S-FM 336: (Ladder) Politico II

[MartinGG99]

Politico II
S-FM 336

Setup Link

Signup Link
(for additional game information by me)

Player List

Host ISO	Player	Role (Phase)
ISO	Marshmallow Marshall
ISO	NotPaopan
ISO	Lag
ISO	Gikkle
ISO	Loldebite	Voter (N2)
ISO	PQRnHack
ISO	oliverz144
ISO	Frinckles	Voter (D1)
ISO	Voss	States Attorney (D2)
ISO	Guillo	Voter (N1)
ISO	Renegade
ISO	Stealthbomber16

EoD Links
EoD 1
EoD 2


SoD1 Countdown Link

Something-something a thing to allow fake-claims (without threat of angle-shooting) if that ever happens, as I used different wording in the PMs.

Spoiler : Role-card stuff :

Spoiler : Congressman :

You have access to an anonymous chat with two other congressmen!

You won't receive the Anonymous Chatzy chat link until SoD1.

Spoiler : Governor :

You may pardon someone each night. A pardoned player cannot be yeeted the next day. You can't target the same player twice in a row, nor can you self-target. This is announced at the start of day.

Spoiler : Judge :

Each night you may target a player, making their vote count for 0 the next day. This is announced at the start of the day.

Spoiler : Mayor :

You're fake-claiming what now?

Spoiler : States Attorney :

You may target someone at night, placing an anonymous vote on them. This will be announced on the next day, and cannot be changed until the next night. You may self-target and target the same person in a row.

Spoiler : Medic :

You may protect someone each night. You may self-target. If you successfully save someone, you cannot do so again. If you do, you are informed but your target is not (unless you are the target).

Spoiler : Voter :

You have no special abilities.

[MartinGG99]

Start of Day 1


Day 1 ends in about 48 hours from now.
Countdown Link

7 votes to hammer.
Renegade is the mayor with 2 votes.

[PQRnHack]

Alright, time to sweep it. I promise there will be no voter fraud!

-vote Renegade

[MartinGG99]

I forgot to add in mentions. Day 1 has begun!


@Marshmallow Marshall
@NotPaopan
@Lag
@Gikkle
@Loldebite
@PQRnHack
@oliverz144
@Frinckles
@Voss
@Guillo
@Renegade
@Stealthbomber16

[Lumi]

Hello everyone, I am the real mayor, Renegade is an imposter Mayor.

This is my rolecard as proof:

Spoiler : Mayor :

You're fake-claiming what now?

Check the OP and you'll see I have the right rolecard

-vote Renegade

[PQRnHack]

Hello everyone, I am the real mayor, Renegade is an imposter Mayor.

This is my rolecard as proof:

Spoiler : Mayor :

You're fake-claiming what now?

Check the OP and you'll see I have the right rolecard

-vote Renegade

Weak!

[Lumi]

Weak!

No! It can't be! The entire mafia team been caught in just 3 posts by the mastermind FM player PQHack?!?

I can't believe it! This is truly another level of FM play, a true generational talent.

[Renegade]

Hello everyone, I am the real mayor, Renegade is an imposter Mayor.

This is my rolecard as proof:

Spoiler : Mayor :

You're fake-claiming what now?

Check the OP and you'll see I have the right rolecard

-vote Renegade

FUCK i've been outed.

[Lumi]

Renegade just changed his profile picture, this is obviously extremely alignment indicative.

I'm not going to say if it's town indicative or mafia indicative, because it's so obvious that it should go without saying, but everyone knows what Renegade is now.

[PQRnHack]

Renegade just changed his profile picture, this is obviously extremely alignment indicative.

I'm not going to say if it's town indicative or mafia indicative, because it's so obvious that it should go without saying, but everyone knows what Renegade is now.

The mastermind used his pig brain to figure this out.



Extra attack power from the factional kill ability!!

[Renegade]

I've not even reached my final form.

[Stealthbomber16]

I CC mayo

[Stealthbomber16]

My contribution today will likely be spotty at best but I'll try to make all of my posts (following this one) quality posts at the very least.

[PQRnHack]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and hypothesize that there are 3 corruptors here, thinking 2 PRs and 1 Congman/Voter (Cong kinda makes more sense for a scum 3rd wo/man). Town then has 3 PRs.

[oliverz144]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and hypothesize that there are 3 corruptors here, thinking 2 PRs and 1 Congman/Voter (Cong kinda makes more sense for a scum 3rd wo/man). Town then has 3 PRs.

a good post for town and PQRN.

