Dead Chat

[Forum Mafia GM]

Was I really Modkilled? When I was using my charge to go after Pro who I thought was Firenation and Yayayp who I thought was faking BMed?

Tell me that didn't just happen as if it did I quit this site.

At best, your action was attempted suicide. At worst, a triple kill on members of your own faction. It's textbook gamethrowing. You throw the game, you get modkilled. It's in the rules.

[FM TheJackofSpades]

At best, your action was attempted suicide. At worst, a triple kill on members of your own faction. It's textbook gamethrowing. You throw the game, you get modkilled. It's in the rules.

And I clearly explained why this was not game throwing. I even whispered you why, which you could have replied too or explained what would happen if I went through with it.

You failed to listen to my reasoning and you did not reply to a single message I sent you over the past two days. That is textbook bad hosting.

At best, my actions killed two scum members, or one out of two. My action was not to take down two probably scum members and myself with it. 2 scum for 1 town is a good trade.
At worst yes, it could have been a triple kill of my own members. But that is not my fault that you, the creators of the game, put that as a in game mechanic that the bus driver can be charged. I even questioned this before hand and announced my intent with facts behind it to show that this was not game throwing but a legit strategy.

First message

"Hello Avatar!

"Bus Driver
Swap 2 players at night.
Players that visit a swapped target will instead affect the other.
Should your swapping cause a killing role to attempt to kill itself the attack will pierce invulnerability.
You may swap yourself."

My night action is to swap FM Procyon and FM Yayap.

(was this submitted correctly?)"

Second sent on Jan 9th

"I think it was! Well I tried to be entertaining in the end at least.

This group of players were far more aggressive and just assholes compared to the last FM. It's probably the game people on both FMs I realize that but they just played different. Maybe Star Trek is happier then Avatar.... AVATAR YOU BRING OUT THE BULLY IN PEOPLE! DAMN YOU NICKELODEON!

I honestly don't believe this should be considered Game Throwing as really do believe that Pro is Scum. Just the read I have gotten off of him.

Yayap could be pretending to be BMed. I have seen that happen in Mafia and at least this way they will know if he is lying or not.

Both of these are decent targets and make sense to try and see if they have lied about A) whom they are aligned with and B) if they were charged or not.

This is playing to my win condition. Eliminate all scum and Fire Nation."

When those were not replied too I sent a few more to check to see if the Avatar was there and if he was ok with my choice. No reply.

Grade A not great hosting.

1) Don't put the mechanic in the game if you will modkill someone for using it to attempt to remove scum members.
2) Announce perhaps in a whisper to one of the 4/5 messages I sent you this weekend what would happen if I followed through.

It's that simple.

[Forum Mafia GM]

And I clearly explained why this was not game throwing. I even whispered you why, which you could have replied too or explained what would happen if I went through with it.

You failed to listen to my reasoning and you did not reply to a single message I sent you over the past two days. That is textbook bad hosting.

At best, my actions killed two scum members, or one out of two. My action was not to take down two probably scum members and myself with it. 2 scum for 1 town is a good trade.
At worst yes, it could have been a triple kill of my own members. But that is not my fault that you, the creators of the game, put that as a in game mechanic that the bus driver can be charged. I even questioned this before hand and announced my intent with facts behind it to show that this was not game throwing but a legit strategy.

Don't put the mechanic in the game if you will modkill someone for using it to attempt to remove scum members.

You planned to do that action before providing any kind of reasoning other than "I'm mad at everyone". I don't believe the reasoning you provided was anything more than an attempt to justify your actions so that I would let you ruin the game.

[FM TheJackofSpades]

You planned to do that action before providing any kind of reasoning other than "I'm mad at everyone". I don't believe the reasoning you provided was anything more than an attempt to justify your actions so that I would let you ruin the game.

Key words being "I don't believe." Unless we are suppose to be mailing you our scum lists every night.
*When I was charged I did not visit anyone as I didn't want to switch people possibly being investigated or set off an innocent person.
*At this point both Yayap and Procyon were already on my scum list. I stated early in the day before "I'm mad at everyone" that I thought Yayap was lying about being BMed.
*I role revealed to save the Vigs shot as I figured they were heading straight for me. And decided to take out two targets who were suppose to be Charged and who I believed are scum.
If one didn't die then they lied about being charged.
If they both flipped scum then my play was correct.
If they both flipped town then I have made the same mistakes the Vigs have been making all game.
It was a play I should have been allowed to finish and not been publicly punished for attempting it.
Not when I tried to talk to you about it and even justified the move with proper logic and reasoning besides "I'm mad at everyone."

This was not an attempted game throw. Like I am sure the Vigs are not attempting to game throw and are using the game mechanic they were given.
I did the same. Charged. Bus Driver.

So don't you agree that the modkill was not needed now? I don't know how I can make it any more clear that it was a mistake.
One that if there was anyway that could be fixed I would appreciate.

