M-FM Overwatch

[M-FM Roadhog]

As far as i'm concerned, i'm the only BP to have claimed, and i claim it in two Game Modes.

Where does the 50% come from?

50% meaning that if there are an equal number of town-BPs as there are scum, 50% of sheriff guilty results will be true positives.

Having a sheriff guilty and then claiming miller is a pretty hard scumtell. Scum pretty much have to claim it. Of course it's possible to have millers, but unless this is miller city most sheriff guilties are going to be scum.

[M-FM Hanzo]

50% meaning that if there are an equal number of town-BPs as there are scum, 50% of sheriff guilty results will be true positives.

Having a sheriff guilty and then claiming miller is a pretty hard scumtell. Scum pretty much have to claim it. Of course it's possible to have millers, but unless this is miller city most sheriff guilties are going to be scum.

Okay, so you are one of those people saying my claim is "convenient" then. Why would me claiming BP before the check make me scummy?

Yes, if you are suggesting that i'm a scum BP then that is a possibility, but you would have to use your own reads to figure that out. (I'm really not though)

[M-FM Bastion]

Opposed to you who posts 10/15 times a day?

Posting little can be a good thing. There is something to be said about brevity.

[M-FM Roadhog]

Okay, so you are one of those people saying my claim is "convenient" then. Why would me claiming BP before the check make me scummy?

Yes, if you are suggesting that i'm a scum BP then that is a possibility, but you would have to use your own reads to figure that out. (I'm really not though)

I'm not saying claiming BP before a check makes you scummy. (if you actually did this; link me or at least say so.) I'm saying claiming BP after being invested is scummy.

Your claim is, barring some weird BD claim, the only thing a scum who got checked by a sheriff could make. Please tell me you realize this.

[M-FM Roadhog]

Posting little can be a good thing. There is something to be said about brevity.

I don't disagree, but brevity at the expense of substance isn't a virtue.

[M-FM Hanzo]

Posting little can be a good thing. There is something to be said about brevity.

I didn't say that though. When you are comparing Tracer and saying "she talks too much" it's fair enough to say that Junkrat hasn't spoken enough. As is the same with you, we hardly hear any of your arguments which doesn't give us an impression or anything to base off of. Tracer on the other hand says so much, and considering they are almost confirmed town I think it's a dumb idea to PL Tracer.

Thoughts?

[M-FM Hanzo]

I'm not saying claiming BP before a check makes you scummy. (if you actually did this; link me or at least say so.) I'm saying claiming BP after being invested is scummy.

Your claim is, barring some weird BD claim, the only thing a scum who got checked by a sheriff could make. Please tell me you realize this.

I did not claim BP before the check, but why would you? I don't seem to understand what you are thinking. Bulletproof is a role where you are supposed to take night kills by using your immunity. If i was revealing myself as BP, I am essentially making myself a citizen who shows up as Mafia. I understand what you are saying, but you don't seem to actually look into it as a BP POV

[M-FM Junkrat]

LOL YOU'LL EXPLAIN THE GREAT IDEA WHEN GAME IS DONE?

Getting rid of an absolute shit player in a game is never a bad idea.

When half of every page contains wallposts with no real content players get bored and discouraged from joining in.

This thread is 250 pages long. If Calix were better, the game would be less than half that long. It's a pain in the ass wading through 125 pages of tard trying to find actual content. It's almost impossible to work out interactions when every fucking one of the interacting posts are separated by a wallpost of batspam deluxe.

I hated playing with Batspam, too.

[M-FM Junkrat]

Opposed to you who posts 10/15 times a day?

If I were able to get into the game my play would be better. I'm not enjoying this at all, it's a real drag.

Not Firebringer's fault.

[M-FM Roadhog]

I did not claim BP before the check, but why would you? I don't seem to understand what you are thinking. Bulletproof is a role where you are supposed to take night kills by using your immunity. If i was revealing myself as BP, I am essentially making myself a citizen who shows up as Mafia. I understand what you are saying, but you don't seem to actually look into it as a BP POV

FACT: In most mafia games, a sheriff guilty is probably scum.

^This CANNOT be disputed.

