S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

[deathworlds]

Spoiler : Large text :

Quite happy to see Zeus gone, am content with Boba and MM for elimination purposes, not happy with Seanzie dead but makes perfect sense for scum to eliminate him.
Given the number of deaths, there seem to be quite some killer cards out there.

I chose to end the day early for following reasons:
1. I did not like where the ITA plan was going. Multiple individuals, including myself, expressed the limited time in those last 12 hours (due to sleep).
2. Multiple people (some of them scum, surely, like Pao himself) wanted to shoot however they pleased.
3. DoctorZeus expressed planning to shoot me and keeps tunnelling me for whatever reason.
4. As I said earlier, I wanted us to gain information about N1 developments before performing mass shootings.
5. I wanted to buy us time to think, not only about Pao's flip but also how to improve our ITA strategy D2. The sleep consideration will remain a concern, I had considered setting alarms as needed during the night, but my previous FM game took a toll on my health as it is, I can't let games do this to me.
6. Things are never 100%, I was comfortable with Pao lynch/shot/kill (one of my scum suspects, just not 100%), but if he flipped town, I had fear that folks would go after me next as I was the 2nd train (I do recognize this may have been a premature thought as I had some good backing from others whose votes were already on Pao and they probably wouldnt have asked for me to be the 2nd ITA victim, but concern #2 still applied). I went for an option that was closer to 100% to save myself at this time (Town, as known to me) as opposed to rolling dice with madmen(or women) shooting or folks going on the basis of votes (I had 2nd highest). My main fear there was that maybe I would die for being the last 5th voter on Pao (some cards result in death of the hammering vote), but I escaped that possibility. I do recognize that shooting outside of agreements would look scummy and give us good scum-reads, but I am pretty sure we have Townies also not wanting to follow through, so I don't believe ITA mechanic alone would have pinpointed all the scum. In short, I believe buying us more time is reasonable, we can still do our magic D2, albeit with fewer players remaining, but I am happy that we have 1 fewer mafioso remaining.
7. Not a reason for my action, but a nice outcome. I am pretty sure that other NA-based players on our Town team appreciated the extra time and sleep

I fully expect HK and his dislike of me to evolve into "both Pao and PQR were scum and PQR hammered early to avoid more damage". I do see it is a plausible scenario (which I, myself, know not to be the case), but I am also wary of Scum who know they didn't hammer (I did) shading the hammering player today.

Double jeopardy time.

Okay I may not still like nor agree with your thought proccesses but they seem consistent so far. I'm going to start putting you tentatively in the town box for now. At least it's good to know where the early end of day came from, not that I like having days end early.

So scenarios are:
1. Message was sent by Town with their genuine views. Zeus has flipped 3P so that's a nothingburger. Mesk/oliver is also in my notes as a potential suspect partner to Pao, but would they really both vote up MM (2 scum and only 2 scum voting MM who is now known to be town)? For Gikkle, I noted they voted Pao early on "without explanation" (I think Pao's words, as I put quotes in my notes). Possible bussing.
2. Message was sent by Pao's scum partner intended to induce a mislynch/misshot.

I don't quite understand point 2 in your post there, but here are my notes for deathworlds.
Deathworlds. Was one of my top townreads earlier. Pao made an incorrect statement about Deathworlds voting MM, deathworlds was first to catch it and point it out. Can that be bussing? I don't think so, I think deathworlds is town still (not 100% ofc). Pao gave them a -1 pt for DW's statement that someone acting uncharacteristically smart could be a sign of getting coached by their team (something I also suggested). I tend to think both DW and I were correct in that regard! But I did find it surprising that deathworlds insisted on voting me, so I need to be aware of the possibility that this was to form a CW to save Pao.

I was voting you at the time because I was in a classic deathtunnel I think, saw some things about your slot I did not like at all and focused on them, water under the bridge. At least I'm still apart of your "towncore"

in retrospect bus drivering Seanzie with someone else was probably not the brightest idea I could have done

because I cant tell if I got blocked or if the person switched with Seanzie was targeted for an NK

the former would be less interesting yet possible but the latter would be more interesting to know if that were the case

did anyone use a protective action on Seanzie last night?

Seanzie and Gikkle? Seems like an okay swap I guess?
Seanzie was a top town read of mine and pretty universally town read, Gikkle (from my perspective) would've been an easy TK or town investigative shot.

