S-FM 209: Surreptitious: The Game of Spies

[Never Unlucky]

While that's less helpful to the town than the possibility of 4 confirmed townies, I wouldn't go as far as to call "having a 40% chance of mafia being lynched D1 and making all groups 1:1:1" an incentive for the scum. The reason it's not enough to make me change my stance is because I can't think of a game-based reason for scum to want G3.

Like maybe they think their G3 scum player is fucking amazing but given that none of the G3 players get anywhere close to that, I'm just going to assume that isn't the case now.

zzz

[Unknown1234]

Does Unknown interact with NU prior to the claim?

I said I thought it was a TvT before JTL cc'd his claim. I've only posted like, 3 times.

[Unknown1234]

Hey Unknown. Interact with NU please.

What...?

[Unknown1234]

Never Unlucky

[Never Unlucky]

Never Unlucky

On what grounds?

[Unknown1234]

On what grounds?

You are confirmed scum. I don't know if this is some sort of trick to frame me, but there's no reason to question only my vote.

[JealousTL]

On what grounds?

Hahahahhahaha

[Titus]

Coffee grounds. Those are the grounds upon which we vote.

[Calix]

zzz

Looks like I was right about something.


[vote]Never Unlucky


You are confirmed scum. I don't know if this is some sort of trick to frame me, but there's no reason to question only my vote.

Ew what the fuck? Who even votes this early?

It's obvious that NU's getting lynched. Voting does nothing.

[secondpassing]

I said I thought it was a TvT before JTL cc'd his claim. I've only posted like, 3 times.
Hey Unknown are you caught up? Don't you have any thoughts? We are trying to catch the other scum.

Can you help us find them? If so, who do you think it is?

[Gingerape]

Awww. I just got caught up.
I feel soo bad for Never Unlucky ;~; I guess this time he got Unlucky.
-faint applause is heard-
So am I a town now? ^^

[JealousTL]

Coffee grounds. Those are the grounds upon which we vote.

This reminds me of a similar situation that played out on Battle.net between one of TL's trolly admins in a 3v3 Starcraft game. It went like this:

intrigue set latency to extra high.
Ace-G set latency to low.
Hot_Bid set latency to extra high.
0:21 - Hot_Bid: extra high = more skill
0:36 - Ace-G: on what basis?
0:42 - Hot_Bid: on 4 bases, home run
0:53 - Ace-G: damn can't win that argument

Cracks me up every time I remember it.

[Kovath]

Unknown's vote on Never Unlucky suggests to me that he's scum rather than dumb being oblivious.

Unknown is really not that dumb or quick to vote on a day in which we literally have a confirmed scum and SHOULD NEVER QUICKHAMMER I SWEAR TO GOD DO NOT DO THAT LOL

[Kovath]

Unknown's vote on Never Unlucky suggests to me that he's scum rather than dumb being oblivious.

Unknown is really not that dumb or quick to vote on a day in which we literally have a confirmed scum and SHOULD NEVER QUICKHAMMER I SWEAR TO GOD DO NOT DO THAT LOL

change the "dumb" in the first line to -> "town who hasn't caught up"

[Never Unlucky]

Unknown's vote on Never Unlucky suggests to me that he's scum rather than dumb being oblivious.

Unknown is really not that dumb or quick to vote on a day in which we literally have a confirmed scum and SHOULD NEVER QUICKHAMMER I SWEAR TO GOD DO NOT DO THAT LOL

If I beat you in a chess game, would you accept being lynched in my place? I suck and have 1250 elo I think.

[Klingoncelt]

Ok, with people dropping it's rather important to be a little more direct.

Someone in me/duck/yuki/second passing is a lookout that saw NU kill RLVG.

More like someone in you/Duck/Yuki/Second Passing is Scum that killed RLVG.

[Never Unlucky]

More like someone in you/Duck/Yuki/Second Passing is Scum that killed RLVG.

http://i.giphy.com/3osxYcafC7tkcBQT60.gif

[Kovath]

If I beat you in a chess game, would you accept being lynched in my place? I suck and have 1250 elo I think.

...Ummm...

I think that accepting that challenge might be playing against my win condition though :P

[secondpassing]

If I beat you in a chess game, would you accept being lynched in my place? I suck and have 1250 elo I think.
We should totally play. I have like the same elo.

[Unknown1234]

Unknown's vote on Never Unlucky suggests to me that he's scum rather than dumb being oblivious.

Unknown is really not that dumb or quick to vote on a day in which we literally have a confirmed scum and SHOULD NEVER QUICKHAMMER I SWEAR TO GOD DO NOT DO THAT LOL

It's the second vote and we need 4 more, I'm not really going to worry about 4 quick votes on a scum.

[Never Unlucky]

We should totally play. I have like the same elo.

You're in group 2 :/

Also, I just realised that I slaughtered RLVG, one of the two fathers of Forum Chess. I do not know how to make a board with pieces.

[JealousTL]

It's the second vote and we need 4 more, I'm not really going to worry about 4 quick votes on a scum.

o_O While it is true that if 4 people vote for NU right now they would probably draw unnecessary suspicion to themselves, it only takes one or two more townies to vote as you did and dilute the mix. NU can vote for himself too.

[JealousTL]

Fuck I'm dumb, erase the "NU can vote for himself too." Thing.

[Never Unlucky]

Fuck I'm dumb, erase the "NU can vote for himself too." Thing.

For the record, even if I was allowed to vote, I wouldn't be able to vote for myself. The vote just wouldn't register.

[Klingoncelt]

It's simple, we blame him for RLVG death, then we lynch him. Then we boil him, cook him, eat him. Ohhhhhhhh......yessssssss..........

Okay, that's funny. lol

[Never Unlucky]

Jealous, you should /sign to Calix's upcoming game. ^^

[secondpassing]

You're in group 2 :/

Also, I just realised that I slaughtered RLVG, one of the two fathers of Forum Chess. I do not know how to make a board with pieces.

Yeah me neither. I never even learned to move the pieces.
You say you're awesome at the mod, what's your win rate?

[Never Unlucky]

Yeah me neither. I never even learned to move the pieces.
You say you're awesome at the mod, what's your win rate?
I don't remember saying I am awesome :c

~80%

[secondpassing]

I don't remember saying I am awesome :c

~80%

Oh crap. How many games is that out of btw?
To put this in perspective, I've only a 60% win.
Quick you didnt answer my quicktopic question.

[Never Unlucky]

700+

[JealousTL]

Jealous, you should /sign to Calix's upcoming game. ^^

I'm not sure that's a good idea, haha ;-;

[Klingoncelt]

Well.

I'm all caught up now.

So I was wrong about Titus.

This means I have to totally re-read everyone.

[Klingoncelt]

Sorry, Titus, I really did think you were Scum.

[Klingoncelt]

I don't know if I'll be back here in time for deadline, so I'll come back later tonight and vote for NU.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

yukitaka oni

told you guys he was scum.

[Yukitaka Oni]

I read the setup thread again, and suicide doesn't seem to be prohibited.

Honestly, Jealous, you're a cool dude. I enjoyed reading your posts though your typing style makes you look like you have a pencil stuck in the butt. I would like to see you play in future games on this site where I (hopefully) don't act like a complete idiot.

Also, what is you first language? Russian?
Da

[Yukitaka Oni]

More like someone in you/Duck/Yuki/Second Passing is Scum that killed RLVG.


http://i.giphy.com/3osxYcafC7tkcBQT60.gif
You done fked up now.....
https://camo.derpicdn.net/1e503d4966816e5e84de398a827ff0a69f7e865f?url=http% 3A%2F%2Fi0.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Foriginal%2F000%2F896%2 F601%2F138.gif

[Yukitaka Oni]

yukitaka oni

told you guys he was scum.
.....claim other people is scum
Vote me
Not sure if retard on purpose or trying to save Never unlucky.
I will handle this question to Calix to make you answer to Calix instead.

[Klingoncelt]

Never Unlucky

I have a headache and a nosebleed, I'm going to sleep now.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Never Unlucky

I have a headache and a nosebleed, I'm going to sleep now.
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/888/298/ea8.png
Be safe ok? This year we already lost some respected mod

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

.....claim other people is scum
Vote me
Not sure if retard on purpose or trying to save Never unlucky.
I will handle this question to Calix to make you answer to Calix instead.

:D After how hard I fought for you all game you doubt me!! No faith YUKI NO FAITH.

Scum want the day to end, just voting you for fun. ( or am I !!)

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Never Unlucky

I have a headache and a nosebleed, I'm going to sleep now.

You should learn to cherish these things, you won't have a head after it is wrapped around a noose.

[Yukitaka Oni]

:D After how hard I fought for you all game you doubt me!! No faith YUKI NO FAITH.

Scum want the day to end, just voting you for fun. ( or am I !!)
v)o.o)> oh ok. I take that back

[Quick]

End of DP: II paused while I search for a replacement for SuperJack.

