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[QUOTE=MrMostache;963885]Here are some recent mafia reviews.


[ATTACH=CONFIG]28423[/ATTACH][/QUOTE]

Those sentiments nigh on identical to my own negative impressions of when I started playing again. What made me come back instead of straight up leaving were the good games though.
Sometimes you get games full of decent adults who're also good players. A joy all around.
Sometimes you get games full of people whom you just don't want to be around whatsoever, but also the games themselves are bad (no trial for days and days, town lynching confirmed townies, mafia killing confirmed neutrals, you name it).
I think the average behavior is in-between, pretty much where Lag showed it is. But the first impressions felt more extreme and it took a while to calibrate.
Currently my main demotivator to join a game is the vast disparity between the average skills between different games. You get from Town just annihilating the opposition, where everyone solves and works together, to Town not voting nor uttering a word of inquisition for days until they become the minority. I find that -Mafia- games are more enjoyable when expectations and reality correlate well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Originally Posted by MrMostache

Here are some recent mafia reviews.

Those sentiments nigh on identical to my own negative impressions of when I started playing again. What made me come back instead of straight up leaving were the good games though.
Sometimes you get games full of decent adults who're also good players. A joy all around.
Sometimes you get games full of people whom you just don't want to be around whatsoever, but also the games themselves are bad (no trial for days and days, town lynching confirmed townies, mafia killing confirmed neutrals, you name it).
I think the average behavior is in-between, pretty much where Lag showed it is. But the first impressions felt more extreme and it took a while to calibrate.
Currently my main demotivator to join a game is the vast disparity between the average skills between different games. You get from Town just annihilating the opposition, where everyone solves and works together, to Town not voting nor uttering a word of inquisition for days until they become the minority. I find that -Mafia- games are more enjoyable when expectations and reality correlate well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

That's a loud and noticeable small minority, gotta be said.

That's a loud and noticeable small minority, gotta be said.

[QUOTE=one_asparagus;933017] It's mind boggling that there is literally a post 4 pages long with you all going back and forth about anti semanticist rhetoric and why it should be allowed. [/QUOTE]
Vast majority of members are against, but you claim the opposite being true. Why?

Originally Posted by one_asparagus

It's mind boggling that there is literally a post 4 pages long with you all going back and forth about anti semanticist rhetoric and why it should be allowed.

Vast majority of members are against, but you claim the opposite being true. Why?

[QUOTE=aamirus;932108]Well not EVERYone…

Honestly ceko I get what you’re saying but taking immediate moderation action against a thread about admins being power hungry nazis just isn’t very tenable. So I personally tend to just let these threads play themselves out. Veliaire helpfully buried himself with that post Voss infracted and we probably should have just closed it there but now people are having some other interesting discussions so why kill that?[/QUOTE]
Tbh I'm a little interested to see what Helz will say to my question I asked him.
Usually you don't see him changing his mind or even reasons for them over years apart. This time, on this topic, he changed his opinion within months.
I kinda want to hear the story behind that change.

Originally Posted by aamirus

Well not EVERYone…

Honestly ceko I get what you’re saying but taking immediate moderation action against a thread about admins being power hungry nazis just isn’t very tenable. So I personally tend to just let these threads play themselves out. Veliaire helpfully buried himself with that post Voss infracted and we probably should have just closed it there but now people are having some other interesting discussions so why kill that?

Tbh I'm a little interested to see what Helz will say to my question I asked him.
Usually you don't see him changing his mind or even reasons for them over years apart. This time, on this topic, he changed his opinion within months.
I kinda want to hear the story behind that change.

[QUOTE=aamirus;932102]Could be but I was too lazy to code a bot to count only the started games posts. I think ceko’s evidence of the game being in the top 10 is a good support though[/QUOTE]
Yah that's fair.

Originally Posted by aamirus

Could be but I was too lazy to code a bot to count only the started games posts. I think ceko’s evidence of the game being in the top 10 is a good support though

Yah that's fair.

[QUOTE=Veliaire;932103]Honest question here. Does it appear that I made this thread to attack everyone?[/QUOTE]Not initially, no.
It did look like this thread turned into a brawl though.

