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[QUOTE=MartinGG99;969484][SIZE=5][COLOR="#ae0b66"]2nd fun fact: I had special flavor text in case [MENTION=15807]Stealthbomber16[/MENTION] died.
[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[spoiler=special flavor]

[I][COLOR="#ae0b66"][SIZE=3]A crowd gathered around as the elected president, Mr. FM-George Washington, was giving a speech to all the Americans of this forum. The president, having been obviously elected for the impeccable wisdom and charisma that they have, started with the following words:
[/COLOR][/I]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=5][COLOR="#FFFF00"]If Night killed:[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[SIZE=3][COLOR="#ae0b66"]The crowd was stunned by this insightful question. What, indeed was a kilometer? But, before the president could finish, and the crowd could ponder, a shot rang out! Before anyone had realized, the president had died!

After a swift investigation by law enforcement, the culprit could not be found. However, law enforcement did stumble upon some suspicious activities by the president, and concluded that he was:[/color]



[COLOR="#ae0b66"]To the dismay of many, it seems that this president sought nothing but to deceive the people! Hope will have to rely on the people of this great nation, for it is up to them to discover the former president's co-conspirators and to elect a new, better, president.
[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[SIZE=5][COLOR="#FFFF00"]If Yeeted:[/COLOR][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]
[COLOR="#ae0b66"]The crowd stood in awe, and the immediate area fell into silence. This question was so stunning that the crowd wondered why they had even elected this guy in the first place. Before anyone realized what had happen, an angry mob had formed assailing the president with accusations of being a british sympathizer, a german spy or even, god forbid, a communist at heart! On this day, the president lost their life.

After the crowds and mobs had been dispersed, and a swift congressional investigation into the private dealings of the former president, it was discovered that the president was:
[/COLOR]



[COLOR="#ae0b66"]To the delight of those who distrusted the president, it seems that this president sought nothing but to deceive the people! Hope will have to rely on the people of this great nation, for it is up to them to discover the former president's co-conspirators and to elect a new, better, president. [/COLOR]

[COLOR="#FFFF00"](insert obvious disclaimer that this is flavor text done purely based on the fact the president died, and has nothing to do with the current game-state nor with the specifics of how the president died except in the case of whether the president was voted out or not.)
[/COLOR]
[/SIZE]
[/spoiler][/QUOTE]
amazing
I love it

Originally Posted by MartinGG99

2nd fun fact: I had special flavor text in case @Stealthbomber16 died.

Spoiler : special flavor :

A crowd gathered around as the elected president, Mr. FM-George Washington, was giving a speech to all the Americans of this forum. The president, having been obviously elected for the impeccable wisdom and charisma that they have, started with the following words:


If Night killed:

The crowd was stunned by this insightful question. What, indeed was a kilometer? But, before the president could finish, and the crowd could ponder, a shot rang out! Before anyone had realized, the president had died!

After a swift investigation by law enforcement, the culprit could not be found. However, law enforcement did stumble upon some suspicious activities by the president, and concluded that he was:



To the dismay of many, it seems that this president sought nothing but to deceive the people! Hope will have to rely on the people of this great nation, for it is up to them to discover the former president's co-conspirators and to elect a new, better, president.


If Yeeted:

The crowd stood in awe, and the immediate area fell into silence. This question was so stunning that the crowd wondered why they had even elected this guy in the first place. Before anyone realized what had happen, an angry mob had formed assailing the president with accusations of being a british sympathizer, a german spy or even, god forbid, a communist at heart! On this day, the president lost their life.

After the crowds and mobs had been dispersed, and a swift congressional investigation into the private dealings of the former president, it was discovered that the president was:




To the delight of those who distrusted the president, it seems that this president sought nothing but to deceive the people! Hope will have to rely on the people of this great nation, for it is up to them to discover the former president's co-conspirators and to elect a new, better, president.

(insert obvious disclaimer that this is flavor text done purely based on the fact the president died, and has nothing to do with the current game-state nor with the specifics of how the president died except in the case of whether the president was voted out or not.)

amazing
I love it

well
didn't expect the game to end
gg george

well
didn't expect the game to end
gg george

Jefferson can you claim?

Jefferson can you claim?

[QUOTE=FM-George Washington;969448][vote]FM-Thomas Jefferson[/vote][/QUOTE]

Let's goooo

Originally Posted by FM-George Washington

-vote FM-Thomas Jefferson

Let's goooo

[QUOTE=FM-George Washington;969436][SIZE=4]������ ������ �������������� ���� �� ������������ ������ ���������� ���� ��������? ������ ������������? ������������ ������ ���������� ���� �� ������������.[/SIZE]

[SPOILER=Print]Can you provide me a reason why Nixon is scum? Any reason? Nobody has given me a reason.[/SPOILER][/QUOTE]

The best argument I've seen is the wagonomics stuff Eisenhower did.
There's also a point to be made about how Nixon is pretty lacking in the scum reads and general solving department.
other than that, I still don't really know what it's about

Originally Posted by FM-George Washington

������ ������ �������������� ���� �� ������������ ������ ���������� ���� ��������? ������ ������������? ������������ ������ ���������� ���� �� ������������.

Spoiler : Print :

Can you provide me a reason why Nixon is scum? Any reason? Nobody has given me a reason.

The best argument I've seen is the wagonomics stuff Eisenhower did.
There's also a point to be made about how Nixon is pretty lacking in the scum reads and general solving department.
other than that, I still don't really know what it's about

[QUOTE=FM-George Washington;969430][SIZE=4]�� �������� ������������ ���� �� ���������������� ���������� �� ������ �������������� ������ ������ ������������������ ���� ������ �������� �������������������� �������� ��������.

�� ���� ���������� ���� ���� ������������������ ����������'�� ������ ������������������'�� ����������. [B]������������ �������� ���������� ������ ���� �������������� �������� ������ ���� ���� ������������.[/B] �� ���� ������ ������������������ "������ ����������" ���������� ������. �� �������� ��������������������.[/SIZE]

[SPOILER=Print]I find myself in a position where I can dictate how the remainder of the game progresses from here.

