S-FM 124: Non-Standard Roles

[Citrus]

Err Banshis & Banshis? Do you mean RLVG & Banshis in that order?

My current theory is that RLVG or NoctiZ was yakuza'ed last night.

NoctiZ has been super quiet.

RLVG has had a weird spike in activity today. I could buy he was yakuza'ed, has no idea who his teammates are, and realizes someone should have died last night. Since I can't have been yakuza'ed last night if he was, he realizes I'm the only confirmed town in his eyes, and thus the only safe ML for today.

Right now I'm reasonably sure Banshis is starting mafia. However I'd much rather lynch a mafioso if possible, since it prevents two players from realizing they're aligned and using it to use their votes as such tomorrow.

[Citrus]

Hypocrite, because everyone else is suited, oracle and sheriff do not bypass suits, I'm pretty much one of the few who have not claimed being suited.
I'm going off early. My logic most of the game was pretty much ignored, other than rolelist (which was wrecked by doc claim).

In my eyes, I don't believe the doctor. If the doctor jumps in to the list, it means that you have to remove a citizen from the setup or replace the Oracle with the Doctor because the endgame make no sense with a Tailor.

Town is already set that Citrus is a Doctor, what can I speculate?
Replace the Oracle. What use do he have with a Fabricator + Tailor setup, Sheriff, Vigilante and Doctor?

Normally a setup is with two Citizen default to begin with.

-vote Kusco

Sheriff bypasses suits, Oracle doesn't.

Mafia could just as easily claim no suit when they received one (it signals the Tailor/whatever also).

How do you think I feel? The entire early/mid game makes no sense to me since my role was entirely useless without a yakuza conversion.

I really dislike how Oracle doesn't penetrate suits, because it does in epicmafia/other setups and basically craps on its power. This game is incredibly anti-townsided as I see it right now.

Ika claims Kusco was town on n2. He could have been yakuza'ed, but it means he started out as Town at the least

Unless clause: Ika was yakuza'ed n2 but still got feedback on Kusco as mafia. Since he was now mafioso, he cleared Kusco as Town and they are thus in cahoots. But I don't see this as likely since he didn't claim it til D3

[Citrus]

And fuck everything if we didn't start with a vigilante, because it means we are playing a game that started with 7 town 3 mafia 3 neutrals where a mafia can convert a town once and town didn't have a KPN beyond lynch, meaning we didn't even have a ML from one angle

[NoctiZ]

My activity naturally declines over the course of the game when I am not one of the subjects that is being talked about. That's usually due to the fact that subjects that don't affect me produce nearly no thoughts of my own. Sometimes I can talk stuff all day about a topic that causes me to think of many things to be said, but most of the time I just take in everything that's being said and when asked I give a statement. I've surprised myself that I have started out pretty active, even though I'm a citizen.

[Citrus]

My activity naturally declines over the course of the game when I am not one of the subjects that is being talked about. That's usually due to the fact that subjects that don't affect me produce nearly no thoughts of my own. Sometimes I can talk stuff all day about a topic that causes me to think of many things to be said, but most of the time I just take in everything that's being said and when asked I give a statement. I've surprised myself that I have started out pretty active, even though I'm a citizen.

Could you do me a favor then?

Could you construct a guess at the starting role list and the current role list, and outline the night actions that have occurred throughout the game? To the best of your ability.

-unvote

I think it would be a good idea if everyone does this, especially as I've seen a few illogical statements made on players' roles/alignments at certain points that are just not possible if you reason things out.

[Citrus]

Actually ignore the unvote.

-vote NoctiZ

I'll leave this here til you construct the role lists + night actions, and then I'll decide what to do with it from there, since we have ~26 hours left.

[Tonex]

I see we are in agreement about both Louiswill's role and Blazer's need to love someone. I suggested that I be Blazer's lover since I am not going to be attacked anytime soon. What are your thoughts on that?

Should be anyone that is fairly certain town, doesn't matter who. However, it should be up to Blazer, as we don't want both to die tonight. As long as he chooses one, it should be fine.

Could you do me a favor then?

Could you construct a guess at the starting role list and the current role list, and outline the night actions that have occurred throughout the game? To the best of your ability.

-unvote

I think it would be a good idea if everyone does this, especially as I've seen a few illogical statements made on players' roles/alignments at certain points that are just not possible if you reason things out.

I really don't have any speculations about roles, except for louiswill really being Caroler, possibility of an original Mafia member being converted to Mafioso, and that the remaining Neutral is very likely not a killer. One thing I'm intrigued by is who the original old maid was. Anyways, just going to post what we already know.

