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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    rumox I don't believe I've said this yet but you are the fuckin bomb.

    thank you.

    do you guys really care that much about two constables? I literally didn't intend this entire discussion to happen due to my post, but it seems like you all missed the point of why I posted it.... so here goes.

    "this is too good"

    "this is the best mafia game" ... "I've ever seen"

    "this is so beautiful"

    It's like you all missed the point.

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    EDIT: P.S. if people are literally copying my 2 constable setups and making their own versions of it, can one really make the argument that "everyone hates it cut that shit out"?
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    That's right. Gloss over the fact that everyone had a great time. Let's face it, this ENTIRE thread of yours isn't about the saves, it's about winning an argument, and when you see people having fun in a "shit save" it kinda shits on your argument that I'm a griefer ramming "troll saves" to "troll the community".

    So I ask you, what's more toxic to the community? Unique saves that offer a fun, new experience or toxic players that think they run the show cussing out everyone for minor things?
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    I know what CHOO is, do you not see the date my account was created? It was started by SCVMurderer, he used to play as THE LYNCH TRAIN, he'd prefer neutral roles and hijack games starting random lynch trains on people. It was at a time when I was preferring town exclusively, and was quite the 933 tryhard. I used to -prefer jailor and just fuckin wreck him every game because I knew what he was up to. You know the saying, you either quit young or see yourself play long enough to become the villain.

    Anyways, here's some feedback on one of my "shit saves". This is the stuff I live for right here. I was "Chargin Mah Lazer" because when am I NOT DH right? lol.

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    P.S. Town won. In this save the Mayors keep their votes when they're culted. I provide a dynamic in this save that no other saves have, and that's EXACTLY what I go for. I want people to have fun.
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    You know, you're a real piece of work, Renegade. Supernoob RARELY hosts his own saves and usually passes, but when he does I guess that makes him subject to your flame?

    Not only do you make fun of his save, but you also make fun of his clan and insult his character? You're trying to make him out to be a troll when I have literally never seen him troll, all because of his save?

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    Not only does he offer to pass the save, he passes it to YOU, and now you're on the forums lambasting him? What a douche.
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    Shit I WANT to be on the team with two DF. That's like saying Judge is effectively useless after he courts. You still have a vote, you can still lie, you can still lynch your way to victory. You also get a second shot at day 7. You have an opposing team (Mafia) that you know is evil that you can divert attention to in order to keep the lynches off of you. There are two benigns there that ALSO provide more of a gray area, AND an Any.

    The whole premise is that you don't use your shot to help the Mafia, you might need to use it to SHOOT the Mafia. That's what makes it fun, it's a three faction dynamic. The triad in that save get TWO day shots. I've seen Arsonists win with fewer kills than that.

    I know I'm a simpleton, but let me explain wAkWaK's save to you. There may be a high Jester chance, but there's also a Marshall with 2 lynches with 3 lynches each. I see what he's going for. Also probably why he allows for 2 NK, because Marsh is so strong.

    However ALL of this is detracting from the real issue here, how toxic you are to the community. All you do is shit on everyone, and that's not OK.
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    This guy is actually griefing the community. He's literally harassing me, personally, even when I say nothing to instigate it. Look at how he behaves in game:

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    It's funny how he makes statements like "Oo shiny bauble DF" but when I explain myself he has nothing to say. Well the image above shows you who he truly is. I spoke nothing to him in lobby or that game, but he flames waKwaK's save and then somehow my name is included in his flaming?

    This is straight up harassment.

    Also, this is wAkWaK's "shitty save" that got flamed all game. This is what I meant when I said "It doesn't matter WHAT your save is, someone will complain. Always."

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    This guy calls us all griefers, but he's the only person actually griefing. I'm honestly getting kind of sick of this toxic behavior, and people like this should definitely not have 4x repick capabilities.
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    The save you posted in the original post is an 82221. Every save I have ever played was thoroughly thought through with balance in mind. I watched the replay of that double mason game and you even recognized that you were supposed to be the gov. But then, you didn't act like the gov. You just raged the whole game and contributed nothing towards the win condition.

    What is balance to you? Balance to me is a game where all factions have an equal chance at victory. All my saves tend to end up in close games, that is most definitely the intent. Sometimes it takes a few games to get the balance right, like with any save.

    You tell me I refuse to have a conversation about my saves? I will explain the idea behind every single one. You just like to shout obscenities at people. You're really good at seeming composed on these forums, but in game you're not the person you're trying to portray yourself as here.

    The Double Flowers don't become Enforcer. It's a Maf vs Triad save. I put double mason to replace the gov because they can act as a gov but why would DF shoot a mason? If both masons confirmed themselves during day town would have two govs, would both DFs shoot both masons? They might need to save that for a better target. If you notice, there's no NK, the 2x DF are supposed to be the NK. Mafia has GF and Consig, because Consig becomes GF and that makes them a bit stronger. Also, the Mafia will have the benefit of information via the Consig, because they don't win ties with Triad and it might be useful for them to be able to scout out Triad. All Neutral Evils are not available in that save, including from the Any Random, because I figured without a traditional gov, Town might have a hard time versus the two factions.

    I'd say that one game we played with that save, it was pretty close. As the GF, if I had shot the Det instead of the Mason, it was possible to create enough plausible deniability to where I could fool the town into thinking I was the doc and not 13.

