S-FM Lady Gaga (10P)

[Gyrlander]

S-FM Lady Gaga

Roles List:

Lady Gaga

Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater
Hater

Role Cards:

Lady Gaga: You're Lady Gaga, the Queen of Pop. When you're alone you are able to transform a Hater into your new fan at night! You share a Day & Night Chat with your Fan.

Lady Gaga's Fan: At night, you can conduct a ritual to make a Hater become Lady Gaga's Fan. However, your soul is used in the process, so you die at the same time. You share a Day & Night Chat with Lady Gaga (YOU'RE PRIVILEGED!!)

Hater: You hate Lady Gaga. (Disgusting...)

Win Conditions:

Lady Gaga's Team: Make sure that no Haters exist or that nothing will prevent this. (2v2 situation)

Haters: Murder Lady Gaga.

Mechanics:

Days last 48 hours, or until someone is lynched with 51% of the votes.
Nights last 24 hours.

Rules of Conduct:

1. No OGC (out of game communication)
2. Insults are alright, but don't be extreme.
3. Don't quote PMs.
4. English only.
5. Be active. Being active also means contributing to the game. Host has total discretion about this.
6. Images and videos are allowed, but don't spam them.
7. No excessive use of unrelated posts.
8. Threatened, attempted, or faked gamethrows are prohibited and will result in force replace, modkill or agressive warn at the host's discretion.
9. Don't spam excessively

[MattZed]

/presign

[Stealthbomber16]

Can the death description for lady gaga being lynched just be her jumping from the roof of a football stadium and then she falls to the ground because someone cut the rope?

Also this is essentially bio-med industries.

Still gonna prolly sign for it if I'm around to play it.

[Gyrlander]

Can the death description for lady gaga being lynched just be her jumping from the roof of a football stadium and then she falls to the ground because someone cut the rope?

Also this is essentially bio-med industries.

Still gonna prolly sign for it if I'm around to play it.

I'll try, but no promises.

I just checked what the hell that FM was and decided mine is 50% more balanced and simple.

And don't dare to compare Lady Gaga with another thing again, YOU HEAR ME???

:calix:

[yzb25]

lady gaga should lose if her fan dies not her cuz then she loses her source of attention and realizes shes shit . . . she doesnt care if she dies as long as shes popular lol the dumb biitttchh . . .

-A Lady Gaga Hater.

[/presign]

[Cryptonic]

Gyrlander
sup bb u rdy

[Gyrlander]

Gyrlander
sup bb u rdy

I confirm I'm prepared to start the new chapter of FM history.

[ika]

i feel like this game is jsut gonna be like my cult game where the recuit shoudl jsut pick people who scum read the scums and just mauipulate the chat form there

[Gyrlander]

i feel like this game is jsut gonna be like my cult game where the recuit shoudl jsut pick people who scum read the scums and just mauipulate the chat form there

Fans end dying, so that wouldn't be very smart if there's someone that could connect the converts with the scum-reads.

This setup is hard for Lady Gaga.

[PowersThatBe]

/sign/presign

[ika]

Fans end dying, so that wouldn't be very smart if there's someone that could connect the converts with the scum-reads.

This setup is hard for Lady Gaga.

what im saying is that a skilled leader would use the fan to convert someone who scum read the true (lady gaga themselfs) scum and mimic what i did. use the scum reads for you so when they die it turns into the argument of "why did their reads not change"

i feel like its more scum sided overall if the fan converts all the time and if the fan gets lynch that a new hater jsut becomes a fan. if there was a one night cooldown i would consider it slightly more ballanced overall otherwise i feel like its jsut cult game +1 scum

thats jsut me though

[Gyrlander]

what im saying is that a skilled leader would use the fan to convert someone who scum read the true (lady gaga themselfs) scum and mimic what i did. use the scum reads for you so when they die it turns into the argument of "why did their reads not change"

i feel like its more scum sided overall if the fan converts all the time and if the fan gets lynch that a new hater jsut becomes a fan. if there was a one night cooldown i would consider it slightly more ballanced overall otherwise i feel like its jsut cult game +1 scum

thats jsut me though

I don't know... I would have to hear more people's thoughts cause I still think that if someone is smart and Lady Gaga plays in a predictable she's screwed. + it only requires a correct lynch for town to win.

