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  1. ISO #1

    Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    There is almost no benefit in being Lover over Survivor/Amnesiac. You not only need to survive yourself without vests but you also need to keep the other person alive. You aren't even confirmed role if you love town because you can still be Heartbreaker/Swinger. I feel like Lover needs either night immunity for himself so he can survive most attacks so he dies if his loved target is killed, or him dying shouldn't kill his loved target and lover wins as long as his target stays alive till the end (reverse exe).

    Swinger/Heartbreaker are also not only borderline useless their ability is a hinderence. It forces you into a lover claim which can be easly countered by other neut benign claims or neutrals dying. You have almost no control over what role you are going to love because you are forced to use the ability n1 and can't change the target. And if you manage to avoid being caught in the first place your ability is just bad. Trading a triad vote for even a gov isn't a good trade, and in most cases certainly won't be for any other town role. While also not providing any passive benefit to the triad while you are alive. Meanwhile you could be something like Double Flower who can just straight up kill anyone he wants whenever he wants anonymously without dying himself and gets a second shot if the game is long.
    At the very least their target shouldn't know who loved them (at least with current version of the role) and they should be able to pick/change their target any night they want. This way they would ensure getting a right role killed with them and wouldn't be straight up revealed d2. I still don't see much benefit in having it over other killing roles like DF/Interro/Informant so they could probably use some passive ability aswell (detection immunity/show up as lover in graveyard/learn target role etc.).

  2. ISO #2

    Re: Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    Lover is a difficult role but I don't see why that's a bad thing. Some players find that as a rewarding experience and the existence of the role in a game can have a huge impact on it.

    Likewise, I think you underestimate how strong Swinger/HB can be. The hostage effect of forcing a player to love you can benefit the Swinger/HB significantly. And if you don't like the idea of pretending to be a Lover, you can always claim that your target instead loved you. Then you could just fakeclaim something like Oracle, SR, Survivor or whatever else is convenient.
    (๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)ﻭ 레드벨벳 ! ! ٩(♡ε♡ )۶

  3. ISO #3

    Re: Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    Quote Originally Posted by Frinckles View Post
    Lover is a difficult role but I don't see why that's a bad thing. Some players find that as a rewarding experience and the existence of the role in a game can have a huge impact on it.

    Likewise, I think you underestimate how strong Swinger/HB can be. The hostage effect of forcing a player to love you can benefit the Swinger/HB significantly. And if you don't like the idea of pretending to be a Lover, you can always claim that your target instead loved you. Then you could just fakeclaim something like Oracle, SR, Survivor or whatever else is convenient.
    An average town will just lynch/kill u both if u CC eachother that's how this game works. Let's say that u managed to get gov in love and he knows u are swinger but doesn't want to kill u yet. U are still useless. U can't vote because ur vote pattern will be used against ur team, u can't affect the game in any meaningfull way because whatever u say is treated as worthless or used against ur team. Also one thing i forgot to mention, if ur taget dies in any way and leaves lw (Jailor, Veteran, Vigilante, NK, Witch, BG) u are done. Not only u just got exposed as a proven swinger/heartbreaker they also know for that one day u don't have any target active so they can just lynch u.

  4. ISO #4

    Re: Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    Quote Originally Posted by RufusPL View Post
    An average town will just lynch/kill u both if u CC eachother that's how this game works. Let's say that u managed to get gov in love and he knows u are swinger but doesn't want to kill u yet. U are still useless. U can't vote because ur vote pattern will be used against ur team, u can't affect the game in any meaningfull way because whatever u say is treated as worthless or used against ur team. Also one thing i forgot to mention, if ur taget dies in any way and leaves lw (Jailor, Veteran, Vigilante, NK, Witch, BG) u are done. Not only u just got exposed as a proven swinger/heartbreaker they also know for that one day u don't have any target active so they can just lynch u.
    There are work arounds to every scenario you've pointed out by being a little creative. But at the end of the day HB/Swinger players aren't obligated to pick a target N1 (unlike Lover.) If the role isn't something you want to play, blacklist it or don't pick a target N1.
    (๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)ﻭ 레드벨벳 ! ! ٩(♡ε♡ )۶

  5. ISO #5

    Re: Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    I was a swinger that managed to fall in love with a doctor on n1. There was a lover in that game as well and they fell in love with the arsonist. We were the last 4 people alive in the game, because the arsonist wouldnít douse the lover and I had a doctor on me the entire time.

    Not saying itís always going to be like that but, I think itís a fun dynamic to include. IMO survivor is a pretty bland role and donít find it enjoyable except to troll people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    1-I really and truly believe @Unknown1234 is town. He stuck by me when I needed him
    Quote Originally Posted by Gyrlander View Post
    Wow, this game was really easy. I just had to talk dumb shit to survive some days more. :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    If sheriff cleared you honestly I would take him out of my town core and put him as scum.

  6. ISO #6

    Re: Lover/Swinger/Heartbreaker are underwhelming

    I frankly don't like how you are forced to choose at N1. I think those roles would be more flexible to play if you were allowed to delay the Choice (TM) until maybe n2 or n3 before you get suicided or softlocked out of your ability.

    And the HBer/Swinger's victim being told who they are being held hostage by really doesn't help HBer/Swinger gameplay, since it forces them into a Lover claim that can still be easily seen through by a spy, and depending on how sus you and/or your target looks to town, the town would just want to lynch you faster. If the victim wasn't told who loved them, then maybe Lover/HBer/Swinger would have more flexibility.
    Last edited by Grakylan; January 20th, 2022 at 01:07 PM.
    https://imgur.com/a/NqMwElZ fuck it heres all the sc2mafia pics i would have put in the sig

 

 

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