S-FM 346: Warcraft - Page 12
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  1. ISO #551

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Mizery View Post
    Oh oli voting yapyap probably means it's yapyap huh
    My point was simply that it sucks nobody has even bothered to talk about it.

    The guy was getting lynched and he gave that as a last read. That Yayap was scum and with some very odd reasoning.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  2. ISO #552

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    I do agree that Olis last comment was very odd. That is also why I brought it up because I thought I was a relevant information.

    I think we need to come to a general agreement on lynch process for today and tomorrow.

    Will everyone post your suggestions on lynch targets for today and tomorrow?

    There is a high chance I may not be killed today because I doubt blademaster has used his ability. He might just redirect my skill while killing, so if he still has charge, he might kill Guillo instead, leaving me as kingmaker in 1v1 situation which I really dont want to be in given lack of experience and player knowledge.

    If you can give me who you will be lynching today and tomorrow and we come to an agreement, even if I live instead of guillo, we can lynch the right person.

    So far from what I can gather it is either helz or yayap

  3. ISO #553

  4. ISO #554

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Anyway, the reason I suspect Helz as the final scum from today's chat after Guillo push on Helz is this.

    We know Guillo and I are town. We all read Mizery as town. So it leaves down to Helz and Yayap as prime suspects. We also all agree that if we mislynch today, the last two have another chance tomorrow.

    Given this information, there really is no reason to be upset/defensive about being the lynch target for Day3 because we can just lynch Yayap on D4. Yayap knows this and he hasn't really reacted to anything except giving his analysis on players.

    Helz on the other hand, when it came to Guillos push, he has been anything but. Maybe that is how I feel but Helz has been AtE in a situation where it really does not matter, sounding seriously disappointed we are pushing for him. Helz has given us with a lot of information and strategies, but that might have been to read as town, and also to push me to the last 1v1 day, and we all know I shouldn't be in that situation. Martin also acted strangely, even in the eyes of a newbie. The above reasons do not feel out of place for me.

    If we are wrong, we can lynch Yayap tomorrow unless Mizery is deduced as scum.

  5. ISO #555

  6. ISO #556

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by ikarusdk View Post
    I do agree that Olis last comment was very odd. That is also why I brought it up because I thought I was a relevant information.

    I think we need to come to a general agreement on lynch process for today and tomorrow.

    Will everyone post your suggestions on lynch targets for today and tomorrow?

    There is a high chance I may not be killed today because I doubt blademaster has used his ability. He might just redirect my skill while killing, so if he still has charge, he might kill Guillo instead, leaving me as kingmaker in 1v1 situation which I really dont want to be in given lack of experience and player knowledge.

    If you can give me who you will be lynching today and tomorrow and we come to an agreement, even if I live instead of guillo, we can lynch the right person.

    So far from what I can gather it is either helz or yayap
    There is no chance of you being the lynch. It would pretty much be literal gamethrowing.

    I doubt the redirect was not used. It quickly became apparent there was no vig and with the D1 lynch its likely N1 they redirected to break up the town block. I would have anyways.

    Saving it to kill Guillo isn't impossible but its very unlikely. If it comes to that your shooting at 50/50. I would consider just making your own read using dead townies for reference and ignore the arguments of whoever's alive if your not confident in making reads from interactions.

    Yayap has been more pushing against reasons to town read people than pushing reasons to scum read them which bothers me. Like he is more focused on others not getting cleared and waiting for the game to unfold.
    Mizery has been pretty apathetic to the degree I am not certain how to read them. Even having a game solve they have not pushed any specific way but have also not acted twords self pres.

    Still currently favor Yayap over Mizery. Years back they had a clear transparent town style and would take on a strong leadership role when they felt it was needed. This game they have been so very passive and I feel like they are substantially holding back.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  7. ISO #557

  8. ISO #558

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by ikarusdk View Post
    Anyway, the reason I suspect Helz as the final scum from today's chat after Guillo push on Helz is this.

    We know Guillo and I are town. We all read Mizery as town. So it leaves down to Helz and Yayap as prime suspects. We also all agree that if we mislynch today, the last two have another chance tomorrow.