[ika]

I don't know... I would have to hear more people's thoughts cause I still think that if someone is smart and Lady Gaga plays in a predictable she's screwed. + it only requires a correct lynch for town to win.

that was the same thing with my cult game and you saw how that ended up.

also your mechanics seem to contradict each other


Days last 48 hours, or until someone is lynched with 51% of the votes.
There is NO majority vote.

if you mean its plurality it should eb clarified becasue the top seems to be contradicting the bottom

[Gyrlander]

that was the same thing with my cult game and you saw how that ended up.

also your mechanics seem to contradict each other



if you mean its plurality it should eb clarified becasue the top seems to be contradicting the bottom

Yeah, but in your game cult leader could have 2 conversions and they don't suicide like in here >>

Fixed the mechanics thing, pretty sure I copied them from somewhere else incorrectly

[ika]

Yeah, but in your game cult leader could have 2 conversions and they don't suicide like in here >>

Fixed the mechanics thing, pretty sure I copied them from somewhere else incorrectly

it follows the same core concepts is what im saying pointing at.

there are some diffrences yes, but it has the same overall concepts of how scums should be playing in this said game

you must also account for the fact that they dont need to sacrafice either and could jsut play this as 2v6 and only recruit if the non-leader gets lynched, hecne why i suggeest a 1 night cooldown: to punish scum for playing poorly or using ability to take away town

[ika]

cus worst case for town plays as follows

6v2
myslynch
5v2
recuit
4v2: mylo
lynching non-lady gaga
4v1
recuit
3v2
still must lynch lady and lynchign the fan means scum wins by recuit so argubly bussing is much more viable in the mylo/lylo situation

[Gyrlander]

it follows the same core concepts is what im saying pointing at.

there are some diffrences yes, but it has the same overall concepts of how scums should be playing in this said game

you must also account for the fact that they dont need to sacrafice either and could jsut play this as 2v6 and only recruit if the non-leader gets lynched, hecne why i suggeest a 1 night cooldown: to punish scum for playing poorly or using ability to take away town

Okey, I either changed my mind now or wrote it incorrectly when I made the setup, but I want the fan to die the following night even if he doesn't get lynched. It is mandatory and I changed it to be so.

[ika]

give me a half hr to relook at it with that i need to think i feel like its still scum sided with the recuit every night becasue town can still lose for lynching correctly and IMO thats unfair

town should have some sort of bost/scum nerf for lynchign the fan and not just be like "HA YOU LYNCHED WRONG NEW RECRUIT"

[PowersThatBe]

I think the fact the fan has to suicide is balanced enough.

[ika]

i think the best way to make it less scum sided to that if fan gets lynched that lady gaga must wait one night before making a new fan.

otherwise there is almost no insentive to even defend the scum buddy and probally and argubly better to jsut bus them

[Gyrlander]

I feel like if I make it so that lady gaga has to wait 1 night to convert again it would be extremely town sided. And I want Lady Gaga to have a considerable chance of winning >>

[PowersThatBe]

Gyrlander correct me if wrong but the most teammates gaga could have are two. If I'm wrong the most she could have is 1. Yeah she gets one every time someone dies but she's essentially alone all game if she decides to use meat shields everyday.

[ika]

I feel like if I make it so that lady gaga has to wait 1 night to convert again it would be extremely town sided. And I want Lady Gaga to have a considerable chance of winning >>

i feel like without that it is overly scum sided by the fact that town can correctly lynch scum (the fan) and lose off of mechanics.

town should be rewarded for lynching scum not punished

also you have to look at it numberwise

day1: 2v6
night 1: myslynch+recuit
day 2: 2v4: mylo

so even at this point if they do lynch the fan it is scum sided in teh sense that after that it becomes 3v2 and even then they now need all 3 towns voting the CORRECT scum becasue lynching fan = recruit and win

so i feel like that its punishing town for playing correctly and thats my issue. im gonan sign anyways but iirc fm staff is suppose to be looking into issue like these and addressing it.

if you think its too town sided to have such thing how about you pitch on why becasue i have explained sevral times why its scum sided as is. or refute on why the math as shown above for town is ok

[Gyrlander]

Gyrlander correct me if wrong but the most teammates gaga could have are two. If I'm wrong the most she could have is 1. Yeah she gets one every time someone dies but she's essentially alone all game if she decides to use meat shields everyday.

Lady Gaga can only have 1 teammate at the same time.

[Gyrlander]

kk. Now Lady Gaga starts alone. That gives town another lynch :)

[ika]

kk. Now Lady Gaga starts alone. That gives town another lynch :)

ok so you made cult of zed 2.0 with even more oped cult.

i feel like your missing my point so maybe an fm staff can look at the setup and tell you in different words that town should not be able to lose for lynching scum in a potential 3v2 secnario

[PowersThatBe]

ok so you made cult of zed 2.0 with even more oped cult.

i feel like your missing my point so maybe an fm staff can look at the setup and tell you in different words that town should not be able to lose for lynching scum in a potential 3v2 secnario

How is this more op? Gaga can only recruit one person at a time, and now starts w/o a teammate. Weren't you the one that said the game is all about scum hunting? Lol

I think the original way you had it was fine. Having Gaga start alone is good too.

