My thoughts on the new Cultist

[MENTLEGEN]

I originally thought it was balanced, and peeps were just mad. But I honestly feel it is overpowered. These three reasons all together make it OP.

1. If a cultist converts a mafia, the converted mafia just reveals the other 2 mafias, without looking like a cheater/troll.
2. If a cultist converts a claimed mayor, the cultist mayor DOES infact retain the mayor votes. This is just fucking ridiculous in all honesty.
3. Spy can't read Cultist chat. This is kind of weird, especially considering the spy could be near useless some games. This would be a nice buff to the spy, and it kinda just looks like a bug that should be fixed.

Anyway, gotta keep it short cause Goonswarm just started the game.

Edit: If any one of these things were changed, I honestly think it would be balanced. I think the last 2 should be fixed, cause the first one can't be fixed.

[Dark.Revenant]

None of them are bugs to be "fixed".

He's still the fucking mayor of the town. Being in the Cult won't change his identity.

The Spy only sees Mafia chat. I removed the Mason chat thing.

[Alpr]

#1 - option to not convert mafia
#2 - dunno
#3 - dunno, but he'd have to like change the UI to show both mason and mafia chat i think? so would be too much work.

[MENTLEGEN]

Oh, sorry. Didn't know about the spy thing. And I guess you're right about the mayor.

[Nebbie]

The first could be solved if the mafia learned of who one of the cultists is upon converting a mafia (the mafia member initially acts as a spy cause he's pretty loyal), so that if the cult reveals the mafia the mafia can reveal a good portion of the cult (and thus the cult is forced to keep quiet.) Death notes would have to be disabled for mafia upon a mafia becoming Cult to prevent Mafia from anonymously outing two cultists tho.
Otherwise mayor would be easily exposed as having changed, but that does shift the votecount way in Cult favor. Consider that a claimed Mayor can't be healed (most setups) and is a likely mafia/sk target. Converting him is a huge risk that should have a good payoff if it is pulled off.
I think having Spy see the Cult's chat would be too OP, since Cult has no leader and has to vote on who to convert, plus needs good strategy for confirming each other's roleclaims.

[philie]

Why remove mason chat tho? i suppose culted spy can lose this ability.... but town spy should be able to hear cult and masons, masons to prove himself and have a few names cleared for himself, and to weaken cult communication
also you could just remove masons since they get too screwed by culted spy, but keep cult since they are still powerful:3

[Inca_Killa]

Oh, sorry. Didn't know about the spy thing. And I guess you're right about the mayor.

Wouldn't sheriff still be sheriff?

Investigator still be investigator?

etc. Just sayin.

[MENTLEGEN]

On a semi-related note. I love the fact that trying to convert mason leader = beat to death with a blunt object xD

[Dark.Revenant]

#1 is handled by choosing the option to not recruit killing roles. If one of the mafia is a Mafioso/Disguiser and the other a Godfather, at least half of the mafia is completely cult-proof.

[Nebbie]

Oh, sorry. Didn't know about the spy thing. And I guess you're right about the mayor.

Wouldn't sheriff still be sheriff?

Investigator still be investigator?

etc. Just sayin.

Sheriff needs to be checking people and conferring with townsfolk all night, the cult just takes up too much of his time (plus would be OP.) Investigator would be cool as a cult stalker I think (hey Mafia has its version of the invest, why not?) I doubt DR will be making any special night action-retaining for Cultists though.

[MENTLEGEN]

#1 is handled by choosing the option to not recruit killing roles. If one of the mafia is a Mafioso/Disguiser and the other a Godfather, at least half of the mafia is completely cult-proof.

True. I still don't really like how mafia is completely screwed if one of their guys gets converted though.

An example, and the way I came across this issue is this:
Goonswarm was a consligiere. Cultists converted him ~halway through the game. I was Serial killer, so I killed him towards the end. Goon's last will was "I was consig. Blue and ---- are mafia." (can't remember the color of the 2nd guy). So Mafia was practically screwed, because everyone now knew who the mafia was. And they were able to treat it as a hard fact rather than just trolling/trying to confuse town like when a mafia dies, and leaves names in his will. In this situation, everyone knows that the consig/cultist had no reason to lie, because he no longer belonged to the mafia. At least with the sheriff, there is a chance that the people he checked were framed. This is just a 100% lynch for mafia, and any former mafia that turned Cultist would do the same thing if he had half a brain.

[Argonanth]

Is the cultist not supposed to be able to convert the night they die? I was killed off by a mason leader and the citizen I tried to convert wasn't converted? Is this a bug or is it not supposed to work that way like a normal 'attack'

[Dark.Revenant]

That's how it should work, yes.