[Calix]

More like someone in you/Duck/Yuki/Second Passing is Scum that killed RLVG.


It's the second vote and we need 4 more, I'm not really going to worry about 4 quick votes on a scum.


[vote]Never Unlucky

I have a headache and a nosebleed, I'm going to sleep now.


Unknown's vote on Never Unlucky suggests to me that he's scum rather than town being oblivious.

Unknown is really not that dumb or quick to vote on a day in which we literally have a confirmed scum and SHOULD NEVER QUICKHAMMER I SWEAR TO GOD DO NOT DO THAT LOL

Given how Unknown/ KC have been interacting (what the FUCK is the point of voting now? It just makes it more likely that NU gets hammered sooner, lmao) I'm inclined to agree.

Unknown doesn't even have a reason why he's early-voting; his justification is "HE ONLY HAS TWO VOTES LOL" which still doesn't explain why he felt the need to do it NOW as opposed to LATER.

If Jealous is scum then the other two scum are going to have a hard time. They can only kill a G3 tonight and Titus is all but confirmed as an Investigative so they have a high chance of the kill fucking up.

Although I have no idea what group would be chosen if NU is the only G3 scum, so it's probably not going to be that simple.

[Quick]

Firebringer replaces SuperJack

[Firebringer]

I am here.
Playing forum mafia.

Lord help me.

Anyways, sum things up.
Ill try to read everything from Day 2 flip onwards.
Summaries and notes, are always appreciated.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

frEEEEEEEEEEEEdommmmmmmmm
Firebringer

two scum slipped defending a titus lookout claim and now we are deciding on what to do going forward. Yuki/kovath/ginger SHOULD become confirmed town after never unlucky is lynched.

Oh and you are widely read as mafia by POE, sooooo if you are town good luck defending that as a replacement.

[Firebringer]

frEEEEEEEEEEEEdommmmmmmmm
Firebringer

two scum slipped defending a titus lookout claim and now we are deciding on what to do going forward. Yuki/kovath/ginger SHOULD become confirmed town after never unlucky is lynched.

Oh and you are widely read as mafia by POE, sooooo if you are town good luck defending that as a replacement.

Who scum slipped?
Why is my slot read as scum?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Who scum slipped?
Why is my slot read as scum?

Never unlucky was red checked, and claimed he was a friendly neighbor who told jealoustl that he was town. Jealoustl kind of hesitated and came up with some weird theories and ended up slipping that it was a fake claim, but not out right denying it.

Almost confirms NU and TL being a pair based on the interaction, with the idea of NU taking a town read player down with him very small.

Your slot has about 2 posts total between the two previous players and it came up with a weird theory involving something I was a part of which was very odd IMO. Calix, Jealoustl(now almost confirmed mafia) and secondpassing were extremely town. Your slot pretty much fit into every world of two. Now that we know Jealous is town with NU, it is looking like a klingon/firebringer/jealoustl/never unlucky world.

[Firebringer]

Never unlucky was red checked, and claimed he was a friendly neighbor who told jealoustl that he was town. Jealoustl kind of hesitated and came up with some weird theories and ended up slipping that it was a fake claim, but not out right denying it.

Almost confirms NU and TL being a pair based on the interaction, with the idea of NU taking a town read player down with him very small.

Your slot has about 2 posts total between the two previous players and it came up with a weird theory involving something I was a part of which was very odd IMO. Calix, Jealoustl(now almost confirmed mafia) and secondpassing were extremely town. Your slot pretty much fit into every world of two. Now that we know Jealous is town with NU, it is looking like a klingon/firebringer/jealoustl/never unlucky world.

Works for me:
Never Unlucky

Except that theory stuff or w/e.

[JealousTL]

For the record, I still maintain that I am town. Just a very dumb town who thought he was cautious. And will suicide if there is no consequence to that action in order to save town a lynch if need-be. Quick, can you confirm that town will suffer any consequences from my suicide, apart from losing a townie? In other words, will the day end or the lynch be wasted?

Also, I suggest you unvote NU for now so that Day 2 doesn't end early.

[JealousTL]

if scum haven't voted for NU yet, they could hammer it now and town would lose a whole day of potential scum-hunting.

[JealousTL]

^ Was just elaborating on what I said earlier so that Firebringer could be caught up with the current plan, wasn't trying to give scum (admittedly obvious) ideas =_='

[Titus]

Jealous claim.

[Firebringer]

Titus doesn't even say hi to me?
What even is this?

[JealousTL]

Already claimed, regular Citizen.

[Firebringer]

For the record, I still maintain that I am town. Just a very dumb town who thought he was cautious. And will suicide if there is no consequence to that action in order to save town a lynch if need-be. Quick, can you confirm that town will suffer any consequences from my suicide, apart from losing a townie? In other words, will the day end or the lynch be wasted?

Also, I suggest you unvote NU for now so that Day 2 doesn't end early.

So you said you were friendly neighbors with Never Unlucky and then retracted and your reasoning is that you are dumb?
Ummmm no. lol

[Titus]

Titus doesn't even say hi to me?
What even is this?

#sleepposting

Hiiii fire

It's 2 AM

Good night Fire

[Quick]

For the record, I still maintain that I am town. Just a very dumb town who thought he was cautious. And will suicide if there is no consequence to that action in order to save town a lynch if need-be. Quick, can you confirm that town will suffer any consequences from my suicide, apart from losing a townie? In other words, will the day end or the lynch be wasted?

Also, I suggest you unvote NU for now so that Day 2 doesn't end early.

I will not accept a suicide, sorry.

[Firebringer]

#sleepposting

Hiiii fire

It's 2 AM

Good night Fire

I live on the west coast too Titus!
I knw what time it is.....that I should go to sleep also, and am delirious tired right now.

[JealousTL]

So you said you were friendly neighbors with Never Unlucky and then retracted and your reasoning is that you are dumb?
Ummmm no. lol

No, he said he was the friendly neighbor and that he sent me a message. I never got a message. I didn't know how to proceed, because I thought that it was too ridiculous/dumb of a move, so there must have been something I was missing. I started conjecturing that if he was a town power role of some sort, he would only be able to get someone to save him is if he claims friendly neighbor and they catch on that he must be a TPR? I don't know, it made sense at the time because I didn't think scum would really take a risk that big. Now that I think about it, he had nothing to lose.

Anyway, I said that I didn't want to corroborate or deny the claim, but then in explaining why, I slipped up by copy-pasting from my QT with Quick (where I pretty much rant). That brings us to the situation now.

[JealousTL]

I will not accept a suicide, sorry.

Damn =_=;

[Calix]

Works for me:
Never Unlucky

Except that theory stuff or w/e.
Firebringer UNVOTE YOU IDIOT, HE'S AT L-2 AND WE STILL HAVE OVER 16 HOURS LEFT

[Firebringer]

No, he said he was the friendly neighbor and that he sent me a message. I never got a message. I didn't know how to proceed, because I thought that it was too ridiculous/dumb of a move, so there must have been something I was missing. I started conjecturing that if he was a town power role of some sort, he would only be able to get someone to save him is if he claims friendly neighbor and they catch on that he must be a TPR? I don't know, it made sense at the time because I didn't think scum would really take a risk that big. Now that I think about it, he had nothing to lose.

Anyway, I said that I didn't want to corroborate or deny the claim, but then in explaining why, I slipped up by copy-pasting from my QT with Quick (where I pretty much rant). That brings us to the situation now.

Huh?

[Firebringer]

Firebringer UNVOTE YOU IDIOT, HE'S AT L-2 AND WE STILL HAVE OVER 16 HOURS LEFT

Don't tell me what to do!

[Calix]

Don't tell me what to do!

Do it or you're scum trying to end the day early.

[Firebringer]

Do it or you're scum trying to end the day early.

What the fuck is this kind of logic?

[JealousTL]

Huh?

Um...

1. Titus claims that NU is scum and killed RLVG.
2. NU claims that he is Friendly Neighbor and that he messaged me N1.
I catch up to this point of the thread, check my PMs, see that there are no messages there.
I start thinking of the possible reasons why someone would do this, because it seemed like it was almost too dumb of a move.
The only non-stupid idea I could come up with was that he was actually a more important role, but the only way someone could defend him against Titus' claim is if they corroborate the Friendly Neighbor fakeclaim. Like, if say he was Sherif, and Titus' claim is faulty. I should have prefaced this by stating that at the time, I was suspicious of Titus and his sheeptrain, and had been null/townreading NU. Anyway...
3. Because of the assumption that he was a TPR, but still could be scum, I decided to play it safe and say that I neither confirm nor deny that I received a PM from him stating that he is Friendly Neighbor.
4. People start pressuring me, and in trying to explain the above logic, I copy+pasted something from a QT I have with Quick, which is where I ranted about how confused I was at this move.
5. That copy+pasted text had a tell in it that pretty much confirmed it was a fake-claim, meaning that NU was scum.
6. Now everyone thinks I am scum by association, and NU has potentially brought a town down with him.

