S-FM The Cold War III

[Lenneth]

Omg, I spent 1h30 reading everthing I missed during my sleep !

Spoiler : Magoroth :

For once, I am actually in favour of my own lynch if every other Lynch fails to go through, because I am now LHF. Pretty sure scum push at opportunities I present.
but, for now...

-vote blinkskater

Is that WIFOM? trying to save himself by saying he is the best candidate for a lynch?

I have a theory that scum are trying to push two mislynches here. Meaning that both naz and Unknown are town.

I have the same feeling actualy, both naz and unknow look town imo.

-vote blinkskater

I actually want to Lynch you right now, not naz, I think you're trying to buddy naz and ride out the storm and mislynch her tomorrow

So basickly, you admited being inconsistent and always flip floping, then you are in favor of your own lynch, then you are looking for another dude to put the spotlight on?

I agree to this lynch, but if blink is indeed scum, what would that make MM? It would likely make aamirus town.

At least, you are now consistent with what you said just before (voting blink).

I do this all the time in the mod. Claim someone is town, Lynch the guy that wants them dead and when that guy flips town Lynch the guy you defended. ezpz.

what? how the fuck does that sound like a town play?

Blinkskater and naz have been insulting people, contributing next to nothing to the town. And Fielzanks and MM are defending them. How is that pro-town?

-vote Fielzanks

You guys are just riding the wave.

Is that flip flopping again? following MM when he wanted to vote blink then saying MM is scum with blink?

Also I want to say that I faked my own breakdown. I wanted to see who would push me for it, and, guess what, it was blinkskater and fielzanks, Fielzanks, who, laughably enough, reassured me that 'I would not taking down anyone with it.' Yeah no shit Jason because I am town.

Your own breakdown? the whole thing when you claimed flip flopping alot? Can you explain a bit more?

@Magoroth
I just read a lot of things from Magoroth who made me think 'wtf'.
To be honest, you just made me(us?) more confused than before which look a bit scummy.
What do you think about it?

[Lenneth]

If that's the case, that could explain naz's behaviour to some extent. And it would also explain what is happening about here. @Distorted , did the mafia have time to fore-plan anything? Meaning, did they know their roles and their partners for a long time before the day started?

That's funny, I see that as an attempt to make you like you actualy don't already know that.

[Lenneth]

Spoiler : Mass Murderer :

There was no sleeper agent/anti-communist in the first game. And there was a Castro. This is much different. You're right, the sleeper agent literally turns the Mafia into a Cultfia. Chasing Mafia > chasing SK, but chasing SK > not knowing what to do.

well right and how do you expect to chase the SK by the way? he will probably be pro town or neutral. Or worst...afk.

Out of the game: You're French, aren't you?

sqsqfsdfsfsf....yeah. why?

-vote rumox

actually. I unvoted you because you stopped claiming sleeper agent, but I was thinking you were not mafia only because you had claimed sleeper agent, and that was too ballsy for a scum. So then... you are probably actually scum lol. Plus, you are 99% aligned with unknown IMO, and unknown has been quite scummy on his last posts.

CHOO CHOO THIS IS AN OFFICAL TRAIN!

I think it's better for him and us if he keep claiming sleeper agent. If he is not lynch today, he is a potential target for mafia and I do still hope he is a shitizen.

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=WIFOM.

Breaking WIFOM in the negative meaning means that you are breaking the confusion amongst scum about if someone is a TPR or not. Me claiming Citizen, me retracting it to a no claim, that is a WIFOM to confuse scum. Rumox not claiming after being heavily pressured and after acting scummy, that is not a "useful" WIFOM for town. Questioning people is generally good, the only thing you must not do is to ask why someone claims citizen or TPR on D1, because it gives clues to scum.

It's not circular reasoning. Now that that's said. I suspect you, as you already know, of being scum, especially with Rumox and Unknown. What are your reads on them? @aamirus

He doesn't have to claim anything else since he already claim sleeper agent (which is...dumb or really smart). Let's imagine he start claiming shitizen, so what? will you change your mind and not lynch him? If we don't lynch him, he won't be a target anymore for scums. I don't see any good outcome when backpedaling his claim will be good for us.

