S-FM 303: Summer 2020 (Newbie Game) - Page 12
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  1. ISO #551

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Unfortunately for him, there was no delete button. Only an edit button and so he changed it to a person he saw a suspicious. You know, the person who endorsed random lynching as part of his introduction.
    Yeah, nice theorycrafting, but it isn’t true. Hellstatis didn’t edit his vote on you to a vote on Grak. He edited it away to a “I’ll wait for a mentor” post and voted Grak quite a while later.

  2. ISO #552

  3. ISO #553

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    And Grakylan’s recent push on Hellstatis could of course be townie - his case is basically the same as my case. But it could also be a self-preservation motivated scum who thinks his best chance is pushing the person many see as a direct alternative to him.
    Well, there is a possiblity that Helltanis is scum. I think it comes down to a difference in perspective. A few of the things he has done could be naturally done even if he were a noob scum who was new to mafia. But those two different read attempts kinda rubs me on the side of town. For scum noobs, it may be simple and just try their best to copy everyone else (even their reads). Here, he's being a bit of a standout like Grakylan.

    Additionally, Grakylan says Helltanis is a headless chicken, like him. Okay. Then based on that they are both new to FM, who's more scummy? I feel Grakylan would be.

  4. ISO #554

    Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I’ll answer anyway.

    Whenever I contemplate a town Martin world the one thing that sticks in my craw the most is how his own play so perfectly matched what he described to be scum play.

    For most players I wouldn’t obsess over that. Townies say self-incriminating or thoughtless things all the time, because they aren’t self-aware. They don’t obsess over the way they post or think about how it looks the way scum do.

    But Martin is self-aware. He’s said it himself, and more importantly, he’s showed it repeatedly.

    It’s really hard for me to buy that this guy who obsesses over himself and how he comes across (but only because he’s anxious and egotistical! Honest!) just goes and matches what he describes as a scummy playstyle rather than a towny playstyle unless he’s actually experiencing the same pressures and drives that he says create that scummy play.

    But then, I think Zedus is scum and I don’t think they’re together, so I guess I have to buy Martin as town? But very very reluctantly.
    Every answer from any of you is very welcome, so thanks.

    I also believe Martin put so much effort toward the game and his last full ISO was really relevant and very close to my actual thoughts.
    I wouldnt vote for Zedus right now, he should survive the night. If he does so, we should really push him for his role since apparently he claimed being power.

    Atm I'm more between Grakylan and Zedus being the scum, will see later.

  5. ISO #555

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    But those two different read attempts kinda rubs me on the side of town. For scum noobs, it may be simple and just try their best to copy everyone else (even their reads). Here, he's being a bit of a standout like Grakylan.
    Well, i mean I feel these are more authentic than Grakylan's attempts for the town in light of the fact that he seems new to Mafia.

  6. ISO #556

  7. ISO #557

  8. ISO #558

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Yeah, nice theorycrafting, but it isn’t true. Hellstatis didn’t edit his vote on you to a vote on Grak. He edited it away to a “I’ll wait for a mentor” post and voted Grak quite a while later.
    Ah. I misremembered SJ's post. You're right. It was the mentor message.

  9. ISO #559

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    I haven't finished the ISO for Renegade, but based on what I saw on Helltanis and the fact that we have 2 votes on him, as compared to Grakylan, I felt it was important to post now.


    Here are my ISO analyses, they're only updated for posts up to post #505.

    This will be in alphabetical order (first to last: Awut, Ash Lael, Bakermir, Dallarian, Grakylan, Helltanis, Renegade)
    I wont be doing Zedus since his consistent tunneled attacks from mid day 1 of the Day 1 Phase on me makes bias against him rather impossible to avoid.

    I'm going to read ISO each as if I hadn't read their posts before, and I hope to gain insights that way.

    Spoiler : Auwt :

    His opening at #85 was completely fine, in my opinion. I believe a lot of what goes on between him and Dallarian early on is just friendly rivalry or nitpicking on each other.

    At #96 he responds to Helltanis and tells him about mentors.

