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The Tally
Jr4life24 (2) - Roflcopter, TheDarkestLight
Fatalis (1) -creedkingsx
Jr4life24 is L-2
Seems as though the old model was better, more aerodynamic but the new is just all flash.
TheDarkestLight, why did you not check Glip? I thought we had agreed on a set of actions. Your investigation result just wasted time and gave nothing to the town. You are now Consigliere in my eyes.
Since Roflcoptor was Roleblocked we have a consort present.
Mafia Roles: Consort/Consigliere/Mafioso
Failure to cooperate with town only hurts it in the long run. I had hoped you were a legitimate investigator TheDarkestLight. Even if there was a chance that Jr4Life24 could be framed, knowing what results he gave back would have been beneficial. It could confirm a framer or actually tell us his pairings. I think you are smart enough to know that and are giving us false results/useless results on purpose.
Since Damus_Graves was attacked that means a few things occured.
Scenario 1: The Killer who attacked Damus
Situation 1: Fatalis Vs. Jr4Life24 as the killer.
If Jr4Life241: Mafia fears that Fatalis really is the doctor. Doing this would change their target so that they can get a kill. 2: They know that Fatalis is not doctor since he is one of them. This leaves his option open to doctor since Jr4life24 is still alive and since no one followed him, he is the perfect candidate to perform the kill. 3: Fatalis is the doctor and Jr4life24 is the killer. No one followed him and he was going to be protected. The curious thing is why kill Damus over a doctor? Because Damus was confirmed and killing Fatalis would confirm his a doctor. Also they are not sure if he is citizen WIFOMING doctor or not, that is why they had TheDarkestLight investigate him to confirm his as doctor.
Situation Conclusion: Jr4Life24 is mafia. MintBerry or Creedkingsx is the Consort.
Situation 2: Mintberry Vs. Creedkingsx as the killer.
Since Roflcoptor was blocked that leaves the possibility as Mintberry or Creedkingsx as the killer. In this case Jr4Life24 is the presumed consort. That leaves the two rivals that claimed bodyguard as the killer. Personally I believe Mintberry over Creedkingsx. In this scenario if Creedkingsx is the killer, he chose to not kill TheDarkestLight because of 1 of 2 reasons. 1 - TheDarkestLight is his mafia buddy, 2 - TheDarkestLight was being protected by Mintberry. He chose to kill Damus because Fatalis is his mafia buddy and it would blow his cover if Jr4Life24 was dead or he believes Fatalis is the Doctor and did not want to confirm his role. If Mintberry is the killer he didn't want to confirm Fatalis as the doctor or he didn't want to kill his mafia buddy. (Jr4Life24) Either way not much is confirmed if Mintberry is the killer. If I was Mintberry, I would have killed Roflcoptor to set Creedkingsx up as a fake.
Situation Conclusion: Creedkingsx is the Killer and Jr4Life24 is the consort.
My theory: TheDarkestLight is the consigliere, he visited Fatalis to confirm he was not a citizen wifoming and is genuinely the doctor. The killer is Jr4Life24 and was sent to kill Damus. Jr4Life24 is also a Mafioso. Why? Because he claimed citizen that's why! I doubt there are 4 citizens and I am the last one. Beyond that, if TheDarkestLight is really the investigator he would appear as cit/mafioso. Now we get to Creedkingsx. If the other two roles are taken that leaves him with consort.
Theory: TheDarkestLight - Consigliere ; Creedkingsx - Consort ; Jr4Life24 - Mafioso
If TheDarkestLight is NOT consigliere.
Theory: Fatalis - Framer ; Creedkingsx/Mintberry - Mafioso/Consort ; Jr4Life24 - Mafioso/Consort
These scenarios and theories are what I find most likely out of all of the odds. I might revise and edit these theories after I see more contribution from the players but as it stands these are the most likely candidates for Mafia.
I think the theory with TheDarkestLight as mafia makes more sense. He claimed investigator and lurked a lot. He flew right under the radar. His target was Fatalis last night. That is a pathetic target that did NOT go along with the plan we had set to catch the mafia, it also help confirm him as a doctor to the mafia. Notice how Jr4Life24 pops up as suspicious in both theories and so does Creedkingsx. Personally I prefer to lynch Creedkingsx because he plays semi-smart as town like he is hiding something for plans at night. I'm still not opposed to a lynch on Jr4Life24.