TL;DR: I made a series of poor choices; instead of seeing that NU's move was desperate and bad because he was going down anyway, I conjectured that he could be a TPR; My stupidity turned an impossible gambit into a success for scum.

[Firebringer]

Um...

1. Titus claims that NU is scum and killed RLVG.
2. NU claims that he is Friendly Neighbor and that he messaged me N1.
I catch up to this point of the thread, check my PMs, see that there are no messages there.
I start thinking of the possible reasons why someone would do this, because it seemed like it was almost too dumb of a move.
The only non-stupid idea I could come up with was that he was actually a more important role, but the only way someone could defend him against Titus' claim is if they corroborate the Friendly Neighbor fakeclaim. Like, if say he was Sherif, and Titus' claim is faulty. I should have prefaced this by stating that at the time, I was suspicious of Titus and his sheeptrain, and had been null/townreading NU. Anyway...
3. Because of the assumption that he was a TPR, but still could be scum, I decided to play it safe and say that I neither confirm nor deny that I received a PM from him stating that he is Friendly Neighbor.
4. People start pressuring me, and in trying to explain the above logic, I copy+pasted something from a QT I have with Quick, which is where I ranted about how confused I was at this move.
5. That copy+pasted text had a tell in it that pretty much confirmed it was a fake-claim, meaning that NU was scum.
6. Now everyone thinks I am scum by association, and NU has potentially brought a town down with him.

TL;DR: I made a series of poor choices; instead of seeing that NU's move was desperate and bad because he was going down anyway, I conjectured that he could be a TPR; My stupidity turned an impossible gambit into a success for scum.

ugh....
I am going to have to read stuff, aren't i....

[Calix]

What the fuck is this kind of logic?

There is no town motivation for voting now and risk having the day end early. It does NOTHING because we all know he's scum so scum will just bus him.

Nice evasion of SIMPLY UNVOTING LOL

[JealousTL]

What the fuck is this kind of logic?

It's pretty black-and-white, but yea, you should unvote if you're town. It's not that "if you vote, you're scum" because four people have voted for NU and only 3 are possibly scum, but it's more like "if you don't unvote now that you have been informed, you are acting against the best interest of town, which is suspect."

[JealousTL]

ugh....
I am going to have to read stuff, aren't i....



I think I covered the publicly-known facts of the matter pretty accurately, but I guess you can't just take my word for it.

[Calix]

Why the fuck would ANY town fake-claim Neighbour? If there's an actual Neighbour in the game then NU forces them to counter-claim.

No way is that town-motivated when you could just claim your REAL role.

[JealousTL]

Why the fuck would ANY town fake-claim Neighbour? If there's an actual Neighbour in the game then NU forces them to counter-claim.

No way is that town-motivated when you could just claim your REAL role.

Wouldn't claiming his real role (Sheriff) mean that he gets NK tonight, and thus town loses a TPR? What if he was Follower and followed someone that didn't do anything, how could he prove it? So on and so forth. It seemed like Friendly Neighbor would be low on scum's priority list of NK, whereas most of the other roles would be higher. Therefore, claiming FN and trying to get someone to corroborate it in order to save a TPR seemed to make sense at the time.

[JealousTL]

When I said "his real role (Sheriff)" I meant as in "(let's say it's Sheriff for argument's sake)."

[Calix]

Wouldn't claiming his real role (Sheriff) mean that he gets NK tonight, and thus town loses a TPR? What if he was Follower and followed someone that didn't do anything, how could he prove it? So on and so forth. It seemed like Friendly Neighbor would be low on scum's priority list of NK, whereas most of the other roles would be higher. Therefore, claiming FN and trying to get someone to corroborate it in order to save a TPR seemed to make sense at the time.

This is such a far-fetched theory.

1. Assumes NU is an important TPR...which is unlikely.

2. Titus claimed BEFORE groups were chosen, so how the fuck could NU get night-killed if G3 wasn't picked if he JUST CLAIMED HIS REAL ROLE?

3. Friendly Neighbour is a role that CONFIRMS ITSELF AS TOWN TO PLAYERS. That's a high-priority for the scum because it's really not hard to find one townie among a group that cannot die and send them a message so you get a town bloc going.

4. You still haven't said how it's pro-town or useful to try and get a counter-claim. Either the REAL Neighbour isn't a complete moron and has yet to claim or they don't exist. Narrowing down what TPRs we have =/= town-sided.

[Quick]

Um...

1. Titus claims that NU is scum and killed RLVG.
2. NU claims that he is Friendly Neighbor and that he messaged me N1.
I catch up to this point of the thread, check my PMs, see that there are no messages there.
I start thinking of the possible reasons why someone would do this, because it seemed like it was almost too dumb of a move.
The only non-stupid idea I could come up with was that he was actually a more important role, but the only way someone could defend him against Titus' claim is if they corroborate the Friendly Neighbor fakeclaim. Like, if say he was Sherif, and Titus' claim is faulty. I should have prefaced this by stating that at the time, I was suspicious of Titus and his sheeptrain, and had been null/townreading NU. Anyway...
3. Because of the assumption that he was a TPR, but still could be scum, I decided to play it safe and say that I neither confirm nor deny that I received a PM from him stating that he is Friendly Neighbor.
4. People start pressuring me, and in trying to explain the above logic, I copy+pasted something from a QT I have with Quick, which is where I ranted about how confused I was at this move.
5. That copy+pasted text had a tell in it that pretty much confirmed it was a fake-claim, meaning that NU was scum.
6. Now everyone thinks I am scum by association, and NU has potentially brought a town down with him.

TL;DR: I made a series of poor choices; instead of seeing that NU's move was desperate and bad because he was going down anyway, I conjectured that he could be a TPR; My stupidity turned an impossible gambit into a success for scum.

Yes, there is a rule about not Quoting anything from outside the game.. That includes QTs. Don't do it again.

[JealousTL]

This is such a far-fetched theory.

1. Assumes NU is an important TPR...which is unlikely.

2. Titus claimed BEFORE groups were chosen, so how the fuck could NU get night-killed if G3 wasn't picked if he JUST CLAIMED HIS REAL ROLE?

3. Friendly Neighbour is a role that CONFIRMS ITSELF AS TOWN TO PLAYERS. That's a high-priority for the scum because it's really not hard to find one townie among a group that cannot die and send them a message so you get a town bloc going.

4. You still haven't said how it's pro-town or useful to try and get a counter-claim. Either the REAL Neighbour isn't a complete moron and has yet to claim or they don't exist. Narrowing down what TPRs we have =/= town-sided.

1. In struggling to find a reason for his claim to have sent me a PM, it was the best I could come up with. If you refer to that post, (I don't know how to link posts and Quick just told me not to quote from outside the thread so I won't quote it again), I had two possibilities in mind and both of them involved him obviously not being FN. It was either that he was a TPR, or he was scum who was inferring he was a TPR. I figured that if I throw him under the bus and he was actually a TPR, I would feel very dumb. If he was scum, Titus already said he was scum and had a train going, so in theory if I did nothing then it would continue. So, being pressured for an answer, I tried to go middle-of-the-road and not confirm or deny it because I simply wasn't sure which world made more sense at the time (remember, I was scumreading Titus + crew for how they were seemingly in cohorts, implying out-of-thread contact).

2. Because it would be Titus' claim which already had backing vs. NU's claim, which at the time of analysis I assumed was too risky to divulge. I wrote that possibility (him claiming a TPR in thread) off entirely.

3. I don't think it's that easy to be 100% of a townie at the end of D1 but I'll take your word for it. In my eyes, you don't know what alignment is on the receiving end of your PM. It's still risky.

4. Not sure I understand this point. Can you rephrase the question?

I'll have to answer tomorrow, though. It's very late here and I have business during the day. I will be back before Night to vote if he hasn't been hammered early.

Also, I don't really think there is much point in saying more, I don't think I will say anything new about my thinking process at the time this happened - better to invest time in looking for scum. My parting request is that you consider the world from my eyes before NU's claim:

1. I was townleaning NU.
2. I was distrustful of the spontaneous train that formed on him that apparently used information that wasn't present in the thread (apparently conveyed in code that I do not know).
3. No one showed any of the supposed analysis or evidence that they were claiming existed to prove NU was scum.

.: Scum blitz and NU wanted to be saved.

I was right about the wanting to be saved part, just not the why -_-;

[Quick]

Shapelog has until the end of the day to let me know they are still playing and plan to post or I will replace them.

[Quick]

I recommend all of you check you QT I linked to you at least once a day.

[Yukitaka Oni]

There is no town motivation for voting now and risk having the day end early. It does NOTHING because we all know he's scum so scum will just bus him.

