M-FM XXI Avatar the Last Airbender Gamethread

[Wei Jin]

You may 'Return' your Captive to the Fire Nation. If your Return Aang your win condition will evolve. If you Return anyone else you will be prevented from acting the following day.

You guys seem to be missing this part about Zuko's rolecard. He won't be able to jail anyone tonight because he killed June.

Actually it makes me wonder. Is there a different announcement if Zuko turned someone in? Along with that is there a different announcement if Zuko just executed them?

Just wondering if the death of June would have said he got turned in. Otherwise if there is different feedback then Zuko will be able to act.

[Huu]

Zuko wasn't even able to execute someone if there was a lynch befeore his rolecard was updated. Zuko was probably prepared to talk people into death.

[Wei Jin]

Zuko wasn't even able to execute someone if there was a lynch befeore his rolecard was updated. Zuko was probably prepared to talk people into death.

Yea I guess he has 3 actions.

Execute, Return, Release. They probably fixed him so he could execute every night so he can be a 2nd KPN. And yea Returning someone that isn't the avatar was added for punishment so most likely he will just be executing now.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Guys ask me a question, I caught up and won't be around for much longer. I feel ignored

[Hama]

Opinion on claimed feedback?
I already told you that someone could be faking roleblock feedback.

Why haven't you contributed something of your own?
I don't see any other significant clues that could help us. My very first lead was Kyoshi, but unfortunately it turned out to be a dead-end. My other good suspects are Due and Wang Shi Tong, but I doubt that you would lynch Due anytime soon. Personally I suspect Due as Zuko/Iroh.

What do you think Duruk or Kue would have to gain by faking role-block feedback? Wouldn't it be obvious in subsequent days if the number of claims didn't add up: ie somebody had manufactured a claim?

Who do you think is most likely to be the faker? Duruk or Kue?

Duruk or Kue? Are you confusing their names on purpose?

I believe the faked claim would come from Due, since he is one of my suspects after all. But it it also possible that both of their roleblocks claims legit. I'm simply not convinced enough about that.

You caught me



I'm going to expand upon your logic a little:

1. Due and Kuruk were swapped and both claimed blocked
2. Kuruk's role-block was intended for Due.
3. Roles that could have targeted Due include Consort or Katara.
4. If a Consort targeted Due what alignment do you then believe Due to be? If he is not Fire Nation, what motivation does he have to lie to us?
5. If Katara targeted Due then you are saying there is no Consort because you're suggesting 1 of the Rbs was fake. Do you think it is more likely that there are no Consorts and somebody is lying than that there are 1 or 2 Consorts and people are being honest?

Do you still believe one of the claims was faked?

Hmm... you have a point out there, Hama. But in my theory I think that Katara did not roleblock anyone and probably chose to protect Kyoshi. So this would mean that a consort roleblocked one person and another could be faking his roleblock. I simply can't imagine Katara roleblocking anyone of those 2 people.

Well then it doesn't matter who you accuse of faking their claim, this is what you're saying:

1. The Consort is intentionally targeting his FireNation teammates. OR
2. Due or Kuruk aren't FireNation, but rather some other faction that stands to gain from manufacturing role-block claims?

I assume you'll go with 2, but I can't think of what faction that might be. Zuko or Jet have little to gain from manufacturing a role-block claim, and a huge amount to risk. Do you think one of them is a Jester then?

I'm not looking for Jesters, I'm looking for evil roles like those in FN and Zuko.

Due CAN be a jester based on the manner how he posts, but Kuruk looks like a normal sane person to me. Yeah, this might clear then from being in FN, so that's why I'm supporting lynch on Wan Shi Tong. I just want to double-check that both of then are speaking the truth.

I highlight these posts because Wang Fire made an accusation and presented a theory that Due &or Kuruk was lying to us about their feedback. This made me suspicious because it looked like he was simply trying to have an opinion on something to make it look like he was contributing. When I tested his resolve by deconstructing his argument it showed that he had given little thought to his theory whatsoever (note each time I refute his logic how his theory seems to evolve to anything that might vaguely seem plausible). He made spur of the moment accusations at two of the more pro-town players and it showed he hadn't thought it through, nor really even believed it in my opinion.

