Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Neither list confirms you as triad, it shows you as a possibility.
I've been feeling very light headed today and haven't had much energy to do things. Perhaps it's a combination of lack of sleep and needing to drink more water, but I was hoping I could sleep it off and wake up later feeling better.
Dodge my point if you would like but its seriously suspicious that you pushed counter wagon for DM, then attacked the reasoning for him being scum read, then failed to Lockdown his slot, then today you once again started poking at the potential of a counter wagon.
Quite a little pattern there.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I don't think renegade and naz can both be triad together if DM takes one of the triad random spots. Naz was confirmed by DM visiting DW and having DW flip switcher. Renegade has also been confirmed to be another TPR role by Martin confirming that they visited someone with a locked house on N1. Unless Martin lied and left a fake TPR role up for grabs, the list above provides the most realistic outcome. Since MattZed can't be triad if you aren't triad, it leaves you as the solo Triad spot.
Something did come to my mind though. Wasn't MattZed witched into Frinckles according to Deathworlds? Wouldn't that mean he would have received feedback about the Locksmith action taking place?
Ughhhh the more I read Helz' posts the clearer it is to me that this game isn't going to be mechanically solved today, that we don't have a candidate remotely as good as DM to yeet, and that I really need to do some actually scumhunting ISOs.
Which I will for-sure do tomorrow IRL.
@Auwt if someone is witched into the same house as Locksmith, would they receive feedback about it if they don't visit anyone?
Only worth noting since MattZed never said anything about locksmith earlier.
I think it's funny that two players are biding their time and essentially claiming TPR.
Some serious shit is gonna happen at night lol
(๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)ﻭ 레드벨벳 ! ! ٩(♡ε♡ )۶
I can't lock people in their house @Helz only people visiting so what are you accusing me of failing to lock down DM?
IMO, the likely 4 triad at the moment appear to be DM, Helz, Naz, and MattZed. I am going to double check something and I would be interested to see if I'm right about my suspicions
Afaik CA needs to visit both targets to bind, or at least I imagine that.
Frinckles isn't bound if you protected him n1 and n2.
Now the question is if DM was bound to anyone else, and I doubt me since I was effectively immune for n2 by switching with Yzb25 (though idk if that means Yzb25 was somehow bound instead).
If CA did bind DM on n2 then I imagine the only plausible targets are Mattzed or Unkown.
A.K.A "That One Idiot"
(Responding to Frinckles) Followed by his D1 recap where he says
(Followed by my Iso of him that I wont quote)
In no particular order those are some of the thoughts voiced on him for D1. I am sure theres more but thats a good quarter of the town voicing significant opinions on him. I really do think he was the most widely scum read player as of the start of N1.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
There are a few things worth noting as of today.
1.) If is Spy and really did check bakermir, she would know who killed bakermir. Then this quote comes in.
Now this could be taken in a few different ways. The first one being that she doesn't know what Helz is, but suspects him of not being on her team. While this all relies on both of them being triad, I also feel like this could be naz letting Helz know that she knows he killed bakermir. This may be a stretch, but there is one other thing to notice in her behavior that changed today.
In the last two posts, Naz seems to have taken a stance on Martin not being bus driver for some reason. While this doesn't directly connect her to Helz, it is interesting how she mentioned he could be triad but never actually pushes on him at all.
Point #3, Helz pushing on Renegade. Given Helz seems to have a problem with mechanically solving the game, he seems to be focused quite a bit on Renegade and very little on Naz. This is worth mentioning because Helz was scum-reading Naz on day 2 and has seemingly dropped it entirely.
I don't know if all of these points connect together, but with all of the role-claims going out and confirmed town slots, it seems like a possible solve at this point. MattZed doesn't directly fit into this, except that he seems to want to push both of me and Helz being Butler and I don't know if it quite makes sense given he has mentioned a few times that he is suspicious of me.
I would like to hear other peoples thoughts on this, as crazy as it sounds.
I think it requires having an actionable ability:
Originally Posted by feedback example
ALSO @Unknown1234
A.K.A "That One Idiot"
I am suggesting you not locking DM's house from visitors would be a scum motivated action. It would allow for the CA to do his thing on DM knowing DM was the next days lynch. And that that in combination with you protecting Frinckles when he was widly scum read and pushing against DM's lynch multiple times reflects a pattern I find very alarming.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
-vote Dark Magician
OOO NOOO REN WANTS TO PROT DM
I also believe I once said or implied that I didn't particularly care (this isn't to indicate a lack of care nor emphasis on it) for who Locksmith protected since I felt things were going to progress in a positive way anyways
its not like anyone said "HEY WE SHOULD PROTECT X"
Technically I did on DM, but I left that position to be done by either me or the Locksmith, and it just so happens neither of us targeted DM.
If anything, I suppose I have as much blame as Renegade for it since my last night bussing basically did nothing.
