S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

[Sino]

why y'all (most of you) gotta be poor sports and bag on the host?

PoD got outed by me for killing me. Me having BCD on my side would have made quite the interesting game, and PoD would have never outed.

thanks for hosting Matt. really, the only thing I'd put into your game rules is no threat to game throw, cuz I think that's a shitty way to play.

Why did you choose PoD as a n1 recruit though ? Just being curious here

[SuperJack]

why y'all (most of you) gotta be poor sports and bag on the host?

PoD got outed by me for killing me. Me having BCD on my side would have made quite the interesting game, and PoD would have never outed.

thanks for hosting Matt. really, the only thing I'd put into your game rules is no threat to game throw, cuz I think that's a shitty way to play.

This is the best post-game post so far. You can all learn a lesson from it.

[DarknessB]

... I did not advocate for a mass claiming. I said I want the godfather or consigliere to claim, but this was obviously planned because I knew this could not happen since I was in that group. The goal was for the evils to not target me at night, and I knew the gf/consig couldnt reveal. It was a bit unfortunate that the person who got pressured was as beguiler, but at the very least it confirmed him as town.

My play minus gyrlander and I's role fiasco was very strong. My town circle was accurate, and I defended two towns very hard until their death (unknown, kovath).

You just tunneled on town, and defended evils.

As for gamethrowing, I never said I was going to, but you guys kept bringing it up, so I asked mattzed if stating gamethrowing was allowed. He said it was so I went with you guys and claimed I would gamethrow if you didn't vote.

I honestly can't even debate when you make posts like this. Your play was anything but strong this game and everyone realizes it but you. You a significant chunk of the Town to start the game (Kenshin, yourself, Mesk), you made yourself come off insanely scummy with your THREE role claims. You used threatened game-throwing as a tactic.

This is exactly Charmander all over again. The Town won DESPITE your play, not because of it. We never defended any of G4, Voss, or POD -- not sure what you're talking about there either.

[Calix]

Not to mention that MZ's hosting left much to be desired.

It does not take much effort to actually tell players that "your concerns will be taken into account after the game if there is an issue" or "friendly reminder that game-throwing is against the rules" or making any efforts at policing the game when a problematic element came up.

Instead he chose to ignore the issues, didn't make any attempts to reassure players or make it clear that he was acknowledging their concerns at all and only cares about the high post count of the game. This shows that he has little interest in making a game for other players to enjoy.

Instead of acknowledging that maybe his detractors have some valid gripes to be taken into consideration, he delays posting the post-game for several hours and dismisses everyone as being salty...despite the fact that almost everyone who has taken issue with the game ended up winning.

[Quick]

Longest game on this site still a consideration? Surely longest game with the shortest day?

[DarknessB]

Not to mention that MZ's hosting left much to be desired.

It does not take much effort to actually tell players that "your concerns will be taken into account after the game if there is an issue" or "friendly reminder that game-throwing is against the rules" or making any efforts at policing the game when a problematic element came up.

Instead he chose to ignore the issues, didn't make any attempts to reassure players or make it clear that he was acknowledging their concerns at all and only cares about the high post count of the game. This shows that he has little interest in making a game for other players to enjoy.

Instead of acknowledging that maybe his detractors have some valid gripes to be taken into consideration, he delays posting the post-game for several hours and dismisses everyone as being salty...despite the fact that almost everyone who has taken issue with the game ended up winning.

I understand MattZed's philosophy on in-game issues, but it let to a significant amount of dissent among the playerbase, which was evident by Calix and I leaving the game, Paladin's dead post, and many other people being upset about the threatened gamethrows and POD's spamming (among others, Voss, Quick, etc.). It was not great PR and I hope MZ learns from this in the future. People don't have confidence when you don't let them know what's going on whatsoever and it looks like bad behavior is being sanctioned. Making announcements doesn't compromise the integrity of the game -- in fact, it keeps the game going and avoids players becoming disenchanted by in-game issues.

[SuperJack]

You should all just Hug your issues out

[DarknessB]

You should all just Hug your issues out

I can see you are practicing your Day 1 for future games, SJ.

[SuperJack]

I can see you are practicing your Day 1 for future games, SJ.

I'm not playing again.

[Mesk514]

90% of the players in this game:

[Quick]

90% of the players in this game:

Great. Exactly 1.3 players played well.

[Edit] I know my math is wrong but you get the point.