YOU CAN'T WIFOM AN INVESTIGATIVE CHECK. There are a lot of things in this game you can a person as scum for, but if you can find a reasonable excuse, it's weak evidence and a null read is more justified. This is now how checks work. If someone feels just as good about you before a sheriff guilty as they do after, they are doing something incredibly wrong.

[M-FM Roadhog]

This is now how checks work.

*not

[M-FM Hanzo]

If I were able to get into the game my play would be better. I'm not enjoying this at all, it's a real drag.

Not Firebringer's fault.

Okay, i can't blame you for this.

[M-FM Bastion]

I didn't say that though. When you are comparing Tracer and saying "she talks too much" it's fair enough to say that Junkrat hasn't spoken enough. As is the same with you, we hardly hear any of your arguments which doesn't give us an impression or anything to base off of. Tracer on the other hand says so much, and considering they are almost confirmed town I think it's a dumb idea to PL Tracer.

Thoughts?

I have no need to make any arguments in this game, as I am a Town Investigative Role on Offense Mode, and will let my results do the talking. I've also already claimed this role yesterday.

I did offer my opinions on who should be swinging from a rope based on reads, and that hasn't changed much either.

[M-FM Bastion]

I have no need to make any arguments in this game, as I am a Town Investigative Role on Offense Mode, and will let my results do the talking. I've also already claimed this role yesterday.

I did offer my opinions on who should be swinging from a rope based on reads, and that hasn't changed much either.

Basically, scum has to choose between shooting me, a Town Investigative who posts almost minimum, or someone who posts more than me (the entire game). If I posted more, it would incentivize my death. No thanks.

[M-FM Hanzo]

FACT: In most mafia games, a sheriff guilty is probably scum.

^This CANNOT be disputed.

YOU CAN'T WIFOM AN INVESTIGATIVE CHECK. There are a lot of things in this game you can a person as scum for, but if you can find a reasonable excuse, it's weak evidence and a null read is more justified. This is now how checks work. If someone feels just as good about you before a sheriff guilty as they do after, they are doing something incredibly wrong.

But see, in a game where you have three different role cards and three different game modes, I don't know why you're surprised to see a BP claim pop up.

I've never played/seen a BP before, if you knew who i was it'd be easier for you to believe this, so i don't understand why claiming in advance would be better. Isn't this EXACTLY what scum would do? Claim before a check so if they look scummy, then they have something to fall back on.

With my role, I look scum. Whether you believe my role claim or not is besides the point. I am a Town Bulletproof. So answer me this, if you're certain that Sheriff checks are almost right, why haven't you voted me? The only thing I would say is lynching me get's you another miss lynch and ends up wasting a day. I can't control my role card, i obviously didn't give myself it. Why people are reading me town isn't up to me to decide either, but i guess that isn't really useful here.

[M-FM Hanzo]

I have no need to make any arguments in this game, as I am a Town Investigative Role on Offense Mode, and will let my results do the talking. I've also already claimed this role yesterday.

I did offer my opinions on who should be swinging from a rope based on reads, and that hasn't changed much either.

I'm not trying to argue, sorry if this came across like that. I'm trying to talk to you because if i'm not mistaken, we are on different time zones (I assume this because i hardly talk to you people) So hearing input is nice to here.

[M-FM Hanzo]

Basically, scum has to choose between shooting me, a Town Investigative who posts almost minimum, or someone who posts more than me (the entire game). If I posted more, it would incentivize my death. No thanks.

You refuse to post to not get night killed? What is shit LMAO.

Something is clearly wrong when this is a problem.

[M-FM Roadhog]

Yeah, a Hanzo train needs to happen. A dead sheriff with a guilty needs a better trial than you've had.

-vote M-FM Hanzo

@Firebringer , is a bulletproof guilty to sheriffs in all modes, or just the ones they're a bulletproof in?

[M-FM Hanzo]

I have no need to make any arguments in this game, as I am a Town Investigative Role on Offense Mode, and will let my results do the talking. I've also already claimed this role yesterday.

I did offer my opinions on who should be swinging from a rope based on reads, and that hasn't changed much either.

Any chance I can see a list? If not I can search for it but if you have a lynch list i would appreciate it. No long explanations needed.

[M-FM Hanzo]

Yeah, a Hanzo train needs to happen. A dead sheriff with a guilty needs a better trial than you've had.

-vote M-FM Hanzo

@Firebringer , is a bulletproof guilty to sheriffs in all modes, or just the ones they're a bulletproof in?