Finally: I can think of one scenario in which Huu's play is to be respected. If he is really a Water Tribe Citizen then claiming Earth tribe would still put him in Aang's sights, make him a failed target for Jet, make him an unlikely target for the FN (can't be Tui), and still declare his allegiance as Town. Unfortunately, I doubt this was Huu's strategy.

If you want to lynch me, go ahead. But as proud member of town, I refuse to give up, so I'll have to reveal it to you - I am Water Tribe Citizen.

The least thing I wanted is for FF to recruit one of the Earth Tribe Citizens, so I tried to pretend to be the one in order to gain their attention. I would rathee see town lynching a non-town role rather than an innocent Citizen. Don't you agree with that?

This looks like maneuvering to me. He knows players will be more willing to lynch Earth Citizens than Water Citizens and he's claiming Water Citizen to halt our lynch, despite giving no regard to the consequences of the Fire Nation identifying a Water Citizen. The claim is unnecessary anyway. A simple claim of Citizen was adequate all along as a role-claim. Instead of trying to convince us of his innocence, he's trying to scare us into not risking lynching Tui. And not once has he addressed the root cause of our suspicions, which is that he is 100% not playing like a townie focused on catching legitimate scum.

I'm placing him at L-1 because I want my vote in and I have to disappear to an exam soon.

-vote Wang Fire

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Hama sounds exactly like a Fire Nation who is tryign to eliminate the Water Citizens. At least that's what it looks like to me.

Does the Fire Nation win condition evolve if Tui is lynched during the day?

So many signs that Hama is a Fire Nation. Does nobody see this except for me?

[Wei Jin]

Guys ask me a question, I caught up and won't be around for much longer. I feel ignored

I don't know if anyone asked you yet, but what do you think of Wang Fire and Wan Shi Tong? Why are you voting Wan Shi Tong over Wang Fire?

[Huu]

Remember that zuko also shares a night chat with uncle iroh. I don't think their names are revealed to eachother considering how easy it would be for zuko to get uncle iroh lynched so he could join team avatar. Due could also be uncle iroh trying to hide his identity from zuko.

[Wei Jin]

Hama sounds exactly like a Fire Nation who is tryign to eliminate the Water Citizens. At least that's what it looks like to me.

Does the Fire Nation win condition evolve if Tui is lynched during the day?

So many signs that Hama is a Fire Nation. Does nobody see this except for me?

I don't really see Hama being FN. At most I can see him being a traitor, but he seems very townie for me.

If you want explanation about why I can see Hama being a traitor is mostly due to his obsession with wanting Aang to reveal day 1.

[Hama]

IMO we should focus also on Hama.

This is the second time you've said this, my friend, but you've neglected to produce a single argument or accusation. It is quite a tease to mention my name so but never draw me into the spotlight and fame.

[Wei Jin]

Remember that zuko also shares a night chat with uncle iroh. I don't think their names are revealed to eachother considering how easy it would be for zuko to get uncle iroh lynched so he could join team avatar. Due could also be uncle iroh trying to hide his identity from zuko.

Yea I think they answered that they don't know eachother. If Due was really roleblocked then he can't be Zuko because Zuko killed June.

[Monk Gyatso]

I feel ignored

Happy birthday.

Give your thoughts on the people that were pressured today.

Please show these "signs" that Hama is FN.

What kind of scum do you think Wan Ahi Tong is?


-----------------------

Going out for some minutes. Will be back in ~ 1 hour.

Don't dare to hammer.

[Monk Gyatso]

Actually.

-unvote

Never trust. >_>

[Hama]

Hama sounds exactly like a Fire Nation who is tryign to eliminate the Water Citizens. At least that's what it looks like to me.

Does the Fire Nation win condition evolve if Tui is lynched during the day?

So many signs that Hama is a Fire Nation. Does nobody see this except for me?

