Mafioso and Agent suggestions

[Claire_Stanfield]

Mafioso - add option: exclude from random.
Agent - rename to stalker.

People don't like mafioso and if i make my setup mafioso, random mafia, mafia deception then i don't want random mafia to be mafioso but i don't want to make it impossible for it to be GF.
Agent doesn't sounds mafia-ish.

[Cryptonic]

I agree that Agent doesn't sound Mafia, but I don't think that really matters.
However, I agree with the Mafioso change fully. Makes a lot of sense.

[Slaol]

Stalker is occupied. Tracker could work, and was my original name for it. But names are meaningless.
Mafioso options is fine, but I would be annoyed to have it added since it would be excluding the most vital role in the history of mafia.

[Deantwo]

Mafioso - add option: exclude from random.

People don't like mafioso and if i make my setup mafioso, random mafia, mafia deception then i don't want random mafia to be mafioso but i don't want to make it impossible for it to be GF.

my brother actually complained about this the other day... since now there's a reason to use the Mafia Killing Category ^^;

told him to post about it but he never did...

anyway... i'll support this!

Mafioso options is fine, but I would be annoyed to have it added since it would be excluding the most vital role in the history of mafia.

i agree... but lets face it... pubs don't like it... in FMs it may be good... but in SC2Mafia people want shiny buttons that do stuff other then just vote...

[Lazers]

Mafioso options is fine, but I would be annoyed to have it added since it would be excluding the most vital role in the history of mafia.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Mafioso is there for hosts who don't want an extremely strong Mafia team. It's an anchor, if anything. Citizen has its vest + tiebreaker niche now, Mafioso does not. It's literally a weaker Godfather. It's also there for a backup killing role if no Godfather or anything is present, which is what it should be in your average 9-3-3

I agree strongly with the Mafioso suggestion.

[Korebian]

Stalker is occupied. Tracker could work, and was my original name for it. But names are meaningless.
Mafioso options is fine, but I would be annoyed to have it added since it would be excluding the most vital role in the history of mafia.

In the current meta setups, Mafioso is probably the most useless role in the history of mafia. Seeing as most setups run a 3-Mafia 3-Neutral 9-Town setup, with a Godfather that is immune to detection, and can kill without a mafioso, the mafioso only works as an extension to the Godfathers immunity. I'd like to note that most setups has Detective and Lookout ignoring immune detection, therefore the only valid skill a Mafioso brings to the game, is complete immunity to the Godfather, though this immunity doesn't extend to the mafioso himself, who is just a running target. Also the Godfather isn't necessarily the mastermind in the mafia, therefore having such a weak role as Mafioso, who shares investigation tip with Vigilante/Serial Killer, and who has no extra information, except information optained from fellow mafia, a very, very weak link in the mafia. You effectively end up with an immunity extension, who has no means to defend himself, and ends up being nothing but a patsy. Other roles, such as the Consigliere can fake an investigator, an Agent can even fake both Lookout and Detective. A Janitor can clean dead peoples roles and help the mafia get proper alibies, and the list goes on. Fact is that Mafioso is by far the weakest link of mafia roles, and for some reason, it's chance of appearing is much higher than any other mafia role.

An exclude option would be very good for the current meta setups of Starcraft Mafia. Even though most games run with, Godfather, Mafia Deception, Mafia Support. I'd argue that people do this, because you have no other option, since any random will get Mafioso 90% of the time, just like with Town Random with Citizen.

[maccabbe]

In terms of advantages, if there is a gf & mafioso then if one is jailed the other will kill anyways. However this combo has the disadvantage that if there is a gf & mafioso then if the mafioso is rbed by escort the mafia will not kill, which seems strange. Personally rather than remove mafioso from setups i'd like to see him buffed by a) making him immune to role blocks/jails or b) giving him the one use ability to ignore heals/immunity.

[Deantwo]

In terms of advantages, if there is a gf & mafioso then if one is jailed the other will kill anyways. However this combo has the disadvantage that if there is a gf & mafioso then if the mafioso is rbed by escort the mafia will not kill, which seems strange. Personally rather than remove mafioso from setups i'd like to see him buffed by a) making him immune to role blocks/jails or b) giving him the one use ability to ignore heals/immunity.

at least making it so that if the Mafioso was blocked... the GF will go do the kill (like when Mafioso is jailed) would make it more useful...

but as it is right now Mafioso is just an extension to the Godfather... like Kore said...

but in the end a Exclude option would still be nice ^^;

[Sen]

I support this.

[PhantomZeRo]

+1 to this idea; Mafioso no fun.

[BorkBot]

It seems OK to add exclusion from randoms as an option to mafioso. My only fear is that noobs will whine if it's not switched on.

My setups never have a confirmed GF. I prefer to use a random mafia killer. That way it's a bit of a surprise what the mafia killer is going to be and investigators won't know what to look for.

[kyle1234513]

It seems OK to add exclusion from randoms as an option to mafioso. My only fear is that noobs will whine if it's not switched on.

