KRC: Sc2Mafia 13th Anniversary Game (S-FM 357)

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

actually I want to hear from Chibi and Lassie the story on Peep decision

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

@FM-Autumn
@FM-Breakup
@FM-Chibi Minnie
@FM-Choo-Choo
@FM-Chromatography
@FM-Eyescream
@FM-Four Past Seven
@FM-Lassie
@FM-Lipstick
@FM-Old Lickilicky
@FM-Platypus
@FM-Player 2
@FM-Protagonist Hair
@FM-Tiny Hippo

If any one of you want to fess up that you visited me last night, please do so so I know its from you and not mafia trying to use a manipulative action on me last night. It’s possible that mafia tried to roleblock me last night so please confirm you didnt visit me so we know for sure. The action on me failed anyway so theres no harm done.

[FM-Chromatography]

@FM-Autumn
@FM-Breakup
@FM-Chibi Minnie
@FM-Choo-Choo
@FM-Chromatography
@FM-Eyescream
@FM-Four Past Seven
@FM-Lassie
@FM-Lipstick
@FM-Old Lickilicky
@FM-Platypus
@FM-Player 2
@FM-Protagonist Hair
@FM-Tiny Hippo

If any one of you want to fess up that you visited me last night, please do so so I know its from you and not mafia trying to use a manipulative action on me last night. It’s possible that mafia tried to roleblock me last night so please confirm you didnt visit me so we know for sure. The action on me failed anyway so theres no harm done.

I confirm I didn't visit you.

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

wasn't me licki. i did think about mind controlling you past 2 night but decided it would be grief. same with my final rb shot

[FM-Breakup]

Protagonist Hair Why didn't you vote yesterday?

[FM-Eyescream]

@FM-Autumn
@FM-Breakup
@FM-Chibi Minnie
@FM-Choo-Choo
@FM-Chromatography
@FM-Eyescream
@FM-Four Past Seven
@FM-Lassie
@FM-Lipstick
@FM-Old Lickilicky
@FM-Platypus
@FM-Player 2
@FM-Protagonist Hair
@FM-Tiny Hippo

If any one of you want to fess up that you visited me last night, please do so so I know its from you and not mafia trying to use a manipulative action on me last night. It’s possible that mafia tried to roleblock me last night so please confirm you didnt visit me so we know for sure. The action on me failed anyway so theres no harm done.

It wasn't me

[FM-Four Past Seven]

skimmed thread for other's reactions (self-consciousness is wolfy I know)

Re: Hippo -- I would have let myself died if I knew BAR no longer existed. Hope you resolve that anger soon (and the airline industry stops fricking with your life) because you might need that after my green flip.

Re: Breakup -- I had no knowledge of you having full claimed, and besides, it was worth verifying. You were trying to self-resolve too, and I wanted to be sure you didn't have some sort of vengeful.


Regardless, not opposed to being ITA'ed so long as Choo gets ITA'ed as well. That reminds me, I have 6 risk now and at that threshold I get 1 risk every time someone tries to ITA me, so I'm guaranteed to die in 6 shots or less. I have claimed the same thing to lassie last SoD, though with less risk at that time.

Back to working on my paper. For those with further complaints against me, feel free to reee into the void.

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

Protagonist Hair Why didn't you vote yesterday?

I don't get what are you two trying to achieve. I am not gonna get baited. You can ask this question rest of the day if you want

[FM-Breakup]

Also I didnt visit u unless I was redirected and if I was it wouldn't have affected u in any way

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

for anyone else coming into thread later on and reading into this^: I already answered this question twice during the first hour today

[FM-Breakup]

I don't get what are you two trying to achieve. I am not gonna get baited. You can ask this question rest of the day if you want

You were around at EoD. You did not vote at all despite the very close wagons. Why is that?

[FM-Chromatography]

for anyone else coming into thread later on and reading into this^: I already answered this question twice during the first hour today

I know you're not talking to me, but you did not. "I thought Breakup up was the consensus" doesn't make sense as an answer when you didn't vote at all, let alone for Breakup.

[FM-Breakup]

for anyone else coming into thread later on and reading into this^: I already answered this question twice during the first hour today

This isn't true. You have not answered the question. We are asking why you didn't vote. "I thought we had a conensus" doesn't explain ehy you chose not to vote esp as the wagons switched majority.

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

You were around at EoD. You did not vote at all despite the very close wagons. Why is that?