    Balance to me are close games where every faction has a chance to win. You can't judge balance just by looking at the roles list. You have to see how the game plays out.

    I don't create interesting saves to troll, I create them to make new metas and provide new experiences. I play like one or two games a day, and if I DO get repicked I don't quit the lobby, I play whatever save gets loaded up. I'm not forcing anything on anyone, I'm breathing fresh air into a stale community.
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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    This is the first time I've heard of "quick start" as an exploit. A lot of people do it. It just gets the game started faster.

    How about people with 40k+ points griefing lobbies by spamming "repick repick repick" all the time with their 4x repick capabilties? Is that not an abuse of power?

    Some people think they're the only person that plays this game, or their opinion is the only one that matters. They don't realize they are the very loud minority with overblown repick privileges. Renegade is a repick abuser. It only takes two repick abusers to hijack lobbies. These players tend to have a lot of points and the save will usually land on them when repicked.

    People have been arguing over saves since the creation of this game. It doesn't matter WHAT your save is, someone will complain. Always. It could be a cookie cutter 933 and you'll hear "Not 8331?!??! SHIT SAVE!"

    These repick abusers need to be addressed. They hijack lobbies and stifle creativity. The game is getting less and less popular. How will new people ever get to enjoy the game if they get their saves repicked by one of these bullies?

    I think we should remove the additional repick votes rewarded with points. It really skews the perception that creative saves are unwanted, because even WITH these trolls trying to hijack my lobbies, they still don't succeed most of the time. That should tell you how many people actually dislike the saves. The loud minority.

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    ►►Re: The fast start glitch and ramming through griefer saves◄◄

    yeah I agree. This "Law" guy is a real jerk. I mean, who makes saves? WHO? How dare he. He should be banned for life.
  10. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Soldato Buff Suggestion

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Re: Soldato Buff Suggestion◄◄

    Wow. I like that even better than my idea.

    One night MM. That's perfect!

    EDIT: Maybe make him able to bomb his own Mafia, even his own house like an MM does (without dying of course). Since his teammates know what he's doing, they won't be home. This would also make it so BG could protect Mayor, and die in combat with a Soldato, because it would also function like an MM.

    I really like the idea.

    DF is extremely strong in that you can take out a Mayor and bypass BG, but a one-night MM style Soldato will have its own strengths in that you can essentially blow up invests checking YOUR OWN TEAMMATES, providing an entirely new element to this game.
  11. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Soldato Buff Suggestion

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Re: Soldato Buff Suggestion◄◄

    I think the biggest pro would to make it actually viable.

    As it stands currently, it's basically an MM and Arson combined, two roles that are notoriously difficult to get kills with. You basically just have to get lucky that you happened to plant a bomb on someone that turned out to be Mayor, who doesn't get shot randomly, and who reveals early enough to where you aren't dead yet or turned into a Mafioso.

    The reason why I think you need the day plant is because that's how MM works. You have to spree someone who would most likely be getting a visitor *that night*. Even that can be hard. Imagine having to do it a day in advance, and you only get one shot at it. It's literally the two hardest killing mechanisms in the game combined, which makes it absurdly hard to kill with.

    I like that you brought up RB. Town can still RB the Soldato if they find him, and this would prevent him from detonating correct? So there's still counter-play at hand.

    Furthermore, you bring up night discussion. I think night discussion can be done preemptively on N1 or N2 discussing how to use the bomb correctly. I also think the Pros of having a much more reliable bomb outweighs the Cons of not getting to talk about your target with the team as you're taking your shot. Would you rather discuss with your team which target to shoot with a weapon with 5% accuracy, or would you rather have a brief discussion early on and use the weapon yourself with 50% accuracy?

    The day button is all about just making him viable.
  12. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Soldato Buff Suggestion

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Soldato Buff Suggestion◄◄

    Soldato sucks nards. Triad gets DOUBLE FREAKIN FLOWER and Mafia gets... a role that almost always blows up his bomb on a dead body. I have seen one good detonation out of like 30 Soldato appearances, which was EPIC, but let's face it, it takes a stroke of wicked luck to do anything with the role.

    So I suggest we give him a button like Jailor gets during the day so he can place his bomb on someone he thinks is going to be visited *that night*. This will allow for bait plays like "invests on 6, he's sus" and then you can bomb the shit out of the invests.

    But you say, Govs will get rekt every time! Make Bodyguard block Soldato detonation. No Bodyguard worth their salt doesn't have a bomb diffuse kit handy am I right?

    Also, no sound for the explosion? Don't worry I got you fam. This shit needs to POP!

    https://pixabay.com/sound-effects/search/explosion/

    Personally, I like the "Explosion" by frolickingdp1. It's not too loud, and it has a mild build up unlike some of the other ones. We don't want to startle anyone. It also kinda sounds like a house blowing up.

    In summary, Soldato is probably one of the coolest concepts I've seen in this game. HE'S GOT A BOMB! KABOOOOM! BUT, he's a limp dick. He can't fuck shit.

    BUFF EM

    Oh yeah, and Frinckles....

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  13. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:goddamn I love this game

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►goddamn I love this game◄◄

    I used to tell the trolls "go ahead and troll, I will outlive you. I will still be playing long after you are bored with this game."

    and it's true.