    Given this information, there really is no reason to be upset/defensive about being the lynch target for Day3 because we can just lynch Yayap on D4. Yayap knows this and he hasn't really reacted to anything except giving his analysis on players.

    Helz on the other hand, when it came to Guillos push, he has been anything but. Maybe that is how I feel but Helz has been AtE in a situation where it really does not matter, sounding seriously disappointed we are pushing for him. Helz has given us with a lot of information and strategies, but that might have been to read as town, and also to push me to the last 1v1 day, and we all know I shouldn't be in that situation. Martin also acted strangely, even in the eyes of a newbie. The above reasons do not feel out of place for me.

    If we are wrong, we can lynch Yayap tomorrow unless Mizery is deduced as scum.
    To be very upfront I think even considering me at this point is really fucking stupid. I keep saying it over and over but in what world does a scum shove the doc onto a 2p town block while pointing out the scum has to kill there and then kill there?

    If I was scum and did it to pull the doc off some other PR sure, makes sense.
    If I was town and did it to push the doc in the right dirrection increasing the chances of a kill block- sure, makes sense

    But as a scum who needs to kill in there to push the doc to cover the people I need to kill? Yeah. Im going to disrespect that window licking logic and say how stupid it is because I know if we simply lynch Mizery and Yayap the town 100% wins. The hilarious part of it is nobody has even bothered to suggest I did some epic level super high risk play to self town confirm to discredit the point. People just keep lethargically ignoring that it even happened without a care like a stoned cow in India.

    Then past that hardly a point has been made I can even speak to. Its not like I have the town grilling me for reasoning on my plays. I was very transparent about them but the most substantial case has come from.. what.. Martian's play?

    If the town was even fucking trying to sort me I would be less irritated about it. So straight up. Disrespect to the read on me (or apathetic lack of one) and when I flip recognize it was not my bad play or scums good play- it was shit play from town that made it happen.

    /Ate
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  9. ISO #559

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Spoiler : A few photos of what I think of towns D3 play :







    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  10. ISO #560

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    To be very upfront I think even considering me at this point is really fucking stupid. I keep saying it over and over but in what world does a scum shove the doc onto a 2p town block while pointing out the scum has to kill there and then kill there?

    If I was scum and did it to pull the doc off some other PR sure, makes sense.
    If I was town and did it to push the doc in the right dirrection increasing the chances of a kill block- sure, makes sense

    But as a scum who needs to kill in there to push the doc to cover the people I need to kill? Yeah. Im going to disrespect that window licking logic and say how stupid it is because I know if we simply lynch Mizery and Yayap the town 100% wins. The hilarious part of it is nobody has even bothered to suggest I did some epic level super high risk play to self town confirm to discredit the point. People just keep lethargically ignoring that it even happened without a care like a stoned cow in India.

    Then past that hardly a point has been made I can even speak to. Its not like I have the town grilling me for reasoning on my plays. I was very transparent about them but the most substantial case has come from.. what.. Martian's play?

    If the town was even fucking trying to sort me I would be less irritated about it. So straight up. Disrespect to the read on me (or apathetic lack of one) and when I flip recognize it was not my bad play or scums good play- it was shit play from town that made it happen.

    /Ate
    Helz, have some class please. If winning the game for you is more worth it than the fun and respect of your peers then go ahead and try to win, im not playing with you again. The Helz i played with at KRC and here are day and night, im very disappointed.

    Im gonna kill you, because i scum read you. Because your progression on Yayap sucks, because killing Stealth instead of me points to someone who believed had me pocketed and that is between you and Mizery. Yayap has no reason to let me live when ive been completely tunneled on him, i even said yesterday that if Luona was not it, Yayap was gonna be next. Stealth said that it was almost the same line of thought he had.

    Stealth would have pushed for your elimination before Yayap and if not he would pushed for Misery whom he also suspected. You and Mizery had every motive to kill Stealth.

    Even with Yayap bailing out today, i dont think i will ever kill him in this game, if he is scum, well played, he snowed me.

