S-FM Faust (7P or 9P)

S-FM St. Mildred's Horror
7P/9P
It is the year 1150. English knights have returned home from the Holy Land, carrying with them untold riches and the plundered wealth of the Levant. Rumours have it that the legendary Ark of the Covenant and even the Staff of Moses would be brought to England by the knights.
The Benedictine monks of the Isle of Thanet have been entrusted with caring for the Ark and other hallowed artifacts, and a handful of the more senior monks have formed a close-knit and secretive Brotherhood whose sole purpose is to guard the holy items. Of these monks, only one knows the true location of the shrine that holds these objects. Each of them holds part of a key that opens the Shrine.
Coveting the power of the Ark and the Staff for itself, an ancient Demon has awakened from its slumber and has assumed physical form as one of the monks, intending to find the staff and the ark and use them for horrific, unholy acts. Already a string of suspicious and gruesome murders have been reported on the Isle of Thanet. The Church, fearing the worst, has dispatched a God-fearing exorcist to assist the monks...

Spoiler : 1 Scum - Setup :

Role List
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Demon (Blackmailer)

Role Cards

Spoiler : Monk :

You are a Monk at St. Mildred's Priory.
You have no special abilities.

Spoiler : Demon :

You are a vile Demon masquerading as one of God's devout monks.
You may send a player an anonymous message at the end of the day phase (the action may be submitted at any time during the day phase) cursing them into executing a demand of yours on the penalty of death. The effects last for only one day.

Mechanics & Rules
Lynch is plurality w/ majority.
Last wills allowed.
The Demon's ability has the following restrictions:

Spoiler : Restrictions :

You are not allowed to blackmail someone into not posting, or into posting a certain number of times a day.
You are not allowed to restrict a player's ability to post, meaning you cannot force them to only post one specific message all day (but you can for example force them to post a certain message during the day).
You cannot demand more than two things at the same time.
You are not allowed to set conditions that imply a time limit.
You cannot restrict a player's ability to vote, apart from asking them not to vote another player.
You ARE allowed to force them to reveal their last will.
Your target is NOT allowed to reveal that they are blackmailed. They may soft-claim it however.
You CANNOT force a player to successfully lynch a target. You can ask them to push someone however.
You cannot blackmail someone more than twice in a row.
You cannot blackmail someone into claiming that they are currently blackmailed. You may however force them to say that they were, at one point, blackmailed.

Days last 48, or 24h if a majority is reached no more than 24h in.
There is no night phase.
Standard FM rules apply.
This means no quoting or SS'ing host feedback or PMs, no OGC,nogamethrowing/pretending to gamethrow, no griefing.
English only, etc
Minimum post count of 5 posts per day.


Wincons
Town wins when the Demon dies.
The Demon wins if they survive and no more than threetown are still alive.

Spoiler : 2-Scum Setup :

Role List
Exorcist
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Monk
Prince of Hell (Demon - Godfather)
Greater Demon (Demon)

Role Cards

Spoiler : Monk :

You are a Monk at St. Mildred's Priory.
You have no special abilities.

Spoiler : Exorcist :

You are a devout, God-fearing priest, sent to St. Mildred's Priory in light of the demonic taint haunting the Island.
You may protect a player from Demonic Curse, preventing them from suffering the ill-effects of a blackmail that night. Neither you nor the player who was blackmailed will be informed if a protection is successful (they will not receive the Blackmailer's message).

Spoiler : Demon :

You are a vile Demon masquerading as one of God's devout monks.
Factional Ability: Send a player an anonymous message at the end of the day phase (the action may be submitted at any time during the day phase) cursing them into executing a demand of your team's on the penalty of death. The effects last for only one day. Alternatively, you may forgo your factional ability to check a player at the end of the day. If they are the Exorcist, they will die. You share a day chat with the other demon. The Prince of Hell has the final say on the day action .

