S-FM 327 : Last Hope

[PQRnHack]

Yeah good luck finding a Priest when we have Archer, Rogue, and Vil->Paladin claims. What a load of shit. Is this guy a fucking idiot or a scum? And if you go like Ozy that i'm role hunting, EVERYONE FUCKING KNOWS THIS SHIT!

[PQRnHack]

This Yues play is so bad, I don't get it.

[Frinckles]

Also, I have another theory on Oberon I'd like the share. One more reasoning as to why he's Templar. Here's a refresher on the role card for it.

Templar (LVL 1) :
You are a templar.
You win whenever you reach level 3, or when you get lynched.
Upon being level 1 AND lynched, you will take down one of your voters with you (decided by RNG).
You can also win with the Shadows whatever your level is.

Cool Templar (LVL 2)
You are a templar, but a cooler one.
You earn a permanent night immunity.
You are close to a victory.
Being lynched won't make you win anymore

Very Cool Templar (LVL 3)
You are a templar, but a very cool one.
You have won.
You are not allowed to vote anymore, but can still post.
Your slot isn't counted anymore in the total number of votes needed to vote someone off.

At level 1 your win condition is to die. At level 3 you've won. At level 2 you're in some fucked up limbo.

Oberon has claimed PR and until MM was close to lynched, stuck with it. He's rescinded that to some ambiguous PR claim. Why?

Well because PRs are the first roles to get targeted by Magus or Wizards moving him closer to level 3.

Why the fakeclaim / almost killing MM? Standard Jester play. Make us angry for getting a town member killed while we're unable to deal with him. It'd essentially be a signal to scum that to not level him up in case he's still lvl1. Keep in mind at level 1 he can still win with the shadows.

While you digest that, you can think about his erratic play in general.

[Frinckles]

It will probably be shown on someone else the death description.

You do realize someone can be level-upped today and a priest can prevent someone's death tonight. Thus the idea of me being dead tonight is not true. Although I'm not sure if the one time ability bypass the skill of the priest though.

There is no priest in this game yet. And if you were Magus who leveled them up, they wouldn't be able to heal you.

[Lumi]

Not following your logic. The Darkness 1-shot Magus bullet can be used by either original Darkness or later-promoted shadow-Darkness, if it has not been used.
The logic for voting support-Shadow over Darkness is that lynching Darkness enables support-Shadow (with whatever level-up, if any) turns them into buffed Darkness+previous role's power(and retaining or missing whatever 1-shot Magus they had remaining - zero or one).

Lower downside risk is one reason, if Frinckles turns out to be scum, and we lynch blink first, then darkness gets a free kill on Magus~Yues with their one shot-weapon, whereas if we lynch Magus~Yues that one-shot weapon just never gets used.

Plus Frinckles explanation from a bit ago.

Plus Frinckles suggesting it makes Frinckles appear more town to me, since if he were scum, wouldn't he want the Magus target eliminated first so they could just use the Magus Killer weapon for free at night?

And then MM being afk was another reason - since we had no idea when or if he would come back, so MM's vote parked on Yuesford would help get the votes needed - that was one of my reasons for going along with the switch too, MM is back now though, but still think Yues first and if Yues flips red then lynch blink would be more prudent

[PQRnHack]

Also, I have another theory on Oberon I'd like the share. One more reasoning as to why he's Templar. Here's a refresher on the role card for it.



At level 1 your win condition is to die. At level 3 you've won. At level 2 you're in some fucked up limbo.

Oberon has claimed PR and until MM was close to lynched, stuck with it. He's rescinded that to some ambiguous PR claim. Why?

Well because PRs are the first roles to get targeted by Magus or Wizards moving him closer to level 3.

Why the fakeclaim / almost killing MM? Standard Jester play. Make us angry for getting a town member killed while we're unable to deal with him. It'd essentially be a signal to scum that to not level him up in case he's still lvl1. Keep in mind at level 1 he can still win with the shadows.

While you digest that, you can think about his erratic play in general.