I am going to be reviewing Nixon's and Jefferson's posts. [B]Please make cases against them for me to review.[/B] I am not accepting "gut reads" right now. I need[/SPOILER][/QUOTE]

In regards to reading Jefferson, I would take a look at how he has reacted to the framing argument. He has clung to it quite hard, and been quite insistent upon it, despite all logic.

Originally Posted by FM-George Washington

�� �������� ������������ ���� �� ���������������� ���������� �� ������ �������������� ������ ������ ������������������ ���� ������ �������� �������������������� �������� ��������.

�� ���� ���������� ���� ���� ������������������ ����������'�� ������ ������������������'�� ����������. ������������ �������� ���������� ������ ���� �������������� �������� ������ ���� ���� ������������. �� ���� ������ ������������������ "������ ����������" ���������� ������. �� �������� ��������������������.

Spoiler : Print :

I find myself in a position where I can dictate how the remainder of the game progresses from here.

I am going to be reviewing Nixon's and Jefferson's posts. Please make cases against them for me to review. I am not accepting "gut reads" right now. I need

In regards to reading Jefferson, I would take a look at how he has reacted to the framing argument. He has clung to it quite hard, and been quite insistent upon it, despite all logic.

I don't believe it's possible to pass FDR's votes with Madison having refused to vote. So unless someone from FDR moves, he's getting lynched.

I don't believe it's possible to pass FDR's votes with Madison having refused to vote. So unless someone from FDR moves, he's getting lynched.

[QUOTE=FM-Franklin D Roosevelt;969424]One hour to go, this is my plea. It is obviously between me and Nixon.

I'd encourage those voting jefferson to choose between us.[/QUOTE]

Well, if you switched to Jefferson, it would be between you and Jefferson. So do you suspect Nixon more, or Jefferson? I think you should vote Jefferson, honestly.

Originally Posted by FM-Franklin D Roosevelt

One hour to go, this is my plea. It is obviously between me and Nixon.

I'd encourage those voting jefferson to choose between us.

Well, if you switched to Jefferson, it would be between you and Jefferson. So do you suspect Nixon more, or Jefferson? I think you should vote Jefferson, honestly.

[QUOTE=FM-James Monroe;969408]I'm not inclined to end up on a vanity wagon again, and Jefferson is on the FDR wagon. May end up voting Nixon anyways. We'll see.[/QUOTE]

I do still want this Jefferson wagon to happen. Nobody wants to join me?

Originally Posted by FM-James Monroe

I'm not inclined to end up on a vanity wagon again, and Jefferson is on the FDR wagon. May end up voting Nixon anyways. We'll see.

I do still want this Jefferson wagon to happen. Nobody wants to join me?

I'm not inclined to end up on a vanity wagon again, and Jefferson is on the FDR wagon. May end up voting Nixon anyways. We'll see.

I'm not inclined to end up on a vanity wagon again, and Jefferson is on the FDR wagon. May end up voting Nixon anyways. We'll see.

[MENTION=46254]FM-Lyndon B Johnson[/MENTION] [MENTION=46244]FM-James Madison[/MENTION]
Y'all should be placing a vote.

@FM-Lyndon B Johnson @FM-James Madison
Y'all should be placing a vote.

[QUOTE=FM-Abraham Lincoln;969403]It’s like i say that all of my instincts tell me Nixon is playing with a scum mindset but no, we need "concrete evidence" bro i almost considered faking that i had an guilty on Nixon just so i wouldn’t need to deal with trying to herd sheep. But town shouldn’t lie so i stopped myself from doing it.[/QUOTE]

I can't follow you just based off of instinct. You say you've already given your thoughts and impressions, but it's all you saying he's shifty, it's poe, or it's gut. Nothing that I can use to look at Nixon with a new angle.

Though, I suppose there is one thing that Nixon has done - or not done, rather - that I can agree is rather suspect. That being that he has neglected to make really any scum reads, with the exception of an OMGUS on you. And he doesn't really go anywhere with it. Doesn't ever even vote you or really push you.

Originally Posted by FM-Abraham Lincoln

It’s like i say that all of my instincts tell me Nixon is playing with a scum mindset but no, we need "concrete evidence" bro i almost considered faking that i had an guilty on Nixon just so i wouldn’t need to deal with trying to herd sheep. But town shouldn’t lie so i stopped myself from doing it.

I can't follow you just based off of instinct. You say you've already given your thoughts and impressions, but it's all you saying he's shifty, it's poe, or it's gut. Nothing that I can use to look at Nixon with a new angle.

Though, I suppose there is one thing that Nixon has done - or not done, rather - that I can agree is rather suspect. That being that he has neglected to make really any scum reads, with the exception of an OMGUS on you. And he doesn't really go anywhere with it. Doesn't ever even vote you or really push you.

[QUOTE=FM-James Madison;969400]What[/QUOTE]

Hello Madison
Have anything to contribute to the conversation?
Also you should vote someone. Do your patriotic duty.

Originally Posted by FM-James Madison

What

Hello Madison
Have anything to contribute to the conversation?
Also you should vote someone. Do your patriotic duty.

[QUOTE=FM-Dwight D Eisenhower;969398]in iso they just come off like they are openly pushing onto town unashamedly and with tmi all throughout the game[/QUOTE]

Can you link a few examples of this?

Originally Posted by FM-Dwight D Eisenhower

in iso they just come off like they are openly pushing onto town unashamedly and with tmi all throughout the game

Can you link a few examples of this?

I'm willing to accept that Dwight is town
Recent posts have been really townie

I'm willing to accept that Dwight is town
Recent posts have been really townie

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969353]Starting another train will just muddy the waters, that is a task for tomorrow. For now we have a few choices:

1. Lynch Mr. FDR in what I think is the most viable of the trains due to lack of activity, content, and overall effort. It does not make me believe that he is an American in the slightest
[/QUOTE]
Doesn't have to be a new wagon. Also how come you say "a few choices" and talk about literally only FDR

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969353]
I continue to latch onto it because I wholeheartedly believe it to be true, which is why I despised the attempts to form a train on me earlier in the day. Now that that has cooled, there are other things and topics to deal with.
[/QUOTE]
But *why* do you wholeheartedly believe it to be true. I've already explained that truman was the best kill for the British night 1 without considering his reads. Yet you insist he could only been killed to frame you. I don't understand why American Jefferson would insist on this theory of why Truman died without any logic or evidence for it. Nobody even suggested you were evil because of the Truman kill before you latched onto Lincoln's framing theory.