Mechanics & Rules
Lynch is plurality w/ majority.
Last wills allowed.
The Demon's ability has the following restrictions:

Spoiler : Restrictions :

You are not allowed to blackmail someone into not posting, or into posting a certain number of times a day.
You are not allowed to restrict a player's ability to post, meaning you cannot force them to only post one specific message all day (but youcan for example force them to post a certain message during the day).
You cannot demand more than two things at the same time.
You are not allowed to set conditions that imply a time limit.
You cannot restrict a player's ability to vote, apart from asking them not to vote another player.
You ARE allowed to force them to reveal their last will.
Your target is NOT allowed to reveal that they are blackmailed. They may soft-claim it however.
You CANNOT force a player to successfully lynch a target. You can ask them to push someone however.
You cannot blackmail someone more than twice in a row.
You cannot blackmail someone into claiming that they are currently blackmailed. You may however force them to say that they were, at one point, blackmailed.

Days last 48, or 24h if a majority is reached no more than 24h in.
There is no night phase.
Standard FM rules apply.
This means no quoting or SS'ing host feedback or PMs, no OGC,nogamethrowing/pretending to gamethrow, no griefing.
English only, etc
Minimum post count of 5 posts per day.


Wincons
Town wins when the Demons die.
If one Demon is still alive, they win if no more than three townies are still alive.
Otherwise, if two Demons are still alive, they win if no more than four townies are still alive.

@Marshmallow Marshall , @Damus_Graves , @AIVION please review, I can host this before blink's game just so we have a game going on (shouldn't take more than 8 days IRL)

First of all, thanks for making a setup that is clear and easy to read! It really helps the reviewing process, and allows for better comprehension from players.


Questions

What happens if the two Demons do not agree on who to blackmail, or on what the blackmail message should be? Please specify it in the setup.

How long does the blackmail last? I assume it lasts for a day, but please specify it.

Once the blackmail ends, can the target claim they were blackmailed? If so, how many details can they give on the orders that were given to them (paraphrasing, copypasting, general idea without more?)

Is the blackmail "Claim that you are (currently) blackmailed to do X" valid? Is the blackmail "Claim that you were blackmailed to do X" valid? If they are, what happens in the first case? Potential loophole.


Suggestions

Specifying the amount of players in the spoilers and the thread's title would allow people to see the setup's size easily.

The game has a low amount of power roles (which is very good and interesting), with a nice storyline that you already wrote. It would be great to have a game with a lot of lore/flavor in host posts when you have time for it. Obviously, this is only a suggestion to make the game more enjoyable; while it is not necessary, it would improve the experience.

Assuming blackmail lasts for a day, Demons can blackmail someone for the entire game, right? I believe a limit of two blackmails in a row to the same person should be set, to avoid someone's game being ruined by constant blackmails; two blackmailed days should be enough to create any effect demons would want to create.


Balance

7 Monks against 2 Demons with a permanent chat and a factional blackmail ability seems biased towards scum, because of the potential confusion created by coordinated scum who can manipulate townies in a quite small game.
This issue could probably be solved by adding a weak power role to Town, or by adding more Monks. If you choose to add a power role, here is a suggestion.

Protector : Can protect a player from demon blackmail for the next day. Has two charges that are consumed even if no blackmail was prevented.


@Magoroth

Thanks for the quick review! A few things first. Originally this setup had only one scum, however I felt that a one-scum game would be quite difficult and maybe not even enjoyable for the town. So I decided to add an extra Demon and a Monk.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall

First of all, thanks for making a setup that is clear and easy to read! It really helps the reviewing process, and allows for better comprehension from players.


Questions

1. What happens if the two Demons do not agree on who to blackmail, or on what the blackmail message should be? Please specify it in the setup.

2. How long does the blackmail last? I assume it lasts for a day, but please specify it.

3. Once the blackmail ends, can the target claim they were blackmailed? If so, how many details can they give on the orders that were given to them (paraphrasing, copypasting, general idea without more?)

4. Is the blackmail "Claim that you are (currently) blackmailed to do X" valid? Is the blackmail "Claim that you were blackmailed to do X" valid? If they are, what happens in the first case? Potential loophole.

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1. Err. Good question. I'm thinking of forcing them to reach a consensus before they submit their night action. Otherwise I'll just turn one Demon into a Godfather-esque role who has the final say on the factional.

