S-FM 361: Rectangle VS. Rhombus (Small-Town Mafia) (13P)

[Aeoryi]

Yes and I did

[Stellaria]

I never even said I thought you were scum. I pointed out a flaw in your logic, and your response was atrocious. And now you're making it worse for yourself. Maybe it threatened you that JMW wanted to vote for the Lawyer and you had to back your partner up?

[Stellaria]

Say whatever shit you want to say. Think what you wanna, but you're not conf!town and you living in your head where you being scum is inconceivable isn't going to help you. I'm still keeping my vote on Auwt. That being said, when town sees you for the unhelpful little gremlin that you are, I don't want to hear shit about how I "started" a train against you. You've done this to yourself.

[Stellaria]

Actually, that was really rude of me. I'm genuinely sorry for calling you a gremlin.

[The Lawyer]

Thats a pretty unfair way to put it.

Yes I jumped on catching bad reasoning from you D2. Your night action made zero sense and more than that the conclusions you drew made zero sense. Very honestly you still have not explained what you were thinking and I am pretty damn sure its simply because that reasoning does not exist. You just did not understand or see value in some of my pushes and disliked my D1 reasoning on Phraze so you had a scum lean on me and slapped an action on me.
I waited to hear from you if you had bothered to ask the host questions about how your role worked like 'can I block day actions.' That was a bit of a trap because I already had asked them and I figured I could catch you in a lie. You kept wanting to talk about anything under the sun other than your reasoning and that really made me dig in thinking you were just scum trying to avoid a subject that was uncomfortable for you to explain.

Going back and looking at it I still think your case on Phraze was bad. You assumed we are aligned which is simply not true and you felt MM was killed because he disliked Phraze saying the word 'interesting.' Thats quite honestly not great to the point I would probably still be pointing it out today, although I have the bias of knowing the majority of your case is totally incorrect about me being teamed with Phraze.

As I said your push on Phraze is absolutely no pillow push. Room for an absurd deep wolf bus but I have really only seen that done a few games ever and its extremely unlikely to the point many players view it as borderline gamethrowing if it does not work. That said your almost certainly town who for some reason just refused to answer basic questions and got lucky on your push D2. Pretty much my conclusion there.

In hind sight I did like that you bothered to read back through and question 'why would MM be targeted.' The way you voiced that within your read was much too soft to be simply grabbing town cred.
I also believe we have a hard difference in playstyle. You view behavior you do not understand as scummy and point to it as opposed to going at the person directly and asking them to clarify what you do not understand. It was your choice to assume I was pushing you in bad faith and avoid interacting with me yesterday but it was my mistake for just hard tunneling on that playstyle difference and actually read into your thought process on the case you were pushing on Phraze.
I also assumed bad faith looking at how so many people were shoving them and softly defending / making excuses for you; which made me feel it was a LHF push on the 1 role that would be critical for mafia to eliminate if town. Felt very opportunistic when other slots had so little posts of substance and took zero pressure. Even EOD I think I was the only one to question Phraze' BD targets with others jumping to the conclusion 'Well they flip town this will lock-clear JMW' which felt like wolves pushing for a known misslynch and speculating on the known result to me.

Maybe that clears up some of my thinking. I did speak a little bit in the Networker chat about how I did not want to fuel the fire on the Phraze lynch given the low justification dog pile but really questioned their choice of night actions.

When you explain it this way, it actually makes more sense.

I couldnt help but notice that your slot had a lot of power on D1 with how a lot of people were townreading you and trusted you, which in my opinion is too early to be trusting someone to the point of following them... I think I never played with you before and therefore don't know what you are capable as scum. So I couldn't have helped but wonder, what if you were evil and everyone was just following you. I felt that your alignment should at least be poked before people start to follow you.

