players? Your suddent buddying of Yuki hasn't gone unnoticed.

I did. I picked the group who voted the claim for wifom.

1) Lighthouse overlooks the sea.
2) Highrope, wow scum look like ants.
3) Cult of the Yellow Eye, Saw scum.

@Duck, There is no vouch. Just NU selling it.

[Titus]

When you have a red check, you get the target lynched without claiming if possible in a last will variant, but given the fractures in town, no choice.

[Titus]

JealousTL, Skip to the end, did you get a friendly neighbor message from NU?

[Titus]

The answer on that is no. Just confirming.

[Never Unlucky]

NU is trying to sell Jealous as vouching for him. If NU gets lynched, scum are likely fucked.

Tell me why the fuck would scum drag 2 of theirs when one has been caught. Your theory is far-fetched.

scum!NU busses his teammates/scum-reads his teammates even when it's not needed (Kovath in POLITICO). This is the extreme opposite of this. It's fucking obvious that you're scum and now trying to stick by what you claim not to be lynched today.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Tell me why the fuck would scum drag 2 of theirs when one has been caught. Your theory is far-fetched.

scum!NU busses his teammates/scum-reads his teammates even when it's not needed (Kovath in POLITICO). This is the extreme opposite of this. It's fucking obvious that you're scum and now trying to stick by what you claim not to be lynched today.

Why does she fake a red on you though when it looked like either you or I were dying today, both should have been good for her to just coast?

[Titus]

Tell me why the fuck would scum drag 2 of theirs when one has been caught. Your theory is far-fetched.

scum!NU busses his teammates/scum-reads his teammates even when it's not needed (Kovath in POLITICO). This is the extreme opposite of this. It's fucking obvious that you're scum and now trying to stick by what you claim not to be lynched today.

You drag it out to get reads. Claiming it causes mass bus in 9/10 instances. With last will, no need to even claim.

Calling optimal play farfetched is scum flail.

Only you visited RLVG.

[Titus]

I gotta run for an hour. Lynch NU.

[Never Unlucky]

Why does she fake a red on you though when it looked like either you or I were dying today, both should have been good for her to just coast?

WIFOM.

She somehow knows that the 2 scums are in G3 and has to fake-claim for town to push me instead of you.

[secondpassing]

Tell me why the fuck would scum drag 2 of theirs when one has been caught. Your theory is far-fetched.

scum!NU busses his teammates/scum-reads his teammates even when it's not needed (Kovath in POLITICO). This is the extreme opposite of this. It's fucking obvious that you're scum and now trying to stick by what you claim not to be lynched today.
Can you not use these out of game met things? Theres a bunch of players that aren't familiar with those game. (and I hated Politico).

Also I still think NU is scum.

[secondpassing]

Group 3

After a quick review of the evidence, Never Unlucky is scum.

I do apologize but I am indeed taking round 1 of this challenge.
I thought this was code. Either this is a PLANNED redcheck. Or this is real.

Since I no longer see this as throwing someone under the bus, this is probably a red check.

[secondpassing]

#924 is where I reevaluated DUCKK's claim. Seems pretty consistent so far.

[Never Unlucky]

Group 3

After a quick review of the evidence, Never Unlucky is scum.

I do apologize but I am indeed taking round 1 of this challenge.

"After a quick review of the evidence" -- You're saying that I was the one who killed RLVG so I assume only one person visited him. Why would you need a "quick review" if the feedback is this simple to understnad? zzz


Can you not use these out of game met things? Theres a bunch of players that aren't familiar with those game. (and I hated Politico).



Ok, you didn't like POLITICO, I won't use this reference ever again. Thanks for your feedback. /s

Using meta is strong to get early reads, why would I not use it? I get that new players are alienated with those references but I won't stop using them if it benefits/justifies my reads.

[Titus]

Forensics lol. You were tagged. Remember the goal. Crumb but not claim. Too few active town. Had to cla.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

On day 1 Jealous said "I only log on when I plan on responding", yet he has not replied with a simple yes or no which is not making me feel good about NU's claim.

Yes I realize he may have started from the bottom .NOW WERE HERE. and that he might not get to stuff later, but he was @pinged and its a bit sketchhhhh

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Forensics lol. You were tagged. Remember the goal. Crumb but not claim. Too few active town. Had to cla.

I don't know what is worse your rendition of "be back in an hour" or my "im not posting until the next phase"

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Kovath don't pay attention to the game until you answer this.

Did you win your chess match ?

[Kovath]

Seems pretty cut and dry to me.

Group 3

[Titus]

I don't know what is worse your rendition of "be back in an hour" or my "im not posting until the next phase"

My mafia addiction. Lols.

[Kovath]

@Kovath (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=4273) don't pay attention to the game until you answer this.

Did you win your chess match ?
No, I've been playing meh since my first two games.

Doesn't matter, am GM lel.

[JealousTL]

Calix You say you don't think that my proposed scum team has more than 2 scum (just reminding you). Who do you think is missing? Who do you think is scum of the 4? Also, what do you make of Titus defending DUCK and super-pushing a G3/NU vote without presenting any reasoning?


If you are town and think two of the the 4 on that list are scum I am going to go commit sodoku IRL.

Just want to let you know it's either seppuku or harakiri, never sudoku. Sudoku is a logic game played with numbers on a grid. I hope this was a joke, but I've seen this mistake before and spelled correctly.


I have ignored specific posts on day 2 though.

Sweet.


Yuki is scummy in that he conformed his behavior when you noted a difference, and that he refused to work with town. This is not something you must lynch, and would only be slightly stronger than a policy lynch. Yesterday I specifically mentioned I townread 4 of the 5 voters ( I think it was about a vote on yuki and someone else, and the non town read was klingon).

Yet you did whatever you could to block the vote on Yuki, and have since repeatedly said that you were suspicious of how that train formed. Now you are saying that 4 of the 5 voters are town. Okay.

As I read on, I see Calix mentioned this as well. Yea, your wording was shitty, I am the last person who can judge you on this so I want to give you a pass on that, but I will be looking for more inconsistencies. You somewhat answer this, and I guess your town circle constitutes the reads that were requested. .


Town circle in no order:
Group 1:
Eggy
Titus

Group 2:
Jealoustl
Calix
secondpassing

Group 3:
Ginger
Kovath

So, why is voting G2 a bad idea then? Why are you voting G3? According to this, your town circle (which I presume includes you) should have 4/5 players in G2, and thus lynching SuperJack is the best move right now. Or, at least it should be given your stance.

UGH. Calix said this exact thing on the page. Damn you, Calix. At least this gives me some validation.


The reasoning I saw was more under what would constitute a policy lynch, which at the time I thought it was possible to miss lynch and just lose the game off a policy lynch. I saw a bodyguard soft claim, which apparently wasn't one, but even without that I would have still defended him to the grave.

Gingerape and a few others explained perfectly well why a D1 mislynch loss wouldn't be approved, well before the final vote on lynch (especially after we were given ~3.5 hours).


I town shielded yuki, I do not want people voting him. I don’t care what you think on the matter, I think it was a bad lynch and will defend him just like I did unknown, and just like I did Clarence. I never said do not scum read them, as I scum read him, but I do not want him lynched. I can’t stop the town from lynching him, only can lead them to the water.

