S-FM 206: POLITICO

[Cryptonic]

S-FM POLITICO


Setup Thread (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/36674-S-FM-POLITICO)





Role List

Living Players

Graveyard


Congressman
Congressman
Congressman
Governor
Judge
Mayor
States Attorney
Voter
Voter
Voter
Voter
Voter
Calix
Kovath
GameFreak
Gyrlander
Unknown1234
Never Unlucky
Brendan
Spruance
Mesk514
Eggy
Firebringer
oops_ur_dead





It is currently night. Night ends in roughly 24.5 hours, at 9:00 AM Central. Night start times will vary throughout the game, depending on availability & time of lynch.
Night actions will be accepted tonight, but there will be no night kill.
Please have all night actions in at least 1 hour before night ends.
You may now post in any chat you may have.

28401,2

[Cryptonic]

Sorry I was busy w/ work & meetings this morning. Day starting in a minute

[Cryptonic]

Day One






Role List

Living Players

Graveyard


Congressman
Congressman
Congressman
Governor
Judge
Mayor
States Attorney
Voter
Voter
Voter
Voter
Voter
Calix
Kovath
GameFreak
Gyrlander
Unknown1234
Never Unlucky
Brendan
Spruance
Mesk514
Eggy
Firebringer
oops_ur_dead





Day One ends in 48 hours, at 2:00 PM Central, July 23 (http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=July+23+2016+2:00+pm+central).

With 12 Players alive, it takes 7

28401,2
28243,0
Calix has been pardoned by the Governor, and cannot be lynched today.

[States Attorney]

Eggy

[Calix]

Let's get this show started.

Never Unlucky

I am surprised that the Judge neutered Unknown - of all players - instead of the Mayor on N0. The double-voter seems like the obvious target for a supposedly-uninformed Judge.

[Kovath]

I'm pumped.

Unknown1234

You're not getting away easy this time, buddy.

[Calix]

I'm pumped.

Unknown1234

You're not getting away easy this time, buddy.

Before you two boys start another round of chest-thumping, thoughts on the night actions?

[Kovath]

Before you two boys start another round of chest-thumping, thoughts on the night actions?

You'd like that, eh?

Eh, it was N0 -> D1 so I wouldn't read too much into them (maybe just RNG lel) but:

Judge on Unknown: No idea what the purpose of this was. Not sure neutering the mayor was the obvious choice, though, since it would make lynches more difficult...
States Attorney on Eggy: Probably just slapped it on the only known PR.
Governor on Calix: Seems more like a placeholder, Calix probably doesn't get lynched D1 over others. Or the Governor just really wants Calix to live.

Your thoughts on getting pardoned and the Attorney vote?

[Calix]

You'd like that, eh?

Eh, it was N0 -> D1 so I wouldn't read too much into them (maybe just RNG lel) but:

Judge on Unknown: No idea what the purpose of this was. Not sure neutering the mayor was the obvious choice, though, since it would make lynches more difficult...
States Attorney on Eggy: Probably just slapped it on the only known PR.
Governor on Calix: Seems more like a placeholder, Calix probably doesn't get lynched D1 over others. Or the Governor just really wants Calix to live.

Your thoughts on getting pardoned and the Attorney vote?

You know it :)

Even if it's RNG, we should be using it to discuss. This is one of the few games where we actually have information on Day One :D

In my opinion, neutering the potential scum Mayor with 2 votes for the first day seems like optimal strategy. Judge shouldn't know anything about anyone else so why not go for the potential threat first?

Governor pardoning me was stupid - all it does is confirm that I am not the Governor and thus reduces the number of players that can be. I don't consider the move to be alignment-indicative one way or another as I have yet to be lynched on Day One. I agree that they probably assumed that it wouldn't do much harm.

States Attorney voting right at the start for the confirmed role is moronic and it means we have less leeway with shifting votes.

:facepalm:

[Never Unlucky]

Before you two boys start another round of chest-thumping, thoughts on the night actions?