[oliverz144]

-vote lag

I meta know lag as well as my pocket
This 3 posts completely contradict the usual neutral-smart town game play
This is not rvs
Town lag would already come up with a plan
Now i need to jump in, gimme some time.
We have 2-3 scum
1 of them is lag.

[Lumi]

-vote lag

I meta know lag as well as my pocket
This 3 posts completely contradict the usual neutral-smart town game play
This is not rvs
Town lag would already come up with a plan
Now i need to jump in, gimme some time.
We have 2-3 scum
1 of them is lag.

It's funny that you think the posts I've made thus far have been alignment indicative.


I also don't think oliver is able to pull off a post like this as wolf, I think this is the fastest >>rand town read I've ever had

[Marshmallow Marshall]

"It's RVS"

-vote lag

I meta know lag as well as my pocket
This 3 posts completely contradict the usual neutral-smart town game play
This is not rvs
Town lag would already come up with a plan
Now i need to jump in, gimme some time.
We have 2-3 scum
1 of them is lag.

No, we just kinda skipped RVS thanks to Oliver :P. It's a D1 read, but it is based on something reasonable. So stating how I position myself towards Oliver's read is perfectly legitimate.

Hi guillo. That's a nice statement you have here. Why is Lag scum in your opinion?

[Guillo]

I didnt say Lag was scum, i said Voss is

[PQRnHack]

I didnt say Lag was scum, i said Voss is

Hmm.. MM mixing up whom Guillo was replying to. Mixing up the TvT's that aren't on your team @Marshmallow Marshall ?

[Lumi]

"It's RVS"



No, we just kinda skipped RVS thanks to Oliver :P. It's a D1 read, but it is based on something reasonable. So stating how I position myself towards Oliver's read is perfectly legitimate.

Hi guillo. That's a nice statement you have here. Why is Lag scum in your opinion?

Just because someone says we're not in RVS, doesn't mean we're not in RVS.

And like, no offense to oliver, but that is especially true when it's a new player making a read that's just totally wrong, pairing that with a statement of "we're not in RVS" doesn't mean anything, you of all people should know that. Also why did you just ignore all of my other points?

And are you claiming that you actually agree with oliver's read for the reasons he stated?

[Marshmallow Marshall]

I forgot everything about the set up of this game but it looks like politicians here suck as much as their real life counterparts for what i just read from Lag, so what if we just play it old school and stop worrying about mechanics and just catch scum on behavior? Yah?

Cool

More or less, although mechanics are important to worry about when it comes to calculating MYLO since they mess with votes. They will also probably matter tomorrow if/when abilities are used. I really think we should focus on behavioral analysis when possible, though (like right now).

I didnt say Lag was scum, i said Voss is

Oh, my bad. "Lag" was in the last words of his post, and my brain made the switch.

So... why is Voss scum, then? Is it because he blankly agreed with Oliver's read on Lag without further comments?

Hmm.. MM mixing up whom Guillo was replying to. Mixing up the TvT's that aren't on your team @Marshmallow Marshall ?

You wish :P

Just because someone says we're not in RVS, doesn't mean we're not in RVS.

And like, no offense to oliver, but that is especially true when it's a new player making a read that's just totally wrong, pairing that with a statement of "we're not in RVS" doesn't mean anything, you of all people should know that. Also why did you just ignore all of my other points?

And are you claiming that you actually agree with oliver's read for the reasons he stated?

When somebody gives a reason to vote someone that is not random/trolly and that several people react to it accordingly, RVS ends, whether you like it or not, and the more serious phase begins. Oliver went straight to the point lol.

Yes, I am claiming exactly that, but with an important nuance: as I said, I'm not sold yet - you see, the nuance matters.

Also, I ignored the mechanical part because I was tired and because it was less important ^^. My stance was already stated, too. Are power roles crazy pro-town in this game? No. Are power roles in the hand of town good? Yes. Can scum know who is a town PR? No, unless we literally just tell them and allow them to plan accordingly. Plus, more claims = less cover for the medic. Actions are public in all cases but the medic's, so we're going to ask for specific roles to claim soon enough anyway.

[Lumi]

Yes, I am claiming exactly that, but with an important nuance: as I said, I'm not sold yet - you see, the nuance matters.

Selective amnesia of my FM-Mabel Pines and FM-Wile E. Coyote games?