? Solid reasoning.


Jesus Christ I cant believe I got out of bed to respond to a post when the person has not read any of my real posts. You are literally the third person to have done this now (Klingon, JealousTl, Calix).

I AM VOTING FOR GROUP 3 BECAUSE TO SIMPLIFY I TOWNREAD 4/5 PLAYERS (rlvg is dead so its fucking four), (yuki is town read because of the lynch against him. I don't actually town read him so I did not want him in a town circle as of yet.), I town read ginger, and Kovath, leaving fucking NU who I have explained that I have wanted to lynch.

I also posted that SJ was likely scum, but that I had to be wrong on actually fuck it. I am not going to continue to waste my time if people are not going to read my posts and I sure as hell now know none of you fucking idiots will pay attention to my last will. ~duck out. I will not be posting again for the rest of this phase in the day.

;-; What a ragequit over someone actually asking a logical question. This is why I don't like players who wear their hearts on their sleeve.

In the end, if your read on Yuki is so weak, I don't see how you can justify going for that group when you have G2 in which you are supposedly guaranteed town (at least in your own eyes), and you strongly townread 3 of the remaining 4 players. That is better odds than what you've professed in G3, and carries less risk (hypothetically).

Gonna cut this catch-up post here so I can switch topics and address others more directly.

[Never Unlucky]

wat

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

While I appreciate the effort in trying to scum read me, more important matters like a yes or a no.

[JealousTL]

Ok, with people dropping it's rather important to be a little more direct.

Someone in me/duck/yuki/second passing is a lookout that saw NU kill RLVG.

I am curious as to how you can claim that one of you four is any role unless you've been communicating outside the game, which is not allowed. What you're essentially saying through a thin veil is that you are the Lookout, but perhaps trying to extend the safety penumbra that claiming a TPR would grant onto three other people? Which you've chosen how, exactly?

Why pick RLVG?



zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz the whole point of me saying yuki softed bodyguard was so that they would attack yuki and the real bodyguard would protect him + get a check. Now they will know he is the lookout. We would have gotten NU lynched without you taking this direct approach.

@Yuki what made you watch rlvg?

What o_O... How are all these players getting all of this information from just about nothing. Yuki never claimed, no one ever claimed to have tracked NU or looked out RLVG, or anything. So how can either of you make claims like this? Yuki is borderline unintelligible half the time, too, and have definitely never said that they tracked/looked out except for that blatant "Will do." at the end of D1.

[Never Unlucky]

Now he's gone...

He has to be trolling me. My life depends on his "yes".

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

This is getting painful. Can someone OGI him to skip to the end.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Actually mods hate me, obligatory don't listen to duck on that comment.

[Kovath]

This is taking way too long for a simple yes / no.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Drinking game time:

For every drop of sweat from NU's forehead take a shot
For every post TL makes without acknowledging the claim take a shot
For every word TL posts that you have to use a thesaurus, dictionary, or the bible take 1/10th of a shot.

[Never Unlucky]

Drinking game time:

For every drop of sweat from NU's forehead take a shot
For every post TL makes without acknowledging the claim take a shot
For every word TL posts that you have to use a thesaurus, dictionary, or the bible take 1/10th of a shot.

I got drunk in less than a minute.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

For every role I will claim this game take a shot
For every time calix says "its a joke guise" take a shot
For every time Kovath loses a chess match because hes playing FM take a shot
For every time duck gets modkilled finish your bottle
For every Time titus codes a soft claim take a shot
For every time Duck troll posts take 1/10th a shot
For every time quick messed up a mechanic dont take a shot because he would never do such a thing
For every time you wanted duck to shut up take a long hard look in th emirror at yourself because that is rude

[Kovath]

For every role I will claim this game take a shot
For every time calix says "its a joke guise" take a shot
For every time Kovath loses a chess match because hes playing FM take a shot
For every time duck gets modkilled finish your bottle
For every Time titus codes a soft claim take a shot
For every time Duck troll posts take 1/10th a shot
For every time quick messed up a mechanic dont take a shot because he would never do such a thing
For every time you wanted duck to shut up take a long hard look in th emirror at yourself because that is rude
Interesting, you capitalize Time only once... in the line you talk about Titus making codes...

:tf:

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Okay seriously... is this guy writing a rough draft and then final copy on every post? That or he has an open dictionary and is looking for the perfect word.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Interesting, you capitalize Time only once... in the line you talk about Titus making codes...

:tf:

I noticed that when I hit enter. DAt ocd though, never capitalized the t in her name and I don't know why.

#overdefensive to a troll post fuck you. Don't bring out my defensiveness, makes me look scummy.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

andddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd hes gone. I take that as he caught up and is probably making a phone call to his local best buy about how to repair a computer that was thrown out of a fourth story window.

[Never Unlucky]

Okay seriously... is this guy writing a rough draft and then final copy on every post? That or he has an open dictionary and is looking for the perfect word.

Using a thesaurus for yes/no synonyms

zzz

[JealousTL]

Guys, I'm actually reading and trying to respond to everything, please chill.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Guys, I'm actually reading and trying to respond to everything, please chill.

can you first just say yes or no, did NU confirm town to you via night action? It will help us stop shit posting

[JealousTL]

I don't use dictionaries or thesauri.

[Never Unlucky]

http://i.giphy.com/3osxYcafC7tkcBQT60.gif

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

This dude is being WAY to cautious with this. what the duck.

[JealousTL]

Role-claim: Friendly Neighbour. Jealous knows I am town.

Nice attempt to fake-claim, Titus, but you've outted a town.

I have deduced that it is better for me to neither confirm nor deny this claim.

[Kovath]

I have deduced that it is better for me to neither confirm nor deny this claim.

Another person's life on the line, only thinks about his own position.

Bag em and tag em.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

LOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL WHAT PL;AENRT IN AAM I ON

[Kovath]

What Jealous just did is something he would have only done as Mafia.

If NU is scum and lying:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous is caught in a dilemma since denying the claim kills NU but confirming NU's claim links them together with iron chains.

If NU is town:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous can either confirm NU and thus have a confirmed town in G3 to work with (meh) or deny, therefore NU then knows that Jealous is scum.

[Kovath]

Jealous and NU are scum together, seems pretty clear-cut to me.

[Titus]

We lynch NU today.

Jealous cannot deny the claim BC I become unkillable conftown. He cannot confirm the claim without turning my death into a net two scum.

No reason to stall as town.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Preach brotha kovath.

[Calix]

@Calix (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27116) You say you don't think that my proposed scum team has more than 2 scum (just reminding you). Who do you think is missing? Who do you think is scum of the 4? Also, what do you make of Titus defending DUCK and super-pushing a G3/NU vote without presenting any reasoning?

Well she's claiming a check, so there's that.

I doubt that Duck/ Titus would collude this openly as mafia. Maybe WIFOM but I seriously doubt it.

The sarcastic jabs at Jealous and the drinking game posts made me laugh.


I have deduced that it is better for me to neither confirm nor deny this claim.