I think the Governor did what most people would have done at N0. He pardoned the strongest-minded player in the game so that this person could focus on others rather than himself. Good move.

I also believe that the Judge pulled a NeverUnlucky (as in noob/not informed) move. Not knowing what to do, I assume this player voted one of his friends or just straight up random.com his action.

States attorney did the natural thing: casting the vote on who was most likely going to be policy lynched. With no reads on other players, it is the right thing to do.

[Calix]

I think the Governor did what most people would have done at N0. He pardoned the strongest-minded player in the game so that this person could focus on others rather than himself. Good move.

I also believe that the Judge pulled a NeverUnlucky (as in noob/not informed) move. Not knowing what to do, I assume this player voted one of his friends or just straight up random.com his action.

States attorney did the natural thing: casting the vote on who was most likely going to be policy lynched. With no reads on other players, it is the right thing to do.

You're familiar with my play, I take it? Elaborate please.

Why do you go out of your way to characterise yourself as a noob in your first post?

You think that the Mayor will be policy-lynched on Day 1 - why now? Do you condone this idea and why?

[Kovath]

You know it :)

Even if it's RNG, we should be using it to discuss. This is one of the few games where we actually have information on Day One :D

In my opinion, neutering the potential scum Mayor with 2 votes for the first day seems like optimal strategy. Judge shouldn't know anything about anyone else so why not go for the potential threat first?

Governor pardoning me was stupid - all it does is confirm that I am not the Governor and thus reduces the number of players that can be. I don't consider the move to be alignment-indicative one way or another as I have yet to be lynched on Day One. I agree that they probably assumed that it wouldn't do much harm.

States Attorney voting right at the start for the confirmed role is moronic and it means we have less leeway with shifting votes.

:facepalm:

I understand your point about the Judge - though, considering it's Day 1 with everyone alive, it's not like a scum Mayor will screw us over by driving the lynches. And there is potential town motivation in not lowering the probability of a lynch - by probability the Mayor is probably a town, after all, not a scum trying to push a mislynch. And still, a lynch should give us more info than a no-lynch.

Do you think the Governor and Attorney should just not have used their actions at all then?


I think the Governor did what most people would have done at N0. He pardoned the strongest-minded player in the game so that this person could focus on others rather than himself. Good move.

I also believe that the Judge pulled a NeverUnlucky (as in noob/not informed) move. Not knowing what to do, I assume this player voted one of his friends or just straight up random.com his action.

States attorney did the natural thing: casting the vote on who was most likely going to be policy lynched. With no reads on other players, it is the right thing to do.

Why do you think Eggy is the most likely PL over... say, Gyrlander?

[Calix]

I understand your point about the Judge - though, considering it's Day 1 with everyone alive, it's not like a scum Mayor will screw us over by driving the lynches. And there is potential town motivation in not lowering the probability of a lynch - by probability the Mayor is probably a town, after all, not a scum trying to push a mislynch. And still, a lynch should give us more info than a no-lynch.

Do you think the Governor and Attorney should just not have used their actions at all then?



Why do you think Eggy is the most likely PL over... say, Gyrlander?

Perhaps. Personally, I feel pretty confident in determining Eggy's alignment...he just has to show up for more than three seconds first.

Why bring up the benefits of a lynch over a no-lynch when that was not being discussed?

Governor using their action today was foolish at best. Scum know three roles at the least, maybe more if one of them is a Congressman. If the Governor is town, they'll figure out who they are much quicker than the town will.

States Attorney should have waited in my opinion. Doesn't tell us much about their alignment when they vote for the confirmed role straight off the bat, you know?

I'll just throw it up now that I'd support a policy lynch on Gyrloser if we're fucked for targets a few hours from EOD and if he doesn't attempt to play the game. I don't want to waste more time discussing that because that is what I'll be considering :p

[Calix]

Wait, just remembered that there can either be two or three scum.