Also games you've not been in, but other players in this game were in (or hosted) like the Anime World 2 game Guillo hosted and Gikkle was in where I spent most of the start of day 1 appraising slots based on how "chill" I deemed them to be, lol

[oliverz144]

I think that claiming who is congressman is very towny
Only scum will say no
So i think that every congressman should claim immediately

[PQRnHack]

I think that claiming who is congressman is very towny
Only scum will say no
So i think that every congressman should claim immediately

Why would a scum~congressman say "no" if the opposite makes them "very towny"?

Or even if scum have 0 CMEN, doesn't it help them narrow down the remaining pool to PRs and Voters (making mafia's PR hunt easier than out of the pool of PR+Voters+CMEN)?

[Gikkle]

I think that claiming who is congressman is very towny
Only scum will say no
So i think that every congressman should claim immediately

What is the logic behind this

[oliverz144]

Sa, judge, governor should claim aswell
Only medic and voter shouldnt claim

[Marshmallow Marshall]

I think that claiming who is congressman is very towny
Only scum will say no
So i think that every congressman should claim immediately

Yeah, considering any scum within congressmen will be able to share the knowledge with his scummates, this could make sense. It's not like there is a real benefit to remaining hidden anyway, at least none that I can see.

Sa, judge, governor should claim aswell
Only medic and voter shouldnt claim

Uh, no? Why in the world would you want the PRs to claim lol, they're just going to get gunned down. The medic only has one successful save charge. The setup was designed not to be solvable via massclaim (and to even punish it). So no, absolutely not.

I like the meta point against Lag, though. I'm not sold about it yet obviously, but it certainly is a great way to start the game. Plus, Lag is always super towny, so I get the chance to vote them for once

-vote Lag

[Lumi]

Yeah, considering any scum within congressmen will be able to share the knowledge with his scummates, this could make sense. It's not like there is a real benefit to remaining hidden anyway, at least none that I can see.


Uh, no? Why in the world would you want the PRs to claim lol, they're just going to get gunned down. The medic only has one successful save charge. The setup was designed not to be solvable via massclaim (and to even punish it). So no, absolutely not.

I like the meta point against Lag, though. I'm not sold about it yet obviously, but it certainly is a great way to start the game. Plus, Lag is always super towny, so I get the chance to vote them for once

-vote Lag

This vote pings me.

It's one thing to see oliver making a read like that and realizing there is almost no way he makes a post like that as wolf, therefore you think oliver is town.

It's another thing to see the post and actually agree with it, because the accuracy of the read is quite bad. I can link several games directly contradicting the meta read - and considering that you were in multiple of those games, the fact that you go along with a meta read that you should know is just wrong is dubious.

But the real kicker is the hedgy "not sold about it yet" - it's RVS, you can vote whatever, feeling like you have to justify/hedge a vote made not even 25 (player) posts into the game feels like a wolf that's trying to not step on toes here.

[Guillo]

How do i multiquote here. Oliver claiming strat stinks.

I think the medic should claim.

I’m the medic.

[Lumi]

Oliver claiming strat stinks.

Hey, exactly the player I was expecting to say the claiming strat stinks.

How do i multiquote here.

Next to the "Reply with Quote" button there's a little Quote with a + next to it button. Click that button for all the posts you want to multiquote, and then click "Reply with Quote" on a post after you've selected all posts you want to include as well, and all the quotes will be included

[Guillo]

Voss trying to pocket Oliverz with an echo of their own read “i agree” is cute.

Voss, what do you like about Oliverz read onnLag?

[Voss]

Voss trying to pocket Oliverz with an echo of their own read “i agree” is cute.

Voss, what do you like about Oliverz read onnLag?

You don't know me, but that's okay. I like you because of it.

I liked Oliverz jumping straight into a meta read on Lag. I've talked with lag a bunch, but never played with him, so he's a scary "pro player" in my book. Oliverz seems to have some experience, and I'm glad they shared it, and would agree. Slightly trolling Lag is not my expectation here.

Also, it doesn't look like it, but my 1/3 congressperson idea came up independently. I missed critical things on the first read of the day and blame sleep deprivation. I townread oliverz though for the read on Lag, and not for saying 1/3 congresspeople are evil.

I also read more of your posts past this quote, and I think I will enjoy playing with you

Refusing to use the tool to put pressure on people and generate information that way is a little dumb, tbh. I will go with the option "biting you", since this is not AI, it's just sad and suboptimal.

Also, WHERE IS EVERYONE?!! : ]

I mean, if someone is at L-1 and I'm sure they're scum, I'll vote them. But I don't want scum to be able to do this.

This is actually kind of interesting.

I would assume always that the host would put one scum congressman in the chat. I think that any host would do that. So if you approach the chat as though it's like a final 3 scenario, ie, there is one imposter among us, I don't see why it would be a bad thing. Creating further information disadvantage for town is never something that benefits the town.