What the fuck? You literally have information that will help CONFIRM A 1V1 POSITION AND LYNCH A MAFIA. HOW IS IT BETTER TO HIDE THAT?


Another person's life on the line, only thinks about his own position.

Bag em and tag em.


What Jealous just did is something he would have only done as Mafia.

If NU is scum and lying:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous is caught in a dilemma since denying the claim kills NU but confirming NU's claim links them together with iron chains.

If NU is town:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous can either confirm NU and thus have a confirmed town in G3 to work with (meh) or deny, therefore NU then knows that Jealous is scum.

This.

Kovath actually making decent points.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

soooo superjack/jealous/nu

DO we just get auto now? We literally have a metric fuck ton of lynches to hit the 1 scum in group A LOL.

[Kovath]

The only way that Jealous's response can make any sense to me from a (twisted) town perspective is if he suspects that NU is trying to use him as fry - that is, NU accepts his death, puts Jealous on the spot, expects Jealous to instantly deny, and then post NU death there will be suspicion on Jealous as to why NU chose him as target. Hence a dilemma.

However, not only is this a really deep and twisted train of logic, this is... really dumb considering what Jealous actually did is basically confirm himself as Mafia, so... no.

[JealousTL]

What Jealous just did is something he would have only done as Mafia.

If NU is scum and lying:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous is caught in a dilemma since denying the claim kills NU but confirming NU's claim links them together with iron chains.

If NU is town:
Town Jealous reveals this, no hesitation.
Mafia Jealous can either confirm NU and thus have a confirmed town in G3 to work with (meh) or deny, therefore NU then knows that Jealous is scum.

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he could be TPR and is using this as a way to get me to confirm his fake-claim so that he would be safe.

Since the risk is too great, I will neither confirm nor deny.

[Kovath]

Besides a town would instantly jump at a chance to refute a claim and bag a confirmed scum 100% (esp. in the 4-man group which is in the most 'danger'), therefore the only way a town wouldn't react this way would be if Jealous actually did receive confirmation that NU is town - but then he would have just revealed it with no hesitation either.

It's this massive tornado of double-binds in the logic that proves Jealous cannot be town in any world.

[Never Unlucky]

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he could be TPR and is using this as a way to get me to confirm his fake-claim so that he would be safe.

Since the risk is too great, I will neither confirm nor deny.
You just denied it zzz.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

The only way that Jealous's response can make any sense to me from a (twisted) town perspective is if he suspects that NU is trying to use him as fry - that is, NU accepts his death, puts Jealous on the spot, expects Jealous to instantly deny, and then post NU death there will be suspicion on Jealous as to why NU chose him as target. Hence a dilemma.

However, not only is this a really deep and twisted train of logic, this is... really dumb considering what Jealous actually did is basically confirm himself as Mafia, so... no.

Nope. He would come out right away and question this very fact, not take 45 minutes consulting the binomial of a parabola to find the derivative of a dinosaur to conclude his answer. He is flustered mafia who got fucked by his teammate.

[Kovath]

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he could be TPR and is using this as a way to get me to confirm his fake-claim so that he would be safe.

Since the risk is too great, I will neither confirm nor deny.

You just denied his claim anyway because you called it a fake-claim.

Bag em and tag em.

[Calix]

Question. Does anyone think it's relevant which player dies first out of NU/ Jealous?

(assuming 1 scum for G2/ 3)

If we lynch on G3 and NU is scum, then Jealous is almost certainly scum, we confirm 3 townies but one of them is likely to die tonight.

If we lynch on G2 and Jealous is scum, then NU is confscum and we confirm 4 townies but one of them is likely to die tonight.

I have no preference but I'm just wondering if anyone has any ideas on which plan is better.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he could be TPR and is using this as a way to get me to confirm his fake-claim so that he would be safe.

Since the risk is too great, I will neither confirm nor deny.

IF? IF ? IF? YOU KNOW FOR 100% WHETHER HE IS TOWN OR MAFIA LOL

[Calix]

You just denied it zzz.

LOL HE'S NOT EVEN CALLING JEALOUS SCUM FOR IT.

Okay fuck my idea. He's just scum-claimed.

[Kovath]

YOU DO NOT FAKECLAIM FRIENDLY NEIGHBOR AS TPR WHEN THERE'S A HARDCLAIM RED LOOKOUT CHECK ON YOU

LOL

[JealousTL]

You just denied his claim anyway because you called it a fake-claim.

Bag em and tag em.

Oops.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Question. Does anyone think it's relevant which player dies first out of NU/ Jealous?

(assuming 1 scum for G2/ 3)

If we lynch on G3 and NU is scum, then Jealous is almost certainly scum, we confirm 3 townies but one of them is likely to die tonight.

If we lynch on G2 and Jealous is scum, then NU is confscum and we confirm 4 townies but one of them is likely to die tonight.

I have no preference but I'm just wondering if anyone has any ideas on which plan is better.

nu is 100% confirmed scum, jealous is 99.9%. We take the sure thing.

[Calix]

Oops.

LOL AT NEVER UNLUCKY FOR TRYING TO FAKE-CLAIM WITH HIS PARTNER AND HIS PARTNER FUCKING IT UP.

SO DONE.

[Titus]

God, I have been waiting years to catch a scum claiming friendly neighbor.

This implosion is WHY you don't immediately out a red check for the record.

[Never Unlucky]

Nope. He would come out right away and question this very fact, not take 45 minutes consulting the binomial of a parabola to find the derivative of a dinosaur to conclude his answer. He is flustered mafia who got fucked by his teammate.

Where does this fake-claim rank in the history of bad mafia plays?

[Calix]

God, I have been waiting years to catch a scum claiming friendly neighbor.

This implosion is WHY you don't immediately out a red check for the record.

Thank you. This is glorious.

Almost beats Paladin in Mafia Wars I :')

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Where does this fake-claim rank in the history of bad mafia plays?

Second to the paladin. You are good.

[JealousTL]

LOL AT NEVER UNLUCKY FOR TRYING TO FAKE-CLAIM WITH HIS PARTNER AND HIS PARTNER FUCKING IT UP.

SO DONE.

To be completely honest, I copy+pasted my musings from my QT with Quick without trying to reword it so that I wouldn't potentially throw a TPR into a confirmed lynch.

"I don't have anyone to talk to about this, so I'll just drop it here. What the fuck? Why would NU claim Friendly Neighbor and say that he contacted me, when no such thing happened? What in the fuck? Is he banking that I would defend his lie, for some reason? I am so confused by all these players.

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he is hoping the same thing.

Statistically speaking, the chances of him being TPR and trying to conceal it are higher. I will take the gamble and say that I neither confirm nor deny it. "

[Calix]

Where does this fake-claim rank in the history of bad mafia plays?

Second only to THE ONE AND ONLY PALADIN, duh.

[Calix]

Jealous, your scum buddy just claimed.

Please give up. You two just waved a white flag around the thread.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

To be completely honest, I copy+pasted my musings from my QT with Quick without trying to reword it so that I wouldn't potentially throw a TPR into a confirmed lynch.