    At #154 is his first read wall post. I feel (regardless of the fact that he noted that I perceived by him as very town at the time) he makes some valuable points in that post that goes beyond the reads. If he was scum, why share all those facts? Why not just stop at the reads? And, honestly, he does defend me quite a fair bit here, it would seem.

    Soon after at #156, he says this:

    I wonder if his opinion still holds up for this? I'm not going to comment if this is towny since obviously I would be potentially biased in saying so. Other townies will have to make that determination for me.

    At #218 Auwt followed up with Helltanis's point where Dallarian said "may the town win" and didn't include himself in that. I feel like thats more of a mistake originating from having English as a second language; don't forget he's active around Europe's time. That doesn't mean he's from the United Kingdom and knows english like from the back of his hand (though he does show quite some understanding of english). And considering Auwt seems know Dallarian prior to this game, it bothers me that Auwt follows up with the Helltanis point.

    At #222 Auwt insinuates that the votes on me for my SoD question feel like a random lynch.

    Roughly the same time he starts to butt heads with Ash Lael over difference of opinion over my question.

    At #257 is when he actually makes the first suggestion that goes against me, where he says he believes the only 2 possible scum combinations at that time are Zedus/bakermir and Dallarian/Martin. He then goes off for the day.

    He returns at #478, with a wall post. He explains and argues that it wouldn't be wise to kill or protect me tonight since quite clearly I'm a controversial figure within the game. He the colorizes his responses to Bakermir's big post and return since SoD1. He also states that (if I understand it correctly, I'm sorry if I don't) Bakermir having 50% null reads is evidence of why the question at start was needed, and therefore anything against it is scummy. He also responds to Bakermir saying that he's keeping an eye on me. (Hi Auwt!) He then states that he feels Grakylan is a powerless townie, since he has mentioned he was busy, but would very much like to see more from him if its possible. Auwt then proceeds to respond to several Zedus posts, and points out problems with them. He also explains that its possible that there may only be one scum in Bakermir/Zedus/Martin, or that Bakermir could be distancing if hes scum with Zedus (as he iterates that in the following posts)

    Conclusion: Unless Auwt is playing at a high level as scum, I doubt he is scum. Therefore, he's town. He has made contributions to the game that would seem unecessary for scum to do, especially in a mostly-noob game.


    Spoiler : Ash Lael :


    I like his opening for the sake that it does make him look town to me, but even if the question was hazardous, i still felt like it was worth something in terms of starting conversation/discussion. I just wish I didn't have to release the information about the question. It would've been harmless if everyone answered what power role they would've wished for. A player's answer to that would've been no different if they were a TPR, Citizen, or Scum if they had all answered it. It wouldn't have been power role indicative of anyone. However, we're way past that now so its mostly irrelevant to talk about now for the time being, unless we suspect Ash was scum.

    I do appreciate that he's the first to post his reads (after me) in the game. I really do. Its one of the best ways to help start discussion, and I continued discussion by stating my response and feelings to the read.

    He then later on also seems to fairly weigh the perceived chance that I am inexperienced (smart?) town, or just smart evil.

    I don't think he has ever been tunneling on me though, as in the coming posts he does another read and also occasionally questions other players.

    Over the course of his next posts, he continues to have problems with people answering my question, and then butts heads with Auwt for about 2 posts. As much as I might disagree with him, its clear he's consistent in what he thinks and thought. Its not like he was scum and questioned me to look town only to discard that once that was done. No, instead he held onto those thoughts. Upon reflection on this, i think I should've kept him as town locked on my last read. Only way to see this as scum is if he was a Scum who planned to get me lynched,and right now he's just waiting for the right moments. But I don't feel that's accurate.

    Then we get derailed by Zedus. I don't think I need to comment on this, after all Zedus was insulting everyone at times when he ascertained and/or implied intellectual superiority.

    He then gets tangled in my poorly worded explanation of the psychological effects of knowing who's who as a mafia, while not knowing who's who as a townie. Sorry for all the trouble im giving you Ash. I don't mean to agonize you lol.