Nice evasion of SIMPLY UNVOTING LOL
Something tell me Firebringer hasn't recovered his play style yet...

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Calix yelling at firebringer feels fake.

Fire shouldn't be putting NU to L-2, but it doesn't actually matter. I would have voted NU, but I wanted to troll vote people.

Jealous wont hammer because he is trying to do damage control, and hammering is not damage control, but ensures that 99-1 world we are in goes to confirmed mafia.
The other 2 scum won't hammer because they are either already voting or will draw our attention.

[Gingerape]

I wanna vote >:
Yuki~! The mafia are probably going to kill one of us three town members in group 3 tonight ;~;
I'm scared, will you hold me?

[Kovath]

Yes, there is a rule about not Quoting anything from outside the game.. That includes QTs. Don't do it again.
...

Uhhh... Does this confirm that message was actually posted in his QT?

[Quick]

...

Uhhh... Does this confirm that message was actually posted in his QT?

I also have a rule that states threatening to break a rule is just as bad as breaking it.

[Never Unlucky]

Ducky, what should I have done after being red-checked? ^^

[Kovath]

Ducky, what should I have done after being red-checked? ^^
Tried to force a 1v1.

[Yukitaka Oni]

I wanna vote >:
Yuki~! The mafia are probably going to kill one of us three town members in group 3 tonight ;~;
I'm scared, will you hold me?
http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/422/637/df1.jpg
I got'chu fam

[Yukitaka Oni]

Ducky, what should I have done after being red-checked? ^^
Fite me noob, 1v1 me faggot, i rekt your mom (a wise word from call of duty kid player)
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/3f/5e/d0/3f5ed06d4182ea1d77139543d9be6a69.jpg

[Yukitaka Oni]

If tonight, group 3 still being killed, then there are 2 mafia in group 3, don't you think? (If never unlucky flip scum)
If group 1-2 killed then the scum change the target.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Ducky, what should I have done after being red-checked? ^^

Insta counterclaim bodyguard if you think you will die to force out a medic. That is what I would have done in your position with this setup. The bodyguard would not have counterclaimed you though. Titus was also pretty town read except by a few people.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Tried to force a 1v1.

Why are you even here? Go play chess.

[Kovath]

Why are you even here? Go play chess.
Last game in 1.5 hours and then I fly home in the evening.

Go to... the gym or something.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Last game in 1.5 hours and then I fly home in the evening.

Go to... the gym or something.

Only one grandmaster allowed in this town at a time, so you may take your leave. I hope your role is the one that leaves town at night.

We kinda waste the time we have since we really need to interact with group A -_-

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

OH THE QUICK TOPICS ARE FOR MOD QUESTIONS... whoops.

I have been putting in random reads and notes. I was about to go full disney musical in that bitch. Quick probably fucking hates me seeing all the "new messages" just to see ANDDDDDDDD I CANT WAIT TO BE MVPPPPPPP. Everybody look left everybody look right ........ standing SPOTLIGHTTTTTTTT

[Kovath]

OH THE QUICK TOPICS ARE FOR MOD QUESTIONS... whoops.

I have been putting in random reads and notes. I was about to go full disney musical in that bitch. Quick probably fucking hates me seeing all the "new messages" just to see ANDDDDDDDD I CANT WAIT TO BE MVPPPPPPP. Everybody look left everybody look right ........ standing SPOTLIGHTTTTTTTT

Are you drunk again Duck

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Are you drunk again Duck

misrep
kovath

[JealousTL]

If tonight, group 3 still being killed, then there are 2 mafia in group 3, don't you think? (If never unlucky flip scum)
If group 1-2 killed then the scum change the target.

If NU is the only scum then there won't be a G3 anymore. If there is another scum, then I would suspect that yes, scum will aim for G3.

[JealousTL]

OH THE QUICK TOPICS ARE FOR MOD QUESTIONS... whoops.

I have been putting in random reads and notes. I was about to go full disney musical in that bitch. Quick probably fucking hates me seeing all the "new messages" just to see ANDDDDDDDD I CANT WAIT TO BE MVPPPPPPP. Everybody look left everybody look right ........ standing SPOTLIGHTTTTTTTT

Yea, I was doing the same thing. It gets lonely. On TL, you can request a "coach" that you have a QT with, so you can bounce ideas off of them. So instead of bouncing ideas off of a human being I was sending messages to Quick who obviously didn't answer ;-;

[Never Unlucky]

Tried to force a 1v1.

I did, I challenged you to a chess game, but you declined the invitation. ;_;

[Firebringer]

If tonight, group 3 still being killed, then there are 2 mafia in group 3, don't you think? (If never unlucky flip scum)
If group 1-2 killed then the scum change the target.
How does this even work?

[Firebringer]

There is no town motivation for voting now and risk having the day end early. It does NOTHING because we all know he's scum so scum will just bus him.

Nice evasion of SIMPLY UNVOTING LOL
This is an easy idea to push for "We can use all the time we have".



Why the fuck would ANY town fake-claim Neighbour? If there's an actual Neighbour in the game then NU forces them to counter-claim.

No way is that town-motivated when you could just claim your REAL role.
That assumes you know theres an actual neighbor, which I think is a unlikely role to actually put in the game, but regardless. If theres a red check on him he is lying or the person who checked him is lying simple PoE.

[Yukitaka Oni]

How does this even work?
What do scum gain from killing in a group with empty mafia? (If never unlucky is the only scum in my group)?

[Firebringer]

There is no town motivation for voting now and risk having the day end early. It does NOTHING because we all know he's scum so scum will just bus him.

Nice evasion of SIMPLY UNVOTING LOL


What do scum gain from killing in a group with empty mafia? (If never unlucky is the only scum in my group)?
I have no idea hw these groups work, so I am going to go with WIFOM.
The answer to all questions of why scum do shit.

[Unknown1234]

I have no idea hw these groups work, so I am going to go with WIFOM.
The answer to all questions of why scum do shit.

Firebringer are you Slayer/SuperJack?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Unknown1234 he is superjack's slot yes.
Firebringer there are 3 groups of 5 players. First 24 hours of a day we vote on a group, the selected group are the only 5 players that can be lynched that day.

Mafia wins by obtaining majority in any group. When there are no more mafia in a group, the remaining towns become confirmed and put into the other groups.

Based on a lot of context you were not here for we are almost 100% sure that group 3 is 1 scum who is red checked, and slipped meaning the others in group 3 are all confirmed town. ( will be for certain after NU is lynched).

the night kill will be on titus or a confirmed town tonight. That is unless there is somehow a second scum in group 3 in which case I better save the day. Not sure who would be a second scum in group 3 though, so we should be gucci.

Also, I agree that there is no chance of a friendly neighbor even being rng'ed into the game as it is a terribly designed role.

[Never Unlucky]

I told you, Duck. Quick said that the roles were handpicked, not RNG'ed.

[Quick]

I told you, Duck. Quick said that the roles were handpicked, not RNG'ed.

If I might clarify,

I knew the roles I was going to use for the game. Roles assigned to players were in fact RNGed. Groups were RNGed as well.

[Titus]

@NU, You were realistically dead the moment I had a guilty on you. The job is not to win at that point but to do as much damage to town and leave the least amount of associative trails.

Can we wrap this up and not no lynch because of derpism? We have last wills here.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

We would make a really good commercial for effective time use.

Never Unlucky

[Calix]

I was under the impression that town would like, comment on my giant wall-post where I pick out NU's comments on the other players since it's pretty stupid to just burn the time NOW when we have confirmed scum in the arena? Apparently not.

I can vote before I go to sleep. (~2-3 hours before EOD)

[secondpassing]

I was under the impression that town would like, comment on my giant wall-post where I pick out NU's comments on the other players since it's pretty stupid to just burn the time NOW when we have confirmed scum in the arena? Apparently not.

I can vote before I go to sleep. (~2-3 hours before EOD)

Same, but it's kinda long and I said "I'll go analyze it!" but I put it off and went to bed.

I can vote at EoD. I can vote now too.

[secondpassing]

I was under the impression that town would like, comment on my giant wall-post where I pick out NU's comments on the other players since it's pretty stupid to just burn the time NOW when we have confirmed scum in the arena? Apparently not.

I can vote before I go to sleep. (~2-3 hours before EOD)

Thoughts on G1 players Calix? I'll go reformat your ISO to something useful in a bit.

[Calix]

Same, but it's kinda long and I said "I'll go analyze it!" but I put it off and went to bed.

I can vote at EoD. I can vote now too.

Well you're Spruance, right? NU was pretty hostile about your slot, characterising his 'push' (for lack of a better word right now) as 'frustration at Spruance's poor play' and discrediting your slot and saying "if we vote G2 then we're voting for a PL of Spruance/ Slayer" so I'm pretty sure you're town by association.