I was there close to EoD. I wasn't there the last portion of it. When I left you were leading the votes and I didn't wanna shoot/vote Catnip. 4p7 cfd seems kinda ok but the Catnip switch stinks

[FM-Breakup]

I need to set back and think if this is actually super scummy or I'm just frustrated. Will be back in like 6 hours or smthn

[FM-Lassie]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

breakup i am sorry but you were self-voting earlier. i think you are the last person to judge others vote atm

[FM-Lassie]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

yeah me/Chibi killed Mining
this was mostly my decision

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

yeah me/Chibi killed Mining
this was mostly my decision

can you explain what happened

[FM-Chromatography]

Protag's last post was at 3:50. 10 minutes before EOD5.

Okay, timing aside, there was no majority. I'm not following why it's irrational to assume they wouldn't vote Breakup (or 4P7 since they said they were "okay" with that wagon formation). Catnip was long a wagon at this point so they didn't miss a CFD or anything.

For someone who continuously harped on me for "holstering my shot on Catnip" (even though they "holstered" their shot as well), I'd think voting would be a top priority to ensure nothing is wasted.

Even if Breakup was "the consensus" (I don't recall them ever being more than general POE) though, that doesn't explain why they didn't join said consensus at any point.

[FM-Lassie]

I messaged Autumn last night but honestly most of it can just be posted publically
it was a numbered list so each spoiler is a number

Spoiler : 1 (BAR fakeclaim plan details) :

Ringmaster, when we were messaging, created the plan of having someone fakeclaim that they received Oink's role after he died. The role is only inherited once, so no one is Oink's role currently. I messaged Peekaboo N3 about this plan, though it appears he missed the part where I mention it only transfers once.

2 was 4P7's role

Spoiler : 3 (breadcrumbing) :

I had attempted to set up a breadcrumbing stratagy between towncore members. I created this D2... and told Scarf, of course. Then N2, when I messaged Ring, I told him about this.

The strategy was that messages contain the first word in posts that talk about neighborhoods.
Unfortunately, this turned out to be a bit difficult to use for longer messages, and also has the issue of having normal posts about neighborhoods appear as though they're in messages.

Here are two places it was used (the only times I'm aware of):

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...95#post1008295
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008298
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008302
(My messages here say 'should I claiming', which is intended to be 'should I claim')

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008313
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008316
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008318
(Scarf replies to me, saying 'only if scared').

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1011308
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...14#post1011314
(I say 'Ringmaster messaging', and ping Scarf. This is when Ringmaster was trying to do his plan of having someone inherit Oink's role. I had advised Ringmaster to breadcrumb to Scarf, and said this to ensure Scarf would see it. Ringmaster was fine with me messaging someone at night, though, fortunately. Most likely this is because it would be quite tedious to breadcrumb out all that, with my method.)

It is possible, though not likely, that Scarf or Ringmaster breadcrumbed something else, and I simply did not notice. It may be worth checking at some point, though I much doubt there's anything to be found.

Spoiler : 4 (mining case (this aged well)) :

If, somehow Mining is alive tomorrow*: read their ISO. They have been correct way more than is likely for a less active townie, and their reasoning frequently is not shown at all. Sure, one can argue points of 'well, they would not do something so blatant as wolf'. But, honestly, would they? This post, from Mining:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...16#post1013316
shows a mindset that believes they should not be suspected for correct, TMI-y, unsubstantiated reads.

Also, at times their tone pushing Droopy and Catnip is extremely exaggerated. Notably, these are both townies.

Droopy:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...47#post1014847
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...49#post1014849
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...51#post1014851

Catnip:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...83#post1016083
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...84#post1016084
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...86#post1016086

Also, this last post especially:

"Okay, red on Peep. There's a series of coincidences that make it possible for them to be green, but I don't actually think those are realistic, and I think we're not obligated to consider them. ITA killing badly kill them badly in ITAs kill them."

i actually burst out into laughter irl

I really have a hard time believing they actually laughed at this.
But anyway. These posts on Catnip show an extremely high confidence they're wolf, and they continue this belief with posts like this:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...38#post1016438

However, when ITAs start, they suddenly 180!
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1016549

They do post this, explaining:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...72#post1016572

But even so, the point they're making is not nearly strong enough to outweigh all the stuff from before. Honestly, reading the Flood post they quoted, I don't really understand how that looks good for Catnip at all (more TMI! amazing).

*I am killing them with Chibi. I originally typed point while still unsure, but have fully convinced myself in the process of writing. I'd rather not delete it, though, so here it stays.