I can answer this question for you, it's only in the modes I'm a bullet proof.

[M-FM Symmetra]

You refuse to post to not get night killed? What is shit LMAO.

Something is clearly wrong when this is a problem.

That's the exact excuse Reinhart used.

[M-FM Symmetra]

-vote m-FM Zarya

Probably a mistake but I want to see where these wierd vote chains link to.

[M-FM Soldier 76]

Which part, what sentence?

If that was the case that Mei knew, she's in desperate need of towncred, arguing not to shoot is the better play.

Second part, second sentence

>assuming Mei is scum along with the blacksmith : Arguing not to shoot requires the town to recognize some WiFOM for Mei to gain towncred

[M-FM Soldier 76]

@M-FM Zarya You town read Zenyatta yesterday, how about today?

[M-FM Symmetra]

Second part, second sentence

>assuming Mei is scum along with the blacksmith : Arguing not to shoot requires the town to recognize some WiFOM for Mei to gain towncred

Not really. No one plead for Winston to do something Day 2 or NOT to do something. It's a pretty big indicator the gun was fake.

Anyway, I still don't get how Zarya is defending Reinhardt so hard? Do you see anything townie?

[M-FM Soldier 76]

Not really. No one plead for Winston to do something Day 2 or NOT to do something. It's a pretty big indicator the gun was fake.

Anyway, I still don't get how Zarya is defending Reinhardt so hard? Do you see anything townie?

'At this moment I do not want to say who I would like to see lynched as I know there is no chance in hell this person is going to be lynched today.' IMO this part is the highlight of Zarya's defense of Reinhardt. And it is something I can agree on after some thinking. Because I don't think a scum will ever say something like that. You could interpret it as a stall tactic, but my feeling says otherwise.

But that's literally the only town tell I can see from Reinhardt.

[M-FM Symmetra]

Is it worth a hard town read? Like to the ends of the earth?

[M-FM Symmetra]

I'm tempted to say fuck it, mass claim setup 1 and never go back to it.

[M-FM Soldier 76]

Is it worth a hard town read? Like to the ends of the earth?

No, but reading Zarya's posts it doesn't actually feel like a hard town read. He's more like defending what he previously stated against your posts. I also have a hunch that its associated with his PoE style of scumhunting.

Another thing that pings me is the town read on Zenyatta though

[M-FM Symmetra]

No, but reading Zarya's posts it doesn't actually feel like a hard town read. He's more like defending what he previously stated against your posts. I also have a hunch that its associated with his PoE style of scumhunting.

Another thing that pings me is the town read on Zenyatta though

This whole vote suspicion feels really weird.

I suspect Zarya who suspects Road who suspects Hanzo who suspects the other Z.

It's a chain no one is touching and I want to know why.

[M-FM Symmetra]

Roadhouse v Hanzo is also something I hope people chime in on.

[M-FM Soldier 76]

This whole vote suspicion feels really weird.

I suspect Zarya who suspects Road who suspects Hanzo who suspects the other Z.

It's a chain no one is touching and I want to know why.

I don't see much to go about the chain, and there's probably not much about it actually either

Also currently the first 3 are town reads, hanzo null and zenyatta scum reads. So...

[M-FM Soldier 76]

Roadhouse v Hanzo is also something I hope people chime in on.

Roadhouse is pursuing the bulletproof/sheriff thing and Hanzo is defending with the same stuffs as day 2, which isn't enough for me to scum read Hanzo.
@M-FM Roadhog maybe I missed it but who are your other scum reads? Will need to know that to see where the Hanzo FoS all correlate into

[Firebringer]

Yeah, a Hanzo train needs to happen. A dead sheriff with a guilty needs a better trial than you've had.

-vote M-FM Hanzo

@Firebringer , is a bulletproof guilty to sheriffs in all modes, or just the ones they're a bulletproof in?

Just the ones they are in.

[M-FM Roadhog]

Gonna post a readlist soon. @M-FM Tracer , if this is what you've been waiting for, hold onto your seat.

[M-FM Tracer]

Tracer's a fuckwit that needs a PL.

Here's another example of scum trying to push the "Tracer should die" narrative. Please note how Mei said earlier that I was "destructive" and "should die before I mislynch more town members"

Neither of them have explained WHY any of my scum reads are town. And in Mei's case, HE CANNOT.

