Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
To those disagreeing with the proposal of being reasonable with skips: I'm saying the following as a completely NAI thing I'd say as either alignment, and this isn't me trying to "look nice" or to "advantage my team" or w/e; I just want the game to be fair.
It's quite obvious that a game without factional kills isn't meant to be skippable forever. Hoping to have a sheriff and going skip skip skip isn't in the spirit of the game, and I really think we should have respect for the spirit of the game here.
Why makes one skip okay that doesn't also make two skips okay?
I can follow you on "spirit of the game," but a skip is *always* going to make the game more townsided. Doesn't matter if it's the first skip, the second skip, or the SEVENTH skip.
I'm also not sure I really agree it's against the spirit of the game. What's the point of removing the factional night kill and not making yeet mandatory if this wasn't the desired result?
Mandatory lynch is a terrible mechanic imo. When you get into a situation where its misslynch and lose its often a great option to skip and allow another kpn to improve the towns standing. I do not believe that mandatory is a 'normal' mechanic at all. I just recognized how broken it is in this unique setup given the lack of KpN.
I play for the experience and not the result. I would rather beat the scum team straight up than take a boring win for some ladder points I dont give a shit about.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I think this was an oversight. I pointed out pre-game that I thought the game was balanced around a senator existing and I felt it was town sided.
I really doubt Stealth had any 'desire' for me to step in and tear apart his setup to the point that it does not require scum hunting to win.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I prefer yeeting during MYLO because you can't get stealth hammered from one town misvote, (nevermind the fact that the town would kill after a skip usually wasn't on the chopping block anyways) but I suppose we'll have to disagree on MYLO vs LYLO there.
I'm going to take as much time as I need. If I need two skips to, say, get through Mike and FrostByte ISOs, I'll advocate for the second skip. If I can get that all done today/D3, then I'll probably have the game solved from reads alone and just push that. But I'm not going to agree to limit skips purely on "gentlemanly" grounds.
I suppose some players like the chase while others like the catch.
Some like the chase while others like the catch I suppose. We can chat about ways to approach MYLO post game but I think its very situational.
https://ibb.co/6r05ZHY
My backyard is calling me and its a chainsaw kinda day.
I would encourage players to voice thoughts and pressure others to voice thoughts on the skip situation.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Let me understand this correctly. We should lynch MM Because first you said he is the only one who could be my mafia partner. Now it can be FB. If me and FB where partners why defend MM? Why not go along with you and bury MM. So we are back to the world me and MM are partners why would FB be defending MM? The problem I have with your logic is there is only 2 mafia. Well there is a neutral. But why would an exe or guardian side with scum????
Well there can be a world FB and MM are teamed and I am hard pocketed. @Helz what is your perspective on this world @Oberon and you? I truly want to hear you thoughts.
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Spoiler : :
Mm is not scum this game @Mike
Im not ever lynching MM, period.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Well I do not see anything wrong with it because mafia may have a buss driver. So how is that not balanced? We still have to trust our reads.
For example left say I am TPR2 I am sheriff night 1 I checked MM got a green check. Now we skip night 2 I check Helz I get a red check. We skip a second day I check FB I get a Green check.
Now what I don’t know is the mafia is MM and FB. Night 1 the mafia bussed there partner with MM night 2 Mafia bussed them self with Helz night 3 mafia bussed FB with there partner.
We now have the 2 mafia as confirmed town. Do you not see that skipping is not cheating? But one advantage town has is mafia does not know who the sheriff is checking.
No if no one was roleblocked I belive they prob would have an agent. And no night KP and no day KP and no one claimed jailed. They prob have buss driver.
If mafia has buss driver and agent that is a bit town sided. Mafia is fucked lol. I would be pissed if I was mafia.
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Now if we don’t have a sheriff this game will never end if there is no night KP. This is an odd setup.
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Plus helz what more info are we going to get from today?
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I read FB as pretty townie. That was the one thing I did with the night cycle. Had a feeling they were scum and had a scum buddy push a counter wagon or something to wiggle them out of a lynch but FB looks pretty good to me. We dont need to depend on potential sheriffs peeks. We can scum hunt.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
No one was role blocked no one was jailed. The only 2 mafia roles that give feedback other than the mafia journalist. But we have confirmed that is not in game. Becise only Oberon is TPR 1. Freckles asked for the TOR2 to out I scum read him more for it. But I am starting to see his perspective. If there is no night KP then why hide.