    At #449, Ash starts suspecting Helltanis because of his recent posts, namely his reads list that seems to conflict with the situation day 1 (I.e. whether I or Zedus is scum or town) and the fact that he originally tried to vote me in an edited post. And since he vote Grakylan, Ash says this is the best argument for Grakylan being town.

    At the moment, he feels if he were to lynch anyone it would be Helltanis, Zedus, Grakylan, and Martin. But he would prefer to start with Zedus.

    Conclusion: While there are some things about him that can be argued to be scummy, I feel that he really holds onto his reads and ideas, while still being flexible to new ones. Probably a much better town than I, and this whole game has been a learning experience for me, especially since I've had 0 games until now. Definitely town.


    Spoiler : Bakermir :


    Bakermir enters the game, swiftly voting me. When asked by Ash as to why he voted, Bakemir just leaves it at this:




    I felt that was a very lacking answer, and stated that to him. He should've explained why what I wrote was bad. In response, he puts this:

    Im honestly not sure if im just judging him too harshly, considering this is a mostly noob game (myself included as a noob), or not. But i felt compared to how much Ash was questioning me, it felt like Bakermir could've gave a better initial explanation before the one above since voting to lynch (Well, trial, as he percieved it) is still a serious thing, even in the mod -Mafia-. Opportunistic? I don't know. I might be too biased for this section of the thread, and i hope other townies can make this judgement for me.

    At #120 his reads are made but i thought they were fairly basic, since they were based purely on whether someone is against or for me.

    He doesn't return until #247, and posts at #298.


    Now, I think I would normally call this scummy, but I think this is a rather reasonable rationale for a noob to follow. Problem is, so can a noob scum.

    Also, as I stated before in this thread, he mentions giving Auwt a pinch of salt for his agression, but he doesn't seem to give any sort of similar treatment for my early plays. I don't know if this is tunneling, or just acting scummy.

    Credit is where credit is due, he does catch me in a later post being inconsistent with my stated reads with regards to Grakylan. As I've explained later on in the thread, I realized that I tunneled thinking that Grak must be townie just because of a post I saw in a champs game, while completely missing that it took four minutes for Grakylan to think of his reads.

    I have issue with this:

    The problem i have with this is that when Auwt created that duo, he also created the Martin/Dallarian duo in the same post. This is just misleading.

    His #319 post about a "selfish" read is something I don't understand. How can reads be selfish?

    After #325 he starts inquiring about and interacting Zedus, along with Helltanis. I don't really see any problems unless Bakermir is scum here, which would implicate Zedus. The way I see it, it is as he says at #494 that he's trying to analyze everyone. Or at least the relevant people.

    Conclusion: He certainly could be town, given the circumstances of this game. But do I feel that way? Im not sure. There's definitely decent arguments as to why he may not be scum. Null read.


    Spoiler : Dallarian :

    His opening is friendly, and votes Auwt. I think considering certain posts by him and Auwt, it would seem they merely have a friendly rivalry.

    At #77 he starts defending me in the sense that he doesn't want an early lynch, and warns against the L-2 vote count, due to having 2 mafias.Keep in mind he wrote this only 8 hours in to a 48 hour day phase.

    Honestly, he gives me funky vibes and is sort of carefree. His messages, at least the early ones, can be easily be perceived mistakenly. Anyways, through his suggestion, I believe it can be obvious that he voted on Auwt for friendly reasons, but once Grakylan voted, Dallarian got information he wanted (which is Grak followed his vote without considering the basis for it).

    In response to Ash's facepalms about people answering my opening question, he typed this:

    I don't think it needs any comment or explanation. Lean town read, but my read will be subject to what he does later on (I.e. votes me anyways or if his reasoning for defending me changes or ect.).

    He later states this:

    I answered this later, but I believe he misinterpreted me. It was 4 votes, and then a hammer vote, that is needed to lynch someone.

    At #138, he clearly outlines why he defended me, and how that was regardless of my alignment. I do lean on town read for this.