[FM TheJackofSpades]

Key words being "I don't believe." Unless we are suppose to be mailing you our scum lists every night.
*When I was charged I did not visit anyone as I didn't want to switch people possibly being investigated or set off an innocent person.
*At this point both Yayap and Procyon were already on my scum list. I stated early in the day before "I'm mad at everyone" that I thought Yayap was lying about being BMed.
*I role revealed to save the Vigs shot as I figured they were heading straight for me. And decided to take out two targets who were suppose to be Charged and who I believed are scum.
If one didn't die then they lied about being charged.
If they both flipped scum then my play was correct.
If they both flipped town then I have made the same mistakes the Vigs have been making all game.
It was a play I should have been allowed to finish and not been publicly punished for attempting it.
Not when I tried to talk to you about it and even justified the move with proper logic and reasoning besides "I'm mad at everyone."

This was not an attempted game throw. Like I am sure the Vigs are not attempting to game throw and are using the game mechanic they were given.
I did the same. Charged. Bus Driver.

So don't you agree that the modkill was not needed now? I don't know how I can make it any more clear that it was a mistake.
One that if there was anyway that could be fixed I would appreciate.

I mean I could have sent you 17 private messages explaining why this was not game throwing and posted maybe 40 more times with facts and reasoning....
Far be it that no one who has ever played mafia before role revealed and attempted to kill scum players when they got upset.
I hope those Vigs are writing you 12 page essays about each shot they take that comes up Town with reasons why they took that shot so you don't assume they were just angry and game throwing.....
See my point?

[Forum Mafia GM]

I mean I could have sent you 17 private messages explaining why this was not game throwing and posted maybe 40 more times with facts and reasoning....
Far be it that no one who has ever played mafia before role revealed and attempted to kill scum players when they got upset.
I hope those Vigs are writing you 12 page essays about each shot they take that comes up Town with reasons why they took that shot so you don't assume they were just angry and game throwing.....
See my point?

I am still not convinced that you weren't trying to gamethrow. However, if you truly were not intending to gamethrow, and you actually want town to win, then you should be grateful that I modkilled you. If I hadn't, you still would have died (from the charges) and you would have taken two townies down with you, putting town in an even worse position than they are in currently.

[FM TheJackofSpades]

I am still not convinced that you weren't trying to gamethrow. However, if you truly were not intending to gamethrow, and you actually want town to win, then you should be grateful that I modkilled you. If I hadn't, you still would have died (from the charges) and you would have taken two townies down with you, putting town in an even worse position than they are in currently.

Well that is good then. But at the very least could you please remove the Modkill strike and replace it with something else. Just killed. As I promise you my intent was not to game throw. I would not be going through this much effort if it was.

[FM TheJackofSpades]

At best, your action was attempted suicide. At worst, a triple kill on members of your own faction. It's textbook gamethrowing. You throw the game, you get modkilled. It's in the rules.

Day 3
Post 680

"Again, what Crimson said is that in past games Fire Nation charged their own members to seem town.

If/When I interact with people claiming to be charged (which I am too) if they don't explode then they are caught lying and that helps town.
If/When I interact with people claiming to be charged (which I am too) if they explode and turn up Fire Nation or scum that helps town.
If/When I interact with people claiming to be charged (which I am too) if they explode and turn up town, then that hurts town.

2 out of 3 possibilities and two are good for town.... APPA GONNA HUG IT OUT TONIGHT TO HELP THE TOWN HE LOVES AND HIS AVATAR PAL!"

I clearly state intent and reasoning behind the play. I clearly state why it is not intended game throwing in multiple posts and USE a mechanic that you put in the game.

So again, how is that gamethrowing when I played to take out scum players?

[FM TheJackofSpades]

*Get Charged.
*Suspect that FM Procyon is scum and that FM Yayap is faking being BMed
*Stand up for a player that flips Scum.
*Realize that you are now hooped as everyone thinks you are scum.
*Reveal as Bus Driver to prevent Vigs from shooting me and wasting shots.
*Announce that I am going to switch Yayap and Procyon as I suspect they are both scum and are also charged. This is a in game mechanic.
*Get mod killed for using the in game mechanic (charges) as I COULD have been taking out town players. (Why were the vigs not mod killed then as they were taking the same risks as I did? What about Bodyguards? They protect town and die for it. How is what I did any different? If a vig shoots a target then Body Guards die and so do they. When I suspect FM Procyon and FM Yayap are both scum, why did I get modkilled for trying to kill them and explaining why?)

Really, I would like this reasoning answered as the Modkill makes zero to no sense. I think it was done to prevent the game from being over that much quicker as I was wrong and both were town. Possibly a very important town role.

Would any of the two hosts like to reply to this please as I believe the modkill was wrong and did not intend to game throw (which I made public and stated many times with facts backing up my plan and reasoning for it.)

Thank you.