A Theme for M-FM

[Dust]

The Top
Godfather
Consigliere

The Sewer Rats
Mafia Boss
Hidden Mafia
Hidden Mafia

The Travelers
Mafia Boss
Hidden Mafia
Hidden Mafia

The Darts
Mafia Boss
Hidden Mafia
Hidden Mafia

The Town
Vigilante
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town
Hidden Town

Neutral
Thief
Truck driver
Mafia for Hire
Mafia for Hire

Win conditions:
Red Mafia:
See all the Mafia Bosses dead and have the Godfather survive

Regular Mafia: Kill the Godfather and all other Mafia Bosses while keeping your Boss alive

Town: Kill The Godfather and all Mafia Bosses and the Thief

This is inspired by Zack's theme idea along with FalseTruth's minor ideas. The premise behind this theme is that the Mafia factions are vying for power through money. And I wanted to try out how a Truck Driver might fit in to a setup.

When the Mafia Boss dies, the rest of the faction joins the faction that killed the Mafia Boss. Even if that faction is the town. That way, killing is more thoughtful and more carefully considered than might normally be the case. Dead members do not switch factions in their graves.


Money
Each night each faction receives 25 money for each member (from now on, it will be like 10m or 30 m or w/e)

The faction members decide what to do with the money as a faction. Each of the abilities use up money.

Action	Cost
Kill	100m
Regular action	40m

Any Mafia faction may "steal" 1/3 of another faction's money from another faction by targeting a member of that faction.

In addition any faction may put up a job to kill someone during the day. This job offer is anonymous except that the faction's name will be printed. The faction chooses a price for someone else to kill. Whoever kills the target receives the money. The faction that put the job up cannot kill that target. Any kill towards the target pierces any invulnerability that target may have. This is the only way to kill the Godfather. The minimum offer to kill a target is 200m.

Each Mafia faction starts with 50m. The town has no money at the beginning of the game.

The Truck Driver gives additional funds.

The town:
Town actions do not use up money but use up charges. Each role has a starting number of charges. The default starting number of charges is 3. Additional charges cost 75m. You cannot buy a charge and use an ability in the same night.

Town members may be "hired" for the price of 200m

Roles:
The Godfather
He receives an additional 25m each night (50m just for him) and has a night chat with the Consigliere
Is invulnerable until one faction has 300m
May kill and bypass protection for 150m
May "go on alert" and kill anyone who tries to kill the Godfather for 30m

Consigliere
May investigate for 30m

Mafia Boss
Has one passive Bullet-Proof vest
If dead, the rest of his former faction either gain the win conditions of the Godfather or the Mafia Faction that killed the Boss.
Has the final say for kill votes

Blackmailer
May Silence his target for 30m
The Silenced target may only vote and say "I am Blackmailed"

Consort
May role-block her target for 30m

Janitor
May clean the body of his target for 30m

Tracker (Detective)
May follow his target and learn where his target went for 30m

Interrogator (Jailor)
May jail his target for 30m
Role-blocks but does not protect
can only choose to jail after a no lynch day or after two consecutive lynch days
Cannot kill on his own (Choice of the entire faction)

Framer
May frame his target for 30m
the target appears to information roles as a random living Mafia role


Vigilante
Has 3 shots.
May shoot once during the day
May shoot the Godfather once all bosses are dead

Virgin
If lynched or killed, no mafia kills are possible for 1 day.
If roleblocked will become an escort (slut)

Town Leader
One random town player is chosen to be the Town Leader
This gives the player 1 extra vote, 1 bulletproof vest, and an additional 25m every other night.
This extra vote is kept secret. I will keep my own tally of votes so I will tell you when someone is lynched.
If a Mafia for Hire targets the Town Leader, the Town Leader may hire him if he has the money.

Truck Driver
Win condition: Survive until the end
His target receives 25m.
In return, the Truck Driver cannot be targeted by that player's faction or, if town, that player.

Thief
May steal up to 1/3 of a factions funds
May kill for 50m
Starts with 40m
Win condition: Kill everyone that stands in your way
If he kills a mafia boss the remaining faction members randomly join other factions

Rat
Is a random mafia member (Godfather and Bosses are excluded for this role) that is neutral
May send a message to any faction of fewer than 11 words. This message will have to be OK'd by me before sending this off. THE MESSAGE WILL HAVE NO NAMES.
Win condition is to survive until the end.