"I don't have anyone to talk to about this, so I'll just drop it here. What the fuck? Why would NU claim Friendly Neighbor and say that he contacted me, when no such thing happened? What in the fuck? Is he banking that I would defend his lie, for some reason? I am so confused by all these players.

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he is hoping the same thing.

Statistically speaking, the chances of him being TPR and trying to conceal it are higher. I will take the gamble and say that I neither confirm nor deny it. "

This would be an appropriate time to go back to that QT and type in "concede"

[JealousTL]

Jealous, your scum buddy just claimed.

Please give up. You two just waved a white flag around the thread.

The sad part is that I am actually town and I was trying to be cautious, haha.

[Kovath]

To be completely honest, I copy+pasted my musings from my QT with Quick without trying to reword it so that I wouldn't potentially throw a TPR into a confirmed lynch.

"I don't have anyone to talk to about this, so I'll just drop it here. What the fuck? Why would NU claim Friendly Neighbor and say that he contacted me, when no such thing happened? What in the fuck? Is he banking that I would defend his lie, for some reason? I am so confused by all these players.

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he is hoping the same thing.

Statistically speaking, the chances of him being TPR and trying to conceal it are higher. I will take the gamble and say that I neither confirm nor deny it. "

No Townread is stronger than a Neighbor fake-claim.

Again: NO TPR WOULD EVER CLAIM FRIENDLY NEIGHBOR AFTER BEING REDCHECKED LOL

[Titus]

Where does this fake-claim rank in the history of bad mafia plays?

Fakeclaiming friendly neighbor is something that should be orchestrated.

It worked better in InuYasha Mafia where the scum was wagoned, claimed Friendly Neighbor at L-1.
Target dead guy.
Roleblocked.
Target buddy.
Oops, I suddenly remembered 3 shot.

I'm still salty over that game.

P.S. You not pushing me for lurking like a mofo yesterday until I called you out on it was a bad move too.

Overall, decent play. Would love a rematch.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

The sad part is that I am actually town and I was trying to be cautious, haha.

In what world as town do you not know his alignment? He is red checked and is claiming he confirmed himself as town to you. You either KNOW hes town, or KNOW hes fake.

[Calix]

The sad part is that I am actually town and I was trying to be cautious, haha.

Better work on those reads (WIFOM and all) because there is NO town motivation for NU fake-claiming and there is NO way you're not eating rope once he flips.

[Unknown1234]

The sad part is that I am actually town and I was trying to be cautious, haha.

There was no reason to be cautious if he was lying. Nice try.

Can't believe you basically fake-claimed a Mayor on a (probably scum mate) random player.

Group 3

[Kovath]

To be completely honest, I copy+pasted my musings from my QT with Quick without trying to reword it so that I wouldn't potentially throw a TPR into a confirmed lynch.

"I don't have anyone to talk to about this, so I'll just drop it here. What the fuck? Why would NU claim Friendly Neighbor and say that he contacted me, when no such thing happened? What in the fuck? Is he banking that I would defend his lie, for some reason? I am so confused by all these players.

If NU is scum, then he is hoping that my TR on him is stronger than what his fake-claim would make me think, and he wants me to think he is a different TPR.
If NU is town, then he is hoping the same thing.

Statistically speaking, the chances of him being TPR and trying to conceal it are higher. I will take the gamble and say that I neither confirm nor deny it. "

Also, you realize that you said that you are gambling that he is TPR and trying to conceal it, yet your refusal to confirm his claim basically consigns him to death?

This makes no sense.

[JealousTL]

This would be an appropriate time to go back to that QT and type in "concede"

It would save you guys an entire day of setting up a mislynching and scum won't kill me now anyway since I am 100% confirmed mafia to all of you because of my trying to be cautious, so...

Quick Can a townie concede as opposed to getting replaced? As in, /out the game?

[Calix]

Fakeclaiming friendly neighbor is something that should be orchestrated.

It worked better in InuYasha Mafia where the scum was wagoned, claimed Friendly Neighbor at L-1.
Target dead guy.
Roleblocked.
Target buddy.
Oops, I suddenly remembered 3 shot.

I'm still salty over that game.

P.S. You not pushing me for lurking like a mofo yesterday until I called you out on it was a bad move too.

Overall, decent play. Would love a rematch.

/shameless shout-out for my game on-site? :)

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Fakeclaiming friendly neighbor is something that should be orchestrated.

It worked better in InuYasha Mafia where the scum was wagoned, claimed Friendly Neighbor at L-1.
Target dead guy.
Roleblocked.
Target buddy.
Oops, I suddenly remembered 3 shot.

I'm still salty over that game.

P.S. You not pushing me for lurking like a mofo yesterday until I called you out on it was a bad move too.

Overall, decent play. Would love a rematch.

turns otu neither of us are getting mvp.

-vote NU for MVP!!

[Unknown1234]

It would save you guys an entire day of setting up a mislynching and scum won't kill me now anyway since I am 100% confirmed mafia to all of you because of my trying to be cautious, so...

Quick Can a townie concede as opposed to getting replaced? As in, /out the game?

Do you not understand the situation? Why would you want to be cautious here? Please explain your logic.

[Calix]

NU is a MVP vote I can get behind, lmao.

Friendly reminder that the two obvious scum can concede and see if their team-mates can carry to a 1v1 in...two groups.

LOL

[Titus]

/shameless shout-out for my game on-site? :)

You were in that game? That game is like Years old. What's your MS handle?

[JealousTL]

Better work on those reads (WIFOM and all) because there is NO town motivation for NU fake-claiming and there is NO way you're not eating rope once he flips.

My logic was that NU is a TPR; Titus is faking a red-check on him, I thought this because I didn't trust the group that was red-checking him in the first place; NU seems to be in a bind and reaches out to me because I didn't think he was scum, hoping that I would catch on to the fact that his role is important to the game but the only way to save himself is if I confirm that he is Friendly Neighbor and therefore town. Thus NU could live another day and do whatever action he has at night, and Friendly Neighbor is hardly high on mafia to-kill list.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

NU is a MVP vote I can get behind, lmao.

Friendly reminder that the two obvious scum can concede and see if their team-mates can carry to a 1v1 in...two groups.

LOL

1v1? we have like 6 lynches to work with, and they cant kill our lookout, so every kill is roulette LOL

[Calix]

You were in that game? That game is like Years old. What's your MS handle?

Oh no, I was advertising for a game I'm hosting on this site that NU signed for :p

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

My logic was that NU is a TPR; Titus is faking a red-check on him, I thought this because I didn't trust the group that was red-checking him in the first place; NU seems to be in a bind and reaches out to me because I didn't think he was scum, hoping that I would catch on to the fact that his role is important to the game but the only way to save himself is if I confirm that he is Friendly Neighbor and therefore town. Thus NU could live another day and do whatever action he has at night, and Friendly Neighbor is hardly high on mafia to-kill list.

oh shit. 10/10 logic.

-unvote

ITS TITUS GUYS

-vote titus.

[Kovath]

My logic was that NU is a TPR; Titus is faking a red-check on him, I thought this because I didn't trust the group that was red-checking him in the first place; NU seems to be in a bind and reaches out to me because I didn't think he was scum, hoping that I would catch on to the fact that his role is important to the game but the only way to save himself is if I confirm that he is Friendly Neighbor and therefore town. Thus NU could live another day and do whatever action he has at night, and Friendly Neighbor is hardly high on mafia to-kill list.
So if you think this, what you do is confirm his claim...