You voiced your suspicion before I voted against Wang Fire. A vote that I spent the entire day deliberating on after careful deep and extended analysis (that I shared with everybody here) explaining the pros, cons, logic and reasoning for lynches all of today's candidates: Huu, TingTong and Fire.

[Huu]

Yea I think they answered that they don't know eachother. If Due was really roleblocked then he can't be Zuko because Zuko killed June.

If the roleblock claim is true then due is most likely Uncle iroh.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

I don't know if anyone asked you yet, but what do you think of Wang Fire and Wan Shi Tong? Why are you voting Wan Shi Tong over Wang Fire?

Wan Shi Tong - Tries really hard to blend, I voted Wan Shi Tong to try to get more information out of him. WST has contributed more today which is good, but I haven't had a proper chance to go back and analyze it yet. WST definitely is blending for a reason, could be scum trying to hide and having a hard time contributing, but at this point I am not so sure. I think he is a better lynch target than Wang Fire though.

Wang Fire - Seemed like a citizen to me and was very bold while answering my survey yesterday. I took this to mean that Wang Fire is town with nothing to hide, although Monk Gyasato's theory that Wang Fire was cabbage seems to fit with picking red as the color in my survey. He did claim water citizen without reason and could just have claimed citizen in general, so I'm not really sure why he did it. It seems to fit with my picture of WF that he would just claim full role even if it wouldn't be the best because no offense but WF seems a bit derpy this game so far. I can't think of reasons off the top of my head that scum would claim water citizen and not just citizen in general.

[Wei Jin]

If the roleblock claim is true then due is most likely Uncle iroh.

Well Due is on now so we can see how he comments to this. This is what I was thinking too since he probably knew getting Uncle Iroh would be a death sentence when Zuko can turn into town if he is lynched. This is only if he actually is uncle Iroh though.

[Wei Jin]

Wang Fire - Seemed like a citizen to me and was very bold while answering my survey yesterday. I took this to mean that Wang Fire is town with nothing to hide, although Monk Gyasato's theory that Wang Fire was cabbage seems to fit with picking red as the color in my survey. He did claim water citizen without reason and could just have claimed citizen in general, so I'm not really sure why he did it. It seems to fit with my picture of WF that he would just claim full role even if it wouldn't be the best because no offense but WF seems a bit derpy this game so far. I can't think of reasons off the top of my head that scum would claim water citizen and not just citizen in general.

Well he did claim citizen day one and then he tried to act like earth kingdom citizen. Votes were getting onto him, but the water tribe claim wasn't really expected since he looked like he was trying to play it off as an earth kingdom citizen.

[Hama]

Wang Fire - Seemed like a citizen to me and was very bold while answering my survey yesterday. I took this to mean that Wang Fire is town with nothing to hide, although Monk Gyasato's theory that Wang Fire was cabbage seems to fit with picking red as the color in my survey.

I think you're putting way too much credibility on your 2 multiple choice question (you already said 2 of the questions didn't even count) survey in regards to its magic ability to discern scum from town.

[Sangok]

Hi people, I'll be reading through the thread

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Give your thoughts on the people that were pressured today.

Please show these "signs" that Hama is FN.

What kind of scum do you think Wan Ahi Tong is?

Already posted about WST and WF in my last post. Was tehre another one?

Hama is FN because:
-focused in on talking about fire nation roles on D1 and tried to tell us that we should make certain plans because role X is not in the game like bruiser and framer.
-Says scum would claim Water citizen since we are more unlikely to lynch them and keep them alive so we don't kill Tui. But I think that his reasoning for this is flawed. Scum would rather claim Earth Citizen because we SHOULD lynch water citizens in order to prevent FN from killing potential Tui. Hama's reasoning on this is backwards and makes me think that he is FN who posted his last thing with his FN hat on instead of pro-town Hama hat on.

I think if we are to lynch WF, we should lynch him for being a water citizen rather than for being scum. But I would rather not lynch a townie in the first place.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

I think you're putting way too much credibility on your 2 multiple choice question (you already said 2 of the questions didn't even count) survey in regards to its magic ability to discern scum from town.