    #157 are his first reads. He makes a paragraph about me, and says im very suspicious, supposedly because I was afraid of there being a different topic? hmm? I was stating the question so we could all have discussion. Having another topic would have been fine so long as it yielded information. But in a mostly noob game I felt like I had to take the lead and risk here by doing a question first, despite how easy it might be for scum to attack me for it. I have no other issues with this post though. I can't see any scummy part to it other than he doesn't seem have a progression of that suspicion that I am scummy.

    At #201 he mentions English as a second language.

    #218 is a bit interesting, upon reflection:

    It would appear at first he's defending me, but it seems like he's actually just accusing Zedus of being more scummy than me/others. He continues on this at #237 by stating more players voted (me) Martin up and faster than players who are voting Zedus.

    Here, at #437, he seems to have completely dropped the "Martin is suspicious" idea. In the following posts, he defends me and himself against Zedus.

    At #500, he posts his updated reads. I agree with most of it, except for the read that Ash Lael is null. But for some reason he suggests an Auwt / Martin scum combo? He says we cooperate well together. But how can that be when Auwt made a post suggesting a Dallarian/Martin team? Is this related to their rivalry, or alignment indicative, or simply townie paranoia? I don't know. His reads may be a bit hedge-y, but as he's warned multiple times, he's short of time as of late. At least he contributes more than Grakylan and Helltanis, in my opinion.

    Conclusion: For what it's worth, I might town-lean this one if I were to compare him to other ISO's. Otherwise, he's a bit null for me. But considering that I don't really have any good ideas as to who he could be teamed with, other than Grak possibly (for the voting earlier), i have to say town lean here.


    Spoiler : Grakylan :


    Warning bells, anyone? Especially considering that Zedus didn't react to this at all?

    At #74 he starts attacking me for my responses to Ash's question, namely the one about what brought me to FM. He attacks me for mentioning my depression of which quite clearly has to relation to the game??? I mean, i could've denied giving Ash an answer but I did because I didn't see any reason not to. If it were up to me, I'd say he didn't seem to have a clear-cut understanding of the situation here, nor the arguments


    This is the last post he made before his first disappearance. That second line suggests he had the time or was going to be active for the next few hours, in my opinion.

    All he had to say was that he was busy. But then he adds this later on:


    #219 is a post with reads, that was made within four minutes of his last post. Looks like he might be trying to bus his teammate, based on the read and if Grak + Zedus is scum.

    Oh hey look Grak is here as im typing up this ISO read list.

    Conclusion: Very suspicious. I still can barely believe I tunneled this guy as town over a reads list. If Zedus is scum, or Grak is, I wont be surprised if the other is too.


    Spoiler : Helltanis :

    His introduction seems to suggest he's new to the idea of Mafia. As in, he's not from the mod. He asked if "we all have 1 life from bad guy attacks" and etc. Unless he was suggesting Citizens can have vest or not, which in this case might be him unknowingly soft claiming citizen.

    At #190 he initally tries to vote me, but then edits it to Grakylan.

    Based on his mentioning of being "summoned", i suspect he's related to Dallarian in some way, at least outside of this game. Even mentions Dallarian in his next post, and jokes if he felt suspicious yet.

    I think he might be an honest new player making the best effort he can to contribute. His first reads at #438 are presented in a unique way, showing scum and town arguments. Why would a scum do this when they could've made reads like everyone else and try to blend in?

    He's also asking if there's questions for him at #444. At #446 he makes reads just like the rest of players do, but he doesn't seem certain of whether to town lean or scum lean people. A lot of Null.

    Conclusion: I honestly believe here that Helltanis is the powerless townie, as Auwt put Grakylan as. It just matches with so many of his posts that he's not familiar with Mafia. He also tries to contribute more than Grakylan, is responsive. At #181 I mentioned him to ask for his thoughts, and he quickly responded.
    I’m still reading this (up to your bakermir iso so far), but I just have to stop and say, damn, this is a hell of an effort post. I know you’ve been effortposting all game but this is next level.

  10. ISO #560

  11. ISO #561

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Auwt View Post
    For now I will hold to my oldest read.
    Since I'm waiting for Zedus to possibly make a claim EOD1/SOD2,
    And Helltanis/Grakylan seem to be either citizen or hiding behind null reads (alongside with bakermir)

    -vote bakermir
    I'm curious as to whether you intend to go the full way with this, or to investigate. But I kinda feel I've been a bit biased against Bakermir for being new to FM. I probably would hesitate to lynch him on Day 1.