Sorry, this explanation is not going to cut it.

Also, no role is so important to the game that a slot would rather keep it secret over dying due to red check.

[Unknown1234]

My logic was that NU is a TPR; Titus is faking a red-check on him, I thought this because I didn't trust the group that was red-checking him in the first place; NU seems to be in a bind and reaches out to me because I didn't think he was scum, hoping that I would catch on to the fact that his role is important to the game but the only way to save himself is if I confirm that he is Friendly Neighbor and therefore town. Thus NU could live another day and do whatever action he has at night, and Friendly Neighbor is hardly high on mafia to-kill list.

You would know if he was TPR because his role confirms it to you,

I don't see a world where NU is scum without Jealous. THAT would be even stupider.

[Titus]

Oh no, I was advertising for a game I'm hosting on this site that NU signed for :p

Link me?

@NU/Jealous, I also have a longer game on MS that needs a sub. No hard feelings.

[JealousTL]

Well, I mean, NU pretty much hard-claimed because of my fuck-up anyway, so I no longer have any reason to suspect Titus unless Titus is bussing.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Link me?

@NU/Jealous, I also have a longer game on MS that needs a sub. No hard feelings.

A sub? These two are going to need A tub of ben & Jerrys and a Romantic comedy to get over this one.

[Unknown1234]

Oh yeah for sure Jealous, NU conveniently fake claims a different role whereas if he was a different role he could literally claim and prove it.


:facepalm:

[Titus]

My logic was that NU is a TPR; Titus is faking a red-check on him, I thought this because I didn't trust the group that was red-checking him in the first place; NU seems to be in a bind and reaches out to me because I didn't think he was scum, hoping that I would catch on to the fact that his role is important to the game but the only way to save himself is if I confirm that he is Friendly Neighbor and therefore town. Thus NU could live another day and do whatever action he has at night, and Friendly Neighbor is hardly high on mafia to-kill list.

Occam's Razor

You have NU faking Friendly Neighbor as a different TPR
Me random fake claiming

Just to support NU being town without a friendly neighbor result? Occam's Razor says to re-evaluate your townread.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Well, I mean, NU pretty much hard-claimed because of my fuck-up anyway, so I no longer have any reason to suspect Titus unless Titus is bussing.

You don't suspect the person who caught two mafia anymore? Was it before or after the first mafia fucked up that you were like hmm... titus is probably real.

[Unknown1234]

JealousTL are you going to vote Group 3?

[Never Unlucky]

Fakeclaiming friendly neighbor is something that should be orchestrated.

It worked better in InuYasha Mafia where the scum was wagoned, claimed Friendly Neighbor at L-1.
Target dead guy.
Roleblocked.
Target buddy.
Oops, I suddenly remembered 3 shot.

I'm still salty over that game.

P.S. You not pushing me for lurking like a mofo yesterday until I called you out on it was a bad move too.

Overall, decent play. Would love a rematch.

I'm a really bad scum player. Quick telling you "I'm good" is only true when I roll town (and even then, I have horrendous games). I slipped at least 5 times this game.

I learned what my scum meta was like this game. My activity seems to be AI, tunneling is AI of my town play, and being an asshole makes me town (Those are my own observations).

I'd like a rematch as well.

[JealousTL]

So if you think this, what you do is confirm his claim...

Sorry, this explanation is not going to cut it.

Also, no role is so important to the game that a slot would rather keep it secret over dying due to red check.

But, if he is scum, and I confirm his claim and he gets lynched, then town wastes another day mislynching me, which would be bad. Hence my intention to not confirm or deny.


You would know if he was TPR because his role confirms it to you,

I don't see a world where NU is scum without Jealous. THAT would be even stupider.

Yea, if NU is #2 worst scum play on this site then I will gladly claim #1 worst town play right now.

[Calix]

Link me?

@NU/Jealous, I also have a longer game on MS that needs a sub. No hard feelings.

Tah dah. (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/37577-Sign-Ups-S-FM-Give-or-Take)


A sub? These two are going to need A tub of ben & Jerrys and a Romantic comedy to get over this one.

So...shall we talk about who the G1 scum would be given that two of the scum have just surrendered?

[Titus]

A sub? These two are going to need A tub of ben & Jerrys and a Romantic comedy to get over this one.

A sub = a replacement.

[Kovath]

Well, I mean, NU pretty much hard-claimed because of my fuck-up anyway, so I no longer have any reason to suspect Titus unless Titus is bussing.
Why would Titus bus her teammate with a hard red check, a teammate who wasn't really under pressure for most of D1 except by myself, Duck, secondpassing? Compared to others in the group?

Like, it's possible, but...? Lookout is also a challenging role to fake-claim I think and gambles that there isn't another one.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I'm a really bad scum player. Quick telling you "I'm good" is only true when I roll town (and even then, I have horrendous games). I slipped at least 5 times this game.

I learned what my scum meta was like this game. My activity seems to be AI, tunneling is AI of my town play, and being an asshole makes me town (Those are my own observations).

I'd like a rematch as well.

Was I right about the traitor slip with the "the" vs "a"??

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Tah dah. (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/37577-Sign-Ups-S-FM-Give-or-Take)



So...shall we talk about who the G1 scum would be given that two of the scum have just surrendered?

klingon. Hard against myself/titus/yuki (yuki confirmed town after NU dies and split, titus almost always town, and I know my alignment)
After that we got some lynches to guess.

[JealousTL]

Oh yeah for sure Jealous, NU conveniently fake claims a different role whereas if he was a different role he could literally claim and prove it.


:facepalm:

If his role was important, how could he claim and prove it? What if his role turned nothing up last night? He would just be NK this night after claiming it without sharing the results.


JealousTL are you going to vote Group 3?

Yup.

Group 3

[The Godfather]

Group 3 has been lynched! Stand by for the host's review and day-end post!


Group 3 ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/28675') (8 [L-0]): Titus ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634838'), PLZLEAVEDUCKK ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634848'), JealousTL ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635111'), secondpassing ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634890'), Yukitaka Oni ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634893'), Calix ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634956'), Kovath ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635023'), Unknown1234 ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635082')
Group 1 ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/28673') (2 [L-6]): Klingoncelt ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634917'), Never Unlucky ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=634979')

[Quick]

Group 3 has been chosen to lynch from.

Gingerape
Kovath
Yukitaka Oni
Never Unlucky

You four are not allowed to vote.

With 10 players voting, it takes 6 to lynch. 6

Day ends in:

End of DP: I: Day 2 Ends in:

01:13:00:00

Titus
Shapelog
Unknown1234
Klingoncelt
Alles_Paletti
Calix
JealousTL
SuperJack
PLZLEAVEDUCKK
secondpassing

[secondpassing]

Hi.

[Quick]

That's what I got from reading the setup thread but I could be wrong. I'd check that now in case he changed it. Also I'll ask:
Quick


Are scum PRs/ TPRs unique?

Yes. All Scum/TPR are unique.