[Stellaria]

Having said most everything I have about Aeoryi, my only other thought is this: their ISO is garbage

[Stellaria]

They never even pushed particularly hard on the failed heal of MM being caused by a Bus Driver. They seemed more convinced that it was because of a Roleblock. I don't even know why they're taking credit for anything at all. The rest of their ISO is just more and more apathy

[Stellaria]

I guess that's a weird thing to think it was considering the Escort is Lawyer. It implies they aren't partnered. But then again, JMW claimed first so it's meaningless outside of that credit, whether sought or not.

[Stellaria]

That being said, I've reassessed you, just a little bit.

r you claiming I would be incapable of pushing players as wolf

To re-answer this question, yes. Your apathy tells me you're incapable of pushing anybody regardless of whether or not you're a wolf.

Sad

[Stellaria]

I town-read you Helz. I feel like we're coming to similar conclusions separately from each other and that feels good.

[Helz]

So Auwt-

Spoiler : Wall :

Some small early pokes like pointing out my original message included talk on claims and an insinuation of SJ/POD pocketing. Then they voice their reads in one of the most odd ways I have ever seen:

Spoiler : My post they respond to :

Read wall (and then I am all out of braincells for this game D1) I did double read doing separate reads on the player and their mech but kinda writing mech as a conclusion. Too tired to polish it.

Totally off the table / Outside of reason:

Tauntshaman
0 Poster and our Sheriff. Will hurt if they do not get N1.. Totally understandable given signups started literally half a year ago
Really rough for town if this slot gets smited or looses their N1. We will deal with that bullshit as it happens I guess.

Aeroyi
The BG. Honestly even if he was mafia right now I could give a fuck less. He is either a large benefit to town or a total detriment to mafia as a role. Would lynch if I had a reason but not gona burn braincells hunting on this slot. I would activly be against lynching this slot. Zero reason to waste it on them imo

Town leans / bad lynch:
(Keep in mind these are D1 soft as fuck)

Marshmallow Marshall
Walks in cautioning on applying town cred for effort. Knows me well there. Also confused by my first post which was a mess (part of why I said fuck it and posted it) and their initial reaction #25 reads well there. Follows up pressuring Phraze for content. Supports not claiming targeting and pushes against host meta RVS break. That goes on for a while and fits their view that its not a good path. They are absolutely constant in their view in both pushing against my strat and embracing RVS/Pressuring for content with votes. They did at some point actively push against what I was up to, but quite honestly I am not sure if its AI given their very healthy level of skepticism for what I do. I want to say they were in a game I I power wolfed and just marched the entire town towards hell while people sheeped me off reputation.
At the end of the day they appear to have hard pushed for the benefit of town as they see things. I do not see any position by them that could not fall into a town mindset or anything I view as opportunistic. Feels like their town play. Mid level risk and reward role but quite honestly even as I disagree with them on a very few things everything they are doing feels in line with what their view of pushing the interests of the town team is.

Powerofdeath
Not aligned with Horkos. They are keeping up with the game but have not taken many hard stances. A hand full of original contributions, asks pointed questions, certainly not sheeping or blending. They are not leveraging their vote power at all and seem to be watching things unfold..
Mechanically game breaking as scum and a mid/high level issue for scum. The bitch mode in me would rather just assume he is not scum and its broken for him to be scum but also, their play feels soft and noncommittal. They are not pushing the game forward and have a seat to be a leadership role but choose not to. I do not like that.

SuperJack
Pushes all over the place and argues for formal RVS style as they push other players to vote. I feel like this lines up with their mindset of progressing the game state. They push against mech talk and encourage classic formal RVS. Not much outside of that but its D1. Really low impact role that both Town and Mafia probably wont have much equity and feels slightly townie to me.