It's a psychological test. I just think that WF picking red shows that he is bold and unafraid compared to literally every other person who took it and picked water to try to blend in.

[Yangchen]

Who cares if the game ends if we die? We can't win if we are dead anyway. The other factions would be forced to keep uss alive if tui dies and the fire nation will try to kill uss either way.

I don't want anyone to confirm if wang fire is telling the truth about his rolecard i just want someone to counter claim him if he is lying. If the fire nation wants to attack a water citizen then that's fine with me.

Like i said, we can't win if we are all dead anyway. I doubt that you are team avatar since this obviously bothers you. It doesn't matter if the game ends after we all die since we would have lost anyway.

The fire nation will only focus on team avatar untill they have killed tui. I think the fire team is smart enough to figure out who the 2nd water citizen is, since he is pretty obvious about it.
The best thing would probably be to let zuko kill tui to deny them their evolved win condition.

We could ask zuko to jail wang fire tonight. Zuko probably wants to prevent the fire nation from evolving their win condition anyway.

Misdirect? im trying to make them lynch the same person that you are currently voting on. Of course it wouldn't be a disaster if we lynch wang fire and he flips kui.

I think due is most likely to be zuko. He is probably using pictures to talk with during the day so that he can speak freely during the night without fear of someone suspecting him based on his typing style.

So. Many. Scum. Tells.

Already posted about WST and WF in my last post. Was tehre another one?

Hama is FN because:
-focused in on talking about fire nation roles on D1 and tried to tell us that we should make certain plans because role X is not in the game like bruiser and framer.
-Says scum would claim Water citizen since we are more unlikely to lynch them and keep them alive so we don't kill Tui. But I think that his reasoning for this is flawed. Scum would rather claim Earth Citizen because we SHOULD lynch water citizens in order to prevent FN from killing potential Tui. Hama's reasoning on this is backwards and makes me think that he is FN who posted his last thing with his FN hat on instead of pro-town Hama hat on.

I think if we are to lynch WF, we should lynch him for being a water citizen rather than for being scum. But I would rather not lynch a townie in the first place.

Do you have anything else?

[Hama]

Lol KW3, my friend, you just made a mega-slip.

[Yangchen]

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

That is what i have off the top of my head.

Also, isn't Huu confirmed Earth Citizen/Citizen turned FF? Please point out the scum tells, Yangchen. Be explicit because just quoting stuff doesn't connect the dots and tell me why you think Huu is scummy.

[Yangchen]

That is what i have off the top of my head.

Also, isn't Huu confirmed Earth Citizen/Citizen turned FF? Please point out the scum tells, Yangchen. Be explicit because just quoting stuff doesn't connect the dots and tell me why you think Huu is scummy.

Its slips in speaking. The amount of time he has been talking about tui he has been talking in a pro-fn manner. Thats a huge scum tell.

[Yangchen]

That is what i have off the top of my head.

Also, isn't Huu confirmed Earth Citizen/Citizen turned FF? Please point out the scum tells, Yangchen. Be explicit because just quoting stuff doesn't connect the dots and tell me why you think Huu is scummy.

Top o the head aint gonna work. Please be more explicit.

[Yangchen]

Its slips in speaking. The amount of time he has been talking about tui he has been talking in a pro-fn manner. Thats a huge scum tell.

Huu scummy, that is all.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Lol KW3, my friend, you just made a mega-slip.

I can't make slips because I'm not scum. But ok, OMGUS me and tell me what you've got.

[Wei Jin]

Its slips in speaking. The amount of time he has been talking about tui he has been talking in a pro-fn manner. Thats a huge scum tell.

Sangok confirmed he is/was an earth kingdom citizen though. Unless you think Sangok is in the FN too to defend him.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Top o the head aint gonna work. Please be more explicit.

I would really like to be more explicit but yesterday/today/this weekend is just really busy for me. If I die tonight please remember my suspicions on Hama.