[DarknessB]

powerofdeath - Underboss
Borderline Crazy Dealers - Drug Dealer
Rurouni Kenshin - Beguiler
Kovath - Drug Dealer
Logically Insane - Kidnapper
G4slight - Consort
Fatalis - Underboss
Voss - FBI Agent
SexyDucK - Consigliere
God Emperor Trudeau - Godfather
Sino - Caporegime
Shifty - Tailor
Unknown1234 - Drug Dealer

Balance was also terrible. There is no logical reason for any of these roles to co-exist together. Town had barely ANY high-power TPRs save for the Beguiler, Underboss (token Investigative) and Doctor. (2/3 which are standard)

Kidnapper and Tailor were basically Citizens. The former is fine; the latter just helped perpetuate needless paranoia among the newer town players that the scum took advantage of. (e.g., Duck and Sino)

There is also NO logical reason to have three of the SAME ROLE in a game. You cannot explain that from a balance perspective because there is no way you can account for that. The only reason to do that was to fuck with the town players. This makes no sense given the other roles, the fact that town only had 3 MLs to count on, the fact that it's a cult setup and the obvious issues with having three townies reveal when one Drug Dealer claims. (because there is no reason for a low-power TPR such as Drug Dealer to NOT counter-claim when there is the chance of the other claim being scum)

Not to mention that having three roles which could have stopped the FBI (a ridiculously nerfed faction) from recruiting, plus the GF/ Consig, plus the Mafia, plus a Doctor, is obviously unbalanced for the FBI.

Agreed that 3 Drug Dealers meant that the FBI had a snowball's chance in hell of a conversion. That combined with only 2 groupscum helped contribute to the Town streamroll. I'm fine with a Tailor honestly -- it was how paralyzed certain Town members became with it that was the issue, which is more of a playstyle issue than a hosting issue.

[DarknessB]

Great. Exactly 1.3 players played well.

[Edit] I know my math is wrong but you get the point.

LOL, still working on that career in comedy, Quick?

[SuperJack]

[Gyrlander]

[Fatalis]

GG everyone! Thanks to Mattzed for hosting the game!

I believe that most* showed effort and commitment to the game, IMO most played well too. The real reason why we won here is because of scum's night actions though.
*minus shifty

-vote SexyDucK

[Quick]

LOL, still working on that career in comedy, Quick?

When people tell me I can't do it it just make me want to prove all the naysayers wrong.

Call me a comedian who tries.

I try.

[DarknessB]

GG everyone! Thanks to Mattzed for hosting the game!

I believe that most* showed effort and commitment to the game, IMO most played well too. The real reason why we won here is because of scum's night actions though.
*minus shifty

-vote SexyDucK

This vote is a joke, right? Three different role claims, outing multiple TPRs, threatening to game-throw?

[BananaCucho]

I claimed two roles, beguiler and consigliere. Claiming beguiler confirmed RK as town.

Don't even get me started on your play this game.

You tunneled on 4 towns as your scum, and defended voss and pod, the two evils.

My town circle day 1 was a perfect 5/5 and my last will:

Kovath- Is ALWAYS town.
RK- ALWAYS town beguiler,
Sino - very strong town
Fatalis - very strong town
(unknown I obviously defended but got lynched)

I was initially wrong with 3/6 scums being correct/wrong, but I actually reevaluated this game unlike you.

Right because you scum reading me and Logically Insane for seeing your shit gambit as shit = stellar play

Lynching shifty = awesome play

Me having to convince you NOT to lynch Sino or Fatalis - both STRONG TOWN for you, over gaslight who was confirmed scum - spectacular!

Either way, you're dead to me after you tried to combine in game and out of game, rage removing me from Skype mid game for not being impressed with your gambit, and for spitting on our friendship when I have gone to bat for you and defended you so many times. Eat a dick, asshole.

[Fatalis]

This vote is a joke, right? Three different role claims, outing multiple TPRs, threatening to game-throw?

No, I legit thought that he put the most effort into winning the game.

[SuperJack]

This vote is a joke, right? Three different role claims, outing multiple TPRs, threatening to game-throw?

Yo. Hugs only.

[DarknessB]

I claimed two roles, beguiler and consigliere. Claiming beguiler confirmed RK as town.

Don't even get me started on your play this game.

You tunneled on 4 towns as your scum, and defended voss and pod, the two evils.