Let me expand on this a little bit.

Assuming an evil congressperson can figure out who the other congresspeople are through diction, post timing, etc, the scum team knowing who the other congresspeople are benefits scum. Scum would then just not kill or pressure these people, and up their chances of winning by killing non CCable PRs.

I'm not sure how this is information disadvantage, and i'd never advocate for something that I believe is anti-town.

Like, my other assumption here is that it's not advantageous for town to do a D1 mass role claim. This is because we don't want scum killing the better TPRs, and would rather wait a few days for TPRs to out and justify their night actions. Right?

[Voss]

I hate RVS and would rather talk strategy. I guess I'll reread the setup, since I just skimmed it.

Also a couple of things:
First, don't burn yourself out and/or have unrealistic expectations for people's contributions. There's a difference between a lurking scum, and someone who is making good posts, but not talking a lot. So when you are frustrated with the lack of contribution at 3am PST, get a grip, and reread/summarize the game instead of asking "wHeRe Is EvErYoNe? DeAd GaMe!!!!". It'll help you, and help those not able to spend 25/8 on the forums.

Second, since we're playing with the ARCANE early hammer system, I will refuse to vote until end of game. You can assume that whoever I put first in my "vote order bird vote" list is the person I'd vote for. Don't like it? Vote me, petition the host to change it, or bite me.

Gotta say I like oliverz here on the Lag meta read.

[Marshmallow Marshall]

I hate RVS and would rather talk strategy. I guess I'll reread the setup, since I just skimmed it.

Also a couple of things:
First, don't burn yourself out and/or have unrealistic expectations for people's contributions. There's a difference between a lurking scum, and someone who is making good posts, but not talking a lot. So when you are frustrated with the lack of contribution at 3am PST, get a grip, and reread/summarize the game instead of asking "wHeRe Is EvErYoNe? DeAd GaMe!!!!". It'll help you, and help those not able to spend 25/8 on the forums.

Second, since we're playing with the ARCANE early hammer system, I will refuse to vote until end of game. You can assume that whoever I put first in my "vote order bird vote" list is the person I'd vote for. Don't like it? Vote me, petition the host to change it, or bite me.

Gotta say I like oliverz here on the Lag meta read.

Refusing to use the tool to put pressure on people and generate information that way is a little dumb, tbh. I will go with the option "biting you", since this is not AI, it's just sad and suboptimal.

Also, WHERE IS EVERYONE?!! : ]

[Guillo]

I hate RVS and would rather talk strategy. I guess I'll reread the setup, since I just skimmed it.

Also a couple of things:
First, don't burn yourself out and/or have unrealistic expectations for people's contributions. There's a difference between a lurking scum, and someone who is making good posts, but not talking a lot. So when you are frustrated with the lack of contribution at 3am PST, get a grip, and reread/summarize the game instead of asking "wHeRe Is EvErYoNe? DeAd GaMe!!!!". It'll help you, and help those not able to spend 25/8 on the forums.

Second, since we're playing with the ARCANE early hammer system, I will refuse to vote until end of game. You can assume that whoever I put first in my "vote order bird vote" list is the person I'd vote for. Don't like it? Vote me, petition the host to change it, or bite me.

Gotta say I like oliverz here on the Lag meta read.

This player is scum

[Voss]

I hate RVS and would rather talk strategy. I guess I'll reread the setup, since I just skimmed it.

Also a couple of things:
First, don't burn yourself out and/or have unrealistic expectations for people's contributions. There's a difference between a lurking scum, and someone who is making good posts, but not talking a lot. So when you are frustrated with the lack of contribution at 3am PST, get a grip, and reread/summarize the game instead of asking "wHeRe Is EvErYoNe? DeAd GaMe!!!!". It'll help you, and help those not able to spend 25/8 on the forums.

Second, since we're playing with the ARCANE early hammer system, I will refuse to vote until end of game. You can assume that whoever I put first in my "vote order bird vote" list is the person I'd vote for. Don't like it? Vote me, petition the host to change it, or bite me.

Gotta say I like oliverz here on the Lag meta read.

This is really kinda obtuse and offensive. I got cornered to some extent both days D1 and D2. Do you want me to stop posting and just cave in and let mafia win?? Aint happening. It sucks that I spend more time defending self, but it was not my own doing (some may disagree since im apparently a scum read)

It's probably not clear, but the advice I gave in my first post here applies.