    And the worst indicator is your najor shift in behavior, when you thought you had me convinced you acted politely, tried to look helpful with mechanics deductions etc.
    But now that you are getting pushed, boy all of that went out of the window and it’s even personally attacking us. Where did that leveled head go?
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  11. ISO #561

  12. ISO #562

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    Helz, have some class please. If winning the game for you is more worth it than the fun and respect of your peers then go ahead and try to win, im not playing with you again. The Helz i played with at KRC and here are day and night, im very disappointed.

    Im gonna kill you, because i scum read you. Because your progression on Yayap sucks, because killing Stealth instead of me points to someone who believed had me pocketed and that is between you and Mizery. Yayap has no reason to let me live when ive been completely tunneled on him, i even said yesterday that if Luona was not it, Yayap was gonna be next. Stealth said that it was almost the same line of thought he had.

    Stealth would have pushed for your elimination before Yayap and if not he would pushed for Misery whom he also suspected. You and Mizery had every motive to kill Stealth.

    Even with Yayap bailing out today, i dont think i will ever kill him in this game, if he is scum, well played, he snowed me.

    And the worst indicator is your najor shift in behavior, when you thought you had me convinced you acted politely, tried to look helpful with mechanics deductions etc.
    But now that you are getting pushed, boy all of that went out of the window and it’s even personally attacking us. Where did that leveled head go?
    I am sorry you feel that way. I stepped away from playing for a personal reason we can talk about post game but yeah. I am much more crass than I once was and I have more limitations than I once did in some respects. I apologize but I really am frustrated.

    It really does not change that I feel blindly avoiding the subject of how my actions make no sense for scum is dumb. Its intentionally blindly avoiding a glaring subject. I have the game solve and did work I feel makes me absolutely unquestionably town and people do not even want to talk about it.

    Put yourself in my shoes. Its not like the town is working to clear me. Nobody is asking me for reads or explanations. The town does not give a shit. Im not going to pretend like that is not the case. Im sorry if I have offended you but yeah, I do feel like I should be a very overt town clear given how I shoved both the NK and the heal into a 50/50. I can say it a million times but there is no reason scum would ever ever ever ever ever do that. Pushing someone that did is really bad play imo; and its 10000% worse to do it without even addressing the subject like it is not even a thing.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  13. ISO #563

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    There was a big difference between recommending to heal someone and pointing out how the scum would absolutely loose unless they hit in that window semi-obligating the doc to heal within that window.

    Like I said earlier, You made up your mind on me without reading me and I am going to drive home how absolutely awful your push on me. The idea a scum would point out they are semi obligated to attack between 2 people and intentionally push the doc on it, then follow through and attack between those two has to be one of the worst lines of thought I have herd in a long time.
    But the math you presented is actually flawed. It really did make no difference.

    N2 doc failed heal on SB
    D3 doc claiming = Helz, Mizery or me gets lynched
    N4 doc dies = Guillo kingmaker vs the last 2
    result: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc failed to heal
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N4a I get killed = Guillo vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    N4b Ika is killed = Guillo kingmaker vs Mizery and me
    N4c doc healed Guillo = Guillo and Ika vs Mizery and me if scum doesn't claim doc
    N4d doc healed Guillo = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    n4e doc healed me = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc (Mizery could even claim he healed Guillo and we wouldn't know)
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 if the doc successfully healed. Then today we would have Guillo, SB confirmed vs Ika*, Helz, Mizery and me
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N3 Scum can 50/50 the doc and the other unknown
    D4a (if Ika died) Then its Guillo and SB as kingmakers vs Mizery and me
    D4b (if I died) Then its a Guillo and SB vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc successfully healed
    D3 not exposed (helz lynched)
    N3 doc healed Me
    D4 then its Guillo, SB and me vs Ika and Mizery
    Resulting in town win

    Literally the only thing Helz did by showing his math was ensure that the last option would not happen. All other options are a 1v1 on D4 with a different kingmaker depending on who died N2.

  14. ISO #564

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Yayap View Post
    But the math you presented is actually flawed. It really did make no difference.

