S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008 - Page 16
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  1. ISO #751

  2. ISO #752

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    I never said anything about that, the point you're attributing to me is not mine.
    The text I put there was my interpretation of what I got from you yesterday. Here is the post that I got this from:
    "the point of me not wanting to wait is to maximize the ratio of town-targeted kills to mafia-targeted kills. "

  3. ISO #753

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    If you don't understand how your posts regarding the plan give the wolves an easy out, I don't know what to say. If you're town, then you've made it much harder for us to successfully pull of a major +EV plan, and if you're wolf, well good job undermining what would make your life much much worse. Yes, it is unlikely enough that it would have been better to not mention it, and so now I am stuck trying to decide if you mentioning it was a townie making a mistake or a wolf doing something strategic.
    Riiiggghtt. As if before I made my posts, wolves were just going to go and out themselves by refusing to shoot their partner despite agreeing beforehand and people saying not shooting would be a scum claim. If anything, if I'm not mistaken, town has something much better now.

  4. ISO #754

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    @Seanzie

    Like, legitimate fucking question, do you actually read the individual that you're talking to, or do you just fucking throw a random read on them and just twist every fucking thing they say into that read?

    You literally just ignore what the person is doing and just fucking tunnel, it's fucking bullshit how you treat people in games.

  5. ISO #755

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    With the attitude in your first post, we might as well just forfeit now, because according to this, scum essentially controls both the TK and the NK, which means this game is unwinnable... I'm going to chalk this up to you not really being familiar with 24/7 scumchat though thanks to your second comment quoted here, so let me speak to you about that.

    I think you are strongly overlooking that if wolves block-vote like this, it becomes really obvious, both at the time and later on doing wagonomics. Sure, 24/7 scum chat allows for more coordination between wolves, but if 2-3 people jump on a wagon that flips town at the last minute without good reason, that is suspicious. This draws attention to both the people voting and the potential CW's at the time. In addition, any townies involved in such a move will have natural suspicion on the other people involved in such a CW, which puts wolves that block-vote in a weird position where they need to be good at scum theatre, or they're outed (and most wolves are not good at scum theatre IME). So like... yes, scum can theoretically control who we kill with an ITA, but they have to more-or-less out in order to do it. This isn't MyLo, so I'm okay letting the scum team out themselves to control one TK.

    As someone who plays almost exclusively with 24/7 scum chat, this is a concern, but not nearly as large of a concern as you're making it. If it was such a big factor, scum would win almost every game with 24/7 scum chat by simply block-voting, and that just doesn't happen.
    Seanzie is having the exact same thoughts as me and I like it, now hopefully lets see if we have similar reads throughout the days.
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  6. ISO #756

  7. ISO #757

  8. ISO #758

  9. ISO #759

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    Did you even read my post? I advocated for voting multiple players BEFORE ANY SHOTS. If you are proposing voting in-between kills, tell me what is your rationale, how is that better, etc.

    I am not saying it is not[better], but tell me your thoughts on this.
    We will be voting multiple players before any shots. You do realize we can't shoot 3, right ? In fact we can barely guarantee we shoot one, even with 11 people shooting there's 9% chance of survival. Low, but that certainly can happen. Thus IMO adding more than 2 people to the shoot list is simply unfeasible. Therefore, voting in 2 rounds looks like a far better option.

  10. ISO #760

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Loldebite View Post
    We will be voting multiple players before any shots. You do realize we can't shoot 3, right ? In fact we can barely guarantee we shoot one, even with 11 people shooting there's 9% chance of survival. Low, but that certainly can happen. Thus IMO adding more than 2 people to the shoot list is simply unfeasible. Therefore, voting in 2 rounds looks like a far better option.
    We also have the day lynch (shot #3 basically).

  11. ISO #761

  12. ISO #762

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by BradLand View Post
    Multiple games though? It's fucking toxic at that point.
    Dude, we've played like 6 or 7 games together, I pushed you a little bit in two of them to see how you react to pressure. You flip out over someone expressing a scumread on you in a game where people are trying to find scum, and then call them stupid and then say they're toxic... nah.

    I'm sorry man, I don't try to make anyone's game experience bad, but I do need to be able to play within the rules of the game, including expressing scumreads and putting pressure on people to see how they react. If you can't handle someone suspecting you, I don't know what to tell you other than this might not be the game for you. I don't mean that in a mean way, but it is the truth.

  13. ISO #763

  14. ISO #764

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    Dude, we've played like 6 or 7 games together, I pushed you a little bit in two of them to see how you react to pressure. You flip out over someone expressing a scumread on you in a game where people are trying to find scum, and then call them stupid and then say they're toxic... nah.