Tbh, you behaved yourself well in my opinion.
For some odd reason, some who feel like they can make good arguments also feel like it gives them leeway to shit on others whilst doing so.

I'm just interested to see if this thread is still salvageable tbh.

Originally Posted by Veliaire

Honest question here. Does it appear that I made this thread to attack everyone?

Not initially, no.
It did look like this thread turned into a brawl though.

Tbh, you behaved yourself well in my opinion.
For some odd reason, some who feel like they can make good arguments also feel like it gives them leeway to shit on others whilst doing so.

I'm just interested to see if this thread is still salvageable tbh.

[QUOTE=Veliaire;932101]Honestly, If you do not like what I have to say then you are free not to post in my thread. You're welcome to talk about the topic, but talking about how I need to be banned and how you would ban me if you were a mod is not the topic of this thread... but something tells me you came in here with the purpose of stirring up drama. You have absolutely no interest in talking about the topic, as is evident by every one of your posts thus far.[/QUOTE]
Btw, technically speaking, only the Serious Discussions and Debates subforum is protected from trolling. (Though not particularly enforced)

I feel like it's a question of just years for that to change? Maybe not, who can tell..

Originally Posted by Veliaire

Honestly, If you do not like what I have to say then you are free not to post in my thread. You're welcome to talk about the topic, but talking about how I need to be banned and how you would ban me if you were a mod is not the topic of this thread... but something tells me you came in here with the purpose of stirring up drama. You have absolutely no interest in talking about the topic, as is evident by every one of your posts thus far.

Btw, technically speaking, only the Serious Discussions and Debates subforum is protected from trolling. (Though not particularly enforced)

I feel like it's a question of just years for that to change? Maybe not, who can tell..

[QUOTE=Veliaire;932098]I'm attacking people? Did you see what he said about me?[/QUOTE]
Idk which one you mean, many here seemed to be just here to scorn you for amusement. Not everyone can be as honest and forthcoming as aamirus and Helz.

However, I'm not asking about them I'm asking about you. This is your thread.

Originally Posted by Veliaire

I'm attacking people? Did you see what he said about me?

Idk which one you mean, many here seemed to be just here to scorn you for amusement. Not everyone can be as honest and forthcoming as aamirus and Helz.

However, I'm not asking about them I'm asking about you. This is your thread.

[QUOTE=Veliaire;931992]Did you want to argue all night about it? I mean, I have my position and you have yours and its clear neither of us intend to change. So what would be the point?[/QUOTE]
[MENTION=31836]Veliaire[/MENTION]
What do you want out of this thread looking forward?
One the one hand, you turned someone interested in honest discussion away. On the other hand, I see you attacking people.

Originally Posted by Veliaire

Did you want to argue all night about it? I mean, I have my position and you have yours and its clear neither of us intend to change. So what would be the point?

@Veliaire
What do you want out of this thread looking forward?
One the one hand, you turned someone interested in honest discussion away. On the other hand, I see you attacking people.

[QUOTE=aamirus;932057]or if we look at the past 2 months versus the preceding time:
5192 lobbies since april 8
61 days
85.11 lobbies per day

13225 lobbies sep 28 to april 8
192 days
68.88 lobbies per day

so a 24% increase in activity the past 2 months versus the preceding 7 months[/QUOTE]
Isn't there a possibility that less players = more lobbies?
Like, if there is always only 1 player and he keeps reconnecting.
Or if people keep creating and cancelling upon seeing none's there.

Originally Posted by aamirus

or if we look at the past 2 months versus the preceding time:
5192 lobbies since april 8
61 days
85.11 lobbies per day

13225 lobbies sep 28 to april 8
192 days
68.88 lobbies per day

so a 24% increase in activity the past 2 months versus the preceding 7 months

Isn't there a possibility that less players = more lobbies?
Like, if there is always only 1 player and he keeps reconnecting.
Or if people keep creating and cancelling upon seeing none's there.

[QUOTE=Veliaire;932022]I never named myself "I GAS JEWS". If you need to lie to prove your point, maybe you don't have much of a point to begin with?[/QUOTE]
He never said you do it.

Originally Posted by Veliaire

I never named myself "I GAS JEWS". If you need to lie to prove your point, maybe you don't have much of a point to begin with?

He never said you do it.