I did not like that mechanic in the M-FM and I won't like it now.

[Never Unlucky]

A) You're familiar with my play, I take it? Elaborate please.

B) Why do you go out of your way to characterise yourself as a noob in your first post?

C) You think that the Mayor will be policy-lynched on Day 1 - why now? Do you condone this idea and why?
A) I am not. This is the first time I get to play with you. I only know you from reputation, lol. A strong-headed and independant person who sometimes tunnels too hard. :P I will get to make up my own opinion of you throughout this game.

B) 1. Because I am still a noob in my eyes. This is my second forum mafia game, and there are definitely still some mechanics I am not familiar with. For instance, I am confused as to what needs to be disussed the first day. The other game I played, day 1 served rvs and a chess game. The discussions felt sort of futile to me. 2. Because I tried making joke. Self-mockery makes others laugh, I heard.

C) I do not think he should be lynched just for being the mayor. This seems unfair for the player who signed up for a game only to get lynched for receiving a certain role. I thought the mayor was the person who was most likely going to be policy lynched on D1 because that is what the people who critiqued Crypt's setup had predicted. I remember Kovath making a post about the power of the mayor's role in a mylo/lylo situation. It is an opinion I somewhat share, but I'd rather base my lynches on my reads than policies.

[Mesk514]

I am surprised that the Judge neutered Unknown - of all players

I know right, not as if his balls have already dropped anyways ;)

[Kovath]

Perhaps. Personally, I feel pretty confident in determining Eggy's alignment...he just has to show up for more than three seconds first.

Why bring up the benefits of a lynch over a no-lynch when that was not being discussed?

Governor using their action today was foolish at best. Scum know three roles at the least, maybe more if one of them is a Congressman. If the Governor is town, they'll figure out who they are much quicker than the town will.

States Attorney should have waited in my opinion. Doesn't tell us much about their alignment when they vote for the confirmed role straight off the bat, you know?

I'll just throw it up now that I'd support a policy lynch on Gyrloser if we're fucked for targets a few hours from EOD and if he doesn't attempt to play the game. I don't want to waste more time discussing that because that is what I'll be considering :p

Aye, Eggy's alignment is probably an easier one if he'd not lurk :P

I brought it up because I considered it relevant to my considerations of why a Judge might or might not have wanted to target Eggy -> whether AI or not.

Foolish at best, then what at worst? You said earlier that it wasn't AI for you. Does a waiting Governor read as Town to you and what actually happened as null then? What's the distinction?

Does the States Attorney waiting tell anything about their alignment either?

I've made my feelings about Mr. G known on multiple occasions.

[Mesk514]

oops_ur_dead

bite me

[Calix]

A) I am not. This is the first time I get to play with you. I only know you from reputation, lol. A strong-headed and independant person who sometimes tunnels too hard. :P I will get to make up my own opinion of you throughout this game.

B) 1. Because I am still a noob in my eyes. This is my second forum mafia game, and there are definitely still some mechanics I am not familiar with. For instance, I am confused as to what needs to be disussed the first day. The other game I played, day 1 served rvs and a chess game. The discussions felt sort of futile to me. 2. Because I tried making joke. Self-mockery makes others laugh, I heard.

C) I do not think he should be lynched just for being the mayor. This seems unfair for the player who signed up for a game only to get lynched for receiving a certain role. I thought the mayor was the person who was most likely going to be policy lynched on D1 because that is what the people who critiqued Crypt's setup had predicted. I remember Kovath making a post about the power of the mayor's role in a mylo/lylo situation. It is an opinion I somewhat share, but I'd rather base my lynches on my reads than policies.

A. Strong independent wymyn at your service.

B. How do you think your lack of experience will affect this game? You brought it up in a fairly awkward-sounding comment FMPOV so you must think it'll have some influence.

Your last two sentences veer off-topic - why include them?

C. We're not deciding lynches based on ideas of what is 'fair' so that is a weak argument. Do you have any better arguments for why the Mayor should not be lynched on policy?

