S-FM 167: Standard

[RLVG]

Day 1: yuki has revealed himself as a sheriff/jailor

Himself?

[Yukitaka Oni]

Himself?

Herself/himself* fixed!
Am anonymous!

[Yukitaka Oni]

<(o.o)>

[RLVG]

Herself/himself* fixed!
Am anonymous!

I suppose "Androgynous" would be the correct word.

[Yukitaka Oni]

I suppose "Androgynous" would be the correct word.

Man....woman...gay....homo...no.i am not one of them anymore.....

[TheDarkestLight]

Implying that your potential contributions are so valuable that scum's performance would improve notably by revealing anything. You'll forgive me for treating this with a dose of skepticism.

Day 1 is also a lynch day, so saying Day 2 is doesn't make much sense. PTRs are not going to be much more informed than Day 1, assuming they found anything.

What's the issue with determining who is more likely to be pro-town/ anti-town early on? If we took your argument of not lynching to its logical conclusion, then you would render pressure-voting to be entirely useless because it would be assumed that no lynch would take place. Do you think there's any useful information to be gleaned from the chat so far?

Obligatory note that you're a) anti-lynch, which denies town information and b) have openly admitted that you are hiding something. Seems rather odd to do.

The scum will look at any non-scum reads. They could see what they're maybe doing wrong, who to push on, and who people think are TPRs. Yeah, no one person is all that important, but it's a compilation. You can connect the dots easily as scum.

Day one is not considered for lynching in my case. The only times I lynch day one is when it's a night start, or a Neutral Benign claims.

Scum can A: Determine Neutrals from Town, B: Find TPRs based off reads since so many people go "Bored Citizen or scum" "TPR or scum". There is useful information, but I do not look at day one reads as fool proof, as they are wrong a majority of the time. I won't tell you my exact play style, as I like keeping my inner thoughts secret, but day one alone doesn't work.

Pressure is not good day one. Scum will claim and we will have nothing to deny that later. It's more likely to reveal TPRs and Citizens. Revealing Citizens gives less room for our TPRs to hide in, and revealing TPRs leaves them open to kills or being messed with by certain Scum roles.

Also, nice "obligatory note". Now I see you trying to discredit me for a future lynch. GJ.

[Yukitaka Oni]

The scum will look at any non-scum reads. They could see what they're maybe doing wrong, who to push on, and who people think are TPRs. Yeah, no one person is all that important, but it's a compilation. You can connect the dots easily as scum.

Day one is not considered for lynching in my case. The only times I lynch day one is when it's a night start, or a Neutral Benign claims.

Scum can A: Determine Neutrals from Town, B: Find TPRs based off reads since so many people go "Bored Citizen or scum" "TPR or scum". There is useful information, but I do not look at day one reads as fool proof, as they are wrong a majority of the time. I won't tell you my exact play style, as I like keeping my inner thoughts secret, but day one alone doesn't work.

Pressure is not good day one. Scum will claim and we will have nothing to deny that later. It's more likely to reveal TPRs and Citizens. Revealing Citizens gives less room for our TPRs to hide in, and revealing TPRs leaves them open to kills or being messed with by certain Scum roles.

Also, nice "obligatory note". Now I see you trying to discredit me for a future lynch. GJ.

This is why Mafia will kill you after me lol. Veteran player, too strong to carry town after I die lol

[TheDarkestLight]

This is why Mafia will kill you after me lol. Veteran player, too strong to carry town after I die lol

Strong logic.

[Suntax]

In general i dont think ima be on for a bit since I need to go to work but i Will leave this on my phone page so I can check through during breaks and such

[Calix]

The scum will look at any non-scum reads. They could see what they're maybe doing wrong, who to push on, and who people think are TPRs. Yeah, no one person is all that important, but it's a compilation. You can connect the dots easily as scum.

Day one is not considered for lynching in my case. The only times I lynch day one is when it's a night start, or a Neutral Benign claims.

Scum can A: Determine Neutrals from Town, B: Find TPRs based off reads since so many people go "Bored Citizen or scum" "TPR or scum". There is useful information, but I do not look at day one reads as fool proof, as they are wrong a majority of the time. I won't tell you my exact play style, as I like keeping my inner thoughts secret, but day one alone doesn't work.

