MAFIA CONTEST - BIG PRIZE

[Cryptonic]

If you go troll, might as well go all the way:

Busdriver x12
SK x3

I prefer my games to start, and how would that setup cause this achieve?

[cxx]

What's your obsession with bus drivers? Witches are the roles you need.

[UltimaNecros]

Wat where are you getting your info?

pls include citations if you're going to shoot down an idea with "facts", otherwise it will just slow down any progress in figuring it out.

How about the fact that jailors drag you to a cell. So technically you vist the cell not any of the jailors. It HAS been stated that YOU have to VISIT people to get this cheevo, NOT meet people. Being visited by many people is a DIFFERENT achievement called mr.popular. All my info comes from basic common sense and information provided by Rev and other mods mostly within this very thread. I am sorry for assume you actually read anything in this thread and will not make the mistake again.

Also cxx i do believe it has been stated if 8 witches controls one person to 8 different houses 7 of the witches will get overrided. You need a combo of controls, redirects, paradoxes, and luck to get this cheevo. Along with a 70% troll save.

Also all BD's will not cause this cheevo because BD's dont make you visit more people they swap you which causes paradoxes which will help cause this cheevo.

[Tonex]

If you don't understand how it works, then all the better, more likelihood I get the achieve and not you . And before the game starts, I spam "This is a troll save, please leave if you don't want to get trolled." which usually filters out the haters.

[cxx]

[...]
Also cxx i do believe it has been stated if 8 witches controls one person to 8 different houses 7 of the witches will get overrided.
[...]

No, 8 of the witches will get overridden, so the respective target won't perform any night action. Despite that, I guess the target technically visits all of the 8 people.

[UltimaNecros]

No, 8 of the witches will get overridden, so the respective target won't perform any night action. Despite that, I guess the target technically visits all of the 8 people.

So the target just acts like a jester but visits everyone. Lol

[Cryptonic]

How about the fact that jailors drag you to a cell. So technically you vist the cell not any of the jailors. It HAS been stated that YOU have to VISIT people to get this cheevo, NOT meet people. Being visited by many people is a DIFFERENT achievement called mr.popular. All my info comes from basic common sense and information provided by Rev and other mods mostly within this very thread. I am sorry for assume you actually read anything in this thread and will not make the mistake again.

Also cxx i do believe it has been stated if 8 witches controls one person to 8 different houses 7 of the witches will get overrided. You need a combo of controls, redirects, paradoxes, and luck to get this cheevo. Along with a 70% troll save.

Also all BD's will not cause this cheevo because BD's dont make you visit more people they swap you which causes paradoxes which will help cause this cheevo.

LOL once again, please include some fucking quotes and citations, like:

It's actually the other way round. Jailing forces the jailee to visit the Jailor. Of course he won't be able to make use of his night action.
The notable exception is an execution. When executing the Jailor will actually visit his target.

I just played a game as agent. I noticed that the Godfather didn't say anything in the night chat. So I went to him to see if he got jailed. Interestingly (for me) I noticed that the Godfather visited somebody despite no kill command having been issued. My first though was that he may have been witched. But his target didn't die and the target claimed Jailor having jailed the Godfather. So the Jailor forced him to visit him.

maybe now you'll humble a bit and stop acting like you're so smart that you don't have to back up anything you say with actual evidence.

[Helz]

Sticky this?

[Squidypie]

Question
I'm not really sure how the game prioritizes
If 5 bus drivers bus player 3
And BG defends player 3, will BG block one of the bus secondary targets or all of them?
-Will a SK who visits someone in the visit chain (assuming it's a chain) be forced along it into the bg?

[UltimaNecros]

If you visit someone and 7 other players visit them, you are still visiting 1 person. You tested 8 people targeting 1 person and it didn't work, so that pretty much settles it to begin with.

Visiting has always meant targeting.

So visited someone is really just going to their house right? Well don't jailers technically detain their suspects at their house?

I know its possible to be jailed by more than one jailers at once, so wouldn't being jailed by 8 jailers technically be considered visiting all 8?

Just an idea...