Neutral:

jmw
Against dictating PR's which is a good stance although I would have been much more aggressive about it and for different reasoning. Seems to have a consistent view on mech crunching. Hard questions the direction of chat and is resistant to mech breaking RVS. Supports Mech crunching on night actions each day. Skeptical while also poking reads. Not awful
The doc. Medium equity for scum and high equity for town to protect. They have been active and I do not see a reason to push them. I would be against their lynch

Phraze
Post of note would be #99 imo. I feel they really have not read the setup there. Slight town lean given they would be in some Mafia chat talking about who to kill if they were not town. Pretty much that reason alone I see them as more likely town. Also low post and reasoning getting pushed makes them feel like LHF
Very powerful role for either Town or Mafia. Still stuck on their ignorance. Would have to argue faking a town slip of not knowing the setup is open to justify them being scum so I am not in support of their lynch.

Gikkle
Calls out mech stuff with a valid point. They pay attention. Follows up with some pushes. Healthy if trying to break RVS. I do like that they push in all directions. They also push against mech RVS break but it resolves in conversation. I do dislike that they do not have a focus. While they are participating in chat they are not really driving it forward or interested in participation.
Mechanically very neutral and not of note. Would really like to see them do more to drive the conversation and take a hard stance especially given their role. Low equity in a D1 lynch imo.

Scum:

Horkos
Only a few posts and literally EVERY one of them is focused on them being able to use their night action. Not aligned with POD..
Mechanically Jailor is low equity to kill or keep alive. I would not be opposed to their lynch but I would also have a very hard "Why" given the other options

Auwt
Gut votes JWM uhhh. Pretty sure that’s it? The empty slot that vote parked JMW. Please do not consider his vote if you wagonomics late game >.> 50% sure Auwt did a vote park play to bus in an FM I was in years back. Vet role which gets a pass for analysis they have apparently decided to take pretty liberally. I could easily see them doing some distance vote and would argue M/M potential with JWM later but not much to talk about, the vote is also opportunistic if scum which is of note.. Scummy but also full speculation scummy and the game did have a half year sign up and little notification for start so ehh?

The Lawyer
Very few posts. I think their only real post not excusing their lack of posts was asking me who I would keep alive which I had basically already said. I am uncomfortable with this slot. Low Proformance and contribution while feeling the need to excuse the lack of contribution
I feel their role is decent equity on a lynch. The constantly excusing their lack of participation is not great and it’s a role with more value for scum than for town. Until the PRs that exist in the game change
They are also a bit of total speculation as opposed to actively scummy which ehh?

Ewianking
You can Iso them in like 4 posts or something. Kinda town reads myself and Gikkle and softly pokes 'The Lawyer'
Very high equity lynch. Low posts that feel blendy appeasing vocal players without taking much of a stance on anything.
I am between The Lawyer and Ewianking for a lynch.
Only a few posts and literally EVERY one of them is focused on them being able to use their night action. Not aligned with POD?
Jailor- Low equity to kill or keep alive. Also not great 100% of their posts have been night action focused. I would not be opposed to their lynch but I would also have a very hard "Why"

Take that order, remove myself, put all scum-tagged in Neutral, and reverse this order.

This would actually decently mirror my current thoughts.

I do not even know how it would be AI but its like "Yeah, that list but totally change it fliiping this way and that"
They clarify and I draw this conclusion:

I am under the assumption now that your reads are something like:

Town:
Auwt

Neutral:
Ewianking
The Lawyer
Horkos
Gikkle Phraze
Jmw

Scum:
Superjack
Powerofdeath
Marshmallow Marshall

Can you explain why you find POD, SJ, and MM so scummy?

They do not ever provide reasoning for their reads.

D2 first thing they soft defend The Lawyer making excuses for them and voicing how Vigi / Jailor coulda done the kill with me still doing the factional. Pretty much reflects they did not read the earlier posts where both Vigi and Jailor were claimed no-kill.

They then soft push JMW and voice they were correct on JMW D1. I will note they never so much as said JMW's name D1 and the only thing it connects with is my assumption of what their reads were placing JMW at the bottom of their neutral pool.