My town circle day 1 was a perfect 5/5 and my last will:

Kovath- Is ALWAYS town.
RK- ALWAYS town beguiler,
Sino - very strong town
Fatalis - very strong town
(unknown I obviously defended but got lynched)

I was initially wrong with 3/6 scums being correct/wrong, but I actually reevaluated this game unlike you.

RK was anything but confirmed Town -- his behavior was EXTREMELY scummy this game, even perhaps by his own admission. He was planning out lynches days in advance and scumreading a number of Town players including Kovath, us, and Shifty.

You hammered Unknown, irrationally read Sino as strong Town because he never questioned much of what you did (he was Town, but not strong Town), Fatalis wasn't particularly active this game, and you were ready to string up Kovath based on Shifty's lynch.

Midgame, you tunneled the fuck out of us and went on a tantrum with your threatened GTs, which caused two of us to leave the game. All over lynching the Town Tailor as well. The Town won IN SPITE of your play not because of it. This is Charmander all over again with your hero ball failing, but the Town winning because of the setup dynamics.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Right because you scum reading me and Logically Insane for seeing your shit gambit as shit = stellar play

Lynching shifty = awesome play

Me having to convince you NOT to lynch Sino or Fatalis - both STRONG TOWN for you, over gaslight who was confirmed scum - spectacular!

Either way, you're dead to me after you tried to combine in game and out of game, rage removing me from Skype mid game for not being impressed with your gambit, and for spitting on our friendship when I have gone to bat for you and defended you so many times. Eat a dick, asshole.

I scum read LI for trying to quick hammer me when I claimed consig/continuing to think of reasons to lynch us after confirmed. I also scum read him initially. I scum read you for inconsistent and suboptimal play.

I am content with the lynch on shifty, it was good.

You didnt convince me to not lynch sino or fatalis, they were my top 2 town and were never going to by lynched by me. Gyrlander told me g4slight was mafia on day 1, i had him null.

I never said my mafia circle was good, it was 3/6 by day2. My town circle was 5/5 and it was a good circle. The difference between our play was I was willing to reevaluate on players. It is okay to have wrong reads, but try to reevaluate...

[BananaCucho]

I scum read LI for trying to quick hammer me when I claimed consig/continuing to think of reasons to lynch us after confirmed. I also scum read him initially. I scum read you for inconsistent and suboptimal play.

I am content with the lynch on shifty, it was good.

You didnt convince me to not lynch sino or fatalis, they were my top 2 town and were never going to by lynched by me. Gyrlander told me g4slight was mafia on day 1, i had him null.

I never said my mafia circle was good, it was 3/6 by day2. My town circle was 5/5 and it was a good circle. The difference between our play was I was willing to reevaluate on players. It is okay to have wrong reads, but try to reevaluate...

Eat a dick, asshole.

[Gyrlander]

Eat a dick, asshole.

Honesty the first thing, always.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

RK was anything but confirmed Town -- his behavior was EXTREMELY scummy this game, even perhaps by his own admission. He was planning out lynches days in advance and scumreading a number of Town players including Kovath, us, and Shifty.

You hammered Unknown, irrationally read Sino as strong Town because he never questioned much of what you did (he was Town, but not strong Town), Fatalis wasn't particularly active this game, and you were ready to string up Kovath based on Shifty's lynch.

Midgame, you tunneled the fuck out of us and went on a tantrum with your threatened GTs, which caused two of us to leave the game. All over lynching the Town Tailor as well. The Town won IN SPITE of your play not because of it. This is Charmander all over again with your hero ball failing, but the Town winning because of the setup dynamics.

Rk was confirmed town if you were thinking from a scum perspective

I hammered unknown as a joke since your slot claimed the hammer, he was dead either way. My posts clearly showed I had him as town. Sino's line of questioning was very good and deeper than say that of calix's. Fatalis was reading people and their intention and he was trying to look at logic from their point of view even when he didn't agree with it.

I was not ready to string up kovath based on shifty's lynch. My last will I posted specifically said "kovath will probably be the lynch today, my reads strongly go against this though"

Town won because of voss, I have never stated otherwise.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Eat a dick, asshole.

About time.

[BananaCucho]

-vote Calix

You do realize Calix (and Darkness) rage quit the game after day 2 right? Vote someone who quit the game... That's worse than lurking IMO and I think I'm still more salty about that more than anything else this game.

[Gyrlander]

You do realize Calix (and Darkness) rage quit the game after day 2 right? Vote someone who quit the game... That's worse than lurking IMO and I think I'm still more salty about that more than anything else this game.