Jailors TARGET YOU. not the other way around. notice i used a quote from you cryptonic. Either you were wrong cryptonic about what visting is or i am completely right in my claims. Again i apologize for assuming you had read anything in this thread, or anything you posted for that matter.

[Cryptonic]

Jailors TARGET YOU. not the other way around. notice i used a quote from you cryptonic. Either you were wrong cryptonic about what visting is or i am completely right in my claims. Again i apologize for assuming you had read anything in this thread, or anything you posted for that matter.

Did you not see the quotes I gave you... Obviously you're the one not reading if you could respond with what you just did...
When a Jailor jails someone, the Jailed target visits the Jailor (as seen by Agent targeting a jailed GF).

This isn't breaking the rule of Visiting=Targeting, it's an exception to the rule..

For your reading before you respond again: https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...-consider-home

[UltimaNecros]

I read it and i promise that it only APPEARS like that. If 8 jailor jail one man he WILL NOT get the cheevo.
I think he would get mr.popular however.
Someone should go test this. Or Rev should tell us what happens.

[Cryptonic]

I read it and i promise that it only APPEARS like that. If 8 jailor jail one man he WILL NOT get the cheevo.
I think he would get mr.popular however.
Someone should go test this. Or Rev should tell us what happens.

Exactly, someone should TEST it. I'm not saying you'd get the achievement, I'm saying don't say someone is wrong when you don't know 100% for a fact. When you shoot down ideas saying it won't work when you actually have no evidence to back it up, it will prevent people from trying things and evolving ideas.

[42shadow42]

Wait has this not been won yet?

[UltimaNecros]

Exactly, someone should TEST it. I'm not saying you'd get the achievement, I'm saying don't say someone is wrong when you don't know 100% for a fact. When you shoot down ideas saying it won't work when you actually have no evidence to back it up, it will prevent people from trying things and evolving ideas.

I said that "technically you dont visit jailor he visits you..." which is true/common sense. I also said "...you cant visit when roleblocked".
Which again is true.

You demanded evidence, you demanded sources and you started this little attack. Not once did you even suggest testing until now. I AM so smart and I DO know what im talking about. Its your choice to not test and to believe that quotes from other players which are NOT always 100% true/official to be absolute in everyway. Not a single quote you used is even from an offical source its from testing of others players which can be wrong. The only evidence one should believe is their own personal testing or quotes from Rev and mods.

Anyway what happens if:
A-BD
B-BD
C-BD

A swaps himself with b
B swaped with C
C swaps with A

It it possible to create a paradox where busdrivers run themselves over or run eachother over?
I think the key to this cheevo is exploring paradoxical situations.

[Tonex]

Those Bus Drivers work like this, the number is what you target, the letter is the result.

Start out with
A1 B2 C3

A swaps with B
B1 A2 C3

B swaps with C
B1 C2 A3

C swaps with A
A1 C2 B3

But the order of switches is based on how high up you are in the original game lobby.

[Cryptonic]

I said that "technically you dont visit jailor he visits you..." which is true/common sense. I also said "...you cant visit when roleblocked".
Which again is true.

You demanded evidence, you demanded sources and you started this little attack. Not once did you even suggest testing until now. I AM so smart and I DO know what im talking about. Its your choice to not test and to believe that quotes from other players which are NOT always 100% true/official to be absolute in everyway. Not a single quote you used is even from an offical source its from testing of others players which can be wrong. The only evidence one should believe is their own personal testing or quotes from Rev and mods.

I didn't start an attack, I asked you to include proof (ie a replay, proven mechanics) before you shoot down ideas. Then you responded with

I am sorry for assume you actually read anything in this thread and will not make the mistake again.

, which, you have to admit, is incredibly bitchy.
I'm saying that you don't really know what happens in the underlying mechanics (which is where this achievement will be got), and are just looking at the after effects.

Common sense is NOT going to get you this achievement.

For example, situations like these do NOT follow common sense, but it happens because of how role had to be coded: https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ight=Bodyguard

Once again, these are not attacks. You're getting defensive because I asked you to include proof to back up your words when you shoot down ideas. Did you ever consider what might happen if 8 Jailors jail an SK? No, you shot it down and prevented further discussion on the Jailor topic. Attitudes like yours will prevent this from being figured out.