A.K.A "That One Idiot"
The funny thing is there was even a good bit of discussion D2 about how the locksmith is specifically more likely than the miller because you likely targeted the Bus Driver. That Defending a Scientist makes the least sense because the Triad would also want the Scientist to live.
Protecting Frinckles D1 when he was the most widely scum read player? The player who also just so happens to be the ONLY town player the Triad would want to keep alive to hunt down the switcher?
And I dont believe you even claimed you had protected him until after every other known PR had given feedback. For all we know you took no action and just said that you targeted him after the fact.
Just for a second opinion @Frinckles How town read do you think you were read at EOD1? Do you find Renegade targeting you then or claiming to last night instead of DM suspicious?
The more I think about it Renegade the more convinced I am that your Triad.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
I do not concede the fact that Frinckles was most scum read d1 player, especially after the oberon flip.
I'm done engaging with Helz and will happily consider his elimination based on his shaky play and strange behavior.
Shaky claim i mean.
I would love to hear more about this 'strange behavior' of mine. Was it the part where I pegged DM and DS would be W/W before anyone else? The part where I created the mechanical framework to solve through claims? Maybe the part where I keep pushing the town to scum hunt and arguing for optimal strategies? Or the part where I railed on the town to make DM the next lynch to the extent people were not even willing to talk to him today?
So far my stated town reads have been flipping town and my stated scum reads look to be flipping or about to flip scum. This would strongly suggest my reads are both good and I am not giving false reads to the town. I do not think I have herd a real argument yet against my play in this game outside from 'Your claim looks weird' or 'The PoE structure you created suggests you could be scum.' What kind of scum player creates the scum hunting structure to trap themselves? So if you would like to point to some behavior of mine as being weird I would love to hear it.
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.
Your role does not make sense in my mechanical solve. You seem to be trying very hard to get Renegade lynched, did not comment on how you suspecting naz doesn't seem to pop up right now, how you asked me why my solve was missing logic but never responded when I actually explained the logic behind it. You are justifying your reads as reasons why you're town but have no associations with people in this game.
I understand why you think it could be but renegade is very much a mechanical player I think.
Even if he was scum, how much does he gain from keeping me alive another day?
Moulder!Renegade could just say "eh he was scummy, I didn't believe he was telling the truth with his claim" and I'd prob be as good as dead.
But he kept me alive and stopped the DH from likely killing me. If he's scum, everything he's done has been anti-triad mechanically even if I die at the end of this day.
There's no real reason for him to let me be a confirmed role another day even if I died by other means. He, regardless of alignment did something blatantly anti-triad because the triad could have 3 town dead instead of 1.
I've been drinking I hope that makes sense.
(๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)ﻭ 레드벨벳 ! ! ٩(♡ε♡ )۶
Just going to comment on this because I feel like you contradict your own statements a little bit. You mentioned earlier that you've played setups like this before and that games usually come down to the last few people resulting in town claiming triad to get them to lynch themselves. Why wouldn't you be providing actual reads if you knew that you'd basically be playing on your own? It sounds like your argument is you're suggesting having accurate reads makes you town which is a concern to me.
I'm going to phrase this other concern differently in a way that I feel would be easier for you to answer and give me a better sense where your thoughts are. Do you think naz and Renegade can be triad together? Which one is more likely to flip triad to you right now if you had to lynch either one today.
You've been giving naz a few passes this game for allowing night actions to go through, but yet seem very concerned about what renegade has done instead. To me it feels like you're picking which arguments to go after even if they both have very similar situations.
Was kinda tunnel vision on Renegade. I really think I am onto something with him. You should take a look yourself at what I am talking about. I get a little excited when I get this feeling.
I dont really see much with your Naz thing. If she knew I was Triad mentioning that when people are considering me for tomorrows lynch makes very little sense. It casts more shade on me and it takes a lot of mental gymnastics for someone in my position to look at that and think "Oh, you know what I did last summer".
And you say that I have a problem with mechanically solving the game? I laid out the structure for us to do it. I just pointed out that people making 4 or 5 assumptions to theory craft a mechanical solve in a game with no association tells is doing it wrong. That we should use it to help us understand where to look for right now.
And its early in the day so please excuse me for not having ISO'ed every player already.
For your reply that I didnt respond to I wont for a while. That sort of thing takes a bit for me to map out so I can look at what assumptions you may have made and what posts reflect the thought process you voiced. I will get into that when I ISO you.
Seriously though. Do you not see this connection of Renegade protecting Frinckles N1 who claimed the only town role Triad would like to keep alive when Frinckles was widly scum read. Then pushed DM's counter train until DS lynch was locked in. Then immediately worked to discredit the FoS on DM. Then failed to prevent DM from being bonded and finally in D3 once again started pokeing at lynching outside of DM.
Like.. I point out that series of events and what pops in your head is that I am pushing Renegade to avoid talking about Naz?
Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.