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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
0BERO.N IS. P0CKETING ME
It'd be hard and useless to pocket you considering half the game would probably vote against what train you were on
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
Let me ask you something. Let's say hypothetically you are town, yes? Let's also hypothetically you trolled and day killed on d1. Should you be killed?
The answer to this is NO. Lynching town is ANTI-TOWN. It baffles me how you guys don't understand this
Lynching a townie just cuz he acted anti-town is pretty fucking stupid if you ask me lol
It means you didn't want to figure out his alignment because "tis too difficult" so you just set a barrier past which you do not feel bad if you are wrong
I'd like to play this game properly and actually try to understand these things and people's mentality and etc which is what this game is about.
In the end, you have to accept that trolling is part of the game and it happens lol
But how do you know the person is town if the supposed troll is likely just scum? Plus, we as a community should simply not accept such play from townies. That's called punitive meta. Remember our conversations about it 3 years ago? If anything, this could be you TMIing Ceko as town.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
oberon refuses to see people as numbers, i respect that
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
This policy lynch argument would be valid if ceko still had access to a day kill, but he doesn't anymore lol
I am not saying ceko is town, but killing him for just "he did thing which is bad to town so therefore he is bad" is stupid.
He did something that makes Z E R O sense from a town PoV. The only way he does it and is town is if he griefed the game, which should not be assumed
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
But how do you know the person is town if the supposed troll is likely just scum? Plus, we as a community should simply not accept such play from townies. That's called punitive meta. Remember our conversations about it 3 years ago? If anything, this could be you TMIing Ceko as town.
okay, i dont like this, why r u ALSO attacking oberon?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
But how do you know the person is town if the supposed troll is likely just scum? Plus, we as a community should simply not accept such play from townies. That's called punitive meta. Remember our conversations about it 3 years ago? If anything, this could be you TMIing Ceko as town.
By talking to them
How did Distorted know you were Citizen in that game where you CC'd a fucking CONFIRMED TOWN ROLE as a Citizen?
Also I'd rather play the game than engage in punitive meta, which doesn't sound that interesting to me and is besides the point of the game
If I can win with a troll in the game because I figured out they were trolling and didn't surrender my intellect to emotion I would feel a lot better about myself than if I lost because "fuck trolls"
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
He did something that makes Z E R O sense from a town PoV. The only way he does it and is town is if he griefed the game, which should not be assumed
You are assuming he didn't grief the game. Why would you make that assumption, especially considering the nature of the setup?
Also it was you that posted in the setup thread ages back that this game can be fun both as a troll game and as a regular game. You're now insisting it has to be taken as a regular game. WHY?
I certainly didn't expect anyone to hammer on D1, and took it as a normal game, but is this really that far outside of something ceko would do as Town? This reminds me of plotato skipping dudes' songs on Discord and laughing to himself IRL
Not that far-fetched as you make it out to be IMO, this is how the previous setup ended
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
lol
guys
lets just never hammer nor shoot
endless mafia game
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
He did something that makes Z E R O sense from a town PoV. The only way he does it and is town is if he griefed the game, which should not be assumed
i thought this was wildwild WEST, WHY TF is everyone dissecting my fuckin troll shoot
like, i am sorry but i did not want lag in this game anyways,
if u guys dont randomly shoot, ur not playing the setup the way it is meant to be played. EVERY0NE HAS A DAYKILL FOR A REASON L0L, FUCK JUST HAVE FUN,
fuckfuck, fuck
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
i thought this was wildwild WEST, WHY TF is everyone dissecting my fuckin troll shoot
like, i am sorry but i did not want lag in this game anyways,
if u guys dont randomly shoot, ur not playing the setup the way it is meant to be played. EVERY0NE HAS A DAYKILL FOR A REASON L0L, FUCK JUST HAVE FUN,
fuckfuck, fuck
Most certainly not and I don't appreciate you repeating the same words as me and by the way you are still in my lynch pool
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
You are assuming he didn't grief the game. Why would you make that assumption, especially considering the nature of the setup?
Also it was you that posted in the setup thread ages back that this game can be fun both as a troll game and as a regular game. You're now insisting it has to be taken as a regular game. WHY?