    I'm still playing and I love you guys. See ya'll next round
  14. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Proposed Chaos Mode Addition

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Re: Proposed Chaos Mode Addition◄◄

    Quote Originally Posted by Varcron View Post
    What I don't really understand is if people are actively enjoying the save why it becomes such a large problem...

    In the past we've had some pretty trollish (like 3 NK saves) or dumb shit like that being hosted and there was never really a problem, people just kind of laughed it off. What's the big problem now?
    holy crap man I love you.

    exactly, if I wanted to troll I wouldn't need to do what I do. I can make a 5 SK 5 Jester 5 Bus Driver save no problem. Exeter loves to use strawman arguments like stump/scumbag saves when, if my goal was really to troll, why would I need to go as far as I do? I can troll with the roles that are already provided.

    It just seems the admins love to listen to Exeter, this guy plays like one game every 3 weeks, he's literally the loud minority. 95% of mafia players aren't even on the forums/discord. It's just forum/discord users think they are the entire community.
  15. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Proposed Chaos Mode Addition

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Re: Proposed Chaos Mode Addition◄◄

    I mean let's be real, Elector is CRAZY strong. But how much stronger is it than Bonker? Bonker is also up there in the realm of insanely OP Neutral Evils.

    I designed this save not only to include Elector, but to basically be Elector's wet fucking dream. And it still comes out balanced. HOW? Because I make sure that most towns have abilities they can use at night. Voting is typically the way town wins the game, but versus something that takes your votes, you need another way.

    Vigi chance is insanely high. Vigi > Elector.

    EDIT: Another thing to look at if adding this save is to be taken seriously is the Order of Operations for Elector's ability at night. It comes first, like DEAD first. Elector goes thru bus, Elector goes thru SR! If you did want to move forward with adding my save to Chaos Mode perhaps it should be sent down the list a little bit so Bus can save Mayor, etc.

    EDIT2: Frinckles has a command?
  16. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Proposed Chaos Mode Addition

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Proposed Chaos Mode Addition◄◄

    So there was a period of a couple weeks where some magical person released Elector back into the community, and during this time I was able to craft a save that was roughly balanced even though the role is known to be insanely OP.

    I call it "The Three Tyrants".



    Godfather
    Town Random
    Town Prot
    Town Investigative
    Any Random
    Mafia Random
    Town Killing
    Neutral Random
    Mayor
    Town Prot
    Mafia Random
    Town Killing
    Neutral Killing
    Elector
    Mayor

    ----

    So the stats to this save was removed because I was revealing bank information, but when I did -saveslots it was legit the exact same information.... soo... idk what to do about that. So I'm just gonna leave it. But if you really do want to add this, REMEMBER, vig chance is MUCH higher chance than normal so please consult with me for slider stats otherwise the save will be shit.

    Thank you.
  17. Forum:Punished Players & Appeals

    Thread:killy: 1-S2-1-5387491

    Thread Author:Exeter350

    Post Author:lawson

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    {Watch List} ►►Re: killy: 1-S2-1-5387491◄◄

    Law: 1-S2-1-354349

    I am the originator of the save. Please redirect punishment to me. killy is one of many great players in the community who only wants to try something fun.
  18. Forum:Research and Development

    Thread:Bring Back Elector

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Bring Back Elector◄◄

    We can rebuild him.. stronger.. better.. more balanced.....

    as a TOWN GOV!

    Elector (Town Government)

    permanently moves votes 1/2/3 times

    flagged as Mayor/Marsh tier, not the sub-gov tier that is Constable, ML, Crier
  19. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Disguiser Revealed via Jailor Button

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Disguiser Revealed via Jailor Button◄◄

    Take a look at this picture here.



    I am jailor. Take a look at graveyard. 14 is dead with ???, 14 was disguiser. You can see my jail button is still by 14. You know who it's not by tho? 13. This made me suspicious, and this turned out to be a profitable assumption.

    Funny stuff.
  20. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Cult Not Spawning From Any Random

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Re: Cult Not Spawning From Any Random◄◄

    yeah man idk, but it's being excluded from Any Random for some reason.

    if you look at the top of the game it shows all the roles that can possibly be in that game. L, P, J, A, M, A, E, A, W, J, S, S

    no W or C, meaning Witchdoc and Cult.

    Seeing as Any Random includes Neutrals and the Cult/WD are at 2.0 (with cult being shown as having 2.0 setting), there must be something blocking Cult from spawning in Any.
  21. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Cult Not Spawning From Any Random

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Cult Not Spawning From Any Random◄◄

    Hello There.

    So this game I rolled Mason Leader. ML only rolls when there is cult or auditor in neutrals. So, when I roll ML, I like to check roles to know what I am up against.

    This game, I look up top, and there is no cult available. This means I know I am against an auditor. HOWEVER! I did NOT ban cult from my save.

    I have cult excluded from Neutral Evil, but not from Any Random. This is because Cult in a 9-3-3 is brutal, and the only way it's viable is with convert every two nights, and only ONE spawns. If I had it spawn from NE and Any, meaning two cult spawn at day 1, cult is damn near guaranteed a win.

    Anyways, cult should not be banned from Any Random given the set of rules I have outlined in my save, but it is. Take a look.



    As you can see, Neutral Evil does exclude cult, but Any Random does not.



    This is from the same exact save, cult is NOT at 0%. Therefore, cult should have spawned from the any.

