S-FM 212: Paired Mafia

[MiniZed]

Before getting to Duckk's most recent post, something I've noticed from the setup spec:

A MILLAR SHOULD NOT CLAIM.

Millars are 3 HP and thus not insta-killed by the night kill. If they claim they are telling the mafia "go look in the other group and you might find a negative utility 1 HP town you can kill." If there's a Sheriff, they already know a Millar exists and you can claim your probably-unique role then if you are unluckily checked. Until then, think of yourself as someone who can take a bullet.

Speaking of which, I'm realizing now that random voting may have been a mistake.

IF YOU HAVE NOT VOTED YET, DO NOT VOTE, BUT INDICATE WHO YOU WOULD VOTE IF IT WAS END OF DAY.

Actors can only hammer and are also 1 HP. If we have one, our random voting will out the actor as being the only person who didn't vote, and if we don't have a doctor to heal them, RIP.

I'm not sure I find this post to be someone struggling to regain town cred by changing their mind, or if someone is actually changing their mind. I am inclined to believe it is more town than scum, but I'm not terribly convinced yet.

I just noticed I might be looking at this wrong. I'm going to read the setup because I don't think I understood it right away.

[MiniZed]

No. I would be outright claiming neutral as neutral.

Second, I have no opinion on a Yuki lynch.

Third, Duck stated something untrue, so I voted him.

Odd post. The neutral comment is an obvious lie because there are evil neutrals in this game. I'm not sure what you are pulling, as if you said that to convince people you wernt aware of that.

So I take this as a Null vote. who are you more inclined to vote currently?

You can't just vote someone for saying something false. That's not how a game works. People will always misinterprete stuff or get things wrong, and what you did was a OMGUS vote which is something you did a lot of in our previous games. You didn't even try to say why he was wrong and how he was lying about you. All you did was vote him which makes no sense.

[Eggy]

@Eggy , are you scum with Yuki and Duck?

how does that make any sense??? 3 scum in one group? no I am not scum with anyone

[Eggy]

-vote titus

seems very strange things she says do not seem to add up not sure where she is comming from as far as town perspective im thinking she is mafia but cud be potentially neutral. Yuki is probably neutral hoping to lurk out the game. Minized is town and so is duck

[Yukitaka Oni]

-vote titus

seems very strange things she says do not seem to add up not sure where she is comming from as far as town perspective im thinking she is mafia but cud be potentially neutral. Yuki is probably neutral hoping to lurk out the game. Minized is town and so is duck

So what you gonna do when you're sleeping? Claiming sleeping? Or letting me claim you're lurking like the same you just did to me? Trying to be an asshole player? Or trying to act scummy?

[Yukitaka Oni]

I've only just woke up, but I'm going to catch up once I'm not naked and have got ready. But what I've seen, Duck and Mz fight each other, little bit of fluff from yuki. Titus popped in and Frog is drinking on a plane.

@Frog try not to talk about, and link, other games you are playing xD you may end up accidently break a rule being drunk =)

v)x.o)> v(o.o(v kept you waiting huh?

[Yukitaka Oni]

That a lot of jumping vote, why my town is so weird this time?!?! A secret code or something ?

[Yukitaka Oni]

Look like group 1 have less vet than group 2, let's gas group 1 v(o.o(<

[Yukitaka Oni]

That a lot of jumping vote, why my town is so weird this time?!?! A secret code or something ?

Well could be a code since mafia doesn't have chat tho. Town should check every single pun, code, language, metaphor, sheeping vote and those who not on the lynch train. Remember, no russia v)x.o)> v(o.o(v

[Titus]

Are you claiming Survivor ?

No. I am town.

[Titus]

Odd post. The neutral comment is an obvious lie because there are evil neutrals in this game. I'm not sure what you are pulling, as if you said that to convince people you wernt aware of that.

So I take this as a Null vote. who are you more inclined to vote currently?

You can't just vote someone for saying something false. That's not how a game works. People will always misinterprete stuff or get things wrong, and what you did was a OMGUS vote which is something you did a lot of in our previous games. You didn't even try to say why he was wrong and how he was lying about you. All you did was vote him which makes no sense.