I certainly didn't expect anyone to hammer on D1, and took it as a normal game, but is this really that far outside of something ceko would do as Town? This reminds me of plotato skipping dudes' songs on Discord and laughing to himself IRL
Not that far-fetched as you make it out to be IMO, this is how the previous setup ended
He is playing on the "but it was a fun shot" here. There is no world where we can safely trust him, as it's very easy to just play on this as scum. And EVEN if you're playing for a fun game, shooting people who haven't spoken yet is not exactly "fun"...
Also, one shouldn't assume rulebreaking, since rulebreaking is technically not part of the game lol. It's a dangerous way to approach the game.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
He is playing on the "but it was a fun shot" here. There is no world where we can safely trust him, as it's very easy to just play on this as scum. And EVEN if you're playing for a fun game, shooting people who haven't spoken yet is not exactly "fun"...
Also, one shouldn't assume rulebreaking, since rulebreaking is technically not part of the game lol. It's a dangerous way to approach the game.
I'm not making any assumptions. You're the one assuming he didn't break the rules. Technically if anyone is in the wrong here it's you lol
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
And yes it's possible we just gave him excellent WIFOM by defending him excessively but I blame you for being bloodthirsty and wanting to lynch because MM.exe stopped working
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
we should lynch everyone who says “pls do not shoot”
ok, not rly, but seriously WTF?!? anyways this does N0T MATTER!!!!
mm dropped from null to possible scum, note that he hasnt commented at all on channelminer! mm shud know why, so this is QUITE odd from MM
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
Yes, but I was basically a noob and tried a bad gambit. If I had done what Zeus said, I wouldn't have CC'd Crier and wouldn't have ruined things xD.
And yes, you always can play suboptimally, just like you always have a choice when you do anything: RADICAL FREEDOM! But if you want to achieve a goal that consists in winning the game, you shouldn't do that.
Distorted looked at it non-mechanically and tried to actually read you and did figure out you were town in the end, so this argument is invalid lol
Want to know who followed this policy Lynch gut "always Lynch anti-town"? Lenneth! What did he do? He lynched 2 townies in a row!
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
Most certainly not and I don't appreciate you repeating the same words as me and by the way you are still in my lynch pool
u P0CKET AND ATTAK ME AT THE SAME TIME, HMM
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
u P0CKET AND ATTAK ME AT THE SAME TIME, HMM
I'm not pocketing you. I hate how people are just dead set on this lynch because of "numbers". If they want that kind of certainty they should be playing Scrabble not Mafia
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
I'm not making any assumptions. You're the one assuming he didn't break the rules. Technically if anyone is in the wrong here it's you lol
I wasn't saying you shouldn't assume something, but rather that you should assume people are playing without cheating or straight up playing against their wincon intentionally. I'll grant you that I was unclear, though.
And I guess "but I thought the game was a troll game!!" is..... well, it's a shit defense, but it has some merit, considering the setup.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
And yes it's possible we just gave him excellent WIFOM by defending him excessively but I blame you for being bloodthirsty and wanting to lynch because MM.exe stopped working
You shouldn't. This is very informative, and I think you're honestly town thinking you can avoid a mislynch; if you're scum, I honestly fail to see why the heck you would put your own life at risk to defend him lol. Hell, you might even be right. But there is absolutely no world in which we can bring this guy to LYLO. And the nice thing with lynching him is that he cannot shoot us to avoid the lynch, meaning we get to see a standard-ish wagon.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
we should lynch everyone who says “pls do not shoot”
ok, not rly, but seriously WTF?!? anyways this does N0T MATTER!!!!
mm dropped from null to possible scum, note that he hasnt commented at all on channelminer! mm shud know why, so this is QUITE odd from MM
ChannelMiner is playing his first game, and the only thing he could say before you monster murdered Lag in cold blood was "hello my fellow Americans"...
I am so very glad the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution doesn't allow you to have more than one gun in this game
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
someone should just shoot me, i am town but this is madness . there’s so much wifom for what should be a fun setup
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
I wasn't saying you shouldn't assume something, but rather that you should assume people are playing without cheating or straight up playing against their wincon intentionally. I'll grant you that I was unclear, though.
And I guess "but I thought the game was a troll game!!" is..... well, it's a shit defense, but it has some merit, considering the setup.