Since no one claimed sheriff the only other investigative role would be investigator. Since there doesn't appear to be a framer (still possible) I think TheDarkestLight is possibly a consigliere. That would explain his actions and he doesn't get involved with the points pushed against Creedkingsx or Jr4Life24. Almost as if he doesn't want to defend them, but he doesn't want to help prosecute them. I would also expect a town investigator to be more active...
Roles List with TheDarkestLight as Consigliere
Detective - Roflcoptor
Bodyguard/Doctor - Fatalis
Vigilante - Damus_Graves
Bodyguard/Doctor - Mintberry
Citizen - Chane
Citizen - Brendan
Citizen - Chiller
Consigliere - TheDarkestLight
Consort - Creedkingsx/Jr4Life24
Mafioso - Creedkingsx/Jr4Life24
Likely Mafia: TheDarkestLight, Creedkingsx, Jr4Life24
With TheDarkestLight as Investigator
Detective - Roflcoptor
Bodyguard/Doctor - Fatalis/Mintberry
Investigator - TheDarkestLight
Vigilante - Damus_Graves
Citizen - Brendan
Citizen - Chane
Citizen - Chiller
Framer - Creedkingsx/Mintberry/Fatalis
Consort - Creedkingsx/Mintberry
Mafioso - Jr4Life24
Likely Mafia: Creedkingsx, Jr4Life24, Mintberry/Fatalis
Again, I will likely revise this based on what other users say and how they respond. This sums up all of my suspicions for now and what roles I think are likely in which scenarios. Either way I still support a lynch on Roflcoptor or Creedkingsx. Just remember Jr4Life24 is likely a mafioso while Creedkingsx has a shot at consort. If we can get Roflcoptor to follow more people it will benefit us more. An investigator is useless at this point. (Could be why there isn't one or why they let TheDarkestLight live)
TheDarkestLight also doubts the existence of 3 citizens, that is interesting seeing as 3 citizens makes a pretty balanced setup. If he was so doubtful of my claim, why didn't he investigate me over Fatalis? Red flags people. Red flags.
Creed voting on Fatalis makes me think he really is doctor.
I like how no matter what scenario, jr is still mafia.
I agree with this mostly. I think Creedkingsx is most likely scum out of others in his bracket. I don't I'm scum because I'm not. Jr4Life24 I can agree with as a high probability. For the fourth I am debating who to put there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roflcopter
If you need me to explain the theory and process I posted before, please let me know. The more discussion the better. It also gives scum more chances to slip up.
Yeah. Just speculation on my part, but that is where the details lead me. I doubt there is a 4th citizen with the roles we have present and I am 100% sure that my role is citizen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roflcopter
This also brings me to a good point. TheDarkestLight has not commented on how Jr4Life24 claimed citizen, yet he finds me suspicious for claiming it when he doubts there is more than 2. Why not point out the same thing to Jr4Life24? He did vote him though. But he should be pushing hard for his lynch if he truly believes what he said. It appears to me that he is reluctantly lynching his mafioso and keeping his consort alive (creedkingsx).
What makes you think jr is mafioso over consort?
I must say, that is quite the impressive wall of text.
I will admit I didn't read the whole thing, but I assure you I got the jist of it.
I probably read 75% anyway.
My question to you, Chiller, is who do YOU want to lynch?
fatalis, roflcopter, jr, or I?
Who do you think is the safest?
I assure you, my claim is completely legitimate.
My reason for wanting to lynch fatalis is, in fact, because of my claim. That coupled with the fact that fatalis was on of the last to claim anything. He has posted little and claims late.
Furthermore, he claims with a category that has been involved in 2 other people, like when a godfather claims citizen knowing there are 2 citizens still alive. It is the safest bet.
I recognize well off that we absolutely CANNOT afford a mislynch today, but I also recognize that if we don't lynch someone today, mafia wins. They have tie tomorrow unless we get lucky with our obnoxious amount of bodyguards and Doctors.
What about Mintberry? Why are you so dead set on Fatalis? Fatalis very well could be doctor while Mintberry is hiding as Bodyguard.
I have to say my top choices for lynching are Creedkingsx or Jr4Life24. I still would like for more discussion and to see night results/players reactions and input.
The only reason I would have to want to target mint is because we have the same role.
I have a lot more reasons to want fatalis for our lynch.