    N2 doc failed heal on SB
    D3 doc claiming = Helz, Mizery or me gets lynched
    N4 doc dies = Guillo kingmaker vs the last 2
    result: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc failed to heal
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N4a I get killed = Guillo vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    N4b Ika is killed = Guillo kingmaker vs Mizery and me
    N4c doc healed Guillo = Guillo and Ika vs Mizery and me if scum doesn't claim doc
    N4d doc healed Guillo = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    n4e doc healed me = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc (Mizery could even claim he healed Guillo and we wouldn't know)
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 if the doc successfully healed. Then today we would have Guillo, SB confirmed vs Ika*, Helz, Mizery and me
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N3 Scum can 50/50 the doc and the other unknown
    D4a (if Ika died) Then its Guillo and SB as kingmakers vs Mizery and me
    D4b (if I died) Then its a Guillo and SB vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc successfully healed
    D3 not exposed (helz lynched)
    N3 doc healed Me
    D4 then its Guillo, SB and me vs Ika and Mizery
    Resulting in town win

    Literally the only thing Helz did by showing his math was ensure that the last option would not happen. All other options are a 1v1 on D4 with a different kingmaker depending on who died N2.
    The really substantial factor was that it pushed the doc onto the town block and killed WIFOM for the rest of the players taking a heal chance from 1/6 to 1/2. The play makes absolutely no sense for scum.

    And if you mean the gamestate for Lylo Priest got to make a decision to put Guillo as the king maker which was also a change. We will see how that shakes out. I think he wanted to step back instead of having the game thrust on his shoulders.

    For a pertinent question- You keep throwing shade on everything that makes others look town. But do you believe that I do not believe what I am saying?
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  15. ISO #565

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    For a pertinent question- You keep throwing shade on everything that makes others look town. But do you believe that I do not believe what I am saying?
    Based on what I remember your skill to be 2 years ago when I last played on these forums, I'm expecting you to have improved and that you would have crossed the line of me being able to read you in day chat to being more manipulative of secret reads and less alignment indicative. In essence, you and me are locked into a duel to see who will flinch first but we both have the skill to not flinch making it a draw and we both know that. The only problem is that if we are both town, neither of us can really point out Mizery just coasting to the finish line while we stare each other down.

    Because the game has been solved mechanically mainly because you posted the path to the endgame scenario - which I would not have because a kill outside of Guillo/Stealhbomber would have given me an idea on the skill level of the last remaining scum, I don't think Mizery or Ika (if she wasn't the doc) would have realized that killing anyone other than Guillo/SB or getting lucky on the doc would eliminate their lifeline in PoE, newer players would probably think getting the night kill to not be healed was more important.

    What you did was not scummy per say because there is only 1 scum left, but it killed any chance of getting a read through the night kill because the choice was made so obvious.

    So all 3 of us are just standing in a line up waiting to see who Guillo/Ika eliminate. Unless Mizery makes a blatant mistake, I really think this game is going to come down to flip a coin to see who is left standing.

  16. ISO #566

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Yayap View Post
    The only problem is that if we are both town, neither of us can really point out Mizery just coasting to the finish line while we stare each other down.
    I have considered this a few times and I have no solution.

    I pushed you at the start of the day to bait a reaction from Mizery but got nothing. Saw a very slight potential town slip D1 and have next to nothing to go on. Solving them tomorrow will probably end up a coin flip which sucks.

    I get frustrated when I sign up for a game to play and feel like I can not play. It makes me wonder what we are even doing. If we are not here to talk, scumhunt, and sort alignments what is the point? Watching the game move in a direction I know is bad while nobody seems motivated to even raise a finger to question if its bad or not sucks.
    I do not see people pushing etchother or arguing motives. It more looks like people are just waiting for the clock to tick down in a game where town has no viable night actions. Tommorow the town will be in worse shape than it is today with little information gained and the bitch of it is that its happening while we have 2 semi-confirmed town.

    Maybe the problem is I am too focused on how I feel the game should be played but regardless of manipulation or skill I figure that should be able to be very clearly read.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  17. ISO #567

  18. ISO #568

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    -vote Unvote


    I think Mizery is town and belueve scum does not want to eliminate them today because Mizery is the designated mischop at lylo.