2. It lasts for no more, and no less than a day.

3. Yes, they can. They're allowed to C/P. But not to quote/SS.

4. a) No, and good point. It shouldn't be valid because that might make the Blackmail ability a bit too scumsided (it would mean that someone who decides to go against the blackmail wouldn't effectively become confirmed town). b) Yes, that blackmail is totally valid, it does not break any rules and isn't *too* scumsided.

Quote:

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Suggestions

1. Specifying the amount of players in the spoilers and the thread's title would allow people to see the setup's size easily.

2. The game has a low amount of power roles (which is very good and interesting), with a nice storyline that you already wrote. It would be great to have a game with a lot of lore/flavor in host posts when you have time for it. Obviously, this is only a suggestion to make the game more enjoyable; while it is not necessary, it would improve the experience.

3. Assuming blackmail lasts for a day, Demons can blackmail someone for the entire game, right? I believe a limit of two blackmails in a row to the same person should be set, to avoid someone's game being ruined by constant blackmails; two blackmailed days should be enough to create any effect demons would want to create.

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1. Wildo
2. I'm planning to do that :)
3. Fair point, I'll take you up on this.

Quote:

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Balance

7 Monks against 2 Demons with a permanent chat and a factional blackmail ability seems biased towards scum, because of the potential confusion created by coordinated scum who can manipulate townies in a quite small game.
This issue could probably be solved by adding a weak power role to Town, or by adding more Monks. If you choose to add a power role, here is a suggestion.

Protector : Can protect a player from demon blackmail for the next day. Has two charges that are consumed even if no blackmail was prevented.

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Yeah I'm sort of afraid of it being too scumsided, hence all those restrictions on the blackmail. Last time I used this role, it was used as essentially a second nightkill (which is not what it's designed for). I like the idea of a protector tbh. Call it something like an Exorcist.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magoroth

Thanks for the quick review! A few things first. Originally this setup had only one scum, however I felt that a one-scum game would be quite difficult and maybe not even enjoyable for the town. So I decided to add an extra Demon and a Monk.



1. Err. Good question. I'm thinking of forcing them to reach a consensus before they submit their night action. Otherwise I'll just turn one Demon into a Godfather-esque role who has the final say on the factional.

2. It lasts for no more, and no less than a day.

3. Yes, they can. They're allowed to C/P. But not to quote/SS.

4. a) No, and good point. It shouldn't be valid because that might make the Blackmail ability a bit too scumsided (it would mean that someone who decides to go against the blackmail wouldn't effectively become confirmed town). b) Yes, that blackmail is totally valid, it does not break any rules and isn't *too* scumsided.

1. Wildo
2. I'm planning to do that :)
3. Fair point, I'll take you up on this.

Yeah I'm sort of afraid of it being too scumsided, hence all those restrictions on the blackmail. Last time I used this role, it was used as essentially a second nightkill (which is not what it's designed for). I like the idea of a protector tbh. Call it something like an Exorcist.

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1. Good idea for the Godfather. Hell, you could call it Satanfather... ;)

2. Good

3. They can copypaste but not quote? I assume you mean that using the quote feature that says "Originally posted by" is forbidden, am I mistaken here?

4. Ok, that answers it well. Please add restriction to the setup when you'll edit it


Suggestions part : Ok ok and ok lol


I've always been bad for finding good role names. And yes, it should work well now; the Protector will allow for more counterplays without removing the communication-only side of the setup. For the record, I had thought about adding a parity cop, too, but it would have been too strong for town and would have defeated the setup's point IMO.



Once the setup will have been edited to meet all the things we've discussed, mention me and I'll last check and approve it. @Magoroth

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marshmallow Marshall

1. Good idea for the Godfather. Hell, you could call it Satanfather... ;)

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1. Ya that's what I'll do. Haha yes, that sounds like something from the Omen lol

Quote:

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2. Good

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Quote:

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3. They can copypaste but not quote? I assume you mean that using the quote feature that says "Originally posted by" is forbidden, am I mistaken here?

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3. Yep

Quote:

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4. Ok, that answers it well. Please add restriction to the setup when you'll edit it

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Oh yoinks, I forgot to edit the 1 -scum setup restrictios

Quote:

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Suggestions part : Ok ok and ok lol


I've always been bad for finding good role names. And yes, it should work well now; the Protector will allow for more counterplays without removing the communication-only side of the setup. For the record, I had thought about adding a parity cop, too, but it would have been too strong for town and would have defeated the setup's point IMO.