Spoiler : 5 (I am mech** clear) :

I am mech** clear. As I previously mentioned, ZOMG softing to Disco doesn't make sense if me/Scarf are w/w, and can just tell Disco anything in hood chat. However, at the time I saw some ways it could be tinfoiled, so I didn't push it that hard. Now, though, I remember that:
-ZOMG tried to signal Goblin was wolf too
-Two wolves tried to discredit the idea that this was a soft

Now, if this were a plot to clear me, ZOMG would have messaged Disco without needlessly implicating other teammates. The way it was done, it would have been putting ZOMG, Disco, and Goblin at risk, to clear me, despite me being pretty low-impact.

Also, other wolves would have jumped on it for cred. If it was planted, with the intention of being found, then wolves would ensure it is found, and make the most of it.

**Yeah arguably this is more dayplay than mech. But still I don't see any reasonable way to tinfoil this

[FM-Chromatography]

Protag's last post was at 3:50. 10 minutes before EOD5.

Okay, timing aside, there was no majority. I'm not following why it's irrational to assume they wouldn't vote Breakup (or 4P7 since they said they were "okay" with that wagon formation). Catnip was long a wagon at this point so they didn't miss a CFD or anything.

For someone who continuously harped on me for "holstering my shot on Catnip" (even though they "holstered" their shot as well), I'd think voting would be a top priority to ensure nothing is wasted.

Even if Breakup was "the consensus" (I don't recall them ever being more than general POE) though, that doesn't explain why they didn't join said consensus at any point.

*would vote Breakup

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

I messaged Autumn last night but honestly most of it can just be posted publically
it was a numbered list so each spoiler is a number

Spoiler : 1 (BAR fakeclaim plan details) :

Ringmaster, when we were messaging, created the plan of having someone fakeclaim that they received Oink's role after he died. The role is only inherited once, so no one is Oink's role currently. I messaged Peekaboo N3 about this plan, though it appears he missed the part where I mention it only transfers once.

2 was 4P7's role

Spoiler : 3 (breadcrumbing) :

I had attempted to set up a breadcrumbing stratagy between towncore members. I created this D2... and told Scarf, of course. Then N2, when I messaged Ring, I told him about this.

The strategy was that messages contain the first word in posts that talk about neighborhoods.
Unfortunately, this turned out to be a bit difficult to use for longer messages, and also has the issue of having normal posts about neighborhoods appear as though they're in messages.

Here are two places it was used (the only times I'm aware of):

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...95#post1008295
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008298
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008302
(My messages here say 'should I claiming', which is intended to be 'should I claim')

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008313
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008316
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1008318
(Scarf replies to me, saying 'only if scared').

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1011308
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...14#post1011314
(I say 'Ringmaster messaging', and ping Scarf. This is when Ringmaster was trying to do his plan of having someone inherit Oink's role. I had advised Ringmaster to breadcrumb to Scarf, and said this to ensure Scarf would see it. Ringmaster was fine with me messaging someone at night, though, fortunately. Most likely this is because it would be quite tedious to breadcrumb out all that, with my method.)

It is possible, though not likely, that Scarf or Ringmaster breadcrumbed something else, and I simply did not notice. It may be worth checking at some point, though I much doubt there's anything to be found.

Spoiler : 4 (mining case (this aged well)) :

If, somehow Mining is alive tomorrow*: read their ISO. They have been correct way more than is likely for a less active townie, and their reasoning frequently is not shown at all. Sure, one can argue points of 'well, they would not do something so blatant as wolf'. But, honestly, would they? This post, from Mining:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...16#post1013316
shows a mindset that believes they should not be suspected for correct, TMI-y, unsubstantiated reads.

Also, at times their tone pushing Droopy and Catnip is extremely exaggerated. Notably, these are both townies.

Droopy:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...47#post1014847
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...49#post1014849
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...51#post1014851

Catnip:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...83#post1016083
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...84#post1016084
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...86#post1016086

Also, this last post especially:

"Okay, red on Peep. There's a series of coincidences that make it possible for them to be green, but I don't actually think those are realistic, and I think we're not obligated to consider them. ITA killing badly kill them badly in ITAs kill them."

i actually burst out into laughter irl

I really have a hard time believing they actually laughed at this.
But anyway. These posts on Catnip show an extremely high confidence they're wolf, and they continue this belief with posts like this:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...38#post1016438

However, when ITAs start, they suddenly 180!
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...=1#post1016549

They do post this, explaining:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...72#post1016572

But even so, the point they're making is not nearly strong enough to outweigh all the stuff from before. Honestly, reading the Flood post they quoted, I don't really understand how that looks good for Catnip at all (more TMI! amazing).

*I am killing them with Chibi. I originally typed point while still unsure, but have fully convinced myself in the process of writing. I'd rather not delete it, though, so here it stays.