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969353]
Attempting to find British Spies is an obligation to all Americans, so I do not really get where you're coming from in this respect.

As for performative, no? I'm attempting to discuss and figure things out in as flush of a way possible. Maybe it's my phrasing that does it for you?
[/QUOTE]
That's not what I meant. I meant like a begrudging obligation. Like you don't take take extra steps to solve. I just haven't seen you go beyond expectations to try and help solve the game. The stuff you do is like a Brit going, "this will fulfill the requirements for not being scumread by town". And that's what I mean by performative.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

Starting another train will just muddy the waters, that is a task for tomorrow. For now we have a few choices:

1. Lynch Mr. FDR in what I think is the most viable of the trains due to lack of activity, content, and overall effort. It does not make me believe that he is an American in the slightest

Doesn't have to be a new wagon. Also how come you say "a few choices" and talk about literally only FDR

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

I continue to latch onto it because I wholeheartedly believe it to be true, which is why I despised the attempts to form a train on me earlier in the day. Now that that has cooled, there are other things and topics to deal with.

But *why* do you wholeheartedly believe it to be true. I've already explained that truman was the best kill for the British night 1 without considering his reads. Yet you insist he could only been killed to frame you. I don't understand why American Jefferson would insist on this theory of why Truman died without any logic or evidence for it. Nobody even suggested you were evil because of the Truman kill before you latched onto Lincoln's framing theory.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

Attempting to find British Spies is an obligation to all Americans, so I do not really get where you're coming from in this respect.

As for performative, no? I'm attempting to discuss and figure things out in as flush of a way possible. Maybe it's my phrasing that does it for you?

That's not what I meant. I meant like a begrudging obligation. Like you don't take take extra steps to solve. I just haven't seen you go beyond expectations to try and help solve the game. The stuff you do is like a Brit going, "this will fulfill the requirements for not being scumread by town". And that's what I mean by performative.

Eisenhower and Lincoln for the love of all that is good can one of you explain why you think Nixon is scummy

Eisenhower and Lincoln for the love of all that is good can one of you explain why you think Nixon is scummy

[QUOTE=FM-John F Kennedy;969311]I did right after that post[/QUOTE]

I saw those. I was thinking more actual thought. Not conclusions.

Originally Posted by FM-John F Kennedy

I did right after that post

I saw those. I was thinking more actual thought. Not conclusions.

[QUOTE=FM-Franklin D Roosevelt;969307]I have trouble seeing the rationale or your vote on Jefferson, and then right here you even give him an out. It is almost like you are not being sincere with your vote and maybe you are using it as a distraction? Planting the seeds here to take your vote off of him?

If you really believed he was scum, why would you give him an out?[/QUOTE]

I'm not quite sure I understand what you're saying by "giving him an out". What I'm saying is that if he wants to convince me he's town, he needs to make content that would show he has a townie thought process (ideally that'd be a push onto a scum read of his). If he's scum, he's not gonna be able to truly mimic that townie thought process, and I wouldn't back off in that case (unless he pulls out some masterful deception and I get fooled). So I'm only "giving him an out" if he's town and can demonstrate that to me. If you have a problem with THAT, well, idk what to tell you.

Originally Posted by FM-Franklin D Roosevelt

I have trouble seeing the rationale or your vote on Jefferson, and then right here you even give him an out. It is almost like you are not being sincere with your vote and maybe you are using it as a distraction? Planting the seeds here to take your vote off of him?

If you really believed he was scum, why would you give him an out?

I'm not quite sure I understand what you're saying by "giving him an out". What I'm saying is that if he wants to convince me he's town, he needs to make content that would show he has a townie thought process (ideally that'd be a push onto a scum read of his). If he's scum, he's not gonna be able to truly mimic that townie thought process, and I wouldn't back off in that case (unless he pulls out some masterful deception and I get fooled). So I'm only "giving him an out" if he's town and can demonstrate that to me. If you have a problem with THAT, well, idk what to tell you.

[QUOTE=FM-John F Kennedy;969300]Eisenhower is still my top town. I don't think Jefferson has been sus.

I still have sus on Fdr and Nixon[/QUOTE]

Why do you suspect nixon? Seems like a lot of people do but I'm not getting a very coherent explanation.

Originally Posted by FM-John F Kennedy

Eisenhower is still my top town. I don't think Jefferson has been sus.

I still have sus on Fdr and Nixon

Why do you suspect nixon? Seems like a lot of people do but I'm not getting a very coherent explanation.

[QUOTE=FM-John F Kennedy;969303]What do you want me to answer[/QUOTE]

Hello Kennedy
could you provide any thoughts/reads you have? Just off the top of your head.

Originally Posted by FM-John F Kennedy

What do you want me to answer

Hello Kennedy
could you provide any thoughts/reads you have? Just off the top of your head.

[QUOTE=FM-George Washington;969297][SIZE=4]������ ������ ������������������ �������� ���� ������ �������� ������? ������������?[/SIZE]

[SPOILER=Print]Are you proposing that we may have one? Wilson?[/SPOILER][/QUOTE]

It's a role in the potential roles, so it's certainly possible. I don't find it particularly like Wilson was one, since he did seem a bit like LHF to me, and nobody was really going out of their way to help him. If the Brits knew he was gonna flip town then I figure they would have tried harder to save him.

I wouldn't sweat about it's potential existence too much, as doubting every lynch result can create confusion and make it harder to hold people accountable for pushing a mislynch, but it is something we should be aware of going forward.

Originally Posted by FM-George Washington

������ ������ ������������������ �������� ���� ������ �������� ������? ������������?

Spoiler : Print :

Are you proposing that we may have one? Wilson?

It's a role in the potential roles, so it's certainly possible. I don't find it particularly like Wilson was one, since he did seem a bit like LHF to me, and nobody was really going out of their way to help him. If the Brits knew he was gonna flip town then I figure they would have tried harder to save him.

I wouldn't sweat about it's potential existence too much, as doubting every lynch result can create confusion and make it harder to hold people accountable for pushing a mislynch, but it is something we should be aware of going forward.