[Gyrlander]

Bonjour!

-vote Calix

[Kovath]

C) I do not think he should be lynched just for being the mayor. This seems unfair for the player who signed up for a game only to get lynched for receiving a certain role. I thought the mayor was the person who was most likely going to be policy lynched on D1 because that is what the people who critiqued Crypt's setup had predicted. I remember Kovath making a post about the power of the mayor's role in a mylo/lylo situation. It is an opinion I somewhat share, but I'd rather base my lynches on my reads than policies.

The unique PRs are all pretty strong in endgame situation but that shouldn't influence how we vote on Day 1...

Policy lynches usually are about lynching certain slots because of how they play. You still didn't really answer the question about why Eggy was the person you thought most likely to be lynched on policy - unless you claim that your point had nothing to do with him as a slot.

[Calix]

Aye, Eggy's alignment is probably an easier one if he'd not lurk :P

I brought it up because I considered it relevant to my considerations of why a Judge might or might not have wanted to target Eggy -> whether AI or not.

Foolish at best, then what at worst? You said earlier that it wasn't AI for you. Does a waiting Governor read as Town to you and what actually happened as null then? What's the distinction?

Does the States Attorney waiting tell anything about their alignment either?

I've made my feelings about Mr. G known on multiple occasions.

At worst, it could have been careless scum who doesn't have the fear of being outed to the scum and thus didn't think twice about picking a target. Not enough information to make a definitive judgment, although given that the Governor picked a town FMPOV for the first day, I am biased and think they are more likely to be town.

Waiting isn't particularly alignment-indicative on Day One, I wouldn't say. A scum SA might want to hold back their vote and use it to swing onto a mislynch if the situation arises. A town SA might hold back until they have more information to go from. The early vote strikes me as careless more than anything malicious.

[Calix]

Bonjour!

-vote Calix

Moving away from role speculation...

This opening post rubs me the wrong way. Looks like a RVS vote that conveniently is on the pardoned player (would suggest that he's either not paying attention or/ and is trolling) but it's a fake vote.

Then he leaves without commenting on anything else. NAI by itself but fake-voting and dashing off is a poor way to start off the day.

Just feels like he's trying too hard to come across as careless.

[Unknown1234]

Gyrlander, why vote Calix when she can't get lynched? Sorry buddy.

[Unknown1234]

Let's get this show started.

Never Unlucky

I am surprised that the Judge neutered Unknown - of all players - instead of the Mayor on N0. The double-voter seems like the obvious target for a supposedly-uninformed Judge.

Why does this surprise you "of all players" ?

[Unknown1234]

I'm pumped.

Unknown1234

You're not getting away easy this time, buddy.

I'm hoping you don't keep this up this game.

[Kovath]

Gyrlander, why vote Calix when she can't get lynched? Sorry buddy.

Why call him out on something weird and then say "Sorry buddy"?

[Gyrlander]

I wanted to see your reaction after fake voting the pardoned player. Now, I'm more confident you're Corrupt.

Unknown

[Calix]

Why does this surprise you "of all players" ?

You are not known for your ability to lead lynches.

[Unknown1234]

Before you two boys start another round of chest-thumping, thoughts on the night actions?

Eggy having a vote on him makes me feel like he's town and the States Attorney is scum. Not much to input on this but why would a town immediately put a vote on the mayor day 1?

Me not having a vote makes me think it's someone who is either 1.) Dumb 2.) Faking Dumb. 3.) Knows I have good judgement. So MESK/Calix/Kovath is where I'd start looking for the judge. Very quick observation but the only thing that has really led me is my vote. I've been slacking in the past games.

[Calix]

I wanted to see your reaction after fake voting the pardoned player. Now, I'm more confident you're Corrupt.

Unknown

Explain what about Unknown's reaction made you 'more' confident.

Why were you confident that he was scum in the first place?
Gyrlander

[Unknown1234]

Oh, the Governor seems town, or he's teamed up with Calix. Scum wouldn't put a pardon on town!Calix on day 1, makes no sense.