Pressure is not good day one. Scum will claim and we will have nothing to deny that later. It's more likely to reveal TPRs and Citizens. Revealing Citizens gives less room for our TPRs to hide in, and revealing TPRs leaves them open to kills or being messed with by certain Scum roles.

Also, nice "obligatory note". Now I see you trying to discredit me for a future lynch. GJ.

You assume that every town member will post their true and honest thoughts at all times, which ignores the effects of WIFOM, soft/ fake claims and other deceptive tactics. Day 1 can be utilised to set up traps for scum or direct a kill onto a healed target, etc etc. I can think of a few players who are trying to mislead the mafia in this fashion.

If you think Day 1 reads are usually incorrect, then what would be the harm in giving them if you are just feeding the mafia inaccurate information?

I'm not interested in role claims. If someone can't defend their actions as being in the interest of the town and has to rely on claiming early, then they are not playing well and should be eliminated.

My obligatory note mentioned things which you yourself admitted to. That is something I think is important to keep in mind and I feel I did not misrepresent you. Are you denying or retracting anything I claimed in my notes?

[Frog]

Agreed that pressure on Suntax would be a good idea. I'd like to see how he reacts to being voted.

Mikecall, you claim I was Executioner, then you flip-flop to assuming I'm town? Elaborate, please.

[Mod caught my post in response to yours ]

-vote Suntax

I want something more substantial about your read on Zekrom. Can you please quote his posts and point out how his town screams town to you?

[Frog]

All them scum reads on me are very informative. Keep the salt flowing on while I do absolutely nothing but point one thing out.
Neutral killers are actually vulnerable to basic attacks! That's a valid reason to have two killers in the game.

Codeword : Royal flush.

Yeah, you're doing a good job acting neut staying under the radar. Not scummy enough to vote, but scummy enough to avoid being killed. Damn you!!!

[TheDarkestLight]

You assume that every town member will post their true and honest thoughts at all times, which ignores the effects of WIFOM, soft/ fake claims and other deceptive tactics. Day 1 can be utilised to set up traps for scum or direct a kill onto a healed target, etc etc. I can think of a few players who are trying to mislead the mafia in this fashion.

If you think Day 1 reads are usually incorrect, then what would be the harm in giving them if you are just feeding the mafia inaccurate information?

I'm not interested in role claims. If someone can't defend their actions as being in the interest of the town and has to rely on claiming early, then they are not playing well and should be eliminated.

My obligatory note mentioned things which you yourself admitted to. That is something I think is important to keep in mind and I feel I did not misrepresent you. Are you denying or retracting anything I claimed in my notes?

The problem is, scum can tend to see truth from lies. They know who is on their team, unlike me. I do not know who my fellow townsfolk are for certain. Yes, certain reads might be lied about to try and deceive scum, yet rarely have I seen a town player just post a bunch of lies on his read list. Also, soft-claims D1 are stupid. If you soft-claim to get a doctor to go on you then you're gonna get some sort of scum to mess with you. Like why ask a Doctor to heal you when we might have a Mass Murderer? That doesn't look well, also a Doctor doesn't protect from certain scum roles meant to simply deceive rather than kill certain roles. Also, as to faking soft-claims, that causes confusion among the Town, and Scum will often do that so they can go like "I soft claimed this role earlier". So, there is little to no way to tell a town soft-claim from a scum soft-claim at this stage of the game. There is later in the game, but not now.

Because it can lead them to TPRs.

So, if someone claims a TPR, and you have no way of disproving this, we should just lynch them?

Wording.

[Frog]

I've yet to see him lurking in this forum, so he's probably our resident AFK pseudo-town. I'm not interested in a policy lynch because they usually kill town, so I guess if we have a Vigilante, he would be a good target. I'll let them decide when they want to shoot, however.

In my opinion, Vigilante shooting Night 1 strikes me as a terrible idea due to the fallibility of having one player shoot on the basis of this fabulous chat. I mean, look at all these confirmed townies/ scum! DDD

Vigi shooting to reveal information is good. E.g. Mikecall -> Iced OR Suntax -> Zekrom

[Frog]

you say I don't defend myself, lovely, you want to go through the 10 page argument between me an Calix, yeah, I know, Calix won that, I was even going to the brink of surrendering, but had to have time to rethink everything, and I Am back, to take the full force of Calix again lol.

lol, why did i unvote you. ugh... Hopefully Suntax feels the pressure.