He also said "and maybe Jealous" in brackets when suggesting policy-lynches so that might be relevant also.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I was under the impression that town would like, comment on my giant wall-post where I pick out NU's comments on the other players since it's pretty stupid to just burn the time NOW when we have confirmed scum in the arena? Apparently not.

I can vote before I go to sleep. (~2-3 hours before EOD)

Well I think an even bigger issue was/is the lack of group 1 interactions rather than NU's posts. It is certainly worth reviewing, but given his bussing nature, I think getting interactions with group 1 players is the key to finishing the game.


ALso do people remember when I siad that the yuki/duck/titus/secondpassing world was all town. yeah fuck you.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I should clarify, the fuck you was at the world, not at the player I was quoting.

[Calix]

Thoughts on G1 players Calix? I'll go reformat your ISO to something useful in a bit.

Klingoncelt definitely needs to be looked at. NU had some (somewhat hostile and unimpressed) interactions with her slot and she was against that weird group block thing around Titus as well.

Unknown is also suspicious. He hasn't DONE anything yet and he's hard as fuck to read under normal circumstances.

I don't remember anything that Shapelog's done but NU 'null scum-read' him and made some snide comments about Shapelog on one or two occasions. Might be town.

Eggy seems like a town from what little he's done so far and Titus is all but confirmed.

[Calix]

Well I think an even bigger issue was/is the lack of group 1 interactions rather than NU's posts. It is certainly worth reviewing, but given his bussing nature, I think getting interactions with group 1 players is the key to finishing the game.


ALso do people remember when I siad that the yuki/duck/titus/secondpassing world was all town. yeah fuck you.

I think he would bus/ buddy his partners in equal measure, it just depends on HOW he was doing it.


I should clarify, the fuck you was at the world, not at the player I was quoting.

Uh excuse you, I'm offended. My lawyer will be in touch.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Klingoncelt definitely needs to be looked at. NU had some (somewhat hostile and unimpressed) interactions with her slot and she was against that weird group block thing around Titus as well.

Unknown is also suspicious. He hasn't DONE anything yet and he's hard as fuck to read under normal circumstances.

I don't remember anything that Shapelog's done but NU 'null scum-read' him and made some snide comments about Shapelog on one or two occasions. Might be town.

Eggy seems like a town from what little he's done so far and Titus is all but confirmed.

eggy was mod confirmed as town by accident.

[Calix]

eggy was mod confirmed as town by accident.

Oh?

I can't disagree with that then. Even better.

[Quick]

eggy was mod confirmed as town by accident.

I don't think he was.

[secondpassing]

I don't think he was.

Should have said "he wasn't". (sorry for picking on you)

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I don't think he was.

We will discuss it post game.

[Yukitaka Oni]

6 hours left. I can't re-join within 6 hours
Never Unlucky

[Eggy]

Im mod confirmed? nice lol idk how tht happened. probably gnna NKd when my group gets voted anyway Im just posting so I dont get replaced.

[Eggy]

should I hammer NU I wont be back in the next 6 hours most likely?

[Eggy]

I think im just gonna do it

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Eggy feel free to hammer if you want.

[Eggy]

Never Unlucky

[The Godfather]

Never Unlucky has been lynched! Stand by for the host's review and day-end post!


Never Unlucky ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/27959') (6 [L-0]): Titus ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635184'), Unknown1234 ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635502'), PLZLEAVEDUCKK ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635666'), Klingoncelt ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635570'), Yukitaka Oni ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635685'), Eggy ('http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=635698')

[Quick]

Never Unlucky HAS BEEN LYNCHED! THEY WERE:

MAFIA GOON!

NEW GROUPS WILL BE GIVEN AT SOD 3!

MAFIA MUST NK FROM GROUP 3

2. JealousTL
3. MattZed Replaced by Unknown1234
4. Gingerape
5. Alles_Paletti Replaced by Eggy
6. Yukitaka Oni
7. Shapelog
9. Spruance Replaced by secondpassing
10. Slayer Replaced by SuperJack
11. Titus
12. PLZLEAVEDUCKK
13. Calix
14. Kovath
15. Klingoncelt

SOD 3:
01:00:00:00

[Quick]

NIGHT ACTIONS HAVE BEEN LOCKED IN!

[Quick]

Kovath
Kovath HAS BEEN NIGHT KILLED! THEY WERE:

Friendly Neighbor


I told secondpassing N1 and Duck N2.

As for players: I'm too lazy to do super extensive reads right now, but I would like to caution the player base about blindly trusting Calix. When I worked through her ISO, a lot of her posts struck me as strange for her, aloof, conveying a detached, analytical air; a number of comments that didn't seem to really drive the conversation forward imo. For instance, a number of her initial posts considered meta in general and specific metas as well (for example #165 is where she provided a somewhat self-deprecating perception of her own meta), yet I saw very little alignment reads or the like offered alongside them to help solve the game. She was simply throwing out the information (which was something she did later as well when summarizing NU's ISO... to which she then commented on, #1362: "I was under the impression that town would like, comment on my giant wall-post where I pick out NU's comments on the other players since it's pretty stupid to just burn the time NOW when we have confirmed scum in the arena? Apparently not." Asking everyone else to do the work, eh?)

Despite voting for me and thinking that I was the only person in G3 with no town motivation on D1, she did very little actual hard pushing, being extremely wishy-washy on pursuing that read (even though you have to lynch among the group and she wasn't scumreading anyone else.. perhaps to keep mislynches open too?). She offered my own inactivity as an excuse for me - which is kinda fair because it was true, yet this strikes me as an unusual overall pattern; for example, consider #156 where she says, "Nah, I usually like to lead and be in charge. I am actually being less vocal/ demanding than usual (due to not wanting to clog the thread and make it hard for people to catch up, RL commitments, etc) - it's just how I operate." It's as if she is offering excuses for deviations from her play, and her lack of commitment to pushing scumreads, though not overall scummy in and of itself, is very similar to the approach NU was pushing in the chat. [Read the remainder of #165 for an example of comments I thought weren't really driving forward the discussion in a game-solving manner]

Even that initial exchange where she pressed Yuki on his odd opening didn't feel as strong as it should have been. Even later in #278 she calls it a "quasi-push".

In #235, she kinda questioningly (a semi-red flag for me) asked NU about his null-read on Gingerape, a read that was pretty weird overall. Yet NU provides an explanation that, when I reread it, feels very shaky to me considering the original point NU said ("Not liking Ginger atm, null-read), yet Calix simply says, "I accept this explanation" and moves on. (#515 was a bit more about her reads on the G3 at the time; she reads NU as town for not seeming to be trying to skate by or something). In general, she was really lazy on reading NU off tone / meta, knowing that NU had only one scum game on the record, his first one, and that he would easily shift his playstyle away from that, while other players like myself and Duck who dug into him were able to ID suspicious spots in NU's play. (Plus NU's blind faith in Calix, which in this case could be either him sucking up to a Town!lix or using his usual pattern of behavior to townread his partner with no suspicion).

#768 was just fking weird, btw. I dunno where that one came from.

My post #798 or whatever with a (somewhat) better and more fleshed out edition of my case on NU was replied to this way by Calix:

"Him kissing my arse to the high heavens is not alignment-indicative as he does it outside of the game also, but the rest of the case comes across as reasoned although I'm not sure wherever I would follow it now."

...Ok, so you comment on the last part where I said that he had this weird idolatry of Calix, say the rest of my case "comes across as reasoned", and then conclude "not sure wherever I would follow it now." If my case is reasoned, YOU WORK THROUGH IT. YOU THINK ABOUT IT AND TRY TO UNDERSTAND IT, and think about your own POV. Duck for example did this by looking at NU (not super sure on Duck either btw but I think he's town) at the end of the day. Scum ping.

"Man, it's coming down to 40 minutes left and the lack of discussion continues despite us having three more fucking hours? I can't shake off the feeling that the scum just don't give a fuck because we're lynching among townies here and thus they're lurking it out or just aren't here."

We got this several times already, what's the need to keep repeating it? This is either whining in general or - trying to push the impression that the scum are afk and lurking (when perhaps... they actually aren't?)

Finally, #868 was the epitome of awkward: "Also I feel that I've been way more obvious as town and even I was pushed/ scum-read at points so why does RLVG get this weird pass?" Do I even need to comment on this post? (Plus she'd been kinda scumreading or whatever it was off my initial townread on RLVG which was, by itself, not scummy, but seems very odd with this RLVG's flip).

In regards to the NU / Jealous discussion in D2: She was kinda content to sit back and comment, for example on my posts explaining logic she would say, "Wow actually good points made by Kovath!" or whatever that post was. Casual way to seem involved while also casting subtle shade on me.

finally, #1369 about NU's associations: "I think he would bus/ buddy his partners in equal measure, it just depends on HOW he was doing it." Ok, got anything to share about what you think about those associations then? #1368 was really weak in that sense.

[Last thing - she was really quick to jump onto my point about Unknown casting an early vote "Nice evasion of SIMPLY UNVOTING LOL" but simply didn't push it any farther - a trend this game).