    So it really comes down to Helz and Yayap

    @ Priest. Tonight you protect me but if you somehow outlive me, treat Mizery as town at lylo.
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  19. ISO #569

  20. ISO #570

  21. ISO #571

  22. ISO #572

  23. ISO #573

  24. ISO #574

  25. ISO #575

  26. ISO #576

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Mizery View Post
    yapyap why are you talking like you think killing helz won't end the game
    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    Because he perspective slipped lol
    Very funny, but no. I'm not taking Guillo reply seriously but Mizery really going for a stretch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yayap View Post
    But the math you presented is actually flawed. It really did make no difference.

    N2 doc failed heal on SB
    D3 doc claiming = Helz, Mizery or me gets lynched
    N4 doc dies = Guillo kingmaker vs the last 2
    result: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc failed to heal
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N4a I get killed = Guillo vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    N4b Ika is killed = Guillo kingmaker vs Mizery and me
    N4c doc healed Guillo = Guillo and Ika vs Mizery and me if scum doesn't claim doc
    N4d doc healed Guillo = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    n4e doc healed me = Guillo and me vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc (Mizery could even claim he healed Guillo and we wouldn't know)
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 if the doc successfully healed. Then today we would have Guillo, SB confirmed vs Ika*, Helz, Mizery and me
    D3 doc not claiming and not exposed = 1 unconfirmable gets lynched (Helz to demonstrate)
    N3 Scum can 50/50 the doc and the other unknown
    D4a (if Ika died) Then its Guillo and SB as kingmakers vs Mizery and me
    D4b (if I died) Then its a Guillo and SB vs Ika and Mizery both claiming doc
    all results: 1v1 on D4

    N2 doc successfully healed
    D3 not exposed (helz lynched)
    N3 doc healed Me
    D4 then its Guillo, SB and me vs Ika and Mizery
    Resulting in town win

    Literally the only thing Helz did by showing his math was ensure that the last option would not happen. All other options are a 1v1 on D4 with a different kingmaker depending on who died N2.
    I just used Helz because he was the leading vote when I posted it. If the game ends, then gg... but to demonstrate the point of his math being wrong, I have to show what happens if the game doesn't end.

  27. ISO #577

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    If the town block is decided that Mizery is off the table regardless and its me/yayap I do not think the order maters.

    Could even just let it RNG between us but if the game is decided it is what it is

    -unvote
    So it does not hit our beloved host : )
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  28. ISO #578

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    If the town block is decided that Mizery is off the table regardless and its me/yayap I do not think the order maters.

    Could even just let it RNG between us but if the game is decided it is what it is

    -unvote
    So it does not hit our beloved host : )
    Ok then

    -vote Helz


    Rest assure you will get justice if you flip town.
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  29. ISO #579

  30. ISO #580

  31. ISO #581

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Yayap View Post
    I just used Helz because he was the leading vote when I posted it. If the game ends, then gg... but to demonstrate the point of his math being wrong, I have to show what happens if the game doesn't end.
    I don't see how you do not see that it is AI to force the doc onto the obligated scum target. And yes the game would end in a 1v1 'almost' always but allowing the priest to make a decision to designate the kingmaker held real value imo.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  32. ISO #582

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    Ok then

    -vote Helz


    Rest assure you will get justice if you flip town.
    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    You know what's the best part of being confirmed town?

    That I can act scummy as hell and scum can't push me for it lol.
    Lol. This is true.

    I will flip town. I have never just let it happen but thought about it this morning and figured there is no point worrying about something I can not influence. To underscore it I won't even bother to self-pres. If players were asking me questions and trying to read me I could influence the outcome. Ironically the removal of the ability for scum to influence the outcome is exactly why I pushed for a follow the cop strat.

