S-FM 204: Insanity

[Gyrlander]

I got a mention notification but I cant find it 😂😂 does anyone know what it was about? Also im very sorry for lurking so hard I totally forgot about this game.. im a Bus Driver just incase you people are wondering. I was so inactive that I didnt even use my night action... so im really sorry about that. Im going to spend some time reading throught the thread to catch myself up. Ill push this train because im sure you people have your reasons.

-vote Gyrlander

if I disagree once reading through ill change my vote.

I'm done with these players, you can go fuck yourself. You don't read what I just said and do that. Thank you very much. See you.

[Iced_Monopoly]

I got a mention notification but I cant find it 😂😂 does anyone know what it was about? Also im very sorry for lurking so hard I totally forgot about this game.. im a Bus Driver just incase you people are wondering. I was so inactive that I didnt even use my night action... so im really sorry about that. Im going to spend some time reading throught the thread to catch myself up. Ill push this train because im sure you people have your reasons.

-vote Gyrlander

if I disagree once reading through ill change my vote.

your mention was in the host day start post, with all our names in the table.
The train on Gyrlander is because kovath died, and kovath wanted to lynch Gyr yesterday. Which is the most ridiculous of reasoning, why would he target someone so obvious and set himself up like that., Unless hes playing some serious wifom right here, its a bad train, or atleast the reasons behind it are bad.

[TheDarkestLight]

-vote Eggy

Solid train. Pointless reveal, and he even claimed he didn't use an action. Likely gonna "forget" again or come up with the idea he was never a BD to begin with. Also, his vote on Gyrlander seems very opportunistic.

His lurking isn't helping either.

[Unknown1234]

your mention was in the host day start post, with all our names in the table.
The train on Gyrlander is because kovath died, and kovath wanted to lynch Gyr yesterday. Which is the most ridiculous of reasoning, why would he target someone so obvious and set himself up like that., Unless hes playing some serious wifom right here, its a bad train, or atleast the reasons behind it are bad.

False. If you think the only reason people are voting Gyrlander is because Kovath died, that's a terrible reason. We have to start pressuring people at some point, so why not try to pressure someone who hasn't done much??

[Unknown1234]

You weren't really doing anything anyways.

I don't like casually disappearing.

[Iced_Monopoly]

False. If you think the only reason people are voting Gyrlander is because Kovath died, that's a terrible reason. We have to start pressuring people at some point, so why not try to pressure someone who hasn't done much??

I also don't see any extra motive to kill Kovath (him being suspicious of the killer). It's possible, but the way he was playing makes sense to see him dead today.

He did want to look into Gyrlander, let's start there.

-vote Gyrlander

Anyone in particular to want to look into today? I'm going to vote Gyrlander for now to start up pressure and get them trying, but also because Kovath wanted him dead a ton.

The people voting kovath are you and RLVG, Eggy admitted not knowing what is going on, and hasnt read, and RLVG didnt post a reason. The only reasons given are by you, for pressure and because kovath wanted 'him dead a ton'

[Unknown1234]

The people voting kovath are you and RLVG, Eggy admitted not knowing what is going on, and hasnt read, and RLVG didnt post a reason. The only reasons given are by you, for pressure and because kovath wanted 'him dead a ton'

Well then I speak for myself, and I'm pretty sure RLVG felt the same way.

[ThePaladin]

You make a good point , I'mma read right now if cult can convert everybody or just cits.
That would make spruance's claim even more questionable

What is the purpose of saying "I'm going to read this"
and posting it?

Why not just say," huh, you're right. That makes ____ look _____"


Just seems like a really odd thing to post

[ThePaladin]

Only the leaders can flip, the normal members cannot. They can only exists via recruitment.

Read the setup.

Are you saying that if a person is culted they won't flip as cultist or occultist, cause I thought they did since they get a new role when converted.

Or are you saying there are no starting cultist/occultist roles?

[ThePaladin]

I'm done with these players, you can go fuck yourself. You don't read what I just said and do that. Thank you very much. See you.

Is this saying that you are asking for a replacement or just refuse to answer/counter-point players anymore?

[Iced_Monopoly]

Are you saying that if a person is culted they won't flip as cultist or occultist, cause I thought they did since they get a new role when converted.