    Thank you for reading.
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    ►►Re: Petition : Restore Option for Executioner Night Immunity◄◄

    I think you should return Exe NI checkbox.

    Solely because people like it.

    Just make people happy, man.
  23. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:wtf man

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►wtf man◄◄

    Jailor crashes game, some weird O. guy saying D1, D2, M1, M5.. other things..?

    Bro within the past two days you just shit on Mafia. What the fuck is this?

    Doll sucks, I tried to like it, but I hate it. I fucking hate it. Nothing like dying to a Neutral Killing that doesn't exist during day in a clutch tie moment... THIS ISN'T FUN DUDE. There is ZERO skill involvement. It's just luck of the draw.

    Jailor not working? fix this shit man. this is NOT acceptable. Fuck your doll patch. Revert to an old patch that doesn't BREAK JAILOR. Fuck DOLL.

    What is this O. D1, D2 crap? dogg. This is SO unprofessional. You need to raise your standards for what you are willing to release.

    Up your standards please. This is unacceptable.

    Seriously you overwrote MAF 1.0 with this shit. Now I'm about to get real. Stop being damn near afk in lobbies and unresponsive. We are not your fucking guinea pigs.
  24. Forum:Research and Development

    Thread:Remove JUDGE night chat?

    Thread Author:Arrow

    Post Author:lawson

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    [Role Change] ►►Re: Remove JUDGE night chat?◄◄

    Don't remove crier, just re-purpose him. Put him Town Support.

    I think everyone's problem with crier isn't his ability, it's that when he gets rolled, it usually means he took a TOWN GOV slot. Just make him town support.

    I would argue crier is an even stronger role than party host. If a skilled player gets "crier", they can lead town through anonymous guidance at night. It really is a powerful role, like coroner, but you need to know how to use it. As someone who enjoys getting crier, I think if you repurpose it to Town Support you will see what a great role it really is.

    I vote in favor of Judge keeping night chat. How'd judge gonna interrupt a marshall lynch, then communicate who he is to mafia amidst that chaos? When Marsh lynch completes, day ENDS. Judge still needs time to communicate to evils who he is.

    Judge without night chat is like a 2D character. Night chat makes him 3D. It adds a whole new DIMENSION! How dare you try to destroy this.

    I honestly can't believe all these threads that want to change mechanics that have been around for 5 years but many of the new 2.0 roles are extremely unpolished and are equally as worthy victims to the chopping block, if not moreso. Can we focus on polishing the new roles please?
  25. ►►Re: Remove -prefer -blacklist, mafia2 vest hogging up all the "fun" roles◄◄

    I would like to see things remain unchanged in terms of -prefer and -blacklist.

    I have enough points to use them both, but I use them sparingly. However, there was a time where I used -prefer every game, and that period lasted several years.

    Listen, I understand your point and you make a great point. People with tons of points hog all the fun roles, and if you see them in your lobby, chances are they're going to get a small selection of roles and if you can pinpoint who they are as a player you can also guess what role they might be. Consider it a weakness/strength.

    Anyways, let them have it bro. I think we should just chill on this one. There are players I enjoy playing against who are amazing at this game but only prefer a few specific roles, and I would rather beat them at their best versus making them play something they don't want to.

    The right to -prefer is a privilege new players seek to strive towards. If you think about it in an RPG context.. I've played this game for a decade+, so I got prefer maybe 5 years ago? lol. But I remember questing for it, trying for it. I was like "just a few more games then I never have to be evil again". Don't deprive people of this rite of passage. Those that have earned it, earned it.

    Anyways, I understand your point of view and even think it is valid, but we need to keep it the same. Sometimes, unfairness is the circumstance that drives people.
  26. Forum:Research and Development

    Thread:Veteran / Lover Interaction

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

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    ►►Veteran / Lover Interaction◄◄

    Lover loves a Veteran, and dies to Vet alert, but then Vet also dies.



    Article 1 you see the Lover dying to Veteran and the Vet dying to heartbreak. This is not a fun interaction.

    Lover shouldn't die to Vet. Lookout is immune to Vet, maybe Lover should be immune to Vet, too.
  27. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Double Flower convert to Enforcer

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
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    ►►Double Flower convert to Enforcer◄◄

    Double Flower currently has a setting that is not accessible in the save. I want to make Double Flower NOT convert to Enforcer at night, and for reasons I will explain further. Please make this an available option because it is available for every other Triad role, and I want to use it to create a fun and interesting dynamic for the community.



    If you look at Article 1, you can see the "convert to Enforcer" is greyed out, and the only option is to have it checked. My idea is to make it available in my "Any Random" (Article 2) as another faction to throw in the mix.

    I have been experimenting with adding choice Triad roles to "Any Random" as stand-alone neutral-evil types to create a four-faction dynamic which enhances complexity, and thus increasing possible game outcomes, for more variety in gameplay. I want to add Double Flower to my 4th faction dynamic, because honestly, it's so much better than my Admin idea, it's SUCH a great role for that, and I promise it will be a lot of fun.

    Please make DF able to NOT convert to Enforcer. I see massive potential with this role.

    Thank you.
  28. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Bus Driver Misclassification

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
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    ►►Bus Driver Misclassification◄◄

    With these two screenshots I hope to bring attention to an inconsistency in the save creator, and hopefully provide a solution to the problem.