My setups never have a confirmed GF. I prefer to use a random mafia killer. That way it's a bit of a surprise what the mafia killer is going to be and investigators won't know what to look for.

and by "random mafia killer" you mean Mafioso 7/10 times, kidnapper 1/10 times, disguiser 1/10 times, and godfather 1/10 times.
its the same way with town random and citizen, I have 3 town randoms, which don't exclude citizen, and I get at least 2 citizens every time. that's the real reason why people always exclude citizen and want to exclude Mafioso.

[BorkBot]

Hence why I said: My only fear is that noobs will whine if it's not switched on.

My setups aren't balanced to need a godfather or to not have citizens in them. So it's fine if they get randomed in more often.

[Titus]

Mafioso is one of the easiest roles to hide as though from an investigator. All you have to say is I didn't shoot, if you were caught early. That buys a day to buddy with a townie who will be assumed to be mafia. That's usually the worst case scenario.

[ika]

Mafioso is one of the easiest roles to hide as though from an investigator. All you have to say is I didn't shoot, if you were caught early. That buys a day to buddy with a townie who will be assumed to be mafia. That's usually the worst case scenario.

but most towns see through it if you get investigate late game. early game it can work but mid/late its less reliable

[kyle1234513]

Hence why I said: My only fear is that noobs will whine if it's not switched on.

My setups aren't balanced to need a godfather or to not have citizens in them. So it's fine if they get randomed in more often.

and what happens if you end up with kidnapper, framer, and a consig, how will mafia put out a kill a night without a Mafioso or a godfather

[ika]

and what happens if you end up with kidnapper, framer, and a consig, how will mafia put out a kill a night without a Mafioso or a godfather

one of them default to a masifo.....

then they can whine about that

[Titus]

but most towns see through it if you get investigate late game. early game it can work but mid/late its less reliable

True, but mid to late game mafia has possibly killed the invest. Plus, if the town has no leads (due to mafia killing sheriff), mafioso can sail.

[kyle1234513]

one of them default to a masifo.....

then they can whine about that

then its basically Mafioso or godfather, and 2 random mafia. and what would you rather have, a godfather or a Mafioso in your save. assuming Mafioso is excluded from randoms.

[ika]

True, but mid to late game mafia has possibly killed the invest. Plus, if the town has no leads (due to mafia killing sheriff), mafioso can sail.

meh true enough. its just that i would be the townie to point out the vig not shooting late game. it can only get the maf so far overall. i just blacklist the role so i dont defult to it.

@kyle what i mean by that is that if it goes day one no trial

kidnapper kidnaps and executes mafia makes jailed person being attacked...

if it default to night one the framer or consig or kidnapper will turn into a masifo. the option exclueds them from spaning at THE BEGINING of the game. if they act as mafiso later game then its ok

[kyle1234513]

meh true enough. its just that i would be the townie to point out the vig not shooting late game. it can only get the maf so far overall. i just blacklist the role so i dont defult to it.

@kyle what i mean by that is that if it goes day one no trial

kidnapper kidnaps and executes mafia makes jailed person being attacked...

if it default to night one the framer or consig or kidnapper will turn into a masifo. the option exclueds them from spaning at THE BEGINING of the game. if they act as mafiso later game then its ok

but until the kidnapper kills, or disguiser disguises, mafia wont be killing anyone. so mafia would have to do those things night one or else theyre at a huge disadvantage because they aren't killing anyone.
and then afterwards it would force one of them into a random Mafioso.

edit----- "one of them" reffered to anyone on the mafia side, not to kidnapper or disguiser

[ika]

you forget framer and consig can turn into mafia also

[BorkBot]

but until the kidnapper kills, or disguiser disguises, mafia wont be killing anyone. so mafia would have to do those things night one or else theyre at a huge disadvantage because they aren't killing anyone.
and then afterwards it would force one of them into a random Mafioso.

edit----- "one of them" reffered to anyone on the mafia side, not to kidnapper or disguiser

I believe that a while back, a change was made that if mafia starts out with only a disguiser as killing role, one of the mafia will convert to mafioso (if that option is on). I'm not completely sure of this, but I am quite sure that this issue did come up before and some solution was implemented.

[TheComedian]

Mafioso - add option: exclude from random.
Agent - rename to stalker.

People don't like mafioso and if i make my setup mafioso, random mafia, mafia deception then i don't want random mafia to be mafioso but i don't want to make it impossible for it to be GF.
Agent doesn't sounds mafia-ish.

Agree 100%, with both!

In my setup I got a GF and a kidnapper fixed, and would really like a Mafia Random, but without Mafioso. Atm I have to use Mafia Deceptive.

(Mafia's converting to mafioso, when GF dies, that's fine as is)

[Mugy]

I prefer Agent, just my personal preference. I wouldn't mind the mafioso option though. Would help to balance some saves.

[Voss]

mafioso exclusion has been added.

[Deantwo]

mafioso exclusion has been added.

it has? O_O

can i get to correct wording of the option so i can add it to the Wiki?
or just tell me if this is correct ^^

SC2Mafia Wiki: Mafioso#Options

*is all happy and waiting for EU server to be updated*