So I've only now actually read the actress role description, and it could make things very complicated for us if it's in the game.

So I've only now actually read the actress role description, and it could make things very complicated for us if it's in the game.

[QUOTE=FM-Abraham Lincoln;969260]Why would my opinion have changed.[/QUOTE]

I never quite understood what your reasoning was for scum reading him in the first place.

Can you just explain exactly why you scum read him please?

Originally Posted by FM-Abraham Lincoln

Why would my opinion have changed.

I never quite understood what your reasoning was for scum reading him in the first place.

Can you just explain exactly why you scum read him please?

[MENTION=46253]FM-John F Kennedy[/MENTION] [MENTION=46242]FM-George Washington[/MENTION]

I would like to see more content from you guys if you would be so kind
More specifically - reads and thoughts.

@FM-John F Kennedy @FM-George Washington

I would like to see more content from you guys if you would be so kind
More specifically - reads and thoughts.

[QUOTE=FM-Dwight D Eisenhower;969254]I agree nixon mad woofish[/QUOTE]

May I know why you think so?

Originally Posted by FM-Dwight D Eisenhower

I agree nixon mad woofish

May I know why you think so?

[QUOTE=FM-Abraham Lincoln;969246]I’m feeling very frustrated and angry right now, and only killing Nixon will fix it.[/QUOTE]

Can you explain why you still scumread Nixon please?

Originally Posted by FM-Abraham Lincoln

I’m feeling very frustrated and angry right now, and only killing Nixon will fix it.

Can you explain why you still scumread Nixon please?

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969236]Going for me is the lazy lynch for scum currently, their entire play revolves around the N1 death of Mr. Truman.

As much as I despise OMGUS, I cannot townread those pushing hard for me when I [B]know[/B] that that's what the scum's plan is.

Liking me now Mr. Johnson? I know how much you appreciate that word.[/QUOTE]

You latching onto the framing thing is a huge part of why I scumread you. The fact you continue to do so only makes me more confident in you being a Brit.
[QUOTE=FM-Dwight D Eisenhower;969238]the only person who sheeped my vote is Monroe[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969241]1. [B]Why else would they kill Mr. Truman? I was his number one suspect, killing him incriminates me.[/B]
2. I'm suggesting Mr. Monroe could be scum for sheeping you, yes. I can't really form a read on your slot yet as there are not enough posts.
3. I've already posted what I believed were solves during D2; however, I'm currently going over them as yes they appear to be not correct currently.

Top Town Read currently: Mr. Kennedy

Sus currently: Mr Monroe, Mr. Johnson.

Both of them don't really have great reads on me other than what looks like "He's scum lol", at least in my POV.[/QUOTE]
1. Truman was a competent and actively contributing town member who was townread by a lot of people. He was like, the best option for the British.
2. Wth is this lol. I can understand Eisenhower thinking I'm sheeping him bc he hasn't fully read up yet, but you blatantly misrepresenting me like this when you know I tried to push you out last day phase is just... not a good look.

Jefferson, if you wish to convince me you are town, show me your heart. Find someone you suspect - could even be me, idc - and push them with all your strength. Engage with the person you suspect, and try and convince others of the reality of this person being evil. So far you've only done sort of half-hearted pushes. What I need to see from you is your brain at work.

A big part of why I scumread you Jefferson is that you feel very perfomative. And what I mean by that is it looks like you're doing things for appearance, rather than to actually solve. You put in enough energy in your posts such that they are quite wordy, yet I don't really see that energy being directed to solving very much. Most "solving" I do see feels like you're just doing an obligation.

If you *are* an American, and I'm making a big mistake. I ask you to correct my misconceptions. It would be regretful if I spend two days pushing someone who turns out to be an American.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

Going for me is the lazy lynch for scum currently, their entire play revolves around the N1 death of Mr. Truman.

As much as I despise OMGUS, I cannot townread those pushing hard for me when I know that that's what the scum's plan is.

Liking me now Mr. Johnson? I know how much you appreciate that word.

You latching onto the framing thing is a huge part of why I scumread you. The fact you continue to do so only makes me more confident in you being a Brit.

Originally Posted by FM-Dwight D Eisenhower

the only person who sheeped my vote is Monroe

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

1. Why else would they kill Mr. Truman? I was his number one suspect, killing him incriminates me.
2. I'm suggesting Mr. Monroe could be scum for sheeping you, yes. I can't really form a read on your slot yet as there are not enough posts.
3. I've already posted what I believed were solves during D2; however, I'm currently going over them as yes they appear to be not correct currently.

Top Town Read currently: Mr. Kennedy

Sus currently: Mr Monroe, Mr. Johnson.

Both of them don't really have great reads on me other than what looks like "He's scum lol", at least in my POV.

1. Truman was a competent and actively contributing town member who was townread by a lot of people. He was like, the best option for the British.
2. Wth is this lol. I can understand Eisenhower thinking I'm sheeping him bc he hasn't fully read up yet, but you blatantly misrepresenting me like this when you know I tried to push you out last day phase is just... not a good look.

Jefferson, if you wish to convince me you are town, show me your heart. Find someone you suspect - could even be me, idc - and push them with all your strength. Engage with the person you suspect, and try and convince others of the reality of this person being evil. So far you've only done sort of half-hearted pushes. What I need to see from you is your brain at work.

A big part of why I scumread you Jefferson is that you feel very perfomative. And what I mean by that is it looks like you're doing things for appearance, rather than to actually solve. You put in enough energy in your posts such that they are quite wordy, yet I don't really see that energy being directed to solving very much. Most "solving" I do see feels like you're just doing an obligation.

If you *are* an American, and I'm making a big mistake. I ask you to correct my misconceptions. It would be regretful if I spend two days pushing someone who turns out to be an American.

anyways I'm just gonna
[VOTE]FM-Thomas Jefferson[/VOTE]

anyways I'm just gonna

-vote FM-Thomas Jefferson

[QUOTE=FM-Franklin D Roosevelt;969225]I'd say its a 50/50 chance of the doctor (unconfirmed at time) being on the mayor due to wifom. N1 okay, but n2? He wasn't attacked? On top of the confirmed doc telling us their suspicions?[/QUOTE]
It being 2 nights doesn't make much of a difference. George was consensus town and the mayor. The Brits would be right in thinking that a doctor would likely be on him, even on the second night.

