KRC: Sc2Mafia 13th Anniversary Game (S-FM 357)

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

Proposed shotlist:

T1: Dredge / Candyfloss / Monet Rocket
T2: ZOMG / Anthill

Please raise all concerns now.

easy champ

we need to sort the wounded players first

[FM-Choo-Choo]

Why no Luigi? Otherwise I'm fine with the list for now, up until I read anthill or whatever

I wanted to re-eval luigi, since my read is stale and I don't have reinforced confidence from dead chat. Not going to shield the slot though

[FM-Peekaboo]

Proposed shotlist:

T1: Dredge / Candyfloss / Monet Rocket
T2: ZOMG / Anthill

Please raise all concerns now.

Why is Dredge in T1? If you’ve mentioned before give me a way to find it so I can read it later tonight when I’m at home.

[FM-Choo-Choo]

I had decent vibes on ZOMG near EOD yesterday, but nothing concrete.

I'd personally move Anthill up to T1. Don't have a strong opinion on Dredge, but didn't really like their "let's flashwagons BHD!" Stuff on d1. Similar to Anthill, came off like a wolf who didn't give a fuck in the face of what is increasingly verified town wagons.

Works for me

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

Naptime’s read in hood chat before they died:

Choo choo can die
follow tin’s dead list
catnip probably town
autumn most useful town in this game
eyescream need death
Hon Hon/ZOMG should die
minor sus on SSS
and finally he said dont let tiny hippo skate by

[FM-Eyescream]

Why no Luigi? Otherwise I'm fine with the list for now, up until I read anthill or whatever

Player 2 seemed townyish from how far I got into EOD1. Maybe less so if Licky is town(I liked their posts around the Licky wagon), but I'm not really keen on shooting them at this point.

[FM-The Hat]

Why is Dredge in T1? If you’ve mentioned before give me a way to find it so I can read it later tonight when I’m at home.

My case for Dredge lies in my bigpost for d3, but in summary " iso is full of holes, just read like, five lines above, skip the ISO if you want. They also tried to shoot anyone other than the third party (who was actually a wolf) whilst also spending the entire time beforehand thinking UHHHHHHHHHHH HAT AND RED CROSS ARE ALLIGNED"

[FM-Eyescream]

Snuggles had a bunch of people calling for them to be saved at least so I thought it was still plausible they were just healed, I agree that I think poisons are fake but if so I think the whole point of them is to gauge reactions from people, so it's probably better to at least postpone this conversation D:

It's only really me sticking up for them so less likely they would be healed if the poison's real so I did kinda want to let that play out as well just to either affirm my thoughts there or see if they potentially go into antispew instead

That's fair. Though, again, I think it was inevitable it would be discussed pretty early today.

[FM-Dredge]

okay, so why does this make you unpaired?

Because wolf!dredge isn't going to push his partner over a naptime hunch, pair them with Hat possibly and tell the entire game that my scum partner visited me when I would have TMI explanation or even a fake claim mechanically to explain it.

[FM-Oink]

Hey did anyone ask dead chat if they were visited by Morshu btw?

[FM-Ringmaster]

Let me check what SSS’s dying resds were before you guys decide to spit in their face

[FM-Choo-Choo]

Why is Dredge in T1? If you’ve mentioned before give me a way to find it so I can read it later tonight when I’m at home.

@FM-Peekaboo below is what initially tipped me off to have Dredge on my radar, and the dead reinforced my confidence there.

Spoiler : quote :

Spoiler : quotewalling :

Catnip points out their grievances with dredge (unprompted) after dregde complains that catnip was townread and they weren't. Dredge's reaction to this is "wtf, I thought you townread me?" (very similar to their post that catnip quoted)

i really don't like dredge's angle here, catnip saying it's townie is whatever but I like their insistence with their wolf feeling



catnip goes through dredge's arguments for suspecting catnip. I don't really have the context for the first two points but I believe they're defensible

as for the third point I believe I remember the context -- catnip saw Oink say that they were busy and imply that it should be NAI that they entered the thread as late as they did and posted a little emotionally over it. I really don't understand dredge's angle here -- it was wolfy because ... sheeping protag's one liner about it? It doesn't really seem to apply (granted I have no idea what the one liner was) and is kinda a bad point imo.

UPDATE: i found the 1 liner, I think

Spoiler : quotes :

and the catnip post, for reference:

This doesn't even read like it could be construed as sheeping the one liner? I read it as genuine and related to posting about activity; I don't see any subtext about implying it's wolfy at all lol

so imo one of dredge's points (which may just be tacked on to make the case stronger?) is just wrong, which catnip goes on themselves about:




----- then, dredge posts a case



dredge opens by flat out accusing catnip of lying -- having badgered oink for being late, then sheeping it being >rand w -- and pushes hard on the point that now they're sheeping... goblin?