Or are you saying there are no starting cultist/occultist roles?

Pretty sure he meant that the any all and sinister roles can only spawn/flip leaders and not followers

[ThePaladin]

Well then I speak for myself, and I'm pretty sure RLVG felt the same way.

How do you know and why are you saying what RLVG felt?

[ThePaladin]

Pretty sure he meant that the any all and sinister roles can only spawn/flip leaders and not followers

So a culted person does still flip as cultist correctly and not for example citizen?

Never seen flip and spawn be used interchangably.

[ThePaladin]

Also to hell with all of you voting me cause I wasn't on for last 24hours of day.

Site was down for about 10hours straight then even when it came back up it got rolledfoward/rolledback at least 5 times.

After about the fifth time, I just decided to do irl stuff since I wasn't dealing with posting and it getting erased and had no way of knowing an eta.

[Iced_Monopoly]

So a culted person does still flip as cultist correctly and not for example citizen?

Never seen flip and spawn be used interchangably.

I would assume so, that was just my interpretation of his comment. Yes rather odd on choice of words If correct.

[Iced_Monopoly]

Also to hell with all of you voting me cause I wasn't on for last 24hours of day.

Site was down for about 10hours straight then even when it came back up it got rolledfoward/rolledback at least 5 times.

After about the fifth time, I just decided to do irl stuff since I wasn't dealing with posting and it getting erased and had no way of knowing an eta.

The site was more than stable for 18+ hours of the extended day

[ThePaladin]

The site was more than stable for 18+ hours of the extended day

How was I supposed to know when it became stable?

[Iced_Monopoly]

How was I supposed to know when it became stable?

you refresh the page? In 18 hours you didnt have a mobile device or computer nearby that had internet access?

[ThePaladin]

you refresh the page? In 18 hours you didnt have a mobile device or computer nearby that had internet access?

Mobile was dead and was out walking about.

[Unknown1234]

How do you know and why are you saying what RLVG felt?

Because RLVG doesn't seem to have a tendency to sheep votes??

Why are you capitalizing on the worst areas?

[ThePaladin]

Because RLVG doesn't seem to have a tendency to sheep votes??

Why are you capitalizing on the worst areas?

Because no one else is pointing it out while people are talking about other stuff.

Spoiler : Capital :

RLVG is fully capitalized look at his name
H is the first letter of the sentence

[Iced_Monopoly]

Mobile was dead and was out walking about.

Seems like a bit of a stretch, but there was no lynch, and you have some minor credibility following RLVGs report from LN. Which reminds me,
If a sheriff leaves 2 targets in his night action, when he recieves feedback, does the feedback default to the name of the first targetted player even if the target was randomed, or does it reflect who he visited of the random players?

ie.
First Target Player A
Second Target Player B
(Randomiser selects actually checking player B)

Scenario 1:
You visited Player A, player A is a scrub
Scenario 2:
You visited Player B, player B is a scrub

[ThePaladin]

Seems like a bit of a stretch, but there was no lynch, and you have some minor credibility following RLVGs report from LN. Which reminds me,

Following numbers, I think I stopped checking at probably an hour b4 site became stable or extension.
Asked host if day was getting extended but roleback happened so it didn't go through and had no way of knowing if day had just ended since there was only a few hours left to EoD when site crashed I believe.

Sleep+irl stuff = ~18hours.


I came back at about an hour past EoD.


I just wanted to state this and call out the people using that as a reason to vote me since it was a terrible reason given events.

[Iced_Monopoly]

Following numbers, I think I stopped checking at probably an hour b4 site became stable or extension.
Asked host if day was getting extended but roleback happened so it didn't go through and had no way of knowing if day had just ended since there was only a few hours left to EoD when site crashed I believe.

Sleep+irl stuff = ~18hours.


I came back at about an hour past EoD.


I just wanted to state this and call out the people using that as a reason to vote me since it was a terrible reason given events.

I dont think I saw this as a reason being used to lynch you, although I came back only 2 mins before day end and ended up skimming those last 2 pages of lynch posts

[ThePaladin]

Too all players

Were you trying to train on me to get a lynch off or because you hard-scum read me?

