S-FM 292: ★ Silent Night ★ [14P]

[OzyWho]

Alright guys. We did 400 posts in 4 hours. I think we did our due diligence.
gn

[blinkskater]

Only 4 pages to read?

I got this.

[Marshmallow Marshall]

Alright guys. We did 400 posts in 4 hours. I think we did our due diligence.
gn

I do agree lol. I think I'll go back to reading other things might check in later before going to bed, but no promises.

Good night Ozy ^^

[blinkskater]

Uh.... thanks naz? I'm not sure how to interpret that defense tbh.

Naz is more passive then agressive when shes scum, i do think in her case passive and agressive can be AI if you also analyze the context, theres currently not enough vianthis post to properly assess this situation. I'm sure when voss posts i know i at least will have a better idea because i'll be able to cross reference nazs behavior to vosses and weigh the pros and cons each way

[blinkskater]

@Marshmallow Marshall @aamirus @Magoroth

I would like to hear your meta reads on Blinkskater.
Everything he says is, logically, bullet proof. But it feels to me like he has done 2 things only:
1. some random meme random posting trolling thing that the bunch of you do.
2. make bullet proof statements.

That 2nd one is scummy for 2 reasons:
1) he is being careful. very typical scum thing to do. Also, you would for example never see Frinckles as scum NOT make bullet proof statements as far as I know.
2) he found something to go for - me - and he sticks to it. Very opportunistic.
As I said in my opening post:


Which is what I think blinkskater is doing atm

-vote blinkskater

I hate to admit this, but after iso'ing aamirus - I don't scumread her anymore.

Wait i'm scummy because i'm towny? I don't mind being scumread when the reasoning sound.

Also what does frinckles have to do with anything?

And pointing out something scummy a player has done then giving valid reasons for it and explaining why it's scummy is actually how you're supposed to play town my dude. If i think you are scum i am going to try and bury you while weeding out your allies.

[blinkskater]

Why are you painting us as TvS? I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's unlikely IMO.

Because that is the way i'm reading the situation

[blinkskater]

Woooow, you're really reaching here. Does that make Ozy less trustworthy? Yes, a bit. Does it make him "WAAH OZY IS SCUM WHY DO YOU TRUST HIM!!!" ? No. Why are you jumping on Ozy so hard?

It baffles me that you seem to town read ozzys every action, straight up baffles

[blinkskater]

Did you just claim to be TPR-hunting, looking for breadcrumbs? That's the Mafia's job. Putting you right next to Aamirus in the scummy list.

Mentioning you found soft claims openly in the thread is straight up open wolfing.

I have no problem lynching this

[blinkskater]

Im Not TPR Hunting.. And If I Am It For A Better Reason Then Me Being Scum.. Also Ive Already Claimed My Role. In My First Post Good Luck Figuring That Out..

Sigh when you bring meta into it this is cliche town yagami, *sighs*

[blinkskater]

Oh no, I'm townreading Blink now. He's confirmed scum


Seriously though, this post seems to have a genuine thought process, it fits with what I think to be Blink's style as town, and the post just makes sense because... well, because it's right lol.
Maybe not the last part about Magoroth but meh :P

Rip, i can confirm the last part is also right

[blinkskater]

I don't metaread people but I don't trust blinkskater tbh

Not incorperating meta into your reads is scummy because you're taking valuable information and ignoring it.

[blinkskater]

Medium townreads
OzyWho, already explained

Weak townreads
Blinkskater, his post about Kovath feels very genuine, as I just said in my recent post
Vozztallah, mostly for Naz's reaction & seemingly genuine frustration, and I don't see why she would be like that as scum

Tiny townreads
Magoroth, his speech about how scum gambits are often misinterpreted makes more sense from a Town than from a Scum PoV (because of benefits), but that's nothing big
Efekannn02, gutread

Nulls : Everyone I don't talk about

Slightly scummy
Kovath, his early posts are posts I would see a scum make, they don't bring anything to the game, aren't specially trolly either, it's just weird, and it doesn't fit with his last game in which he was town

Scummy
Light_Yagami, openly TPR-hunting, posts that "He might be scum, and he might be town" useless reasoning.
Aamirus, a lot of stretches and wording manipulation (calling ozy my lock town read when I didn't say that, the "liar" thing, attacking Ozy a lot for weak reasons)




I'm an anti-scum ;)

MM is town he can't replicate this type of reads lists as scum. Especially this early into day one, i'll ride or die on this read.