I strongly disagree with arguments (not conclusions) of this post. Won't say why.

[PQRnHack]

There is no priest in this game yet. And if you were Magus who leveled them up, they wouldn't be able to heal you.

Magus can create a priest out of a vanilla villy. But they wont be able to use heal until N3 anyway!! So N2 Magus died, if attacked.

[CRichardForumLies]

So if Yues is scum, then I think that if they're a role that doesn't visit their partners then that confirms Frinckles and Blink as town.

[Frinckles]

--Oberon Theory I just posted--

Oh and also there was the whole part about everyone wanting him dead early D1 before I townread him and the wagon stopped. That could have been me ruining something he designed.

[Yuesford]

Oh wow. By your logic, if a Towny lied, it's trolling. But if you're evil, it's okay.
Even my opinion on what Oberon did is an acceptable town play looking for evils.
Why are playing a deception game again?

[Frinckles]

I strongly disagree with arguments (not conclusions) of this post. Won't say why.

👍

[Yuesford]

Aight, get me out of here. If I can't lie, I don't want to partake in this game any longer.
I'll stick to the arcade. I thought this had a higher level of competition.. Turns out it wasn't.

-vote Yuesford

[CRichardForumLies]

This Yues play is so bad, I don't get it.

The big question is if it's scum bad or village trolling bad.

[CRichardForumLies]

Aight, get me out of here. If I can't lie, I don't want to partake in this game any longer.
I'll stick to the arcade. I thought this had a higher level of competition.. Turns out it wasn't.

-vote Yuesford

Just so you know, if you happen to be village you are throwing here.

[PQRnHack]

So if Yues is scum, then I think that if they're a role that doesn't visit their partners then that confirms Frinckles and Blink as town.

Frinckles said Yues visited Blink. Explain your reasoning one more time pls?

[Frinckles]

Oh wow. By your logic, if a Towny lied, it's trolling. But if you're evil, it's okay.
Even my opinion on what Oberon did is an acceptable town play looking for evils.
Why are playing a deception game again?

Lol

If you're town who the hell are you trying to deceive here? They would KNOW that you are Magus. I know you visited Blinkskater and you can't explain why. You can't give a night action. You can't give us a roleclaim.

There are fringe cases where lying as Town makes sense. This isn't one of them.

[Frinckles]

Just so you know, if you happen to be village you are throwing here.

Self votes don't work on our site.

[Lumi]

Why? I don't understand. Their claims are not contradictory.

Also, Screw You @Oberon You Damn Troll
What was the point of your "move" lol

@Marshmallow Marshall
I should have said Frinckles vs blinkskater + Yuesford.

Since Frinckles claimed that Yuesford visited blinkskater.

Then assuming Frinckles is telling the truth AND assuming blink is town

What role could Yues be?
Choices are:

• Villager - can't visit and Frinckles wouldn't have been able to visit him if he was forced to visit by a Horror
• Templar - can't visit and Frinckles wouldn't have been able to visit him if he was forced to visit by a Horror
• Magus
• Town Power Role - technically possible, but very unlikely because him STILL insisting he is a villager is very game-throwy, he would have CC'd as one of the starting TPR's when 3 other people claimed
• Darkness - we're assuming blink is town, so blink would have reported being leveled up and then down, but he didn't just said leveled up
• Gargoyle - can't move
• Shaman - visits two people, and confirmed by Auwt that Archer would see two visits
• Fanatic - we're assuming that blink is town, Fanatic can only visit shadows
• Horror - we're assuming blink is town, so if he were town he would have reported
• Slime

So that means under our assumptions, Yues is either Slime or Magus. Scum would obviously know that Yues is not slime, therefore they would know Yues is magus, so he would have no reason to stay silent on him being Magus, but Yues continues to insist that he is Villager.

Which means the only way blink is town in this scenario is if Yues is a slime that just randomly decided to visit someone who darkness wasn't de-leveling. Why would a Janitor just randomly visit and risk getting caught by an archer (like he did). Doesn't make any sense, so that means blink AND Yues are both scum.