Also I'm not the biggest fan of her tone either, her jokes and reactions to things just seem a bit unnatural, too subdued in some places and too extreme in others. It's inconsistent. Hard to explain further, would advise skimming through the ISO yourself.

I rest my case, please seriously look at Calix today because I feel she is being extremely scummy. Much like NU, she's not trying to push the game forward. I may not have done a great job in explicitly filling out the scum motivation and scum narratives that I've brought together from all these points, but I think it should be self-evident with some careful though as to why scum!Calix would do these things in a way compelling enough to deserve consideration.

Good luck my townie friends. Your Friendly Neighbor, out.




GROUP 1

GROUP 2


Unknown1234
Titus
secondpassing
Shapelog
JealousTL
Eggy

PLZLEAVEDUCKK
Firebringer
Yukitaka Oni
Gingerape
Klingoncelt
Calix




End of DP: I: Day 3:
00:23:54:00

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

The whole reason I signed up for this game was to play with Kovath.

One of you fuckers killed him, and I am going to policy lynch you in the next game I play with you when I find out who it was.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

group 2

[secondpassing]

I can't get to it right now, but over the night I've been stewing over Calix and what she is.

Fact 1. She lied. Not about her role or anything, but kinda like how I lied about my nationality.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I can't get to it right now, but over the night I've been stewing over Calix and what she is.

Fact 1. She lied. Not about her role or anything, but kinda like how I lied about my nationality.

calix/klingon/jealoustl

bag em and tag em? Meh maybe replace one of the two from group 2 with Firebringer.

All but one of the limited posters are in group 1 which hopefully we will get more out of them in time. I think whether or not we look to lynch calix today, we end up on group 2.

I originally read Firebringer's slot as mafia by POE, so that is a good place to look
I have noticed odd behavior about calix, like I mentioned with the fake interaction with Firebringer, and the odd misreps against me
Klingon's hard defense of NU, and overall play
ginger-confirmed
yuki-confirmed
me- I should be around to answer anything about my reads.

[secondpassing]

I haven't read Kovath's will yet. I'll get to it later today.

1. Oddly unreasonable. Even though she had no clue of who to lynch on Day 1. She refused to lynch NU. If she had these people at "null" why the preference to not sheep my read or bring it down?

2a. Misplaced focus. Her posts regarding group selection (especially at a time when yuki/gingerape were looked at to be lynches) was highly analyzed, but when it came to lynch targets (see above), she suddenly had no opinion. She went for the low hanging fruit.

2b. She did a basically random ISO on NU. Why do an ISO on NU? Why not do an ISO on JealousTL, or better yet, on a player not looked at as much? I find her opinions on the matter quite weak. Side note: I had to copy pasta that thing into Google docs to edit that sucker. I'll post what I find later. Or not. I can't say there's much trustworthy stuff in there.

3. Not of the collective. I expect people not to get this one but bear with me. During the time that Quick allowed for an extension, she posted that ISO. It lacked analysis so IIOA.

She also did not go along and let herself chat with us. (yes the thread was derailed) Why not? She needs to maintain her appearance of towniess.

4. Gut. My favorite... Which I will decide when I look into Her posts in more detail for: word choice, tone AND mood, syntax.

5. Uh I forgot what goes here. Probably that fact that she lied about never rolling scum recently? I just want to hear what she says about this one XD.

[Titus]

I have IRL, so I am not delaying results. Shapelog targeted Kovath.

Group 1

[Titus]

Jealous likely spewed town by choice of killer.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I have IRL, so I am not delaying results. Shapelog targeted Kovath.

Group 1

I don't agree with lynching within group 1 today even if it is a red check. Does leaving the red check alive really matter at this point? You being night immune is more important.

[Calix]

Fuck's sake. I'll have to respond to that giant wallpost in the morning but changing how I play =/= scum-tell, zzz.


I can't get to it right now, but over the night I've been stewing over Calix and what she is.

Fact 1. She lied. Not about her role or anything, but kinda like how I lied about my nationality.

What?


Jealous likely spewed town by choice of killer.

How do you mean?

[Yukitaka Oni]

group 2
Group 2
King,calix,or maybe you plzduck but.....hey. At least we narrow down 1/2 scum right?

[Titus]

If jealous is confscum, why wouldn't they send him to kill?

@Duck, disagree. But scumhunting good so, *shrug*

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

town has auto btw.

[Calix]

If jealous is confscum, why wouldn't they send him to kill?

@Duck, disagree. But scumhunting good so, *shrug*

Fair point.




GROUP 1


GROUP 2



@Unknown1234 (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28243)
@Titus (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=8790)
@secondpassing (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=16431)
@Shapelog (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28656)
@JealousTL (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28650)
@Eggy (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28401)
@PLZLEAVEDUCKK (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27917)
@Firebringer (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=15644)
@Yukitaka Oni (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=15734)
@Gingerape (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=4019)
@Klingoncelt (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=14164)
@Calix (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27116)





So assuming Titus/ Jealous/ Eggy are all town, G1 seems like it'll be the best option for a lynch. If Shapelog is the only G1 scum then we can't lose and if not then we know that SP/ Unknown have to be Traitor.

Bodyguard would 100% be on Titus tonight so that's not a concern. Scum are unlikely to risk that because a dead Bodyguard confirms another townie. (even if by death)

Group 1

And correct me if I'm wrong but Yuki/ Ginger are also confirmed. So FB/ Duck/ Klingoncelt = POE pool. Let me know if I missed anyone but game seems mostly wrapped up FMPOV.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Town has 8 confirmed members, just lynch shapelog and speed it up.

group 1

[Yukitaka Oni]

I prefer king then calix first lol. Gotta love boiling train......full of blood....good'old big boss goes nuclear....
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/AXon0GNNz44/hqdefault.jpg

[Yukitaka Oni]

Fair point.




GROUP 1


GROUP 2



@Unknown1234 (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28243)
@Titus (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=8790)
@secondpassing (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=16431)
@Shapelog (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28656)
@JealousTL (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28650)
@Eggy (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=28401)
@PLZLEAVEDUCKK (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27917)
@Firebringer (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=15644)
@Yukitaka Oni (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=15734)
@Gingerape (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=4019)
@Klingoncelt (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=14164)
@Calix (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php?u=27116)





So assuming Titus/ Jealous/ Eggy are all town, G1 seems like it'll be the best option for a lynch. If Shapelog is the only G1 scum then we can't lose and if not then we know that SP/ Unknown have to be Traitor.

Bodyguard would 100% be on Titus tonight so that's not a concern. Scum are unlikely to risk that because a dead Bodyguard confirms another townie. (even if by death)

Group 1

And correct me if I'm wrong but Yuki/ Ginger are also confirmed. So FB/ Duck/ Klingoncelt = POE pool. Let me know if I missed anyone but game seems mostly wrapped up FMPOV.
One people just move from group 2 to group 1, give a little bit attention to him......(remind)

[Yukitaka Oni]

Will remember Kovath's last will in case going back to group 2

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Will remember Kovath's last will in case going back to group 2

Don't think you need his last will at this point.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Gingerape and me play null yesterday so Kovath can prove himself over Never Unlucky. If titus didn't look at kovath then the brain is fked up....everyone know mafia gain nothing from killing a null...

[Yukitaka Oni]

Don't think you need his last will at this point.
Just a notice, but indeed I didn't need it right now b)o.o)>

[Calix]

Will remember Kovath's last will in case going back to group 2

Most of his points can be countered by the following:

1. I hadn't read the thread properly on D1, thus I wasn't pushing for shit because I wasn't sure what was going on and didn't trust my instincts.

2. I had RL and was in another game which I was focusing on (where I was scum trying to attain a harder win con compared to this game)

3. I ISOed NU because he had CLAIMED SCUM so while the thread was closed, I summarised his posts and posted it ASAP.

I see nothing damning but the scum are welcome to try and use said LW against me if they want to wave a white flag harder.

[Firebringer]

I am here, haven't read anything since the flip.
Whats new pussy cats?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I am here, haven't read anything since the flip.
Whats new pussy cats?

The game is over, vote group 1 please. I don't want tow aste another 3 days on a game that is 100% auto.

[Firebringer]

Group 1

Do vote tags work for groups?

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Group 1

Do vote tags work for groups?

Yeah. and if you happen to receive a pm, reply "yes".

[Firebringer]

Game is auto over.

[Calix]

Yeah, last two scum can only be among four players.

No way does town not win this.

[Firebringer]

Yeah, last two scum can only be among four players.

No way does town not win this.

Which is why I already asked Quick to end it.
He put the wrong person I asked to do night kill anyways.

I already asked to premature end it and my teammate is nowhere to be found.
Too many towns are confirmed for this game to go in any other way.

[Firebringer]

GG!