Besides - killing the president early on isn't *objectively* the best play. You kill the president early on, America just votes a new one in. American heroes like Truman and Theodore? We don't get em back.

Originally Posted by FM-Franklin D Roosevelt

I'd say its a 50/50 chance of the doctor (unconfirmed at time) being on the mayor due to wifom. N1 okay, but n2? He wasn't attacked? On top of the confirmed doc telling us their suspicions?

It being 2 nights doesn't make much of a difference. George was consensus town and the mayor. The Brits would be right in thinking that a doctor would likely be on him, even on the second night.

Besides - killing the president early on isn't *objectively* the best play. You kill the president early on, America just votes a new one in. American heroes like Truman and Theodore? We don't get em back.

[QUOTE=FM-Franklin D Roosevelt;969189]Frankly it is pretty suspicious you are even still alive. I mean the doctor wasn't even on you last night.

Nobody else finds it strange the mayor is still alive?[/QUOTE]

Explain how the mafia would know the doctor wasn't on George? I don't understand how you find this suspicious.

Originally Posted by FM-Franklin D Roosevelt

Frankly it is pretty suspicious you are even still alive. I mean the doctor wasn't even on you last night.

Nobody else finds it strange the mayor is still alive?

Explain how the mafia would know the doctor wasn't on George? I don't understand how you find this suspicious.

[QUOTE=FM-Dwight D Eisenhower;969207]Just going back to this, your response to his case was to dismiss it like such, old mate subsequently flipped town... This can be TMI because of absence of omgus.[/QUOTE]

cool story bro

Originally Posted by FM-Dwight D Eisenhower

Just going back to this, your response to his case was to dismiss it like such, old mate subsequently flipped town... This can be TMI because of absence of omgus.

cool story bro

[QUOTE=MartinGG99;969187][CENTER][SIZE=5][COLOR="#ae0b66"]Day 3 has begun[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][URL="https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/election?iso=20220802T15&p0=419&msg=SoD3+Countdown&font=sanserif&csz=1"]EoD3 Timer[/URL][/CENTER]
[/SIZE]
[MENTION=46248]FM-Theodore Roosevelt[/MENTION] has died! They were:
[/COLOR]
[spoiler=flip]
[COLOR="#00FF00"]Doctor
[/COLOR][/spoiler]

[COLOR="#ae0b66"]They also left a last will:
[/COLOR]
[spoiler=will]Doctor Teddy Roosevelt here. I healed Mr. Washington on N1, but Mr. Lincoln on N2, for I did not fully trust our President anymore: he severely lacked contributions and actively avoided commenting on the hot topics (Wilson and Nixon, for example).

Do not suspect Lincoln too much: despite his shortcomings about D1 activity, he strikes me as the most honest Abe one could wish for.

Good luck, citizens, and may you preserve the United States of America to the best of your ability.[/spoiler]

[resetcount][/resetcount][/QUOTE]

Rest in peace, Teddy.

o7

Originally Posted by MartinGG99

Day 3 has begun
EoD3 Timer

@FM-Theodore Roosevelt has died! They were:

Spoiler : flip :

Doctor

They also left a last will:

Spoiler : will :

Doctor Teddy Roosevelt here. I healed Mr. Washington on N1, but Mr. Lincoln on N2, for I did not fully trust our President anymore: he severely lacked contributions and actively avoided commenting on the hot topics (Wilson and Nixon, for example).

Do not suspect Lincoln too much: despite his shortcomings about D1 activity, he strikes me as the most honest Abe one could wish for.

Good luck, citizens, and may you preserve the United States of America to the best of your ability.

Rest in peace, Teddy.

o7

Woodrow... Sort of feels like he could be mislynch bait? Just feels too easy.

Woodrow... Sort of feels like he could be mislynch bait? Just feels too easy.

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969121]
[B]If you still believe I killed the late Mr. Truman than you are horribly mistaken. We had quite the discussion late into the night before EOD that I think changed his opinion on me at least a bit. [/B]
[/QUOTE]
I see no indication that he had changed his read. He indicated he might think it over a bit more, but not that he was actively considering changing his read.
[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969121]
On a different note, in what world would me killing Mr. Truman be the right move if I were scum? A better kill would have likely been someone who reads other people as town as to draw less suspicion.
[/QUOTE]
A lot of worlds? He was one of the most actively contributing players, and he suspected you.
[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969121]
Moreover, Mr. Monroe, I think you have been fooled by the enemy and ask you reconsider your opinion.
[/QUOTE]
I'll reconsider my opinion when I see townie content from you. A lot of your content just feels very performative to me.
[QUOTE=FM-Richard Nixon;969137]unless i'm remembering incorrectly, I don't think anyone had truman as not town read, so it could just as easily be an IC kill. night 1 NK analysis generally lacks futility IMO so I don't think we should spend too many brain cells coming up with 100 and 1 reasons truman died unless someone points out some huge brain point from ISO's yesterday or something that actually leads to a read on a specific person[/QUOTE]
Well, I actually think it is possible to do good N1 NK analysis, but I don't have the time to commit to that right now.
And just so it's clear, I'm not sussing Jefferson because I think only he would kill Truman there. I'm sussing him because I don't like how he latched onto the framing argument.
[QUOTE=FM-Theodore Roosevelt;969152]To come back to the post I last quoted, I believe it is somewhat indicative of Mr. Jefferson's true loyalty to America. He truly appears to be a tunnelled patriot who believes he has caught an anti-American scum, and despite my opposition to his beliefs, my opinion of him has [I]somewhat[/I] improved, enough to put him in my town leans.[/QUOTE]
I don't understand this? He's hardly gone after Nixon, or even mentioned his scum read on Nixon. The post you quoted and an earlier reads list by him are his only mentions of an activescum read on Nixon. And neither of those really go into much depth about Nixon.

[VOTE]FM-Thomas Jefferson[/VOTE]

I think that's where I want my vote for now.

Sort of unrelated to everything else in this post, I think there's a world where Jefferson/Theodore/Abraham are a team. I individually TR both Theodore and Abraham, but I think they have some team equity with Jefferson.

