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    ►►Re: Punishment Vs Reformation & prisons.◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by oops_ur_dead View Post
    I don't understand why someone would argue for the death sentence when life imprisonment in solitary is a worse punishment and doesn't require irreversibly killing a potentially innocent person.
    I've always been torn between the death sentence vs life in prison.
    A part of me thinks that having a person suffering for the rest of their natural life in prison is wrong
    another part of me thinks that killing a person is wrong.

    Maybe if we had better prisons that didn't stuff people into conditions not dissimilar to factory chickens I might be fine with life in prison as a sentence.
  2. Forum:Serious Discussion & Debate

    Thread:Nuclear Apocalypse

    Thread Author:Ganelon

    Post Author:deathworlds

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    ►►Re: Nuclear Apocalypse◄◄

    I think most people don't expect to be directly targeted when they're making a nuclear bunker shelter.
    If engaging in total war, civilian population centers, military bases, and missile silos are the assumed targets, not random areas in the countryside
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    ►►Re: Punishment Vs Reformation & prisons.◄◄

    But you see, at least 4% people executed on death row were later found innocent. So it's clear that there isn't ever really indisputable evidence
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    ►►Re: Punishment Vs Reformation & prisons.◄◄

    "Hmmm yes, these people are somewhat disruptive to my idea of an ideal society, let's mind control them and fucking kill them"
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    ►►Re: Punishment Vs Reformation & prisons.◄◄

    I find the idea of retributive punishment abhorrent. Killing someone because they killed someone, does that make the system any better than the person who killed another?
    I take a moral stance similar to utilitarianism, I first seek to reduce the amount of suffering present in the world, then increase the amount of pleasure.
    I'll agree that any society needs systems in place that incentivize people to not break the rules, but mandatory sentencing, the death penalty, and private prisons really got to go, as these are all things that are contrarian to the idea of using our legal system for rehabilitation. Right now it seems like most people have some sort of justice boner when it comes people getting sentenced. How many times have you heard "oh I hope that guy gets raped in prison" or "i hope he gets beat up" or "you know what they do to guys like him", it's disgusting that people will cheer for using the legal system to put someone in a box where people will do extrajudicial actions to them. People don't seem to care about reformation for criminals (in my experience), even though they are people too
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    I admit, I haven't done much reading on FM. It was all YOLO based on what experience I have from mod and party games. Thanks for the link
    We all start somewhere I hope ya stick around for some more games!
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    I always considered 1 TPR being citizen but very small chances. I didn't know the setup principle would be like you describe it now. Wish I figured this out earlier tbh
    I purposely left it out earlier when I was talking about setup balance D2, because that would've probably outed ash and that would have been disadventagous.

    For the sake of learning here's the post that discusses the game that is the holy grail of forum mafia
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    Like I was certain the evil were going to try their best but then DW gave himself away with spiderman meme pretty good. I believe this was the right strategy for me but unfortunately I lost internet at that key voting moment and expected other townies to not leave votes on people. I think that was a very wrong play from town.


    I could have ended up voting Martin and losing but I would feel less shitty. I could have ended up voting DW and see what happens tomorrow. damn, it feels horrible to be robbed off like this. I hope the importance of votes on lylo is not forgotten next time. I had no plans of leading the votes today and just let it happen naturally.
    To be honest I was sick of being alive at MYLO, I've been there for three games in a row, and that's all it really devolved into. I probably would have done the same thing as town.

    Otherwise yes, it is a disadvantageous play to stick your vote down without considering every single possibility when scum could, in theory, turbohammer.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Some general advice for everyone,
    consider EVERY possibility, I think that's the most valuable takeaway from this game.
    Here's what the role list was posted as
    Mafia Any
    Mafia Any

    Town Any
    Town Any
    Town Any
    Citizen
    Citizen
    Citizen
    Citizen

