Asking for Role Cards

[Ubernox]

I honestly don't see how this is even a problem. It is a known mechanic in SC2 Mafia, and one that is easily used by Mafia and town alike. It doesn't take much effort to even just make up a convincing role card. Until someone explains to me their arguments, I shall firmly stay in the belief that asking someone for their role card, despite how rare it is, is a perfectly legitimate tactic.

[Lazers]

It's kind of like police IRL asking an illegal immigrant for proof of citizenship

ahahah

[MrPark]

What do you mean by asking others to read the role card? Do you mean asking them to state their roles or by making literally read their given role's abilities?

[Dust]

What do you mean by asking others to read the role card? Do you mean asking them to state their roles or by making literally read their given role's abilities?

Not at all. We ask them to read the Roll of Cards. Usually at Casinos or on Poker Nights

[BorkBot]

Don't make fun of the new guy. Even if the possibility exists that it's Archangel with another fake/troll account.

literally read their given role's abilities

This.

[Dust]

Don't make fun of the new guy. Even if the possibility exists that it's Archangel with another fake/troll account.

Sorry...

I just auto troll at the moment

[MrPark]

The reason I asked was just a few minutes ago some asshole called me "scrummy" merely because I wanted them to state their role. I was the jailor and I had full suspicion of him being something other then a townie- as the investigator stated this out loud. This asshole then waited until I died only to rant on about how its against the rules to call out for people's roles and once again call me a scrummy lol. Seriously does this community allow such behaviors from its members?

[Dust]

The reason I asked was just a few minutes ago some asshole called me "scrummy" merely because I wanted them to state their role. I was the jailor and I had full suspicion of him being something other then a townie- as the investigator stated this out loud. This asshole then waited until I died only to harass me and once again call me a scrummy lol. Seriously does this community allow such behaviors from its members?

Hopefully that player isn't on the forum. I don't condone the behavior of that player. You acted correctly in that situation.

[MrPark]

I know this is a bit off topic but I notice you guys don't have anything against harassment. So many times before I notice people spew out insults and threats to report only to be able to get away it, with absolute no repercussion. I can understand for the threats, however the insults are never necessary. Why isn't there anything to prevent this?

[Luna]

The reason I asked was just a few minutes ago some asshole called me "scrummy" merely because I wanted them to state their role.

This asshole then waited until I died only to rant on about how its against the rules to call out for people's roles and once again call me a scrummy lol.

He does sound like an asshole - asking someone to 'state their role' in day chat may be scummy, may not be, depends on context, but it is a part of the game. The dude probably thought you were asking for his role card; it's a tactic whereby you have to type out exactly what is on your role card. It's a crap tactic and frowned upon, though since you didn't seem to know what it was then you probably just asked him to claim his role (which is fine and dandy and the basis for every single mafia game).

[Dimwit]

I know this is a bit off topic but I notice you guys don't have anything against harassment. So many times before I notice people spew out insults and threats to report only to be able to get away it, with absolute no repercussion. I can understand for the threats, however the insults are never necessary. Why isn't there anything to prevent this?

It really depends on the level of harassment. There's annoyances and then there's game breaking annoyances.

[Ash]

I know this is a bit off topic but I notice you guys don't have anything against harassment. So many times before I notice people spew out insults and threats to report only to be able to get away it, with absolute no repercussion. I can understand for the threats, however the insults are never necessary. Why isn't there anything to prevent this?

It's called the internet, beware of the trolls.

[Raptorblaze]

DR should add it back if he gets time. We kick for it, it should be a known rule.

The reason I asked was just a few minutes ago some asshole called me "scrummy" merely because I wanted them to state their role. I was the jailor and I had full suspicion of him being something other then a townie- as the investigator stated this out loud. This asshole then waited until I died only to rant on about how its against the rules to call out for people's roles and once again call me a scrummy lol. Seriously does this community allow such behaviors from its members?

Sounds like a troll, but I agree with the others. I always demand they claim a role in jail, asking them to read the card is something totally different.

[Goonswarm]

Be Vigilante.
Be Jailed N2 after I was witched N1 and shot the bus driver.
Tell Jailor this.
Jailor says read me description.
I say "of what".
He says "of role".
lol no thats cheating.
I get executed.
He gets kicked.

[Ash]

Be Vigilante.
Be Jailed N2 after I was witched N1 and shot the bus driver.
Tell Jailor this.
Jailor says read me description.
I say "of what".
He says "of role".
lol no thats cheating.
I get executed.
He gets kicked.