    Beginning of the game, I have save. I crank up Bus Driver to 10! No way we aren't getting at least one.






    Game starts and we check the roles list and Bus Driver is not an available role. The only "B" in the list is "Bodyguard".

    Bus Driver is "Town Power" in Mafia 2, although historically it has been a Town Protective/Town Power hybrid role, meaning it could spawn in either Town Protective or Town Power. In Mafia 2, Bus Driver can only spawn through Town Power.

    So let's take a look at the settings. What do we notice? Town Random excludes protective, but NOT power. Back in 1.0, Town Random excluding Protective would also exclude Bus. However, since 2.0 no longer allows for Bus to spawn in Town Prot, he should not be excluded from Town Random due to "Exclude Town Prot" checkbox.

    I imagine the code must be written directly on the checkbox in for "Exclude Town Prot" under "Town Random".

    Thank you for reading.
  29. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Three Bugs in One Game!

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
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    ►►Re: Three Bugs in One Game!◄◄

    Thank you for the quick reply.

    In response to question 2: Yes, the option to learn role was turned on that game. In my second picture, both chat boxes A and B are from the same game, this game.

    Forgot to attach the replay in my first post.

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  30. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:Three Bugs in One Game!

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
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    400

    ►►Three Bugs in One Game!◄◄

    Bug One: Party Host "flair" not appearing at night.

    I was actress and I got myself killed talking at night during a party when I thought I was speaking only to my allies. I was looking for the cue that there was a party, which is a multi colored filter that appears in the four corners and flashes like a disco ball or something. There is no disco ball effect this game. There was a party the previous night.



    As you can see there are no bright colored lights around the corners of the screen, but with both 1 and 5 speaking at night it is evident there is a party going on. Could we please have a text message added to the party trigger that tells everyone there's a party? I know I fucked up this game because I should have noticed 1 and 5 weren't on my team and I could hear them talking, but what happens if town doesn't talk first and the cues don't show and mafia shoots themselves in the foot because of a game inconsistency like this?



    Bug Two: My actress target doesn't confirm nor does it tell me the role I have copied.



    Chat Box A illustrates how a copy should normally look. I pick a target for copy (A-1) and it tells me who the person is (A-2). Chat Box B shows the evening in question, where although I choose a target to copy (B-1), I don't learn who the person is while the game continues until the next day (B-2).






    This image shows the targets of every single person alive that night that could possibly interfere with the copy. There is no reason this copy shouldn't have occurred, as NOBODY interfered with it and I am the sole visitor to 9 that night.



    Bug Three: Auditor has audit blocked with no protection



    You can see from the Auditor's perspective that he attempts, and fails, to audit 9 on Night 2. 9 happens to be jailed by the kidnapper, 3, that night.

    Is blocking auditor with jail an intended feature? I do remember that not being the case in Mafia 1, and only BG could block audits.
  31. Replies
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    Views
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    ►►Re: Poisoner not killing Arsonist when he should have◄◄

    Hmm I thought I found a bug but maybe just an inconsistency. I figured it out, the Bodyguard 10 protected 15 on Night 3.

    Is Bodyguard intended to block Poisoner?
  32. Replies
    2
    Views
    289

    ►►Poisoner not killing Arsonist when he should have◄◄

    Recently I had a game where I poisoned an arsonist and he survived my poison. There was no way he could have survived that if the game's mechanics functioned as designed. Please read further.



    Night 3, from the Arsonist's perspective, you can see he is Poisoned (Article 2). The last Doctor in the game, the only person that could have saved him from this, is already dead (Article 1).



    The last remaining protective that could arguably have interfered with the poison was lynched during the day (Article 1) and wasn't even granted the chance to use an ability Night 4 (Article 2). There was no one remaining alive that had any means of protecting the Arson from my poison (Article 3).

    The night ends, there is no poison message or survive message. It just goes thru to the next day. The timestamp to witness this on the replay is roughly 18:35.

    It is also worth noting that the Interrogator DID die to poison Night 5. That may give the developers some insight on which mechanic is blocking the poison from killing Arsonist.

    Attached is a replay for reference. Thank you for reading.

    Name: Poisonbug1.SC2Replay
Views: 21
Size: 313.5 KB
  33. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:General Beta Feedback

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    19
    Views
    1,581

    ►►Re: General Beta Feedback◄◄

    All those little things like the name and theme are not all that important, very small changes. I guess everyone has an opinion. I just think it would be wisest to approach this with the idea "ADD to 1.0, don't create a new game". Take it slow, add one or two roles at a time, and balance the roles as they are added. That's how DR did it.

    Everyone that still plays this have thousands of games. We're all veterans. We're all hooked on a specific game. All the new roles are fun for a few games but once that fun expires people are gonna want to fall back to something. If you remove what everyone falls back on (1.0), then people are just gonna quit.

    Or if you really want to just take the reigns and make your own game, then don't patch 1.0 with 2.0, just have 2.0 be a separate entity. Let the people decide. If 2.0 was really a better game, people would pick it. I made a 2.0 lobby the other night when no 1.0 lobbies existed, spammed the hell out of Arcade with lobby links, watched as a 1.0 lobby was created, and filled up, and NOBODY joined my lobby. I was SPAMMING it. Take that how you want to.