[blinkskater]

Fuck it im going to bed yall suck as soon as i get back yall split, get bent

[Varcron]

You Guys Really Do Talk A Lot..lol Took Me A Good Thirty Minutes To Get Caught Up.. And I Think I Figured Out A Couple Of PPLS Roles As Of Right Now.. Just Some Small Bread Crumbs Ive Noticed..

Lucky you, I still haven't finished catching up, y'all talk too much.

[OzyWho]

Wait i'm scummy because i'm towny? I don't mind being scumread when the reasoning sound.

Also what does frinckles have to do with anything?

And pointing out something scummy a player has done then giving valid reasons for it and explaining why it's scummy is actually how you're supposed to play town my dude. If i think you are scum i am going to try and bury you while weeding out your allies.

This is interesting though.

I never said "towny".
I said "bulletproof logic", or something along those lines.
This means you view making solid-bullet-proof-statements as "towny", thereby making your scumplay exactly that what I accused you in that post.

I don't have a reason to scumread you per se but I don't have a reason to townread you either.
I want to ask you this question: assuming that you're Town - what would be different in your scumplay compared to this?


Also, I think it's very rude of you to reply to a post but ignore the big red letters.

as opposed to mafia who may be looking to simplify their day by letting one simple encounter define how they vote or how they contribute for the day.

---

---

@Solid D.
You have only 4 posts, but there is already some controvery in them. I was hoping you could clear some things up for me.

In your first 2 votes, you made it very clear that you find Blink to be scummy:

Phew! This game has been live for like an hour? So much tension. I love it! FROM HOUSTON TEXAS ITS SOLID D! I sus blink an ozy for being so...”conflicty”

I trust mag! Will reread thread to make a more conclusive post!

Bold claim from a man I sus! Lots of scum pointing but still nothing solid tho. OH WAIT HAH!

But in your 3rd post, you very much so agree to what he is saying all along:

I agree with this, A post that large and detailed suggest a plot. Perhaps?

You haven't followed up on this so I just want to make sure. Do you find Blink scummy or towny?


But more interesting is your 4th post:

Support your local scum! Although I do agree with some of your statements if that’s not to overbearing. 😃

Did you slip that you and aamirus are scum together?
@aamirus he replied to your question in that post, why you didn't follow up on it?

[Caustic]

I will perhaps, make an analysis at some point.
Would anyone care to engage in conversation towards me?

[Marshmallow Marshall]

Wait i'm scummy because i'm towny? I don't mind being scumread when the reasoning sound.

Also what does frinckles have to do with anything?

And pointing out something scummy a player has done then giving valid reasons for it and explaining why it's scummy is actually how you're supposed to play town my dude. If i think you are scum i am going to try and bury you while weeding out your allies.

I'm going to let Ozy respond to this

Mentioning you found soft claims openly in the thread is straight up open wolfing.

I have no problem lynching this

Sigh when you bring meta into it this is cliche town yagami, *sighs*

So do you think he's town or scum? He has learnt to replicate his town meta as scum, and since it's literally the only thing that allows us to read him without having to appeal to him making sense, it's hard to read him now.

[DJarJar]

There are a few things I look out for, ways that scum often slip at SoG.

This is very close to one of them:



After that. At least from my perception, we have you starting to tunnel on me after this post, which inherently has a wrong statement at its very core.

So, after that thing, which I percieved to be a scum-paint attempt BECAUSE it's based on a false statement - what follows is worse and worse and worse posts from you regarding me. At some point going as far as I thought: "this guy is seriously reaching for straws and trys to scumpain me at all costs possible". Like none of it made sense to me - clearly shading. The "pressuring" you were talking about? Very skeptical about it.

Also, when you started tunneling on me - it was at a convenient time wasnt it? Almost like jumping to the opportunity? I remember it some people voicing their concnerns about me, then you jump in with your less than ideal statement and "push" on me.

So, answering your question about why they didn’t understand your +- post was somehow pocketing you (mind you I had previously said very rudely that I would not even read your first post). But if that was my goal why would I then start aggressively pushing you.

And the second thing was a misunderstanding, I thought you were saying there MUST be a d1 chat if no pregame chat (to be fair you basically did assume this), which i found scummy at the time because it’s very rare for there to be a d1 chat, so for you to assume there was felt very suspicious. Now the host confirmed there isn’t one, but even given that it’s STILL suspicious for anybody to assume there was a d1 chat. Like if you’re scum and know there isn’t one then that’s a good way to look towny by not knowing, but seriously who would assume there is a day chat?

Are you saying you completely ignored everything I said after that because “must be scum so ignore it”? Like I repeatedly asked you GOOD questions and called you out on things and you just didn’t respond to any of it

[Caustic]

I suppose my acquaintance can be rather incriminating.
I don’t blame you all for your sympathy towards me.