  12. ISO #562

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    From Martin’s ISO on Auwt:

    But for some reason he suggests an Auwt / Martin scum combo? He says we cooperate well together. But how can that be when Auwt made a post suggesting a Dallarian/Martin team?
    I definitely wouldn’t rule out an Auwt/Martin team on that basis. Could easily just be distancing. Auwt hasn’t gone for the kind of really hard push on Martin trying to get him lynched that would make such a pairing difficult to believe.

  13. ISO #563

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Auwt View Post
    For now I will hold to my oldest read.
    Since I'm waiting for Zedus to possibly make a claim EOD1/SOD2,
    And Helltanis/Grakylan seem to be either citizen or hiding behind null reads (alongside with bakermir)

    -vote bakermir
    Wait, WTF?

    Two posts ago you said it was between Zedus and Grakylan and now you post this?

    How did you suddenly drop your top two scum reads for a third option with none of them posting anything new in that time?

  14. ISO #564

    Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    From Martin’s ISO on Auwt:



    I definitely wouldn’t rule out an Auwt/Martin team on that basis. Could easily just be distancing. Auwt hasn’t gone for the kind of really hard push on Martin trying to get him lynched that would make such a pairing difficult to believe.
    At this point I used the sentence "I'm defending Martin", but the truth is, I didnt intend to really defend him.
    I just thought that bakermir and Zedus were voting Martin for really weak reasons and very early on (first and second post from respectively bakermir and Zedus).

    I do not consider to be possible to come, and at the same time vote someone.

  15. ISO #565

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    From Martin’s ISO on Auwt:

    I definitely wouldn’t rule out an Auwt/Martin team on that basis. Could easily just be distancing. Auwt hasn’t gone for the kind of really hard push on Martin trying to get him lynched that would make such a pairing difficult to believe.
    Fair enough. However, mafia don't have access to a day chat, so it must be some play on Auwt's end, if we were to imagine I and him as mafia. I personally haven't pressed him at all because I haven't found anything wrong with his posts other than the nitpicking at Dallarian and saying he was "aggressive".

  16. ISO #566

    Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Wait, WTF?

    Two posts ago you said it was between Zedus and Grakylan and now you post this?

    How did you suddenly drop your top two scum reads for a third option with none of them posting anything new in that time?
    Bakermir has always been on my scum list along side with Zedus.
    Zedus convinced me a bit (but not too much still), and I already said, he claimed power, I wouldnt take risk lynching him right now, unless big failure happen from now on to EOD1.
    So last call is Grakylan.

    Between Grakylan and Bakermir, this is a tough spot, but I told you earlier that Grakylan is sending powerless bored Citizen play.
    I wouldn't see a scum comming in the game and say : "I will do as always in the mod, randoming" (idrc if it was said like this, but thats the way i perceived it)

    Leaving only Bakermir.

  17. ISO #567

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    A bit offtop.

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    His introduction seems to suggest he's new to the idea of Mafia.
    Feel trolled.
    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    So, yes. I think Helltanis is being a powerless townie. Not by choice, though. Dallarian summoned him probably from another game or off the interweebs.
    My main in RPG games usually is Summoner.

    @Ash Lael
    That's consistent of Auwt to vote on bakermir.

  18. ISO #568

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Wait, WTF?

    Two posts ago you said it was between Zedus and Grakylan and now you post this?

    How did you suddenly drop your top two scum reads for a third option with none of them posting anything new in that time?
    I don't think he was necessarily being inconsistent here. He was asking my opinion on bakemir a few pages ago, suggesting bakermir is indeed on his radar.

  19. ISO #569

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    I don't think he was necessarily being inconsistent here. He was asking my opinion on bakemir a few pages ago, suggesting bakermir is indeed on his radar.
    I've long had an excel sheet with a chart noting people's reads. Awut has been suspecting Bakermir since #150, or even earlier.