    Everyone assumed the "Town Any" would be rolled as TPR, when it was entirely possible they could be rolled as citizen, hell it was entirely possible it would've been a vanilla game with just mafioso and citizens.
    As Mafia, Ash, dall, and I considered the possibility of splitting up our claims, so we avoid being in the same lynch box (boxing up groups of people for lynches is a totally valid thing to do btw bake). Instead of it being a 2v4, we were thinking it would be a 1v3 and a 1v3 at worst, which makes it much more difficult for town to pin down the scum.
    Regardless, as an experienced host on this site setup balance principles tells us that the town and the scum should have a roughly equal amount of power roles, the amount of kills that can be performed by scum should be able to be countered by town via protectives (bus drivers, escorts, doctors, etc), and the amount of investigative ability should be matched (consig, agent, framer vs detective, sheriff, lookout). Having an extra TPR would make this setup much more favorable to town.
    Yes this is setup/host meta, but it's a valid tool to be used by any player.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Martin I was super impressed by you this entire game,

    you brought an extraordinary amount of preparation and effort that intimidated me and dall. I would love to see you in more games and have you around to help solve them
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Good game everyone, truthfully, I was super nervous going into mylo

    Quote Originally Posted by Renegade View Post
    @Dallarian @deathworlds

    Great job! Fun to see Dallarian totally panic as soon as Auwt said Dall/Ash team was a possibility, so much so that he needed to get subbed out for 'personal' reasons, only to have his papa mentor join the game. Talk about a switcheroo! A vet into a newbie game, wow the wolf did sneak into the hen house!

    Oh and I loved how you two just giggled and laughed after that in your mentor chat: how dumb the poor newbie town players are! Insert laughing spaniard emoji here.

    Give me a break. Total bullshit.
    I'll have you know I respect every single player here, and I didn't just ask to be subbed in, it was requested of me.
    I'm not going to hold any punches and purposely play sub-optimally for new players, that doesn't teach anyone anything.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    SCUM WIN
    BOTTOM TEXT
    -vote Drizzt
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Fuckin' hell, I hate mylo
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    -vote MartinGG99
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    My first FM game. Yeah, I agree it would have been pretty good content if I turned out to be godfather after all of this.




    Who would you vote anyway? Ash/Martin/Bakermir/Drizzt
    Martin's the safest bet from my PoV.
    I have a hard time believing ash or you are scum based off of mechanics and claims.
    Drizzt would be my 2nd choice in this scenario, strictly because he isn't mechanically disproven.
    Martin's been scummy this whole game from my PoV.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    We didn't have more than a few hours left. It was roughly around the time you said you were going to hammer him. I quoted that in my hammer vote.
    I was going to hammer unless someone unvoted, as I said before, I mostly just wanted to make sure my vote was somewhere it would count by EoD
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Actually I do have one bit to add.

    I'd still like to see Martin get lynched more than anything else, the way he hammered auwt when we still had more than a few hours left to go in the day left a sour taste in my mouth, in addition to my prior scum read on him.
    We live in a timeline where it's POSSIBLE for bake to be scum, and drizz to be innocent. But there's no timeline where I see Martin being town
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Actually I do have one bit to add.

    I'd still like to see Martin get lynched more than anything else, the way he hammered auwt when we still had more than a few hours left to go in the day left a sour taste in my mouth, in addition to my prior scum read on him.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    *obligatory self preservation statement*
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Yeah there’s a tiny edge possibility of bakemir being exactly godfather, but I am never going to bet the game on that. Not when we have a 2/3 chance to hit scum in the non-insane world where it’s 2 of Martin/DW/Drizzt.
    I remember when I got juked by betting on the non-cursed timeline.

    Gods third line butterfly is going to haunt me for years to come
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    If you want, we can end this now
    :crabrave:
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    I really hate this puzzle solving stage of the game
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Drizzt View Post
    I'd like to hear from Bake, Martin unvoted me, but at the end of the day I'll prob follow him as long as I agree with his logic. If we lose, we'll lose as a team.
    Well I mean arguing in this 1v2 isn't going to get us anywhere because we'll all just point fingers at each other like the spiderman meme, it's probably best if we get input from bake and ash, because I'll just say you and martin are scum, martin will say that you and I are scum, and you will say that martin and I are scum. We all "know" that we're citizen.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Well assuming you are citizen, like me, then there's one possibility, but i don't believe it likely. That would be Bakermir + Deathworlds. Like I said, Bakermir could've done nothing on N1 while scum, and that wouldn't have tipped off Grakylan the detective as scummy. Actually, that could make sense in some world. There was a slight reason for him to do nothing night 1, and that's because Auwt voted him day 1. Although that was just only 1 vote against Bakermir. If I were him and scum, that wouldn't convince me to do nothing. However, it is possible.
    Well it's certainly possible that bake COULD be scum. He isn't mechanically disproven, but as I said before, the bloody stars would have had to align for him to get this far.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    So ash is un CC'D tpr claim, bake didn't do anything n1, and we got two other unresolved citizen claims in Drizzt and Martin.