Don't tell me how to play. I can and will vote people for lying ty.

[Frog]

I'm here - was having technical issues - couldn't post on the site due to airline wifi restrictions - asked in skype to post my posts, but I'm kind of sure they were all meaningless drunken words string together without meaning. Lol.

[Titus]

i dont understand why you are defending Titus so much. If I am interpreting something wrong then why can she not say it herself?

Also, that question is the weakest question you can ask. There is obviously a reason you ask, and it doesn't even reflect their own opinion, or put it in a way that they are actually trying to solve the game. Why.

I wish I could vote you. Asking why someone votes someone else is common sense not being for or against a lynch.

If you wanted to know why I asked, you would ask me why I asked. Instead, you assumed my position and tried to frame things.

[Titus]

So what you gonna do when you're sleeping? Claiming sleeping? Or letting me claim you're lurking like the same you just did to me? Trying to be an asshole player? Or trying to act scummy?

More of these types of posts please. I kinda figured most would have determined my entry posts were made before heading to bed but hey...

[Frog]

I'm getting drunk as fuck

Flying like fucj

Follow me here:

Notes on gane: Matt zed I'd call an obv scum on my for objective perspective - slmething Calix used to do like nuts (see that gane where I was 3P and caught her within pg1 and saved her, lol.)

But yeah I'm straight town - MS is exactly the same with that reakext

Duck is pure as fucj. In no world is dicker ever not town. Ever. It's fucing obv.


Titus not being head butting is weird as fuck for me but I like it. I don't think it's alignment I dative at all - I e been therlyfh phases of May where my gane Ganges and this feels pro fir Titus. Ike I'm ducking psyched to see this now. Not up mention our new fans clog. Up with that ace attorney.

I gave a ridiculous TK foil but heh I'll say it for shots and jiggles - no no, it's too dumb, Ir can't be. Fuck that Anys.


I'm devil as fuck. I don't know who to vote but OH yEaA$ MZ

-1v]Marrt Zaed -1/.Staa

Oh I guess I posted here. Lol. Wtf.

[Frog]

Orpz you dolt he's in group 2.

As for things to happen since I left:
I'm actually a big fan of Duckk providing a quick read list now that people have had a chance to check in. He's not off the hook yet for moon logic, but he makes a read list that cites specific things people have been doing, so I'm not scumreading him as strongly as when I signed off last night.

Times like this remind me that Frog has an incredibly infuriating playstyle. Time and again I've seen him enter a game and refuse to give information until the last minute, and he's doing it again here. The only positions he's advanced is that Titus is hard to read, Duckk is obvious town, and I'm obvious scum. And yet he doesn't list the reasoning. How can I tell the difference between a Frog who's town hiding his reasons for supporting Duckk and scum Frog who's trying to pocket an active player? You can't. Right now he's pushing that I'm obv scum for having an "objective perspective," without going into any details of what that is or why it might be a scumtell. Discrediting one of the most vocal members of town so far without explaining why? Yeah, no. Not letting that slide. Frog is a scumlean and I'd be voting him now if he were in group 1.

HOLD. FROG. ACCOUNTABLE.

Eggy needs to read the setup, but him seeming to think Jester is actually a role in the game may have been a non-neutral slip.

Titus should post more substance. Null

Null on Orpz/SJ

ThePrince is reading the game and using their short post for substance. Townlean.

Weird. You're talking about me but not me so you're grandstanding. :-/

[Frog]

The *not to me

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

Last time I checked citizens are town. So, no. All town don't know roles.

Also, negative utility roles are not informed.

Why are you lying?

TOWN POSITIVE NOT ALL TOWN
I specifically said citizens know nothing

Negative utility are infomred because roles are unique.

Holy fuck why are you trolling us. You are not THIS bad. Please reread the setup or tell me what the fuck I am missing about the setup.

[Titus]

TOWN POSITIVE NOT ALL TOWN
I specifically said citizens know nothing

Negative utility are infomred because roles are unique.

Holy fuck why are you trolling us. You are not THIS bad. Please reread the setup or tell me what the fuck I am missing about the setup.

I am not trolling you. All roles are unique but the setup is vague as to what paired with means. Usually pairing in a setup refers to an investigative pairing.

