S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak - Page 71
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  1. #3501

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall View Post
    Fair point. It's the manner of saying it that may lean towards toxicity imo though, not really the content. Or maybe I'm just twisting the content to make it what I wish it would be.

    I already said it was rude, so I'm not sure what you're on about. I'm talking about the "constructive introspection" part, as Voss put it, which was going down the drain along with the "everyone is shit". Again, don't confuse civility and facts. I don't approve of calling everyone shit, but I also don't approve of saying "noone made any mistakes", and I approve even less of those who say nobody should say otherwise, even in a civil manner.


    Forcing the sub-out in a situation where the slot was heavily affected by weird claims would have been very damaging and would have opened the door to angleshooting way too hard. Imagine you're town seeing ZZ force-replaced and then his replacement says "forget everything my predecessor has said, I'm just VT lol". Even if you want to avoid reading into the replacement, it will be impossible not to think that the replacement was due to trolling.

    As for warning vs modkilling, I agree that in hindsight it would have been better to warn before and modkill after if it didn't stop. That being said, I definetly wouldn't say the modkill was abusive given the circumstances, just not optimal (and probably very unpleasing for the modkilled player). And note that in some regards, the modkill better preserved game integrity than waiting longer would have, considering town would have been completely misled for a really long and significant time if the modkill hadn't happened quickly enough. So I'd just say it's a lesson for the future.
    I expect every goofy ass gambit from here on out to be modkilled then. To prevent town from being misled.

    Wtf?

  2. #3502

  3. #3503

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    Since when are modkills used to "prevent town from being misled"?

    yikes (!!!!!)
    Isn't the setup even more scum sided than a mountainous 15er - where wolves winrate is ~75%?

    I reckon Mike knows his setup best and what's the best/safest way to minimize damage to the game and keep it as playable as possible.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    from time to time, I act very much like a normal person.

  4. #3504

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    I expect every goofy ass gambit from here on out to be modkilled then. To prevent town from being misled.

    Wtf?
    Misled by malicious intent, obviously...

    That's the basic assumption behind any modkill (except for those caused by unfortunate accidents that would destroy the game) and doesn't even need to be stated lol.
    Last edited by Marshmallow Marshall; July 14th, 2021 at 04:11 PM.
    Spoiler : Quotes :
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Hey peter View Post
    There are two wolves inside you. One is addicted to crack. The other one is also addicted to crack. You are addicted to crack.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    MM IS AN ANTI-VAXXER
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Mallow are you really an anti vaxxer
    Quote Originally Posted by The Lawyer View Post
    Besides your lamp and your refridgerators, do you find anyone else suspicious?
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    God is a goofy loser.

  5. #3505

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    Since when are modkills used to "prevent town from being misled"?

    yikes (!!!!!)
    That's what I was thinking, especially considering we had the same shenanigans happen with different players in S-FM Lazy fairly recently


    3 people (all townies, 2 VT's and 1 sheriff) claimed sheriff out of 6 people which caused chaos for the entirety of the day, and had it not been for a scum error likely for the next day aswell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall
    considering town would have been completely misled for a really long and significant time if the modkill hadn't happened quickly enough.
    Why were there not two modkills in the game referenced above then?

    Quote Originally Posted by OzyWho
    Isn't the setup even more scum sided than a mountainous 15er - where wolves winrate is ~75%?

    I reckon Mike knows his setup best and what's the best/safest way to minimize damage to the game and keep it as playable as possible.
    Either way the outcome of the game I doubt would have been influenced due to ZZ being passed off as a troll by the majority of players, the D1 and D2 lynches would not have been altered.

    At most instead of Renegade being lynched we likely would have seen ZZ.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16
    I feel like I'm watching a horror movie and the protag. group is exploring an old house or something and everything is super quiet, but you know something bad is about to happen. Mafia man is about to come out from behind the basement furnace and gun down varcron right in front of me. And there will be nothing I can do.

  6. #3506

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    I'm assuming that ZZ didn't intentionally try to fuck up the game btw
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16
    I feel like I'm watching a horror movie and the protag. group is exploring an old house or something and everything is super quiet, but you know something bad is about to happen. Mafia man is about to come out from behind the basement furnace and gun down varcron right in front of me. And there will be nothing I can do.