Outside of that forcing Gaga to only have one teammate is great bc they can suicide or not and it gives them versatility!

[ika]

How is this more op? Gaga can only recruit one person at a time, and now starts w/o a teammate. Weren't you the one that said the game is all about scum hunting? Lol

I think the original way you had it was fine. Having Gaga start alone is good too.

Outside of that forcing Gaga to only have one teammate is great bc they can suicide or not and it gives them versatility!

werent you also the one who did the math in cult of zed about how trying to lynch one scum has something like 11% chance? and that it was scum sided on math alone? is this any diffrent?

lady gaga isnt forced to have a teammate. adding the teammate only makes it more oped in the sense that you can lynch the fan all day long town still loses by lynching the wrong scum come lylo

so my point is this: why is town being punished for scum hunting or playing well?

[ika]

also you seemed ot have missed how the fan card worked lol

[PowersThatBe]

werent you also the one who did the math in cult of zed about how trying to lynch one scum has something like 11% chance? and that it was scum sided on math alone? is this any diffrent?

lady gaga isnt forced to have a teammate. adding the teammate only makes it more oped in the sense that you can lynch the fan all day long town still loses by lynching the wrong scum come lylo

so my point is this: why is town being punished for scum hunting or playing well?

I didn't miss anything unless gyro changed it.

My numbers were based on the scum gaining more and more teammates. In this game the town is shedding teammates.

youre not playing well if you're mislynching. Everyone but Gaga is a mislynch.

[Gyrlander]

How is this more op? Gaga can only recruit one person at a time, and now starts w/o a teammate. Weren't you the one that said the game is all about scum hunting? Lol

I think the original way you had it was fine. Having Gaga start alone is good too.

Outside of that forcing Gaga to only have one teammate is great bc they can suicide or not and it gives them versatility!

Gaga's fan WILL ALWAYS suicide. It is not optional.

[ika]

I didn't miss anything unless gyro changed it.

My numbers were based on the scum gaining more and more teammates. In this game the town is shedding teammates.

youre not playing well if you're mislynching. Everyone but Gaga is a mislynch.

that also follows the same logic does it not? town is still losing more and more so the math should not be all that diffrent

the fan isnt a myslynch nor should it be considered one. its a scum because its not aligned to town so it leads back to the orginal question:

why is town being punished for lynching scum?

[ika]

Gaga's fan WILL ALWAYS suicide. It is not optional.

^this :P

[Gyrlander]

werent you also the one who did the math in cult of zed about how trying to lynch one scum has something like 11% chance? and that it was scum sided on math alone? is this any diffrent?

lady gaga isnt forced to have a teammate. adding the teammate only makes it more oped in the sense that you can lynch the fan all day long town still loses by lynching the wrong scum come lylo

so my point is this: why is town being punished for scum hunting or playing well?

Lady Gaga needs to have another way of winning than just converting 1 person forever. Making it so that they will suicide the following night, Lady Gaga can use the fan as a way of protecting herself and making people not pay attention to her own scumness. (?)

This can be countered, for example, if town leaves someone who is REALLY scummy for the next day and if he doesn't suicide then he's either Lady Gaga or Town.

[ika]

Lady Gaga needs to have another way of winning than just converting 1 person forever. Making it so that they will suicide the following night, Lady Gaga can use the fan as a way of protecting herself and making people not pay attention to her own scumness. (?)

This can be countered, for example, if town leaves someone who is REALLY scummy for the next day and if he doesn't suicide then he's either Lady Gaga or Town.

thats not the point im adressing gyr, if people keep lynching the fan they will lose off the fact that they are playing what is objectively correct (lynching scum). it should not be the fans job to play "mayrter" to gaga herself as a defense. it should be that if they play scummy they get lynched

the later argument is just basically saying town is gonna circle talk themselves and should just lynch the player in question to begin with. leaving it to the "oh let them suicide" is really bad play because at that point you might as well go "HEY GUYS IM FAN IM GONNA SPAM POST YOU ALL NOW" or encourage scum to play scummy when they should be playing townie

[PowersThatBe]

thats not the point im adressing gyr, if people keep lynching the fan they will lose off the fact that they are playing what is objectively correct (lynching scum). it should not be the fans job to play "mayrter" to gaga herself as a defense. it should be that if they play scummy they get lynched

the later argument is just basically saying town is gonna circle talk themselves and should just lynch the player in question to begin with. leaving it to the "oh let them suicide" is really bad play because at that point you might as well go "HEY GUYS IM FAN IM GONNA SPAM POST YOU ALL NOW" or encourage scum to play scummy when they should be playing townie

I don't think the fan should HAVE to suicide. I think it should be two against the world and if the fan dies or suicides they can recruit someone else.