You shouldn't. This is very informative, and I think you're honestly town thinking you can avoid a mislynch; if you're scum, I honestly fail to see why the heck you would put your own life at risk to defend him lol. Hell, you might even be right. But there is absolutely no world in which we can bring this guy to LYLO. And the nice thing with lynching him is that he cannot shoot us to avoid the lynch, meaning we get to see a standard-ish wagon.
Ceko can defend himself by trying to play the game like a townie. That will help us get a read on him.
If he does so satisfactorily we will not lynch him unless we literally have no targets. We have plenty of things to go around on, such as Martin, yourself and Zeus, neither of whom are particularly townie. Heck, from your perspectives even I can be scum. I'm pretty fucking sure I could say this as scum too, at least in the mod, where I always act towny irrespective of alignment (as Mafia I always bus my teammates if they're retarded. I'm not carrying dead weight and outing myself just cuz they got found out).
If through his interactions we become convinced he is scum then we will lynch him. But I am not policy lynching him just because.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
@rumox
will i be banned after this game?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
I wasn't saying you shouldn't assume something, but rather that you should assume people are playing without cheating or straight up playing against their wincon intentionally. I'll grant you that I was unclear, though.
And I guess "but I thought the game was a troll game!!" is..... well, it's a shit defense, but it has some merit, considering the setup.
You shouldn't. This is very informative, and I think you're honestly town thinking you can avoid a mislynch; if you're scum, I honestly fail to see why the heck you would put your own life at risk to defend him lol. Hell, you might even be right. But there is absolutely no world in which we can bring this guy to LYLO. And the nice thing with lynching him is that he cannot shoot us to avoid the lynch, meaning we get to see a standard-ish wagon.
You should not be making these kinds of assumptions if you want to win the game tho
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Also since you guys like game theory so much, Ceko has acted so anti-town that if we make it to LyLo and he is still alive and we are not sure who to lynch, there's a high likelihood he will be Mafia.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
Ceko can defend himself by trying to play the game like a townie. That will help us get a read on him.
If he does so satisfactorily we will not lynch him unless we literally have no targets. We have plenty of things to go around on, such as Martin, yourself and Zeus, neither of whom are particularly townie. Heck, from your perspectives even I can be scum. I'm pretty fucking sure I could say this as scum too, at least in the mod, where I always act towny irrespective of alignment (as Mafia I always bus my teammates if they're retarded. I'm not carrying dead weight and outing myself just cuz they got found out).
If through his interactions we become convinced he is scum then we will lynch him. But I am not policy lynching him just because.
Hmm
REALLY looks like oberon is mafia, hm?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
what is wrong with martin though?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
Ceko can defend himself by trying to play the game like a townie. That will help us get a read on him.
If he does so satisfactorily we will not lynch him unless we literally have no targets. We have plenty of things to go around on, such as Martin, yourself and Zeus, neither of whom are particularly townie. Heck, from your perspectives even I can be scum. I'm pretty fucking sure I could say this as scum too, at least in the mod, where I always act towny irrespective of alignment (as Mafia I always bus my teammates if they're retarded. I'm not carrying dead weight and outing myself just cuz they got found out).
If through his interactions we become convinced he is scum then we will lynch him. But I am not policy lynching him just because.
He doesn't really seem to be planning to play like a townie...
And sure, you could say this as scum, because absolute certainty with behavioral tells doesn't exist. RADICAL FREEDOM!!! Only mechanics can give absolute certainty. We don't have cop checks here, though, so we have to rely on behavioral tells. And here, I think you're town, whether you like it or not :evil:
also I am most obviously town :calix:
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
He doesn't really seem to be planning to play like a townie...
And sure, you could say this as scum, because absolute certainty with behavioral tells doesn't exist. RADICAL FREEDOM!!! Only mechanics can give absolute certainty. We don't have cop checks here, though, so we have to rely on behavioral tells. And here, I think you're town, whether you like it or not :evil:
also I am most obviously town :calix:
There are no mechanics to speak of in this game
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
Hmm
REALLY looks like oberon is mafia, hm?