^^ EXACTLY. Going to link you the previous game, where as Sheriff, I pulled a terribly big WIFOM game. It was ballsy, but it worked (the other people fucking threw the game after my plays ). I did the exact same strategy, and I really feel like he intended to retract his claim before EoD. But I don't see how, in this setup, it can have pro-town applications that are plausible.

I also don't see how retracting could have good repercussions on town.

@Marshmallow Marshall
It look like a bit you want to really know if rumox is sleeper agent in order to attack him or not tonight
Or you are a town prot who want to protect him.

[Lenneth]

nope i'd say lynch myself over Naz, but I think we should lynch you Unknown or MM I will not place a vote on Naz in this game

that sound scum af, naz can be town or scum, I also think she is town but claiming you won't put a vote on naz make me think you actualy know who are the scums.

lmfao I refuse to vote Unknown. and I also refuse to vote MM, because you seem to be ok with that Lynch.

Will you not vote them the entire game, no matter what?

[Ganelon]

That's funny, I see that as an attempt to make you like you actualy don't already know that.

Dude, how else do you explain this bullshit?

[Lenneth]

There is virtually nothing pro scum about my role claim. If I was scum claiming the lookout/detective role I would have to implicate a team mate the following day with a lead to seem semi credible. And that is only half of the job, I have to say who visited them as well. The moment either one of us flip scum the other person is going down the drain too. The only way this would work as a scum would for some ungodly reason guess who someone visited (i could confirm this with scum night chat) AND who visited them. That's such a huge fucking leap to make that it's retarded to even attempt that. I'd also be outting my scum mate as a power role. Forcing a scum mate to be revealed day 2? LOL. This is also under the assumption that I am doing without consulting any of my scum mates either. Who would do that? I would seriously love to see this setup played with scum fake claiming Sleeper Agent day 1 lmao.

The people that are voting me are either people that cannot think too much on the situation and just see my claim and think SCUM, case closed... or are actually scum frothing at the mouth at a potential free lynch. Those people were MM, Naz and Fielzanks. Naz has kinda forced herself to stay true to that path with how much fucking time she has spent calling me scum it would be next level scum to just stop accusing me. MM seems opportunistic with this situation. Fielzanks wall posts breaking all wifom screams scum to me because I honestly read it as him seeing my claim as bullshit and maybe trying to force a CC on my role claim, pitting two town together? Aamirus made a read on his wall post which echos the same thoughts as mine. The post at face value screams pro town but what it did was just deconstruct a lot of the game. Making the game as confusing for scum is very important, why the fuck make things obvious for them? This is the biggest issue I have with him regarding me. He attempted to shatter all wifom regarding my claim. Why? Because you thought it was a shit play? There are numerous new people in this FM that could theoretically fall for it.

-vote Fielzanks

I can see an easy way out if you are scum and you claimed a lookout/det with this settings ===> 'I have been rbed!'
There is a shitload of roles who can rb people (mafia, town and sk)

[Lenneth]

Dude, how else do you explain this bullshit?

Well, you know when distorted gave you your role, and when the game start.

[Ganelon]

that sound scum af, naz can be town or scum, I also think she is town but claiming you won't put a vote on naz make me think you actualy know who are the scums.



Will you not vote them the entire game, no matter what?

I don't want to vote Unknown at this point. Wtf is this question? No, 'no matter what', if Unknown keeps behaving as he has thus far then I will not Lynch him.
I'm actually fine with a MM Lynch.

[DJarJar]

while others spent pages and pages just going back and forth with insults

and specifically with this, I felt that once I got on and had finally finished reading through all the posts since I had gone to sleep, I still couldn't keep up with the posts for awhile because people weren't bothering to read everything and just kept attacking each other over 1 word in each post.

Like, there where about 20 posts coming in every 5 minutes, like an Instant Messaging chat, but I was spending 5+ minutes per post I wrote and so almost all of them were immediately getting covered up by everything else, and I felt that was extremely counter-intuitive to the game. From what I have seen so far the "good posts" take a significant amount of time to write and to gather evidence for.


I can see the ultra high-paced posting tactic as a way to try to get somebody to slip-up because they don't take the time to review their responses, I guess, but then only the person who initiated it was making a smart move and everyone else was being dumb.