Spoiler : 5 (I am mech** clear) :

I am mech** clear. As I previously mentioned, ZOMG softing to Disco doesn't make sense if me/Scarf are w/w, and can just tell Disco anything in hood chat. However, at the time I saw some ways it could be tinfoiled, so I didn't push it that hard. Now, though, I remember that:
-ZOMG tried to signal Goblin was wolf too
-Two wolves tried to discredit the idea that this was a soft

Now, if this were a plot to clear me, ZOMG would have messaged Disco without needlessly implicating other teammates. The way it was done, it would have been putting ZOMG, Disco, and Goblin at risk, to clear me, despite me being pretty low-impact.

Also, other wolves would have jumped on it for cred. If it was planted, with the intention of being found, then wolves would ensure it is found, and make the most of it.

**Yeah arguably this is more dayplay than mech. But still I don't see any reasonable way to tinfoil this

thats a towny process on peep from you actually. what about chibi? any cliffnotes on their hood comms?

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

also the whole ringmaster/scarf/lassie crumbing is wild. i haven't looked for any crumbs this game lol

[FM-Lipstick]

Guess I'm still here lol

[FM-Chromatography]

Guess I'm still here lol

I'm not going to hog your attention or anything but if you could let me know if I'm being irrational about Protag, that would be helpful.

[FM-Lipstick]

We should just shoot
Choo and Four

Breakup is town anyway
They have the Catnip vibes
As is Protag

[FM-Lipstick]

I'm not going to hog your attention or anything but if you could let me know if I'm being irrational about Protag, that would be helpful.

Yeah, you are.
Should probably stop biting at villagers tbh

[FM-Lassie]

can you explain what happened

writing the message I sent to Autumn (point 4) is what ended up convincing me there
as for not choosing other people:

Main other people I was considering were Breakup, Choo, and 4P7

Mech-wise:
If ITAs didn't get disabled, Choo and 4P7 are heavily wounded, so they're worse kills
If ITAs do get disabled, Breakup will be alive because of their +1 armor from Peekaboo, and with no ITAs they'll just live, so they're a worse kill

as for reads:
Breakup was POE and in my view had points for and against them
I also remembered posts like this:

Yeah

I highly doubt Breakup is wolf

How she defended you when two known wolves tried to kill you
How she's offering herself up doesn't read manipulative at all

I'm keeping my vote

Choo I thought was kinda towny because their push on me would be terrible as wolf
like even if they managed to kill me, they'd just look terrible off my flip so ???
Plus they were also not an eod wagon

4P7 I also found kinda towny after rereading their message to me and seeing again their thing about trying to get nightkilled, and the explanations they gave for their actions
Normally I'd put more weight in consensus but I'm the only one who had their message and claim

[FM-Chromatography]

Yeah, you are.
Should probably stop biting at villagers tbh

I just don't understand how my question would be baiting but you seem best at deciphering irregular tone.

[FM-Lassie]

thats a towny process on peep from you actually. what about chibi? any cliffnotes on their hood comms?

they mainly differed to me
main thing is, when I gave the following list of people I was considering (and noted in that list that I was leaning towards removing Eyescream and Chroma) (the following is not ordered):

Chroma
Choo
Breakup
Mining
4P7
Eyescream

Their ordering, and paraphrased explanations, was (from most preferred to least):
Mining (biggest wolfread after Catnip flip)
Breakup (CW shot is good but has armor)
Eye (No reasons one way or the other)
Four Past Seven (Most likely town in these names, but above Chroma/Choo because CW)
Choo choo (Next to most likely town here)
Chroma (Self-resolve claim)

[FM-Lipstick]

I just don't understand how my question would be baiting but you seem best at deciphering irregular tone.

I think Protag is more allergic to being accused than most tbh

Not very concerned with Protag right now myself

But I've been plenty wrong too
Defended Choo for too long
Only got to their ISO right before EoD last phase and recommended a wagon there
But it was too late

We get Choo in ITA 1

[FM-Chromatography]

I think Protag is more allergic to being accused than most tbh

Not very concerned with Protag right now myself

But I've been plenty wrong too
Defended Choo for too long
Only got to their ISO right before EoD last phase and recommended a wagon there
But it was too late

We get Choo in ITA 1

Should most shoot in ITA 1 this time?

[FM-Lipstick]

Should most shoot in ITA 1 this time?