Because jr4life24 claimed citizen. I had suspected creed to be either framer or consort but now that there is a consort I am leaning towards that. Also if TheDarkestLight is consigliere then he would be willing to sacrifice his mafioso over his consort. Hence his vote for jr4life24.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roflcopter
Do elaborate.Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
Already did. :|Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
:P
Why was I included on the list of who you want to lynch today creed, do you believe I am scum?
It seemed that you had more reasons than the ones you provided. The one's you supplied are weak.Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
To sum up your reasoning is because of 'your claim' as vigilante and then bodyguard. Coupled with him being the last one to claim. (Technically Jr4Life24 was the last one to claim.) If you follow your own logic, you should want Jr4life24 dead. He was the last to claim and claimed the least likely role. He fits your "Godfather claiming citizen" scenario better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roflcopter
I was referring this paragraph.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
Ah. Typo. So many names going through my head. I meant to say Jr4Life24 or Creedkingsx. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
Creed, who do you think are the 3 mafia?
That was just an example, but you aren't necessarily town either. You have no way to support your claim, and you know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
Albeit you massive wall of text is something most scum wouldn't commit time to making so it is probably to say you are, but there are still a dedicated few, such as our own clementine, who has and would. In fact, if clementine were mafia in this game, I imagine her playing the exact same way you are right now.
Leading the town, focusing every single eye anywhere else but herself while leaving subtle clues that puts the idea of her being town into everyone's subconscious.
But hey, this is just a big game of the mind, isn't it? ;)
Oh I knwo what you meant, silly. Was wondering how long it would take for someone to realize it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
But at least you know I read it. ;)
@rofl fatalis, TDL, chiller, mint, Jr
I normally would say you as well, but your role-block claim, while relatively easy to fake, is the only support we have for the mafia even paying attention to this game and plus no counter detective/lookout claim makes you confirmed town in my eyes apart from myself.
Creed, which of the THREE, not FIVE do you think are mafia atm.
Btw, I know it should be obvious, but I feel I should clarify it anyway, I targeted roflcopter.
This is obvious, but I feel like someone were harmfully bash me for not stating it.
I currently cannot decide that.
I have an odd suspicion Chiller is clem's smurf which makes me hesitant to decide on Jr or Chiller.
I know there is no way to confirm me. There is no possibly way except for my death. But I think my input has definitely hindered the mafia. I narrowed their choices to kill between either me or Damus. (Granted they could pick someone else, but that would hurt more than help.)Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
If you are suggesting that I am Clementine, you are wrong. If you are suggesting I am scum read the first sentence I wrote and everything else I have contributed.
It is a game of the mind. Much better than chess.
So your reasoning is just an example and not a real reason? I am confused. I thought that you said that claiming something less likely or something was more important. Well Jr4Life24 claimed something way more fitting for your logic than Fatalis. Could you explain how Fatalis fits your logic better than Jr4Life24?
Good choices. I wonder why you still want Fatalis dead over Jr4Life24 if you agree with everyone else on the matter.Quote:
fatalis, TDL, chiller, mint, Jr
No way to prove and if you are telling the truth you could still be that consort I believe you to be. You wouldn't be lying now would you?Quote:
Btw, I know it should be obvious, but I feel I should clarify it anyway, I targeted roflcopter.
This is obvious, but I feel like someone were harmfully bash me for not stating it.
I know pairing don't follow exactly but if Rofl is a Det and the Mafia has a consort wouldn't those be conflicting, Janitor goes with Det and Consort goes with escort, I feel asthough Rofl is town but I can't wrap my head around how Det is his role.
@Chiller I think Creed is trying to say Fatalis>Jr because Jr just started this day causing him to claim "immediatly" because of Glip's afking while Fatalis waited till end of the day he was in to claim a role.
Welcome. Please read to catch up. There hasn't been an investigative result saying that Roflcoptor isn't detective...If you mean that there has to be a Janitor if there is a Detective, where did you get that information? There is no necessity to have any role involved. A consort can be present without an escort..Quote:
Originally Posted by MintBerry Crunch
to be fair, seeing you now, you and damus, both, are more valuable to the town than any of us townPR's, except maybe myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
No offense to the rest of you, but you are still learning. I expected it to be me dead today, but if not me then I expected Damus to be dead. I imagine the only reason I am not dead is because the fear of wifom of either mint or fatalis protecting me, whichever is legit about their role.