That being said, I am inclined to believe it was mostly the rule "No personal attacks on players" was just being constantly violated for that portion of the day by half the lobby (and I did violate the no editing posts rule so I'm not trying to be a rules whore, I only properly read them after naz pointed out that I did that ). AKA: this was just people bitching at each other with no benefit to the game.

[Ganelon]

Well, you know when distorted gave you your role, and when the game start.

I was given my role ONE DAY PRIOR TO THE GAME STARTING.

[Lenneth]

I don't want to vote Unknown at this point. Wtf is this question? No, 'no matter what', if Unknown keeps behaving as he has thus far then I will not Lynch him.
I'm actually fine with a MM Lynch.

Your post was right after blink saying he will never vote against naz :P
I wanted to see what kind of response you will say.

[Lenneth]

I was given my role ONE DAY PRIOR TO THE GAME STARTING.

same with me, so yeah potentialy, scums could have talked together before the game start. If they are cheating and I don't think there is a way for us to know it.

[DJarJar]

Dude, how else do you explain this bullshit?

Like I said, they came into the game with hatred and anger towards each other. This is my first FM but I heard quite a lot of bitching in Skwirl Discord about how Rumox supposedly threw the previous game as town. I would definitely say that naz came in here wanting to pick a fight with Rumox and then that things just escalated from there and I don't think this fight which ended up encompassing half the lobby really had anything to do with the game or people's roles

[DJarJar]

same with me, so yeah potentialy, scums could have talked together before the game start. If they are cheating and I don't think there is a way for us to know it.

There is no point in playing a game if you are just going to guess that everyone else cheated. Sure it happened before with a player who is technically still in this game (PTB), but seriously it's a dumb thing to say.

[DJarJar]

@Distorted I see u lurking, how is the new laptop? and fix the game bitch!

[Ganelon]

There is no point in playing a game if you are just going to guess that everyone else cheated. Sure it happened before with a player who is technically still in this game (PTB), but seriously it's a dumb thing to say.

A'ight. I don't genuinely believe anyone cheated, I was just trying to state all the possibilities.

[Ganelon]

-vote Distorted

confirmed scum

[Distorted]

If that's the case, that could explain naz's behaviour to some extent. And it would also explain what is happening about here. @Distorted , did the mafia have time to fore-plan anything? Meaning, did they know their roles and their partners for a long time before the day started?

....no that would be OGC.

[Lenneth]

There is no point in playing a game if you are just going to guess that everyone else cheated. Sure it happened before with a player who is technically still in this game (PTB), but seriously it's a dumb thing to say.

Yes of course ! I am not saying people did that, but that is what Mag implied with his question to Distorted.
That's why I am thinking maybe his question was more to act like someone who don't already know that (so a town)

[Distorted]

There is no point in playing a game if you are just going to guess that everyone else cheated. Sure it happened before with a player who is technically still in this game (PTB), but seriously it's a dumb thing to say.

Just to clarify - PowerofDeath is not Powersthatbe (PTB); different people.

[Ganelon]

Yes of course ! I am not saying people did that, but that is what Mag implied with his question to Distorted.
That's why I am thinking maybe his question was more to act like someone who don't already know that (so a town)

Outside of myself, what are your scumreads atm? And why didn't you address my other posts?

[Distorted]

I am working on replacements for the 2 inactives as well. I have 2 people who I contacted yesterday who agreed - now waiting for them to message back. I messaged them about 3 hours ago that the replace is open asap.

[DJarJar]

Just to clarify - PowerofDeath is not Powersthatbe (PTB); different people.

my mistake he hasn't posted so I didn't even see his whole name

[Ganelon]

I am working on replacements for the 2 inactives as well. I have 2 people who I contacted yesterday who agreed - now waiting for them to message back. I messaged them about 3 hours ago that the replace is open asap.

Thank you!!
Oh wow who exactly are those two people?

[DJarJar]

In regards to the sleeper agent I have a question @Distorted
Would he still receive the Lookout/Detective info on the night he was converted (assuming he wasn't roleblocked)? In the Order of Operations it says det/lo comes before conversion so I guess that answers my question but I am not entirely sure if that just means the info is based on that point in the night (and they don't actually get it until night is over) or if they receive the info at that point in the night.