If blink AND Yues are scum, then that means it's best to try to eliminate the Shadow rather than Darkness and blink is more likely to be shadow in this scenario - therefore the vote on blink.

===

BUT since I posted that, the train has shifted to Yues first anyway, for reasons I posted earlier.

This vote should be extra clear for you, since you claimed RB and the only one that could do that is Magus, but Yues didn't visit you, therefore you know Yues can't be Magus if Frinckles is telling the truth.

So the targets in the thunderdome are either Yues or Frinckles.

[PQRnHack]

Is it a clue that ZZO reappeared barely in time to not get replaced by Helz?

[CRichardForumLies]

Frinckles said Yues visited Blink. Explain your reasoning one more time pls?

So here is my thought process.
If blink is town, then Yues is never darkness as blink never mentioned having their level reduced as well right?
Lets look through what scum roles Yues cannot be.

Yues cannot be Gargoyle because they can't move.
Yues is not Shaman because assuming Frinckles is a legit archer, they would have said Yues visited two people.
If Yues is Fanatic, then blink is outed scum here.
Has anyone explained a plausible world where a slime visits someone and that target doesn't die?
Yet none of the PR claims is a healer as far as I know.

Blink is only scum with Yues if the latter is fanatic.

[CRichardForumLies]

Self votes don't work on our site.

Ok yet I still don't like the intention behind it.

[Lumi]

So if Yues is scum, then I think that if they're a role that doesn't visit their partners then that confirms Frinckles and Blink as town.

If Yues is scum, then blink is scum, unless Yues happens to be slime. In which case blink is almost certainly town

[Yuesford]

I already stated I'm town. So I didn't throw.
As early as day 2. I cannot divulge the voyage I am into.
But if you still think I'm evil, It's a democracy and I'll let you guys figure things out the ff. day.

[Lumi]

Is it a clue that ZZO reappeared barely in time to not get replaced by Helz?

No, if anything him NOT reappearing would have been a clue lol

[CRichardForumLies]

When we have a 1 for 1, we start with whoever the investigative claim has a red check on.
Which in this case is Yues as they aren't claiming a village PR role. So therefore one of Frinckles/Yues is lying.

-vote Yuesford

[Yuesford]

who said I'm a Magus?? I'm just a lonely Villager

[Frinckles]

Random Magus brainstorm:

Fire: Didn't happen, no deaths.
Water: Unlikely N1 unless the Magus super confident.
Ground: Possible.
Ice: Likely. MM claims roleblocked; another person would have to be level zero and targeted too. Assuming RNG.
Thunder: Possible.
Psychic: If Yuesford was witched to Blinkskater, the real Magus would have spoken up by now.
Explosive: Unlikely but I guess we can find out tomorrow lol

[Lumi]

So here is my thought process.
If blink is town, then Yues is never darkness as blink never mentioned having their level reduced as well right?
Lets look through what scum roles Yues cannot be.

Yues cannot be Gargoyle because they can't move.
Yues is not Shaman because assuming Frinckles is a legit archer, they would have said Yues visited two people.
If Yues is Fanatic, then blink is outed scum here.
Has anyone explained a plausible world where a slime visits someone and that target doesn't die?
Yet none of the PR claims is a healer as far as I know.

Blink is only scum with Yues if the latter is fanatic.

Blink is scum if Yues is Darkness or Fanatic.
???? if Yues is Shaman or Gargoyle or Horror
Blink is 95% town if Yues is slime (5% chance of slime is super big brain play by visiting a teammate banking on them getting caught, then flipped slime, therefore clearing their teammate. Or more likely just random targeting because apathy)
Blink is indeterminant (go back to reads) if Yues is Magus who wants town to lose

[CRichardForumLies]

who said I'm a Magus?? I'm just a lonely Villager

Well obviously not you that's for sure.

