MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate - Page 4
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  1. ISO #151

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    1. It doesn’t affect me directly - don’t you see? Everyone’s is missing the point here. It’s jot the word change that pisses me off. I wouldn’t give a shit if they started calling it execution, outvoting, election it anything else. My problem is the underlying social attitude that led to it being even considered. And, I WILL continue to use that word. It’s impossible to predict what someone else will feel offended by; in not going to start policing my speech just because someone is displeased with a neutral word.
    no one asked you to stop using the word lynch, and MU specifically said they will not police it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    2. That’s their problem. If they do get offended, they should sort themselves out and stop being so sensitive. You’re not being an asshole by using a word. They’re being the asshole by requesting you use a different word that literally means the same thing and then claim you to be a racist who hates people for not complying with their request.
    no one's calling you racist or asshole here for using the word lynch. this is straw manning

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  2. ISO #152

  3. ISO #153

  4. ISO #154

  5. ISO #155
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    no one asked you to stop using the word lynch, and MU specifically said they will not police it.



    no one's calling you racist or asshole here for using the word lynch. this is straw manning
    Read stealths post. He was asking me if, hypothetically if someone asked me not to use it, what reason there would be for me not to comply

    yes, right now nobody is - but in the event of someone asking me to use lynch and me refusing, I could very easily see someone calling me racist.

  6. ISO #156
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    Explain to me why I shouldn’t change it to eliminate
    Thats not how it works. You explain to me why it should be changed, not why it shouldn’t.

  7. ISO #157

  8. ISO #158
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    What are the negative repercussions of that change?
    Alienating long standing users.
    A bizarre situation where the term lynch was frowned upon but allowed. If we start seeing lynch as racist, we’ll start seeing reports from people who felt offended by the use of the term (in an FM game), and then people getting infracted for no reason other than the fact that they used lynch.

  9. ISO #159

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Alienating long standing users.
    A bizarre situation where the term lynch was frowned upon but allowed. If we start seeing lynch as racist, we’ll start seeing reports from people who felt offended by the use of the term (in an FM game), and then people getting infracted for no reason other than the fact that they used lynch.
    Yea have you seen the fm reports section?....
    Have you ever heard the tragedy of Darth Jar Jar the wise?

  10. ISO #160
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    I disagree, it’s not your code
    Is this a police state? For the record it’s not your code either. And if you change the word like this without consulting be community there WILL be backlash. You don’t go around deciding for other people what’s best for them - as staff you are held to a higher standard, and aren’t a dictator.

  11. ISO #161

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    For the record, I actually don’t know where you are coming from suggesting that changing the word lynch to execute would help with inclusivity.
    how the fuck do you not know where i'm coming from. i gave you a real life example where changing the word helped with inclusivity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Many long-standing players with views similar to my own were probably displeased with MU’s move. I would imagine some of them even left.
    if they left over the word change, then good riddance, they need thicker skin, and i don't want to play with them. sounds familiar??

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    And it’s jot the only thing MU has done. They’re also changing the logo (because it has a noose in it),

    you're right! if anything we should make a logo featuring a mutiliated body! /sarcasm

    the noose goes literally hand in hand with the lynch argument. to me they hold the same moral weight, so it's not surprising that they're changing it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    and there’s been discussion on banning the word AIDS (as a curse word). There’s many things happening on that website, the lynch debacle is simply the most glamorous one.
    come back to us when they change it and i'll have a fresh set of arguments for it. for the time being it's just a hypothetical and i imagine going to be harder to get changed. their post sounded like they didn't want to do active moderation, something that i can absolutely relate to.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  12. ISO #162
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    That’s precisely why I deleted my posts on this thread. While I do think freedom of speech is important, I realize that as staff my words have a significant impact and I’d rather not use them for evil.

  13. ISO #163
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    yes Voss, you’ll get some people on the train and alienating MANY. I’m not convinced you’ll love the people you’ll be taking onboard, however.