In regards to Truman's special ability to roleblock, it says "all town and others ability", so this means ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME?, or all non mafia players?

In regards to Truman's ability to role block where "targets will not be informed of roleblock", what does that realistically mean for roles like for example the Sleeper Agent, will you just tell them their target visited nobody and was visited by nobody? Or are you just going to straight up send no information at all to "stealth roleblocked" players? In other words, how are you going to avoid making it obvious to them that they were indeed roleblocked?

@Distorted

[Ganelon]

>inb4 it's Hybrid

[DJarJar]

Thank you!!
Oh wow who exactly are those two people?

1. Dunna
2. yzb25
3. Efekannn02

Reserves

[Distorted]

@Distorted

Sleeper agent would still get the feedback for the night

'Others' is what neutrals are called in this setup, so just town and neutrals/others are RBed. Mafia is still able to use their night actions

They receive 0 feedback for that night.

[DJarJar]

Sleeper agent would still get the feedback for the night

'Others' is what neutrals are called in this setup, so just town and neutrals/others are RBed. Mafia is still able to use their night actions

They receive 0 feedback for that night.

Thanks! Makes sense.

[Ganelon]

-vote Fielzanks

[Ganelon]

Lenneth and aamirus, you ok with killing Fielzanks/Blinkskater/MM/(NAZ? I can't read you naz at all!)

[DJarJar]

Lenneth and aamirus, you ok with killing Fielzanks/Blinkskater/MM/(NAZ? I can't read you naz at all!)

Nope, not killing anybody or agreeing to shit until new players start talking

[DJarJar]

Nope, not killing anybody or agreeing to shit until new players start talking

"just give me ur current reads" might be a response to this. NO. Not until those guys talk, is my answer.

[Lenneth]

@Lenneth !!!!!!

when you come online, please post a list of reads when you can ( doesn't really need to be explained, maybe more of like your top 3 scums and top 3 towns so far ) , do you want a d1 lynch? (if yes, who? what information does it reveal?) , do you want to role call/lw reveal tomorrow ? , can we share lunch ? , thank u . . .

Excluding the two afks

Spoiler : cvote :

blinkskater, Magoroth, aamirus, Fielzanks, TheGodDavid, Marshmallow Marshall, Unknown, rumox, naz

Unknow : I saw nothing who can be scummy atm, as i said before, his confused side (early game) and the fact that he was actively looking for scum look townish for me.
Rumox: Let's be honest, we have town killing role who can actualy kill him, or he is shitizen and mafia will kill him, or we will lynch him tomorrow... It's not usefull to lynch him right now imo. I do prefer to see his claim as a shitizen move so I put him in the town side.
Naz: about her, it's more meta, and I don't think a scum would like to be that aggressive.

Blinkskater: 'I will never vote against naz', look scummy af. Plus Unknown theory about him is pretty interesting
Magoroth: he made me more confused with how he played and look inconsistent af. And it look like he doesn't understand why the SK is good for town. Only mafia would want to find the SK.

Marshmallow Marshall: it's more meta but I don't find him really usefull compared to as usual. I actual put him in the scum list first but I couldn't find any good reasons. In the beginning of the day, he looked like more a scum then I reread a lot of his recent posts and couldn't find if I should put him in the town side or scum side. It's more meta so I just put him in the neutral dudes.
Fielzanks: that guy is a mystery, he is very cautious about his words, NEVER said something who could be seen as scum, was even a bit usefull early day with his setup's read, maybe SK or TPR.

Yep I want a D1 lynch, I don't think this is the kind of game who will be benificial for us if we are wasting a lynch. I think lynching Rumox is a bad idea today, tomorrow, that will be another call.

Lynching Blink could give us a lot of informations about Fiel and naz. Fiel and Blink are defending naz pretty hard, plus since Mag is pushing for Blink, that will also give us informations about him. If I remember, Blink also claimed shitizen, which won't be huge loss if he is really town. Scums will probably all claim shitizen?