That being said, it's a pretty unlikely world, so it's not particularly worth thinking about until later on.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

If you still believe I killed the late Mr. Truman than you are horribly mistaken. We had quite the discussion late into the night before EOD that I think changed his opinion on me at least a bit.

I see no indication that he had changed his read. He indicated he might think it over a bit more, but not that he was actively considering changing his read.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

On a different note, in what world would me killing Mr. Truman be the right move if I were scum? A better kill would have likely been someone who reads other people as town as to draw less suspicion.

A lot of worlds? He was one of the most actively contributing players, and he suspected you.

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

Moreover, Mr. Monroe, I think you have been fooled by the enemy and ask you reconsider your opinion.

I'll reconsider my opinion when I see townie content from you. A lot of your content just feels very performative to me.

Originally Posted by FM-Richard Nixon

unless i'm remembering incorrectly, I don't think anyone had truman as not town read, so it could just as easily be an IC kill. night 1 NK analysis generally lacks futility IMO so I don't think we should spend too many brain cells coming up with 100 and 1 reasons truman died unless someone points out some huge brain point from ISO's yesterday or something that actually leads to a read on a specific person

Well, I actually think it is possible to do good N1 NK analysis, but I don't have the time to commit to that right now.
And just so it's clear, I'm not sussing Jefferson because I think only he would kill Truman there. I'm sussing him because I don't like how he latched onto the framing argument.

Originally Posted by FM-Theodore Roosevelt

To come back to the post I last quoted, I believe it is somewhat indicative of Mr. Jefferson's true loyalty to America. He truly appears to be a tunnelled patriot who believes he has caught an anti-American scum, and despite my opposition to his beliefs, my opinion of him has somewhat improved, enough to put him in my town leans.

I don't understand this? He's hardly gone after Nixon, or even mentioned his scum read on Nixon. The post you quoted and an earlier reads list by him are his only mentions of an activescum read on Nixon. And neither of those really go into much depth about Nixon.

-vote FM-Thomas Jefferson

I think that's where I want my vote for now.

Sort of unrelated to everything else in this post, I think there's a world where Jefferson/Theodore/Abraham are a team. I individually TR both Theodore and Abraham, but I think they have some team equity with Jefferson.

That being said, it's a pretty unlikely world, so it's not particularly worth thinking about until later on.

[QUOTE=FM-Thomas Jefferson;969063]I
I really want my last scum to be Mr. FDR but in all likelihood one of the people that townread me D1 is likely scum. They assassinated Mr. Truman in an attempt to make the people scumreading me focus on me, which quite notably failed.[/QUOTE]

I absolutely do not like that you are piggy backing off of Abraham's framing argument. It feels disingenuous and like you're trying to sweep the whole thing under the rug and come out looking like you were "framed".

Truman also suspected me and FDR. Do you not think, from your PoV at least since, that Truman could possibly have been killed for having potentially 2/3rds correct scum reads?

Originally Posted by FM-Thomas Jefferson

I
I really want my last scum to be Mr. FDR but in all likelihood one of the people that townread me D1 is likely scum. They assassinated Mr. Truman in an attempt to make the people scumreading me focus on me, which quite notably failed.

I absolutely do not like that you are piggy backing off of Abraham's framing argument. It feels disingenuous and like you're trying to sweep the whole thing under the rug and come out looking like you were "framed".

Truman also suspected me and FDR. Do you not think, from your PoV at least since, that Truman could possibly have been killed for having potentially 2/3rds correct scum reads?

[QUOTE=FM-Woodrow Wilson;969082]i do reckon i’ll get pushed for anything i do, but tonight i’m gonna attempt to solve[/QUOTE]

I'm glad to hear that.

Originally Posted by FM-Woodrow Wilson

i do reckon i’ll get pushed for anything i do, but tonight i’m gonna attempt to solve

I'm glad to hear that.

[QUOTE=FM-Abraham Lincoln;969015]I think it stands to reason that the kill on Truman suggests mafia likely wants us to believe that Truman's scumreads were correct and that we should be suspicious of Jefferson in particular.
Thusly i feel like Jefferson is slightly less rand!scum.
Although it is possible that Jefferson is mafia and just had Truman killed because they were the towniest individual in the room. but in all honestly. I find that less likely.[/QUOTE]

Very rarely do scum perform kills with the sole intention of framing someone. I find it interesting that this is not only the first conclusion you jump to, but that you find it more *likely* than British Jefferson just killing Truman.

Do you town read Jefferson or something?

Originally Posted by FM-Abraham Lincoln

I think it stands to reason that the kill on Truman suggests mafia likely wants us to believe that Truman's scumreads were correct and that we should be suspicious of Jefferson in particular.
Thusly i feel like Jefferson is slightly less rand!scum.
Although it is possible that Jefferson is mafia and just had Truman killed because they were the towniest individual in the room. but in all honestly. I find that less likely.

Very rarely do scum perform kills with the sole intention of framing someone. I find it interesting that this is not only the first conclusion you jump to, but that you find it more *likely* than British Jefferson just killing Truman.

Do you town read Jefferson or something?

[QUOTE=FM-Woodrow Wilson;969074]i reckon the more posts someone has the more likely they’re scum, more thread control-> more chance of a mislynch. i have to look into it[/QUOTE]

This is incorrect. Town can be very active.

Originally Posted by FM-Woodrow Wilson

i reckon the more posts someone has the more likely they’re scum, more thread control-> more chance of a mislynch. i have to look into it

This is incorrect. Town can be very active.

Wilson, if you don't want to be suspected, show your thought process more often. We can't determine your alignment very well if you just post reads without proper explanations.

Wilson, if you don't want to be suspected, show your thought process more often. We can't determine your alignment very well if you just post reads without proper explanations.

[MENTION=46250]FM-Franklin D Roosevelt[/MENTION]
[MENTION=46252]FM-Dwight D Eisenhower[/MENTION]
Could you guys do things? Perhaps share your thoughts? It'd be tremendously useful to be able to read your two slots.

@FM-Franklin D Roosevelt
@FM-Dwight D Eisenhower
Could you guys do things? Perhaps share your thoughts? It'd be tremendously useful to be able to read your two slots.