I later poke them to stop giving excuses for The Lawyer given it prevents me from getting the players thoughts and mention something about Phraze- they immediately correct me stating "I don't recall having pushed or even interacted at the slightest with Phraze"
Of tiny note but they are very aware of their interactions with that slot specifically.

They conclude Town Phraze clears JMW; then at some point POD asks why they are not voting but they are gone for the day.

D3 they hard town read Horkos and The Lawyer while voicing suspicion on Aeroyi. Then their is their second odd post

Their 462 post has reasoning I disagree with. I point out how me using a BD would result in me being caught and they point out it would be handled as a thunderdome. Yeah.. Sounds like an outstanding thing for town.
They point out good reasoning on how as scum making a lookout play for town cred makes sense, although I do still feel using it to hard confirm a role as town would still be a questionable play. They question a 'slip' by me saying 'went out of my way to confirm a town.' I just do not follow there. Then it leads into how I can prove JMW is not scum making me feel they did not catch the sheriff had a town peek on the slot as well.

TLDR-
They have voiced their reads D1 in one of the oddest ways I have ever seen. "Yeah, I think that too. Just flip these two categories and invert the list of that and remove this player and that category" Duno if thats AI but its so out of place..

They seem to not be tracking PR moves. Missing Vig/Jailor stuff D2 while speculating around it, then maybe missing sheriff peek D3 while speculating around it.

They were very aware of their stance on Phraze

Not much to go with there. Doesn't look scummy as hell with many things just seeming odd but certainly does not look very towny.

I would like to hear @Auwt could you clearly explain what your reads on players are? Im still very unsure where you stand

[Stellaria]

I ISO'd Gikkle and found myself wanting more.

[Helz]

When you explain it this way, it actually makes more sense.

I couldnt help but notice that your slot had a lot of power on D1 with how a lot of people were townreading you and trusted you, which in my opinion is too early to be trusting someone to the point of following them... I think I never played with you before and therefore don't know what you are capable as scum. So I couldn't have helped but wonder, what if you were evil and everyone was just following you. I felt that your alignment should at least be poked before people start to follow you.

I understand. Not to toot my own horn but I power wolf very well. You are right to be paranoid. Effort is one of those things that gets "read as" towny while its not but I do feel I have pushed a number of things that does not make sense for a powerwolf to do. I think a large contributing factor to us talking past etchother was my bias on your case of me aligned with Phraze to the point I failed to consider how genuine it could be.

I think you specifically should consider my thoughts on letting me take lookout. Even if you do not trust me if I took BD it easily can result in a thunderdome (same as a sheriff red check) while me having lookout can really help sort the game, and I do feel with the amount I have posted I should be able to be sorted in day chat.

[Stellaria]

I kind of like the conversation they were having with you Helz but not enough to think anything in particular about him. Nothing really seemed indicative of his alignment so I null-read him for now.

[Aeoryi]

They never even pushed particularly hard on the failed heal of MM being caused by a Bus Driver. They seemed more convinced that it was because of a Roleblock. I don't even know why they're taking credit for anything at all. The rest of their ISO is just more and more apathy

I justified why I thought it was a Roleblock quote clearly that day.

[Helz]

I town-read you Helz. I feel like we're coming to similar conclusions separately from each other and that feels good.

We seem to think the same which I very much like. You have yet to draw a conclusion I disagree with. The only things I have questioned so far was your awkward entry to the Network chat and your target on the Doc.

Im honestly just gona give it time. You seem like a strong player and a part of me hopes you just snag a red peek to kill my paranoia.

I do still think before days end you should get a good understanding with the Jailor on who he will target if we do not lynch.

[Aeoryi]

I never even said I thought you were scum. I pointed out a flaw in your logic, and your response was atrocious. And now you're making it worse for yourself. Maybe it threatened you that JMW wanted to vote for the Lawyer and you had to back your partner up?

I'm... not sure if that's completely true, unfortunately.