Rolecall tomorrow...hum if we look at the settings, TPR are really specific and can almost all be confirmed by themself (for exemple, the jailor ~~) or it's like DET/LOOKOUT but scums don't have that kind of role, which mean scums will probably all claim shitizen.
Which mean, public rolecalling will give us a huge list of shitizens, and will reveal Trotsky/Lenin which will be good for...scums.
So that will be a run between us lynching all the shitizens 'randomly' when mafia will be focus on the TPR. SK will probably kill the shitizens in order to find mafia?

It could be interesting if people who played this game before know if it's better to roleclaim or not. Personaly I am not sure it's a good idea.

A lunch? why not ! What about korean food?

[Ganelon]

How I have become scum read is beyond me. When last I checked flip-flopping was indicative of towniness, and I actually faked that because I wanted to see who would push me for it.

[Ganelon]

How I have become scum read is beyond me. When last I checked flip-flopping was indicative of towniness, and I actually faked that because I wanted to see who would push me for it.

Claimin' Citizen on d1 is just a no-go in this setup.

[Ganelon]

Excluding the two afks

Spoiler : cvote :

blinkskater, Magoroth, aamirus, Fielzanks, TheGodDavid, Marshmallow Marshall, Unknown, rumox, naz

Unknow : I saw nothing who can be scummy atm, as i said before, his confused side (early game) and the fact that he was actively looking for scum look townish for me.
Rumox: Let's be honest, we have town killing role who can actualy kill him, or he is shitizen and mafia will kill him, or we will lynch him tomorrow... It's not usefull to lynch him right now imo. I do prefer to see his claim as a shitizen move so I put him in the town side.
Naz: about her, it's more meta, and I don't think a scum would like to be that aggressive.

Blinkskater: 'I will never vote against naz', look scummy af. Plus Unknown theory about him is pretty interesting
Magoroth: he made me more confused with how he played and look inconsistent af. And it look like he doesn't understand why the SK is good for town. Only mafia would want to find the SK.

Marshmallow Marshall: it's more meta but I don't find him really usefull compared to as usual. I actual put him in the scum list first but I couldn't find any good reasons. In the beginning of the day, he looked like more a scum then I reread a lot of his recent posts and couldn't find if I should put him in the town side or scum side. It's more meta so I just put him in the neutral dudes.
Fielzanks: that guy is a mystery, he is very cautious about his words, NEVER said something who could be seen as scum, was even a bit usefull early day with his setup's read, maybe SK or TPR.

Yep I want a D1 lynch, I don't think this is the kind of game who will be benificial for us if we are wasting a lynch. I think lynching Rumox is a bad idea today, tomorrow, that will be another call.

Lynching Blink could give us a lot of informations about Fiel and naz. Fiel and Blink are defending naz pretty hard, plus since Mag is pushing for Blink, that will also give us informations about him. If I remember, Blink also claimed shitizen, which won't be huge loss if he is really town. Scums will probably all claim shitizen?

Rolecall tomorrow...hum if we look at the settings, TPR are really specific and can almost all be confirmed by themself (for exemple, the jailor ~~) or it's like DET/LOOKOUT but scums don't have that kind of role, which mean scums will probably all claim shitizen.
Which mean, public rolecalling will give us a huge list of shitizens, and will reveal Trotsky/Lenin which will be good for...scums.
So that will be a run between us lynching all the shitizens 'randomly' when mafia will be focus on the TPR. SK will probably kill the shitizens in order to find mafia?

It could be interesting if people who played this game before know if it's better to roleclaim or not. Personaly I am not sure it's a good idea.

A lunch? why not ! What about korean food?

I'm fine with a role call on MyLo, but not till then.

[Lenneth]

I'm fine with a role call on MyLo, but not till then.

MyLo?

[Ganelon]

MyLo?

Mislynch and lose

[Lenneth]

By the way, with two afks it's complicated. Let's imagine they are both scums, that mean we are mostly arguing each other between....towns.

[Lenneth]

How I have become scum read is beyond me. When last I checked flip-flopping was indicative of towniness, and I actually faked that because I wanted to see who would push me for it.

how is that being towny?

[DJarJar]

Mislynch and lose

and im a noob but in case this didn't explain it, in other words it's like 4 v 3 and if town mislynched a town at that point it becomes 3 v 3 and evils almost have a guaranteed win (depending on town roles).