    I really, REALLY want to believe that drizz is town, based off of Helltanis' play, but I can't imagine a world where mafia doesn't act on n1.
    So that really does leave martin/drizzt, if we all agree that it isn't bake.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Well I can't say I'm totally shocked that scum decided to kill Grak, makes sense from a mechanical standpoint.
    I am shocked that auwt didn't flip red
  27. Forum:Forum Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Role : Slave Master

    Thread Author:Gzz

    Post Author:deathworlds

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    ►►Re: Role : Slave Master◄◄

    This post is almost a decade old
  28. Forum:Circlejerk

    Thread:BLACK HOLE SUN

    Thread Author:Frinckles

    Post Author:deathworlds

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    ►►Re: BLACK HOLE SUN◄◄

    18 naked cowboys in the showers at Ram Ranch!
    Big hard throbbing cocks wanting to be sucked!
    18 naked cowboys wanting to be fucked!
    Cowboys in the showers at Ram Ranch!
    On their knees wanting to suck cowboy cocks!
    Ram Ranch really rocks!
    Hot hard buff cowboys their cocks throbbing hard!
    18 more wild cowboys out in the yard!
    Big bulging cocks ever so hard!
    Orgy in the showers at Ram Ranch!
    Big hard throbbing cocks ramming cowboy butt!
    Like a breed a ram wanting to rut!
    Big hard throbbing cocks getting sucked real deep!
    Cowboys even getting fucked in their sleep!
    Ram Ranch ... it ROCKS!
    Cowboys love big hard throbbing cocks!
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    ►►Re: Right-wing liberalism vs Conservvatism◄◄

    Oh I was referring to the application of polygamy within any singular culture or religion. I was simply referring to polygamy as a consensual romantic/sexual relationship involving more than 2 people.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    I'm placing my vote on auwt as soon as I get home, in about an hour
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Gyrlander you dumb slut, you know better than to post in live games smhing my head
    For legal reasons, I'm obliged to say that that phrase was mostly entirely sarcasm
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Gyrlander you dumb slut, you know better than to post in live games smhing my head
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    ►►Re: Right-wing liberalism vs Conservvatism◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Do y’all react just to it being banned/or not by religion cuz if that’s the reason then I get it but I can’t really argue with that stance.
    I provided my own reasoning arsehole
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    ►►Re: Right-wing liberalism vs Conservvatism◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Its weird that you’d be for polygamous marriages, even from a utilitarian perspective it’s PLAIN wrong, it leads to social unrest because some men don’t get any women.
    "leads to social unrest" LMAO

    that's some neckbeard tier shit right there.

    anyways, I'm for people doing whatever they like with other consenting people of age, life is meant to be enjoyed, forcing arbitrary rules and labels upon oneself is restrictive more often than it is helpful or enjoyable.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Auwt View Post
    Oh and also, no one here is able to find me a valid team mate.
    And I'm luring everyone's hate atm.
    This should alert you. But will it?
    I mean from my pov it's either Drizz, Martin, or bake.
    I already said bake or drizz are unlikely scum candidates,
    thus that leaves Martin.
    Simple PoE, association reads are usually bogus anyhow
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    ►►Re: Right-wing liberalism vs Conservvatism◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Its pretty misogynistic in my view.
    It's pretty misogynistic to think that polygamy is strictly one man and multiple women
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    ►►Re: Right-wing liberalism vs Conservvatism◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganelon View Post
    Yeah and Mormonism is also for polygamy. I never understood why that religion exists. I really don’t like it either, and I’m glad I’m not the only one.
    What's wrong with polygamy?
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    ►►S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by deathworlds View Post
    Consider my vote on Auwt for now, I will probably stick my vote down around 4ish hours from now, then I'm out for the rest of the day.
    Whether or not that will result in a lynch or not is up to the rest of the voters because I want to make sure my vote is somewhere were I believe it will do work by EoD, which I won't be around for
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Consider my vote on Auwt for now, I will probably stick my vote down around 4ish hours from now, then I'm out for the rest of the day.
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    ►►S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    Why would town lynch a TPR or someone confirmed by TPR?