[Frog]

because of this reasons, ill vote hardmike

-vote mikecall

If you're aligned, you're kind of forced to distance yourself. If the bus -> unvote distance -> revote distance ALWAYS put you in a scummy spotlight, then you have hope. The alternative is that you've actually spotted a scummy player and acted on it. Either way, I approve of this vote.

[Calix]

-vote Suntax

I want something more substantial about your read on Zekrom. Can you please quote his posts and point out how his town screams town to you?

I'll just state what I feel are two of the most plausible explanations for this.

A) he's scum who tried and failed to buddy with Zekrom, then retracted his support when questioned/ realised that it wasn't a great idea

B) slightly overwhelmed/ confused town who latched onto the first nice-seeming player and automatically assumed he was town

Speaking of weird buddying tactics, would you care to elaborate on your overt town-read of me in the early days of the chat? Some of your quotes, such as me being your 'strongest town read' (after 3 posts? Most likely hyperbole), considering the first post-vote of the game to be 'solid' (hyperbole) and directing a Doctor onto me, struck me as odd.

Would you be willing to forego a lynch in favour of a Vigilante shot? I would disagree since we miss out on voting patterns and we're assuming there's a Vigilante. Why would we shoot Zekrom? He's done nothing exceptional in my eyes and he pointed out Sun's buddying. I guess that can be perceived as distancing as well, eh.

@TDL, I was just about to post this when I saw your post. However, it's approaching midnight here, so I have to go to sleep now. I'll just put it down for the record that I think you make valid points, I just disagree with how they're being used to justify no lynches.

Or maybe I actually agree with you and I'm just being a contrarian arsehole to see how you think/ how you want me to think you think, etc etc. We can go on all day with this line.

Goodnight all. I know it's hard, but don't be useless while I'm gone ;p

[Calix]

Annnnd I had this nice long sign-off post as I'm going to bed now, but guess what happened to that?

I'll just say that either a) I disagree with TDL's points and how they're being used to justify a no-lynch or b) I agree and I'm being a contrarian to pry into how you think/ present yourself.

And Frog, I'd like some detail on why you were buddying me so hard on the first few pages with claiming I was the 'strongest town' read after 3 posts (hyperbole0, asking for a Doctor on me (not a great move with MM, eh?), saying the first post-vote was 'solid' (hyperbole).

For the reason of MM, I'm against directing a Vigilante shot tonight.

Anyway, goodnight.

[Frog]

I was testing you and you answered incorrectly!

The correct answer would be to say 'no' because being town is not a 'commitment' but an integral part of how you play. Furthermore, your response dismisses the true powah of shitizens.

Also, luck doesn't exist.

I'm getting a nefarious tone from you here Calix. Like you're taking pleasure out of antagonizing MikeCall. Yes, MikeCall seems scummy, but he also seems inexperienced, and it seems like you're enjoying taking advantage.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Yeah, you're doing a good job acting neut staying under the radar. Not scummy enough to vote, but scummy enough to avoid being killed. Damn you!!!

Use the counter-sign: full horse

[Yukitaka Oni]

If you're aligned, you're kind of forced to distance yourself. If the bus -> unvote distance -> revote distance ALWAYS put you in a scummy spotlight, then you have hope. The alternative is that you've actually spotted a scummy player and acted on it. Either way, I approve of this vote.

Tell our daddy to shoot tonight to revenge for me!

[Yukitaka Oni]

Annnnd I had this nice long sign-off post as I'm going to bed now, but guess what happened to that?

I'll just say that either a) I disagree with TDL's points and how they're being used to justify a no-lynch or b) I agree and I'm being a contrarian to pry into how you think/ present yourself.

And Frog, I'd like some detail on why you were buddying me so hard on the first few pages with claiming I was the 'strongest town' read after 3 posts (hyperbole0, asking for a Doctor on me (not a great move with MM, eh?), saying the first post-vote was 'solid' (hyperbole).