    My money is on Yayap over Mizery. His shading when people are town read feels like an intention indicator and I feel like he is very intentionally misrepresenting the value of my mechanical play.
    So saying its valid or not is one thing, but not focusing on the motivation for it is quite another. Even in a world where I am totally wrong and my deductive logic was shit the question should still have been 'why' I did what I did as opposed to 'what' I did. I just do not see that thought process in his posts. Instead its throwing shade to say 'Actually you shouldn't be read as town because your math was bad'
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  33. ISO #583

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    If Mizery legit slept to the solo win its gona be pretty funny though
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  34. ISO #584

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    Lol. This is true.

    I will flip town. I have never just let it happen but thought about it this morning and figured there is no point worrying about something I can not influence. To underscore it I won't even bother to self-pres. If players were asking me questions and trying to read me I could influence the outcome. Ironically the removal of the ability for scum to influence the outcome is exactly why I pushed for a follow the cop strat.

    My money is on Yayap over Mizery. His shading when people are town read feels like an intention indicator and I feel like he is very intentionally misrepresenting the value of my mechanical play.
    So saying its valid or not is one thing, but not focusing on the motivation for it is quite another. Even in a world where I am totally wrong and my deductive logic was shit the question should still have been 'why' I did what I did as opposed to 'what' I did. I just do not see that thought process in his posts. Instead its throwing shade to say 'Actually you shouldn't be read as town because your math was bad'
    Then why aren't you voting Yayap?
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  35. ISO #585

  36. ISO #586

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Yayap View Post
    Not gonna lie mizery but there is little I can say truthfully that would make me look towny. My town play and my scum play are near identical and to lynch me, you might as well flip a coin to read me. Helz knows that thus why I wouldn't expect any progression in his read on me Guillo (not trying to defend him but that part of your read is inaccurate). The reasons I find Helz scummy has nothing to do with his read on me but how he has been reading others and trying to influence them; focusing on mechanical endgame scenarios when it really didn't matter if we were aware of it or not, it would happen naturally; his claims that he would like to set up a trap for me is strange because he should know that I wouldn't fall for it... and if I did, I would have a perfectly reasonable explanation get myself out of it.
    What makes you think the trap was set up for you and not Mizery or Ika at the time?

    -vote Yayap
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  37. ISO #587

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    Then why aren't you voting Yayap?
    "To underscore it I won't even bother to self-pres"

    If the game is locked in with 2 lynches that will be exactly myself and Yayap the coin is already tossed.

    So if the RNG or the vote falls on Yayap and he is town the game is over anyways. Whats the point? Peoples minds are made up, I don't see anyone trying to read me and me getting worked up about it just managed to offend you yesterday so I would rather just let it go. I can not be too mad about it given I pretty much single handedly forced the game into its current state.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  38. ISO #588

  39. ISO #589

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Also if Mizery is not going to vote and I do not its just the town block. If Yayap thinks I am the scum and Mizery is town he also has no reason to self pres.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  40. ISO #590

  41. ISO #591

  42. ISO #592

  43. ISO #593

  44. ISO #594

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Ika you should have protected Stealth. I was willing to die, I told you guys that I play to die as fast as possible while making the most impact in as less time as possible, that should have given you the hint to protect Stealth on night 2, cause he has a better head at end game than I do and probably more time too.
    Tell the truth and you'll lie good.

  45. ISO #595

  46. ISO #596

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Do whatever you want.

    I will note again that was frustrated yesterday when I was not even on the chopping block. Even spammed cat pictures at one point.

    I do not like playing a game where I feel like I can not play and that is how I have felt. To include this moment. Saying all the things I have already said will do nothing.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  47. ISO #597

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    Fuck it. Im killing Helz

    Sorry if Im wrong.

    -vote Helz
    Its alright. I will try to slip in a cheeky 'I told you so' post just before days end but if I don't make it know that I died grabbing some delicious chicken wings with friends : )
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  48. ISO #598

  49. ISO #599

  50. ISO #600

    Re: S-FM 346: Warcraft

    Quote Originally Posted by Guillo View Post
    -vote Unvote


    I think Mizery is town and belueve scum does not want to eliminate them today because Mizery is the designated mischop at lylo.

    So it really comes down to Helz and Yayap

    @ Priest. Tonight you protect me but if you somehow outlive me, treat Mizery as town at lylo.
    I will do

 

 

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