Mei is 100% scum and there is no way that he can get out of that. There will NEVER be town motivation in his posts because HE IS NOT TOWN.

Please never do vote analyses again, you suck at them.

Strong arguments. Note that he doesn't actually refute any of the points made in my VA. He just dismisses it as being shit but cannot actually defend himself...because he knows I am right. Scum will always be more sensitive to points made against them because they know they are accurate and thus have a difficult time refuting them.

Wasn't Mei the one that warned Banana that the Sword could be a fake?

Another example of Junkrat signal-boosting Mei's idea. BOTH of them are pushing the "Mei said the sword was fake so Mei must be town" idea even though Mei's ONLY argument for the sword being faked was "nobody would give YOU a real sword"

Remember when I called this player OMG Scum?

I remember.

Pathetic attempt at reminding players that he distanced himself from the useless scum Zenyatta.

Bastion, Hanzo, McCree, Zarya, Zenyatta are my Scumpool today.

>makes no attempts to push on any of his "scum pool"

Not to mention those are AWFUL scum reads

FACT: In most mafia games, a sheriff guilty is probably scum.

^This CANNOT be disputed.

YOU CAN'T WIFOM AN INVESTIGATIVE CHECK. There are a lot of things in this game you can a person as scum for, but if you can find a reasonable excuse, it's weak evidence and a null read is more justified. This is now how checks work. If someone feels just as good about you before a sheriff guilty as they do after, they are doing something incredibly wrong.

Shitty doubt-casting on Hanzo even though we already went through this on Day 2. Also doesn't USE HANZO'S POSTS TO BACK THIS UP.

I called the scum team trying to mislynch Hanzo and I was correct. Mei, Junkrat, Roadhog are ALL trying to throw shade on Hanzo because he cannot be night-killed.

The fact that Roadhog feigns ignorance of the Lucio/ Hanzo drama is extremely difficult to believe and looks like he is faking it as a reason to stir up old drama.

Next.

[M-FM Reinhardt]

-vote M-FM Hanzo

Lucio said Hanzo came up scum, I think the train should be on a confirmed scum.


Town is probably everyone but Hanzo, Trobjorn and Zarya/Zenyetta.

Hanzo is confirmed scum by sheriff
Trobjorn and his fluffy content and lack of detail show he's trying to keep an open mind to be able to keep flow of the game
Hanzo won't vote Zenyetta or Zarya, which ever one he's giving excuses for is his partner...

[M-FM Tracer]

-vote M-FM Hanzo

Lucio said Hanzo came up scum, I think the train should be on a confirmed scum.


Town is probably everyone but Hanzo, Trobjorn and Zarya/Zenyetta.

Hanzo is confirmed scum by sheriff
Trobjorn and his fluffy content and lack of detail show he's trying to keep an open mind to be able to keep flow of the game
Hanzo won't vote Zenyetta or Zarya, which ever one he's giving excuses for is his partner...

Mei is also confirmed scum who has a far more damning case than Hanzo.

[M-FM Tracer]

I do not like how Reinhardt's reads conveniently matches up with Symmetra's (someone who was scum-reading her)

[M-FM Roadhog]

Players I townread:
Tracer - This is a mechanical read following the WM lynch; deep wolf play is possible, but I simply haven't seen it in the interactions. I really, really, don't like her overconfidence at this point, however.

Soldier 76 - This partially a gutread, but he seems to be able to function independently of the prevailing/spammed opinion and uses consistent reasoning and was on the WM train rather early if I'm not mistaken.

Winston - This is a mechanical read in that I don't think that if town gave scum a suicide blade, the town would have stayed quiet now. Not that relevant of a read, but I expect a townflip. Also the WM lynch.

Players I townlean:
Mei - Has independently arrived at conclusions I myself favor, and if I'm not mistaken rightfully stood up for Pharah and Reaper.

Players I am suspicious of, but want to look closer at to form a deeper read:
Zarya - I've explained this before that I don't like how she doesn't bother to find reason to scumread her PoE scum in their own right. Sure, PoE can be useful, but why is there not a sanity check at the end to ask "is this person actually scum?" Also has tendency to clear people for some pretty light "this feels genuine," without indicating what exactly makes it genuine. Gives a lot of room to form "convenient" reads, and I don't have a way to see if they aren't just that. However, with the WM flip, this slot needs to be re-evaluated, and I am no longer content with a scumread.