For the reason of MM, I'm against directing a Vigilante shot tonight.

Anyway, goodnight.

Inbound shooting yuki sheriff/jailor night 1. GG noob town lelz

[Yukitaka Oni]

The problem is, scum can tend to see truth from lies. They know who is on their team, unlike me. I do not know who my fellow townsfolk are for certain. Yes, certain reads might be lied about to try and deceive scum, yet rarely have I seen a town player just post a bunch of lies on his read list. Also, soft-claims D1 are stupid. If you soft-claim to get a doctor to go on you then you're gonna get some sort of scum to mess with you. Like why ask a Doctor to heal you when we might have a Mass Murderer? That doesn't look well, also a Doctor doesn't protect from certain scum roles meant to simply deceive rather than kill certain roles. Also, as to faking soft-claims, that causes confusion among the Town, and Scum will often do that so they can go like "I soft claimed this role earlier". So, there is little to no way to tell a town soft-claim from a scum soft-claim at this stage of the game. There is later in the game, but not now.

Because it can lead them to TPRs.

So, if someone claims a TPR, and you have no way of disproving this, we should just lynch them?

Wording.

Doc on me, am confirmed v)o.o)>!

[Frog]

Implying that your potential contributions are so valuable that scum's performance would improve notably by revealing anything. You'll forgive me for treating this with a dose of skepticism.

Day 1 is also a lynch day, so saying Day 2 is doesn't make much sense. PTRs are not going to be much more informed than Day 1, assuming they found anything.

What's the issue with determining who is more likely to be pro-town/ anti-town early on? If we took your argument of not lynching to its logical conclusion, then you would render pressure-voting to be entirely useless because it would be assumed that no lynch would take place. Do you think there's any useful information to be gleaned from the chat so far?

Obligatory note that you're a) anti-lynch, which denies town information and b) have openly admitted that you are hiding something. Seems rather odd to do.

100% agree. TDL is the OPPOSITE of being solvey. Basically a non-participant. I find this to be not in the spirit of the game, and even anti-town.

[Frog]

The scum will look at any non-scum reads. They could see what they're maybe doing wrong, who to push on, and who people think are TPRs. Yeah, no one person is all that important, but it's a compilation. You can connect the dots easily as scum.

Day one is not considered for lynching in my case. The only times I lynch day one is when it's a night start, or a Neutral Benign claims.

Scum can A: Determine Neutrals from Town, B: Find TPRs based off reads since so many people go "Bored Citizen or scum" "TPR or scum". There is useful information, but I do not look at day one reads as fool proof, as they are wrong a majority of the time. I won't tell you my exact play style, as I like keeping my inner thoughts secret, but day one alone doesn't work.

Pressure is not good day one. Scum will claim and we will have nothing to deny that later. It's more likely to reveal TPRs and Citizens. Revealing Citizens gives less room for our TPRs to hide in, and revealing TPRs leaves them open to kills or being messed with by certain Scum roles.

Also, nice "obligatory note". Now I see you trying to discredit me for a future lynch. GJ.

Honestly man, I'm not sure how genuine this was, but we play the game differently as Town.

I post my scum reads and town reads. That way TPRS know who to target. That way Town knows who to pressure and lynch. That way we can make sense of kills and determine scum play being simple or fancy etc.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Honestly man, I'm not sure how genuine this was, but we play the game differently as Town.

I post my scum reads and town reads. That way TPRS know who to target. That way Town knows who to pressure and lynch. That way we can make sense of kills and determine scum play being simple or fancy etc.

When will we kill the town and name it town v)o.o)>?

[TheDarkestLight]

Honestly man, I'm not sure how genuine this was, but we play the game differently as Town.

I post my scum reads and town reads. That way TPRS know who to target. That way Town knows who to pressure and lynch. That way we can make sense of kills and determine scum play being simple or fancy etc.

I do this every game on D1. D1 is not a good day for the town.

[Frog]

Annnnd I had this nice long sign-off post as I'm going to bed now, but guess what happened to that?

I'll just say that either a) I disagree with TDL's points and how they're being used to justify a no-lynch or b) I agree and I'm being a contrarian to pry into how you think/ present yourself.