[QUOTE=Stealthbomber16;932013]When you eat at a restaurant and the food is bad, you don’t come back. You don’t talk to employees or the management about how the food sucked or whatever. You don’t try and fix the food. You just don’t come back. Have you considered for a moment that there may be a cause and effect link between the fact that lobbies take forever to fill up and the fact that there’s a very vocal minority in the community (and it is well established at this point that you are in a minority) that is actively spamming racist messages and dragging the quality of games down?[/QUOTE]
+The fact that someone, Ceko I believe, showed that the exact opposite to be true. (more players playing the Mafia Arcade, relatively to other SC2 Arcades, since the policy change)

Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16

When you eat at a restaurant and the food is bad, you don’t come back. You don’t talk to employees or the management about how the food sucked or whatever. You don’t try and fix the food. You just don’t come back. Have you considered for a moment that there may be a cause and effect link between the fact that lobbies take forever to fill up and the fact that there’s a very vocal minority in the community (and it is well established at this point that you are in a minority) that is actively spamming racist messages and dragging the quality of games down?

+The fact that someone, Ceko I believe, showed that the exact opposite to be true. (more players playing the Mafia Arcade, relatively to other SC2 Arcades, since the policy change)

[QUOTE=OzyWho;932001]Helz is dogmatic enough on the topic of racism that it has been mistaken for bigotry somewhere else. This is something he feels strongly about.

On other news, that frustration, which is being let out, is projected here due to similarities and has more than likely nothing to do with you personally.[/QUOTE]Speaking of which, [MENTION=10617]Helz[/MENTION], what happened to this?:
[QUOTE=Helz;890203]Accept their existence and learn to adjust ourselves to our environment as opposed to expecting our environment to adjust to us.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Helz;890937]I agree its sad. But understand there is some pathetic person on the other end baiting for outrage because they desperately need attention. When they are so damaged as a person they have to resort to that kind of behavior to meet their basic needs you should offer them your pity because that makes them face themselves while its your anger, attention, and reaction that they crave.

At the end of the day Activation has replaced Blizzard and they give no fucks about their community. There are things you can change in life and there are things you can only accept.[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by OzyWho

Helz is dogmatic enough on the topic of racism that it has been mistaken for bigotry somewhere else. This is something he feels strongly about.

On other news, that frustration, which is being let out, is projected here due to similarities and has more than likely nothing to do with you personally.

Speaking of which, @Helz , what happened to this?:

Originally Posted by Helz

Accept their existence and learn to adjust ourselves to our environment as opposed to expecting our environment to adjust to us.

Originally Posted by Helz

I agree its sad. But understand there is some pathetic person on the other end baiting for outrage because they desperately need attention. When they are so damaged as a person they have to resort to that kind of behavior to meet their basic needs you should offer them your pity because that makes them face themselves while its your anger, attention, and reaction that they crave.

At the end of the day Activation has replaced Blizzard and they give no fucks about their community. There are things you can change in life and there are things you can only accept.

[QUOTE=Voss;931995]Yeah, Oberon's turned a new leaf and isn't being anti-admin cringy for the sake of it.[/QUOTE]
Voss, frankly, shut your mouth.
You're one of the biggest griefers on the site, you griefed on Oberon for like forever because he attacked you in some game or whatever other reason.
It was literally painful to watch you grief so openly, viciously and for so long. And now you're being hypocritical by projecting your own actions but in reverse? You're fucked up mate.

Edit: him ignoring all your abuse and grief is him "not being anti mods for the sake of it" - ok, cool mate, whatever floats your narcissism.

Originally Posted by Voss

Yeah, Oberon's turned a new leaf and isn't being anti-admin cringy for the sake of it.

Voss, frankly, shut your mouth.
You're one of the biggest griefers on the site, you griefed on Oberon for like forever because he attacked you in some game or whatever other reason.
It was literally painful to watch you grief so openly, viciously and for so long. And now you're being hypocritical by projecting your own actions but in reverse? You're fucked up mate.

Edit: him ignoring all your abuse and grief is him "not being anti mods for the sake of it" - ok, cool mate, whatever floats your narcissism.