Bastion - far too lurky and never seemed to contribute much of an opinion. Claims an offensive investigative role, but I haven't seen any leads yet. With how few posts he's made, warrants a quick ISO

Junkrat - I like his repeating my point about Calix being overconfident in her reads, but being on the Tracer train and discrediting a fairly-confirmed town doesn't sit right with me. Would want to look at this slot later to see if I'm in sincere agreement with them or if my thoughts are being picked up to cause chaos.

Players I scumread:
Hanzo - A guilty sheriff result is a strong scumtell. I haven't paid too much attention to his posts, but the sheriff result is enough to warrant a scumtell, and I intend to make him the next person I ISO to deepread.

Zenyatta - Mostly a gutread. Was on the Tracer train and gives a shockingly poor defense now. Second on my list of people to inspect. Only reason I would spare this slot is if a closer inspection makes them look misrepped, but I really doubt I'd see that at this point.

Torbjorn - This mostly boils down to how I don't like that time he cooked up some team-finding method that assumed no bussing, and then voted Bastion for it... and then he votes Tracer because Bastion went Widowmaker, so he's totally okay with an associated read on Tracer. Seems like a forced conclusion his scum partners made him come to try to save WM. I recall an instance where he backed off Tracer after being suggested as vigbait. A target to look at later.

Players I don't have many thoughts on:
Symmetra - I really haven't bothered to read this player's posts more than a skim. Seems like they're posting coherent stuff, but it hasn't been my focus at all

Reinhardt - I honestly cannot even tell you what this player's avatar looks like without checking.

McCree - his manner of approaching things D2 struck me as odd, but hasn't pinged my radar since. Kinda low priority atm given Hanzo and Zenyatta, and how he was on the WM train.

[M-FM Reinhardt]

i think it's very obvious due to my participation that I'm not all that into this game, really my reads are based off previous things that have been said earlier in this game and not now, I'm not reading what symetra or whatever the fuck her name name is says about me. Lucio visit Hanzo Night 1, I confirmed that a long time ago, Lucio said Hanzo came up scum... use your fucking head why would i push a scum if I'm scum

I have nothing to defend nor hide

[M-FM Tracer]

[QUOTE=M-FM Roadhog;620168]Players I townlean:
Mei - Has independently arrived at conclusions I myself favor, and if I'm not mistaken rightfully stood up for Pharah and Reaper.

Really now? Only THREE town-reads and ONE town-lean? In a game that currently has 13 players?

Mei was the player who first MADE a case against Pharah. Not once did he defend her. You need to show where you got that conclusion from because that's a falsehood.

Zarya - I've explained this before that I don't like how she doesn't bother to find reason to scumread her PoE scum in their own right. Sure, PoE can be useful, but why is there not a sanity check at the end to ask "is this person actually scum?" Also has tendency to clear people for some pretty light "this feels genuine," without indicating what exactly makes it genuine. Gives a lot of room to form "convenient" reads, and I don't have a way to see if they aren't just that. However, with the WM flip, this slot needs to be re-evaluated, and I am no longer content with a scumread.

This is still a criticism of her play-style and scum-reading players because you don't like how they play the game = bad move. You pulled this shit with me and look how THAT turned out.

Bastion - far too lurky and never seemed to contribute much of an opinion. Claims an offensive investigative role, but I haven't seen any leads yet. With how few posts he's made, warrants a quick ISO

Follow up on this please.

Junkrat - I like his repeating my point about Calix being overconfident in her reads, but being on the Tracer train and discrediting a fairly-confirmed town doesn't sit right with me. Would want to look at this slot later to see if I'm in sincere agreement with them or if my thoughts are being picked up to cause chaos.

Repeating points and not adding anything else =/= town.

Follow up here as well.

Hanzo - A guilty sheriff result is a strong scumtell. I haven't paid too much attention to his posts, but the sheriff result is enough to warrant a scumtell, and I intend to make him the next person I ISO to deepread.

Yeah I'd really like to see this, lol.