I find it odd how Yzb trains on takeyon [iirc] decides calling me[ being fine with no lynch and then saying, I could lynch these 2 people who's playstyles are always detrimental or so scummy we can't tell if they are scum ]as scummy, but decided to shift from takeyon to me and then even push a train on me.

[ThePaladin]

To explain why I shifted from no-lynch to lynch position.

Either you guys[yzb and unknown] can't follow chains of replys or were purposely misrepresenting what I said.

I said a no-lynch was beneficial if we were following the plan.

However, since Kovath and other players [kovath was who I was replying to do say who I could lynch after he commented on that we weren't following it ]explicitly denied it and most players hadn't commented nor confirmed liking it. I decided to do what i standardly believe is usually better which is to lynch based on scummy playstyles.

This wasn't even remotely hard to follow.

[TheDarkestLight]

Are you saying that if a person is culted they won't flip as cultist or occultist, cause I thought they did since they get a new role when converted.

Or are you saying there are no starting cultist/occultist roles?

The latter. When I say flip it means their role being revealed. This can either mean to themselves when they receive it at the start, or to the rest of the players when they die.

[secondpassing]

-vote Taekyon

Reasons for Gyrlander train:
WIFOM serial killer ->Kovath
Policy
Pressure start

Why you should be on this train instead:
Original Post
Taekyon has been offset most of this game. Can you see him take a position?

I could be wrong since I haven't gone through a different analysis, but he's been at the wrong places (<- lacks context I'll get to it).


Please vote Taekyon, he is a more worthy pressure target than Gyrlander. If I see that town was unwilling to consider my position that I've had since yesterday, I will move to Gyrlander in order to move things along. I find Gyrlander to be a poor target because:
Doesn't attempt to appear town.
Emotional data mine.
Gut.

[RLVG]

Sorry i can't multiquote here (on phone). But you posted that you had a second target as yzb, and the goat said earlier that of you had two targets, it would be randomized and you wouldn't know which one you targeted. So how does your feedback have paladins name on it?

My feedback specifically mentioned ThePaladin.
Credits to TDL for mentioning this here.

Sheriff recieves feedback that has his targets name in it.

Your raging paranoia (which is completely justified) has led you to the cell of XXX, in his absence, you have discovered that XXX has Sinister Motives.

Your raging paranoia has led you to the cell of XXX, in his absence, you have discovered that XXX has Misguided Motives.

---

Is that such a weird thought then ? this isnt an RLVG host so i don't expect 2 SKs and a mass murderer.

But it's deathworlds lol. "Your average game", I'm your host. :troll:

im a Bus Driver just incase you people are wondering. I was so inactive that I didnt even use my night action...

A BD who didn't act, lolwut?

-vote Eggy

The people voting kovath are you and RLVG, Eggy admitted not knowing what is going on, and hasnt read, and RLVG didnt post a reason. The only reasons given are by you, for pressure and because kovath wanted 'him dead a ton'

True, I parked my vote before going to sleep.

Well then I speak for myself, and I'm pretty sure RLVG felt the same way.

I also don't see any extra motive to kill Kovath (him being suspicious of the killer). It's possible, but the way he was playing makes sense to see him dead today.

He did want to look into Gyrlander, let's start there.

-vote Gyrlander

Nope actually.

Also to hell with all of you voting me cause I wasn't on for last 24hours of day.

Site was down for about 10hours straight then even when it came back up it got rolledfoward/rolledback at least 5 times.

After about the fifth time, I just decided to do irl stuff since I wasn't dealing with posting and it getting erased and had no way of knowing an eta.

This is the part reason why I "lurked" or was not available around as well.

The site was more than stable for 18+ hours of the extended day

At this point I guess it's something to do with server nodes and certain regions, since most of the day wasn't available to me.

Because RLVG doesn't seem to have a tendency to sheep votes??

Why are you capitalizing on the worst areas?

I was going to sleep and I decided to park my vote on Gyrlander since he's scummy in general.
It's nothing to do with another player's decision to vote him lol.

Seems like a bit of a stretch, but there was no lynch, and you have some minor credibility following RLVGs report from LN. Which reminds me,
If a sheriff leaves 2 targets in his night action, when he recieves feedback, does the feedback default to the name of the first targetted player even if the target was randomed, or does it reflect who he visited of the random players?

ie.
First Target Player A
Second Target Player B
(Randomiser selects actually checking player B)

Scenario 1:
You visited Player A, player A is a scrub
Scenario 2:
You visited Player B, player B is a scrub

I think it would be broken as fuck if we're given a "secret setup" in which we don't know if our role is real, giving option to do 2 targets - and we don't even know which of the two targets was picked.