Mafia for Hire
Win condition: Be recruited into one of the mafia factions
Is one of the possible mafia roles but is not told which one
Can target one player each day asking to be recruited. Only the Godfather or a Mafia Boss can recruit. The decision to recruit takes place during the night.
A recruitment costs 150m

Possible Mafia Roles: Blackmailer, Consort, Janitor, Tracker (Detective), Interrogator (nerfed Jailor), Framer, Drug Dealer
Possible Town Roles: Escort, Investigator, Doctor, Lookout, Coroner, Virgin, Gunsmith

Investigation results:
Investigator/Consigliere/Blackmailer
Godfather/Mafia Boss/Truck Driver/Virgin
Consort/Escort
Interrogator/Vigilante/Gunsmith
Janitor/Coroner
Tracker/Lookout
Thief/Doctor/Drug Dealer



This is very much a WIP. Criticism is welcome.

[Zane]

Damn, I thought it would be my animal forum mafia idea.

[Luna]

I like it, but that day chat would be weird lol.

"You're acting suspicious, you're scum!"

"Why, yes I am. Aren't you?"

"... Yes."

It would be interesting to see whether anyone would be able to accurately guess who the Bosses are, since regular scumhunting tells won't work.

[Nick]

Colorful type. Should be a good idea. I think town might need to be buffed though. Either by number or abilities. I look forward to trying out this setup.

If Mafia boss is lynched, what will happen? Do they join town?

[Dust]

If a boss is lynched the faction joins with the Godfather or if another faction hammered, that faction

[Dust]

I should put in a "steal" action for the mafia to do. And perhaps a "thief" role. Ideas for a thief role?

[Dust]

Yes, the day chat would be very weird. I don't know how to remedy that. Any ideas?

[Luna]

Truck Driver
In return, the Truck Driver cannot be targeted by that player's faction or, if town, that player.

Is that just for that night, or for the rest of the game?

[Nick]

I found a way to break this game. Hidden Mafia refuse to kill at night.

All Hidden Mafia will try to get their bosses lynched to join the Godfather. Then target town!

But near impossible to happen. Given human nature.

And I take back my comments on buffing town. Mafia factions will try to kill each other and leave town for last.

[Dust]

Is that just for that night, or for the rest of the game?

Just for that night

[Dust]

I found a way to break this game. Hidden Mafia refuse to kill at night.

All Hidden Mafia will try to get their bosses lynched to join the Godfather. Then target town!

But near impossible to happen. Given human nature.

And I take back my comments on buffing town. Mafia factions will try to kill each other and leave town for last.

That is why the Bosses have control of the faction's kill

[Luna]

My main concern is that this becomes a bit luck-based; you're not looking to see if that player is scum, but what role they are.

In a normal game of Mafia, the Mafia know who each other are so they just pick their kills based on who they think is the biggest threat. It's a bit luck-based, they just don't want to be found. When you make a bunch of mafia factions, all of whom know who is on their team, then any target at night is as good as another. I can see some subtlety in day chat as Mafia members don't want to associate themselves with their friends (if the 3 members of one faction make themselves known, they'll be targeted in the hope the boss is killed).

There's still that issue of 'any target other than my buddies is the right one'

[Dust]

My main concern is that this becomes a bit luck-based; you're not looking to see if that player is scum, but what role they are.

In a normal game of Mafia, the Mafia know who each other are so they just pick their kills based on who they think is the biggest threat. It's a bit luck-based, they just don't want to be found. When you make a bunch of mafia factions, all of whom know who is on their team, then any target at night is as good as another. I can see some subtlety in day chat as Mafia members don't want to associate themselves with their friends (if the 3 members of one faction make themselves known, they'll be targeted in the hope the boss is killed).

There's still that issue of 'any target other than my buddies is the right one'

That is why the Win conditions are so. If the rest of the faction joins after The Boss, then a faction would have to think very carefully about killing someone because they might kill a possible ally.

[Nick]

Yes, the day chat would be very weird. I don't know how to remedy that. Any ideas?

Obviously mafia will masquerade as town, to avoid being killed at night. But mafia factions will not vote and resist lynching to avoid other members joining godfather. To avoid that, why not make it ballot instead of majority vote? Then everyone will vote. And we can somehow connect voting patterns with factions?

[Dust]

Obviously mafia will masquerade as town, to avoid being killed at night. But mafia factions will not vote and resist lynching to avoid other members joining godfather. To avoid that, why not make it ballot instead of majority vote? Then everyone will vote. And we can somehow connect voting patterns with factions?

Good idea.

[Luna]

That is why the Win conditions are so. If the rest of the faction joins after The Boss, then a faction would have to think very carefully about killing someone because they might kill a possible ally.