IIRC there's only 2 : Lag's Own Risk and Once Upon a Town in the West, which was his very first.
I also TR him D1, but the hammer i have trouble explaining myself. The hollow/PQR thingy going so smoothly makes my spine shiver, idk i feel weird about it.
On the other hand, PQR was extremely survival-oriented in the Politico game too, so i guess that makes sense, after all...

I was going to quote this to note that PQ was in lag's game and completely trounced us, but I guess I just missed that in my quick read of the thread.

So now I really have little to hide I think with double elimination via voting, we gain some control for the scenario in which ITA deaths are not immediate flips. That is to say, we could choose to skip ITA altogether and anyone who shoots is a violator that gets lynched. And we just focus on our 2 lynches today.

Someone has a LOT of lynch manipulation mechanics, early lynch and a double elimination? Hot damn, that could be a very useful set for scum that was confident in their ability to manipulate town and potentially bus their weaker scum mate, but that's a bit of a tin-foil theory.

i dont
and i dont fcking care what info you will get from this
i think i have the game solved
BUT ONLY IF YOU DONT POST the great chinesese wall of text again. i have 500mb of screenshots i will have to put into a text. God will help me, i hope.

I don't really like this slot already, but I am interested in what you have to say.

i voted mm?=
and i have a case on deathworlds.

Please tell us more about the case so that I can poke holes in it, I'd love to see you try, unless you're actually town, in which case just shut up.

I hate all this shit. Why did all of you use actions? I just get bonus shit for winning. I sacrificed a protective card to get cooler shit when I win.

We better fucking win guys. I will mald if we lose after that day 1 hard ass read.

You get bonus shit from winning? I uh, guess that could be a card, although I can see why you would use it from a town perspective since we actually got scum on d1 which was a major win for town.

You really think loldebite could be scum here after day 1? Justify that for me.

Why is deathworlds so high up on your list?

loldebite is a pretty solid town read for me as well.

FMPOV loldebite and I have the exact same views on everything right now and should be treated as equal.

I liked deathworlds on day 1 but I have an awful vibe about them now that I can’t quite place. I wish I had the time to go back and figure out what it was.

If you could clarify that whatever that awful vibe about me is I could try and help you get over it, that is if that vibe is still there.

-vote Oliverz144

Also now that I've thought about it more the very fact that Gikkle KNEW it was him who I bussed, that confirms I wasn't blocked and very likely Gikkle was an NK target

so unless someone wants to own up to shooting Gikkle I suggest we treat the Seanzie/Gikkle attack as being done by mafia

I really don't see the pov where scum shoots gikkle, shooting seanzie, maybe, but not gikkle, I think scum would leave Gikkle alone since they were a somewhat hot topic yesterday.

The alternative is that mafia killed Boba or MM, both of whom were suspected (In the case of MM, he was one of the top wagons).

I'll just straight up disregard the possibility mafia killed Boba. If MM was killed by mafia, why?

MM being killed by mafia seems so outlandish to me, they were a lurker slot and lurking!MM = scum!MM, except in this case I guess.

I should elaborate, I chose my kill at night.

Did you kill someone last night?

Or Martin is scum, used bus driver to get around any protectives, and told us about the bus drive for town points.

I guess?

Abilities are NAI in this game, much like KRC or some bastard games. I think the honesty gets some points from me for now, although I am still somewhat suspicious of Martin since I'd expect them to be a bit more solvy this game.

I think Hollowkatt and SB16 are could have been bussing Paopan with the intention that they felt he would likely not survive ITA shenanigans. If the goal was to be on the correct side of a dead mafia!paopan, placing their votes on him with under an hour before ITAs were unlocked would be a good way to do it. In a way, I guess the result could be the same since PQR ended the day early- they look like they're on the correct side of the lynch. Paopan has encouraged teammates to bus him on multiple occasions and SB16/HK are pretty good at bussing. Even if neither of these suspicions are true, I can't really give credit to anyone who was on that wagon except for PQR but I still feel like that's the best place to lynch.

Who would you give town credit to then? Who are your town reads, your scum reads? Clarify in a list, preferably with colors to make it easier to read.

If you're talking about my kill, I submitted my kill action that will occur at the end of the day when a ICBM will land on somebody's head. The player will be taken-aback by the sheer concussive force of the large object hitting them and they'll be stammer around confused. As the bomb slowly rolls to the other end of the room, the player will reflect briefly about their favorite ride in Disney World. After a few seconds the nuclear bomb will detonate. I have the nuclear codes to de-activate it.

Is this a role-block/black mail + kill? Seems a bit goofy to me, less cryptic nonesense and more mechanics please!

I should clarify this, I do not think PQR is Mafia. The "best place to lynch" is HK/SB.