Don't spam the thread. It's a better use of your(nay, EVERYONES) time to go back and do longer posts on these sorts of things:
find why people are scum reading you and find your own posts that contradict/disprove/assuage their reasonings.

and more importantly, go push your actual scum reads by finding their posts and telling others why you think they're bad. But not by responding to each one one at a time to spam the thread. A nicely formatted post with commentary and wrapped in spoilers is way better to give other people pause on whether you're scum or not. Give them alternatives, and they can also judge your reasonings as to whether they come from a town perspective, or a scum faking it.

i'll stop preaching about this after this post.

[Voss]

Oh, ren is actually the mayor. Missed that with the trolling.

Governor, states attorney, and judge aren’t really worth commenting right now bc they haven’t had time to do an action.

This is something I'd like to discuss though:
I don’t see why congresspeople should ever talk in the day/night chat. Scum will only use it to figure out who not to kill.

[Stealthbomber16]

Oh, ren is actually the mayor. Missed that with the trolling.

Governor, states attorney, and judge aren’t really worth commenting right now bc they haven’t had time to do an action.

This is something I'd like to discuss though:
I don’t see why congresspeople should ever talk in the day/night chat. Scum will only use it to figure out who not to kill.

This is actually kind of interesting.

I would assume always that the host would put one scum congressman in the chat. I think that any host would do that. So if you approach the chat as though it's like a final 3 scenario, ie, there is one imposter among us, I don't see why it would be a bad thing. Creating further information disadvantage for town is never something that benefits the town.

[Stealthbomber16]

you were talking bout power roles
not cmen

This is actually kind of interesting.

I would assume always that the host would put one scum congressman in the chat. I think that any host would do that. So if you approach the chat as though it's like a final 3 scenario, ie, there is one imposter among us, I don't see why it would be a bad thing. Creating further information disadvantage for town is never something that benefits the town.

Please don’t misquote me. It makes you look bad.

[NotPaopan]

It is I, the town leader of this town.
You can call me Mr. Chairman
I shall and will give town the salvation it needed!

We must learn to look at problems all-sidedly, seeing the reverse as well as the obverse side of things.
In given conditions, a bad thing can lead to good results and a good thing to bad results.

[PQRnHack]

You can call me Mr. Chairman

Here comes Pao, planting an Easter Egg in his first post. RED IS ALWAYS MAFIA!

[NotPaopan]

Here comes Pao, planting an Easter Egg in his first post. RED IS ALWAYS MAFIA!

Stop scum painting me!

The colour red is a fiery symbol that interprets happiness, beauty, vitality, good luck, success and good fortune!!

[Marshmallow Marshall]

It is I, the town leader of this town.
You can call me Mr. Chairman
I shall and will give town the salvation it needed!

We must learn to look at problems all-sidedly, seeing the reverse as well as the obverse side of things.
In given conditions, a bad thing can lead to good results and a good thing to bad results.

I almost want to say that you're towny by meta for this, considering your last game as Mayor in Once Upon a Town in the West. But seriously, please drop it. I was scum, and I can say you were a blessing for us because you distracted everyone. Please integrate thoughtful content in your posts. Else, you will be deemed lazy and antipatriotic, and will thus be sent to the nearest gulag. Thank you.

[NotPaopan]

New things always have to experience difficulties and setbacks as they grow.

It is sheer fantasy to imagine that the cause of socialism is all plain sailing and easy success, without difficulties and setbacks or the exertion of tremendous efforts.

[PQRnHack]

New things always have to experience difficulties and setbacks as they grow.

It is sheer fantasy to imagine that the cause of socialism is all plain sailing and easy success, without difficulties and setbacks or the exertion of tremendous efforts.

Pao Zedong detected!!! Corrupted impostor amogus!!

[Frinckles]

hi

[Lumi]

hi

Hi Frinckles

[Frinckles]

Hi Frinckles

Hay Lag. I see you're already dealing with a bunch of analysis so I'll just sit back on this one.

I made a pizza. But I put some diced green onions on it. It was pretty good. I'm surprised more people haven't done that, like yeah white onion is a thing, NEVER red onion. Even chives, which I think is related to green onion and the leek family? But nobody ever says GREEN onion.

[PQRnHack]

Hay Lag. I see you're already dealing with a bunch of analysis so I'll just sit back on this one.

I made a pizza. But I put some diced green onions on it. It was pretty good. I'm surprised more people haven't done that, like yeah white onion is a thing, NEVER red onion. Even chives, which I think is related to green onion and the leek family? But nobody ever says GREEN onion.

So Frinckles claims to be a GREEN onion and NEVER red onion.