We shoot until Choo is dead imo
They were caught visiting Peekaboo
So top priority

Four's defence seems town
But everything else is wolfy about them imo

[FM-Lipstick]

I guess I should ISO Lassie at some point
Just in case

[FM-Lipstick]

If any one of you want to fess up that you visited me last night, please do so so I know its from you and not mafia trying to use a manipulative action on me last night. It’s possible that mafia tried to roleblock me last night so please confirm you didnt visit me so we know for sure. The action on me failed anyway so theres no harm done.

I didn't visit you @FM-Old Lickilicky

[FM-Lipstick]

Breakup is also town on the account of Choo literally nagging me and everyone to vote Breakup at EoD last day because it's +ev or whatever. They also said they would vote Catnip to save Four, and how it was a gamble or whatever to vote Four. Which naturally doesn't make any sense.

4P7 is wrong, that slot is super wounded
itas may close sure but there's no reason to gamble like this imo

gamble on itas closing
it's ++ev to land on breakup here

I WILL vote catnip to save 4p7 btw

[FM-Chromatography]

Breakup is also town on the account of Choo literally nagging me and everyone to vote Breakup at EoD last day because it's +ev or whatever. They also said they would vote Catnip to save Four, and how it was a gamble or whatever to vote Four. Which naturally doesn't make any sense.

Yeah, I buy this.

[FM-Lipstick]

We shoot Choo
Game probably doesn't end
We shoot Four
If game doesn't end
Chroma is up next imo

[FM-Four Past Seven]

Breakup is also town on the account of Choo literally nagging me and everyone to vote Breakup at EoD last day because it's +ev or whatever. They also said they would vote Catnip to save Four, and how it was a gamble or whatever to vote Four. Which naturally doesn't make any sense.

I swear me seeming w/w with just about every wolf is going to become a meme in some form. Its funny because I almost TRed the guy yesterday too till I realized he could've done what he did for Flood's sake.

Something something casual commentary (not really defending, just saying) and since thread is slow I'm reading and doing my paper at the same time which totally isn't a sign of me having an unhealthy relationship with FM

[FM-Lipstick]

I swear me seeming w/w with just about every wolf is going to become a meme in some form. Its funny because I almost TRed the guy yesterday too till I realized he could've done what he did for Flood's sake.

Something something casual commentary (not really defending, just saying) and since thread is slow I'm reading and doing my paper at the same time which totally isn't a sign of me having an unhealthy relationship with FM

Yeah, if you're town here
It's literally the most unlucky thing I've ever seen
You've explicitly and implicitly defended and town read about every wolf you came across
And they defend you

It's almost like you're
Just a wolf lol

But if you are town
Shit happens
It's a good meme

I think a lot of us have somewhat unhealthy relationship to FM
I also play more in times when I have a lot of stressful things going on in my life
Humans need some silly outlets sometimes
And that's ok

[FM-Four Past Seven]

I'm just imagining the next time I'm in a mash where I can discuss self meta

and someone will ask me "what's your mash experience"

"uhhhh I had one where I tr'ed all the wolves and wolfsided hard, does that count?"

and it wouldn't be much of an exaggeration lmao

[FM-Four Past Seven]

I do feel better about how I'm doing though. Earlier I was massively upset about it but then I noticed that people were still calling me towny at times despite that. So that's cool I guess.

[FM-Chromatography]

We shoot Choo
Game probably doesn't end
We shoot Four
If game doesn't end
Chroma is up next imo

I'm actually about to self clear since I wasn't blocked last night. If nothing happens by D7 though, feel free to kill me.

[FM-Platypus]

Lmao I wasted my item by visiting Peep. Oh well.

[FM-Chromatography]

I'm actually about to self clear since I wasn't blocked last night. If nothing happens by D7 though, feel free to kill me.

@FM-Lipstick Also to add "What if Chroma is lying about self-clearing?"

I can lie but Licky can't. If there's no kill, I'm outted.

[FM-Lipstick]

I'm actually about to self clear since I wasn't blocked last night. If nothing happens by D7 though, feel free to kill me.

Just makes me paranoid you're 3p arsonist or some shit
Maybe we should shoot you first
nya

[FM-Lipstick]

Like who the fuck has a
I self clear on day hundred role
Are your trees dangerous

I am scared

[FM-Player 2]

Just makes me paranoid you're 3p arsonist or some shit
Maybe we should shoot you first
nya

I was so happy and then you posted this.

Imma assume that with lack of posting from Choo Choo means this is a legit red check. Imma try shoot instantly because I have boosted ITA, dont want him to snipe a town on the way out

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

Just makes me paranoid you're 3p arsonist or some shit
Maybe we should shoot you first
nya

even then they cant ignite as i prevent them from doing it