[Quick]

It would save you guys an entire day of setting up a mislynching and scum won't kill me now anyway since I am 100% confirmed mafia to all of you because of my trying to be cautious, so...

Quick Can a townie concede as opposed to getting replaced? As in, /out the game?

They can hammer themselves if that's what you're asking.

[Titus]

Never Unlucky

Let's get the fastest lynch ever.

I kinda feel JTL may be town but the lynch has to happen on them. No way can that be tolerated no matter how charmingly derpy Jealous is.

[secondpassing]

I forget if that if we hammer we lose time to discuss or something.

Pretty sure we should use this time to think G1 and G2 scums.

[secondpassing]

So G1. Does anyone have an opinion on these players? I think i read all of them as scum.

But if Titus claims the red check, that would more mean she is town.

[secondpassing]

#basicmath

[secondpassing]

I feel we should not vote G2 tomorrow. If we do, we lose another town voice.

We can simply go ahead and -mute JealousTL and whoever replaces SuperJack (because they probably won't follow the thread)

[Titus]

We know Group 3 has NU as scum.

Our search should require rereading to see who deferred on NU because "Too Risky".
Group 2 is likely Jack or Jealous.

Group 1 is likely Klingon or Unknown, just based on spew prior to the revelation of my check.

[secondpassing]

I think Unknown is scum.
/discuss

[Titus]

So G1. Does anyone have an opinion on these players? I think i read all of them as scum.

But if Titus claims the red check, that would more mean she is town.

Red Check obviously claimed. LOL

NU was the sole visitor other than myself to RLVG.

[secondpassing]

Red Check obviously claimed. LOL

NU was the sole visitor other than myself to RLVG.
Call me stupid but I'm just a little (just a little) but paranoid that it was all A TRAP . (bus)

[Calix]

Hello I made a mini-ISO of NU's posts. It's a bit of a mess right now and super-lazy but I can dump the thing and work on it later.

I'll just get it up now.

[Calix]

NEVER UNLUCKY

#57: Throws shade on Spruance's posts, calls him "lurking troll and dumb town". Characterises Jealous as "who we know few about", low-key pushes for a PL on Spruance/ Slayer (with 'maybe Jealous' in brackets). #88 furthers the 'frustrated at Spruance' narrative.
#218: 'Early T-R on Jealous'
#234: Thinks Duck is honest. 'doesn't like Gingerape so far' (weird read there)
#239: This..."2) I know that you've said that you can 180 people you previously town-read, but I don't understand why Kovath is your #2 when you clearly stated that you weren't lynching him today because your D2 reads on him were better. He didn't post since you made your reads list either. Care to explain why he's #2? He's also sitting in a similar spot as RLVG as he's only posted once. Why is RLVG more important of a lynch to you? 3 and 4) Other than Gingerape's town tone, I haven't noticed anything AI in their posts. I wouldn't (Vocally) support their lynch today."
#244: [On Gingerape] "He's thrown shade on Duck by mentioning the possibility of him being the traitor (which is a possibility), but he didn't push the idea and he kept his tone. It's the opposite of what Eggy and MattZed did in IC to you: they mentioned the possibility of you being scum and killing Mesk who was defending you for town cred and pushed the idea to discredit you. Ginger isn't doing this. Yes, IIOA is a scum-tell just like town tone is a town-tell. I don't feel like any of these points are over-shadowing the other atm (especially after mislynching SP in BN who showed many scum-tells while still having a town tone), so I conclude null."
#245: [On PLZLEAVEDUCKK] "It's not that your posts don't make sense, it's more that you contradict yourself (sometimes in the same post, lol) and flip-flop your opinions quickly. This is something my 'good buddy' Eggy does a lot as scum, so I am intrigued to know what goes through your head when you make said posts. It seems to be NAI for you though, so I'll just have to get used to it."
Town-reads Jealous but insults his posting style.
AND "Because there's nothing to be said about group 1. 3 inactive players asking to be PLed, Titus (null for me), and Shapelog being the scummiest with his "Oh, I didn't know there was X mafia" comment doesn't propose an educated lynch."
#249: HIS "READS":
"Titus, Yuki, Ginger, Kovath, RLVG - null
Shapelog - null-leaning-scum
Calix - Lean-town
Jealous - Town
Duck - I trust his claim and would like to keep him at least until D2 to see how his role and play evolve."
[also pushes for a policy-lynch]
#251: Expresses confusion and possible derision at Yuki
#255: [to Yukitaka Oni] "Why are you contradicting yourself?"
#262, #271 and some other posts that I can't be arsed to add: Makes some half-arsed pushes on Yuki
#292: [to Klingoncelt]: "B) That can't be all you say 284 posts in."
#343: Defends Duck's claim. "This whole claim is WIFOM based. Do you believe that he’s scum trying not to be lynched D1 or do you believe in his claim? I reject the first wine cup because :
He drew a lot of attention on him with his claim. I doubt scum would draw this much attention onto themselves this early on. Scum would probably keep the claim for themselves which may be what someone else is doing atm.
Also, such a claim would guarantee that an investigative role checks him tonight. Dunno why scum would risk it.
Are you suggesting that he could be in a third faction?"
#406: MORE READS ON THE G3 PLAYERS
"Yuki - Gut tells me he's town, but I don't really find town motives behind his posts. I know you'll discredit me for this, but I think that he's too "dumb to be scum".
It felt weird that he called out Group 3 for not scum-hunting each other when he hasn't been doing it himself.
Ginger - Town tone, posts feel like IIOA, and I'm questioning the motives behind saying that Shapelog stole the "oh I didn't know how many scum there were, I am therefore town" thing from him.
Kovath - Politico-scum!Kovath (and IC-neutral!Kovath during day 2) kept his activity to a bare minimum due to RL events and flew under the town's radar. His inactivity this game feels like Déjà vu in that sense. Could be a coincidence.
Found his reasoning for town-reading RLVG unnatural, it felt like something Unknown would say.
RLVG - Well reasoned player whose posts I like. Didn't notice anything AI in his comments yet."
#413: [to secondpassing] "I'm intrigued by this read. Klingoncelt hasn't done anything that warrants a town-read"
#431: [to Yukitaka Oni] "Why are you asking me this? It almost feels like a scum soft-claim."
#439: "I personally don't see the difference between Yuki and Ginger's plays. What makes you feel like Ginger feels towny and not Yuki ?"
#440: "Your post has me intrigued too. I realize that I consider both of these slots to be the same due to play style (Trolly) , yet I am giving Yuki a favorable read and not Ginger. Will reflect on that."
#449: [on PLZLEAVEDUCKK] "I think it's weird that people accepted your claim like cash."
#521: "Shapelog using the "I didn't know how many mafs there were, I am town" argument is scummy at worst, noob at best. Judging by his previous posts I highly doubt that he is a noob, and thus reject the noob idea. I think he pulled the 'NeverUnlucky' (I am noob, don't push me -- from POLITICO).