[Marshmallow Marshall]

I will perhaps, make an analysis at some point.
Would anyone care to engage in conversation towards me?

Hello! What's your experience with Mafia in general? Do you have any questions? Do you like or dislike a player's points, think someone is scum (evil), or something else?

Also, I'd suggest you to get an avatar. It allows us to put a picture on your name, and makes it easier to read the thread when there are a lot of posts. @Caustic

[Marshmallow Marshall]

I suppose my acquaintance can be rather incriminating.
I don’t blame you all for your sympathy towards me.

Oh well, you already chose your avatar

What do you mean by this post? I don't understand the point you're trying to make here.

[DJarJar]

Why Is That Might I Ask? How Would It Be Game Throwing?

Yagami it’s a meme from a previous game I played with Mag. Please ignore it lol

[Ganelon]

i believe this but that doesn't mean ur town !~



this post smells scummy



same

tbh

-vote Chip Skylark

I seriously doubt Ozy is scum here, call it gut or whatever but I think you guys are scumreading thin air

[DJarJar]

Support your local scum! Although I do agree with some of your statements if that’s not to overbearing. 😃

Intelligence is a dying breed. But not today!

These guys HAVE to be bots

[Varcron]

I suppose my acquaintance can be rather incriminating.
I don’t blame you all for your sympathy towards me.

Hey! It's a guy who's in my position last game, have fun and make sure to participate alot, it makes learning this easier.

[Ganelon]

tatami mentioning he saw a role claim is scummy af, you should not say something like that, almost grounds for instant Lynch I'd say
but then, his other posts and his style are fairly towny coming from him lul
and no its not just meta

[DJarJar]

@Marshmallow Marshall @aamirus @Magoroth

I would like to hear your meta reads on Blinkskater.
Everything he says is, logically, bullet proof. But it feels to me like he has done 2 things only:
1. some random meme random posting trolling thing that the bunch of you do.
2. make bullet proof statements.

That 2nd one is scummy for 2 reasons:
1) he is being careful. very typical scum thing to do. Also, you would for example never see Frinckles as scum NOT make bullet proof statements as far as I know.
2) he found something to go for - me - and he sticks to it. Very opportunistic.
As I said in my opening post:


Which is what I think blinkskater is doing atm

-vote blinkskater

I hate to admit this, but after iso'ing aamirus - I don't scumread her anymore.

I don’t have a read on blink yet. He agreed with me in a pockety kind of way but at the same time he agreed with me. So I’m conflicted.

[Ganelon]

These guys HAVE to be bots

frinckles is just toying with us tbh, this is secretly a trial run of the secret sc2mafia AI

[Ganelon]

I don’t have a read on blink yet. He agreed with me in a pockety kind of way but at the same time he agreed with me. So I’m conflicted.

+1

[Caustic]

Oh well, you already chose your avatar

What do you mean by this post? I don't understand the point you're trying to make here.

As I’m one of the variables, it can be rather difficult to engage with someone such as myself.
After all, the process is rather unique in many aspects.

[DJarJar]

I agree with your read on aamirus here, that + the twisting of my words that she even left unanswered.

Trying to finish one thought, the thought of townreading you, before going back to real life is so scummy, yes...
I AM AUTHORIZED TO HAVE A LIFE, GUYS. If you don't believe me, check last game, I was town.

Mag is hard to read on early D1, I'll wait a bit longer before giving my thoughts on him. I don't want to get played like in the last game.

Why do you scumread Vozztallah?

How do you agree with his read there? His read was basically “Aamirus is scummy”? He just admitted that he doesn’t even find me scummy anymore after he tried to find a reason why too.

[DJarJar]

Woooow, you're really reaching here. Does that make Ozy less trustworthy? Yes, a bit. Does it make him "WAAH OZY IS SCUM WHY DO YOU TRUST HIM!!!" ? No. Why are you jumping on Ozy so hard?

I already addressed this like two posts later. To be clear, you don’t care anymore that somebody said you were lurking because you now realize that person was Ozy?

[Ganelon]

Okay Thus Far U And Ozzy Seem Town Efe Seems Hard Null As Does Mag Also Null.. Aamirus Seems To Active Day 1 To Be Town.. Based On Meta.. Likely Scum.. Blink Does Like To Flip Narratives Alot So Far Null Read.. But Slight Scum Lean.. Also SB16 Claiming Not To Be Third Party Worries Me Bacause As Another Member Of This Party Stated.. It Doesnt Make Them Town..