Why does the narrative change here? Anyways, catnip themselves deconstructs it pretty fine so i'm not going to repeat that:




catnip clarifies things, and honestly in a way that's pretty easy to understand, but dredge doesn't really seem to get it, and circles back to sheeping protaginst hair this time (which is like, wut, am i missing some context here?? Dredge seems to continuously misinterpret what catnip is saying and at this point it's really hard to believe that perspective is legitimate.





(there was more quotes between the two of them, but i didn't have much to say so I cut them out)

Dredge has consistently brought arguments to the table that while yes, some of them are valid points that catnip does address, the ones that keep getting argued over either change between posts (sheeping protag --> sheeping goblin, which was never mentioned before) or are just so extremely tunneled that catnip could just quote themselves to discuss the point.

The arguments here and here hardly make sense to me anymore (I tried to boil them down to points but couldn't). My take on this is that dredge just tunneled catnip for some reason (? to seem productive, to cause something to happen?) and brought up arguments seemingly just for the sake of arguing.

It's hard to see their involvement here as genuine, and I think catnip saw it too by the end, but they didn't say much about it themselves and end up seemingly townreading them by the end of it. Which, I don't understand, I had dredge as a slight townlean before this but now I'm putting this as a wolflean after reading this.

tldr - catnip v dredge is a lot of dredge being wolfy (by bringing up dead points slightly shifted to poke holes at catnip & their perspective is really hard to follow and see as genuine). Catnip townreading dredge for this is weird, but i can see it because from the perspective of the victim of the tunnel the absurdity of the tunnel would be amplified to a point where it seems -EV for a wolf to do (?)

This could be w/w theatre (since nobody in thread seemed to care (from what I remember, could definitely be wrong here)), but I think that's unlikely at best considering the nature of this tunnel and that catnip is town


...this took me way too long to make

[FM-Yellow Snow]

That's fair. Though, again, I think it was inevitable it would be discussed pretty early today.

I was hoping people would move on but eh, maybe D:

[FM-Peekaboo]

Hey did anyone ask dead chat if they were visited by Morshu btw?

Villagery thought

[FM-Chromatography]

I know someone told me that Dredge is unaligned with Red Cross but I never got an answer as to why. Personally, I don't village read them.

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

Do you really think I'd let my hypothetical wolfmates be so bad at ITAs if I was their partner

[FM-Chromatography]

-vote FM-Hon Hon Hon

as well

[FM-Eyescream]

Naptime’s read in hood chat before they died:

Choo choo can die
follow tin’s dead list
catnip probably town
autumn most useful town in this game
eyescream need death
Hon Hon/ZOMG should die
minor sus on SSS
and finally he said dont let tiny hippo skate by

Hippo is pretty mech cleared? This coming from someone who struggles to come to a townread on him.

Disagree on Choo Choo and Hon, a little disagreement on ZOMG.

The rest seems decent if true.

[FM-The Hat]

You might not like the reasoning but it's true

[FM-The Hat]

It's why I removed the possibility of naptime as a deepwolf

[FM-Eyescream]

Trying to figure out whether Licky is actually relaying Nap's reads or trying to use his name as cred to push townies

[FM-Dredge]

my wolf range isnt bad either but none of that makes sense.

what does make sense is RC made a sloppy read swap, got called out on it, and then shimmied his way into a grave.

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

Hippo is pretty mech cleared? This coming from someone who struggles to come to a townread on him.

Disagree on Choo Choo and Hon, a little disagreement on ZOMG.

The rest seems decent if true.

is he? i wasnt rly following mechs can you point out where hes mech clear

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

Trying to figure out whether Licky is actually relaying Nap's reads or trying to use his name as cred to push townies

i mean tiny hippo and mining peep can prove it if you doubt me

[FM-Yellow Snow]

If not Red Cross, I think Wakka's ISO is probably good for Dredge with the whole egg thing, didn't feel too theater-y to me

[FM-Oink]

is he? i wasnt rly following mechs can you point out where hes mech clear

Yeah so Morshu has to visit a town D1 and Hippo said they were visited.

[FM-Chromatography]

@FM-ZOMG why did you self-vote yesterday?

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

Hey did anyone ask dead chat if they were visited by Morshu btw?

I didnt

I dont even know who Morshu is, apologies

[FM-Dredge]

If not Red Cross, I think Wakka's ISO is probably good for Dredge with the whole egg thing, didn't feel too theater-y to me

thank you, i actually forgot about lying about the goose thing. what a lame fakerole.