[Tonex]

I didn't start an attack, I asked you to include proof (ie a replay, proven mechanics) before you shoot down ideas. Then you responded with , which, you have to admit, is incredibly bitchy.
I'm saying that you don't really know what happens in the underlying mechanics (which is where this achievement will be got), and are just looking at the after effects.

Common sense is NOT going to get you this achievement.

For example, situations like these do NOT follow common sense, but it happens because of how role had to be coded: https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ight=Bodyguard

Once again, these are not attacks. You're getting defensive because I asked you to include proof to back up your words when you shoot down ideas. Did you ever consider what might happen if 8 Jailors jail an SK? No, you shot it down and prevented further discussion on the Jailor topic. Attitudes like yours will prevent this from being figured out.

What does happen if 8 Jailors jail an SK and don't execute? They all die? It's more likely that only 1 dies that is randomly chosen.

[UltimaNecros]

What does happen if 8 Jailors jail an SK and don't execute? They all die? It's more likely that only 1 dies that is randomly chosen.

Most likely outcome- same as double roleblocking SK. jailor counts as a roleblock which is why sk kills.
Cryptonic Common sence and understand DO help if you have any idea of whats going on.
And the -9 rep you have given me isnt an attack? If you have to state "these are not attacks" then they are obviously attacks or easily taken as attacks.
You dont even dispute tonex's little explanation on BDs. No quotes in it, but it makes sense. instead you focus more on me instead of even paying attention to information that could potentially lead us to solving this cheevo.

The situation in that thread IS common sense- MM does not attack people he attacks their houses. Just like how bussing the MM's target doesn't change the house he goes to. I dont remember the thread that rev stated that but it was a long while ago iirc.

I still feel that its all about bd swaps and paradoxes because as Rev stated in this thread only BD visit more than one at a time.

Im not pulling the quote, im on my iPod so don't try starting more arguments on this crypt if you want it so badly read this thread.

Also if we All go test the same thing and its wrong as a whole we get NOWHERE.
If you think something is right go test it instead of attacking someone who thinks its wrong. And then post PROOF.
Meanwhile if other people test OTHER THEORIES we can make progress faster.

[Cryptonic]

Most likely outcome- same as double roleblocking SK. jailor counts as a roleblock which is why sk kills.
Cryptonic Common sence and understand DO help if you have any idea of whats going on.
And the -9 rep you have given me isnt an attack? If you have to state "these are not attacks" then they are obviously attacks or easily taken as attacks. W/e you keep on doing what ever it is people like you do.

The situation in that thread IS common sense- MM does not attack people he attacks their houses. Just like how bussing the MM's target doesn't change the house he goes to. I dont remember the thread that rev stated that but it was a long while ago iirc.

I still feel that its all about bd swaps and paradoxes because as Rev stated in this thread only BD visit more than one at a time.

Im not pulling the quote, im on my iPod so don't try starting more arguments on this crypt if you want it so badly read this thread.

Also if we All go test the same thing and its wrong as a whole we get NOWHERE.
If you think something is right go test it instead of attacking someone who thinks its wrong. And then post PROOF.
Meanwhile if other people test OTHER THEORIES we can make progress faster.

Lol I can only give you -5, the other -4 must've been from other members. Plus, I derepped you for the bitchy comment you said that I pointed out. I disapproved of such a shitty attitude, so I derepped it. Derepping is not an attack, or derepping wouldn't be allowed.

If me asking you not to shoot down ideas without proof is now attacking, then I don't know where to go from here. GL being stubborn in your life.

What does happen if 8 Jailors jail an SK and don't execute? They all die? It's more likely that only 1 dies that is randomly chosen.

I'm not sure what happens when that many Jailors jail. No one may die, but SK might still "visit" them all.

[UltimaNecros]

Most likely outcome- same as double roleblocking SK. jailor counts as a roleblock which is why sk kills.

I'm not sure what happens when that many Jailors jail. No one may die, but SK might still "visit" them all.