The specification of the role of godfather and citizen was an example, the reasoning otherwise. Shouldn't be that difficult. :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
there are further meta reasons on fatalis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
Unfortunately, Glip has not been talking in any games lately so it was impossible to attempt any meta on him. I feel more comfortable with a lynch on fatalis. We have only 1 shot to get this right, so I am choosing the shot that makes me feel the more comfortable.
If I were Consort attempting to claim bodyguard, I would have to be pretty stupid to choose my fake target as the same with my real target.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
So no, not lying. ^.^
If you were doctor would you want to claim that right away? If there wasn't a mass role-claim revealing as doctor is suicide. However, I am not saying he is clean from all suspicion.Quote:
Originally Posted by MintBerry Crunch
If you want me to lynch Jr, I need to feel comfortable with it. At a time like this where it is literally make or break, everyone has to feel 100% sure on who to lynch.
I know it isn't necessary but I was looking at the pairings on Appley's set-up and it has escort/consort paired togther and also Detective/lookout/Janitor paired together. I was more wondering if the pairings that Appley listed were just as a generality or more of a concrete combination where one is needed for the other (I am newer to FMs)Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiller
The pairings are in Appley's sig to check them out.
Still applies to what happened though. Just coincidentally it was citizen in the example and the reality of the claim.Quote:
The specification of the role of godfather and citizen was an example, the reasoning otherwise. Shouldn't be that difficult. :P
Meta gaming isn't always a safe thing to do. So you feel comfortable lynching someone with hardly any reason to lynch compared to others? Interesting..Quote:
there are further meta reasons on fatalis.
Unfortunately, Glip has not been talking in any games lately so it was impossible to attempt any meta on him. I feel more comfortable with a lynch on fatalis. We have only 1 shot to get this right, so I am choosing the shot that makes me feel the more comfortable.
It's all a mind game remember? What would appear to be stupid could act as a good cover. Just like you said with the Godfather example. :)Quote:
If I were Consort attempting to claim bodyguard, I would have to be pretty stupid to choose my fake target as the same with my real target.
So no, not lying.
Plus if you legitimately targeted him as consort, you still visited your target and there would be no way to track anything else. Therefore, it wouldn't be a stupid move to target your actual target.
I think thoughts are getting mixed up in here.
Looks like good cop bad cop. Say I'm scummy then say I am valuable. Haha. Damus was useful. He took a bullet for a town PR. A confirmed town PR would be nice though. (He was already confirmed as vigilante so I am overlooking that. He was also essentially a citizen.) So it was a neutral kill for both sides. (Besides the fact that the scum is one step closer to majority) Perhaps they didn't target you because 1: It would "confirm you as bodyguard" and leave mintberry to be thrown under the bus. 2: you are their mafia buddy. 3: the mafia realized they could only target me or Damus_Graves without risking getting caught.Quote:
to be fair, seeing you now, you and damus, both, are more valuable to the town than any of us townPR's, except maybe myself.
No offense to the rest of you, but you are still learning. I expected it to be me dead today, but if not me then I expected Damus to be dead. I imagine the only reason I am not dead is because the fear of wifom of either mint or fatalis protecting me, whichever is legit about their role.
The pairings are strictly relevant to Investigators.
Those are investigative results. If one role on one side is in the game, the other is not required to be in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by MintBerry Crunch
Yeah, I think we are having some communication problems, let's start over.
Hi, I am creed, I am a bodyguard.
I targeted rofl, think we should lynch anyone except rofl, and of course myself, and and I enjoy the occasional walk on the beach.
I never said you were scummy, but have fun with the word twisting.
I explored the option of you as scum and you as town. Both through the eyes of a town and through the eyes of the mafia, respectively.
Going by today, mafia would be likely to want you dead because you are leading the town, making active decisions and encouraging conversation.
Through the skeptical town eye, you look like the rare case of a mafia who is willing to take the big gambit and lead the town completely diverting all attention away from with the only reason being, basically, meta. Something you just said is bad and you shouldn't base decisions off.
So let's backtrack for a moment, why do you think Tdl, Jr, I or anyone else are mafia if not for meta reasons?
Oh, and what's your name? We are starting over, in fact. ;)
What a great way to try and get off topic.Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
You have hinted that you thought of me as scum. Which is natural. I was just pointing out that either you were still deciding on what to think of me or you are just changing positions.