[Stellaria]

Dead
Marshmallow Marshall
powerofdeath
Phraze

Me
Stellaria

Reads List
jmw
Helz
Horkos
ewianking
The Lawyer
Gikkle
SuperJack
Aeoryi
Auwt

This is where I stand for now.

[Aeoryi]

Interestingly, a setup prospect could be that both Lawyer and Phraze are scum, successfully giving them the required counterplay to stop the many roles

either way, I will be protecting Ewian lookout him if you wish do whatever

[Stellaria]

We seem to think the same which I very much like. You have yet to draw a conclusion I disagree with. The only things I have questioned so far was your awkward entry to the Network chat and your target on the Doc.

Im honestly just gona give it time. You seem like a strong player and a part of me hopes you just snag a red peek to kill my paranoia.

I do still think before days end you should get a good understanding with the Jailor on who he will target if we do not lynch.

You just reminded me of what was mentioned earlier, that being that Jailed players aren't actually protected from kills. Could I not just... check a Jailed player and get a result?

[Helz]

I will also say there is the potential of town trying to mech lock the game.

BG- Stops kill and kills the killer
Doc- Stops kill
Escort- Stops the factional
Jailor- Stops the factional

Vet- Could only factional
Survivor- Could only factional
Networker- Could only factional

Sheriff- Hunts
Lookout- Catches lies and Hunts

Vig- Can double kill if evil

Duno if its good to try right now but to be kept in mind- If we full on trust JMW, The Lawyer, and Horkos thats things that prevent kills with 2 invests running about hunting. Then BG is self resolving. Kinda a lot of power in the towns hands where more nights = more information while mafia takes a lot of risk.

[Helz]

Interestingly, a setup prospect could be that both Lawyer and Phraze are scum, successfully giving them the required counterplay to stop the many roles

either way, I will be protecting Ewian lookout him if you wish do whatever

I hope thats wifom. Your role does nothing if you declare who you are protecting. You need to be the land mine the mafia step on.

[Stellaria]

I will also say there is the potential of town trying to mech lock the game.

BG- Stops kill and kills the killer
Doc- Stops kill
Escort- Stops the factional
Jailor- Stops the factional

Vet- Could only factional
Survivor- Could only factional
Networker- Could only factional

Sheriff- Hunts
Lookout- Catches lies and Hunts

Vig- Can double kill if evil

Duno if its good to try right now but to be kept in mind- If we full on trust JMW, The Lawyer, and Horkos thats things that prevent kills with 2 invests running about hunting. Then BG is self resolving. Kinda a lot of power in the towns hands where more nights = more information while mafia takes a lot of risk.

Jailor/Horkos could also double-kill if evil. And I guess Vet/Auwt could get another kill for Mafia, too, but I don't think anybody in their right mind would ever visit him.

Mech-wise maybe an argument could be made that the Mafia has something like a Jailor, Vig, or Vet to balance the power out, too.

[Helz]

You just reminded me of what was mentioned earlier, that being that Jailed players aren't actually protected from kills. Could I not just... check a Jailed player and get a result?

I believe so yes-
My point is if you check the jailed person and they are executed it wastes a town action of your check. We get their alignment already in their flip so you targeting his target is a waste in a world where he wants to execute. I do believe he voiced that he would be willing to be trigger happy.

The other bit is there is just no downside to him saying who he is going to jail There is no mechanic in the game that can screw with that

[Stellaria]

I believe so yes-
My point is if you check the jailed person and they are executed it wastes a town action of your check. We get their alignment already in their flip so you targeting his target is a waste in a world where he wants to execute. I do believe he voiced that he would be willing to be trigger happy.

The other bit is there is just no downside to him saying who he is going to jail There is no mechanic in the game that can screw with that

Oh I guess I missed the bit where he said he'd be fine being trigger happy. Fair enough I guess.