It'll all come down to how the players adapt, I expect no one to do any role-claiming. The Town will just have to push for any lynch they can get. At the end of the day, how would you pin down who a mafia boss is? I still love this idea, but the fundamental premise of Mafia is having to solve logic puzzles and analyse posts to determine who is on your team. I think the best course of action for every single Mafia player is to just post nothing and vote for no one and kill at night hoping to snipe a Mafia boss whilst hoping your boss doesn't get hit.

[Nick]

I think doing multi-faction and money might be too risky for balance. Should it be separated first?

[Dust]

Perhaps I should add a killing neutral to get everyone to speak up and try to find him...

[Luna]

Perhaps I should add a killing neutral to get everyone to speak up and try to find him...

That's an interesting notion, a neutral killer would inspire some co-operation between factions and begin the WIFOM.

[Dust]

I think doing multi-faction and money might be too risky for balance. Should it be separated first?

Hmm. I don't know. My idea has them intertwined so that the factions have the same amount of funds as the rest and that is what is the core of my idea. I don't think I CAN separate the two.

[Nick]

I think doing multi-faction and money might be too risky for balance. Should it be separated first?

On second thought. Both must be implemented together. Make it so that a death of a member is bad bad bad. They might just dump their allies like lizard tails to avoid getting implicated. Will make it more advantageous to risk your life protecting a member from lynches. If member got lynched, remaining members are less likely to be targeted at night.

[Dust]

That's an interesting notion, a neutral killer would inspire some co-operation between factions and begin the WIFOM.

Maybe someone who messes with the money supply... Like a Thief!

Like this:
Thief
May steal up to 1/3 of a factions funds
May kill for 50m
Win condition: Kill everyone that stands in your way

[Nick]

Hmm. I don't know. My idea has them intertwined so that the factions have the same amount of funds as the rest and that is what is the core of my idea. I don't think I CAN separate the two.

10 money per member might be a bit low... maybe 20 money. So that they can make actions every night.

[Dust]

On second thought. Both must be implemented together. Make it so that a death of a member is bad bad bad. They might just dump their allies like lizard tails to avoid getting implicated. Will make it more advantageous to risk your life protecting a member from lynches. If member got lynched, remaining members are less likely to be targeted at night.

If you lose a member, the money that comes in starts to diminish. basically you lose 1/3 of your income. That's enough reason to try to save your ally

[Nick]

Or make townies the bank!

[Luna]

Yeah the main thing stopping this from being a luck-based kill fest is the money mechanic, which slows everything down and makes it more strategic, you can't take it out,

But can you imagine the first few day chats? *yawn* ^^

[Dust]

10 money per member might be a bit low... maybe 20 money. So that they can make actions every night.

They start with 90m

They can do whatever they want with it. They can save it. They can save some of it. Or they can use it all. It depends on what they want to do with it.

[CmG]

not enough pirates. Too much bread "thumps down"

[Dust]

not enough pirates. Too much bread "thumps down"

The leftover money is spent on rum

[Deathfire123]

HI ZACK'S THEME BUT SMALLER

[Zack]

lol, I am all for this attempt, though this is still quite diffrent from my idea. Recruitment does not happen, see in my idea a dead mafia boss sends the remaining members back into the recruitment pool.

Lets add an interesting notion to this yes? Make it so the hammer vote is like a kill, meaning if you are part of one team and you hammer the lynch on a mafia boss - his members will join your faction.

Lets also add that town can do this too, in other words if a townie hammers the mafia boss then the members of that mafia will stop their ways of crime and will transform into the town version of their roles, like blackmailer turning into a detective for example.

The neutral killer is a good idea to add, to expand on that - if the neutral kills a mafia boss then a shuffle will occur on each of the remaining members of that team. Random.org will decide each member's new affiliation, and they will still all know who their previous allies were naturally. So the neutral killer has the potential to spread chaos and mayhem.

Edit: This also means that if the vigilante kills a mafia boss it is like a townie hammered that boss, same effect - the members turn into townies.

[Dust]

lol, I am all for this attempt, though this is still quite diffrent from my idea. Recruitment does not happen, see in my idea a dead mafia boss sends the remaining members back into the recruitment pool.

Lets add an interesting notion to this yes? Make it so the hammer vote is like a kill, meaning if you are part of one team and you hammer the lynch on a mafia boss - his members will join your faction.

Lets also add that town can do this too, in other words if a townie hammers the mafia boss then the members of that mafia will stop their ways of crime and will transform into the town version of their roles, like blackmailer turning into a detective for example.

The neutral killer is a good idea to add, to expand on that - if the neutral kills a mafia boss then a shuffle will occur on each of the remaining members of that team. Random.org will decide each member's new affiliation, and they will still all know who their previous allies were naturally. So the neutral killer has the potential to spread chaos and mayhem.