No I was just thinking that I always act towny as a neutral evil so I then added "also as Mafia bc I bus my teammates to avoid associations"
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
There are no mechanics to speak of in this game
Exactly, which is why your "but this is all possible to do scum" stuff doesn't mean much: we have to work with uncertainty. The most certain things in this game are Ceko's shot being horribad and your defense of him being probably towny (arguably)
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
Exactly, which is why your "but this is all possible to do scum" stuff doesn't mean much: we have to work with uncertainty. The most certain things in this game are Ceko's shot being horribad and your defense of him being probably towny (arguably)
I disagree it being horribad means he is scum. I certainly don't think it's alignment indicative either way lol
Ceko's slot is so terrible though that we should leave him for last and look for "information" on real unknowns like the people I just mentioned
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
One game Paopan was scum and I defended him in spite of his stupidity. One game Paopan was town and I still defended him in spite of his stupidity.
What does this prove?
That stupidity does not one scum make.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
I disagree it being horribad means he is scum. I certainly don't think it's alignment indicative either way lol
Ceko's slot is so terrible though that we should leave him for last and look for "information" on real unknowns like the people I just mentioned
At best, he's a question mark we will never be able to trust, and that is exactly what we do NOT want to bring to LYLO...
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
At best, he's a question mark we will never be able to trust, and that is exactly what we do NOT want to bring to LYLO...
No, YOU are question marks. Ceko has done something extremely anti-town. With a person like Ceko you leave them around until LyLo in case other lynches don't flip scum, that way we can at least have a buffer if we fuck up.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
No, YOU are question marks. Ceko has done something extremely anti-town. With a person like Ceko you leave them around until LyLo in case other lynches don't flip scum, that way we can at least have a buffer if we fuck up.
That means you think Ceko is scum after all...? If so, then let's just lynch him RIGHT NOW and remove vote power from scum?
...
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
That means you think Ceko is scum after all...? If so, then let's just lynch him RIGHT NOW and remove vote power from scum?
...
Nope but if we have 0 scum deaths 3-4 days from now it will become much more likely that the guy who hammered town on d1 after 10 minutes was mafia
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theoneceko
someone should just shoot me, i am town but this is madness . there’s so much wifom for what should be a fun setup
This does sound pretty fake tho
Reminds me of what Mike said in his literal first post as evil one game
"carry me, I have no clue who it could be at this point"
Slaol was also in that game if
@Marshmallow Marshall
remembers
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mizery
hey guys
hi
CAN YOU PLEASE NOT COMMIT MURDER
Apart from this, thoughts on Ceko and the whole thing surrounding him?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
This does sound pretty fake tho
Reminds me of what Mike said in his literal first post as evil one game
"carry me, I have no clue who it could be at this point"
Slaol was also in that game if
@
Marshmallow Marshall
remembers
Oh god. No, I think I suppressed those memories xD.
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Why shouldn't i shoot martin
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
Oh god. No, I think I suppressed those memories xD.
#10
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mizery
Why shouldn't i shoot martin
Because murder is immoral
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mizery
Why shouldn't i shoot martin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
Because murder is immoral
^
And most importantly, because Ceko murdered Lag without letting them speak, which is horrible
Why would you shoot Martin if murder weren't immoral and anti-town at this point, though?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oberon
I don't see how it's the same, though. Mike was basically saying "pocket us and we will follow", whereas Ceko's post is basically self-contempt applied to Mafia lol
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
I don't see how it's the same, though. Mike was basically saying "pocket us and we will follow", whereas Ceko's post is basically self-contempt applied to Mafia lol
Yeah this is the feeling it gave me at the time, but after the fact I don't really see the similarity anymore lol
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
^
And most importantly, because Ceko murdered Lag without letting them speak, which is horrible
Why would you shoot Martin if murder weren't immoral and anti-town at this point, though?
I see word salads
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mizery
I see word salads
I'm glad we're in either of those words:
- I'm not dumb and Martin really prepared some word salad for us to eat
- We're both dumb :D
In all seriousness, though, what do you think he's trying to achieve?
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Re: S-FM 341: American Flag Nightless
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Marshmallow Marshall
I'm glad we're in either of those words:
- I'm not dumb and Martin really prepared some word salad for us to eat
- We're both dumb :D
In all seriousness, though, what do you think he's trying to achieve?
Dinner