[QUOTE=FM-Theodore Roosevelt;969053]Fellow Americans, I believe I have found an evil anti-American German scum.


But why? Also, I had asked this during the last day:



Mr. Wilson never provided me with a response, unfortunately.

This statement is vague and empty. As empty as Mr. Wilson's program, if I may add: his ISO is full of unexplained one-liners, and one is lucky if he can find a read instead of a comment saying democracy is WRONG and glorifying Chinese dictatorship.

Why let your vote rand, sir? Is that not against the best interest of America in a very obvious manner?

Why? I would like precisions on this, sir; simply saying you dislike the game state does not mean much.


What does this mean?


In general, Mr. Wilson's ISO looks a lot like those of scums I have seen on different sites, giving empty and unexplained reads in a "wise and cool" manner to make others feel like he has a thread presence and participates to the game while he actually just slides by. If he truly wanted to changed the thread state, he would step in and provide the assembly with substantial comments; instead, he is merely asking others to do what he never did himself.

[vote]FM-Woodrow Wilson[/vote]

While Mr. Nixon remains suspicious, I believe it is great time that Mr. Wilson sees some pressure applied upon himself - and more, if he does not redeem himself before America's watchful eyes.[/QUOTE]
I could get behind applying some pressure there. I don't recall any aspect of his ISO being something Brits couldn't very easily also do.

Originally Posted by FM-Theodore Roosevelt

Fellow Americans, I believe I have found an evil anti-American German scum.


But why? Also, I had asked this during the last day:



Mr. Wilson never provided me with a response, unfortunately.

This statement is vague and empty. As empty as Mr. Wilson's program, if I may add: his ISO is full of unexplained one-liners, and one is lucky if he can find a read instead of a comment saying democracy is WRONG and glorifying Chinese dictatorship.

Why let your vote rand, sir? Is that not against the best interest of America in a very obvious manner?

Why? I would like precisions on this, sir; simply saying you dislike the game state does not mean much.


What does this mean?


In general, Mr. Wilson's ISO looks a lot like those of scums I have seen on different sites, giving empty and unexplained reads in a "wise and cool" manner to make others feel like he has a thread presence and participates to the game while he actually just slides by. If he truly wanted to changed the thread state, he would step in and provide the assembly with substantial comments; instead, he is merely asking others to do what he never did himself.

-vote FM-Woodrow Wilson

While Mr. Nixon remains suspicious, I believe it is great time that Mr. Wilson sees some pressure applied upon himself - and more, if he does not redeem himself before America's watchful eyes.

I could get behind applying some pressure there. I don't recall any aspect of his ISO being something Brits couldn't very easily also do.

Sorry for being sort of AWOL (last day phase and the first 11 hours of this phase as well). Have been pretty busy.

Nixon seems to be a point of discussion, so I shall provide my thoughts on that topic. I don't believe Nixon has demonstrated anything overtly British. In fact, I personally find [URL="https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/50355-S-FM-344-(Ladder)-President-II?p=968730#post968730"]P#141[/URL], [URL="https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/50355-S-FM-344-(Ladder)-President-II?p=968904#post968904"]P#312[/URL], and[URL="https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/50355-S-FM-344-(Ladder)-President-II?p=968910#post968910"] P#318[/URL] somewhat good looks for Nixon.

141 is a good look because it's Nixon giving an independent thought rather than just going with the crowd, which in this context would be to just hard town read Washington with everyone else for basically the same reason. This is easy enough for the Brits to fake, but it is a point in his favor imo.

312 just feels like an American response. I don't quite know to explain it since it's sort of a gut read, but I'll try anyways. Best explanation that I can think of for why I feel this post is townie is that I feel a Brit would be less likely to even [I]bother[/I] making this post. It's a townie perspective to find someone not *easy* to read, whether that be scummy or townie, and while a Brit could use "finding someone not obvious/hard to read" as an excuse for not actually having a read, I feel like given the context of the post (the post by Kennedy he's quoting was from like 90 posts prior, meaning he felt the active [I]desire[/I] to respond to this specific post rather than it just being a "I'm responding to this because it's on the newest page"), this is just a [I]natural[/I] response coming from someone who actually has that perspective.

318 I like because it shows a sort of natural skepticism. He could have just ignored or thanked Wilson or something that doesn't antagonize Wilson, but he chooses to question Wilson about "jumping the gun". If a British Nixon wanted to *act* skeptical on purpose to look good, I believe they would have upped the shade on Wilson here, that way he gets the point across to all the observers. But instead, it's a sort of pointless skepticism that doesn't really do anything, which I believe more likely comes from a player that lacks an agenda (or Wilson and Nixon are Brit/Brit and it was a half-hearted attempt at distancing, but I feel like that's kinda unlikely considering how Wilson is kinda associating himself a lot with Nixon, which Brits don't typically want to do).

I also like Nixon's overall relaxed attitude. First post of the game was "you really showed him there bro" in response to me saying "cool story bro" to truman, which I think is a fairly natural entrance.

I think this is likely American. Though, I wouldn't bet my life on it since this read is based on the fairly small amount of actually useful posts by Nixon.

Sorry for being sort of AWOL (last day phase and the first 11 hours of this phase as well). Have been pretty busy.

Nixon seems to be a point of discussion, so I shall provide my thoughts on that topic. I don't believe Nixon has demonstrated anything overtly British. In fact, I personally find P#141, P#312, and P#318 somewhat good looks for Nixon.

141 is a good look because it's Nixon giving an independent thought rather than just going with the crowd, which in this context would be to just hard town read Washington with everyone else for basically the same reason. This is easy enough for the Brits to fake, but it is a point in his favor imo.

312 just feels like an American response. I don't quite know to explain it since it's sort of a gut read, but I'll try anyways. Best explanation that I can think of for why I feel this post is townie is that I feel a Brit would be less likely to even bother making this post. It's a townie perspective to find someone not *easy* to read, whether that be scummy or townie, and while a Brit could use "finding someone not obvious/hard to read" as an excuse for not actually having a read, I feel like given the context of the post (the post by Kennedy he's quoting was from like 90 posts prior, meaning he felt the active desire to respond to this specific post rather than it just being a "I'm responding to this because it's on the newest page"), this is just a natural response coming from someone who actually has that perspective.