There's a reason I gave a "first" target.

[secondpassing]

A BD who didn't act, lolwut?

-vote Eggy

.

I'm willing to sheep this as well. He said "sorry for being inactive, didn't notice site was down" (paraphrased) yet hasn't offered anything more. Hasn't even asked if he should focus on something or what, just drops a vote on the largest train.

[secondpassing]

Saying the same thing as Spruance?
The coincidence is...suspicious.

I mean... what are the chance that the "counselor" got targeted by the real counselor AND the "escort" got targeted by the real escort...

When does your skepticism end?
Can you tell me which arguments you support?
Can you tell me which arguments are something you made yourself?
Are you scum hunting?

[secondpassing]

Gyrlander (2 [L-5]):
Unknown1234, Eggy
Eggy (2 [L-5]):
RLVG, TheDarkestLight
Taekyon (1 [L-6]):
secondpassing

I would love to consolidate these votes, and there are multiple other targets I would love to pressure. Please discuss with me why you think your suspect is the most worthy of attention.

[Taekyon]

When does your skepticism end?
Can you tell me which arguments you support?
Can you tell me which arguments are something you made yourself?
Are you scum hunting?

~3AM here, can't sleep.
I'm obviously scum hunting as much as I can with the info we got right now.
(Mainly by pointing out things that I find suspicious)
I don't like to write wall of text based on some gut feeling and/or assumption.
I understand my argument can be "lacking" something sometime and that thing is logic.
I'm waiting for a good piece of info before going all out targeting someone with solid info.

I'm still unsure about GameFreak. Unfortunately, I'm lacking info to push further this suspicion of mine.
Only thing I got, like I said earlier, is that weird claim (like Spruance) which was being targeted by the role they though they were.

I though first that the real role (Escort and Asylum Counselor) targeted them to help them confirm their role.
But there's no way both could have done that since they probably don't know their true role either.

If you have any other question, I'll answer them to the best of my ability.

[Taekyon]

Also @RLVG , do you think you are Sherif or Insane Sherif?
If I were you, I would target someone like Spruance to see the result of your Investigation since he claimed Insane.
It's not the best but could help.
Seeing how ThePaladin is still alive, it's obvious that you don't have a killing role.
But we still have no way of confirming if you are truly Insane or Sinister.

[TheDarkestLight]

Also @RLVG , do you think you are Sherif or Insane Sherif?
If I were you, I would target someone like Spruance to see the result of your Investigation since he claimed Insane.
It's not the best but could help.
Seeing how ThePaladin is still alive, it's obvious that you don't have a killing role.
But we still have no way of confirming if you are truly Insane or Sinister.

Not obvious he doesn't have a killing role. He could be a Mass Murderer and Paladin visited someone, or maybe a Ritual Killer.

Certainty isn't possible this game.

[Taekyon]

Not obvious he doesn't have a killing role. He could be a Mass Murderer and Paladin visited someone, or maybe a Ritual Killer.

Certainty isn't possible this game.

Forgot about these roles. Thanks for that info.

[RLVG]

Also @RLVG , do you think you are Sherif or Insane Sherif?
If I were you, I would target someone like Spruance to see the result of your Investigation since he claimed Insane.
It's not the best but could help.
Seeing how ThePaladin is still alive, it's obvious that you don't have a killing role.
But we still have no way of confirming if you are truly Insane or Sinister.

I need to target someone that's going to die in the night to be 100% certain of Sheriff vs Insane Sheriff, unless we decide to pursue for a lynch based on the feedback that Paladin is Town which is just a logical fallacy on its own.

Don't forget to take in account that I may be a Lunatic. I may also be a Doctor who stopped a kill, who knows.

[Taekyon]

I need to target someone that's going to die in the night to be 100% certain of Sheriff vs Insane Sheriff, unless we decide to pursue for a lynch based on the feedback that Paladin is Town which is just a logical fallacy on its own.