In a rare case where the Serial Killer is jailed, not executed and also role-blocked by an Escort or Consort will result in no role-block kill. This is a Bug the developers have decided to leave in.
Escort + Consort = no one dies
Escort + Jailor = no one dies
Jailor + Jailor = no one dies

Straight from the wiki. i was right. common sense ftw. all you need is a bit of common sense people.

[Voss]

you know guys, i don't think jailor is part of the secret to unlocking this achievement.

[Gyver]

you know guys, i don't think jailor is part of the secret to unlocking this achievement.

^^

[UltimaNecros]

Ive expressed twice that its about paradoxes.
Just out of curiosity if a jailor releases an SK and the BD swaps the jailor with someone does it cause the sk to kill the other guy or the jailor?

[Tonex]

you know guys, i don't think jailor is part of the secret to unlocking this achievement.

It's spam BDs and a few non-BDs.

[suicidaln00b]

thread theme

Priority order is Witches, Bus Drivers, then role-blockers (Escort or Consort). It then repeats that cycle a random number of times to deal with complicated webs of events and paradoxes.

enjoy ur RNG lol

ps:::::::i will get this achievement first bcuz i am okabe in real life

bye

[Friend of Trutles]

I think best idea is bg chain.

[UltimaNecros]

I think a BG visits you when you attack his target so i think a bg chain makes you get Mr.Popular but it is worth a try.

[louiswill]

"Originally Posted by this was probly alreay posted but i dont give af uck
Priority order is Witches, Bus Drivers, then role-blockers (Escort or Consort). It then repeats that cycle a random number of times to deal with complicated webs of events and paradoxes."


hmm was that me? D: I let someone else get the prize first awwwwwwwwwwwwww.....

[Dark.Revenant]

Nobody has the prize because nobody posted a replay.

[Helz]

So this contest is over?

[Dark.Revenant]

Ongoing. No replays were posted.

[louiswill]

escort suppose to act after witch, then a escort witch loophole doesn't really generate more visits

need better ideas....

[Espozito]

What if many witches manipulate a person to visit 8 different people? Could that work?
*Sorry if was already suggested*

[Apache]

maybe this works:

9 witches (1-9), one normal role like doc (x)
witch 1 gets the achievement

witch 1 action: witch 2 to witch 1
witch 2 action: x to witch 3
witch 3 action: x to witch 4
witch 4 action: x to witch 5
witch 5 action: x to witch 6
witch 6 action: x to witch 7
witch 7 action: x to witch 8
witch 8 action: x to witch 9
witch 9 action: -
x action: -

then we need to get very lucky so they witch exactly in that order from 1 to 9.
witch 1 will visit witch 2 because of her own action.
witch 2 will then target witch 1 meaning witch 1 will be witched to witch 3 now
so witch 3 will then target witch 1 too and witch 1 will visit witch 4 and so on

in the end witch 1 will have visited all other 8 witches

the difference to 8 witches just targeting someone is that it doesn't happen all at once but one after another, like a chain

what i'd like to know, in which order do all witches witch
and are we allowed to try it out by coordinating if we do not submit the replay? because how else should we figure out if our methods work? if that's not allowed we aren't even allowed to test what happens if 8 witches witch the same guy to different targets

[SYlum]

So I'm curious, what would happen if you had a beguiler chain?
Like Beguiler 1 hides behind Beguiler 2, so on until.
Beguiler 8 hides behind Beguiler 1 creating a Beguiler loop. Would a person visit all 8 beguilers until they eventually wrapped around to beguiler 1 or would it simply end at the second beguiler?

[Helz]

My money is on beguilers and bus drivers.

Player targets 1.
1 was bussed with 2 so Player visits 1 then 2.
1 is a beguiler that hid behind 2 so player goes back to 2 and then is redirected to 1.

if my understanding is correct this would be 4 visits. I think a bg could do the same as a beguiler as well. Maybe this situation would cause unlimited visits but I doubt it

[SamSparta]

I would think it's if an SK gets visited by 8 escorts?

[Helz]

I would think it's if an SK gets visited by 8 escorts?