GingerApe -- It is possible that she(?) was trying to draw attention to Shapelog's scummy comment by saying she was going to use it though I do not think it is the case given the trolly manner of delivery. Her mentionning this is trolly at best, scummy at worst. I do not know why a scum would willfully make this comment and draw attention on his case, so WIFOM."
[to Gingerape] "It's not between you and her, not in my book at least. I have my money on you/Kovath though I appreciate your tone. Would you explain your motives when you made the "aw, Shapelog stole my 'idk how many mafs there are' argument"? It seemed pretty scummy."
#527: Explains town-reads on Jealous and myself
#543: Claims KC's scum teams are "based on nothing" + MORE G3 READS
"I like that you’re trying to scum-hunt me, albeit in a hypocritical way. Some of your points are also caricatures of my posts, and they give me a strong feeling that you’re trying to paint me as scum.
I dislike that you town-read RLVG « because he is pushing Duck », it’s NAI. It’s as easy to do this for scum to deflect off of a pressured scum.
Feels weird that you start being active when your group is being voted and not before.

I’m still not sure what to make of Yuki’s posts. I’d normally scum-read someone who doesn’t contribute the way Yuki does, but she looks and feels like just an innocent townie, idk how to explain.
I’m curious to know what the ploy she’s talking about constantly is.

Ginger seems like he doesn’t care if he’s mislynched as long as Yuki lives which is not what he should be doing if he is town (He is confirmed town to himself). Then again, would scum give up like that?

RLVG giving SuperJack and me technical tips looks like what a scum would do to change the subject though it’s more likely that he was simply being a good guy."
#559: [on Kovath] "HO HO! Looking at my prodding from the scum angle rather than the town angle like you told me to do in the BG, saying that my prodding is very simplistic when it is NOT the case, claiming that my "don't take a vacation, give reads instead" comment on RLVG was opportunistic when it was just an original way of asking for his reads without directly pinging him."
#600: [on Shapelog] "Why were you T-Ring him? Don't you find his posts to be 'superficial'? He's only been trolling and playing le noob card." + some weird coaching/ prodding for JealousTL's reads
#726: [on Gingerape] "The town tone here cannot be unseen. Also being willing to be lynched instead of her good friend (How noble and cute ^^) is TOWN AF. Scum would feel the need to survive and push for someone else which looks more like Kovath's play."
#739: [to secondpassing] Throws shade on a Yuki town-read; likes SP for 'pinging people so actively' (lolwut); calls out and challenges klingoncelt for sheep-vote/ discrediting Calix
#790: Scum-reads both Titus and klingoncelt for their interactions/ KC sheeping Titus, concludes that "it's unhealthy and scummy but too obvious to be one"

[Calix]

Okay, that formatting went horribly wrong.

[Never Unlucky]

Hello I made a mini-ISO of NU's posts. It's a bit of a mess right now and super-lazy but I can dump the thing and work on it later.

I'll just get it up now.

yay

[Calix]

NEVER UNLUCKY



#57: Throws shade on Spruance's posts, calls him "lurking troll and dumb town". Characterises Jealous as "who we know few about", low-key pushes for a PL on Spruance/ Slayer (with 'maybe Jealous' in brackets). #88 furthers the 'frustrated at Spruance' narrative.
#218: 'Early T-R on Jealous'
#234: Thinks Duck is honest. 'doesn't like Gingerape so far' (weird read there)
#239: This..."2) I know that you've said that you can 180 people you previously town-read, but I don't understand why Kovath is your #2 when you clearly stated that you weren't lynching him today because your D2 reads on him were better. He didn't post since you made your reads list either. Care to explain why he's #2? He's also sitting in a similar spot as RLVG as he's only posted once. Why is RLVG more important of a lynch to you? 3 and 4) Other than Gingerape's town tone, I haven't noticed anything AI in their posts. I wouldn't (Vocally) support their lynch today."
#244: [On Gingerape] "He's thrown shade on Duck by mentioning the possibility of him being the traitor (which is a possibility), but he didn't push the idea and he kept his tone. It's the opposite of what Eggy and MattZed did in IC to you: they mentioned the possibility of you being scum and killing Mesk who was defending you for town cred and pushed the idea to discredit you. Ginger isn't doing this. Yes, IIOA is a scum-tell just like town tone is a town-tell. I don't feel like any of these points are over-shadowing the other atm (especially after mislynching SP in BN who showed many scum-tells while still having a town tone), so I conclude null."
#245: [On PLZLEAVEDUCKK] "It's not that your posts don't make sense, it's more that you contradict yourself (sometimes in the same post, lol) and flip-flop your opinions quickly. This is something my 'good buddy' Eggy does a lot as scum, so I am intrigued to know what goes through your head when you make said posts. It seems to be NAI for you though, so I'll just have to get used to it."
Town-reads Jealous but insults his posting style.
AND "Because there's nothing to be said about group 1. 3 inactive players asking to be PLed, Titus (null for me), and Shapelog being the scummiest with his "Oh, I didn't know there was X mafia" comment doesn't propose an educated lynch."
#249: HIS "READS":
"Titus, Yuki, Ginger, Kovath, RLVG - null
Shapelog - null-leaning-scum
Calix - Lean-town
Jealous - Town
Duck - I trust his claim and would like to keep him at least until D2 to see how his role and play evolve."
[also pushes for a policy-lynch]
#251: Expresses confusion and possible derision at Yuki
#255: [to Yukitaka Oni] "Why are you contradicting yourself?"
#262, #271 and some other posts that I can't be arsed to add: Makes some half-arsed pushes on Yuki
#292: [to Klingoncelt]: "B) That can't be all you say 284 posts in."
#343: Defends Duck's claim. "This whole claim is WIFOM based. Do you believe that he’s scum trying not to be lynched D1 or do you believe in his claim? I reject the first wine cup because :
He drew a lot of attention on him with his claim. I doubt scum would draw this much attention onto themselves this early on. Scum would probably keep the claim for themselves which may be what someone else is doing atm.
Also, such a claim would guarantee that an investigative role checks him tonight. Dunno why scum would risk it.
Are you suggesting that he could be in a third faction?"
#406: MORE READS ON THE G3 PLAYERS
"Yuki - Gut tells me he's town, but I don't really find town motives behind his posts. I know you'll discredit me for this, but I think that he's too "dumb to be scum".
It felt weird that he called out Group 3 for not scum-hunting each other when he hasn't been doing it himself.
Ginger - Town tone, posts feel like IIOA, and I'm questioning the motives behind saying that Shapelog stole the "oh I didn't know how many scum there were, I am therefore town" thing from him.
Kovath - Politico-scum!Kovath (and IC-neutral!Kovath during day 2) kept his activity to a bare minimum due to RL events and flew under the town's radar. His inactivity this game feels like Déjà vu in that sense. Could be a coincidence.
Found his reasoning for town-reading RLVG unnatural, it felt like something Unknown would say.
RLVG - Well reasoned player whose posts I like. Didn't notice anything AI in his comments yet."
#413: [to secondpassing] "I'm intrigued by this read. Klingoncelt hasn't done anything that warrants a town-read"
#431: [to Yukitaka Oni] "Why are you asking me this? It almost feels like a scum soft-claim."
#439: "I personally don't see the difference between Yuki and Ginger's plays. What makes you feel like Ginger feels towny and not Yuki ?"
#440: "Your post has me intrigued too. I realize that I consider both of these slots to be the same due to play style (Trolly) , yet I am giving Yuki a favorable read and not Ginger. Will reflect on that."
#449: [on PLZLEAVEDUCKK] "I think it's weird that people accepted your claim like cash."
#521: "Shapelog using the "I didn't know how many mafs there were, I am town" argument is scummy at worst, noob at best. Judging by his previous posts I highly doubt that he is a noob, and thus reject the noob idea. I think he pulled the 'NeverUnlucky' (I am noob, don't push me -- from POLITICO).