[Yangchen]

Sangok confirmed he is/was an earth kingdom citizen though. Unless you think Sangok is in the FN too to defend him.

Yeah. I dunno. But you can't take a look at Huu's post and think yeah that guy seems like a Cit to me.

[Hama]

Hama sounds exactly like a Fire Nation who is tryign to eliminate the Water Citizens. At least that's what it looks like to me.

Does the Fire Nation win condition evolve if Tui is lynched during the day?

So many signs that Hama is a Fire Nation. Does nobody see this except for me?

Hama is FN because:
-focused in on talking about fire nation roles on D1 and tried to tell us that we should make certain plans because role X is not in the game like bruiser and framer.
-Says scum would claim Water citizen since we are more unlikely to lynch them and keep them alive so we don't kill Tui. But I think that his reasoning for this is flawed. Scum would rather claim Earth Citizen because we SHOULD lynch water citizens in order to prevent FN from killing potential Tui. Hama's reasoning on this is backwards and makes me think that he is FN who posted his last thing with his FN hat on instead of pro-town Hama hat on.

I think if we are to lynch WF, we should lynch him for being a water citizen rather than for being scum. But I would rather not lynch a townie in the first place.

Let's play the spot the inconsistency game. It is one of my favourites.

Tell me KW3, do Fire Nation want to lynch the Water Tribe, or keep them alive, because so far you've said both, and somehow tried to turn both of them into arguments against me.

I'm having trouble believing that both contrary ideas can exist in your head simultaneously, particularly given that they are consecutive posts.

Now I really do have to go to my exam.

[Hama]

If I die tonight please remember my suspicions on Hama.

Inb4 somebody kills Kw3 to frame me.

[Wei Jin]

Already posted about WST and WF in my last post. Was tehre another one?

Hama is FN because:
-focused in on talking about fire nation roles on D1 and tried to tell us that we should make certain plans because role X is not in the game like bruiser and framer.
-Says scum would claim Water citizen since we are more unlikely to lynch them and keep them alive so we don't kill Tui. But I think that his reasoning for this is flawed. Scum would rather claim Earth Citizen because we SHOULD lynch water citizens in order to prevent FN from killing potential Tui. Hama's reasoning on this is backwards and makes me think that he is FN who posted his last thing with his FN hat on instead of pro-town Hama hat on.

I think if we are to lynch WF, we should lynch him for being a water citizen rather than for being scum. But I would rather not lynch a townie in the first place.

Hmm Hama I personally thought you meant this. But yea I'd like to hear KW3's reasoning behind the posts.

I'll be back in a bit going to make a pizza Starving.

[Huu]

Its slips in speaking. The amount of time he has been talking about tui he has been talking in a pro-fn manner. Thats a huge scum tell.

I don't think you understand the setup. The freedom fighters would have nothing to gain from getting tui killed. It would only force them to protect team avatar to prevent the fire nation from winning.

[Due]

Spoiler : wan shi tong case :

Pathik? More like PATHETIC! Geddit?!?!

You need to find the other La so you two can combine and transform into a Teletubby.

Dat fail vote. Tots suspicious.

Wang Fire? Sounds sexual...

That's so unnecessary to say that I would deem it as scummy.

[Kuruk]

Back and catching up. Just a hip shot note- I totally disregard Wang fires cit claim because... What the hell else is there to claim? If he was a tpr he would say so but can't because of counter claim potential. He can't claim scum either.

I think he will flip red and his buddies are pushing the other lynch.

[Guru Pathik]

Koh is now viewing.

[Koh]

Koh replacement checking in. I have some catching up to do on the posts and I'm going to the gym in 1.5 hours. I'll make a post before I leave even if I don't have anything I'd particularly like to add after I review.

[Kuruk]

Spoiler : wan shi tong case :

Sounds a lot weaker than my case on you. Care to answer some questions or maybe explain your actions? Or maybe you would prefer to keep ignoring me and hope I forget about you?

[Due]

Sounds a lot weaker than my case on you. Care to answer some questions or maybe explain your actions? Or maybe you would prefer to keep ignoring me and hope I forget about you?