Thank you for showing Deathfire his error of seeing our two themes as the same but in scale.

That is a very interesting idea. It would cause a lot of chaos and might lead to some potentially game-throwing scenarios. This gives town a boost that I don't know that they need.

The neutral killer thing would be good yes. I shall add that.

[Zack]

Well if the vigi is too much of a boost, then make the vigi's kill result the same way as the neutral killer. But a townie hammering should still have that effect, though this may create a very funny voting pattern, or planned vote ambushes by team-mates when the voted person is at L-3 ... Still, watching these voting patterns allows to gather information and guess people's roles.

[Dust]

Well if the vigi is too much of a boost, then make the vigi's kill result the same way as the neutral killer. But a townie hammering should still have that effect, though this may create a very funny voting pattern, or planned vote ambushes by team-mates when the voted person is at L-3 ... Still, watching these voting patterns allows to gather information and guess people's roles.

After thinking about it, this would make the day chat A LOT more interesting. each faction would try to find the bosses and and the thief while trying to protect their own. But I won't have their roles change. I don't like to change people's roles unless they're citizens or amnesiacs. There should be someway for the town to switch sides if the mafia can...

[Luna]

I like the idea of the mafia becoming Town if their boss dies to a neutral killer. Kind of a 'ohh crap, we request sanctuary we join the masses!' kind of way. Means that some players will do their best to pretend they're town but secretly screw them over, then suddenly are turned blind and have to rely on town.

[Rocshi]

Please tell me how the fuck town can win this.

[Dust]

Please tell me how the fuck town can win this.

You aren't thinking. The Mafia factions need to wait to use their actions while the town doesn't have to. Also, the Mafia and the Town have similar Win conditions that the town can take advantage of. Also with the addition of the remaining Members of a Faction that lost its boss joining the town, the town can have quite a few members. Please think next time.

[Dust]

I like the idea of the mafia becoming Town if their boss dies to a neutral killer. Kind of a 'ohh crap, we request sanctuary we join the masses!' kind of way. Means that some players will do their best to pretend they're town but secretly screw them over, then suddenly are turned blind and have to rely on town.

Basically, yes

[Ubernox]

I like this setup.

[Dust]

I like this setup.

Thank you. I worked a good half hour on it.

[Dust]

-Added the role cards for the mafia roles
-Revised the Rat role
-Added the Virgin
-Added the Mafia for hire
-Added the Kill Job
-Revised the town's money mechanics
-Fixed some money values for balance
-Added the investigation results
-Added the Coroner to the possible town roles
-Added the Drug Dealer to the possible mafia roles
-Allowed the town to become mafia
-Added the Town Leader

[Dust]

I have been editing this for a week now without anyone noticing without me telling them. I think that it is now time for me to reveal a mostly done setup for a M-FM that I will host.

[Dust]

I'm bumping this again to get some MORE screen time.

[BBmolla]

Seems way too scumsided.

Nick's breaking strategy works, all Mafia claim d1, and then no lynch so the godfather can kill all bosses. Town don't have any control over that, I guess they can try to shoot a mob boss to gain those members. What if two people shoot the same boss?

tbh, optimal town strategy is to claim Mafia.

[Dust]

No, if the mafia all claim then I will report them for gamethrowing. That is why I have their Win conditions so.

[Dust]

And btw BBmolla, that is what this setup is all about. It's switching the roles of town and mafia. If you don't like that then don't play.

[Nick]

Seems way too scumsided.

Nick's breaking strategy works, all Mafia claim d1, and then no lynch so the godfather can kill all bosses. Town don't have any control over that, I guess they can try to shoot a mob boss to gain those members. What if two people shoot the same boss?

tbh, optimal town strategy is to claim Mafia.

No, if the mafia all claim then I will report them for gamethrowing. That is why I have their Win conditions so.

DR's idea of dead members losing might or might not help. Worth considering.

In the case of double kill, first to submit wins?

Sceptical of mafia joining town. As what? Citizens? How about Mafia for Hire?

[Dust]

Perhaps

Yes

Mafia joining town keep their roles EXACTLY like town joining mafia. Mafia for Hire are a part of whatever faction hires them. They keep the role I give them

[Nick]

And btw BBmolla, that is what this setup is all about. It's switching the roles of town and mafia. If you don't like that then don't play.

Indeed. People who don't like new setups and expecting to play like traditional setups should really not join. It's a lose-lose situation. Though BBmolla should find more fault with this setup so that it can work smoothly later.

Oh yea, Dust are you giving players any "secondary objectives" or the like that will mess up our reads?

[Dust]

No secondary objectives at all.