[Calix]

Which is why I already asked Quick to end it.
He put the wrong person I asked to do night kill anyways.

I already asked to premature end it and my teammate is nowhere to be found.
Too many towns are confirmed for this game to go in any other way.

Oh good.

I am a Town Investigative and I have two town clears.

Scum cannot win. Concede now.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Yeah, last two scum can only be among four players.

No way does town not win this.
Yeah sure, your last game.....you killed all the bunch of normal player and left the newbie going nuts. And I can't stop laughing.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Oh good.

I am a Town Investigative and I have two town clears.

Scum cannot win. Concede now.

oh trust me, we already did.

Were you actually a town invest though?

[Yukitaka Oni]

Oh good.

I am a Town Investigative and I have two town clears.

Scum cannot win. Concede now.
Ze sheriff lol

[Firebringer]

Oh good.

I am a Town Investigative and I have two town clears.

Scum cannot win. Concede now.

I did.

[Calix]

Yeah sure, your last game.....you killed all the bunch of normal player and left the newbie going nuts. And I can't stop laughing.

You can't read me for shit. Nobody on this site can and last game is proof of that.

[Firebringer]

I really don't know what recommendations I can give this game to make it more "balanced"
its inherently swingy in both directions depending on a successful town or scum lynch.

Its basically like scum or town win if they successfully get a lynch or mislynch.
Because either too many players become conf town.
Or you are forced in a LYLo next day.

[Calix]

Fuck balance. This game is great for mafiah parties while you're crying into a wine bottle on a lonely Friday night.

[Firebringer]

Fuck balance. This game is great for mafiah parties while you're crying into a wine bottle on a lonely Friday night.

Speaking from experience miss calix?

[Calix]

Speaking from experience miss calix?

You know me. Wasted all day every day.

[Firebringer]

You know me. Wasted all day every day.

I did not know this about you.
Lay off the sauce my dear.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Since I am a traitor and we are conceding with 2 mafia in group 2, do I count as town for this victory? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Firebringer]

Since I am a traitor and we are conceding with 2 mafia in group 2, do I count as town for this victory? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You can always count as winning in your own book my love.
Don't let a game tell you who won. Its all about perspective.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

"You do not count as a member of the mafia until you are the only mafia left in that group."

Loophole. Duck ties.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

You can always count as winning in your own book my love.
Don't let a game tell you who won. Its all about perspective.

You let kovath die. Not cool.

[Firebringer]

You let kovath die. Not cool.

Who else would you kill from group 3?

[Yukitaka Oni]

You can't read me for shit. Nobody on this site can and last game is proof of that.
No, I'm black, I can't read.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Who else would you kill from group 3?

That was the point. Kovath was the logical lookout target. Medic dodge brah. Then we dodge 20 lynches and hope for the best.

[Yukitaka Oni]

"You do not count as a member of the mafia until you are the only mafia left in that group."

Loophole. Duck ties.
Lynch you = you're on our side until the end!?!?

[Quick]

MAFIA CONCEDES!!!


TOWN HAS WON!
CONGRATS:
2. JealousTL - citizen
3. Unknown1234 - Citizen
4. Gingerape - Citizen
5. Eggy - Citizen
6. Yukitaka Oni - Citizen
8. RLVG - Citizen
9. secondpassing - Universal Backup
11. Titus - Lookout
13. Calix - Neapolitan
14. Kovath - Friendly Neighbor
15. Klingoncelt- Citizen


MAFIA WAS:
1. Never Unlucky - Mafioso
7. Shapelog - Follower
10. Firebringer - Rolestopper
12. PLZLEAVEDUCKK - Traitor


QuickTopics:

Players (in order of number)
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/vzgrMjpWPkaSM
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/fCnZSb4yXswSs
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/ATpJe8urvrH
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/U9pJGkmYEBh
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/LzeU2RzFyqE
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/iB3BsC34aDkv3
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/nixasXniaDdpc
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/xB9SA8g7QFejC
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/j5Y2XetW76GrB
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/9qziicJXrjh
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/CEUCa7GfG57C2
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/dixMHqqiqXETp
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/kmcw5JZDBGub
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/Fw7U33AuF4sh
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/H5NLiJPQP3vcL

Spectators I thread:

https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/kR7vCMRYena

Mod QuickTopic:

https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/EFNWUgqWK9C

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Lynch you = you're on our side until the end!?!?

Pfft I was always on your side yuki!! These bad bad townies wanted to lynch you.

[Calix]

Mafia had a CONSORT?

Why would you not just roleblock Titus? Or were night actions also constrained to groups...?

[Quick]

Looking back and talking to deathworlds I would have made the mafioso a motion detector and let the Traitor know who their teammates were.

[Never Unlucky]

Mafia had a CONSORT?

Why would you not just roleblock Titus? Or were night actions also constrained to groups...?

Rolestopper =/= Roleblocker.

Rolestopper stops checks on players, so Rolestopper would've prevented the red check on me and Shapelog.

[Firebringer]

Mafia had a CONSORT?

Why would you not just roleblock Titus? Or were night actions also constrained to groups...?

Rolestopper doesn't work like roleblocker.

[Quick]

Mafia had a CONSORT?

Why would you not just roleblock Titus? Or were night actions also constrained to groups...?

Its a rolestopper, not a consort. But the same thing applies. If Rolestopper would have targeted who did the kill then Titus wouldn't get a guilty.

[Calix]

Oh wait, misunderstood the role.

Rolestopper, heh.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Pfft I was always on your side yuki!! These bad bad townies wanted to lynch you.
No, i always lure the town to lynch me. It's always happen in a lot of game, and that's what i wanted

[Firebringer]

rolestopper basically makes all investigations on the person fail, so I put it n PLZLEAVEDUCK hoping someone would check and ask why they got no result.

Didn't think about using it on my teammate because if they were directly checked it wouldn't matter.

Thought Titus was a tracker, not a watcher(Lookout).

W/e.

[Never Unlucky]

You can't read me for shit. Nobody on this site can and last game is proof of that.

Get off your high horse.


Its a rolestopper, not a consort. But the same thing applies. If Rolestopper would have targeted who did the kill then Titus wouldn't get a guilty.

It wasn't how I understood the role. I thought that it would stop all actions that targeted X player i.e. if I rolestop RLVG, the lookout won't get feedback and the kill won't go through. I didn't think it could 'frame' players from being/not being red checked if that makes sense.

[Quick]

I invite you all to critique my game and I actually encourage that.

[Quick]

Get off your high horse.



It wasn't how I understood the role. I thought that it would stop all actions that targeted X player i.e. if I rolestop RLVG, the lookout won't get feedback and the kill won't go through. I didn't think it could 'frame' players from being/not being red checked if that makes sense.

Yeah, I didn't want to explicitly state that Mafia could do that, maybe I should have.

[Firebringer]

I invite you all to critique my game and I actually encourage that.

I mean....given scum can't kill in any other group is kind of imbalanced for the Lookout....

[Quick]

Yeah, I didn't want to explicitly state that Mafia could do that, maybe I should have.

I expected way more questions, I will say that.

[Calix]

Critique? Let me think.

Main one would be NOT restricting scum kills to a group. It makes Lookout/ Detective way too OP imo.

It's a swingy game by nature so I don't think it's going to be balanced regardless.

[Quick]

I mean....given scum can't kill in any other group is kind of imbalanced for the Lookout....

Right, but given what rolestopper can do, which wasn't asked about... That's one of the reasons rolestopper was chosen for mafia.

[Firebringer]

rolestopper does stop kill attempts as far as I am aware.....
It stops all actions on a player, but not the player itself.

Its a inverse of a roleblocker (Consort)

[Yukitaka Oni]

I ignore JealousTL almost entire game if he noticed it. Lol, poor guy. Got ignored because I believe he's town

[Quick]

Critique? Let me think.

Main one would be NOT restricting scum kills to a group. It makes Lookout/ Detective way too OP imo.

It's a swingy game by nature so I don't think it's going to be balanced regardless.

Hmm.. maybe you are right. I was just assuming that Mafia would do this since if say there actually was a lynch day one then it would make that group LyLo for that group if a townie was lynched.

[Firebringer]

Right, but given what rolestopper can do, which wasn't asked about... That's one of the reasons rolestopper was chosen for mafia.

But why not just remove that and give them an ability to attack anyone?
You basically have to power up scum because you nerf the fuck out of them on kill choices....

Its like crippling a person then giving them a gun to "balance" things out.
Why not just don't cripple the person to begin with?

Not to mention if someone is good at setup spec, they would assume that rolestopper had to be given to mafia based on limited kill choices on your own design.....

[Yukitaka Oni]

Critique? Let me think.

Main one would be NOT restricting scum kills to a group. It makes Lookout/ Detective way too OP imo.

It's a swingy game by nature so I don't think it's going to be balanced regardless.