  20. ISO #570

    Re: Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Auwt View Post
    Bakermir has always been on my scum list along side with Zedus.
    Zedus convinced me a bit (but not too much still), and I already said, he claimed power, I wouldnt take risk lynching him right now, unless big failure happen from now on.
    I want to summon the spirit of JaggedJimmyJay to tell you how cowardly and weak this is.

    Any scum on the block could claim power role to avoid a lynch. Why wouldn’t they, if they are going to die anyway?

    If you just automatically respect that claim, you are guaranteeing a town mislynch. To catch scum we need to have the courage and conviction to stare through lies and see the truth.

  21. ISO #571

    Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    I don't think he was necessarily being inconsistent here. He was asking my opinion on bakemir a few pages ago, suggesting bakermir is indeed on his radar.
    Yeah I’m aware that he’s been dissing bakemir for a while. That’s not my issue. My issue is that he had seemingly progressed from that and had explicitly been weighing up two other players. Then bam, that gets discarded for no clear reason.

    As town it’s fine to change your mind. We all get stuff wrong, hopefully we all reassess. But it’s important to explain your thought processes.

    If Auwt was still considering bakermir why didn’t he list him with Zedus/Grakylan when he made that post? If he had genuinely moved on from that read, what has prompted him to suddenly move back? He needs to explain these things so we can assess if they are genuine towny thought processes.

  22. ISO #572

  23. ISO #573

  24. ISO #574

    Re: Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Yeah I’m aware that he’s been dissing bakemir for a while. That’s not my issue. My issue is that he had seemingly progressed from that and had explicitly been weighing up two other players. Then bam, that gets discarded for no clear reason.

    As town it’s fine to change your mind. We all get stuff wrong, hopefully we all reassess. But it’s important to explain your thought processes.

    If Auwt was still considering bakermir why didn’t he list him with Zedus/Grakylan when he made that post? If he had genuinely moved on from that read, what has prompted him to suddenly move back? He needs to explain these things so we can assess if they are genuine towny thought processes.
    I would have to second this. As much as I might be okay with lynching bakermir. I just cant feel confident (with my possible bias) in lynching him unless there's good reasons to do so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Auwt View Post
    I wouldn't see a scum comming in the game and say : "I will do as always in the mod, randoming" (idrc if it was said like this, but thats the way i perceived it)
    However, I do acknowledge this as a good point.

  25. ISO #575

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    For the record, bakermir is and remains my strongest town read and he has been ever since like page 2. I’m comfortable with the idea of Renegade/Dallarian/Auwt being town but I’m confident in bakermir. There’s no hidden agenda with this guy. He’s out to catch scum.

    Yeah he’s been a bit tunelly on Martin, but townies tunnel! If anything that’s more Town indicative than otherwise.

  26. ISO #576

  27. ISO #577

    Re : Re: Re : S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Yeah I’m aware that he’s been dissing bakemir for a while. That’s not my issue. My issue is that he had seemingly progressed from that and had explicitly been weighing up two other players. Then bam, that gets discarded for no clear reason.

    As town it’s fine to change your mind. We all get stuff wrong, hopefully we all reassess. But it’s important to explain your thought processes.

    If Auwt was still considering bakermir why didn’t he list him with Zedus/Grakylan when he made that post? If he had genuinely moved on from that read, what has prompted him to suddenly move back? He needs to explain these things so we can assess if they are genuine towny thought processes.
    Be sure that my guess have still been on Bakermir for very long, I just wanted to make sure nothing goes off my mind from Grakylan and Zedus
    I have asked many people on their thought on bakermir, and so I believed I just had to clarify Grakylan/Zedus position before doing so.

  28. ISO #578

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    For the record, bakermir is and remains my strongest town read and he has been ever since like page 2. I’m comfortable with the idea of Renegade/Dallarian/Auwt being town but I’m confident in bakermir. There’s no hidden agenda with this guy. He’s out to catch scum.

    Yeah he’s been a bit tunelly on Martin, but townies tunnel! If anything that’s more Town indicative than otherwise.
    Not to mention its a bit unfair to accuse Bakermir at this time instead of last night, but then again Zedus did derail our conversations and discussions at that time to be on him and not Bakermir.