  7. #3507

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    @Varcron I can't speak for the multiple hosts, but I can at least make enlightened assumptions.

    - Malicious intent was probably not assumed in S-FM Lazy. Remember that this game, ZZ started the game by deliberately circumventing the rules to avoid having to actually play. This is the kind of stuff that makes hosts doubt the goodwill of a player, and with good reason. Now, again, I cannot speak for the host, but Mike did say he thought that ZZ was showing that he "had not tried".

    - S-FM Lazy was not a flipless game. The flipless aspect is very important, because it makes it impossible to know who was telling the truth and who was scum (or if everyone was town engaging in fakeclaiming), and therefore throws the important information into the garbage.
    Spoiler : Quotes :
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Hey peter View Post
    There are two wolves inside you. One is addicted to crack. The other one is also addicted to crack. You are addicted to crack.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    MM IS AN ANTI-VAXXER
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Mallow are you really an anti vaxxer
    Quote Originally Posted by The Lawyer View Post
    Besides your lamp and your refridgerators, do you find anyone else suspicious?
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    God is a goofy loser.

  8. #3508

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Varcron View Post
    I'm assuming that ZZ didn't intentionally try to fuck up the game btw
    That's what the post-game investigation concluded: it was probably not his intention. That wasn't exactly evident at the moment of the modkill, though, as I said in my last post.
    Spoiler : Quotes :
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Hey peter View Post
    There are two wolves inside you. One is addicted to crack. The other one is also addicted to crack. You are addicted to crack.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    MM IS AN ANTI-VAXXER
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Mallow are you really an anti vaxxer
    Quote Originally Posted by The Lawyer View Post
    Besides your lamp and your refridgerators, do you find anyone else suspicious?
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    God is a goofy loser.

  9. #3509

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Varcron View Post
    Why were there not two modkills in the game referenced above then?
    Tbh, blink did it purposefully as gambit to bait our reactions; with Oberon's reaction being to fake claim too. Arguably it worked out as the townies were found due to having very natural reactions and the PoE got lynched which happend to be Mafias? Though LagAttack disagrees with that assessment but it's a story for another day.

    Here, a guy was trolling after trolling? Correct me if I'm wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    from time to time, I act very much like a normal person.

  10. #3510

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by OzyWho View Post
    Tbh, blink did it purposefully as gambit to bait our reactions; with Oberon's reaction being to fake claim too. Arguably it worked out as the townies were found due to having very natural reactions and the PoE got lynched which happend to be Mafias? Though LagAttack disagrees with that assessment but it's a story for another day.

    Here, a guy was trolling after trolling? Correct me if I'm wrong.
    I don't know the exact circumstances of S-FM Lazy, but they were certainly very different from the circumstances in this game, and comparing them is comparing pears and oranges.
    Spoiler : Quotes :
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Hey peter View Post
    There are two wolves inside you. One is addicted to crack. The other one is also addicted to crack. You are addicted to crack.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    MM IS AN ANTI-VAXXER
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Mallow are you really an anti vaxxer
    Quote Originally Posted by The Lawyer View Post
    Besides your lamp and your refridgerators, do you find anyone else suspicious?
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    God is a goofy loser.

  11. #3511

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall View Post
    @Varcron I can't speak for the multiple hosts, but I can at least make enlightened assumptions.

    - Malicious intent was probably not assumed in S-FM Lazy. Remember that this game, ZZ started the game by deliberately circumventing the rules to avoid having to actually play. This is the kind of stuff that makes hosts doubt the goodwill of a player, and with good reason. Now, again, I cannot speak for the host, but Mike did say he thought that ZZ was showing that he "had not tried".