Ika they don't kill at night, and they can only recruit one person at a time. It is much different than cult of zed because you were MLing then someone was converted. So tow was bleeding members very quickly. This is a very slow slow burn, in which town has a chance to find Gaga. Much different.

[ika]

I don't think the fan should HAVE to suicide. I think it should be two against the world and if the fan dies or suicides they can recruit someone else.

Ika they don't kill at night, and they can only recruit one person at a time. It is much different than cult of zed because you were MLing then someone was converted. So tow was bleeding members very quickly. This is a very slow slow burn, in which town has a chance to find Gaga. Much different.

i think your missing the rolecard again

when fan dies a new one (aka town) will take its place so if anything town is being eaten faster

have you read the fan rolecard?

edit: so again my point is this:

a fan is considered scum, even with the removal of sucide mechanics the fan should always sac itself into a new town making it burn just as quick

i mean i asked for the math of this game so how about you do that and show me math stats and show me how ballanced it is to hit gaga

[Gyrlander]

I'm going to make the ritual optional. That way, town may even have another lynch if Lady Gaga prefers to play the Flawless Win.

[PowersThatBe]

i think your missing the rolecard again

when fan dies a new one (aka town) will take its place so if anything town is being eaten faster

have you read the fan rolecard?

Yeah I saw that, but the fan HAS to DIE before the Gaga can take a towny. In cult no cult had to die to get another cult. So I think it's balanced that you're not gaining multiple teammates. This puts it on the town to get the right lynch.

I didn't miss that lol

[Gyrlander]

Interesting that Setup Workshop doesn't appear on the New Post thing.

[ika]

I'm going to make the ritual optional. That way, town may even have another lynch if Lady Gaga prefers to play the Flawless Win.

that seems mostly pointless unless they are being widely scum read.

its still not adressing the issue of 3v2 where you can maryter your scum buddy and win which has been my issue all along


Yeah I saw that, but the fan HAS to DIE before the Gaga can take a towny. In cult no cult had to die to get another cult. So I think it's balanced that you're not gaining multiple teammates. This puts it on the town to get the right lynch.

I didn't miss that lol

that does not refute my issue of what i am saying that town can play correctly and still lose and town should not be able to lose on that.

im still waiting on the math of it all form you scince you are arguing its so ballanced

[Gyrlander]

that seems mostly pointless unless they are being widely scum read.

its still not adressing the issue of 3v2 where you can maryter your scum buddy and win which has been my issue all along



that does not refute my issue of what i am saying that town can play correctly and still lose and town should not be able to lose on that.

im still waiting on the math of it all form you scince you are arguing its so ballanced

This is like Jester. Town has to adapt, or perish.

[PowersThatBe]

i think your missing the rolecard again

when fan dies a new one (aka town) will take its place so if anything town is being eaten faster

have you read the fan rolecard?

edit: so again my point is this:

a fan is considered scum, even with the removal of sucide mechanics the fan should always sac itself into a new town making it burn just as quick

i mean i asked for the math of this game so how about you do that and show me math stats and show me how ballanced it is to hit gaga

Sure I just got off work but you could run the numbers yourself.

It's still 11% day 1.

14% day 2 28% of vote

20% day 3 40% of vote

Day 4 game should be over if Gaga is successful

They'll never have enough votes until day 4 to be able to control the lynches. Which is drastically different from cult of zed.

Honestly, make it an 11 or 13 person game and it self balances

[ika]

This is like Jester. Town has to adapt, or perish.

thats the thing your not listening to. it should not be treated as a jester. it should be treated as scum

if you want it to be a jester you should make it not count towards wincon of LG. having it count towards wincon makes it a non-jester role and a scum role and in turns makes it scum sided that it can be lynched and town will lose off that

ive asked you before and will ask again: if you think its fine as is or ballanced or town sided or whatever adress my issue on why tonw should eb allowed to lose in 3v2 for lynchign the fan.

the simple quesiton translated is this: why should town lose for playing right?

[ika]

Sure I just got off work but you could run the numbers yourself.

It's still 11% day 1.

14% day 2 28% of vote

20% day 3 40% of vote

Day 4 game should be over if Gaga is successful

They'll never have enough votes until day 4 to be able to control the lynches. Which is drastically different from cult of zed.