Don't forget to take in account that I may be a Lunatic. I may also be a Doctor who stopped a kill, who knows.

ThePaladin would've got a feedback saying he got saved in case you're a Doctor.
Yet he never told about his feedback (Or I missed it)
The other possibility is that he's keeping his feedback secret to keep you safe.

[Taekyon]

My night feedback was kinda... scary.

Same.

Wouldn't it be a great idea to start here to find our next pressure target?

Who targeted these two?
What are the feedback they received?

[Iced_Monopoly]

I am not comfortable with a taekyon lynch today.
Nor am I overly comfortable with a lynch on eggy

I got a mention notification but I cant find it 😂😂 does anyone know what it was about? Also im very sorry for lurking so hard I totally forgot about this game.. im a Bus Driver just incase you people are wondering. I was so inactive that I didnt even use my night action... so im really sorry about that. Im going to spend some time reading throught the thread to catch myself up. Ill push this train because im sure you people have your reasons.

-vote Gyrlander

if I disagree once reading through ill change my vote.

This post is almost textbook jester(king) play, more than enough points to bring attention to himself, and then a lack of replies seals the deal.

Instead id prefer to focus on spruance, after going through his posts, almost all of D1 was shitposting, followed by discrediting scum reading or anyone having any thoughts on other players, then fake voting, and I think at one point jokingly claiming ML before changing to AC. Today he claimed that he himself was checked by AC, and was revealed to be cit. Given that the AC doesnt get to see what the role is, it would be easy for Spruance to fake claim cit, a role that wouldnt require him having to construe a night action that may require confirmation. So thats where my vote is going.

-vote Spruance

Lets not forget that from this point forward, days are only 24 hours in length.

[Gyrlander]

[b]Hey guys! Looks like the train is preparing to set off![color=#D80738]

-vote Taekyon

[Gyrlander]

[b]Hey guys! Looks like the train is preparing to set off![color=#D80738]

-vote Taekyon

Correct one without fail:

Hey guys! Looks like the train is preparing to set off!

[Iced_Monopoly]

Correct one without fail:

Hey guys! Looks like the train is preparing to set off!

Beautiful colours. I assume you've put just as much effort into your reasoning for voting taekyon. Care to share with us?

[Gyrlander]

Beautiful colours. I assume you've put just as much effort into your reasoning for voting taekyon. Care to share with us?

I used a page that I got thank to some sex favors. As I said yesterday, this vote is purely gut. And now that another player voted him too WOWOWOWO GET ON THE TRAIN MY LITTLE FRIENDS WE'RE GOING TO WONDERLAND

[Iced_Monopoly]

I used a page that I got thank to some sex favors. As I said yesterday, this vote is purely gut. And now that another player voted him too WOWOWOWO GET ON THE TRAIN MY LITTLE FRIENDS WE'RE GOING TO WONDERLAND

Quality reasoning, absolutely infallible. Can you contribute to the discussion other two claims of the day? GF claiming BD and spruance claiming lunatic AC who's actually cit

[yzb25]

To explain why I shifted from no-lynch to lynch position.

Either you guys[yzb and unknown] can't follow chains of replys or were purposely misrepresenting what I said.

I said a no-lynch was beneficial if we were following the plan.

However, since Kovath and other players [kovath was who I was replying to do say who I could lynch after he commented on that we weren't following it ]explicitly denied it and most players hadn't commented nor confirmed liking it. I decided to do what i standardly believe is usually better which is to lynch based on scummy playstyles.

This wasn't even remotely hard to follow.

Firstly, I'd like to say that democracy has made a decision, and it would be arrogant and divisive of me to go "you fucks don't know what you're talking about!" and keep pushing a lynch on Paladin. Besides, if RLVG can get counselled and visit a few more people to be sure he isn't an insane sheriff, Paladin may end up being proven town, regardless of my reads of his rolecard. So, I do not intend to pursue a lynch train on Paladin for at least a few days (assuming I still scumread Paladin in a few days).

At this point, I'm responding purely to clarify history and defend myself, as a lynch train on me can still be considered valid and non-divisive.

Even outside of the plan, you seemed to gravitate towards the views TDL expressed in post #605, rather than the views I expressed in #609. In other words, you were anti-d1-lynch regardless of your plan's success, apart from perhaps for a PL. This meant even if your plan went balls-to-the-wall, you should have still taken a more TDL-esqued stance (except also supporting PL).