[Helz]

It was somewhere D1. POD (mayor) and him were getting into it and people question if he even protects. He said if not he would just always kill (but also then did not kill POD N1)

[Helz]

Jailor/Horkos could also double-kill if evil. And I guess Vet/Auwt could get another kill for Mafia, too, but I don't think anybody in their right mind would ever visit him.

Mech-wise maybe an argument could be made that the Mafia has something like a Jailor, Vig, or Vet to balance the power out, too.

Yeah, Without BD I don't see a vet kill as a real potential and Horkos I am pretty confident as town. Their N1 target and lack of kill made no sense for Mafia but did make sense for a townie frustrated with a mayor who wanted to prevent their action.

For balance someone said the host said roles are randomed. A lot of people felt some type of way about me speculating on balance this game but the setup this setup was based upon was designated to random rolls. I just didn't believe it because of how broken a Mafia Mayor would make the game. Put 1 half decent power wolf in on a team that coordinates with 4 votes +1 from mayor and town would be so fucked.

[Stellaria]

This is miserable

[Helz]

This is miserable

I did say its been a bit of a slog. The website issues are certainly not helping when your digging and the internet decides "nope, come back later"

So I will probably not be around EOD.

Helz posts a lot.
SuperJack I wanna say T but, reservations for now.
Gikkle seems to be the kinda player I have trouble reading.
Marshmellow seems adamant on pushing me. Meh.

No impression from everyone else.

Townreading Superjack felt odd. Only stance taken combined with the odd vote.

Maybe TMI handing out town credit too easily? Hard to find anything of real value to go off Phaze iso but that and the other odd vote thing feel awkward.

[Stellaria]

I did say its been a bit of a slog. The website issues are certainly not helping when your digging and the internet decides "nope, come back later"



Townreading Superjack felt odd. Only stance taken combined with the odd vote.

Maybe TMI handing out town credit too easily? Hard to find anything of real value to go off Phaze iso but that and the other odd vote thing feel awkward.

Good find. He stays exactly where he is currently on my readslist, though

[Helz]

Good find. He stays exactly where he is currently on my readslist, though

Yeah. Theres not much to do with it. But in their only 'read list' its the only person mentioned where they even say something associated with alignment.

Quite honestly looking at it now I should have pinged on this post. Making a reads list that hardly addresses reads is actually something I have seen scum do before. They say things without conclusions and stay noncommittal.

Any thoughts as to why Gikkle made a chat and did not bother to include themselves? There targeting was also interesting.

Both protectives, Me, and the new zero post sheriff.

[Stellaria]

I could try to find a meta reason. I've played quite a few games with Gikkle before and maybe he's done something similar that I can't remember. But I don't know if that'd be frowned upon here.

If he's good, maybe it's possible that he wanted to gather all of the strong roles together thinking that he himself would benefit less from being in a private chat? /shrug

If he's evil, he could've put a teammate in there to keep tabs on things. Which wouldn't be a good look for Aeoryi but I don't think is likely otherwise.

[Helz]

I could try to find a meta reason. I've played quite a few games with Gikkle before and maybe he's done something similar that I can't remember. But I don't know if that'd be frowned upon here.

If he's good, maybe it's possible that he wanted to gather all of the strong roles together thinking that he himself would benefit less from being in a private chat? /shrug

If he's evil, he could've put a teammate in there to keep tabs on things. Which wouldn't be a good look for Aeoryi but I don't think is likely otherwise.

Kinda my conclusion. Maybe they town read me enough and wanted me to coordinate but I was also very against voicing actions in advance.

Like the one common thing is all 4 roles are of high value to know their targeting. 'If' he figured out my RB did not impact day actions then he woulda seen me as lookout. He also would have submitted the list during the day when Mafia still had a BD. Doc, Bg, Lookout, and Sheriff- all the critical pieces Mafia would need to know in advance to make a BD super effective.