Probably should have used 'so' instead of 'but'.

I'd be okay with an hk lynch I think, I'd have to reread them to see if I like what they say.

Jeeze, that's like a way to make me immediately not interesting in digging through people's ISO; I'm allergic to BD stuff.

Town!DW on the other hand might have fun figuring all that shit out.

Seems simple.

Martin claims to have swapped gikkle and seanzie.
All actions that would've affected seanzie would've affected gikkle and vice versa

When analyzing what happened to each slot one would work from the perspective that their intended target was the other.
Gikkle is alive and well.
Seanzie is not, seanzie is very much dead.

There where three kills, Seanzie/Gikkle, MM, and Boba Fett.
Boba was shot by bradland, which makes sense from a town!pov on n1.
MM was killed by something or someone, which really confuses me.
Seanzie is dead, but was swapped with Gikkle, so unless someone used a brute attack to directly kill Seanzie, they meant to kill Gikkle, which doesn't really make sense from a scum!pov to me, neither does killing Gikkle from a town!pov. I think the only real possibility is strongman/brute/unblockable attack on Seanzie, considering they were a universal town read and likely would've had protections on them. OR Martin is lying about the bus entirely, unless BD gives feedback which Gikkle I think claimed did not.

Who killed MM and why? This is really going to bother me and something I chew on for a while.

Speaking of DW, I'm kind of surprised "Mr. Mechanix" isn't on yet.

I slept in, also I do not appreciate the offloading of mental work on me, not cool dude.

--
Just going through my list.

I will accept Loldebite's affirmation that he is town.

I'm wondering if Bradland's outbursts come from town though. Probably, right?

I think those are both pretty safe town reads.

Takumi feels like townie even being wrong af on me

townie bucket:
gikkle - functionally confirmed via bus drive between him and senzie
hk - obvs I'm putting myself here
takumi - does not feel like they're posting with an agenda. thoughts seem somewhat straightforward to arrive at even if I disagree with the destination
PQR - pure af tone and oozes town
loldebite - posting strong today, like their angles, like their "just say shit" takes.

How is gikkle "functionally confirmed"? I don't think anyone is mechanically confirmed in a setup where you bring your own abilities.

leaning townie bucket:
martin? - I liked them early in the day D1 and nothing they've said here sticks out as super wolfy. ? is for the bus drive though, like why gikkle to seanzie?
SB16? - Todays posting is pretty good, I liked some of the questioning they've done


basically leaves me at:
oliverz - Maybe swap here for martin, don't really have a good reason for them to be POE other than they're less town than the aboves basically.
deathworlds - who?
bradland - have they even posted?

basically I know nothing about death and brad so they're poe by default. nothing they've said sticks out to me which is generally indicative of wolves sliding under the radar.

as a poe...

I have done nothing but stay under the radar, I may not have interacted with you a whole lot on D1 but I am pretty consistently a top poster in whatever game I am in, fuck outta here with that.

I'd have to read martins ISO but I don't recall him expressing a strong town read on gikkle headed into the end of the day. Flips I guess could have changed that given that gikkle was early on Paopan and really didn't seem to waiver.

Thanks for the reminder to reread martin, I'm still chewing on the fact that the claimed bussing was Gikkle and Seanzie, seanzie makes sense but bussing Gikkle seems like a recipe for investigatives to fuck up

I can shoot after a wolf flip.

Here is the wolf flip shooting claim, also previously a claim that they shot boba, which I think makes sense from a town pov
What a weird win-more card to have.

[deathworlds]

Glad to see you didn't get day killed by the time you got back SB.

[Stealthbomber16]

There are 2 scum left. Just expected a little world building from you. Is my theory equally as absurd to you if I accused only HK of it?

Slightly less because HK didn’t build a train on a scum from scratch.

[Stealthbomber16]

There are 2 scum left. Just expected a little world building from you. Is my theory equally as absurd to you if I accused only HK of it?

I have literally been driving since 20 minutes after SoD.

[deathworlds]

Spoiler : Large text :

Okay I may not still like nor agree with your thought proccesses but they seem consistent so far. I'm going to start putting you tentatively in the town box for now. At least it's good to know where the early end of day came from, not that I like having days end early.


I was voting you at the time because I was in a classic deathtunnel I think, saw some things about your slot I did not like at all and focused on them, water under the bridge. At least I'm still apart of your "towncore"



Seanzie and Gikkle? Seems like an okay swap I guess?
Seanzie was a top town read of mine and pretty universally town read, Gikkle (from my perspective) would've been an easy TK or town investigative shot.