Honestly, make it an 11 or 13 person game and it self balances

its a one day diffrence overall

does this math also account for the fact that lynching the fan on day 3 (presuming your going with 3v2 pretense) that there are 4 people who can be lynched and gaga can still win?

[Gyrlander]

Sure I just got off work but you could run the numbers yourself.

It's still 11% day 1.

14% day 2 28% of vote

20% day 3 40% of vote

Day 4 game should be over if Gaga is successful

They'll never have enough votes until day 4 to be able to control the lynches. Which is drastically different from cult of zed.

Honestly, make it an 11 or 13 person game and it self balances

You're talking about Cult of Zed with the last statement?

[Gyrlander]

It's hard to completely balance setups like this where the scum can lose just with 1 correct Lynch.

[ika]

It's hard to completely balance setups like this where the scum can lose just with 1 correct Lynch.

i know. its argubly not even mafia to an extent but we run games like this anyway.

how about this: if the game state is 3v2 and the fan is lynched LGG can not recuit the following night?

again, all i want to have overall is that town is not punished in mylo for playing correctly (granted i would want to have it be for the entire gaem but i find this to be the most vital point)

if you at least do that i can live with it

[PowersThatBe]

It's hard to completely balance setups like this where the scum can lose just with 1 correct Lynch.

I agree and I don't think this is the same as zed. You don't have to change anything. It was approved. I was saying if you ad 2 or 4 more haters it might make it Moerr balanced but not ruin Gaga chances

TBH the goal isn't to lunch all scum, just the head bitch in charge so town has to play well

[ika]

I agree and I don't think this is the same as zed. You don't have to change anything. It was approved. I was saying if you ad 2 or 4 more haters it might make it Moerr balanced but not ruin Gaga chances

TBH the goal isn't to lunch all scum, just the head bitch in charge so town has to play well

by your lgoic then town should not be punished for lynching a fan. no?

playiung well would include lynching the fan so are you saying lynching the fan is not playing well?

[PowersThatBe]

by your lgoic then town should not be punished for lynching a fan. no?

playiung well would include lynching the fan so are you saying lynching the fan is not playing well?

The goal is to lynch gaga-- so yes lynching fan is bad. Just apply solo scum hunting thought to this. Everything outside of Gaga is a mislynch

[ika]

The goal is to lynch gaga-- so yes lynching fan is bad. Just apply solo scum hunting thought to this. Everything outside of Gaga is a mislynch

thast the thing. there is no way to "solo scum hunt" LG can basicly play as town and be read as town for their motivations.

fan is not a myslynch becasue they are part of the scum team, if the fan did not count towards wincon then it could be argued.

again this is not adressing the issue that town loses for playing right on 3v2 and lynching fan becasue now the "scums" can "myslynch" it for the win so town has to correctly use 3 townies to correctly lynch one scum there.

[PowersThatBe]

thast the thing. there is no way to "solo scum hunt" LG can basicly play as town and be read as town for their motivations.

fan is not a myslynch becasue they are part of the scum team, if the fan did not count towards wincon then it could be argued.

again this is not adressing the issue that town loses for playing right on 3v2 and lynching fan becasue now the "scums" can "myslynch" it for the win so town has to correctly use 3 townies to correctly lynch one scum there.

Any role in any game could play as town and bee read as town.

Fan dies at night nmw, so it doesn't matter. It's a mislynch bc lunching them doesn't hurt the scum it hurts the town.

[ika]

Any role in any game could play as town and bee read as town.

Fan dies at night nmw, so it doesn't matter. It's a mislynch bc lunching them doesn't hurt the scum it hurts the town.

thats not the point nor does it adress the still isuse of 3v2 where the single scum has bascily 4 myslynches to use as well as cordinated day-chat for quick hammer.

all 3 towns could argubly lynch correctly the fan but then lose becasue its ocnsidered a "myslynch" when by definiotn of role and wincons, its not a "myslynch"

[PowersThatBe]

by your lgoic then town should not be punished for lynching a fan. no?

playiung well would include lynching the fan so are you saying lynching the fan is not playing well?

the fan is dying regardless of being lynched or not. Lynching the fan is not playing well because it's not the objective of the game.

The objective of cult of zed was to find the leader, but if you lynched a cult member it stopped a conversion at night, so there was merit in lynching the cult member. In this set up it does NOT HELP THE TOWN to lynch the fan.

The goal is to find Lady GaGa. That is the only goal, if you find the fan, then you need to look at interactions and try to scum hunt, and change your methods each day as the fan changes. You can use post flip associations to find the GaGa after each fan is revealed.

Lynching the fan hurts the town.

[Cryptonic]

Gyrlander ping me when you want me to review. Don't want to review during conversations like this, incase something changes about the game.