It is something to chew on. I asked the host if a Networker could see content in a chat they created but did not add themselves to.

[Stellaria]

I havent seen him join it so I'd imagine not. That'd be a pain for Oli to do, too

[Helz]

Fair point. It would have to be manually copied over or something and I very much doubt any host would deal with that. Will see what he says.

If there was a scum motive it would be a partner in the chat. I could see at least 1 person on a 4p team figuring out to ask if a roleblock hits a day action though; especially given how much I pushed The Lawyer for their action choice not making sense.

On that note though if Gikkle is Mafia he would be a logical option for the factional. Not that it changes anything

[Horkos]

Dead
Marshmallow Marshall
powerofdeath
Phraze

Me
Stellaria

Reads List
jmw
Helz
Horkos
ewianking
The Lawyer
Gikkle
SuperJack
Aeoryi
Auwt

This is where I stand for now.

I see helz and ewianking as a pair if we kill one of them the other should follow or be cleared right after maybe at this point i will jail ewianking or Aeoryi tonight i will wait before i decide, i want to see some votes even if we don't lynch, it gives good informations (helped me chose phraze over the lawyer)

I don't see why auwt is so low in the list, other than hard towning the lawyer , i agree with his posts today

[Helz]

I see helz and ewianking as a pair if we kill one of them the other should follow or be cleared right after maybe at this point i will jail ewianking or Aeoryi tonight i will wait before i decide, i want to see some votes even if we don't lynch, it gives good informations (helped me chose phraze over the lawyer)

I don't see why auwt is so low in the list, other than hard towning the lawyer , i agree with his posts today

I really do wish you would try to sort me by hunting in day chat instead of just planning out to use your night actions to resolve my slot. You could ask me anything and I have probably given by word count 40-50% of all the content in this game so far. Tons of material you could look at.

[Stellaria]

I see helz and ewianking as a pair if we kill one of them the other should follow or be cleared right after maybe at this point i will jail ewianking or Aeoryi tonight i will wait before i decide, i want to see some votes even if we don't lynch, it gives good informations (helped me chose phraze over the lawyer)

I don't see why auwt is so low in the list, other than hard towning the lawyer , i agree with his posts today

What is your read on Helz?

[Horkos]

I really do wish you would try to sort me by hunting in day chat instead of just planning out to use your night actions to resolve my slot. You could ask me anything and I have probably given by word count 40-50% of all the content in this game so far. Tons of material you could look at.

While i do like some of the material and your contribution to this game, i think that a lot of your posts are many speculations and very neutral or pointless.

I think if you made mistakes, they would be drowned in the ocean of words you posted . I do see who you voted , who voted with you and who you tried to protect (ewianking and Aeoryi, you know, the ones i want to jail 😉 )

If we get rid of ewianking you get the gun this is why i want to resolve your slot right after.

[Stellaria]

I was trying to get him to consider Helz using social deduction rather than just saying he's dangerous only because of his role. Or, at the very least, I wanted him to put some more thought into it or at the very least stick around and talk. He lurked in the thread for a while and left. I expect more of him.

From my perspective, his lack of contributions are a part of the general sense of apathy I get from others this game. He could be contributing, and he chose not to. That doesn't sit right with me, and it's why I have him in the same position as Aeoryi. If they don't want to contribute, then they can remain in my PoE and stay there.

Quick aside: Those two are only a scum-lean. If I scumread them fully, you'd see their names in full-on red. They're low on the list because I see everyone else as being less scummy and the people I put there are the most deserving of being in the PoE. Auwt 100% deserves being there imo

[Stellaria]

"Why not vote Aeoryi?"

I'd be willing to do that, too. I vote Auwt because I expect anything from him. I don't expect anything of Aeoryi.

[Horkos]

I think if you made mistakes, they would be drowned in the ocean of words you posted . I do see who you voted , who voted with you and who you tried to protect (ewianking and Aeoryi, you know, the ones i want to jail 😉 )

For helz and ewianking , if you think of pod and me as town and suspectes phraze as well why didnt you change your vote to lynch phraze

[Helz]

While i do like some of the material and your contribution to this game, i think that a lot of your posts are many speculations and very neutral or pointless.

I think if you made mistakes, they would be drowned in the ocean of words you posted . I do see who you voted , who voted with you and who you tried to protect (ewianking and Aeoryi, you know, the ones i want to jail 😉 )

If we get rid of ewianking you get the gun this is why i want to resolve your slot right after.

I absolutely agree with you that a lot of my posts are speculation or neutral. I have been all but banging my head against the wall trying to create stuff for people to actually jump on and participate in day chat. Its been pretty frustrating to be honest.

Do you disagree on my reasoning for Aeoryi? If so what part? I have basically been saying they are self resolving so I am less interested in digging on them. I do not believe I have pushed against a single post made against them this entire game.

Ewianking and you are mechanically T/T or T/W both claiming to shoot Phraze. I have not defended them but them claiming to shoot after you had claimed to execute looked good to me. You could not really know this though because I have not talked about it. Basically the only other point I have made on them has been about them not shooting N1 and how I thought scum would shoot. Stellaria pointed out Mafia become Cit which I missed, you can see in all the times I talked about their role I spoke about how it gave the mafia +1 KPN (kill per night) but you never seemed to correct this.

Again- you could ask me about my views and bother to hear me out if you do not want to dig through the thread. Seems like your just making assumptions, going off your gut and eager to use your night action. I get thats how the mod is played but the Forum variant is usually very citizen heavy and all about day analysis.

[Stellaria]

I'm gonna go to bed, it's getting late. Hope you two have a wonderful night. I'll answer any questions in the morning (or earlier if I can't sleep)

[Horkos]

I'm gonna go to bed, it's getting late. Hope you two have a wonderful night. I'll answer any questions in the morning (or earlier if I can't sleep)

Good night

Its already the morning for me, i dont have the hour needed to check helz's iso i will do it later

[The Lawyer]

So I think It's safe to say that Stellaria and Aeroyi aren't teamed

[jmw]

my (lack of) reasoning is here

Okay, if you didn’t read that is fair. I had assumed you did and in that case checking me after the events of that day seemed odd to me but doesn’t hold if you weren’t aware.

[jmw]

Just an ewianking-related brainstorm:

> Ewian claims to have shot Phraze.
> Horkos claimed to jail and execute Phraze.
> Those aren't necessarily conflicting claims.
> Vig has unlimited shots, provided they don't hit a Town.
> In the first place, Phraze flipped scum anyway.
> Whether or not Ewian actually shot Phraze doesn't actually matter.
> It's a better look for Ewian that he was honest about what he did.
> Why would scum!Ewian lie about shooting at Phraze?
> scum!Ewian would never actually shoot Phraze.
> So if Ewian was scum, the shooting must therefore be a lie.
> I can't think of a reason to do this other than gaining towncred.
> Ultimately he decided to not holster, which seems a little reckless.
> That being said, a scum vigilante is really powerful lategame.
> If he actually made the shot, that would imply he's town.
> The reason for that is because scum would want to save the bullet.

Idk tbh saying all of this gives ewianking a slight town-lean from me

FMPOV, after the events of last night, T!Ewian basically *has* to shoot here, if he doesn’t he looks like mafia, and there were worlds we lose in last night. So from a W!Ewian perspective he has to claim a shot somewhere and Phraze being executed lets him holster

that said as a villager I’d be shooting Phraze as well so not like I think he has to be lying. But I think scum ewian worlds exist.

[jmw]

Cringe

I also prefer “most votes at eod dies”, I was surprised when I saw the eod1 and no lynch happened.

[jmw]

So I think It's safe to say that Stellaria and Aeroyi aren't teamed

I think I agree.