No town roles have any information.

[SuperJack]

I am not trolling you. All roles are unique but the setup is vague as to what paired with means. Usually pairing in a setup refers to an investigative pairing.

No town roles have any information.

How about asking then?

[Titus]

How about asking then?

Why would I ask? If the mod intended for me to know something, it would be in my QT.

[ThePrince]

It is 100% factually true.
Mafia knows mafia
All town positive know their corresponding negative role
All neutral know the other neutral role
Citizens know nothing

What are you doing this game? I assume you are a tpr trying to play dumb citizen, but since this post revived your bad point, maybe you are just scum

I do not understand the bold.

Odd post. The neutral comment is an obvious lie because there are evil neutrals in this game. I'm not sure what you are pulling, as if you said that to convince people you wernt aware of that.

So I take this as a Null vote. who are you more inclined to vote currently?

You can't just vote someone for saying something false. That's not how a game works. People will always misinterprete stuff or get things wrong, and what you did was a OMGUS vote which is something you did a lot of in our previous games. You didn't even try to say why he was wrong and how he was lying about you. All you did was vote him which makes no sense.

How are you so sure about evil neutrals being in the game? Did I miss something in the setup?


-SuperJack seems to be role hunting.

[PLZLEAVEDUCKK]

it is mod confirmed that paired means in the game together, which is why i said if miller wanted to claim they should fake enabler.

Therefore your reasoning is now gone.

As for your bold inquiry prince,

If I am sheriff, I know a miller is in the game. If I am miller, I know sheriff is in the game.

Survivor knows cult, cult knows survivor, etc.

It is impossible for someone to not know another person's role unless they are citizen. The mafia know the name of the role, the other players only know the role exists.

[SuperJack]

@Quick

What does the Pairing mean?


Arguement will be solved, Now we can talk about real shit, instead of fuffing with stupid setup mechanics that are solved with a question.

So Yes, @Titus I'm not happy that you will drag this on. Its nothing but a distraction. You know better.

[Quick]

@Quick

What does the Pairing mean?


Arguement will be solved, Now we can talk about real shit, instead of fuffing with stupid setup mechanics that are solved with a question.

So Yes, @Titus I'm not happy that you will drag this on. Its nothing but a distraction. You know better.

This should be asked in the game thread or your QT.

Paired mafia is called paired mafia because roles are paired together. Look over the special mechanics in the setup thread to know what roles are paired with what.

[MattZed]

No. I would be outright claiming neutral as neutral.

Second, I have no opinion on a Yuki lynch.

Third, Duck stated something untrue, so I voted him.

@Titus , why do you prefer to vote people for saying untrue things? What does it actually accomplish for you in the game right now? (honest question)

@MattZed I make early reads list everygame, you are letting me off for the same type of reads list I gave at the start of my last game where I was traitor. Sad part is you scum read me for my AI stuff...

Zzz I type like 1wpm on mobile so frustrTing

@PLZLEAVEDUCKK , if you knew what about your behavior was AI and NAI, then you'd have a nearly-perfect winrate as scum by blending so darned well. You're not off the hook, and I want to see more from you.

-vote titus

seems very strange things she says do not seem to add up not sure where she is comming from as far as town perspective im thinking she is mafia but cud be potentially neutral. Yuki is probably neutral hoping to lurk out the game. Minized is town and so is duck

@Eggy , do you care to expand more on those reads, or are you just going to leave them there?

Weird. You're talking about me but not me so you're grandstanding. :-/

No, @Frog , I'm not. I was making a quick post in the morning because I had to go but wanted to leave instructions for how this day should go. You've been notorious for keeping things close to your chest as scum (see: Sen's nearly-canceled game or Fire's UPICK) unless you're under a lot of pressure. You've admitted yourself that it's up to town, not scum, to drive discussion, and if you're scum I'm not letting you get away with your historically successful scumplay.

On that note, do you have any reads that you would like to back up with reasoning? Surely the masterful Frog would have a lot to say right now as town.

Why would I ask? If the mod intended for me to know something, it would be in my QT.