I was going to quote this to note that PQ was in lag's game and completely trounced us, but I guess I just missed that in my quick read of the thread.



Someone has a LOT of lynch manipulation mechanics, early lynch and a double elimination? Hot damn, that could be a very useful set for scum that was confident in their ability to manipulate town and potentially bus their weaker scum mate, but that's a bit of a tin-foil theory.



I don't really like this slot already, but I am interested in what you have to say.



Please tell us more about the case so that I can poke holes in it, I'd love to see you try, unless you're actually town, in which case just shut up.



You get bonus shit from winning? I uh, guess that could be a card, although I can see why you would use it from a town perspective since we actually got scum on d1 which was a major win for town.



loldebite is a pretty solid town read for me as well.



If you could clarify that whatever that awful vibe about me is I could try and help you get over it, that is if that vibe is still there.



I really don't see the pov where scum shoots gikkle, shooting seanzie, maybe, but not gikkle, I think scum would leave Gikkle alone since they were a somewhat hot topic yesterday.



MM being killed by mafia seems so outlandish to me, they were a lurker slot and lurking!MM = scum!MM, except in this case I guess.



Did you kill someone last night?



I guess?

Abilities are NAI in this game, much like KRC or some bastard games. I think the honesty gets some points from me for now, although I am still somewhat suspicious of Martin since I'd expect them to be a bit more solvy this game.



Who would you give town credit to then? Who are your town reads, your scum reads? Clarify in a list, preferably with colors to make it easier to read.



Is this a role-block/black mail + kill? Seems a bit goofy to me, less cryptic nonesense and more mechanics please!



I'd be okay with an hk lynch I think, I'd have to reread them to see if I like what they say.



Seems simple.

Martin claims to have swapped gikkle and seanzie.
All actions that would've affected seanzie would've affected gikkle and vice versa

When analyzing what happened to each slot one would work from the perspective that their intended target was the other.
Gikkle is alive and well.
Seanzie is not, seanzie is very much dead.

There where three kills, Seanzie/Gikkle, MM, and Boba Fett.
Boba was shot by bradland, which makes sense from a town!pov on n1.
MM was killed by something or someone, which really confuses me.
Seanzie is dead, but was swapped with Gikkle, so unless someone used a brute attack to directly kill Seanzie, they meant to kill Gikkle, which doesn't really make sense from a scum!pov to me, neither does killing Gikkle from a town!pov. I think the only real possibility is strongman/brute/unblockable attack on Seanzie, considering they were a universal town read and likely would've had protections on them. OR Martin is lying about the bus entirely, unless BD gives feedback which Gikkle I think claimed did not.

Who killed MM and why? This is really going to bother me and something I chew on for a while.

I slept in, also I do not appreciate the offloading of mental work on me, not cool dude.




I think those are both pretty safe town reads.



How is gikkle "functionally confirmed"? I don't think anyone is mechanically confirmed in a setup where you bring your own abilities.



I have done nothing but stay under the radar, I may not have interacted with you a whole lot on D1 but I am pretty consistently a top poster in whatever game I am in, fuck outta here with that.



Thanks for the reminder to reread martin, I'm still chewing on the fact that the claimed bussing was Gikkle and Seanzie, seanzie makes sense but bussing Gikkle seems like a recipe for investigatives to fuck up



Here is the wolf flip shooting claim, also previously a claim that they shot boba, which I think makes sense from a town pov
What a weird win-more card to have.

Wait I totally forgot DoctorZeus died
How did doctorzeus die? wtf?

[Takumi Fujiwara]

Slightly less because HK didn’t build a train on a scum from scratch.

Okay.

I have literally been driving since 20 minutes after SoD.

Guessing that means you're busy atm. So, just drive safe I guess and chime in when you can help unwrap this.

[deathworlds]

Did doctorzeus starve to death?

[PQRnHack]

I thought he was just talking about how you get a car in the mod when you're Street Racer.

AHHHHH YOU ARE SO FRUSTRATING

So you stick to
I didn't see him listing me as his only green read. But if he did, probably to pocket me. Guess he did in a way.

You know Paopan already tried to pocket me and Seanzie. But in a very different manner.