And Frog, I'd like some detail on why you were buddying me so hard on the first few pages with claiming I was the 'strongest town' read after 3 posts (hyperbole0, asking for a Doctor on me (not a great move with MM, eh?), saying the first post-vote was 'solid' (hyperbole).

For the reason of MM, I'm against directing a Vigilante shot tonight.

Anyway, goodnight.

Dude, I find my neck spasming from nodding my head so much when I read your posts.

You read the way a Town would direct, especially as you picked up on the player level in this game, it's a very strong open that people can get a grasp of how to play as Town, whether or not you actually are Town.

I'd like to keep you in because I'd like to see more of this.

Does this make you Town? No, but it excludes you from a D1 lynch.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Drop the hint: Yuki is not a commie or trying to protect the tree

[Frog]

I do this every game on D1. D1 is not a good day for the town.

KK.

Mike already gave us his reads and soft claim. I'd be willing to keep him alive for the night but he'll be in the spotlight tomorrow and pressured to act on the pressure. Considering the way he's acted today, I don't see it in line with his soft claim, I also saw a slip or two. I'm going to go ahead and push the MikeCall lynch as much as I can for informed night actions, considering I don't believe the Suntax lynch will pick up in time to get any info in time to possibly switch back to MikeCall.

-vote MikeCall

[Yukitaka Oni]

Mike...lol. Everybody hate him or something lol...

[Yukitaka Oni]

Remember DarknessB said: if anyone want policy lynch, then lynch me instead to save people life v)o.o)>

[Iced_Monopoly]

Well that was quite a bit to catch up on.

TDL summarized my stance on d1 lynchings well, and Calix, I believe that moderation message was because someone had posted while you were writing, so just continue to hit the post button, eventually yours will go through.

I agree that Iced/ POD's sheep-voting is in poor taste. You can imagine my surprise when I woke up to see such an obvious scum tactic performed by two players.

You claimed earlier that you were voting to pressure for information, a single vote isnt pressure, you need the votes of other players to pressure information. How were you in any way surprised that other votes would fall on this player? Then scum reading on people helping you apply pressure to top it off, thats quite a shifty play you make.

[Toadette]

Dear God you people posted a lot. All I read though was Mikecall squirming around a bunch, certain people scummingly going for the low hanging fruit in Yuki, another pointless argument about day 1 lynch/no lynch, and Yuki not understanding that I'm his Ma, not his Pa.

Mikecall should hang today. If he flips town or scum, either way we get a plethora of info that would help town more than scum. Also, he's a high chance of flipping scum.

[Yukitaka Oni]

Dear God you people posted a lot. All I read though was Mikecall squirming around a bunch, certain people scummingly going for the low hanging fruit in Yuki, another pointless argument about day 1 lynch/no lynch, and Yuki not understanding that I'm his Ma, not his Pa.

Mikecall should hang today. If he flips town or scum, either way we get a plethora of info that would help town more than scum. Also, he's a high chance of flipping scum.

Mama >)o.o)>! ^(^•^(^!

[Toadette]

Mama >)o.o)>! ^(^•^(^!

Vote Mikecall, my son.

[Yukitaka Oni]

-vote Mikecall

[Toadette]

Atta boy.

[Calix]

Well that was quite a bit to catch up on.

TDL summarized my stance on d1 lynchings well, and Calix, I believe that moderation message was because someone had posted while you were writing, so just continue to hit the post button, eventually yours will go through.



You claimed earlier that you were voting to pressure for information, a single vote isnt pressure, you need the votes of other players to pressure information. How were you in any way surprised that other votes would fall on this player? Then scum reading on people helping you apply pressure to top it off, thats quite a shifty play you make.

You're online now and it's approaching the end of the day.

I'd just like to note that you have yet to re-vote Mikecall. Can we have some reasoning as to why that is?

A single vote can be pressure, but it depends on the resilience of the player. I'm scum-reading the other votes because they were sheeping and flip-flopped onto another train quickly despite the lack of a good defense from Mikecall.

[RLVG]

There's less than two hours lest, FYI.

Based on votes and activity on players, we have to determine if we do want to lynch Mike, or go for a No Lynch.
I can put him on L-1.

[Toadette]

There's less than two hours lest, FYI.