[CRichardForumLies]

Blink is scum if Yues is Darkness or Fanatic.
???? if Yues is Shaman or Gargoyle or Horror
Blink is 95% town if Yues is slime (5% chance of slime is super big brain play by visiting a teammate banking on them getting caught, then flipped slime, therefore clearing their teammate. Or more likely just random targeting because apathy)
Blink is indeterminant (go back to reads) if Yues is Magus who wants town to lose

I really hope Yues isn't a gamethrowing town.
Otherwise I'll lose all respect I had for everyone on this site.

[CRichardForumLies]

Yeah if Yues is Darkness, then blink can only be starting shadow as they never said anything about being levelled down.
I'd think that town!blink would have said they were leveled down first thing if Magus+Darkness both targetted them.
Then again I see this game is chock full of trolls, so maybe I'm just blowing smoke.

[Frinckles]

@Marshmallow Marshall
I should have said Frinckles vs blinkskater + Yuesford.

Since Frinckles claimed that Yuesford visited blinkskater.

Then assuming Frinckles is telling the truth AND assuming blink is town

What role could Yues be?
Choices are:

• Villager - can't visit and Frinckles wouldn't have been able to visit him if he was forced to visit by a Horror
• Templar - can't visit and Frinckles wouldn't have been able to visit him if he was forced to visit by a Horror
• Magus
• Town Power Role - technically possible, but very unlikely because him STILL insisting he is a villager is very game-throwy, he would have CC'd as one of the starting TPR's when 3 other people claimed
• Darkness - we're assuming blink is town, so blink would have reported being leveled up and then down, but he didn't just said leveled up
• Gargoyle - can't move
• Shaman - visits two people, and confirmed by Auwt that Archer would see two visits
• Fanatic - we're assuming that blink is town, Fanatic can only visit shadows
• Horror - we're assuming blink is town, so if he were town he would have reported
• Slime

So that means under our assumptions, Yues is either Slime or Magus. Scum would obviously know that Yues is not slime, therefore they would know Yues is magus, so he would have no reason to stay silent on him being Magus, but Yues continues to insist that he is Villager.

Which means the only way blink is town in this scenario is if Yues is a slime that just randomly decided to visit someone who darkness wasn't de-leveling. Why would a Janitor just randomly visit and risk getting caught by an archer (like he did). Doesn't make any sense, so that means blink AND Yues are both scum.

If blink AND Yues are scum, then that means it's best to try to eliminate the Shadow rather than Darkness and blink is more likely to be shadow in this scenario - therefore the vote on blink.

===

BUT since I posted that, the train has shifted to Yues first anyway, for reasons I posted earlier.

This vote should be extra clear for you, since you claimed RB and the only one that could do that is Magus, but Yues didn't visit you, therefore you know Yues can't be Magus if Frinckles is telling the truth.

So the targets in the thunderdome are either Yues or Frinckles.

Succinctly spoken.

[Lumi]

Random Magus brainstorm:

Fire: Didn't happen, no deaths.
Water: Unlikely N1 unless the Magus super confident.
Ground: Possible.
Ice: Likely. MM claims roleblocked; another person would have to be level zero and targeted too. Assuming RNG.
Thunder: Possible.
Psychic: If Yuesford was witched to Blinkskater, the real Magus would have spoken up by now.
Explosive: Unlikely but I guess we can find out tomorrow lol

Each power is a one time use and it's done. After all powers are used then no more powers for Magus other than leveling up.

Because of that I think a Magus playing well would have saved Ground, Fire, Explosive, and Psychic states as those seem the strongest.

Water actually seems like a w/e throwaway skill that is okay to just make a gamble with night 1.
Thunder too - although that one runs the risk of massively backfiring

Ice is actually the most likely night 1 Magus ability I believe, making MM's claim more believable - and Magus~Yues much less believable

[CRichardForumLies]

If Yues isn't the Magus, the real one should speak up before EoD so we can resolve this one way or the other.
This day is giving me a headache.

[CRichardForumLies]

Each power is a one time use and it's done. After all powers are used then no more powers for Magus other than leveling up.