[ika]

the fan is dying regardless of being lynched or not. Lynching the fan is not playing well because it's not the objective of the game.

The objective of cult of zed was to find the leader, but if you lynched a cult member it stopped a conversion at night, so there was merit in lynching the cult member. In this set up it does NOT HELP THE TOWN to lynch the fan.

The goal is to find Lady GaGa. That is the only goal, if you find the fan, then you need to look at interactions and try to scum hunt, and change your methods each day as the fan changes. You can use post flip associations to find the GaGa after each fan is revealed.

Lynching the fan hurts the town.

but both objectives from cult of zed and this are the same.

what im saying here is that town should still get merit for lynching fan and not punished becasue thats again, unfair to town that they correctly lynched scum but are still being punished for it. i understand their goal is to get LGG but being punished for hitting the partner (and my biggest point where it matters is the 3v2) is very unfair to town itself.

LGG should be able to be town enough to not be lynched in general. if they got lynched becasue they were scummy thats that.

in turn the fans should never change their read lists ever, they should instead continue the push and reads they had the entire time they are a fan. that way there is really nothing to go on other then maybe the n1 WIFOMing argument of why they were recruited and who would do it.

and if you add the fan back the fan is better off never giving reads at all and jsut trolling the fuck out of the game to rremove town of info so it can jsut take town out though recuitment

it boils down to that the point i keep bringing is not being adressed: why is town being punished for what is objectivly the good and right play (lynching scum). towns overal motive is to lynch LGG yes, but there should be an incentive to also lynch the recuit at a point instead of just going "ignore"

i mean if anything if you get recuited you should jsut afk or just come in and hammer day 2 and out yourself as scum and then jsut take someone new. scums should not be rewarded for being outed scum, they should be punished.


Gyrlander ping me when you want me to review. Don't want to review during conversations like this, incase something changes about the game.

i would actualy like your (or any fm staffs like Unknown1234) input on this issue.

[PowersThatBe]

but both objectives from cult of zed and this are the same.

what im saying here is that town should still get merit for lynching fan and not punished becasue thats again, unfair to town that they correctly lynched scum but are still being punished for it. i understand their goal is to get LGG but being punished for hitting the partner (and my biggest point where it matters is the 3v2) is very unfair to town itself.

LGG should be able to be town enough to not be lynched in general. if they got lynched becasue they were scummy thats that.

in turn the fans should never change their read lists ever, they should instead continue the push and reads they had the entire time they are a fan. that way there is really nothing to go on other then maybe the n1 WIFOMing argument of why they were recruited and who would do it.

and if you add the fan back the fan is better off never giving reads at all and jsut trolling the fuck out of the game to rremove town of info so it can jsut take town out though recuitment

it boils down to that the point i keep bringing is not being adressed: why is town being punished for what is objectivly the good and right play (lynching scum). towns overal motive is to lynch LGG yes, but there should be an incentive to also lynch the recuit at a point instead of just going "ignore"

i mean if anything if you get recuited you should jsut afk or just come in and hammer day 2 and out yourself as scum and then jsut take someone new. scums should not be rewarded for being outed scum, they should be punished.



i would actualy like your (or any fm staffs like Unknown1234) input on this issue.


I think this is a trumped up issue. I don't think it's really an issue at all. This forces the town to work together and use scum hunting to their advantage. You have to play in a different way than most tradition scum team games, because in lynching one scum, you are actually helping the scum team.

This is as if Masquerade Madness, the solo scum had an apprentice. And instead of the SK changing identities, the identity of the apprentice changes. I think it's unique and cool, and what I think you're doing is hurting the chances for creativity and innovation. Sure this isn't a traditional setup and it wasn't meant to be a traditional set up.

So if you apply traditional methods of thought and scum hunting, the town will fail, this helps the town to rise above -- to shoot for more.

The town shouldn't get anything for not lynching the correct target. It's really that simple. This is gyrlanders save, and if you don't like it, you don't have to play it. Now he has been more than accommodating, and has made alterations. I think we should let this play out, and then see what changes need to happen post game.

As it stands now, this is a very unique set up, and it could lead to team Gaga snowballing, but it's more balanced than cult of zed was...and I think that as long as town works TOGETHER, and, realigns every single day, and treats each day as a day 1 situation, then they should be fine.

But continuing to water it down will just ruin what could be a great and fun save.

Forum mafia isn't and shouldn't be about winning and losing. It should be about playing the game because it is fun. And I say this as a very competitive person.

This save is great. Town has 1 objective, lynch Lady Gaga. That is it. That is how Gyrlander designed it, and trying to get him to switch that just isn't right.