I don't get the aamirus read here

[DJarJar]

Did you just claim to be TPR-hunting, looking for breadcrumbs? That's the Mafia's job. Putting you right next to Aamirus in the scummy list.

You are playing as if you don’t know anybody here... Yagami always says shit like that.

[DJarJar]

@aamirus what's the scum benefit from the play you are supposedly calling out here?

If you can find one, you probably deserve the medal of stretching :P

Another post you randomly quote that ozy and I already discussed further

[Marshmallow Marshall]

This is interesting though.

I never said "towny".
I said "bulletproof logic", or something along those lines.
This means you view making solid-bullet-proof-statements as "towny", thereby making your scumplay exactly that what I accused you in that post.

I don't have a reason to scumread you per se but I don't have a reason to townread you either.
I want to ask you this question: assuming that you're Town - what would be different in your scumplay compared to this?


Also, I think it's very rude of you to reply to a post but ignore the big red letters.

---

---

@Solid D.
You have only 4 posts, but there is already some controvery in them. I was hoping you could clear some things up for me.

In your first 2 votes, you made it very clear that you find Blink to be scummy:

But in your 3rd post, you very much so agree to what he is saying all along:You haven't followed up on this so I just want to make sure. Do you find Blink scummy or towny?


But more interesting is your 4th post:

Did you slip that you and aamirus are scum together?
@aamirus he replied to your question in that post, why you didn't follow up on it?

It doesn't mean that Blink sees his posts as attempts to look towny (or at least it doesn't necessarily mean that). It could also mean that what he's doing is the town way to do things in his mind. I'm going to defuse this right away because that looks like a big TvT argument coming up, with town!Blinkskater as the star of it once again lol. He always ends up in a fight like that, and I'm not so sure it helps town because it draws too much attention to townies and not enough to the scum, unless ozy would be scum here, which I do not believe.

The only beneficial scenario here would be a world in which Blink would be scum, and draw a ton of attention to him by creating a "duel" between Ozy and himself. I don't see why he would do that as scum.

Note that I'm not saying that your point is 100% invalid, Ozy. I'm saying that the conclusion you draw out of the bulletproof posts thing is not necessarily right, and has high enough odds of being wrong for me to talk about it.


What is so AI about Solid's posts here? You don't seriously think he slipped by just saying "Support your local scum!", right? Even complete newbies understand that scums are evil, at least I believe so lol.

[Ganelon]

I agree with your read on aamirus here, that + the twisting of my words that she even left unanswered.

Trying to finish one thought, the thought of townreading you, before going back to real life is so scummy, yes...
I AM AUTHORIZED TO HAVE A LIFE, GUYS. If you don't believe me, check last game, I was town.

Mag is hard to read on early D1, I'll wait a bit longer before giving my thoughts on him. I don't want to get played like in the last game.

Why do you scumread Vozztallah?

don't worry, you're not getting played this game
but like I said, I think there's a risk of you being an anti-vaxxer this game
take that as you will
also if this isn't 100% town MM I will quite literally eat my hat and never play FM again

[Ganelon]

You are playing as if you don’t know anybody here... Yagami always says shit like that.

Sounds very suspicious however, and I don't think I've seen him claim something like that before

[DJarJar]

Are you seriously saying that Aamirus is scum because she's minimally active on D1?

.......................................

Stealth claiming not third party is just about the meme of him always being 3P. I actually believe him when he says it, though, just because I don't see him saying that, even more since the 3P roles aren't inherently evil this game, they're actually more pro-town than pro-mafia by probability.


Uh, hooray? Lol

I can understand the reasoning about townreading me from your PoV, so okay. But about your reads, do you have actual pairings between the people you named or not? I have the same feeling (there's probably just one wolf in there though, usually some wolves are more hidden than that; this theory is not scientific or anything, but I have faith in it), but how can you not not townread them? Aamirus is straight up scummy and has pretty much nothing going for her, and the two others are not SUUUPER towny, although I do townread them. Unless I misunderstand your use of "can't not townread them"?

I have... nothing... going for me? What? I’ve scumhunted about as much as anybody else in the game and I have...”nothing” going for me? That seems really oddly aggressive for you MM

[Ganelon]

@Caustic have you played mafia before?

[Ganelon]

I also don't understand what MM's talking about when he says aamirus is scummy, I don't think you can view her as scummy atm, I think her behaviour has been NAI at worst

[DJarJar]

I agree with Mag here, btw. What makes Ozy towny isn't specifically that he made the charts thing (even though I townread it a little bit), but that he's defending them and actually getting reads and results from them, and actually contributes with other stuff, which shows that he didn't make them just to not have to actually contribute.

What reads has he given from his chart other than saying he now finds me towny?