Right, but given what rolestopper can do, which wasn't asked about... That's one of the reasons rolestopper was chosen for mafia.
The most imbalance reason
1. Never, ever gives TPR to Calix
2. Noob mafia, didn't kill pro Calix. Not voting group 2, lol

[Klingoncelt]

calix/klingon/jealoustl

bag em and tag em? Meh maybe replace one of the two from group 2 with Firebringer.

All but one of the limited posters are in group 1 which hopefully we will get more out of them in time. I think whether or not we look to lynch calix today, we end up on group 2.

I originally read Firebringer's slot as mafia by POE, so that is a good place to look
I have noticed odd behavior about calix, like I mentioned with the fake interaction with Firebringer, and the odd misreps against me
Klingon's hard defense of NU, and overall play
ginger-confirmed
yuki-confirmed
me- I should be around to answer anything about my reads.

If you want to lynch me you should wait until the Scums are dead.

I'm Town.

You're just pissed off because I suspected Titus.

[Firebringer]

If you want to lynch me you should wait until the Scums are dead.

I'm Town.

You're just pissed off because I suspected Titus.

Hilarious.

[Never Unlucky]

Critique? Let me think.

Main one would be NOT restricting scum kills to a group. It makes Lookout/ Detective way too OP imo.

It's a swingy game by nature so I don't think it's going to be balanced regardless.
My thoughts exactly. It also greatly improves protective roles to save their targets.

I would also reduce the player count. 15 players was too hectic and half the slots barely/did not show up. I was frustrated that my two other known teammates were empty slots.

I'd propose that the group who has eliminated all the mafia within itself doesn't converge into the two other groups thus confirming 1-4 players as town.

[Klingoncelt]

I have IRL, so I am not delaying results. Shapelog targeted Kovath.

Group 1

Group 1

[Gingerape]

Nya ^~^ I had fun even though I never got to vote and the game ended really early.
It helped me learn the game a lot better so I can do another one of I wasn't too terrible ~

[Never Unlucky]

If you want to lynch me you should wait until the Scums are dead.

I'm Town.

You're just pissed off because I suspected Titus.
http://i.giphy.com/3osxYcafC7tkcBQT60.gif

[Calix]

The most imbalance reason
1. Never, ever gives TPR to Calix
2. Noob mafia, didn't kill pro Calix. Not voting group 2, lol

My night actions weren't that great. All I did was confirm two citizens.

My play wasn't pro. I just coasted and played flippantly.

Fuck meta :laugh:

[Quick]

But why not just remove that and give them an ability to attack anyone?
You basically have to power up scum because you nerf the fuck out of them on kill choices....

Its like crippling a person then giving them a gun to "balance" things out.
Why not just don't cripple the person to begin with?

Not to mention if someone is good at setup spec, they would assume that rolestopper had to be given to mafia based on limited kill choices on your own design.....

Yeah, that may be true, but rolestopper has a variety of different uses besides just hiding the NK. Scum can use it on anyone for many different reasons. And rolestop for Mafia is not a given. I did add a rolestop possibility for Town as well.

[Yukitaka Oni]

If you want to lynch me you should wait until the Scums are dead.

I'm Town.

You're just pissed off because I suspected Titus.
Either way first day 2 i already told ya. You're on my first lynch train. Just a problem that die soon or later....

[Calix]

unvote

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

If you want to lynch me you should wait until the Scums are dead.

I'm Town.

You're just pissed off because I suspected Titus.

This is what I lost to.

Sigh.

[Klingoncelt]

I don't agree with lynching within group 1 today even if it is a red check. Does leaving the red check alive really matter at this point? You being night immune is more important.

What?

Can't a Protective PR cover Titus?

I'm still not Townreading you...

[Firebringer]

This is what I lost to.

Sigh.

You won, you were a traitor scum, not a mafia scum.

[Yukitaka Oni]

My night actions weren't that great. All I did was confirm two citizens.

My play wasn't pro. I just coasted and played flippantly.

Fuck meta :laugh:
Fk me, always Shitizen, always same null play style. LOL

[Firebringer]

What?

Can't a Protective PR cover Titus?

I'm still not Townreading you...

Waiting for klingoncelt to get to game over message....

[Yukitaka Oni]

You won, you were a traitor scum, not a mafia scum.
He's a double agents^

[Calix]

Klingoncelt is adorable right now.

Rolestopper doesn't really work out well. Town/ Scum would use it way too differently for a town counterpart to do anything imo.

[Gingerape]

Group 1

[Yukitaka Oni]

Waiting for klingoncelt to get to game over message....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v627/Scottz04/Game%20over/riskywoodsgameover.gif
RLVG's reaper gift

[Quick]

Calix also confirmed themselves as PR Day one. They said they were PR. If Mafia could kill anyone I would expect Calix to be dead by Day 2.

[Firebringer]

Klingoncelt is adorable right now.

Rolestopper doesn't really work out well. Town/ Scum would use it way too differently for a town counterpart to do anything imo.

Rolestopper is way more useful in a role madness game.
In a game like this is kind of weird/awkward and you have no idea how to use it I don't think.

My plan was to use it on DUCK so as to frame any investigation on him.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Group 1
The feel when Gingerape didn't know game over yet....

[Calix]

Yeah I was really not subtle with soft-claiming.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Calix also confirmed themselves as PR Day one. They said they were PR. If Mafia could kill anyone I would expect Calix to be dead by Day 2.

Did she? I completely missed it. I was not sure if Superjack or Calix was my partner from group 2.

[Gingerape]

Yuki I wanna play another with you ;~;

[Yukitaka Oni]

Calix also confirmed themselves as PR Day one. They said they were PR. If Mafia could kill anyone I would expect Calix to be dead by Day 2.
I always kill Calix if i were scum. I don't mind sacrifice 1 life just to cut the snake's head

[Calix]

Also we might want to change the votes before the thread locks or something.

12

[Quick]

Klingoncelt is adorable right now.

Rolestopper doesn't really work out well. Town/ Scum would use it way too differently for a town counterpart to do anything imo.

IDK how to take this really. I mean, it seems like you are giving me credit for not having a Town Rolestopper, but also saying that role shouldn't be in the game? Town can use it on a confirm Townie iirc.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Rolestopper is way more useful in a role madness game.
In a game like this is kind of weird/awkward and you have no idea how to use it I don't think.

My plan was to use it on DUCK so as to frame any investigation on him.

Half my plan was to account for invest checks by claiming miller with my amnesiac claim :P

[Calix]

Okay, that doesn't work for me. Annoying.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

duckduckgooseduckduckgoose

[Quick]

Resetting count.

[Firebringer]

Okay, that doesn't work for me. Annoying.

Only works for the original poster of the thread, love.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Yuki I wanna play another with you ;~;
Calm down, you're alive until the game ended,calm down
http://img.memecdn.com/i-know-that-feel-brother_o_1524217.jpg

[Calix]

IDK how to take this really. I mean, it seems like you are giving me credit for not having a Town Rolestopper, but also saying that role shouldn't be in the game? Town can use it on a confirm Townie iirc.

As I understand it, Rolestopper makes a player Ascetic and that seems more appropriate for Role Madness games. I think replacing it with a good old-fashioned Roleblocker that doesn't inform the target works out fine.

I'm not familiar with MS role variations though; I have never encountered Rolestopper before.

[Quick]

12

OK 12 it is.

[Firebringer]

Wait, did this version of role stopper not stop kills?

How did role stopper confirm anyone?

[Yukitaka Oni]

Titus
Scum! b)x.o)>!

[Firebringer]

This is how I know role stopper works.

It stops all actions including kills on a player.
So investigations, Protections, and killing actions are all voided.

The player can still however use their own action(s).

Some versions of rolestopper don't prevent kills on them.

Think of rolestopper like inverse of roleblocker (consort).

So how does a player become "Conf" with a rolestopper on them?

[Never Unlucky]

Half my plan was to account for invest checks by claiming miller with my amnesiac claim :P

I was very surprised that only 2-3 players doubted your traitor soft/hard-claim.

[Quick]

Wait, did this version of role stopper not stop kills?

How did role stopper confirm anyone?

Not sure what you're asking.

rolestopper doesn't confirm anyone as far as I'm aware.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

I was very surprised that only 2-3 players doubted your traitor soft/hard-claim.

After I learned traitor was a confirmed role I expected a instant train on me.

[Gingerape]

Calm down, you're alive until the game ended,calm down


^~^
But next game I'll have to kill you so I can be the only cute one in the game.
You hurt my feelings on day one

[Quick]

Titus
Scum! b)x.o)>!

Yeah.. Titus is where my vote is going as well.

Titus

[Firebringer]

IDK how to take this really. I mean, it seems like you are giving me credit for not having a Town Rolestopper, but also saying that role shouldn't be in the game? Town can use it on a confirm Townie iirc.

Misunderstood this.

[Quick]

Misunderstood this.

Yeah, confirmed.