    - S-FM Lazy was not a flipless game. The flipless aspect is very important, because it makes it impossible to know who was telling the truth and who was scum (or if everyone was town engaging in fakeclaiming), and therefore throws the important information into the garbage.
    Okay, so in essence the flipless setup required more severe and quicker action needed to be taken without warning beforehand. Basically it was a combination of bad stuff and unfortunate circumstance

    That makes sense to me, as much as it still seems slightly extreme.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16
    I feel like I'm watching a horror movie and the protag. group is exploring an old house or something and everything is super quiet, but you know something bad is about to happen. Mafia man is about to come out from behind the basement furnace and gun down varcron right in front of me. And there will be nothing I can do.

  12. #3512

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Gamewise, ZZ got as smited as someone who would've personally attacked someone else (apart from post-game judgement).
    I however do not believe what he did has been planned to be malicious intent,
    We are talking here about 4 out of game's context posts to "fit the amount of post required".

    It's not like a first of having someone spamming out of game stuff in the gamethread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Efekannn02 View Post
    MM Magoroth and Distorted are the 3 baddies
    just like Agrael Acriel and Auwt being the original 3 baddies
    Quote Originally Posted by Efekannn02 View Post
    MafiaZ and Skwirl its all a repeat of history
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkRevenant View Post
    But Potoss has Pobes, Zeelot, and Acrons!
    Quote Originally Posted by Efekannn02 View Post
    Screw you I actually have more grudges towards the people who have their names start with A

  13. #3513

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by OzyWho
    Here, a guy was trolling after trolling? Correct me if I'm wrong.
    I wouldn't go as far to say trolling as he was distracting from a townie POV in this game, however in the previous Lazy game it did appear to be trolling.

    You're not necessarily wrong though depending how you look at it which justifies what happened.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16
    I feel like I'm watching a horror movie and the protag. group is exploring an old house or something and everything is super quiet, but you know something bad is about to happen. Mafia man is about to come out from behind the basement furnace and gun down varcron right in front of me. And there will be nothing I can do.

  14. #3514

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Varcron View Post
    Okay, so in essence the flipless setup required more severe and quicker action needed to be taken without warning beforehand. Basically it was a combination of bad stuff and unfortunate circumstance

    That makes sense to me, as much as it still seems slightly extreme.
    As I said, I do think warning first would have been better in hindsight, but I really don't blame Mike for what he did, both because modkiling immediatly had its merits and because he had to take action quickly (in other words, not with the hindsight we all have the luxury of having to blame or defend him).
    Spoiler : Quotes :
    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Hey peter View Post
    There are two wolves inside you. One is addicted to crack. The other one is also addicted to crack. You are addicted to crack.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthbomber16 View Post
    MM IS AN ANTI-VAXXER
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Mallow are you really an anti vaxxer
    Quote Originally Posted by The Lawyer View Post
    Besides your lamp and your refridgerators, do you find anyone else suspicious?
    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    God is a goofy loser.

  15. #3515

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall View Post
    Misled by malicious intent, obviously...

    That's the basic assumption behind any modkill (except for those caused by unfortunate accidents that would destroy the game) and doesn't even need to be stated lol.
    I've yet to be convinced he did anything malicious.

    Being stupid is not malicious. Doing a goofy gambit (that no one should've taken seriously) is a bad PLAY not malicious.

    Extremely heavy handed because he is new to FM. Sad!

  16. #3516

    Re: S-FM 330: All Stars (Old School) Not for the Weak

    I mean yeah.. It's quite unfair for me actually XD. Game would've changed dramastically when ZZOrange was modkilled and I wasn't when we're like playing in a similar playstyle. Hence, people can confirm that ZZorange was town and I probably wasn't bcos I wasn't modkilled.

    It's my 2nd game at FM. But my first game consisted of @Oberon fake claiming as "sheriff" whom he called out @Marshmallow Marshall as "scum" on day 2. Thus putting him at L-1.. was almost close though but some players are inactive at that time. But he wasn't given a warning or modkilled. So there's that, so I thought it wasn't against the rules too..

    Maybe.. I could've won that game as scum if MM was lynched followed ? I don't know.. Don't want to think about alternative history.

    In any case. After a game/battle ends, it's all water under the bridge.
    Last edited by Yuesford; July 15th, 2021 at 12:51 AM.
    What I got for my 18th Birthday

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

  17. #3517

  18. #3518

 

 

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