[Solid D.]

@OzyWho I've been on mobile all day so it's nice to actually type. I sus'd you and blink for being so confrontational with each other over your first post, why be so aggressive so early? So my first post i sus'd Ozy and Blink and i trust mag. After blink responded to me with cop check claim, my second post/suspicions didn't change. After some time you and aamirus started to argue about the same first post you made which i tried to be clear that i was already sus of you Ozy, for having made your first post, arguing with blink about it and now arguing with aamrius. I was merely agreeing with aamirus that she was making good points, that is my third post. After this it did seem like she kinda had it out for you, kinda pushy seeing how blink let up already. My fourth post was still agreeing with aamrius on those points about you but she called me a bot. Oof thank you mobile.

With that said i sus the most is Blink. I trust mm and mag the most but i haven't had a chance to read past the 17th page an pick up anymore clues. As far as my sus with you, your a stats man and i like that but i'm still unsure, i still need to read over the thread thoroughly to make an honest judgement. i have no reads on anyone else. T.T also thank you for recognizing me. i know im not adding much to the conversation i hate using this website on my phone. xD

[Marshmallow Marshall]

These guys HAVE to be bots

What? Do you think bots are that advanced lol? I refuse to believe bots can sneak in a FM game and play with humans like this. Just no way lol.

Hey! It's a guy who's in my position last game, have fun and make sure to participate alot, it makes learning this easier.

Indeed! Good tip.

tatami mentioning he saw a role claim is scummy af, you should not say something like that, almost grounds for instant Lynch I'd say
but then, his other posts and his style are fairly towny coming from him lul
and no its not just meta

Did autocorrect just make Yagami a tatami? Lmao

Do you think that Light is able to replicate his meta enough to play like this as scum?

[DJarJar]

It baffles me that you seem to town read ozzys every action, straight up baffles

For real though

[Caustic]

@Caustic have you played mafia before?

Ah. I certainly have.
The more to Observe. The more the Parasites are revealed.

[DJarJar]

This is interesting though.

I never said "towny".
I said "bulletproof logic", or something along those lines.
This means you view making solid-bullet-proof-statements as "towny", thereby making your scumplay exactly that what I accused you in that post.

I don't have a reason to scumread you per se but I don't have a reason to townread you either.
I want to ask you this question: assuming that you're Town - what would be different in your scumplay compared to this?


Also, I think it's very rude of you to reply to a post but ignore the big red letters.

---

---

@Solid D.
You have only 4 posts, but there is already some controvery in them. I was hoping you could clear some things up for me.

In your first 2 votes, you made it very clear that you find Blink to be scummy:

But in your 3rd post, you very much so agree to what he is saying all along:You haven't followed up on this so I just want to make sure. Do you find Blink scummy or towny?


But more interesting is your 4th post:

Did you slip that you and aamirus are scum together?
@aamirus he replied to your question in that post, why you didn't follow up on it?

He replied after I said I was going to go play rocket league. His response is also somewhat nonsensical to me anyway...

[Ganelon]

The posts here just look like sending people away to do useless things, or "chase their own tails" as Blink said. There's a contrast between this and the very contributive player of Whizzbang. It might be because it's early D1, but I'm keeping an eye on Kovath.

And it's KOVATH, not korvoth or whatever you all keep calling him lol

I don't think so, that sounds like a lame tactic and I don't think Korvath/Kovath/Korvoth is lame

[Marshmallow Marshall]

You are playing as if you don’t know anybody here... Yagami always says shit like that.

That's a whole new level, though. He's literally saying that he has been actively doing the Mafia's job instead of the Town's...

Also, I'm using meta less because meta screwed me over recently.

don't worry, you're not getting played this game
but like I said, I think there's a risk of you being an anti-vaxxer this game
take that as you will
also if this isn't 100% town MM I will quite literally eat my hat and never play FM again

Do you mean that anti-vaxxer = town?

Sounds very suspicious however, and I don't think I've seen him claim something like that before

^ it's more than what he usually does

[Ganelon]

What? Do you think bots are that advanced lol? I refuse to believe bots can sneak in a FM game and play with humans like this. Just no way lol.

Indeed! Good tip.


Did autocorrect just make Yagami a tatami? Lmao

Do you think that Light is able to replicate his meta enough to play like this as scum?

dunno, as far as I can tell its not that simple for him bcs there's a huge difference between his scum/town games, his logic is significantly easier to follow when he's town; when he's mafia, I'm pretty sure his reads are meant to influence others rather than to keep him alive. I think he's actually trying this game; anyway my point is, no. he can't replicate his town meta, because they are too far apart.