  14. ISO #164

  15. ISO #165

  16. ISO #166

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Read stealths post. He was asking me if, hypothetically if someone asked me not to use it, what reason there would be for me not to comply

    yes, right now nobody is - but in the event of someone asking me to use lynch and me refusing, I could very easily see someone calling me racist.
    "Hey voss, please stop using the word lynch"

    "Why?"

    "Because it has racist conotations."

    "Ah, we talked about this as a community a while back. It was really civil. Our end result was that we'd change the modbot word, but as a community allow people to keep using the word. If you want me to change it, let's have a community wide talk and get everyone on board, because it's been a while since we've visited this topic"

    ####

    or you could respond with

    "REEEE FUCK YOU CIVIL RIGHTS FREEDOM OF SPEECH"

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  17. ISO #167
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    The issue is that the people who feel strongly about such a change are myself, MM, Exeter, and presumably such people as Distorted, Ceko, blinkskater - and that’s just on our tiny website. Who are the people in favour if changing lynch? I have no idea who they are - but if they’re anything like the people who wanted to ban AIDS - which they probably are - they aren’t the sort of people you’d want on their website.

    also, you’re describing a hypothetical situation where someone would be displeased with an invented problem that exists entirely in the mental plane (conflation of the word lynch with racism), whereas the other problem is much more significant and exists in the real world. I’ve just outlined to you what would happen if the word lynch were changed.

  18. ISO #168
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    Where do you get your MANY statistic from.

    Tbh the bot on here was changed like 12+ hours ago and nobody left
    What the fuck?
    okau this is hilarious

  19. ISO #169

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    It also depends on how you phrase it to blink, ceko, and distorted:

    "sc2mafia leftist anarchist black pleasing overlords are banning the word lynch! wanna get in one good last game on the site before degenerates destroy our pure sc2mafia culture?"

    or

    "The Godfather now says "eliminate" rather than lynch."

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  20. ISO #170

  21. ISO #171

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Which also brings up another question. How often do you read the script that modbot says? I bet that most people wouldn't be able to recite exactly what it says verbatim. Do you know why? Because they don't read it. They care about who was voted out and by whom.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  22. ISO #172

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Which also brings up another question. How often do you read the script that modbot says? I bet that most people wouldn't be able to recite exactly what it says verbatim. Do you know why? Because they don't read it. They care about who was voted out and by whom.
    Deathwords was fucked! Stand by for the host's end day post and review!

    [vote count]

    Now I'll go see how off I was
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho

  23. ISO #173

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    I will once again bring up the non hypothetical situation where I was able to be a bit more inclusive, and got a LOT of coworkers to continue to keep playing the game even though I used the word lynch once. There are a lot of fun people in that group and we're able to really attack each other in a friendly context.

    So frankly this fearmongering over people being worked up over AIDs is just wrong, and them being distasteful people is "mental gymnastics" for me.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  24. ISO #174

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Deathwords was fucked! Stand by for the host's end day post and review!

    [vote count]

    Now I'll go see how off I was
    wrong.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  25. ISO #175
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Again, you keep trying to put it to it just being a word. It’s jot just a word, and you know it, because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk if changing it in the first place. The problem is the underlying social attitude, not using one word or another

  26. ISO #176

  27. ISO #177

  28. ISO #178

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Again, you keep trying to put it to it just being a word. It’s jot just a word, and you know it, because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk if changing it in the first place. The problem is the underlying social attitude, not using one word or another
    It's literally just a word. The spirit of mafia isn't changed due to the word.
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho

  29. ISO #179

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Again, you keep trying to put it to it just being a word. It’s jot just a word, and you know it, because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk if changing it in the first place. The problem is the underlying social attitude, not using one word or another
    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    I will once again bring up the non hypothetical situation where I was able to be a bit more inclusive, and got a LOT of coworkers to continue to keep playing the game even though I used the word lynch once. There are a lot of fun people in that group and we're able to really attack each other in a friendly context.
    see this real life scenario where it was just about a word.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  30. ISO #180

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Again, you keep trying to put it to it just being a word. It’s jot just a word, and you know it, because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk if changing it in the first place. The problem is the underlying social attitude, not using one word or another
    But that’s just a slippery slope conspiracy theory response dude. What if it IS just a word?
    Have you ever heard the tragedy of Darth Jar Jar the wise?