Once the setup will have been edited to meet all the things we've discussed, mention me and I'll last check and approve it. @Magoroth

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[/QUOTE]
Sure sure

Oh, I just realized something. The Exorcist can claim without much fear, since the Demons have no way to kill if the blackmail is respected... I think they should have choice to sacrifice their blackmail to instead check a player to see if they are the Exorcist; if they are, they will die. This way, the Exorcist cannot claim, and the point of the setup without claims is conserved.

My bad for not realizing that earlier. @Magoroth what do you think about that

Fair. Not a bad idea, I’ll implement it

@Magoroth Friendly reminder that you made this setup, and that it is nearly finished! Please add what we discussed in the thread.

Bump; made you owner of the original post @Oberon

I added what we talked about. Ready for review.

- It'd be good to specify whether or not the blackmail has to pertain only to the very next day and not to the ones after (which I believe is the case). Same for the Exorcist's protection.

- The limitations for blackmail in the 1-scum setup are not updated. There's also a missing word making something potentially unclear: "You cannot blackmail someone more than twice in a row."

- I'd suggest adding an "etc." to the list of "standard FM rules" to cover things up if you intend to have the standard FM rules to be applied here, just so that players aren't confused.

As a player, I'm really excited to see how that plays out. The blackmailer mechanic is very interesting, it just doesn't fit well with a factional kill in standard-sized setups; this setup doesn't have that issue.

done! @Marshmallow Marshall
if everything else is fine, i'd like to host this soon :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Oberon

done! @Marshmallow Marshall
if everything else is fine, i'd like to host this soon :)

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Nice, approved. I'm adding this to the Mini S-FM Queue as a 9P. You may post signups whenever you're ready: you're next.

thank ya

Can you force someone to claim Demon multiple times in the one day?

Yes.

@Marshmallow Marshall I’ve updated the wincons a little. The demons need to reduce the humans’ number to the number of demons + 2 to win.
I would like to host this.

I'm correct? (Just making sure)

• Setup is nightless.
• Demon might not reach the deadline "at the end of the day phase" if majority Lynch early.
• "one day" is game day / not IRL day.
• Exorcist can claim immediately without repercussions.
• Demon could force a player to talk about nothing but cats for a day.
• In the 1 evil setup, because of Demon needing town to mislynch 3 times but can manipulate a single player 2 days in a row while D2 is the first day someone could be manipulated - the Demon could just himself talk about nothing but cats D2 and D3, leaving Town to just guess and not really "play" himself.

I personally find that the demons in the 2 evils setup could have not factional power but rather individual due to the ability being (imo) slightly underwhelming.

Edit: uncool

The Demons and the Exorcist can submit their actions at any point during the day.
Yes, one day lasts for 48h.
Nope, the demons have a night ability specifically for killing the Exorcist.
Yup, totally allowed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Oberon

Nope, the demons have a night ability specifically for killing the Exorcist.

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In that case, you made a typo:

Quote:

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Alternatively, you may forgo your factional ability to check a player at the end of the day. If they are the Exorcist, they will die. You share a day chat with the other demon.

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In mechanics, there's no mention of a night - only day lengths. I think that's an oversight if there's supposed to be a night.
I see no reason for a night tbh, not even the Demons have a night chat and all actions are to be submitted by the end of the day.

What you think of the idea allowing the Demons to submit a action pre-game, just so D1 is more interesting? :P

My bad, this setup is indeed nightless. Its a day ability.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Oberon

@Marshmallow Marshall I’ve updated the wincons a little. The demons need to reduce the humans’ number to the number of demons + 2 to win.
I would like to host this.

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That's basically a mislynch possibility down, though. In the 7P, it seems rather fair (two mislynches and a blackmail kill or three mislynches should make town lose especially with only one scum, so that's good), but in the 9P, the same applies (3 town deaths needed), except the scum have something that can be a direct kill (against the Exorcist) + they are two. Thoughts on balance? Note that I'm not straight up opposing it, but that can be discussed.

Also, this setup is pretty experimental; the prefix didn't exist when it was approved, but now it does, so I'm going to add it.
@Oberon