[DJarJar]

how is that being towny?

Based on what everyone else has said, being towny D1 is trying to probe EVERYONE for some kind of info without going too far and potentially ruining WIFOM. Evils want as little information as possible to be revealed about themselves and their teammates so they will tend to hone in on certain people or avoid talking at all.

At least, this seems to have been the sentiment of everyone saying I was scum read while I was asleep (since I went "Too far" on MM at the start of the day).

[DJarJar]

(since I went "Too far" on MM at the start of the day).

and then didn't say anything for several hundred posts, which was mainly because my awake/active hours were different from the majority of active players, but still contributed to my scumminess as far as I could tell

[Ganelon]

how is that being towny?

If blink, Fiel and MM are town, I have no idea what they're trying to accomplish. What Unknown and rumox are doing makes more sense to me than blink is doingm

[Ganelon]

and im a noob but in case this didn't explain it, in other words it's like 4 v 3 and if town mislynched a town at that point it becomes 3 v 3 and evils almost have a guaranteed win (depending on town roles).

That's LyLo, Lynch or Lose. MyLo wpuld be 5v3.

[DJarJar]

so, going to go to sleep soonish, don't like the amount of time that will be left when I get back with lack of interaction with the 2 new players but I blame distorted

[Ganelon]

I wanted to say that there is a chance I might be busy today, and I may not be able to post.
One last thing.
Naz, stop taking things so seriously, it's just a game me and Unknown aren't trying to annoy you, we're just thinking you could be evil! It's a natural part of the game, don't be so angery! If we did this none of us would be friends lol

[Ganelon]

I don't want to push the naz issue just yet - that's a matter for another time. I'm really gunning for blinkskater and Fiel at the moment, and for MM as well.

[Fielzanks]

There is virtually nothing pro scum about my role claim. If I was scum claiming the lookout/detective role I would have to implicate a team mate the following day with a lead to seem semi credible. And that is only half of the job, I have to say who visited them as well. The moment either one of us flip scum the other person is going down the drain too. The only way this would work as a scum would for some ungodly reason guess who someone visited (i could confirm this with scum night chat) AND who visited them. That's such a huge fucking leap to make that it's retarded to even attempt that. I'd also be outting my scum mate as a power role. Forcing a scum mate to be revealed day 2? LOL. This is also under the assumption that I am doing without consulting any of my scum mates either. Who would do that? I would seriously love to see this setup played with scum fake claiming Sleeper Agent day 1 lmao.

The people that are voting me are either people that cannot think too much on the situation and just see my claim and think SCUM, case closed... or are actually scum frothing at the mouth at a potential free lynch. Those people were MM, Naz and Fielzanks. Naz has kinda forced herself to stay true to that path with how much fucking time she has spent calling me scum it would be next level scum to just stop accusing me. MM seems opportunistic with this situation. Fielzanks wall posts breaking all wifom screams scum to me because I honestly read it as him seeing my claim as bullshit and maybe trying to force a CC on my role claim, pitting two town together? Aamirus made a read on his wall post which echos the same thoughts as mine. The post at face value screams pro town but what it did was just deconstruct a lot of the game. Making the game as confusing for scum is very important, why the fuck make things obvious for them? This is the biggest issue I have with him regarding me. He attempted to shatter all wifom regarding my claim. Why? Because you thought it was a shit play? There are numerous new people in this FM that could theoretically fall for it.

-vote Fielzanks

I remember saying that somewhere. That if your play was a WIFOM it would only work on complete newbies. Why would I accept something like that when the possibility of you being scum/potential scum is way higher than that? I have a habit of lynching every survivor I can get my hands on because they usually side with mafia (and they aren't obliged to do so); as a sleeper agent, you will have no choice but to SIDE with them. So even if you're town, you're NOT town. And that's only taking on the possibility that's you are stupid. if you're not, you've clearing chosen a role where you could pull shit bullshit off to stay alive and make the mafia gain a day. The only day they need to win, actually. That's pro-scum play because you're throwing extreme confusion into town and tried to make other TPR reveals to CC you. You're saying I'm scum because deconstructing the game makes it clear, while saying in the same paragraph that confusion is bad. Don't contradict yourself that much please.