    There is no counter claim.


    All of you fucks claimed citizen.


    Now lambs to the slaughter.
    I like your energy
  41. Forum:Circlejerk

    Thread:Give me my colors.

    Thread Author:Mesk514

    Post Author:deathworlds

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    ►►Re: Give me my colors.◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    You give me the retired staff award (lol) but not my color
    I cry
    It's been 3 years, I'm almost 23 now. I'm mature now
    miss u bb, welcome back
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Auwt you're going total tinfoil right now.
    Grak and Ash are uncc'd TPRs
    Grak claims detective that cleared bake
    Ash remains unclaimed to put mafia in wifom hell presumably (at least that's what I'm getting from his crypticallity)
    Drizzt, you, MartinGG, and myself all explicitly claim citizen.
    There's one claim left, bake, who is confirmed to have NOT performed the mafia kill at minimum (unless they're a godfather, but I doubt there would be a godfather in a setup this small).

    Here's the remaining rolelist
    Hidden scum
    Hidden scum

    Hidden town
    Hidden town
    Citizen
    Citizen
    Citizen


    Mix and match until you get what you want, but as per the status quo there are exactly two TPR claims that are resolved.

    Hidden scum
    Hidden scum

    Hidden town Grak, Detective
    Hidden town Ash, TPR
    Citizen
    Citizen
    Citizen


    Now to add myself as a self-confirming citizen claim

    Hidden scum
    Hidden scum

    Hidden town Grak, Detective
    Hidden town Ash, TPR
    Citizen DW
    Citizen
    Citizen


    It's super easy auwt. the only ones left unresolved are Bake (who did not perform the mafia kill assuming grak is telling the truth), Drizzt (who is probably a townie based off their prior slot), Martin (Who hunts TPRs) and yourself who cannot puzzle solve, and attacks our TPR claims.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Problem is, I don't see anything leading to a garunteed victory right now, due to knowing certain player's alignments already; and it seems either a lynch of me or a lynch of Drizzt is the most likely to lead to a victory. And if those aren't possible, and the consensus that we must lynch, then the next best option is you.
    Well obviously our last choices for being lynched should be ourselves, as I explained before, to a town!pov, selflynching is basically a throw.
    For me the list goes Martin/Auwt/Bake/Drizzts, in that order. with bake and drizzt being much further away than martin and auwt.
    I have a hard time seeing drizzts being scum, because their previous slot was basically a headless noob townie (no offense mate, we were all like that once).
    Bake is 90% confirmed (could be an actionless mafia, or a godfather or some dumb shit like that) unless grak is CC'd
    Auwt has been TPR hunting and attacking our pretty much confirmed townie the entire day.
    Martin also had a bit of TPR hunting, but his hyper-awareness makes me very hesitant to not throw him out of the game.
    That being said I am very much willing to lynch Auwt, I'd very uncomfortably lynch bake or drizzt, but I would be pleased with a Martin or Auwt lynch.
    I don't know who his partner would be because I don't hunt by association very often, as that is something that scum can manipulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Man we're spread out today aren't we?

    If I'm reading the thread right, at this moment:

    I want to lynch Auwt (but that might change)
    Ash wants to lynch Auwt
    Bakermir wants to lynch Deathworlds
    Deathworlds wants to lynch MartinGG99
    Drizzts wants to lynch...no one yet? He's probably still deciding. Maybe Deathworlds or Ash considering his recent posts.
    Auwt was pressuring Ash on his last post, so I think he wants to lynch Ash.
    I quoted this for some reason and I can't remember :thonk: OH I remember, it was to agree with the list at that moment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grakylan View Post
    I'm sure I've said this elsewhere, but I targeted bake n2 cuz he was a null read for most people, and I wanted to clear up any neutral territory first: scum reads or town reads aren't worth the check at first.
    On another note...

