Two New Roles, Puppeteer and Kidnapper

[Charlondo]

Before I start, I wanted to tell the developers of this game that they've done a great job so far, did a great job of bringing one of the best games back to life onto Starcraft 2. If you need a moderator or just someone to come up with new ideas, I'm your man.

My first role is a mafioso called the Puppeteer that can choose someone to follow his every will, and if his ability is used, the player will vote on the Mafia's side in the next Trial. It can be used to save a godfather on trial or to kill that extra innocent that's 50/50'd in the ballot votes. HUGE counter to the Mayor if played correctly, as his vote will still count as two for the mafia. It will only Follow the Puppeteer's vote, so he cannot use it to save himself when he is on trial. The automatic vote that follows his should be put on a random timer that isn't always the same, so people can't tell when someone is being puppeteer'd, unless that is how you want it.

My Second role is also Mafioso, the Kidnapper, and he can hold someone "Hostage" and when this Mafioso dies by trial, he will take that person's life with him. The idea behind this is to make it a little easier for the mafia to shut down greater roles that normally get saved by doctors early, being a good counter to groups that just shout out their roles in the first day.People trying to keep themselves alive, like the Jesters can also claim to be the Kidnapper to try to hold out a little longer if they are accused before getting lynched.

[Clawtrocity]

I like the idea of the Kidnapper, don't like the puppeteer. It doesn't add much more than the disguiser just altered a bit.

[Charlondo]

I can kind of see what you mean about the Puppeteer, but not completely. He's not killing anybody, He's just stealing their ballot. He's up for editing if anyone wants to help out.

[Charlondo]

I guess no ones likes the ideas? :(

[FalseTruth]

I disagree with Claw, I like the puppeteer a lot more than the kidnapper.

Here's why!

Kidnapper is a suicide role. Mafia only gains his usefulness if he dies, am i right? When mafia find the sheriff and realize they cant kill him due to bg/doc/etc. then they just kidnap him, and wait to die. This makes the role seem little better than a mere mafioso trying to get lynched. A mafioso jester, if you will.

Why I like the idea of a puppeteer:
Mayor seems to be the new big and powerful role that docs and bgs will save even over sheriffs. This definitely needs a counter and this role will serve that purpose quite well.

A possible strategies will probably show up:
The "puppet" will obviously say he's being controlled! He may say, "I didn't vote for him,wtf?" which will reveal his innocence. BUT! Mafia can use this to their advantage to avoid being caught, by pretending to vote right after another mafia and then claiming "puppet". The mafia would have to be very attentive to when his teammate votes so that he can vote immediately afterwards.

Another combo would be to silence the "puppet" every day, so he can't vote legitametly at all and there is no way to reveal his role!

However, there are some issues with your puppeteer role:
1) The timer will be hard to implement, and may not even be possible
2) Some may consider it to be OP when paired with the BM.

I will add more suggestions if they come to mind, but honestly, I wouldn't mind both of these roles in the game at all. Kidnapper would be a good replacement for mafioso and puppeteer would make mafia games much more fun.

[Membrax]

I like your defense of the Puppeteer, as it clearly shows that this idea has a some potential 8)

As for the Kidnapper, it looks like a mafia version of the Hunter, with night action instead of day action:
http://wiki.epicmafia.com/index.php?title=Hunter
Dunno if technically it's possible, but I would prefer the town version since it's way more proactive and brings a lot of new interesting situations.

[Charlondo]

Thanks for keeping the thread alive and giving your opinions. I appreciate it.

Membrax, in a way you're right about the Kidnapper, he is like the Hunter, only I tried to think of a way to incorporate him onto the mafia's side, for the purpose of being able to take out a more powerful role "with" him if he gets lynched. I don't find it overpowered though since he can still be killed by night, via Serial Killer, Jailor, or Vigilante, him being colored because he is my main point. I love the vigilante role and making it more powerful in a sense where you're not actually buffing him but making it more important to have him alive.

[Krismighty]

Both of these are great ideas and deserve to be implemented. Especially the Puppeteer. There are lots of mafia side roles out there tho, good luck. ;D

[Charlondo]

Well everyone knows the Town is OP, and what kills the town better than the mafia? :)

[Krismighty]

in my opinion they both are completly even. But it depends on the game setup. More mafia roles like pupeteer and kidnapper just give more variety to choose from.

[Charlondo]

I was just reading the other thread of a similar role to the Puppeteer, and a problem arose where people think that if the stolen ballot votes innocent for a target, the guy must be mafia. In my opinion, this is not the case because it adds strategy to it. If that's the mindset everyone has, use the balloted vote to vote innocent on someone you want DEAD then. everyone will think he's a mafia and the vigilantes will be moving out the next night.