    Armorsmith > Armorer. Smith makes me think blacksmith, forge and anvil. Armorer is the guy at the police station who works behind a cage and hands out the vests and guns to the cops. There is most definitely a theme in Mafia, there is no magic aside from "Witch". The line between the new roles and old roles is so easy, it's so easy to tell which roles are new, because they just don't look like something DR would come up with. Poisoner is the only one that is simple, balanced, and named properly to be added to 1.0 and have 1.0 still feel like DR's Mafia.


    This is the Poisoner win screen I made. I tried to copy DR's style HEAVILY, because it is SUPER important to me to make that line between old and new content to be as hard to see as possible. I want things to be new, but feel old. Does that make sense? Like trying a new beer you've never had before. It's something you're already comfortable with, so you find appreciation in the nuance.
    Name: UG0VSLF.png
Views: 16
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  34. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:General Beta Feedback

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    19
    Views
    1,581

    ►►Re: General Beta Feedback◄◄

    Ok, that's cool. I just want you to know the perspective I am coming from. I will play this game until I can't anymore. You see how I edited my post? I actually wanted to suggest Omni-Jester to 1.0 as well, but honestly it's just a novelty. Even though I want to see it, it will probably make the game less fun overall because it's game breaking. I critique my own ideas as well.

    I want the transition from 1.0 to 2.0 to be a success, which is why I am participating so much. It's also why I'm not pulling any punches, because we need to be honest in order to have a good finished product.
  35. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:General Beta Feedback

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    19
    Views
    1,581

    ►►Re: General Beta Feedback◄◄

    Thanks for keeping this thread going. I think, honestly, we need to focus on adding to the current Mafia 1.0 versus creating a whole new meta with Mafia 2.0. That means we need to take things slow, perhaps introduce things slow. I can't get anyone to join my 2.0 lobbies anymore, they prefer 1.0 overwhelmingly.

    For me, with this beta, the focus has always been not on novelty, but in something that can last. This is why I was one of the first to create my own 2.0 save and tinker with balance on my own terms. At it's current state, 2.0 is a novelty that people enjoy a lot while it is new, but they want to return to a baseline. This is the baseline I have been trying to create with the 2.0 meta.

    That being said, I think the only role that is truly worthy of being added to Maf 1.0 at this state is Poisoner. It's basically the role that Arsonist should have been. If given a NI option checkbox, it would fit in nicely with other NK in the current Mafia 1.0 meta. We may need to look at this not as one big patch, but as a series of patches, where roles are introduced slowly. I think the reality is you guys are going to have to accept that a lot of your ideas will need to be heavily reworked to be something that people will play again, again and again.

    I think you should start by adding Poisoner, and seeing how that turns out. There are a lot of good ideas you guys have, but you have to understand the reality of this. 95% of your ideas won't be worthy of becoming a permanent addition to 1.0. Frinckles tells me "Once I drop this patch you'll never see me again." This attitude is fucking garbage. I'm gonna keep playing this game for maybe another decade if it's still popular in 2030. Listen to me, because I'm never going to leave. I want to see this thing survive. Don't drop a patch and leave just to fulfill some stupid ego creative bullshit you have. I plan to play forever. So I really hope you take me seriously.

    That being said, there are two metas you can play with. The "Goofy Meta" and the "Actual Meta". The "Actual Meta" is 933/8331, baseline Mafia play, which MUST remain consistent (or improved) if the game is to survive. The "Goofy Meta", is a lot of the shit you guys introduce in 2.0, like Chaos Mode. If you want to add all the things you have created in 2.0 to "Chaos Mode" in 1.0, then that sounds swell. 2.0 has been a novelty to the community, so with confining most of the 2.0 additions to "Chaos Mode", you could realistically add all of these new roles to 1.0 without upsetting the Actual Meta. My concern is obviously the Actual Meta, and the only role worthy of adding to that would be Poisoner.

    A criticism I have of some of your roles and why they are incompatible with Mafia can sometimes be reduced to simply the name of the role being out of theme. Mafia's "theme" has always been The Godfather, crime noir, criminals vs police. Some of these roles seem to stray from that, a lot of the new 2.0 roles sound like they belong in World of Warcraft and not Mafia. Enchantress, Armorsmith, Oracle, bruh this is a modern crime game.

    But yeah, for real, just add Poisoner, give him a NI checkbox, and take it from there. Don't look at this like one big patch, look at it like a series of patches. We are ADDING to 1.0, versus creating something new.
  36. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:General Beta Feedback

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    19
    Views
    1,581

    ►►Re: General Beta Feedback◄◄

    I'm pretty sure I said I understood the reasoning for the nerf. I know what you guys are getting at. Just, for something that you don't really have to do, why take away something that gives me pleasure?

    So you guys are gonna take away one of my best roles, fine. Fair point. But I also think your change is weak sauce. Literally read what I wrote. You took away a UNIQUE ability and replaced it with something MANY roles have (a vest). Your new Spy is literally just an Anti-Disguiser. It's trash now. Damn near useless and DEFINITELY WAY MORE BORING. A fucking VEST?! How fun.

    Forum lurkers should listen to people who actually play the game. We're the ones who are gonna be keeping it alive for you to log on every 6 months and play a few rounds.
  37. Forum:Mafia Bug Archive

    Thread:General Beta Feedback

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    19
    Views
    1,581

    ►►General Beta Feedback◄◄

    1. I think Enchantress should be Town Power. Not sure how she's protective. Something a lot of 2.0 saves lack are the traditional 1.0 protectives. Not a lot of docs, or bgs, and it's because Town Protective is cluttered with too many roles. Town Prot would be great with Doc, BG, Armor, Bus. Four roles.