  29. ISO #579

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Here's another question I think we should consider:

    If there is some consensus on Bakermir being scum, while others may be deemed more suspicious than other players, then why can't we just put Bakermir's "trial" until the next lynch?

  30. ISO #580

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    What we know for sure about Zedus is that he is not one of 9 possible roles in this game. He is one of 5, 2 of those being scum, because he has ruled himself out of the 4 natural Citizen roles.

    If you are reading anyone else as a town power role, that should narrow the non-scum possibilities for Zedus further still.

  31. ISO #581

  32. ISO #582

  33. ISO #583

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    Ash - I might suggesting placing a vote. Day is going to end in around 3 hours and I think the EU folks are going to be sleeping soon.
    I’m intending to be here right until end of day. I’ve made my position and preferences clear. I want a Zedus lynch first and foremost but I’ll go for any of my four suspects that is most viable.

    At the moment we have some very splintered votes and we need to coalesce.

  34. ISO #584

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    I guess what I'm saying is, if we're going to lynch, and we all want to lynch someone, then why shouldn't we lynch Zedus (or anyone else if there's better consensus) and then put Bakermir under the microscope the next day phase?
    This is also fair. I have no objection to the guy being interrogated - I could be wrong about him, after all. But lynching him today just seems like a losing play to me.

  35. ISO #585

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    I’m intending to be here right until end of day. I’ve made my position and preferences clear. I want a Zedus lynch first and foremost but I’ll go for any of my four suspects that is most viable.

    At the moment we have some very splintered votes and we need to coalesce.
    Well, I am also feel good about a Zedus lynch. So time to coalesce I suppose.

    -unvote

  36. ISO #586

  37. ISO #587

  38. ISO #588

  39. ISO #589

  40. ISO #590

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Based on what I've noted from the last reads of everyone, we either have the largest consensus on Zedus or Grakylan.

    Renegade has null'ed Zedus, but scum-lean'ed Grakylan.

    Ash Lael, on his last read at #249 (before the Zedus debacle) had Grakylan as his strongest scum read.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, the only published reads list of Auwt is back at #150.

    Auwt had Grakylan as town-lean, while having Zedus Scum-lean

    Dallarian has Zedus as his biggest scum read at #500, and suspected Grakylan.

    I would go for either a Grakylan or Zedus lynch. Preferably Grakylan.

    But Zedus did scum read Grakylan at #507.

    Helltanis null'ed preety much everyone but two. Dont know if he would even vote.

    Bakermir had Zedus at town-lean, and Grakylan at null. (This is from #120...waaay back)

  41. ISO #591

  42. ISO #592

  43. ISO #593

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Based on what I've noted from the last reads of everyone, we either have the largest consensus on Zedus or Grakylan.

    Renegade has null'ed Zedus, but scum-lean'ed Grakylan.

    Ash Lael, on his last read at #249 (before the Zedus debacle) had Grakylan as his strongest scum read.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, the only published reads list of Auwt is back at #150.

    Auwt had Grakylan as town-lean, while having Zedus Scum-lean

    Dallarian has Zedus as his biggest scum read at #500, and suspected Grakylan.

    I would go for either a Grakylan or Zedus lynch. Preferably Grakylan.

    But Zedus did scum read Grakylan at #507.

    Helltanis null'ed preety much everyone but two. Dont know if he would even vote.

    Bakermir had Zedus at town-lean, and Grakylan at null. (This is from #120...waaay back)
    By the looks of it, even though no body really favoured Grak in a positive manner, Zedus is more "popular".

  44. ISO #594

  45. ISO #595

  46. ISO #596

  47. ISO #597

    Re: S-FM Summer 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    I nulled him initially but after my post with the 4 zedus scenarios it seems MOST likely he is scum to me. His play doesn't make sense as town.
    What if this "sense" is beyond your understanding, cause you can't think a few steps forward? Do you admit that you understand the game worse than you think?

  48. ISO #598

  49. ISO #599

  50. ISO #600

 

 

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