Just pasting my notes from last night (sorry, this is not updated to reflect today's game state; also if someone attacks me now that im supposedly dropping this cuz im scum, then either you are scum or you need to re-evaluate me)

Seanzie. My top townread, Paopan awarded +1 pts (as he sorta did to me when I pointed out incorrect MM name in his vote), I think that was just Pao pocketing each of us. Seanzie remains in my towncore. The only small flag is he tried to go for SB16 late in the day and commented on my Paopan vote (where I mentioned MM as a viable lynch/shot candidate but I felt conflicted) that he was starting to consider MM an option (and maybe Martin) and wanted a CW. For all we know, both Pao and MM may be scum, so we may have been right either way. Furthermore, I doubt that scum~Seanzie would strategize with their Scum~Pao here about ITA in which their expressed opinions were polar opposites of one another. Sean remains a solid towncore for me, the small redflag is immensely outweighted by other factors and is basically essentially a non-factor for me.

[Takumi Fujiwara]

Did doctorzeus starve to death?

Yes.

[PQRnHack]

Yes.

Tell me with excellent precision what led you to this conclusion and WHEN.

[deathworlds]

Yes.

Tell me with excellent precision what led you to this conclusion and WHEN.

Answer soon please

[Takumi Fujiwara]

AHHHHH YOU ARE SO FRUSTRATING

So you stick to
I didn't see him listing me as his only green read. But if he did, probably to pocket me. Guess he did in a way.

You know Paopan already tried to pocket me and Seanzie. But in a very different manner.

Just pasting my notes from last night (sorry, this is not updated to reflect today's game state; also if someone attacks me now that im supposedly dropping this cuz im scum, then either you are scum or you need to re-evaluate me)

Seanzie. My top townread, Paopan awarded +1 pts (as he sorta did to me when I pointed out incorrect MM name in his vote), I think that was just Pao pocketing each of us. Seanzie remains in my towncore. The only small flag is he tried to go for SB16 late in the day and commented on my Paopan vote (where I mentioned MM as a viable lynch/shot candidate but I felt conflicted) that he was starting to consider MM an option (and maybe Martin) and wanted a CW. For all we know, both Pao and MM may be scum, so we may have been right either way. Furthermore, I doubt that scum~Seanzie would strategize with their Scum~Pao here about ITA in which their expressed opinions were polar opposites of one another. Sean remains a solid towncore for me, the small redflag is immensely outweighted by other factors and is basically essentially a non-factor for me.

The two aren't mutually exclusive. If he wanted to pocket me and talk about street racer and jot me down in some bullshit list, okay that's cool. Paopan is going to type nonsense so I don't pay huge amounts of attention to him. I didn't townread him because of those things. I townread him because of his tone which only changed right before you hammered him.

[Takumi Fujiwara]

Zeus was not shot or killed (and he required multiple shots to get killed per the flip), he died/suicided. The Survivor failed to consume enough calories thanks to yours truly ;) He got 0 calories from his off-Pao vote D1 and his N1 was not sufficient to stay alive (10k required).

Boba, MM, Seanzie were shot. Maybe 1 factional kill, 2 card kills (alignments not known, unless someone comes forward). The card kills could also have been suicides/bombings (like one of the 3 visiting a player with a card that kills visitors).

Also this is really embarrassing but for some reason I kept saying we are in a 9v2. We are in an 8v2. Surprised no one pointed out this mistake earlier. I swear I can count to 10!

This? Duh

[deathworlds]

This? Duh

guess I missed that in my skim, either way, a dead scum is a dead scum is a dead scum

[deathworlds]

I think I'm okay with an HK, Oliverz, and frinckles vote.

-vote Hollowkatt

[PQRnHack]

This? Duh

Checking if you are ACTUALLY paying attention. If you are town, I need you here in more capacity than the games where I mislynched you TvT.

[PQRnHack]

I think I'm okay with an HK, Oliverz, and frinckles vote.

-vote Hollowkatt

You and Hollowkatt are my remaining upper townreads with Seanzie gone. But I am also aware that someone (if not everyone) is pocketing me.

This game reminds me of the case in which I chose to save myself over a stronger player simply because I knew I was 100% town and there was no viable alternate train but to vote my other townread SCUMBAGS you really are exploiting me.

[deathworlds]

You and Hollowkatt are my remaining upper townreads with Seanzie gone. But I am also aware that someone (if not everyone) is pocketing me.

This game reminds me of the case in which I chose to save myself over a stronger player simply because I knew I was 100% town and there was no viable alternate train but to vote my other townread SCUMBAGS you really are exploiting me.

I don't know how to read you

[PQRnHack]

Loldebite was very accusatory early on. Is it possible he backed off when he realized that I will be universally townread (what a miracle)? And why did pressure on me stop?

[PQRnHack]

I don't know how to read you

Do it in Russian.