This is playing just a bit dense. Perhaps it's just a difference in site culture, but a plain reading of the setup (and the discussion thereof in the setup there) confirms that roles are "paired" in the sense that if one is present in the game, then so is the other. Every non-citizen thus knows the existence of at least one other role in the game. Quick doesn't need to tell you this; it's just in the setup.

[MiniZed]

I do not understand the bold.



How are you so sure about evil neutrals being in the game? Did I miss something in the setup?


-SuperJack seems to be role hunting.

Well, if I'm following what I think the pairings mean, there is atleast one neutral evil in each pair, so this is what I think unless I'm wrong.

Even if I'm wrong, it's expected probably to have a neutral evil in the game but well figure it out when Quick answers SuperJacks question.

[MiniZed]

Well, if I'm following what I think the pairings mean, there is atleast one neutral evil in each pair, so this is what I think unless I'm wrong.

Even if I'm wrong, it's expected probably to have a neutral evil in the game but well figure it out when Quick answers SuperJacks question.

Jokes it's already answered -derp-. So I think I'm right about there being an evil regardless.

[MiniZed]

Matt, out of curiosity, you have practically ignored me this game. You haven't commented on anything and I'm not in your reads list.

[MattZed]

Matt, out of curiosity, you have practically ignored me this game. You haven't commented on anything and I'm not in your reads list.

Honestly, when I skimmed through the thread to read what I missed, I skipped over your posts because I thought they were mine.

[Frog]

@Titus , why do you prefer to vote people for saying untrue things? What does it actually accomplish for you in the game right now? (honest question)


@PLZLEAVEDUCKK , if you knew what about your behavior was AI and NAI, then you'd have a nearly-perfect winrate as scum by blending so darned well. You're not off the hook, and I want to see more from you.


@Eggy , do you care to expand more on those reads, or are you just going to leave them there?


No, @Frog , I'm not. I was making a quick post in the morning because I had to go but wanted to leave instructions for how this day should go. You've been notorious for keeping things close to your chest as scum (see: Sen's nearly-canceled game or Fire's UPICK) unless you're under a lot of pressure. You've admitted yourself that it's up to town, not scum, to drive discussion, and if you're scum I'm not letting you get away with your historically successful scumplay.

On that note, do you have any reads that you would like to back up with reasoning? Surely the masterful Frog would have a lot to say right now as town.

This is playing just a bit dense. Perhaps it's just a difference in site culture, but a plain reading of the setup (and the discussion thereof in the setup there) confirms that roles are "paired" in the sense that if one is present in the game, then so is the other. Every non-citizen thus knows the existence of at least one other role in the game. Quick doesn't need to tell you this; it's just in the setup.

Sure.

I was 30 drinks deep and posting with godly soup reads .

You're scum, duck is town. Ez

[MattZed]

Sure.

I was 30 drinks deep and posting with godly soup reads .

You're scum, duck is town. Ez

Kek.

But seriously, I would like to see some reasoning-based reads.

[Titus]

@MattZed , I can not believe you're asking me this. Liars are bad for us. They obfuscate things. If someone lies, then I want to know why. The best way to solve that is usually by voting. That's common sense.

-unvote

It however seems my perception was caused by sloppy setup design.

@SuperJack , if Duck claimed paired meant we all got free Bluetooth devices, would I be required to check that too?

[Titus]

Prince is town. Duck is probably town.

MiniZed is scum.

[Frog]

I'll be driving for the next 6-7 hours

I'll be accepting Mason applications

[MattZed]

In response to @MiniZed :
I would direct you to the part of the setup that says roles are unique and that the neutral roles are paired. Our neuts are either Survivor/Savior or SK/Exec.

What about Yuki's jokes gives you more of a scum impression than a null impression? Are you voting Yuki because he's seeming really scummy to you, or simply because he's scummier than everyone else? (also, there is a space in his name unless you meant to fakevote)

Titus seems to be more cautious with the few posts they've said. FROG seems to be drunk.

These are objective facts. Why do you phrase them as merely "seeming" to be?

[MattZed]

Prince is town. Duck is probably town.

MiniZed is scum.

That's a lot of conclusions to be making for someone who seems super intent on the argument that town are uninformed.

Would you like to share some reasons for these reads?