LIKE A BOSS

[Pancho556]

One time I jailed that bitch of JackOsSpades (a bitching moderator) and I asked his role and read his card, he said it was against the rules, so I decided to execute him and he kicked me from the game lol fucking faggot.....

You should take out their moderators powers because he is abussing of them.

Cyas...

[Ash]

One time I jailed that bitch of JackOsSpades (a bitching moderator) and I asked his role and read his card, he said it was against the rules, so I decided to execute him and he kicked me from the game lol fucking faggot.....

You should take out their moderators powers because he is abussing of them.

Cyas...

Lol, did you read page number 1, 2, and 3? that would give you a good reason why you got kicked.

[Pancho556]

Lol, did you read page number 1, 2, and 3? that would give you a good reason why you got kicked.

there are no reasons, I just made him a question, he denied to give his card, so I executed him. I got kicked just for making a question?, at least a warning or something... Rofl, I would wish be moderator so I could kick every jailor who jail me...

[vornksr]

Dude, read the thread. Asking for role cards isn't ok; mods will boot you for doing it.

[Raptorblaze]

One time I jailed that bitch of JackOsSpades (a bitching moderator) and I asked his role and read his card, he said it was against the rules, so I decided to execute him and he kicked me from the game lol fucking faggot.....

You should take out their moderators powers because he is abussing of them.

Cyas...

Not power abuse, it says right on the loading screen that asking for role cards is bad. Get over it.

[Lazers]

Couldn't help it

[Ash]

Couldn't help it

+1, i hate when this shit happens lol

[Raptorblaze]

+1, i hate when this shit happens lol

I usually claim jester, 7 times out of 10 the jailor helps me get my ass lynched the next day lol

[Sookie]

I usually claim jester, 7 times out of 10 the jailor helps me get my ass lynched the next day lol

i also generally let the jester go if i am jailor. sometimes help him as well, mafia will likely vote guilty on about anyone, so if i know hes a jester and i set him up, mafia will have a far likely chance to get jestered

[Ubernox]

I still don't see what's so wrong with asking someone about their role card. Also, awesome comic.

[Lysergic]

I still don't see what's so wrong with asking someone about their role card. Also, awesome comic.

Again, it's taking a gameplay mechanic that is supposed to help new players, and using it to make them lose because of their lack of knowledge.

The role-card is like a tutorial. Quoting a role-card is like having played the first level of a game SO MUCH that you have the entire tutorial memorized. Asking someone who is new to quote the tutorial verbatim without making errors in order to prove their role = using a game mechanic in the EXACT OPPOSITE way that it was intended.

If that reason doesn't work, then because DR said so.

[Ubernox]

While you have a good point, I must say that this tactic is so flawed and open to inforseen consequences that it is seldom used. In all my time, I've only seen it used twice. And one of those was in a jail cell. While it does indeed seem to be exploiting the system, personally I would say that it should be treated in a similar way to trolling: no official punishment, but excessive amounts of it could incur the wrath of any ingame mods, and even be labelled as game throwing, which is a punishable offence.



Tldr seems like too small an issue to induce this much fuss.

Also this.

[RMcD94]

If someone asks for my role card I'll die over reading it out.

[Xife]

Honestly I think Jailors should be allowed to ask in most of the pub games u will play u will only get like 2 chances to jail and asking role card is the most affective but being very careful when deciding to lynch.

Not everyone is fast typer so I don't execute people just cuz they don't say.

But If I am anything else I don't ask. Btw In my humble opinion i think the loading screen should be changed to "dont ask players to read their role card (unless you're jailor and the player you're asking is jailed.)

It's only realistic for jailor to be able to get off any kills within 2 jails unless he's put into the rare late game situation with like 4 peeps 2maf 2town he is able to jail a GF or some kind of situation like that.

[Tysheth]

Xife, I think the problem you're experiencing is in fact caused by your assumption that the jailor's job is to execute people.

It isn't.

[cygx]

No, he's assuming that the jailor's job is to find out whether a person is clean or not. Which he's right. You can't find out whether or not someone's clean by just asking a simple role. They can say anything and there would be no one to call bullshit until the next day, when the guy could deny being jailed altogether and call the jailor a liar.

[wolfcheese]

You can't find out whether or not someone's clean by just asking a simple role.

That's kind of the whole point of the game...

[Lysergic]

Honestly I think Jailors should be allowed to ask in most of the pub games u will play u will only get like 2 chances to jail and asking role card is the most affective but being very careful when deciding to lynch.