Trying to say "well town should be rewarded for scum hunting." Yeah sure, in most games they are, but this isn't most games, and it doesn't pretend to be a vanilla save. If you want a vanilla save, go play a vanilla save. I, however, will be playing this very interesting save where I know my objective will be to either kill lady gaga as a hater (until or if I am converted) or win the game as Gaga. It's simple, and if I figure out who the fan is. I'm going to try to use that information to kill the lady gaga as a hater.

You're really over complicating this Ika. Truly.

I think the best thing we can do, is let Crypt review and let other fm staff review if they want, and they can have a conversation with gyr separate from us. You've made your points, and I think it would be best if they considered everything between host and fm staff.

[ika]

I think this is a trumped up issue. I don't think it's really an issue at all. This forces the town to work together and use scum hunting to their advantage. You have to play in a different way than most tradition scum team games, because in lynching one scum, you are actually helping the scum team.

yes and that should not be the case. if you think its all trumped up you can just agree to disagree

This is as if Masquerade Madness, the solo scum had an apprentice. And instead of the SK changing identities, the identity of the apprentice changes. I think it's unique and cool, and what I think you're doing is hurting the chances for creativity and innovation. Sure this isn't a traditional setup and it wasn't meant to be a traditional set up.

i already know that and have aknoglaged that. i would still like it to be ballanced

So if you apply traditional methods of thought and scum hunting, the town will fail, this helps the town to rise above -- to shoot for more.

and thats what i have been aruging but it should also mean town should be rewarded for playing right. we have had dicussions in the past on why town does so bad and this would only renforce the negatvitity that has been an issue

The town shouldn't get anything for not lynching the correct target. It's really that simple. This is gyrlanders save, and if you don't like it, you don't have to play it. Now he has been more than accommodating, and has made alterations. I think we should let this play out, and then see what changes need to happen post game.

town should though, otherwise its leads to the same shit site meta we have as of now. i know this is gyrs game and he has every right to refuse everything and anything i say as well. its jsut my adivice as a host that many have argued that the sites games are imballanced and is what have made people play less. so im looking ot have better ballance so players will stay and play again. its not a matter of "just me" its a matter of what has been a site issue

As it stands now, this is a very unique set up, and it could lead to team Gaga snowballing, but it's more balanced than cult of zed was...and I think that as long as town works TOGETHER, and, realigns every single day, and treats each day as a day 1 situation, then they should be fine.

and what are the odds of that happening? while town should be doing that its also what happened in cult of zed and what i used to my advantage. town got apathtic off that and basicly "quit" after day 2

But continuing to water it down will just ruin what could be a great and fun save.

again, gyr can disregard what is said entirely or not. im voicing what i beleive will lead to better site meat and retaining players on what is a site issue bieng adressed in the past about ballance

Forum mafia isn't and shouldn't be about winning and losing. It should be about playing the game because it is fun. And I say this as a very competitive person.

thats what i have said but most people also want ballance

This save is great. Town has 1 objective, lynch Lady Gaga. That is it. That is how Gyrlander designed it, and trying to get him to switch that just isn't right.

im not trying to get him to switch that either. im trying to say that town is stacked to lose by playing right

Trying to say "well town should be rewarded for scum hunting." Yeah sure, in most games they are, but this isn't most games, and it doesn't pretend to be a vanilla save. If you want a vanilla save, go play a vanilla save. I, however, will be playing this very interesting save where I know my objective will be to either kill lady gaga as a hater (until or if I am converted) or win the game as Gaga. It's simple, and if I figure out who the fan is. I'm going to try to use that information to kill the lady gaga as a hater.

and i already explained what fan has to do after day 1, jsut not post at all or troll the shit out fo the game. at best come the lylo/mylo thats when it matters.

finding the fan only leads to a WIFOM dicussion of why was player X recuited. not only that theres jsut another WIFOM argument of fear of "why is player X not dead/converted"

You're really over complicating this Ika. Truly.

not really, like i said, it can be ignored entirly. you are the one who continues to respond in gyrs defense

I think the best thing we can do, is let Crypt review and let other fm staff review if they want, and they can have a conversation with gyr separate from us. You've made your points, and I think it would be best if they considered everything between host and fm staff.

they can review at any point they like, i have even asked them for input on this said issue if you have not noticed. if they wanted us players to not comment at all then they can ask as much. but i find it that they rather encourage it becasue us players can find things they may overlook

[Gyrlander]

2 Haters have been added so Town has another Lynch. Cryptonic Ready for review.

[PowersThatBe]

2 Haters have been added so Town has another Lynch. Cryptonic Ready for review.

Real quick. If you're doing 10 people, Gaga should start with a fan Day1 imo.