[deathworlds]

Do it in Russian.

probably some english only rule that I overlooked so no, nice attempt to get me modkilled tho

[PQRnHack]

I don't know how to read you

If you are town, then read me as town. If you are scum then i don't give a rat's ass how you read me

Deathworlds. Was one of my top townreads earlier. Pao made an incorrect statement about Deathworlds voting MM, deathworlds was first to catch it and point it out. Can that be bussing? I don't think so, I think deathworlds is town still (not 100% ofc). Pao gave them a -1 pt for DW's statement that someone acting uncharacteristically smart could be a sign of getting coached by their team (something I also suggested). I tend to think both DW and I were correct in that regard! But I did find it surprising that deathworlds insisted on voting me, so I need to be aware of the possibility that this was to form a CW to save Pao.

[deathworlds]

the MM kill is going to bug me for a long time, why?

[PQRnHack]

probably some english only rule that I overlooked so no, nice attempt to get me modkilled tho

Made me laugh, thank you

You are correct, I think. Was not an angleshoot, dont worry. I just happen to be Russian.

[PQRnHack]

the MM kill is going to bug me for a long time, why?

If you are town, you need to give me more. I don't wanna sound like Paopan, but I will. Can you convince me why I was scum in your view (give me reasons at the time).

[deathworlds]

If you are town, you need to give me more. I don't wanna sound like Paopan, but I will. Can you convince me why I was scum in your view (give me reasons at the time).

I thought your attempts at forcing a town core with me was sussy

[deathworlds]

I don't like being town read for poor reasons, easy way to get pocketed by scum

[PQRnHack]

I thought your attempts at forcing a town core with me was sussy

I expressed my frustration about being scumread (when I was town) to Takumi Fujiwara (his real ID) a couple games ago. He gave me pointed to a forum that taught me that I should focus on finding town as opposed to hunting scum. That is what I attempted to do this game. I am a recreational player, but I will fight hard. This is my first DM game and I want to do a good job (which apparently i failed at cuz no one likes my hammer on Pao, but i STILL LOVE IT).

[PQRnHack]

I don't like being town read for poor reasons, easy way to get pocketed by scum

Tell me about my poor reasons.

[deathworlds]

I expressed my frustration about being scumread (when I was town) to Takumi Fujiwara (his real ID) a couple games ago. He gave me pointed to a forum that taught me that I should focus on finding town as opposed to hunting scum. That is what I attempted to do this game. I am a recreational player, but I will fight hard. This is my first DM game and I want to do a good job (which apparently i failed at cuz no one likes my hammer on Pao, but i STILL LOVE IT).

I don't necessarily agree with your plan to hammer pao early, but it makes sense from a town!pov, in hindsight it was a good play because it also happened to obliterate scum. Self-preservation is a good thing from any perspective (one of your self admitted reasons for the hammer), and pao WAS suspicious, I just wish we had the opportunity to shoot more scum d1, ultimately I think we got very lucky

[deathworlds]

Tell me about my poor reasons.

I was speaking generally with that statement, I've been pocketed by some shite town reads before and I don't intend to repeat what I did LAST game by town reading you based off a shit meta read.

[MartinGG99]

Is anyone of the three known for op roles / cards

I can't recall, but I think Seanzie had some sort of "special card" but I have no clue what it is.

DrZeus also has an MVP card but he self-resolved seemingly because not enough people poked him last night

so im doubtful cards had to deal with the motive of any of the attacks last night

[PQRnHack]

I don't like being town read for poor reasons, easy way to get pocketed by scum

If you are town, then I am about to get real upset

Even if my townread of your slot is poor, how do you justify that I put a vote on Pao and hammered him? Give me an explanation and do it pronto.

[deathworlds]

If you are town, then I am about to get real upset

Even if my townread of your slot is poor, how do you justify that I put a vote on Pao and hammered him? Give me an explanation and do it pronto.

self preservation makes sense from any perspective

[MartinGG99]

except for stuff like this

Possible scum strongman killed Seanzie.

but I haven't seen a card that works like a strongman so I would assume that any strongman card would be linked to factional actions or something like that where it would be useless to a town

unless its a night-kill card that comes with a strongman modifier but that would by necessity have a higher rarity

so I don't think that would be likely given someone would have to bring it knowing it could be useless to them

[PQRnHack]

I don't necessarily agree with your plan to hammer pao early, but it makes sense from a town!pov, in hindsight it was a good play because it also happened to obliterate scum. Self-preservation is a good thing from any perspective (one of your self admitted reasons for the hammer), and pao WAS suspicious, I just wish we had the opportunity to shoot more scum d1, ultimately I think we got very lucky

You may also be forgetting that i had the double lynch in the bag. I had my own plan, and I executed to it. If I felt confident at the approach to D1 ITA, I woulda have acted differently. Did I feel confident? No, I did not, it was a mess. But I do acknowledge that Pao and Zeus were both non-town so we could have caught that in that manner as well.