Not everyone is fast typer so I don't execute people just cuz they don't say.

But If I am anything else I don't ask. Btw In my humble opinion i think the loading screen should be changed to "dont ask players to read their role card (unless you're jailor and the player you're asking is jailed.)

It's only realistic for jailor to be able to get off any kills within 2 jails unless he's put into the rare late game situation with like 4 peeps 2maf 2town he is able to jail a GF or some kind of situation like that.

This:

Xife, I think the problem you're experiencing is in fact caused by your assumption that the jailor's job is to execute people.

It isn't.

Jailor's job doesn't even require an execute. Night chat with jailed + roleblock = Mafia destroyer. Once the Jailor gets the Mafia killing role jailed, you can prevent all Mafia kills until all 3 mafia are known, and then figure out the most efficient way to kill them all without town dying. The roleblock is far more important than the execute ability.

[Dimwit]

Asking for role cards is cheating, there's no debate.

Just like using Lag Chat is cheating.

Just because you can also use it as a source of misinformation does not take away from the simple fact that it is, everyone together now:
FUCKING CHEATING

There's not much else to it.

[cygx]

Being able to use it as a source of misinformation makes it not 100% confirmed when asked for and revealed. Therefore by your definition it isn't cheating, seeing that it does NOT bypass the fact that anything is possible! GJ!

[Ambient]

A role card is for the individual players reference. Not be to shared with other players, especially demanded to prove role. If everyone read their role card it literally breaks game.

Stop arguing about this Cygx. The matter has been solved.

[cygx]

If everyone were to read their role card, the game wouldn't necessarily be broken at all. I mean, who would believe each other? It's a game of lies, and memorizing role cards is a powerful weapon that is just as strong in defending onself as a liar as it is finding whether someone is innocent or guilty. It's an extreme move, yes, but there is no way that it is unfair, seeing that it can be used by evils and towns alike.

I don't see with this in mind how it's been solved.

[Lysergic]

Being able to use it as a source of misinformation makes it not 100% confirmed when asked for and revealed. Therefore by your definition it isn't cheating, seeing that it does NOT bypass the fact that anything is possible! GJ!

Lag chat can be used to disinform anonymously. Doesn't change the fact that a dead role revealing all the scum in lag chat is cheating and can get you banned.

Anything is possible = not a good qualification to exclude something from being cheating.

Just give it up; christ. DR himself said it was cheating. But I suppose you know better than DR, don't you?

[cygx]

Lysergic, you seem to be missing my point completely. My argument is not that it isn't against the rules. My argument is how it is technically not an unfair move, much like lag chat as you just explained.

[Lysergic]

Lysergic, you seem to be missing my point completely. My argument is not that it isn't against the rules. My argument is how it is technically not an unfair move, much like lag chat as you just explained.

Wait, so lag chat IS an unfair move, but asking for role cards ISN'T?

Or are you saying that NEITHER is an unfair move?

If you're saying that neither is unfair, then I'm done arguing with you, since the vast majority of Mafia players agree that BOTH are unfair, and the will of the few (in this case, you) shouldn't be given precedence over the will of the many (in this case, everyone who isn't you).

[cygx]

The majority of Germany back before world war 2 brought the national socialist party into power. Besides that, I'm not asking to be given precedence. This isn't a matter that can go either way, because there is absolutely NO bias towards what team using role card tactics would benefit. Or lag chat, for that matter. Especially seeing that the game is randomized, so would the noobs be.

[NorthStar]

Attachment 819

It's still cheating nonetheless.

[cygx]

And not for any other reason than being a rule. A new one, at that.

[NorthStar]

Was created before this incident, your arguement is invalid. Close this thread now please.

[cygx]

Another one who thinks that my argument is that role carding isn't cheating. sigh. My argument is valid because what I'm saying isn't being contested.

[Ash]

What's the fuss?
Reading role card is cheating because it is taking advantage of others.
99.50% probably don't have time to memorize a dumb role card to defend themselves, so it is considered cheating.

[cygx]

Memorizing Support/Adv Protect one person each night from death, special attributes: none isn't a tough thing to do. It's not time consuming either. And it works

[Ash]

If you really want to prove others wrong, make a thread/poll about it.

[cygx]

Oh I'm not trying to prove anything to anyone. This is just standing my ground where I can.

[NorthStar]

There's like 20 roles in the game, try memorizing all of it word for word, attributes, win conditions, factions, special abilities.