    I'm sorry man, I don't try to make anyone's game experience bad, but I do need to be able to play within the rules of the game, including expressing scumreads and putting pressure on people to see how they react. If you can't handle someone suspecting you, I don't know what to tell you other than this might not be the game for you. I don't mean that in a mean way, but it is the truth.
    So the thing for me to figure out is whether Brad is Town and is legit upset or he is Scum and.... ....
    ....


    is legit upset!

  15. ISO #765

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    We also have the day lynch (shot #3 basically).
    That shot has to be another "round" of votes, simply because of mechanics. You've yet to present a single argument in favour of shooting the top 2 wagons after a single vote. IMO this only allows scum to spread out their vote and still get myslynches, which sounds like crap.

  16. ISO #766

  17. ISO #767

  18. ISO #768

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Gikkle View Post
    Riiiggghtt. As if before I made my posts, wolves were just going to go and out themselves by refusing to shoot their partner despite agreeing beforehand and people saying not shooting would be a scum claim. If anything, if I'm not mistaken, town has something much better now.
    No? If everyone in town was adamant about following the strategy, then I would expect wolves to ITA their wolf mates to blend in.

    How is it better? it is just a less-effective version of the strategy. More likely to not get 2 extra TKs and more susceptible to wolf-influence. I don't see the upside.

  19. ISO #769

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    If Seanzie is scum, can we recover?
    This plan doesn't give him any extra power, if he's scum and I just can't tell at the moment then whatever.

    I'll take useful tools regardless of where they come from, I don't see a lot of problems with the plan.
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  20. ISO #770

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Loldebite View Post
    That shot has to be another "round" of votes, simply because of mechanics. You've yet to present a single argument in favour of shooting the top 2 wagons after a single vote. IMO this only allows scum to spread out their vote and still get myslynches, which sounds like crap.
    Hello? That is my point, we identify the 3rd shot in advance (I know the quantity of shots is dependent on their success etc.) but whatever that lynch-based shot is, we prep it in advance. And not "oh hey we killed 2 people, now let's do some actual voting". That is okay for Scenario B (immediate flips) but I don't like it in Scenario A as then scum gets advantage in being able to manipulate the voting after they know the outcomes of the first 2 ITA shots.

    Can you explain "in favour of shooting the top 2 wagons after a single vote."
    Did I offer an argument to shoot top 2 wagons?

    I am about to lose my mind here.

  21. ISO #771

  22. ISO #772

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    Hello? That is my point, we identify the 3rd shot in advance (I know the quantity of shots is dependent on their success etc.) but whatever that lynch-based shot is, we prep it in advance. And not "oh hey we killed 2 people, now let's do some actual voting". That is okay for Scenario B (immediate flips) but I don't like it in Scenario A as then scum gets advantage in being able to manipulate the voting after they know the outcomes of the first 2 ITA shots.
    Liking the talk about the two different scenarios, i'm going to double check to see if flips show up upon death immediately or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  23. ISO #773

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    I don't understand your position. How does performing TKs suit an active scum team, and why are you so convinced the scum team is especially active this game?

    Who would you like to be the top train? Maybe two names, so like your preferred wagon/cw pair?
    NotPao. This is textbook scum pao. We were scummates last game.

    This is a strange question to ask considering that I have a vote placed.

    I'm not sure who my alternative would be currently. I should have one though, you're correct.

    I don't currently see any of the inactive players as particularly scummy. But you strike me as a player who is a powerwolf when you're scum. I absolutely could see you making an attempt to consolidate power towards yourself and another active wolf. The way I see it, openly narrowing the ITA pool only gives more power to active players and powerwolves who are around to shape how that pool is narrowed. Town players should be able to just... not shoot town.
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Unfunny View Post
    How dare you send me another box of cereal
    Quote Originally Posted by ChannelMiner View Post
    Anyways I shot Brad due to my morbid fear of zombies.

  24. ISO #774

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by BradLand View Post
    @Seanzie

    Like, legitimate fucking question, do you actually read the individual that you're talking to, or do you just fucking throw a random read on them and just twist every fucking thing they say into that read?

    You literally just ignore what the person is doing and just fucking tunnel, it's fucking bullshit how you treat people in games.
    Please keep the frustration related to the slot, not the player. @BradLand
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Unfunny View Post
    How dare you send me another box of cereal
    Quote Originally Posted by ChannelMiner View Post
    Anyways I shot Brad due to my morbid fear of zombies.