[QUOTE=Veliaire;931992]Did you want to argue all night about it? I mean, I have my position and you have yours and its clear neither of us intend to change. So what would be the point?[/QUOTE]
Helz is dogmatic enough on the topic of racism that it has been mistaken for bigotry somewhere else. This is something he feels strongly about.

On other news, that frustration, which is being let out, is projected here due to similarities and has more than likely nothing to do with you personally.

Originally Posted by Veliaire

Did you want to argue all night about it? I mean, I have my position and you have yours and its clear neither of us intend to change. So what would be the point?

Helz is dogmatic enough on the topic of racism that it has been mistaken for bigotry somewhere else. This is something he feels strongly about.

On other news, that frustration, which is being let out, is projected here due to similarities and has more than likely nothing to do with you personally.

[MENTION=31836]Veliaire[/MENTION]
I recently made a post showing how this change came to be, if you're interested:
[QUOTE=OzyWho;927166][QUOTE=naptime;927161]
since when was racism considered a bannable offense?? there are racists all the time in this game. [/QUOTE]It wasn't until recently, and technically still kinda isn't but kinda is.
There was a case recently that was so extreme, it was completely justified and largely supported:
[url]https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/46998-Cute-1-S2-1-10478739?highlight=10478739[/url]

It's the gateway case. After that, the mods punish the use of bad language much more freely.

Things change dude. Before that 'gateway case' the community consensus was that this sort of thing sucks but ain't nothing can be done because it's not against the rules technically. [I](it is now though, at least [MENTION=29585]aamirus[/MENTION] added some example of it in the list of bannable offenses)[/I]
After that case, the community supports the mods taking action against it for the most part; there are exceptions people though.

People's opinions before the 'gateway case':
[url]https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/47487-General-Concerns-about-Names[/url]

People's opinions after the 'gateway case':
[url]https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/48715-Racist-names-(yes-this-again)[/url][/QUOTE]
That one thread was before the change and the other was after it - this one, yours, is still a continuation of process and people catching up.


Btw, my post that I quoted - it's just paraphrasing what aamirus has said in that one thread:
[QUOTE=aamirus;925154][QUOTE=OzyWho;925153][QUOTE=aamirus;925149]Excessive spam has always been reportable under griefing. The only real change recently is adding names like "I RAPE YOUR 6 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER" and "ALL NIGGERS MUST DIE" to name abuse.[/QUOTE]

Weird question perhaps, but how did that change happen?[/QUOTE]

[url]https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/46998-Cute-1-S2-1-10478739?highlight=10478739[/url][/QUOTE]

@Veliaire
I recently made a post showing how this change came to be, if you're interested:

Originally Posted by OzyWho

Originally Posted by naptime

since when was racism considered a bannable offense?? there are racists all the time in this game.

It wasn't until recently, and technically still kinda isn't but kinda is.
There was a case recently that was so extreme, it was completely justified and largely supported:
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...light=10478739

It's the gateway case. After that, the mods punish the use of bad language much more freely.

Things change dude. Before that 'gateway case' the community consensus was that this sort of thing sucks but ain't nothing can be done because it's not against the rules technically. (it is now though, at least @aamirus added some example of it in the list of bannable offenses)
After that case, the community supports the mods taking action against it for the most part; there are exceptions people though.

People's opinions before the 'gateway case':
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...ns-about-Names

People's opinions after the 'gateway case':
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...es-this-again)

That one thread was before the change and the other was after it - this one, yours, is still a continuation of process and people catching up.


Btw, my post that I quoted - it's just paraphrasing what aamirus has said in that one thread:

Originally Posted by aamirus

Originally Posted by OzyWho

Originally Posted by aamirus

Excessive spam has always been reportable under griefing. The only real change recently is adding names like "I RAPE YOUR 6 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER" and "ALL NIGGERS MUST DIE" to name abuse.

Weird question perhaps, but how did that change happen?

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showt...light=10478739

[QUOTE=Unknown1234;931985]You should try putting yourself in other peoples shoes sometimes.[/QUOTE]
I remember someone in a -Mafia- game once saying that that they're black and that they find some of the racist jokes funny. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Originally Posted by Unknown1234

You should try putting yourself in other peoples shoes sometimes.

I remember someone in a -Mafia- game once saying that that they're black and that they find some of the racist jokes funny. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