GingerApe -- It is possible that she(?) was trying to draw attention to Shapelog's scummy comment by saying she was going to use it though I do not think it is the case given the trolly manner of delivery. Her mentionning this is trolly at best, scummy at worst. I do not know why a scum would willfully make this comment and draw attention on his case, so WIFOM."
[to Gingerape] "It's not between you and her, not in my book at least. I have my money on you/Kovath though I appreciate your tone. Would you explain your motives when you made the "aw, Shapelog stole my 'idk how many mafs there are' argument"? It seemed pretty scummy."
#527: Explains town-reads on Jealous and myself
#543: Claims KC's scum teams are "based on nothing" + MORE G3 READS
"I like that you’re trying to scum-hunt me, albeit in a hypocritical way. Some of your points are also caricatures of my posts, and they give me a strong feeling that you’re trying to paint me as scum.
I dislike that you town-read RLVG « because he is pushing Duck », it’s NAI. It’s as easy to do this for scum to deflect off of a pressured scum.
Feels weird that you start being active when your group is being voted and not before.


I’m still not sure what to make of Yuki’s posts. I’d normally scum-read someone who doesn’t contribute the way Yuki does, but she looks and feels like just an innocent townie, idk how to explain.
I’m curious to know what the ploy she’s talking about constantly is.


Ginger seems like he doesn’t care if he’s mislynched as long as Yuki lives which is not what he should be doing if he is town (He is confirmed town to himself). Then again, would scum give up like that?


RLVG giving SuperJack and me technical tips looks like what a scum would do to change the subject though it’s more likely that he was simply being a good guy."
#559: [on Kovath] "HO HO! Looking at my prodding from the scum angle rather than the town angle like you told me to do in the BG, saying that my prodding is very simplistic when it is NOT the case, claiming that my "don't take a vacation, give reads instead" comment on RLVG was opportunistic when it was just an original way of asking for his reads without directly pinging him."
#600: [on Shapelog] "Why were you T-Ring him? Don't you find his posts to be 'superficial'? He's only been trolling and playing le noob card." + some weird coaching/ prodding for JealousTL's reads
#726: [on Gingerape] "The town tone here cannot be unseen. Also being willing to be lynched instead of her good friend (How noble and cute ^^) is TOWN AF. Scum would feel the need to survive and push for someone else which looks more like Kovath's play."
#739: [to secondpassing] Throws shade on a Yuki town-read; likes SP for 'pinging people so actively' (lolwut); calls out and challenges klingoncelt for sheep-vote/ discrediting Calix
#790: Scum-reads both Titus and klingoncelt for their interactions/ KC sheeping Titus, concludes that "it's unhealthy and scummy but too obvious to be one"

[Gingerape]

i can't read black ;~;

[Titus]

Does Unknown interact with NU prior to the claim?

[secondpassing]

Unless Calix, you're about to sleep or something. You could have just kept it in a notepad?

That was basically like 5 posts. Would appreciate a summary of your thoughts on it.

[secondpassing]

Does Unknown interact with NU prior to the claim?
Hey Unknown. Interact with NU please.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Never Unlucky

Let's get the fastest lynch ever.

I kinda feel JTL may be town but the lynch has to happen on them. No way can that be tolerated no matter how charmingly derpy Jealous is.
Hold your horse. We still have one day to disscusion about tomorrow. Don't wasted it

[Never Unlucky]

Hey Unknown. Interact with NU please.

I don't think he's in the mood of posting tonight.

[JealousTL]

So, no voting for NU until around deadline tomorrow?

[Never Unlucky]

No, hammer me now. I may get away if ISIS orchestrates a mega electromagnetic pulse attack on the planet and shuts down all computers. Then I'll get the chance to kill one extra person from my group.

Yeah. Voting me now is the best thing you could do.

[JealousTL]

Quick, what would happen if I hammer myself? Will the day end? Will town lose the chance to lynch? Doesn't make sense for that to be the case, in my opinion.

[Titus]

JealousTL, If you're town, you should claim and have other townies direct your action tonight.

I'm going to be out for the night. Please just get the confscum lynch off. We can meet tomorrow to discuss associatives.

[Never Unlucky]

Quick, what would happen if I hammer myself? Will the day end? Will town lose the chance to lynch? Doesn't make sense for that to be the case, in my opinion.

I read the setup thread again, and suicide doesn't seem to be prohibited.

Honestly, Jealous, you're a cool dude. I enjoyed reading your posts though your typing style makes you look like you have a pencil stuck in the butt. I would like to see you play in future games on this site where I (hopefully) don't act like a complete idiot.

Also, what is you first language? Russian?

[Calix]

Does Unknown interact with NU prior to the claim?

I don't think so.


Unless Calix, you're about to sleep or something. You could have just kept it in a notepad?

That was basically like 5 posts. Would appreciate a summary of your thoughts on it.

Well I was just desperate to get the summary out there ASAP so that people would like, discuss it?

Have been busy the past few hours and it's getting late so no deep analysis over here.

I recall that he kissed my arse to the high heavens, flip-flopped with his Ginger read, made some half-arsed pushes on Kovath and Yuki, null-scum-read Shapelog and asked a question to SJ that was designed to discredit Shapelog, has a few sharp interactions with Klingoncelt...that's the gist of it I think.


@JealousTL (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28650), If you're town, you should claim and have other townies direct your action tonight.

I'm going to be out for the night. Please just get the confscum lynch off. We can meet tomorrow to discuss associatives.

NU has basically scum-claimed. He is going NOWHERE.

We should use the rest of the day to discuss it and organise tomorrow if we get more confirmed townies and shit.

Please don't quick-hammer. We have the votes and the time.

[JealousTL]

JealousTL, If you're town, you should claim and have other townies direct your action tonight.

I'm going to be out for the night. Please just get the confscum lynch off. We can meet tomorrow to discuss associatives.

Fortunately/unfortunately, I am just a regular Citizen.


I read the setup thread again, and suicide doesn't seem to be prohibited.

Honestly, Jealous, you're a cool dude. I enjoyed reading your posts though your typing style makes you look like you have a pencil stuck in the butt. I would like to see you play in future games on this site where I (hopefully) don't act like a complete idiot.

Also, what is you first language? Russian?

Thanks! Like I said, I can't help it =_= It's just how I write.

My first language is Russian, yes.


We should use the rest of the day to discuss it and organise tomorrow if we get more confirmed townies and shit.

Please don't quick-hammer. We have the votes and the time.

I just wanted to find out what the consequences would be. If town wants to lynch me, and I can suicide and not cost anything to town, I will do that. That way town can focus on more pertinent targets.