[Gyrlander]

Real quick. If you're doing 10 people, Gaga should start with a fan Day1 imo.

In that case town wouldn't have another Lynch.

[Cryptonic]

You guys can comment and discuss as much as you want, im not discouraging it.

I am just not doing an official review until Gyrlander has confirmed any changes to his setup based on these conversations lol.

If he says hes ready, then i will review once home.

[Gyrlander]

You guys can comment and discuss as much as you want, im not discouraging it.

I am just not doing an official review until Gyrlander has confirmed any changes to his setup based on these conversations lol.

If he says hes ready, then i will review once home.

I think the setup has been modified enough by far lol. Hope you can review it & give your opinion when you return home :)

[Cryptonic]

Gyrlander

Lady Gaga's rolecard doesn't specify that they get to choose the first Lady Gaga Fan, please add to rolecard.

I would consider giving Lady Gaga a number of charges (probably around 1-2) for conversions, if I were you. I do agree that Town should be rewarded for successful lynches on Lady Gaga's team eventually, but it initially being treated like a Jester for the first lynch helps bring some balance to Lady Gaga's team. If you are adverse to Conversions limits, make it so Lady Gaga has to wait 1 day + 1 night cycle before converting again. This prevents the game from having almost every single lynch qualify as a misslynch.

I don't feel that the psuedo-disguise is OP the way it is, since it's basically always 1 KPN per night regardless of the outcome.

Let me know what you think.

[Cryptonic]

Actually, crunching the numbers again, I'm not really concerns about the conversion limits.
With the forced 1 KPN from the Fan, it is 3 pure Misslynches to lose (lynch on Town, not Fan), and 1 correct lynch to Win.

Reading the Fans can easily be a way to help Town find Gaga.

I also see that Town is rewarded because it doesn't take away the number of misslynches they can have:

WCS:
2v8
(L)2v7
2v6
(L)2v5
2v4
(L)2v3

Lynching Fans:
2v
(L)1v7
2v6
(L)1v6
2v5
(L)1v5
2v4
(L)1v4
2v3

So, lynching Fans in the game gives Town an extra lynch, so they are being rewarded with extra time and reads.

[Gyrlander]

Lady Gaga starts alone, though.

[Gyrlander]

Actually, crunching the numbers again, I'm not really concerns about the conversion limits.
With the forced 1 KPN from the Fan, it is 3 pure Misslynches to lose (lynch on Town, not Fan), and 1 correct lynch to Win.

Reading the Fans can easily be a way to help Town find Gaga.

I also see that Town is rewarded because it doesn't take away the number of misslynches they can have:

WCS:
2v8
(L)2v7
2v6
(L)2v5
2v4
(L)2v3

Lynching Fans:
2v
(L)1v7
2v6
(L)1v6
2v5
(L)1v5
2v4
(L)1v4
2v3

So, lynching Fans in the game gives Town an extra lynch, so they are being rewarded with extra time and reads.

They actually have 1 more lynch cause Lady Gaga starts alone, so I think it is balanced enough?

[Cryptonic]

They actually have 1 more lynch cause Lady Gaga starts alone, so I think it is balanced enough?

I am comfortable with it if you are.
3-4 misslynches vs 1 lynch seems harder for scum then for Town, IMO.

You can post signups whenever you're ready.

Please do fix Lady Gaga's rolecard, though.
Like change "when your fan dies" to "When you're alone", or something like that.

[Gyrlander]

I am comfortable with it if you are.
3-4 misslynches vs 1 lynch seems harder for scum then for Town, IMO.

You can post signups whenever you're ready.

Please do fix Lady Gaga's rolecard, though.
Like change "when your fan dies" to "When you're alone", or something like that.

Yeah, I also feel like scum will have a hard time in this setup, but I must hear what the few people that actually dedicate their time to check setups have to say. And well... HAVING TO BE GOOD IN ORDER TO WIN AS LADY GAGA MAKES SENSE.

Fixed the Rolecard, will post signups soon.

[PowersThatBe]

Yeah, I also feel like scum will have a hard time in this setup, but I must hear what the few people that actually dedicate their time to check setups have to say. And well... HAVING TO BE GOOD IN ORDER TO WIN AS LADY GAGA MAKES SENSE.

Fixed the Rolecard, will post signups soon.

Just to clarify before we start. The Gaga has to convert each night correct? They can't keep the same fan for longer than one days?

[Gyrlander]

Just to clarify before we start. The Gaga has to convert each night correct? They can't keep the same fan for longer than one days?

The rolecard says "CAN" so it is not mandatory. Pretty sure we changed it during our discussion.