318 I like because it shows a sort of natural skepticism. He could have just ignored or thanked Wilson or something that doesn't antagonize Wilson, but he chooses to question Wilson about "jumping the gun". If a British Nixon wanted to *act* skeptical on purpose to look good, I believe they would have upped the shade on Wilson here, that way he gets the point across to all the observers. But instead, it's a sort of pointless skepticism that doesn't really do anything, which I believe more likely comes from a player that lacks an agenda (or Wilson and Nixon are Brit/Brit and it was a half-hearted attempt at distancing, but I feel like that's kinda unlikely considering how Wilson is kinda associating himself a lot with Nixon, which Brits don't typically want to do).

I also like Nixon's overall relaxed attitude. First post of the game was "you really showed him there bro" in response to me saying "cool story bro" to truman, which I think is a fairly natural entrance.

I think this is likely American. Though, I wouldn't bet my life on it since this read is based on the fairly small amount of actually useful posts by Nixon.

I think I will vote Teddy as president.

I think I will vote Teddy as president.

Abraham is [I]proooobably[/I] not a British spy

Abraham is proooobably not a British spy

I don't think I trust Mr. Jefferson.

I don't think I trust Mr. Jefferson.

[QUOTE=FM-James Monroe;968765](even with a red check from a sheriff, since there is a tailor and bus driver in the game),
[/QUOTE]

framer*
tailor is something different in this I guess
also apparently British bus driver is called "Chauffeur" which I didn't see beforehand

Originally Posted by FM-James Monroe

(even with a red check from a sheriff, since there is a tailor and bus driver in the game),

framer*
tailor is something different in this I guess
also apparently British bus driver is called "Chauffeur" which I didn't see beforehand

[QUOTE=FM-Dwight D Eisenhower;968761]Kennedy feels towny on page 1 in terms of trying to engage others but quite a bit of questions about things that are nothing really about the game.

James Monroe casting the first shade on page 1 and talking about his own entrance being awkward feels like a town viewpoint.

Harry Truman's scumread and reasoning on Monroe feels like a good read given the explanation regardless of Monroe's alignment.
Monroe's response to it felt like towny confidence or arrogance if we want to take it that far.

Page 2 James Madison is awkward with his townread of JFK.

The only thing Jefferson spoke about was the George Washington writing style and nothing really about reads, not good.

Page 3 I feel like Truman has the right idea about maybe not voting our top town, but voting the suspects is maybe not a good idea.
This is maybe towny minus the suspects part.

Page 4 I skimmed, big whoop, wanta fight aboutit?

------------------------------------

John F Kennedy
Harry Truman
James Monroe
George Washington

I am townreading these fellow American Presidents.

James Madison
Thomas Jefferson

These two fellow [I]"Americans"[/I] I'm scumreading.[/QUOTE]

A solid and understandable reads list.

Originally Posted by FM-Dwight D Eisenhower

Kennedy feels towny on page 1 in terms of trying to engage others but quite a bit of questions about things that are nothing really about the game.

James Monroe casting the first shade on page 1 and talking about his own entrance being awkward feels like a town viewpoint.

Harry Truman's scumread and reasoning on Monroe feels like a good read given the explanation regardless of Monroe's alignment.
Monroe's response to it felt like towny confidence or arrogance if we want to take it that far.

Page 2 James Madison is awkward with his townread of JFK.

The only thing Jefferson spoke about was the George Washington writing style and nothing really about reads, not good.

Page 3 I feel like Truman has the right idea about maybe not voting our top town, but voting the suspects is maybe not a good idea.
This is maybe towny minus the suspects part.

Page 4 I skimmed, big whoop, wanta fight aboutit?

------------------------------------

John F Kennedy
Harry Truman
James Monroe
George Washington

I am townreading these fellow American Presidents.

James Madison
Thomas Jefferson

These two fellow "Americans" I'm scumreading.

A solid and understandable reads list.

[QUOTE=FM-Theodore Roosevelt;968758]I thank you, but would like to know your reasons. You are not trustable enough for me to accept jumping into your pocket, as cozy as it may look.[/QUOTE]

That's fine; I do not wish for you to jump into my pocket. As for my reasons - I thought your entrance into the thread was natural, and your stance against Truman's "voting for scum" idea seemed as if you were honestly arguing in America's best interest. I believe a Brit would be fine with Truman's plan, or at least I do not believe they would openly campaign against it. I agree with what you've said about scum being president harming America more than it helps us - I think most Brits would be fine with sacrificing a role for a vote (which brings the number of mislynches they need to win from 4 to 3), and it's not as if us Americans can ever be 100% sure that someone is scum (even with a red check from a sheriff, since there is a tailor and bus driver in the game), so it's fairly possible for a British president to avoid getting lynched at any point in the future even if they were made president for being a suspected Brit day 1.

I also think the general tone of your posts is just genuinely solvey, but the two above reasons are the more easily explainable reasons.

Originally Posted by FM-Theodore Roosevelt

I thank you, but would like to know your reasons. You are not trustable enough for me to accept jumping into your pocket, as cozy as it may look.

That's fine; I do not wish for you to jump into my pocket. As for my reasons - I thought your entrance into the thread was natural, and your stance against Truman's "voting for scum" idea seemed as if you were honestly arguing in America's best interest. I believe a Brit would be fine with Truman's plan, or at least I do not believe they would openly campaign against it. I agree with what you've said about scum being president harming America more than it helps us - I think most Brits would be fine with sacrificing a role for a vote (which brings the number of mislynches they need to win from 4 to 3), and it's not as if us Americans can ever be 100% sure that someone is scum (even with a red check from a sheriff, since there is a tailor and bus driver in the game), so it's fairly possible for a British president to avoid getting lynched at any point in the future even if they were made president for being a suspected Brit day 1.

I also think the general tone of your posts is just genuinely solvey, but the two above reasons are the more easily explainable reasons.

Truman and Kennedy are not both British, for what it's worth. I do not believe their "mindmeld" interaction from earlier to be something two Brits would bother to do with each other.

Truman and Kennedy are not both British, for what it's worth. I do not believe their "mindmeld" interaction from earlier to be something two Brits would bother to do with each other.