    2. Bus Driver should be moved back to Town Prot, because he actually has the ability to protect. Enchantress CAN protect in a way similar to bus, but Bus doesn't have to eat a bullet for it. Furthermore Enchantress has to guess just right to find the GF to target herself, where Bus just has to swap the intended prot target. This makes Bus Driver more qualified to be Prot than Enchantress.

    3. Town Random excluding Prot still excludes Escort and Bus Driver, even though these have changed designations. If you were to return Bus Driver to prot, you would just need to make sure Town Random Excludes Prot doesn't keep excluding Escort. I think Escort to Town Support is really good, because she's not really a prot.

    4. I have heard complaints about Party Host from other people when hosting my lobbies, and I have to say their criticism is valid. "He doesn't actually do anything." He doesn't. Blocking Mafia from talking at night doesn't actually block Mafia from doing anything. It is a low-power role akin to Crier. I think to buff Party Host you should make him also do a global Role Block, meaning NOTHING happens that night. No jail targets, nobody gets attacked, it essentially skips the entire night and gives town an extra day. This could be like town's Anti-Judge, where Judge steals a day from town, Party Host would give an extra day to town. Useful if say, there's no BG but you want mayor to live another day.

    5. Spy was one of my favorite roles, I have caught many Mafia by analyzing how they speak at night. I understand your argument for removing it and giving Mafia the peace to discuss their plans at night. However, the ability you chose to give him should be redone. You removed a unique playstyle element (the ability to read Mafia chat at night) and replaced it with a mundane ability present in many roles (night immunity). This nerf is watering down the game and making it more bland. I think you should add a wiretap ability for him. 1, 2, 3 wiretaps available depending on which checkbox you pick. Wiretap a player each night, giving yourself the ability to read their PMs during the day.

    Also maybe just add a check box to give the save creators an option whether or not they want Spy to read Mafia chat. Here's a replay of me catching all 3 mafia night 1 through text analysis. This is the one thing in this game where you may be talking to the best. Please don't take this avenue of play from me. Name: SpyPlay1.SC2Replay
Views: 22
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  38. Forum:Punished Players & Appeals

    Thread:VladTheGreat: 1-S2-1-9688967

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    2
    Views
    961

    {Permanently Banned} ►►VladTheGreat: 1-S2-1-9688967◄◄

    Account Name: VladTheGreat
    Account ID: 1-S2-1-9688967
    In-Game Name: Michelangelo the Thin

    Crimes Committed: Hacking

    Your Account Name: Law

    Summary: Day 1 he posts everyone's role and ruins the game.

    Name: VladTheGreat.SC2Replay
Views: 3
Size: 118.3 KB
  39. Forum:Punished Players & Appeals

    Thread:Bankai: 1-S2-1-1016287

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    2
    Views
    885

    {Watch List} ►►Bankai: 1-S2-1-1016287◄◄

    Account Name: Bankai
    Account ID: 1-S2-1-1016287
    In-Game Name: Romeo Giordano

    Crimes Committed: Intentional Gamethrowing

    Your Account Name: Law
    Summary: Bankai rolled Investigator. Throughout the game he did not use his ability once. Two instances which show his intent to gamethrow are at 9:45 and 20:45 in the replay, where he puts falsified leads in his LW. The second lie at 20:45 caused me to get lynched and was directly responsible for town's loss.

    Name: bankai.SC2Replay
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  40. Replies
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    ►►[POSSIBLE BUG] Two Bodyguards Defending Double Attacked Target◄◄

    Hi,

    I just played a game where two Bodyguards were on a Mayor who was attacked twice. Only one Bodyguard "protected" the Mayor, and the Mayor died. The second kill went through, despite there being another Bodyguard protecting the Mayor.

    Is this working as intended or is this a bug? **If this is working as intended, may I request it be explained on the Bodyguard role card?

    Replay is included. The incident occurred Night 3 (14:50 on the replay). Bodyguards are 5 (Messyparty) and 7 (SangFrold). Mayor is 15 (saka). SK is 10 (Banana) and Mafioso is 14 (FallenReaper). Names are Account names for replay perspective, not in-game name.

    Name: 2x BG Bug.SC2Replay
Views: 27
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  41. Forum:Punished Players & Appeals

    Thread:Manus: 1-S2-1-3702156

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    2
    Views
    605

    {Watch List} ►►Manus: 1-S2-1-3702156◄◄

    Account Name: Manus
    Account ID: 1-S2-1-3702156
    In-Game Name: Ehno Lombardi

    Your Account Name: Law
    Summary: Marshall lynches two town and expresses his apathy after the fact. Doesn't appear to be playing the role's objective. Game outcome is affected.

    I also want to say I made a lot of mistakes this game. I am 8, Ronald McDonald Trump.

    9:14 - 1 dies and his role flips (???) after being shot with bullets. I incorrectly think he's Disguiser.

    9:50 - I notice 6 (Morty) typing different than he did before. Now he capitalizes everything. This is not a concrete lead, but I try to get him put up and see how he reacts.

    10:00 - 10:45 - Morty and I argue amongst ourselves. At 10:45 I realize I might be wrong and unvote 6.