Lol. I think that would do it but I do not think that is the most likely option...

[Helios]

Well its maybe the answer to this achievement but what happens if a player targets a other play that gets swapped from 2 busdrivers in 2 different directions?

Like 1 targets 2, 2 gets swapped from 7 and 8 with 3 and 4. Will 1 visit then 3 and 4 or only one of them?

Well if it goes so i know how to do it but it will still be a pain to get ppl to do it without coordinating them.

[rocco1233]

As far as im concerned, this is impossible

[MrJazzHands2]

Visit 8 people in one night?

So, umm..

Arsonist can't.

If, as said above, 8 witches forced a, let's say, sheriff to visit 8 different people at night, would that get the achievement?

Guess there's only one way to find out.


EDIT: Actually, I figured it out. Just have to make a save for it and hope a leave train doesn't occur when I start the game with this save, which will probably happen.

[Swansong]

I've been reading this thread and I think this contest is very interesting.

I have a general question about the game that could help me find the solution: How does the game behave when same roles do conflictual actions ?

For example:
Witch A controls player 1 on player 2.
Witch B controls player 1 on player 3.
Player 1 decides to target player 4.

Which witch has priority here ?
Is it randomly determined ?
Does this depend on the time the witches selected their actions ? (The "fastest" witch wins over the other witch ?)
Or is the action canceled and player 4 will be targeted ?

I don't believe player 1 would target BOTH player 2 and 3 in that case, it doesn't make any sense (that would mean some Godfather could kill 2 people in 1 night).


I also have the same question with 2 jailors jailing each others... What is the rule that determines which Jailor is jailed, and which jailor is jailing ?


Finally, I'd like to raise a point that I have read in the wiki in the "Mechanics" section:

"Target switches and role-blockers

Priority order is Witches, Bus Drivers, then role-blockers (Escort or Consort). It then repeats that cycle a random number of times to deal with complicated webs of events and paradoxes. "

Like Dark Revenant said earlier, I believe the key of this puzzle is in that paradoxal section, and since this point "repeats a random number of time" this is how you can get the multiple targets.

[Mugy]

I've been reading this thread and I think this contest is very interesting.

I have a general question about the game that could help me find the solution: How does the game behave when same roles do conflictual actions ?

For example:
Witch A controls player 1 on player 2.
Witch B controls player 1 on player 3.
Player 1 decides to target player 4.

Which witch has priority here ?
Is it randomly determined ?
Does this depend on the time the witches selected their actions ? (The "fastest" witch wins over the other witch ?)
Or is the action canceled and player 4 will be targeted ?

I don't believe player 1 would target BOTH player 2 and 3 in that case, it doesn't make any sense (that would mean some Godfather could kill 2 people in 1 night).


I also have the same question with 2 jailors jailing each others... What is the rule that determines which Jailor is jailed, and which jailor is jailing ?

The witch that comes first in the players list(not the list in-game but the players list at the beginning of the game).
Same for the jailor situation.

[Xentios]

I think 8 beguiler 1 vigi will do this

Also what is the logic behind agents? Dedective and lookout on the same target? Or dedective on his target and the visiters?

[SamSparta]

Has anyone actually tested the 8 witches theory yet?

[Cryptonic]

Has anyone actually tested the 8 witches theory yet?

Testing = Ban
You're not allowed to organize night actions for this, apparently D:

[kyle1234513]

Testing = Ban
You're not allowed to organize night actions for this, apparently D:

i thought the rule was you could do it and have the achievement, but you just couldn't enter it into the competition. and entering it into the competition would result in the ban, not just having the achievement.

[Cryptonic]

i thought the rule was you could do it and have the achievement, but you just couldn't enter it into the competition. and entering it into the competition would result in the ban, not just having the achievement.

Why would one ban for submitting it instead of just ignoring the submission?

It's said that any organization to achieve this is a bannable offense, probably due to the point value.

[ika]

organizing it while the competion is going on=ban

after someone gets it legitly, raptor wont care if you have organized ways. if im wrong he can correct me but i think thats what i remmeber after talking to him about it