Claims:
Tailor (Frog)
??? > Old Maid > Yakuza (Brendan)
Caroler (louiswill)
Caroler (Tonex)
Doctor (Citrus)
Sheriff (Ika)
Sheriff (AppleyNO)
Citizen (Banshis)
Citizen (RLVG)
Citizen (Noctiz)
Oracle (Kusco)
Lover (Blazer)
Yakuza > Old Maid (ThinkLiveLife)

Hiding:
Random Mafia (may have been Yakuzaed to Mafioso)
Mafioso
Mafioso
Random Neutral
Original Old Maid > ???

[NoctiZ]

U wot m8

Sure, I can maybe take a shot at it. But keep in mind that I have nearly no knowledge of the roles. That's because I want to keep a clear mind and only focus on the behaviour of each player. The mechanics are, for me, of a lesser priority and by not reading the setup extensively I can keep it that way. But hey, if you so desire, I could try. Just not now.

I will say that I believe louis' Caroler claim, I do think that Frog is the Tailor, and other than that I'm pretty neutral about the guesses.

[Blazer]

Kusco can I haz a list of who you've been orcing on? :3

[Citrus]

Should be anyone that is fairly certain town, doesn't matter who. However, it should be up to Blazer, as we don't want both to die tonight. As long as he chooses one, it should be fine.



I really don't have any speculations about roles, except for louiswill really being Caroler, possibility of an original Mafia member being converted to Mafioso, and that the remaining Neutral is very likely not a killer. One thing I'm intrigued by is who the original old maid was. Anyways, just going to post what we already know.

Claims:
Tailor (Frog)
??? > Old Maid > Yakuza (Brendan)
Caroler (louiswill)
Caroler (Tonex)
Doctor (Citrus)
Sheriff (Ika)
Sheriff (AppleyNO)
Citizen (Banshis)
Citizen (RLVG)
Citizen (Noctiz)
Oracle (Kusco)
Lover (Blazer)
Yakuza > Old Maid (ThinkLiveLife)

Hiding:
Random Mafia (may have been Yakuzaed to Mafioso)
Mafioso
Mafioso
Random Neutral
Original Old Maid > ???

This (redline I added). Because they haven't claimed it by now, I'm fairly solid they are not town at this time, and the most sense I can get out of that is that is because they were yakuza'ed

[Citrus]

Kusco can I haz a list of who you've been orcing on? :3

I wouldn't mind this also, and some reasoning behind each night too

[Tonex]

Maybe we should just lynch Kusco for his Oracle and hope that one of the Citizen claimers is actually a bomb.

[Citrus]

Maybe we should just lynch Kusco for his Oracle and hope that one of the Citizen claimers is actually a bomb.

Wut.

[Blazer]

If we lynch Kusco and he's orc, we've got 3 v 3 v 2 and -1 town or neutral over night. Most likely -1 town to put mafia at majority. Town would need the help of a vigilante or both neutrals to win against mafia. (No matter who is made naked)

We should've pressed for his lynch days ago...the only good orc is a dead orc making mafia naked. (Sexy times)

If you townies decide to lynch him, you better hope he's mafia.

[Citrus]

If we lynch Kusco and he's orc, we've got 3 v 3 v 2 and -1 town or neutral over night. Most likely -1 town to put mafia at majority. Town would need the help of a vigilante or both neutrals to win against mafia. (No matter who is made naked)

We should've pressed for his lynch days ago...the only good orc is a dead orc making mafia naked. (Sexy times)

If you townies decide to lynch him, you better hope he's mafia.

This + it doesn't bypass suits. That was a scummy post Tonex...

[Blazer]

Would you think there's an orc in a game of 2 carolers and 2 sheriffs? \ _ _ /

[Kusco]

Okay.

Night 1 I targeted Citrus. I thought (correctly) that he was hiding something.

Night 2 I targeted Tonex. If I died I wanted to verify that there were two carolers in the setup. I didn't want an unnecessary lynch. If he was mafia, then you could have lynched his ass.

Night 3 I targeted Citrus (again). There simply can't be 3 sheriffs in the setup. If I died and showed the veracity (or lack thereof) and a lynch could be started on either Appley or Ika.

Plus I don't think lynching me would reveal Citrus' role. The role is worded "killed" which is similar to the bomb's rolecard. I think that I would need to be killed at night to reveal my target.

Would lynching an oracle reveal the target of the previous night?

Just to make sure. Not that I'd like a lynch on me.

[Kusco]

Would you think there's an orc in a game of 2 carolers and 2 sheriffs? \ _ _ /

Considering that one sheriff claimer says that the other appeared neutral, I don't think there are two sheriffs. One or the other is lying.

[Tonex]

This + it doesn't bypass suits. That was a scummy post Tonex...

Well it's not like we can win at this point, unless we secretly have a vig or a bomb.