The fact that you stayed in the game when your partners left taking all the boulder instead of rage-quitting too (and played reasonavely well is impressive. You have my respect Banana.

-vote Bananacucho

[BananaCucho]

The fact that you stayed in the game when your partners left taking all the boulder instead of rage-quitting too (and played reasonavely well is impressive. You have my respect Banana.

-vote Bananacucho

There's nothing impressive about finishing a game that you started.

What a stupid MVP vote. There should be an option to derep FM posts.

[Gyrlander]

There's nothing impressive about finishing a game that you started.

What a stupid MVP vote. There should be an option to derep FM posts.

No other player deserves it, sorry. You still can look for posts of mine and derep them.

[Calix]

No other player deserves it, sorry. You still can look for posts of mine and derep them.

MVP is a stupid participation trophy, nothing more.

You can just say "nobody deserves MVP" if you so insist on bringing it up.

[DarknessB]

No other player deserves it, sorry. You still can look for posts of mine and derep them.

MVP has no bearing on the ladder -- it's strictly a ceremonial thing that the players pick. If no one deserved it, you can vote no one.

[BananaCucho]

So how come we have 4 games going on at once before this game

But when its MZ's turn to host we only have 1, and halfway through only 2? Coincidence or naw?

[AIVION]

I have to agree with this.

I will not be voting. AIVION can if they want, but I will not.

Sure.

-vote SuperJack

For bringing us all together

[ThePaladin]

I think we really need to have a serious discussion about threatening to rulebreak(gamethrow,spam,etc.) and the punishment(if it should be punished) for it, even if it's a void threat.


Anyone Else Agree?

[DarknessB]

Sure.

-vote SuperJack

For bringing us all together

Just when I thought SuperJack had brought this thread to rock bottom with shitposting off topic stuff, a new contender has emerged!

[DarknessB]

I think we really need to have a serious discussion about threatening to rulebreak(gamethrow,spam,etc.) and the punishment(if it should be punished) for it, even if it's a void threat.


Anyone Else Agree?

A million times yes. I have started to encourage hosts to adopt a rule prohibiting attempted, threatened, or fake game-throws in their games as a starting point.

[ThePaladin]

-vote SuperJack

For being smart enough not to play.

[BananaCucho]

-vote SuperJack

For not being one of the following people:

PLZLEAVEDICKK
MattZed

[ThePaladin]

I think we really need to have a serious discussion about threatening to rulebreak(gamethrow,spam,etc.) and the punishment(if it should be punished) for it, even if it's a void threat.


Anyone Else Agree?

Also I think it would be nice if we made some sort of indicator that the host and/or mod has read up to a certain point to help players feel that host does care and is taking proper action. Like some sort of indicator by vote count or something. This Way Host doesn't ever have to confirm or deny the accusations.


Also I was Heth Ledger Joker

[Gyrlander]

-vote SuperJack

For not being one of the following people:

PLZLEAVEDICKK
MattZed

My fucking god I'm not there

-vote SuperJack

[ThePaladin]

Some Scum Want To Lynch Their Respective Chats and anon Chat?

Here's Dead Chat
www.quicktopic.com/52/H/2r4Py9X79Mvq

[DarknessB]

-vote SuperJack

For not being one of the following people:

PLZLEAVEDICKK
MattZed

I'm ok with SuperJack as a null MVP vote.

-vote SuperJack

[BananaCucho]

Also I was Heth Ledger Joker

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

-vote SuperJack

For not being one of the following people:

PLZLEAVEDICKK
MattZed

1) Im glad gyrlander is not on this list
2) throwing an mvp vote away is unfair to players who deserve it. (fatalis in this game)

Kind of a slap in the face to him to throw it away because you hated another player's play.

[BananaCucho]

1) Im glad gyrlander is not on this list
2) throwing an mvp vote away is unfair to players who deserve it. (fatalis in this game)

Kind of a slap in the face to him to throw it away because you hated another player's play.

Eat a dick, asshole.

[ThePaladin]

Is It possible for duck to somehow be the actual mvp by making us start to seriously scumhunt people after his stupid play in revealing multiple tprs?


The plot thickens....

[BananaCucho]

Is It possible for duck to somehow be the actual mvp by making us start to seriously scumhunt people after his stupid play in revealing multiple tprs?


The plot thickens....

If you fuck up yet it somehow works out, that's the fire briner effect. Not commendable.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Eat a dick, asshole.

Wtf no, you eat the dick. Why would I do such a thing?