But helz is worried about an ass or a night hitman holding there shot. Time to find out. Becise I don’t think there is an ass or a night hitman.
What if I claimed TPR2
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Spoiler : :
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Uhh..
I think you just made a poor decision if you are TPR2. If you are please do not claim what role you are.
I personally expect Mafia to hold their kill if they do not feel they are at real risk of being lynched given they have limited kills. Its what I would do especially if I was afraid of a potential BG.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Time to wifom the mafia lol
Do Not open this spoiler under any condition!!!!!!!
Spoiler : :
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I have decided that I am straight the fuck up obsessed with this song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cRIYZWFwOw
Anyways, I am going to start digging through some association stuffs. I would encourage everyone not to hammer the day skip. Bringing it back from L1 would also be a good idea.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
We both have. I honestly don’t think they have KPn. The only person who is town that would know the mafia roel would be the TPR 2. Think about it.
If the TPR 2 is doc or bg then there would be KPN like a hitman but of the TPR 2 is a sheriff then most likly the mafia role would be the buss driver.
I know MM said not to use MoD thought. But the mod would have to pick roles. Or else you could end up with a medic and mafia a buss driver. Then the town PR2 would be useless. So there has to be some balance put in.
@Helz what are your thoughts on this
Do Not open this spoiler under any condition!!!!!!!
Spoiler : :
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Not sure it holds any value to say but our base case situation tonight is of Obe targets TPR2 and they are sheriff revealing N1 peek. Obe would then have himself and TPR2 confirmed as well as the peek voicing a strong alignment indicator.
If TPR2 is a doc or BG they could voice it and we would know there is very likely a hitman while Obe would once again have himself and TPR2 confirmed.
In effect- that journalist role has the potential to clear a slot the same as a sheriff could while providing the town with critical information on the mafia role composition.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Best^
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
If you are scum pray to Belphegor. He may be your only hope : )
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Mike is number one two and three, lol. and if I have to highlight why again, I will... but i wont get over his asskissing and such from yesterday. Not to mention the fact he's literally had like zero interaction with me, no rebuttal to any of my points (that i see or remember), and just all around scum behaviour.
I've kind of just been banking on him being scum. Everyone else is playing rather, uh, well. LOL
I suspect there's a scum between frinckles and MM for sure, but if i were to think about preflip associations (which I hate), I would lean more towards frinckles being with Mike, honestly. While Frinckles believes mike to be scum, it appears to me that it comes from more of a "i know he's scum" mindset rather than a "i believe him to be scum" mindset.
FrostByte seems alright to me, no clue where to align this person.
Oberon is either real tpr or not, so I think that slot works itself out in due time, but I don't see any association with mike at all, so a scum oberon would go against my theory.
Between you and MZ, I don't think I can see either of you being scum with a teammate, but I could see either of you being neutral. From my understanding, neuts pretty much have their own win condition and some are pretty pro town or have the ability to kind of take a pro stance as they can with with town if they complete their objective. So with that being said, I find it would be easy for either of you to play with a town mindset given you can easily align yourself with town and their wincon.
Although I was attempting to make MZ see the light of day with Mike, i would lean more towards him as being the neut over you. He seems to have a more of an invested interest in his scum leans. But hey, I'll allow him or any neut to dictate the way of the game if they vote with us, lol.
i think i touched upon everyone
did i miss someone?
in case I'm not clear
Mike => #1 scum read. when we're done our skipping phase, lynch him. sheriff, check him
Frinckles/MM => at least one of these two is scum. leaning toward frinckles if Mike is actually scum
MM => can see more as a neut than mafia
MZ => neut, if not, town.
Helz=> neut, if not, town.
Frostbye=> eh, probably just town given I feel pretty confident in my leans on other people
Oberon=> will sort himself, but if he's scum i have no damn fucking clue.
So I guess at this point, I really truly only think Frostbyte would be town, cause i don't see anything scummy or out of the ordinary
so final list would really be
Town:
Me
DM
Oberon
Frostbyte
MZ
Helz
MM
Frinckles
Mike
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I mean, I get what your saying. But you do recognize I just mechanically broke a ladder game right?
One thing I have gotten better at over the years is recognizing how others will read me and with my play this game I kinda expect to be a hair under as confirmed town as Obe is. There is very few things I wouldn't do but outlining a way for town to perma skip while defining probable sheriff and outlining how TPR1 can confirm a town block and relay information is a bit much. I am curious as to how I could do this but you read me as 'on par' with Matt in your read.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.