This is how I got that impression from you:

Though in #244 you imply you respect the reasoning behind an every-day lynch, in #233 you seem to express that d1 lynches are generally not beneficial for town.

Later, in #375 you imply all lynches in this setup are PLs. While you were probably being a little hyperbolic, I think it's fair to say you at least meant this as a serious comment for d1.

I remember during the interview in which I tried to ascertain your philosophy to trying to catch scum, any techniques you used outside of elimination and scumslips were difficult for you to express. I suspected you took a more reactionary approach to reading people - rather than going in with a set strategy to try and derive set results, you are flexible and non-committal. Even plans you build are "in the moment". This also implied you weren't pro-read-based-d1-lynches, because flexible players can easily see that nearly all d1 scumreads have an alternate explanation and are generally uncertain - flexible players don't really tunnel-vision.

This all implies you don't really like a d1 lynch made on the basis of reads unless it's a really severe scumslip (and even then you'd be a little hesitant due to rolecard shenanigans), and could only really support a d1 PL.

Add to that the fact that you already thought the scumreads on GF had more to do with meta than scummyness, and the fact that there was a good chance GF would end up being 90% confirmed escort by d2, your advocacy for a vote of GF didn't even make sense to me as a PL, let alone a scumread lynch.

Even though I myself disagree with the philosophy you advocate for in regards to lynching, the fact you voted GF looked like a clear contradiction to your established philosophy. I could kinda see the Gyrlander as a PL, but the advocacy of a GF vote made no sense on any level, and, in the context of the moment, looked like a desperation move to avoid being lynched.

Hopefully, even if you still disagree with my stance, you can at least see the validity of my perspective.

[yzb25]

^wall of text mainly meant for Paladin. Sorry the rest of you had to see its uglyness.

Anyway, a lot of people find it implausible that escort rbed the escort claim and a counsellor rbed the counsellor claim. I think we should use some more empathy:

-If I was counsellor, I would conclude that it's unlikely there's two counsellors, and anyone else who honestly has another counseller rolecard is a lunatic. So I'd obviously counsel them in the name of counselling a lunatic.

-If I was escort, I would conclusde that it's unlikely there's two escorts, and anyone else who claims to be escort is likely lying or has a fake rolecard. Either way, it'd be productive to roleblock them until the truth is revealed.

This is not anywhere near as implausible as people seem to imply.

[yzb25]

Lastly, people should try and get into the habit of stating whether they will be on for EOD. We only have 24 hours and most lynches will likely be swing lynches with a few hours to go.

[Taekyon]

Anyway, a lot of people find it implausible that escort rbed the escort claim and a counsellor rbed the counsellor claim. I think we should use some more empathy:

-If I was counsellor, I would conclude that it's unlikely there's two counsellors, and anyone else who honestly has another counseller rolecard is a lunatic. So I'd obviously counsel them in the name of counselling a lunatic.

-If I was escort, I would conclusde that it's unlikely there's two escorts, and anyone else who claims to be escort is likely lying or has a fake rolecard. Either way, it'd be productive to roleblock them until the truth is revealed.

This is not anywhere near as implausible as people seem to imply.

That would imply that they know for sure their role.
In this setup, there's no way you can be sure of your role on night 1.

You got to agree that the chances of both happening at the same time is unlikely although not impossible.

[yzb25]

That would imply that they know for sure their role.
In this setup, there's no way you can be sure of your role on night 1.

You got to agree that the chances of both happening at the same time is unlikely although not impossible.

Yes, though they still could have gotten that rolecard. And I'm guessing most people would just play to their rolecard.

I don't really agree that the chances are low. I've avoided talking about it because I thought it would mainly be an unproductive conversation, but some roles are definitely more likely to be lunatic than others.

There's little point in making a role like escort or councillor lunified, because it's quite easy to confirm whether or not you're actually a lunatic. It's simply a waste. On the other hand, making a role like sheriff or doctor lunatic can result in some devilishly hilarious stuff.

Again, I didn't want to say my speculation out loud because it might make towns act less towny, but I personally thought there was a good chance a neutral killing had been lunified to be a doctor, because that would be banter as f***.