Because of that I think a Magus playing well would have saved Ground, Fire, Explosive, and Psychic states as those seem the strongest.

Water actually seems like a w/e throwaway skill that is okay to just make a gamble with night 1.
Thunder too - although that one runs the risk of massively backfiring

Ice is actually the most likely night 1 Magus ability I believe, making MM's claim more believable - and Magus~Yues much less believable

Yet Frinckles said Yues visited Blink.
So assuming MM was indeed roleblocked and Yues was Magus who used roleblock on MM, Frinckles should have said that if the latter is real Archer.

[Frinckles]

I really hope Yues isn't a gamethrowing town.
Otherwise I'll lose all respect I had for everyone on this site.

Hey that's a little extreme. We have 3 or 4 players new to FM this game; If anything LagAttack's first game should be an impressive sight. Sometimes shit happens.

[Lumi]

Yeah if Yues is Darkness, then blink can only be starting shadow as they never said anything about being levelled down.
I'd think that town!blink would have said they were leveled down first thing if Magus+Darkness both targetted them.
Then again I see this game is chock full of trolls, so maybe I'm just blowing smoke.

Technically blink could be Templar too and Magus leveled up a Shadow/Darkness/(OzyWho lol)

But templar~blink seems... wild, unbelievably so

[Frinckles]

Yet Frinckles said Yues visited Blink.
So assuming MM was indeed roleblocked and Yues was Magus who used roleblock on MM, Frinckles should have said that if the latter is real Archer.

I don't see the confusion.

[Yuesford]

Why would I throw lol.
It's not my decision to lynch an important town role. The votes are democratic.
I already stated I'm town. If you guys won't believe it, then vote me. It's that simple. After that, you guys can sort things out.
It's a fine play. Wilhelm Steinitz would be proud of me.

[Lumi]

If Yues isn't the Magus, the real one should speak up before EoD so we can resolve this one way or the other.
This day is giving me a headache.

I'm not so sure about that - if Frinckles is Archer->Ranger and he just caught two scum for town to lynch, the real Magus doesn't need to reveal, what would they say anyway?

"Hi, I'm Magus, I Ice powered MM + {random villager here}, I'm dead tonight now, ty"

[Lumi]

Yet Frinckles said Yues visited Blink.
So assuming MM was indeed roleblocked and Yues was Magus who used roleblock on MM, Frinckles should have said that if the latter is real Archer.

Right, it's one more reason why Magus~Yues seems unlikely when we're in a town~Frinckles world

[Frinckles]

So this is scum Yues giving up here. Scum MM wouldn't lie about being roleblocked because it'd confirm him as scum.

Kind of wish he atleast tried to lie though.

[WrathCyber]

I don't like how angry Paochan sounds. Frinckles could've bullshitted us all and be making a grand templar play as all we know.

[WrathCyber]

Why is ceko off the table for being scum again? Ceko could be scum, with Frinckles being templar, and zzorange being magus.

[Yuesford]

Not really. My death can contribute to town a lot. Cos I know for a certain that Frinckles is one of the evils in this game. The domino will fall apart once after this day.

-vote Frinckles

[WrathCyber]

Sorry I'm just a mod player. Ignore everything that I've said like you guys have been this whole time using the excuse that I'm a templar. xD

[Lumi]

Why is ceko off the table for being scum again? Ceko could be scum, with Frinckles being templar, and zzorange being magus.

Either Frinckles is lying or Yues is lying, one of them is scum, lynch one of them, and if wrong then lynch the other. That's why ceko is off the table for day 2

[ZZorange]

This frinkles guy is tryharding way 2 hard.

-vote Frinckles

[WrathCyber]

Curious, then who DID level @blinkskater up if it is not Paochan?

[Lumi]

Sorry I'm just a mod player. Ignore everything that I've said like you guys have been this whole time using the excuse that I'm a templar. xD

I won't ignore you, let's talk. Do you understand why the choice for today is Frinckles or Yues?