  31. ISO #181
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Imagine getting so worked up about 1 word changing that you basically threaten to leave the site and take "many" others with you
    I did not threaten to leave the site. I did not even threaten to take others with me, I gave people who would be displeased with the change as an example and SUGGESTED that they were at risk of leaving or at the very least of being alienated.

  32. ISO #182
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    But that’s just a slippery slope conspiracy theory response dude. What if it IS just a word?
    If it’s just a word, why change it?

  33. ISO #183

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    “Because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk of changing it”

    Isn’t it a little contradictory to suggest the change is to infringe on your free speech when you previously suggested it was just virtue signaling? Pick one
    Have you ever heard the tragedy of Darth Jar Jar the wise?

  34. ISO #184

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    and ganelon, if it's not just about a word, why don't you start a new thread about what you fear might happen, but not cite this "lynch" example.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  35. ISO #185
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    see this real life scenario where it was just about a word.
    No it isnt
    the problem is the social attitude. Fuck the word. The word is literally irrelevant

  36. ISO #186

  37. ISO #187

  38. ISO #188

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    I did not threaten to leave the site. I did not even threaten to take others with me, I gave people who would be displeased with the change as an example and SUGGESTED that they were at risk of leaving or at the very least of being alienated.
    this is true, banana and I did put some words in your mouth here. sorry.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  39. ISO #189
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by aamirus View Post
    “Because otherwise there wouldn’t be this talk of changing it”

    Isn’t it a little contradictory to suggest the change is to infringe on your free speech when you previously suggested it was just virtue signaling? Pick one
    The two are not mutually exclusive. Also, you’re conflating reason with effect. The reason is virtue signaling, the effect is infringing on freedom of speech.

  40. ISO #190
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    this is true, banana and I did put some words in your mouth here. sorry.
    No worries. It often happens in heated debates like this.

  41. ISO #191

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    No it isnt
    the problem is the social attitude. Fuck the word. The word is literally irrelevant
    yeah, i TOTALLY should have said that to my co workers. because that's more important than me trying to play more games with people that I like.

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

  42. ISO #192
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho View Post
    Ah the word is literally irrelevant. Thanks for proving our point?
    It is irrelevant. Like i said the action of changing it is literally meaningless in and of itself. Its the attitude that led to it being an issue that is the problem

  43. ISO #193

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    I did not threaten to leave the site. I did not even threaten to take others with me, I gave people who would be displeased with the change as an example and SUGGESTED that they were at risk of leaving or at the very least of being alienated.
    Right. Not actually threatening. Just heavily suggesting it.
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho

  44. ISO #194

  45. ISO #195

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    It is irrelevant. Like i said the action of changing it is literally meaningless in and of itself. Its the attitude that led to it being an issue that is the problem
    As far as I can see the attitude of it changing at sc2mafia is this:

    A user rants about the change happening on other sites
    Another user says he changed it in his game to be more inclusive
    Some users here say "wow, thats a good point, we can be more inclusive by making that change here too"

    That sound about right? I didnt see a social justice movement happen here, did you? This wouldn't have even been a topic had you not brought it up
    Quote Originally Posted by BananaCucho

  46. ISO #196

  47. ISO #197

  48. ISO #198

  49. ISO #199

  50. ISO #200
    Ganelon
    Guest

    Re: MafiaUniverse replaced the word ‘lynch’ with eliminate

    Right, and on sc2mafia I think we’re atill sane enough not to consider something like this. But it’s wirrying. I was not even aware this had happened anywhere.

 

 

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