[Blazer]

Considering that one sheriff claimer says that the other appeared neutral, I don't think there are two sheriffs. One or the other is lying.

I wasn't completely serious in that comment, but did want to bring attention to the likelihood of an orc. Just more things to analyze.

Also, i remember someone said Banshis was likely the original mafia. That would most likely mean he's not a killer. Food for thought for town priorities in lynches.
(I think someone said that too. I just agree.)

[Blazer]

Well it's not like we can win at this point, unless we secretly have a vig or a bomb.

Town still has the chance. Just don't lynch incorrectly today. Get yourself a mafioso.

[Citrus]

I wasn't completely serious in that comment, but did want to bring attention to the likelihood of an orc. Just more things to analyze.

Also, i remember someone said Banshis was likely the original mafia. That would most likely mean he's not a killer. Food for thought for town priorities in lynches.
(I think someone said that too. I just agree.)

Both what I said and how I feel. I have my feelings on the mafia, but I would like Noctiz 's lists first (and rlvg' s and any more people want to offer up)

[Tonex]

Exactly, but we don't know the identity of the mafia. Even if one Sheriff says that the other is neutral, there's no particular reason to lynch either, since it's not more likely that we come up with Mafia than neutral or town. That' why I propose we lynch Kusco, cuz even if he turns out to not be mafia, there is a chance that he is Oracle, and using that (and if there a Mafia member got Yakuzaed), we might actually be able to win.

[Tonex]

Town still has the chance. Just don't lynch incorrectly today. Get yourself a mafioso.

Exactly, but we don't know the identity of the mafia. Even if one Sheriff says that the other is neutral, there's no particular reason to lynch either, since it's not more likely that we come up with Mafia than neutral or town. That' why I propose we lynch Kusco, cuz even if he turns out to not be mafia, there is a chance that he is Oracle, and using that (and if there a Mafia member got Yakuzaed), we might actually be able to win.

Forgot to quote.

[Blazer]

Who said we should lynch Ika or Appls because of Ika claiming Appls was neutral?

I would pick between Notctiz, Kusco, Ika and Citrus tbh. One of them is bound to be yak'd if not more than 1. But that's just me. If citrus is legitimately doctor, then I would pick between Noctiz or Kusco. The problem is that the good Yak targets are the pro-town people who have roles that can help the town.

Citrus you said you protected Ika last night right?

[Blazer]

*flips coin*
*flips coin*

-vote Kusco

I shouldn't be thinking about this too much. I'm fine either way the lynch goes. <3

[Tonex]

Alright, guess it has enough (1?) support.

-vote Kusco

[Blazer]

Alright, guess it has enough (1?) support.

-vote Kusco

Baahh Baaahh Baahhh. Follow the neutral to your demise blindlessly..
Tonex you sure you aren't scum?

[Blazer]

Scum in Tigers clothing.

[Tonex]

Well I did suggest it first... I was waiting to see if it had the approval of anyone else.

[AppleyNO]

I would rather not lynch Kusco, I found him town, remember.

[Blazer]

Well I did suggest it first... I was waiting to see if it had the approval of anyone else.

I just flipped a coin. Idk what you're talking about.
I just found it interesting that myself and others were still on Banshis when the likelihood of him being not mafioso hadn't been refuted by any logical means.

Hence, I gambled and we shall see what happens next.

Since I'm bored...

Appls: Neut (Still claims sheriff) I swear is this guy is mafia and so is Ika I will sh*t bricks.
Ika: Deputy
RLVG: Shtizen?
Tonex: Evil Caroler
Citrus: Doctor Who
Kusco: Wicked Witch
Banshis: Godfather
Noctiz: Hooker
Blazer: Whore

So we have RLVG and Noctiz claiming citizen.
Ika and Appls both claiming sheriff.
Tonex as Caroler last time we checked.
Citrus as doctor.
Kusco as orc.
Banshis as orig maf. (I dont remember what he claimed lol. citizen?)
Blazer as lover.

Tailor
Yak
Actress/Tailor MK II lul

Caroler
Caroler/Sheriff
Orc/Vig/Sheriff
Doctor/Vig
Citizen/Mill/Gallis/Bomb (If there is a traitor, so help you PoD)
Citizen..
Citizen..

Old Maid
Lover
Werewolf/Extreme Survivor (lol if Zombie)

The only role I think there would be multiples of in town is Citizens or Carolers.

[Blazer]

I would rather not lynch Kusco, I found him town, remember.

No I don't. But if you want to stick with your sheriff claim and pick him as a clear, while Ika picks you as neutral...interesting...

You do realize you sheriff BEFORE yakking right?

[AppleyNO]

No I don't. But if you want to stick with your sheriff claim and pick him as a clear, while Ika picks you as neutral...interesting...