    10:57 - Marshall (Ehno Lombardi) reveals.

    11:02 - Ehno Lombardi says "how about this" followed by "you both die".

    11:04 - Ehno Lombardi receives PMs from everyone. I am the first to PM him and I tell him I'm bodyguard.

    11:16 - Morty publicly claims he's invest and gives his last will.

    11:23 - Morty is lynched, with myself included in the vote. I was already a little suspicious of him and I figure Marshall knew something I didn't.

    11:58 - I am lynched.

    12:20 - I express my lamentation for being lynched. 7 (Ehno Lombardi) responds with "i dont care", "you and 6 are bickering", and "and now youre not"

    12:58 - Ehno Lombardi writes a last will "shut the fuck up 6 and 8"

    19:26 - Game ends, Arsonist wins.

    In summary, the reason why I think Ehno Lombardi (Manus) qualifies for game-throwing instead of just poor play is his clear expressed intent to lynch both 6 and 8, followed by an expressed statement of apathy.
  42. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:The "Guilty or Inno" Reveal

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    12
    Views
    1,665
  43. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:The "Guilty or Inno" Reveal

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    12
    Views
    1,665

    ►►The "Guilty or Inno" Reveal◄◄

    well you know what they say, don't make fun of people when they open themselves up to you. they probably won't do that again.
  44. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:How can hacker hack this game?

    Thread Author:Yukitaka Oni

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    7
    Views
    1,205

    ►►Re: How can hacker hack this game?◄◄

    "How can hacker hack this game? You know... for a friend." -Yukitaka Oni
  45. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Role Idea

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    3
    Views
    695

    ►►Role Idea◄◄

    I can't think of a good name for this..... or what faction it should be... or if it's possible. But it's PURE evil!

    Role: Sick Fuck Brain Scrambler

    Classification: Neutral Evil probably, could be Mafia... who cares

    What you do:

    You visit someone at night, giving them drugs/poisoning them/doing experiments on their brain.

    From the victim's perspective, the names and chat are scrambled. For example, what 1 says will appear to come from 11, and what 2 says comes from 4, etc. The names would remain the same, so the person wouldn't be aware their brain was scrambled. Just all the chat would be fucked.

    Thoughts?
  46. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Cult Needs More Roles

    Thread Author:Cryptonic

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    24
    Views
    2,147

    ►►Re: Cult Needs More Roles◄◄

    Then make it so broken saves aren't an option.

    You want to make cult a legitimate faction, with roles that do things and a cult leader that can be immune at night. I think that detracts from what cult is.

    Cult is a disease. The role is converting. You kill one, another is converted. If you give it roles, night immunity, all the things normally attributed to Mafia, then you have to nerf it considerably. As it stands, it's OP. You want to make cult NIGHT IMMUNE?! You want to give cult ROLE BLOCKING? So they can RB vigilantes from shooting them, or sheriffs from detecting them, or mafia can't take them out, etc.

    They're neutral evil man. If you want to make them a faction, fine, but then they have no place in the standard 9 - 3 - 3 setup. I'm not against your idea, but if you want to make them a full fledged faction they just won't fit in the Neutral Evil category anymore. They would also need to be considerably reworked.
  47. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Cult Needs More Roles

    Thread Author:Cryptonic

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    24
    Views
    2,147

    ►►Re: Cult Needs More Roles◄◄

    Cults are OP right now. Convert every night cult is a guaranteed win. ML can have only two saves, which can't stop a cult already 3 deep.

    What I'm saying is, if the maker of a save wants to make it so cult wins, he can do it. I can't think of any other faction that can practically guarantee your success with a few checkboxes clicked.

    I hate cult, honestly. It turns town into evils. I love playing town, love it. Prefer it every time. Nothing sucks more dick than taking out 3 baddies then being converted.

    So look, if you think a cult getting a jailor would be fun, in essence, giving cult an RBer, then you gotta nerf the fuck out of cult. They are OP as fuck right now at "convert every night" setting, and I see it all the time by people "trying to get their cult win".
  48. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Jailor and vigilante

    Thread Author:Yukitaka Oni

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    11
    Views
    935

    ►►Re: Jailor and vigilante◄◄

    It is better to never shoot than to shoot every night and help the Mafia win.
  49. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Blackmailer + Jailor Adjustment

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    9
    Views
    1,183

    ►►Blackmailer + Jailor Adjustment◄◄

    In my travels I have encountered a situation most unpleasant. A quiet town who is also chain BMed gets jailed, the Jailor thinks the person is evil due to silence, then executes his fellow town even though he's doing everything right. Logically, a Jailor should execute a prisoner who is completely silent.

    I propose a simple change: Add the "I am Blackmailed." text that is present on trial to jails as well. Also, the checkbox that allows those that are blackmailed to speak on trial should also allow the blackmailed to speak in jail.

    This is a very minor problem but it is still a flaw in the game.
  50. Forum:Mafia Discussion

    Thread:Role: Mad Scientist

    Thread Author:lawson

    Post Author:lawson

    Replies
    5
    Views
    825

    ►►Re: Role: Mad Scientist◄◄

    I'm gonna be honest I take offense from your condescending nature, SuperJack.

    I don't think it would be OP at all and it seems like if you're the one in control of putting things into the game you've already made up your mind.

    Nothing is OP if you balance it.
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