Based on votes and activity on players, we have to determine if we do want to lynch Mike, or go for a No Lynch.
I can put him on L-1.

Please do.

[Toadette]

Let the record show that Iced was here and left.

[RLVG]

Please do.

Of course, Miss Pro Lynch.

-vote Mikecall

[Calix]

From what I can tell, the majority want a lynch. The only people who have protested this, as far as I recall, are TDL (feels it will give scum info Day 1) and Iced (claims that Day 1 is invalid evidence for a lynch).

If Iced really has left, then that is certainly enough to solidify suspicions on him. We'll see if he returns to hammer or not.

Suntax was ambivalent about it and changed his vote away from Mikecall with some faulty reasoning. Also rather odd.

Just some points to keep in mind, I think.

[Mikecall]

And it seems you guys will kill a Sheriff, yeah, i know, weird right, if you knew what i soft claimed then you would of known before the votes that I was trying to say I was a sheriff, Calix, I dont have an idea with the type of game you are playing, but seriously though, you have some strange ways of wanting to lynch a town.

But yeah, I already said my case, you guys want me dead, which i am saying is fair enough, but would you want to risk losing a sheriff? that is what i call high stakes.

[Calix]

And it seems you guys will kill a Sheriff, yeah, i know, weird right, if you knew what i soft claimed then you would of known before the votes that I was trying to say I was a sheriff, Calix, I dont have an idea with the type of game you are playing, but seriously though, you have some strange ways of wanting to lynch a town.

But yeah, I already said my case, you guys want me dead, which i am saying is fair enough, but would you want to risk losing a sheriff? that is what i call high stakes.

You have one hour to point out all the posts where you have soft-claimed Sheriff. I can't see very many, so you can show the way.

[ika]

-vote mikecall

Role survival arguments are stuipidly scummy

[The Godfather]

Mikecall has been lynched! Stand by for the host's review and day-end post!


Mikecall (7 [L-0]): Calix, powerofdeath, Yukitaka Oni, Frog, RLVG, Toadette, ika
Yukitaka Oni (1 [L-6]): Suntax

[AppleyNO]

Night One

Mikecall was lynched in the name of the sc2Mafia people. He was an Executioner.


He left a last will:

Spoiler : Last Will :

Well, seems this is what I get, Calix first game trying to make someone vunerable, well done, you know my weakness, well, this is going to effect my WIFOM for the next few games, saying OMGUS which is pretty much what your trying to achieve, well done, it worked, even if I was an executioner, using fail tactics seems to only work for you, but oh well, seems Calix is too pro for this, but town, I am going to say this, Calix might think having huge posts, putting some OMGUS scenarios in there would make her pro town, but keep an eye out on her, she has something very suspicious which you guys would catch onto in the later rounds if she lives. Oh well, gg, seems I was too much of a noob to underestimate the pro of a first timer, God I suck.

in any ways, nobody will use this will to its advantage, probably keeping away from it since it would hold any tactical data, however, I will say this, out of the people who voted me, there will be bound to have some town, some Mafia which would vote me, but at the moment, Calix, Frog, Toadette, and any others who vote me, keep an eye on them, who knows, you might of hit the jackpot,

But overall if there is mass murderer or arsonist, I hope you eliminate this town.

Day One will begin at https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i...C+2015+4pm+CST

Players Alive

1. Teld SuperJack
2. Frog
3. Calix
4. RLVG
5. Ika
6. Yukitaka Oni
7. Zekrom2802
9. powerofdeath
10. Iced_Monopoly
11. Toadette
12. TheDarkestLight
13. Suntax

Graveyard

8. Mikecall

Role List

Hidden Mafia
Hidden Mafia
Hidden Mafia

Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town

Executioner
Hidden Neutral

Link to Setup:

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...S-FM-Standard?

Day Zero:

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...M-167-Standard

Good luck players!

[AppleyNO]

Some people are having problems with the Wolfram Alpha link, but as a clarification night is 24 hours long. Day One will begin 24 hours after I posted the Night One post, which will be December 2nd, 2015, 4 pm Central Standard Time (That's an American timezone).

EDIT: Here is the time in Greenwich Mean Time for those of you in Europe! https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i...wich+Mean+Time