I know people wanna trash on me for terminating D1. It got us Survivor skinny boi (not expected, so i won't result on that), it got us Brad and Martin mechanics. It's exactly what I wanted! (not that it necessarily helps as i dont know who the scums are... or do i?). I am allowed to make bad plays. But i, myself, do not think it was bad at all.

[PQRnHack]

self preservation makes sense from any perspective

I need more. This was a really weak answer.

[PQRnHack]

except for stuff like this



but I haven't seen a card that works like a strongman so I would assume that any strongman card would be linked to factional actions or something like that where it would be useless to a town

unless its a night-kill card that comes with a strongman modifier but that would by necessity have a higher rarity

so I don't think that would be likely given someone would have to bring it knowing it could be useless to them

It could be as simple as "visit X, die to X" cuz X has a card that terminates their visitors.

[deathworlds]

I need more. This was a really weak answer.

That's what you're going to get

Your twenty questions yesterday peeved me off, as well as your joking attitude, but that's maybe a playstyle read, perhaps I'm just not a fan of how you play the game in general.
If you read my "large text" you would understand that as of now I have put you in the tentative town read box.

[deathworlds]

except for stuff like this



but I haven't seen a card that works like a strongman so I would assume that any strongman card would be linked to factional actions or something like that where it would be useless to a town

unless its a night-kill card that comes with a strongman modifier but that would by necessity have a higher rarity

so I don't think that would be likely given someone would have to bring it knowing it could be useless to them

Unless you're lying about the bus I think that strongman is one of the only other universe where the seanzie/gikkle kill makes sense

[PQRnHack]

I don't necessarily agree with your plan to hammer pao early, but it makes sense from a town!pov, in hindsight it was a good play because it also happened to obliterate scum. Self-preservation is a good thing from any perspective (one of your self admitted reasons for the hammer), and pao WAS suspicious, I just wish we had the opportunity to shoot more scum d1, ultimately I think we got very lucky

It is not all luck. We now have 2 lynches available to us. LYNCH is where town rules. We need to focus on lynching at least 1 of 2 mafia and we'll be gucci.

If you get top wagon today, who is your alternate?

[hollowkatt]

Spoiler : Large text :

Okay I may not still like nor agree with your thought proccesses but they seem consistent so far. I'm going to start putting you tentatively in the town box for now. At least it's good to know where the early end of day came from, not that I like having days end early.


I was voting you at the time because I was in a classic deathtunnel I think, saw some things about your slot I did not like at all and focused on them, water under the bridge. At least I'm still apart of your "towncore"



Seanzie and Gikkle? Seems like an okay swap I guess?
Seanzie was a top town read of mine and pretty universally town read, Gikkle (from my perspective) would've been an easy TK or town investigative shot.


I was going to quote this to note that PQ was in lag's game and completely trounced us, but I guess I just missed that in my quick read of the thread.



Someone has a LOT of lynch manipulation mechanics, early lynch and a double elimination? Hot damn, that could be a very useful set for scum that was confident in their ability to manipulate town and potentially bus their weaker scum mate, but that's a bit of a tin-foil theory.



I don't really like this slot already, but I am interested in what you have to say.



Please tell us more about the case so that I can poke holes in it, I'd love to see you try, unless you're actually town, in which case just shut up.



You get bonus shit from winning? I uh, guess that could be a card, although I can see why you would use it from a town perspective since we actually got scum on d1 which was a major win for town.



loldebite is a pretty solid town read for me as well.



If you could clarify that whatever that awful vibe about me is I could try and help you get over it, that is if that vibe is still there.



I really don't see the pov where scum shoots gikkle, shooting seanzie, maybe, but not gikkle, I think scum would leave Gikkle alone since they were a somewhat hot topic yesterday.



MM being killed by mafia seems so outlandish to me, they were a lurker slot and lurking!MM = scum!MM, except in this case I guess.



Did you kill someone last night?



I guess?

Abilities are NAI in this game, much like KRC or some bastard games. I think the honesty gets some points from me for now, although I am still somewhat suspicious of Martin since I'd expect them to be a bit more solvy this game.