You do realize you sheriff BEFORE yakking right?

Yea, and I understand there is a risk of Kusco being yakked, but I also like my sheriff results.

[Blazer]

Yea, and I understand there is a risk of Kusco being yakked, but I also like my sheriff results.

You said "results". That's plural. What other results you have to share?

[AppleyNO]

You said "results". That's plural. What other results you have to share?

You don't read. I already posted my results yesterday for N1 and N2, and I posted my N3 result today.

[AppleyNO]

You said "results". That's plural. What other results you have to share?

Scummy > Dead due to modkill.

I counter claim Citrus and Ika as a Sheriff.

Night One Kusco - Town
Night Two Nocitz - Town.

and

I checked Brendan last night, he came up Mafia. His suit claim is legit :P

[Blazer]

Why thank you my good sir. I have learned a little bit more about you.

[AppleyNO]

Why thank you my good sir. I have learned a little bit more about you.

:P

No problem xD

[Tonex]

It doesn't really matter that you saw him as town N1, as we are looking at people who were Yakuzaed into being Mafioso N2 and N3.

[Blazer]

appls u sure you don't want to claim neutral? I promise I won't lynch you for it if you really are neutral. Scouts honor.

[AppleyNO]

appls u sure you don't want to claim neutral? I promise I won't lynch you for it if you really are neutral. Scouts honor.

Fine. I'm extreme survivor. Terrible role.

[Blazer]

Fine. I'm extreme survivor. Terrible role.

R u sure?

[AppleyNO]

R u sure?

Yes, I am positive. Why do you think I'm so inactive? xD

[Citrus]

Erg. I don't even know what to think anymore.

Tbh I don't particularly like the bandwagon forming on Kusco, but I guess we'll see what happens as the day continues

[Tonex]

Ｗｉｔｈ　ｔｈｉｓ　ｌａｃｋ　ｏｆ　ｌｅａｄｓ,　ａｓ　ｏｒａｃｌｅ,　Ｉ　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｈａｖｅ　ｖ ｏｌｕｎｔｅｅｒｅｄ　ｍｙ　ｏｗｎ　ｄｅａｔｈ　ｌｏｎｇ　ａｇｏ.

[Tonex]

HURP THAT FONT. "With this lack of leads, as oracle, I would have volunteered my own death long ago."

[Citrus]

HURP THAT FONT. "With this lack of leads, as oracle, I would have volunteered my own death long ago."

No, because it means we have to spend a mislynch. Yesterday we had Frog, the day before was way too early.

I want to think more about this, because I'm not too convinced Kusco was yakuza'ed right now, but I'm realizing there's little to no way to figure it out >.>

Either way, we need to lynch a mafioso

[Blazer]

Well now, I didn't actually expect you to answer that Appls....(to PoD!)

Ok well if we are to believe Appls' claim (at the very least as a neutral), I'm inclined to believe that we have 1 caroler 1 sheriff and either 1 more caroler or an orc in the roles list.

Caroler x Sheriff x Caroler vs Caroler x Sheriff x Orc

Citrus Heals:
1: Louis
2: Tonex
3: Ika

Ika cleared Kusco N2 and Appls as neutral N3. So long as Citrus is still (or ever was) a doctor, Ika can not be yakk'd. I find the probability of him being yakk'd to be very low in the least. Since the two Mafiosos don't know each other's identity, and there was no mafioso kill last night, I think Citrus saved Ika last night. Now since Yak doesn't count as a kill and can't be healed by a doctor, fu.... there goes my train of thought..

Process of elimination. Sheriff results from N3 = Ika had to be converted from N3 if he ever was converted.
No night kill last night leads me to believe that Citrus protected the target of Mafioso last night. That means if Ika was converted, it had to be N3. 2 conversions cannot happen in the same night so 1 is safe. (If not both)

Night 2 there was a Yak. Citrus and Ika both got their night actions in so both should be legitimate. Since Tonex caroled last night, he was not Yakk'd. The names: BRENDAN, KUSCO, and BANSHIS. The role card says "at least one" will be mafia. That means more can be. (So long as Noctiz wasn't converted, we can believe him.)

This leaves us with interesting information. Since Noctiz was sung to, he did not attack anyone. I find it highly unlikely that mafioso would not attack someone. Since the odds are mafioso attacked and the target was healed, Noctiz can NOT be the culprit! He received a song! That leaves us with Kusco as the yakk'd target!!! (Banshis is already mafia) Now I realize that following this thought process, all 3 people in the song are mafia which is really trippy. That's why I somewhat question conclusion that I came to..

If I'm off base, LOL.

[Blazer]

Wait...on night 2 there wasn't even a mafioso there to attack was there...fu**...sounds like town has issues.