    Also we gotta think for a second, why would Dallarian suddenly leave the game after hours where we were basically coming to a consensus to lynch Dallarian? Helltanis was one thing, but Dallarian was way more active d1 then d2, so his excuse of not being able to keep up with many things seems disingenous. Especially considering I was having trouble keeping up at first but decided to stay in the game. But that also could be because I'm a town power. Even a citizen has his civic duty to vote scum out, so if a citizen leaves, not in the beginning, but in the MIDDLE of the game after a consensus against him was forming, what could that say? Could he be scum?

    And that's not to mention that deathworlds did not have such a good introduction, and is starting to give off toxic vibes.

    Could be another Zedus situation, but at this point I say we take the chance, if we are to lynch anyone.
    Okay that makes perfect sense now, that is something I would have 100% done.
    Because of reasons that you can talk to SJ or Dall about post game.
    I would never stoop to Zedus' level, I'm not toxic, I play aggressively towards my scum-reads, and aggressively in general. Trying to advocate for my lynch for giving off "toxic vibes" when there are none to be found isn't a very cash money move.

    Oh and bake I saw that post, and, uh, yeah it was kinda damning, accusing not just one, but indirectly both of our unCC'd TPRs when there's a maximum of two TPRs left is ignorant of reality at best, and an attempt of hijacking the town in a super high-risk play at worst. It's super unlikely that bake is scum, the bloody stars would've had to align for him to be scum. I don't see how ash/bake could be a thing, because ash is more or less confirmed at this point.
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    WHOAH HOLY SHIT I JUST REALIZED AUWT WAS AT L-1
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Oh and Bake, I saw your post and I'll respond to it in a minute, I just got a little bit of downtime at work
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Also, since i pointed out that Auwt's been indirect power hunting by labelling citizens, even if he's town, that's anti-town stuff. Deathworlds said Zedus lynch justified, because he was acting anti-town, and honestly I wonder if he would vote to lynch Auwt.
    Yeah looking back on it, I kind of glossed over the fact that Auwt was pretty much openly TPR hunting, and is still kind of doing it to ash, pressuring him to reveal what his role is.
    Granted at this stage of the game I'd like Ash to reveal their actual role, but since no one else CC'd TPR I'm inclined to believe and trust ash.
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    ►►Re: Re : Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    Looking at Grakylan's past reads list at 823#, we could have up 3 hypothetical votes on Deathworlds. Me, Drizzt, and Grakylan's, if we really decided that compared to all other options, Deathworlds was the best choice. That's be the strongest consensus so far that I've seen.
    Town should never advocate for their own lynch unless they are 100% sure it's going to lead to a town victory.
    From a town pov it's a guaranteed mislynch, literally any option is better
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    ►►Re: Re : Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinGG99 View Post
    @deathworlds
    EOD2 happens in 20 hours 30 mins I believe. For EST, that's 5PM tomorrow.
    Yeah I'm going to be asleep, I get off shift at 10EST (im PST) and I'm home usually an hour later.
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    ►►Re: Re : Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Ash Lael View Post
    Oh one last thing:

    DW, Drizzt: please take the time left in the day to go back and build a proper case against one or two of the other slots in your four person group. Someone in this group is getting lynched and at least two are town. We need to be able to identify at least one of the group as town to have a winning POE, and helping us solve the group is the best way to show us that you’re the person we can afford to not lynch.
    Ofc

    Btw to everyone, I work funky shifts and am actually quite busy tonight. I'll keep reading and contributing throughout the rest of the day cyle, but I'm probably not gonna be here at EoD because I think I'm gonna be dead asleep by then, idk I haven't caught up to the day 2 countdown yet lmao
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    ►►Re: S-FM Summer 2020◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by bakermir View Post
    Fair point. However, his play has been consistent with how Helltanis played on Day One. You seem to have an entirely different approach than Dallarian. Now, let's not forget you know this game very well compared to most of us and it was Dallarian's first game. This is the only reason I am giving you time. Welcome to downtown.


    What are your thoughts on Martin and Auwt?
    I'm still catching up, I'm on post 478 but the more I read the more I like Auwt and am reminded of his gameplay in standoff.
    I can't say the same of Martin unfortunately. Am I overanalzing? probably, but with the stage of the game we're in and how there's limited options to choose between I think Martin is the safest lynch.
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