Who would you give town credit to then? Who are your town reads, your scum reads? Clarify in a list, preferably with colors to make it easier to read.



Is this a role-block/black mail + kill? Seems a bit goofy to me, less cryptic nonesense and more mechanics please!



I'd be okay with an hk lynch I think, I'd have to reread them to see if I like what they say.



Seems simple.

Martin claims to have swapped gikkle and seanzie.
All actions that would've affected seanzie would've affected gikkle and vice versa

When analyzing what happened to each slot one would work from the perspective that their intended target was the other.
Gikkle is alive and well.
Seanzie is not, seanzie is very much dead.

There where three kills, Seanzie/Gikkle, MM, and Boba Fett.
Boba was shot by bradland, which makes sense from a town!pov on n1.
MM was killed by something or someone, which really confuses me.
Seanzie is dead, but was swapped with Gikkle, so unless someone used a brute attack to directly kill Seanzie, they meant to kill Gikkle, which doesn't really make sense from a scum!pov to me, neither does killing Gikkle from a town!pov. I think the only real possibility is strongman/brute/unblockable attack on Seanzie, considering they were a universal town read and likely would've had protections on them. OR Martin is lying about the bus entirely, unless BD gives feedback which Gikkle I think claimed did not.

Who killed MM and why? This is really going to bother me and something I chew on for a while.

I slept in, also I do not appreciate the offloading of mental work on me, not cool dude.




I think those are both pretty safe town reads.



How is gikkle "functionally confirmed"? I don't think anyone is mechanically confirmed in a setup where you bring your own abilities.



I have done nothing but stay under the radar, I may not have interacted with you a whole lot on D1 but I am pretty consistently a top poster in whatever game I am in, fuck outta here with that.



Thanks for the reminder to reread martin, I'm still chewing on the fact that the claimed bussing was Gikkle and Seanzie, seanzie makes sense but bussing Gikkle seems like a recipe for investigatives to fuck up



Here is the wolf flip shooting claim, also previously a claim that they shot boba, which I think makes sense from a town pov
What a weird win-more card to have.

I don't know you from Adam so I'm not sure why you think I should be aware of how much or how often you post.
Also I shot MM with Inactivity Vig which lets me shoot someone with fewer than 15 posts

[PQRnHack]

This is pissing me off, i was expecting scum to paint a narrative against me. you know i could be framer and paopan flip was not real..

[PQRnHack]

I don't know you from Adam so I'm not sure why you think I should be aware of how much or how often you post.
Also I shot MM with Inactivity Vig which lets me shoot someone with fewer than 15 posts

Tell me what you decided to hold off on this information for so long.

[deathworlds]

I don't know you from Adam so I'm not sure why you think I should be aware of how much or how often you post.
Also I shot MM with Inactivity Vig which lets me shoot someone with fewer than 15 posts

Okay.

So we have a few claims

MM kill: inactivity vig from hollowkatt
Boba fett kill: vig that works after wolf flip from BradLand
Seanzie/Gikkle: Likely scum kill
Martin bussed seanzie and Gikkle
PQR ended day early and gave us double lynch today.
SB16: got rid of one of their cards for extra benefit after wolf flipped?

[deathworlds]

Okay.

So we have a few claims

MM kill: inactivity vig from hollowkatt
Boba fett kill: vig that works after wolf flip from BradLand
Seanzie/Gikkle: Likely scum kill
Martin bussed seanzie and Gikkle
PQR ended day early and gave us double lynch today.
SB16: got rid of one of their cards for extra benefit after wolf flipped?

oh and the mafia sided survivor likely starved to death

[deathworlds]

I don't know you from Adam so I'm not sure why you think I should be aware of how much or how often you post.
Also I shot MM with Inactivity Vig which lets me shoot someone with fewer than 15 posts

Why shoot MM as opposed to someone like Boba?

[PQRnHack]

Okay.

So we have a few claims

MM kill: inactivity vig from hollowkatt
Boba fett kill: vig that works after wolf flip from BradLand
Seanzie/Gikkle: Likely scum kill
Martin bussed seanzie and Gikkle
PQR ended day early and gave us double lynch today.
SB16: got rid of one of their cards for extra benefit after wolf flipped?

Tell me % im scum

[deathworlds]

It is not all luck. We now have 2 lynches available to us. LYNCH is where town rules. We need to focus on lynching at least 1 of 2 mafia and we'll be gucci.

If you get top wagon today, who is your alternate?

I think HK and oliverz are good choices today, maybe frinckles

[deathworlds]

Tell me % im scum

Low, maybe 20%