[FM-Eyescream]

is he? i wasnt rly following mechs can you point out where hes mech clear

It has to do with Pyramid's(?) flip, whoever had the Morshu shop. His role basically says he can't target scum in N1. Hippo had claimed to be visited by a shop way before the flip.

So if the rolecard is to be trusted, the only way Hippo can be scum is if someone else claims to have been visited by the shop, or if one of the people who died N1 was visited by the shop.

[FM-Ringmaster]

-vote FM-Choo-Choo

ftr. one of the main mid tier slots i wanna seriously eval tomorrow. rereading his sod1 was kinda underwhelming, could be utr scum, but there have been moments that were really solid, so i need to do a more thourough reading

The dead can say what they want but it’s uncanny how many times someone votes choo and then immedaitelt die

[FM-Choo-Choo]

Because wolf!dredge isn't going to push his partner over a naptime hunch, pair them with Hat possibly and tell the entire game that my scum partner visited me when I would have TMI explanation or even a fake claim mechanically to explain it.

So, you're unpaired because why?

I genuinely don't mean to strawman you, I think it's just hard for me to understand without context.

My understanding is:

Red Cross wolfreads --> townreads Hat
Naptime calls it out, suggests something about an item
Red Cross says that yes, that item was why they swapped their read on a dime
You push Red Cross

I don't see how Red Cross maybe visiting you plays in here

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

The dead can say what they want but it’s uncanny how many times someone votes choo and then immedaitelt die

Ftr it was funny

Cuz the deads told me to sheep SSS

And then I was like 'so I go for Choo Choo?'

Dead chat: No no Choo Choo town

[FM-Platypus]

easy champ

we need to sort the wounded players first

I'd def leave out Joycat out of list now. I know I shot them first IIRC but at the time I felt good about it and not many were objecting (and I really needed that pfp restriction). Looking at who else shot and the Matchstick flip I'd prob TL Joycat for now.

[FM-Platypus]

I didnt

I dont even know who Morshu is, apologies

Morshu deez nuts

[FM-Chromatography]

The dead can say what they want but it’s uncanny how many times someone votes choo and then immedaitelt die

Pressure there is fine too.

[FM-Eyescream]

i mean tiny hippo and mining peep can prove it if you doubt me

Meh, to be fair, I think I'm colored by the fact that some people I was townreading seemed confident on you D1 so I'm not like...let me blast you right now, but weary.

[FM-Peekaboo]

Just for my future understanding, who were the mediums speaking to this night? And was it only villagers or wolves as well? Was it anon or not?

[FM-Ringmaster]

I GOT A FUCKING LETTER BIT ITS SCRAMBLED I CANT FUCKING RRAD JT

[FM-Oink]

@FM-Ringmaster

10000000% ITA was denied by hosts I just got confirmation

[FM-Ringmaster]

OH MY GOD I CANT FUCKING READ IT

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

Just for my future understanding, who were the mediums speaking to this night? And was it only villagers or wolves as well? Was it anon or not?

It wasnt anon, but each 'medium' was in a diff chat

The deads told me they were speaking with me, Minnie, and with Choo Choo and Flood

[FM-Protagonist Hair]

It's why I removed the possibility of naptime as a deepwolf

you come here and have the face to call me a null slot?

PUH-LEASE!!

you were inside naptime's butthole all day dude. I reaction tested dredge and almost killed RC. I will take partial credit on that pelt since I voted them up while yall were afraid to. votehistory is your friend.

Peekabo should be locktown btw

[FM-Yellow Snow]

I GOT A FUCKING LETTER BIT ITS SCRAMBLED I CANT FUCKING RRAD JT

LMAO That's rough I'm sorry

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

I GOT A FUCKING LETTER BIT ITS SCRAMBLED I CANT FUCKING RRAD JT

Try Caesar cipher?

[FM-Eyescream]

I have a feeling that Joycat is a good egg, but I'll have to wait a bit to confirm that

[FM-Old Lickilicky]

Just for my future understanding, who were the mediums speaking to this night? And was it only villagers or wolves as well? Was it anon or not?

tiny hippo mentioned he had 1 on 1 chat with every dead players, then it got consolidated to 1 large chat for convenience

[FM-Ringmaster]

Try Caesar cipher?

PROBLEM IS
IT SCRAMBLES THE FEEDBACK
ITS SCRAMBLED INFINITELY

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

tiny hippo mentioned he had 1 on 1 chat with every dead players, then it got consolidated to 1 large chat for convenience

Was that N1, then?

[FM-Chibi Minnie]

PROBLEM IS
IT SCRAMBLES THE FEEDBACK
ITS SCRAMBLED INFINITELY

:skull: