S-FM 350: Chaotic Executioner

[Nancy Drew 39]

@Zenon , @Varcron , either of you get the gun?

[ikarusdk]

But he could have still sent a carol during the night, no?

When I got my carol, it was at SoD yesterday.

no impossible.

According to Order of Operations, caroler visiting is the last priority, meaning when mafia killed debs, she could not hand out carols.

[Nancy Drew 39]

-vote Yoshida

[Renegade]

Why not, there’s no role blocker?

Last in the order of operations means he was killed before he could sing a carol to someone.

[Renegade]

I'm totally fine with Yoshida getting voted today. Wonder if he will change from the mopey "just lynch me" from yesterday.

[MartinGG99]

Frinckles flipping red

+Scumpoints for Varcron. Unfortunately at the EOD2, Buster quickly followed a vote on Yoshida after Frinckles voted.
+Scumpoints for Yoshida. I think Frinckles was okay with bussing Yoshida D2 and D4. Frinckles+Stellaria voting Yoshida as a bussing attempt fmpov.
+Scumpoints for Stellaria.

Stellaria > Yoshida > Varcron > MartinGG99 > ikarusdk > Loldebite/Nancy Drew 39/Renegade

This seems preety good. Although I would like a bit of clarification on Nancy, in case you have any insights about them I haven't noticed. I read them preety highly based on similar thoughts at specific moments of yesterday but also tonally at times. However, I don't see them as being above ikarusdk's town play so far.

One major problem with this though is that, as much we would like to try, we can't vote out Loldebite.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Last in the order of operations means he was killed before he could sing a carol to someone.

Order of Operations:
Vengeful Kill
Jailor Jail
Roleblocker Visit
Bus Driver Visit
Witch Visit
Actress/Oracle Visit
Tailor Visit
Mafia Faction Kill/BlackSmith's Gun Kill
Doctor Visit/Shaman visit
BlackSmith Vest/Bomb trigger
Janitor Clean.
Fabricator/BlackSmith/Gunsmith Visit
Sheriff Visit
Blackmailer visit
Cult Leader Visit
Illusionist Visit
Caroler Visit

Yeah right.

[MartinGG99]

This seems preety good. Although I would like a bit of clarification on Nancy, in case you have any insights about them I haven't noticed. I read them preety highly based on similar thoughts at specific moments of yesterday but also tonally at times. However, I don't see them as being above ikarusdk's town play so far.

One major problem with this though is that, as much we would like to try, we can't vote out Loldebite.

Also apparently Zenon is missing from the list.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I think Frinckles flipping mafia bomb, just adds to my confidence that Stellaria is the scum in both mine anf Gikkle’s carol.

[Renegade]

This seems preety good. Although I would like a bit of clarification on Nancy, in case you have any insights about them I haven't noticed. I read them preety highly based on similar thoughts at specific moments of yesterday but also tonally at times. However, I don't see them as being above ikarusdk's town play so far.

One major problem with this though is that, as much we would like to try, we can't vote out Loldebite.

So I feel like after day 2, Loldebite, myself, and Nancy have been in lock step. Nancy was hard pushing Frinckles yesterday too.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I think the game is probably solved. I would be completely gobsmacked if it wasn’t Stellaria, Yoshida and I don’t intend to vote outside of those two.

[MartinGG99]

I did a few mechanical hypotheticals in my head and I don't think there's any meaningful difference between chopping Stellaria and Yoshida, except for where Stellaria somehow happens to be town.

In which case, in theory, it would be better to know that sooner rather than later as we'll have more heads to bounce ideas off with. Leaving it for last will likely mean the mafia kill whoever isn't Varcron/Zenon that is the biggest threat to them (or whichever kill they think they can WIFOM best). Yoshida might as well be effectively non-existent because in the case we're wrong about Stellaria the mafia have already gotten a gun, and Yoshida can't give guns to the same people. Thus, its only just a matter of which day they are automatically chopped because outed wolf.
@ikarusdk your opinion on this?

[MartinGG99]

Although actually voting out Yoshida effectively makes Ikarus an alignment cop of whoever they jail.

[MartinGG99]

In which case I think the best way we can play this day out is if we chop Yoshida and Ikarus announces whoever they're jailing.

[MartinGG99]

But really it doesn't make a difference to me unless we somehow tie.

[Renegade]

In which case I think the best way we can play this day out is if we chop Yoshida and Ikarus announces whoever they're jailing.

yes

[Nancy Drew 39]

Although actually voting out Yoshida effectively makes Ikarus an alignment cop of whoever they jail.

He should just keep on jailing Stellaria if no gun.

[ikarusdk]

I did a few mechanical hypotheticals in my head and I don't think there's any meaningful difference between chopping Stellaria and Yoshida, except for where Stellaria somehow happens to be town.

In which case, in theory, it would be better to know that sooner rather than later as we'll have more heads to bounce ideas off with. Leaving it for last will likely mean the mafia kill whoever isn't Varcron/Zenon that is the biggest threat to them (or whichever kill they think they can WIFOM best). Yoshida might as well be effectively non-existent because in the case we're wrong about Stellaria the mafia have already gotten a gun, and Yoshida can't give guns to the same people. Thus, its only just a matter of which day they are automatically chopped because outed wolf.
@ikarusdk your opinion on this?

I actually had a thought that resembles your thinking during night phase, and todays flip completely proved at least 1 mafia member.

But let's examine our carols. (if i remember correctly)

loldebite+ikarusdk+stellaria - debs flipped town. I know I'm town. Therefore it is 100% stellaria.
stellaria+zenon+varcron - this carol further proves that stellaria is also 100% mafia, but leaves options for zenon and/or varcron also being mafia because the carol contains 'at least 1' mafia member.

I don't think it matters when we chop stellaria because I know she is mafia. But I understand if someone is skeptical about it because you are not me, therefore cannot know the same fact (stella=scum) as i do.

I've already explained why I wanted to push yoshida. I've had a lot of time to reflect on this slot, after Varcron mentioned that this could just be TvT. The more and more I think about it, the less confident I am about the slot, but to be quite frank, I am not sorry that I view yoshida as the other scum.

I do not mind who we lynch first, because the slot between yoshida and stellaria we aren't sure about might be different to each player.

[ikarusdk]

If we lynch yoshida today, I am jailing Stellaria.

If we lynch Stellaria today, I am jailing yoshida.

[ikarusdk]

I actually had a thought that resembles your thinking during night phase, and todays flip completely proved at least 1 mafia member.

But let's examine our carols. (if i remember correctly)

loldebite+ikarusdk+stellaria - debs flipped town. I know I'm town. Therefore it is 100% stellaria.
stellaria+zenon+varcron - this carol further proves that stellaria is also 100% mafia, but leaves options for zenon and/or varcron also being mafia because the carol contains 'at least 1' mafia member.

I don't think it matters when we chop stellaria because I know she is mafia. But I understand if someone is skeptical about it because you are not me, therefore cannot know the same fact (stella=scum) as i do.

I've already explained why I wanted to push yoshida. I've had a lot of time to reflect on this slot, after Varcron mentioned that this could just be TvT. The more and more I think about it, the less confident I am about the slot, but to be quite frank, I am not sorry that I view yoshida as the other scum.

I do not mind who we lynch first, because the slot between yoshida and stellaria we aren't sure about might be different to each player.

I do think the game is over at this point though, so we might just be over thinking it.

[Nancy Drew 39]

He should just keep on jailing Stellaria if no gun.

or if we vote out Stellaria, Yoshida.

The names in the carols: Gikkle: Loldebites, Ikarus, Stellaria. Mine: Zenon, Varcron. Stellaria.

[Nancy Drew 39]

If we lynch yoshida today, I am jailing Stellaria.

If we lynch Stellaria today, I am jailing yoshida.

+1

[ikarusdk]

I do think the game is over at this point though, so we might just be over thinking it.

but in case the game does not end because we are wrong here.

If stella flips W but yoshida flips T

Zenon>Varcron=Nancy>Renegade>Martin

If stella flips T and yoshida flips whatever
Ikarusdk>Zenon=Varcron>Nancy>Rengade>Martin

[ikarusdk]

-vote yoshida

[MartinGG99]

I do think the game is over at this point though, so we might just be over thinking it.

true, but like

what the hell else am I going to think about lmao

there is no more daily dosage of devoting brain power to reading specific people

[MartinGG99]

one of these days a game will be so conclusively swept and the host forbids conceding that there will have been a genuine game of mafia run in a game of mafia without it being originally planned

too bad this game will likely be too short for that

[MartinGG99]

speaking of which

a town sweep wherein the 3ps are wiped out first and then the mafia

is really impressive on a site like this

[Renegade]

-vote Yoshida

I still want to know who got the gun. How convenient would it be if he claims he gave it to Loldebite.

[ikarusdk]

true, but like

what the hell else am I going to think about lmao

there is no more daily dosage of devoting brain power to reading specific people

I mean, if we would like to discuss alternate possibility.

In Stella/Yoshida

Stella is 100% Maf
Yoshida is less than 100% Maf

So it makes better sense for me to discuss about yoshida and him potentially being T.

In this case, who would be our POE.

[ikarusdk]

if we had to, I'd like to point out that I didn't really like Varcron commenting my interaction with yoshida being TvT because everything yoshida had done/said up until that point was extremely scummy (we all agre no?)

Zenon had parroted this view without explaining much.

So either Varcron has some weird takes that turns out to be true about yoshida, or it was TMI.
Zenon taking this opportunity to also say yoshida being T is also a convenient TMI.

[Nancy Drew 39]

We should vote whichever is more likely to be able to sway anyone but the only players I think that’s even possible with are the subs. Everyone else seems to be on the same page.

[ikarusdk]

Don't think it is Nancy, given how aligned she has been with loldebs, although she's only been loldeb's mirror after she got the carol. Understandable but have a weird feeling how confident she was about the slot. But she has been pushing for both mafia which gets my credit.

Same goes for Renegade.

I've shared very similar world view as Martin so I very much doubt it is Martin.

If yoshida ever flips T

I'll be looking into Zenon/Varcron .

[Nancy Drew 39]

I just think it most likely ends with Stellaria/Yoshida.

[yoshida]

Here are some of the quotes I can pull. Underlines were added by me, and one or two of these quotes might not be chronologically ordered.

Spoiler : wall of quotes and comments :

earliest mention of bomb(er)



has to explain how he came up with bomb(er) when being prodded by Frinckles -- who we know flipped mafia bomb(er), and Frinckles also mentions Gunsmith and he mentions how if the town misused the gun it would be very bad for the town

we didn't know Yoshida was gunsmith at this time



Arguing for Renegade to shoot one of Frinckles/Gikkle, and that not-shooting isn't an option.



Yoshida is suggesting the possibility that town caroler is hiding, which is suggesting that Mafia-Bomber (Frinckles) is fake-claiming being town caroler



Arguing that Frinckles should be shot by Renegade and also that Yoshida is certain that Frinckles is always a Wolf/Mafia here



Arguing to shoot Frinckles again.

it is interesting you don't even read my other posts about realizing there is a bomber and asking ren to not shoot frinckles or anyone.

Existence of a potential Gunsmith tells me there has to be a bomber. CE always wants a fast game in this setup with no skips.

In that case

-vote Frinckles

I don't think I can make it to EOD, no promises.

I will leave my vote in case Renegade decides to int by not shooting or Gikkle flips town.

If the host extends the game then that's cool too.

glgl

and I had a post before all of this that there can be a town caroler hiding. from a GS PoV in a game and me being the GS, I gave it a good chance there can be a bomber seeing two people Stellaria/Frinckles also talked about it. At that point I wasn't sure between Frinckles and STellaria were bomber and that is why I tried to stop Ren from shooting Frinckles. I get punished for reading the game here while slots like ikarus or renegade that don't even read the game can miselim me today. that's the quality of the town we have and I just want to get out of this game tbh.

also interesting that you don't even look at renegade who shot gikkles instead of renegade. was it because of my bomber warning back then or did he perhaps already knew he is the bomber? in either case, if I had known Frinckles was bomber if I were mafia, why would I fuckin push Ren for it? Like dude, if Renegade is town, he needs to lock me as town because if I were mafia or if anyone were mafia, they would never share a gun outside of Mafia on first night of actions even the mafia ends up controlling a bomber. can you guys get some sense???????


Stellaria was jailed. I gave a gun to zenon btw.

zenon should shoot varcron today and then you guys should give me one more night for another gun. I shouldn't be voted out today because I am town and it is 2vs7 so it is too early to vote me out but I understand that I must be voted out before mylo.


We already know there is 1 scum between varcron/zenon at least. I would like zenon to shoot one so I AM PROVEN TOWN as I SAID EARLIER I AM MECH CLEAR


Then after this, we should look into whoever is pushing for my elimination rn

[yoshida]

CAN YOU GUYS JUST EXPLAIN HOW CAN I KILL SOMEONE AND GIVE A GUN TO ZENON THE SAME NIGHT IF I AM MAFIA??????



@Zenon shoot varcron and decide our fate today. you wanted some fun, lets have some fun

[yoshida]

CAN YOU GUYS JUST EXPLAIN HOW CAN I KILL SOMEONE AND GIVE A GUN TO ZENON THE SAME NIGHT IF I AM MAFIA??????



@Zenon shoot varcron and decide our fate today. you wanted some fun, lets have some fun

[yoshida]

One mafia is in martin/ren/ikarus/nancy

i am sure it is most likely renegade btw. if it is martin then I don't mind losing to that

[yoshida]

@MartinGG99

I would never misplay a PR sir. You should see into this if you are truly town.

Zenon needs to shoot Varcron today so that Town can use more gun.


If Zenon shoots me, get her ahh.


I am solving the game for you guys everyday. wake the fuck up

[ikarusdk]

it is interesting you don't even read my other posts about realizing there is a bomber and asking ren to not shoot frinckles or anyone.





and I had a post before all of this that there can be a town caroler hiding. from a GS PoV in a game and me being the GS, I gave it a good chance there can be a bomber seeing two people Stellaria/Frinckles also talked about it. At that point I wasn't sure between Frinckles and STellaria were bomber and that is why I tried to stop Ren from shooting Frinckles. I get punished for reading the game here while slots like ikarus or renegade that don't even read the game can miselim me today. that's the quality of the town we have and I just want to get out of this game tbh.

also interesting that you don't even look at renegade who shot gikkles instead of renegade. was it because of my bomber warning back then or did he perhaps already knew he is the bomber? in either case, if I had known Frinckles was bomber if I were mafia, why would I fuckin push Ren for it? Like dude, if Renegade is town, he needs to lock me as town because if I were mafia or if anyone were mafia, they would never share a gun outside of Mafia on first night of actions even the mafia ends up controlling a bomber. can you guys get some sense???????


Stellaria was jailed. I gave a gun to zenon btw.

zenon should shoot varcron today and then you guys should give me one more night for another gun. I shouldn't be voted out today because I am town and it is 2vs7 so it is too early to vote me out but I understand that I must be voted out before mylo.


We already know there is 1 scum between varcron/zenon at least. I would like zenon to shoot one so I AM PROVEN TOWN as I SAID EARLIER I AM MECH CLEAR


Then after this, we should look into whoever is pushing for my elimination rn

like...if you know there's 1 scum between V/Z......why give a gun to one of them?
Say Zenon shoots Varcron and V is town. Does that in any shape of form indicate Zenon is Town or Mafia?

[ikarusdk]

One mafia is in martin/ren/ikarus/nancy

i am sure it is most likely renegade btw. if it is martin then I don't mind losing to that

????

you just said one mafia is V/Z

[yoshida]

Don't think it is Nancy, given how aligned she has been with loldebs, although she's only been loldeb's mirror after she got the carol. Understandable but have a weird feeling how confident she was about the slot. But she has been pushing for both mafia which gets my credit.

Same goes for Renegade.

I've shared very similar world view as Martin so I very much doubt it is Martin.

If yoshida ever flips T

I'll be looking into Zenon/Varcron .

I am glad I didn't give you a gun on N2 and gave it to Renegade instead

[yoshida]

????

you just said one mafia is V/Z

why are you getting mad? I am playin my role correctly here. I know from the caroler flip and on the basis Nancy and Gikkle have low chance of lying about the carol, There is a scum between Zenon/Varcron. This is giving us a flip check.


dude you are either 90% maf or 10% VI at this point

[ikarusdk]

why are you getting mad? I am playin my role correctly here. I know from the caroler flip and on the basis Nancy and Gikkle have low chance of lying about the carol, There is a scum between Zenon/Varcron. This is giving us a flip check.


dude you are either 90% maf or 10% VI at this point

You do not see a contradiction in your post?

You said there's 1 scum in Z/V.

Then your follow up post said

There's 1 mafia between martin/ren/ikarus/nancy

Which is it? I'm not getting mad, I am just confused as fuck what your view exactly is.

[ikarusdk]

And if from your POV zenon or varcron is mafia

Why give a gun to that combo.

What does that achieve? I'd like to know.

How is Zenon shooting Varcron indicate their alignment? And more importantly, yours?

[yoshida]

@MartinGG99
@Renegade
@Nancy Drew 39
@ikarusdk

Get your votes off me and start playing with me. We need Zenon to make a decision. They either shoot Varcron here or mafia wins the game by making town vote me out today.

[Renegade]

Holy shit. Yoshida gave a gun to Zenon and is now saying Zenon could be scum?

Is this a joke?

[ikarusdk]

@MartinGG99
@Renegade
@Nancy Drew 39
@ikarusdk

Get your votes off me and start playing with me. We need Zenon to make a decision. They either shoot Varcron here or mafia wins the game by making town vote me out today.

I am trying to play with you right now but could you explain the logic behind it so we can understand.

[Renegade]

CAN YOU GUYS JUST EXPLAIN HOW CAN I KILL SOMEONE AND GIVE A GUN TO ZENON THE SAME NIGHT IF I AM MAFIA??????



@Zenon shoot varcron and decide our fate today. you wanted some fun, lets have some fun

By reading the rolecard. Obviously you are playing dumb now.

Vanilla Mafia - You share day and night chat with your fellow members of the Mafia. Mafia are forced to choose to send 1 person to perform a Factional Night Kill each night starting Night 2. You may receive an additional rolecard from Chaotic Executioner on start of Day 2, this will not affect your alignment or win condition. You may perform your new rolecard and be sent to perform the factional kill on the same night.

[ikarusdk]

Like if you are town, I'm sure your play makes sense in your head

but I think I can speak for the rest of us when I say

We do not get it.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Holy shit. Yoshida gave a gun to Zenon and is now saying Zenon could be scum?

Is this a joke?

Does that make sense to you for a townie to do that? Sounds majorly fucked up to me, if Yoshida’s actually town.