Spoiler : img :

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

Tui: For the Fire Nations evolving win condition they seek to kill Tui. Tui will be a predetermined Water Tribe player. If killed the player will be revealed as Tui.

So I take this to mean night kill Tui.

Let's play the spot the inconsistency game. It is one of my favourites.

Tell me KW3, do Fire Nation want to lynch the Water Tribe, or keep them alive, because so far you've said both, and somehow tried to turn both of them into arguments against me.

I'm having trouble believing that both contrary ideas can exist in your head simultaneously, particularly given that they are consecutive posts.

Now I really do have to go to my exam.

You misrep my posts. Paraphrasing, my first post says:
Hama sounds like a fire nation who is trying to eliminate the Water Citizens. (eliminate meaning kill the water citizens at night)

My second post says (paraphrasing):
-Hama's reason for lynching WF is because Hama thinks WF is scum.
-Hama FN thinks scum will claim water citizen so people won't lynch them.
-Only FN would not want to lynch a water citizen.
-Therefore Hama's reason for WF being scummy is bad.

This looks like maneuvering to me. He knows players will be more willing to lynch Earth Citizens than Water Citizens and he's claiming Water Citizen to halt our lynch, despite giving no regard to the consequences of the Fire Nation identifying a Water Citizen. The claim is unnecessary anyway. A simple claim of Citizen was adequate all along as a role-claim. Instead of trying to convince us of his innocence, he's trying to scare us into not risking lynching Tui. And not once has he addressed the root cause of our suspicions, which is that he is 100% not playing like a townie focused on catching legitimate scum.

-The real townies would want to lynch a water citizen claimer for being a water citizen since if we let them live and fn kills them then FN win conditions evolve.
-Therefore scum would want to claim earth citizen instead of water citizen because we would rather lynch water citizen claimers than earth citizen claimers.

-Hama calling WF scum for claiming water citizen that is less likely to be lynched comes from a fire nation mindset where water citizens ARE less likely to be lynched. We should try to lynch water citizens for being water citizens to prevent FN wincondition evolution if there are not other scum suspects.

-vote Hama

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

If Zuko wants to help the town because you can townside as a blue spirit you will jail and execute Hama tonight.

[Kyoshi Warrior #3]

And yeah, conveniently Hama leaves right after falsely calling me out as contradicting myself. Contradiction denied, and Hama just made himself look a lot more scummy.

Please keep this in mind. I bet that the FN is going to kill me to shut me up about Hama.

[Kuruk]

Just because sangok confirmed huu's claim:
A- Doesn't mean they can't be scum on the same team and
B- In no way confirms sangok.

The same that I could say now 'I confirm huu' and it in no way confirms me as a cit. The lack of counter claims is a plus.

I am just pointing this out because as far as I have caught up Nobody else has.


Also- I would like to hear some night action discussion..

[Kuruk]

I would rather make new ones. (@Due)

Did you blow off my questions before or did you just not read entire pages of this games discussion?
Why do you think Katara would role block you?
Why do you think a consort would role block you?
I see the utter lack of focus on you as potentially your rb claim being faked and red members avoiding you while running trains. Any thing you could give to sway this train of thought?
Will you eventually talk normally or will you do it through pics the whole game?
Why have you hardly scum hunted if you are town?
What is your motivation to post like you do when it hinders peoples ability to read you and hinders your ability to make logical points?

[Kyoshi]

Inb4 somebody kills Kw3 to frame me.

Mission Accepted.

[Kuruk]

I would also like to say I just dont see the logic in lynching wan shi tong over Wang fire. I started the fos on him and it was for pressure. Not a lynch. Wang fire dodged questions, try's to fos without logic and votes on anyone with little consideration. If I am missing something here please enlighten me but I am really starting to look harder on those lobbying on him and derailing Wang fire.

This is not to say I consider him a town green at all. He just seems like a much less viable target to me. I would really like to get some feedback on this from those that advocate lynching him over Wang.