[Titus]

Prince is town. Duck is probably town. Sj town.

MiniZed is scum.

[Titus]

That's a lot of conclusions to be making for someone who seems super intent on the argument that town are uninformed.

Would you like to share some reasons for these reads?

Nope.

[MiniZed]

I'm not voting though am I?

[Titus]

Oh minized is in my group.

-vote MiniZed

[Titus]

I'll be driving for the next 6-7 hours

I'll be accepting Mason applications

I don't need a stinking mason. I'm applying for innocent child man.

[MattZed]

@MattZed , I can not believe you're asking me this. Liars are bad for us. They obfuscate things. If someone lies, then I want to know why. The best way to solve that is usually by voting. That's common sense.

-unvote

It however seems my perception was caused by sloppy setup design.

@SuperJack , if Duck claimed paired meant we all got free Bluetooth devices, would I be required to check that too?

Well, I don't accept that liars are necessarily bad for us. Sure, there are some sites with a very strong anti-liar meta, but there are times when it would be helpful for town if the right people could tell strategic lies. Concretely, we want the neuts right now to lie and say that they're town so that they can potentially take bullets for town. Lying in and of itself isn't unhelpful, but with poor execution or sinister motivations, it ends poorly for us.

Frankly, I'm fine that you want to investigate, (although you suffer the same problem as MiniZed in spelling your vote incorrectly) but I want to makes sure that you're not going to end up pushing a lynch just because someone lied.

[MattZed]

Nope.

I apologize that I made asking for reasoning seem like it was merely a request. It wasn't.

-vote Titus

[MiniZed]

In response to @MiniZed :
I would direct you to the part of the setup that says roles are unique and that the neutral roles are paired. Our neuts are either Survivor/Savior or SK/Exec.

What about Yuki's jokes gives you more of a scum impression than a null impression? Are you voting Yuki because he's seeming really scummy to you, or simply because he's scummier than everyone else? (also, there is a space in his name unless you meant to fakevote)


These are objective facts. Why do you phrase them as merely "seeming" to be?

I already covered this. I was telling Prince there is a confirmed evil, I wasn't sure if I was reading up on it correctly.

Why does Yuki joke about being scum? To me it's a weird joke that I don't expect Yuki to make unless trying to seem like typical Yuki. I also feel like they have been less involved in discussion than normal, as well as less memes 😂😂

Honestly, Italk how I talk. This is questionable in every game I play, including the game that I said I was "probably town" (I was town, SuperJack can confirm this) and so it's not something new it's just how I talk when playing this game.

[MiniZed]

Prince is town. Duck is probably town. Sj town.

MiniZed is scum.

You are voting people who

1.) Accuse you
2.) "make up stuff" about you
3.) have no proof to back up your thoughts, and
4.) Have refused to cooperate or even be part of discussion.

[Titus]

Well, I don't accept that liars are necessarily bad for us. Sure, there are some sites with a very strong anti-liar meta, but there are times when it would be helpful for town if the right people could tell strategic lies. Concretely, we want the neuts right now to lie and say that they're town so that they can potentially take bullets for town. Lying in and of itself isn't unhelpful, but with poor execution or sinister motivations, it ends poorly for us.

Frankly, I'm fine that you want to investigate, (although you suffer the same problem as MiniZed in spelling your vote incorrectly) but I want to makes sure that you're not going to end up pushing a lynch just because someone lied.

Sites that don't threaten liars with lynch are bad sites. I am not going to debate this with you. Of course town lie sometimes. Why is the question. Unsatisfactory answers get rope.

Sorry if that's not how you play. Yet, given my last few games, you should be well aware that I know what I am doing.

Pissed you cannot lie as scum or overbearing control freak? Pick one.

[MiniZed]

Sorry, 3 and 4 are actually directed at you I just got off track.

[Titus]

You are voting people who

1.) Attack everyone and their brother - check
2.) "make up stuff" about you - thought so, was wrong
3.) have no proof to back up their thoughts - check
4.) Have refused to cooperate or even be part of discussion. - check

Eat rope. You're making this easy.

[MiniZed]

Matt, I didn't fix my vote because I don't want to vote Yuki anymore.