I welcome death. If they have the guts to come and kill me, they should go for it. Last night they had 2 choices, me or Damus. I believe that they chose Damus because he was confirmed, unprotected, and would provide the least information to town. If they killed me, I would take up the third citizen spot and add to the confirmed list. There is also the possibility someone deviated and would protect me. (Which you should never do)
Point out where I have given meta gaming as a reason for lynch or prosecuting someone as scum. I do not know any of you so I can not use outside of game information to call on. Each game is unique and players can change play styles. Relying on past games to prove current games is faulty and not as solid of a tactic as one should think.
My name? Chiller.
Also you have still failed to provide sufficient evidence for your lynch. The only valid reasons you have provided is interpreting a late claim as something scummy and meta gaming. Don't try and direct this discussion elsewhere. Insignificant discussion should not take place today. (Nor any other day) If you would please trim the fat in your paragraphs from now on, I would greatly appreciate it.
All discussion is significant.
Like I said, he is claiming into a category that 2 other people are involved with.
Odds are, one of us are Framer.
Odds are, either you or Jr are lying about the Citizen claim.
Odds are the last mafia is either TDL or of mint, fatalis and I.
So mafia for me goes like this, through the eyes of the average townsperson:
Framer/w.e- Fatalis/Mint/I
Consig/w.e- TDL/mint/fatalis/I.
Mafioso- Chiller/Jr
He claimed late into something that had 2 other people claiming from the category that were alive.
He claimed later than anyone else.
He has rarely posted, as is.
He claim, to start with is weak. He chose something that can't be proven.
You realize there IS a consort, not a framer and consig..Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
hmm
Can mafia have 3 PR's? does there have to be a mafioso?
brb checking setup.
Mafia role cards:
The Mafia can kill once a night
The Mafia will have a night chat
Mafioso
Can kill at night
Consort
Can roleblock someone
Can kill instead
Consigliere
Check one person for their investigative pairings
Can kill instead
Framer
Can frame anyone as any role
Can kill instead
Janitor
Has two cleanings.
Can clean someone at night, if they die if they die, you will receive their last will.
Can kill instead.
I don't think they have to have a mafioso.O.o
:/
hmm
Just to be sure
Is Mafioso a definite role?
No. Mafioso is not. It just fits the balance of the setup. There could certainly be a framer in place of the mafioso, but that doesn't really change our situation. The framer would be useless and essentially a mafioso if TheDarkestLight was consigliere. So I believe that there is more likely a mafioso. In that regard it really doesn't matter. What we need to focus on is the consort. You do like to appear active and helpful by providing that information though creed.
In light of new perspective, this is how I change it around.Quote:
Originally Posted by creedkingsx
It's nto a question of consig/consort
There IS. IS. IS. A consort.
>>
<<
>>
I know, just listing it out.
I would also like to point out that it takes 4 to lynch someone. After one town votes someone incorrectly the mafia can just train on him and win. The fact that this hasn't happened to Jr4Life24 yet just adds to likelihood of him being mafia. Of course some mafia might bandwagon on their teammate to appear unsuspicious. If Creedkingsx is in fact mafia, it would still make sense for him to promote the lynch on Fatalis to divide the votes and to get a townie to vote so the scum can hammer. His mafia buddies won't want to vote with him right away but would like to do it after convincing someone else to join him. I'm surprised the mafia isn't trying to direct a vote towards someone by actively being involved in the day chat. I guess they are waiting on me to take on that role. The lack of activity from this game is really disheartening. It seems that Roflcoptor, Creedkingsx, and I are going to be the ones that contribute the most.
The nonchalant attitude that Creedkingsx also took when voting Fatalis makes me believe he is mafia. If he was town, he just put someone up for a quick lynch. Since there are 3 mafia all they have to do is train. I would assume that he would be smarter than that. He has proven himself to be intelligent, yet somehow he isn't making the best decisions for town. This keeps telling me that he is scum.
It will take a great effort to get someone lynched correctly. The whole town has to have a consensus or a mafia member will try to take a gambit on clearing himself by voting with the town and projecting another town member as mafia.
My current debate: Should we lynch Creedkingsx or Jr4Life24?
Both are likely mafia. I think Creedkingsx has a greater chance of being the Consort, but I get the feeling the majority of you believe that Jr4Life24 has a better chance of being mafia than Creedkingsx. If we lynch Jr4Life24 I think he will flip Mafioso (Useless Framer) or Consort. If we lynch Creedkingsx I think he will flip Consort.
I think I would like to vote Creedkingsx, but I will not do so yet. I would like to hear the thoughts of the community before placing an official vote.