  25. ISO #775

  26. ISO #776

  27. ISO #777

  28. ISO #778

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Liking the talk about the two different scenarios, i'm going to double check to see if flips show up upon death immediately or not.
    Per the 2nd to last deck mafia games flip happen immediately upon death

    https://www.mafiacafe.net/forum/stan...ge34#post49139
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  29. ISO #779

  30. ISO #780

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    So umm anyone wanna hear my candidates for the massacre of D1?
    sure
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  31. ISO #781

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Per the 2nd to last deck mafia games flip happen immediately upon death

    https://www.mafiacafe.net/forum/stan...ge34#post49139
    Holy smokes, that was unexpected. And I like whom I see from the author of post #1 there. GOOD JOB!
    So we are more likely in scenario with the instant flips, good to know (but we should not assume it as 100% probability).

  32. ISO #782

  33. ISO #783

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    NotPao. This is textbook scum pao. We were scummates last game.

    This is a strange question to ask considering that I have a vote placed.

    I'm not sure who my alternative would be currently. I should have one though, you're correct.

    I don't currently see any of the inactive players as particularly scummy. But you strike me as a player who is a powerwolf when you're scum. I absolutely could see you making an attempt to consolidate power towards yourself and another active wolf. The way I see it, openly narrowing the ITA pool only gives more power to active players and powerwolves who are around to shape how that pool is narrowed. Town players should be able to just... not shoot town.
    *In the last game we played together.

    Important distinction.
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Unfunny View Post
    How dare you send me another box of cereal
    Quote Originally Posted by ChannelMiner View Post
    Anyways I shot Brad due to my morbid fear of zombies.

  34. ISO #784

  35. ISO #785

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    I am blackmailed.
    -vote PQRnHack
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  36. ISO #786

  37. ISO #787

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    It was a joke! In case you dont know, that is the automatic message thrown out in the Starcraft Mafia game when a person is blackmailed. But you should not throw votes around freely.
    I've been getting bad juju vibes from you for a while and I'm sticking my vote on you for now
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  38. ISO #788

  39. ISO #789

  40. ISO #790

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    Are you joking? We are in the towncore! Tell me what vibes you have been getting from me. Do not let scum utilize your error as an opportunity.
    I don't consent to your towncore
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  41. ISO #791

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Liking the talk about the two different scenarios, i'm going to double check to see if flips show up upon death immediately or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    No? If everyone in town was adamant about following the strategy, then I would expect wolves to ITA their wolf mates to blend in.

    How is it better? it is just a less-effective version of the strategy. More likely to not get 2 extra TKs and more susceptible to wolf-influence. I don't see the upside.
    I totally thought that was what y'all were going for and why you were upset at me about giving them an "out". A slightly less guaranteed chance of a kill is worth it considering we gain a pretty useful data point.

  42. ISO #792

  43. ISO #793

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    Very odd. I guess the feelings are not mutual. But I need you to unvote me please. You are screaming town to me.
    No, I'm perfectly fine with my vote exactly where it is
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  44. ISO #794

  45. ISO #795

  46. ISO #796

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Seanzie View Post
    So instead of trying to undermine the plan, call for wagon consolidation.

    You're scum, aren't you?
    Your plan doesn't work when people aren't voting because the wagons are town. I literally am calling people to vote for Pao, my preferred wagon. Scroll up. You don't even have to switch pages.

    Don't try and scumpaint me. I'm really good at taking scum down with me.
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Unfunny View Post
    How dare you send me another box of cereal
    Quote Originally Posted by ChannelMiner View Post
    Anyways I shot Brad due to my morbid fear of zombies.

  47. ISO #797

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by PQRnHack View Post
    What are your reasons for voting me? And tell me about them vibes, dont tell me only that you are comfortable with where your vote is (btw that is MY line!)
    Maybe it's a playstyle read, I'm a pretty serious player and antics don't sit well with me
    Quote Originally Posted by MattZed View Post
    deathworld's and RLVG's suicides made me lul. I take a lot of pleasure in knowing that I gave you an night action, and that you used it to kill yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by yzb25 View Post
    At least Mesk has lewdy lefty and raunchy righty. You're not even Canadian.
    Quote Originally Posted by FM-Shocked Kirby Face View Post
    Deathworlds is simply better than us at this game. Don't kill them for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    fucketh me in the ass

  48. ISO #798

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    Your plan doesn't work when people aren't voting because the wagons are town. I literally am calling people to vote for Pao, my preferred wagon. Scroll up. You don't even have to switch pages.

    Don't try and scumpaint me. I'm really good at taking scum down with me.
    I still like the plan. but yea i dont like the wagon (on me) lol.

  49. ISO #799

  50. ISO #800

    Re: S-FM 338: Deck Mafia #008

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Maybe it's a playstyle read, I'm a pretty serious player and antics don't sit well with me
    If you are town, as I think you are, we gotta work together. Your careless vote on me is really really bad, you know that some cards can take advantage of that, right?

 

 

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