Zenyatta - Mostly a gutread. Was on the Tracer train and gives a shockingly poor defense now. Second on my list of people to inspect. Only reason I would spare this slot is if a closer inspection makes them look misrepped, but I really doubt I'd see that at this point.

Oh right, outright claiming to have given Winston a fake sword, giving troll reads after Mei was on the line, etc, can somehow be misrepresented.

We know Zenyatta is scum so don't bother.

Torbjorn - This mostly boils down to how I don't like that time he cooked up some team-finding method that assumed no bussing, and then voted Bastion for it... and then he votes Tracer because Bastion went Widowmaker, so he's totally okay with an associated read on Tracer. Seems like a forced conclusion his scum partners made him come to try to save WM. I recall an instance where he backed off Tracer after being suggested as vigbait. A target to look at later.

Pre-flip associations are dumb, not scummy. Again, another read based on PLAY STYLE.

Can't help but notice that all of your scum reads are terrible. Hanzo's is based off the Sheriff, Zenyatta is because of a "shockingly poor defense" (so nothing that hasn't been said already); Torbjorn's is based on his focus on mechanics and a pre-flip vote.

No scum would make up that idea to try and save Widowmaker when they could have just dug through my posts and used that as an excuse.

[M-FM Tracer]

i think it's very obvious due to my participation that I'm not all that into this game, really my reads are based off previous things that have been said earlier in this game and not now, I'm not reading what symetra or whatever the fuck her name name is says about me. Lucio visit Hanzo Night 1, I confirmed that a long time ago, Lucio said Hanzo came up scum... use your fucking head why would i push a scum if I'm scum

I have nothing to defend nor hide

Hanzo ISN'T scum though and nobody has been able to use his posts to show it.

I remain unimpressed that the scum cannot be arsed to case UNKNOWN1234 OF ALL PLAYERS.

Kindly move your vote onto actual scum Mei.

[M-FM Tracer]

Getting rid of an absolute shit player in a game is never a bad idea.

When half of every page contains wallposts with no real content players get bored and discouraged from joining in.

This thread is 250 pages long. If Calix were better, the game would be less than half that long. It's a pain in the ass wading through 125 pages of tard trying to find actual content. It's almost impossible to work out interactions when every fucking one of the interacting posts are separated by a wallpost of batspam deluxe.

I hated playing with Batspam, too.

If I were able to get into the game my play would be better. I'm not enjoying this at all, it's a real drag.

Not Firebringer's fault.

Just want to bring up these gems.

This is coming from the player who ONLY comments on useless/ off-topic posts.

Yet he complains that he's struggling to find "actual" content.

[M-FM Roadhog]

Calix, if you're not going to show me the basic respect of not strawing everything I say from your assumption that I'm scum, I'm not going to keep responding to you.

[M-FM Tracer]

Calix, if you're not going to show me the basic respect of not strawing everything I say from your assumption that I'm scum, I'm not going to keep responding to you.

My post was not "strawing" you and I want an answer to the queries raised.

Your read on Mei is factually incorrect so needs be explained.

Pointing out that your scum-reads are weak =/= straw man.

[M-FM Roadhog]

My post was not "strawing" you and I want an answer to the queries raised.

Your read on Mei is factually incorrect so needs be explained.

Pointing out that your scum-reads are weak =/= straw man.

What's there to explain? There's a factual inaccuracy because this is a spammy game with a shitton of details to follow.

[M-FM Tracer]

What's there to explain? There's a factual inaccuracy because this is a spammy game with a shitton of details to follow.

You said that Mei (the player who first scum-read Pharah and never relented on that read) DEFENDED her. You 100% need to explain where you got that impression from.

[M-FM Roadhog]

You said that Mei (the player who first scum-read Pharah and never relented on that read) DEFENDED her. You 100% need to explain where you got that impression from.

Because that was three THOUSAND posts ago and you're asking me to remember why memory missed a detail after frantically replacing in.

Knocks Mei down to yellow in my book, though.

[M-FM Tracer]

Because that was three THOUSAND posts ago and you're asking me to remember why memory missed a detail after frantically replacing in.

Knocks Mei down to yellow in my book, though.

You keep trying to explain it away as "missing a detail"

But you didn't "miss a detail" - you got the complete opposite impression of what actually happened.

That doesn't come out of nowhere. Which posts gave you that impression?