[Never Unlucky]

B. How do you think your lack of experience will affect this game? You brought it up in a fairly awkward-sounding comment FMPOV so you must think it'll have some influence.

Your last two sentences veer off-topic - why include them?

C. We're not deciding lynches based on ideas of what is 'fair' so that is a weak argument. Do you have any better arguments for why the Mayor should not be lynched on policy?

B. I do not think my lack of experience will affect the game. I think it will only affect me in having to look up terms online or trying not to get manipulated and thus sheep.
As I said, when I brought it up I was trying to put a bit of humor in my post. I called myself a noob as in new player, not as a weaker player. That's what was going through my mind when I wrote the post.

C.Kovath brought up two very solid arguments on this point. First, he is statistically more likely to be town than corrupted. Second, the state attorney and the judge are the two prs that have the most potential to get someone lynched. As town do not have the ability to kill at night, lynching is the only way to get rid of the crooks. Those two roles are very important in that regard.

I will add that the Judge counters the mayor. We really do not have to lynch Eggy if he is a town-read. Even if he is a scum-read we can keep him alive for the entire game and lynch him at the end as long as the judge keeps targeting him.

[Unknown1234]

I wanted to see your reaction after fake voting the pardoned player. Now, I'm more confident you're Corrupt.

Unknown

Does that make sense to you?

[Calix]

Eggy having a vote on him makes me feel like he's town and the States Attorney is scum. Not much to input on this but why would a town immediately put a vote on the mayor day 1?

Me not having a vote makes me think it's someone who is either 1.) Dumb 2.) Faking Dumb. 3.) Knows I have good judgement. So MESK/Calix/Kovath is where I'd start looking for the judge. Very quick observation but the only thing that has really led me is my vote. I've been slacking in the past games.

Why are you openly TPR-hunting?

I agree with you on one point. I don't think States Attorney and Mayor are in a scum team together.

Think about it. Both of those roles on the scum team would mean that scum have the ability to use 4+ votes. They'd be able to carry lynches by themselves if they lived until the Final 7 or so.

[Unknown1234]

Why call him out on something weird and then say "Sorry buddy"?

Because his vote is pointless? Maybe it doesn't make sense but that's where I was going. Maybe taunting a bit too :P

[Kovath]

In regards to Gyrlander:

First, it wasn't even a real vote, he said Unknown and not Unknown1234 LOL

Second, why specifically target Calix in order to draw out a reaction 10 posts later from Unknown, who you thought was scum when he hadn't even posted yet?

[Never Unlucky]

The unique PRs are all pretty strong in endgame situation but that shouldn't influence how we vote on Day 1...

Policy lynches usually are about lynching certain slots because of how they play. You still didn't really answer the question about why Eggy was the person you thought most likely to be lynched on policy - unless you claim that your point had nothing to do with him as a slot.

That is my point, yes.

[Unknown1234]

Why are you openly TPR-hunting?

I agree with you on one point. I don't think States Attorney and Mayor are in a scum team together.

Think about it. Both of those roles on the scum team would mean that scum have the ability to use 4+ votes. They'd be able to carry lynches by themselves if they lived until the Final 7 or so.

Maybe I shouldn't be doing this, but I've been making these kinds of observations in the past few games where it doesn't matter if you're a TPR or not. Sometimes it might come down to the balance in the end, but I'll keep it to myself.

[Unknown1234]

In regards to Gyrlander:

First, it wasn't even a real vote, he said Unknown and not Unknown1234 LOL

Second, why specifically target Calix in order to draw out a reaction 10 posts later from Unknown, who you thought was scum when he hadn't even posted yet?

I thought it was more of a general trap. Otherwise no clue.

[Calix]

B. I do not think my lack of experience will affect the game. I think it will only affect me in having to look up terms online or trying not to get manipulated and thus sheep.
As I said, when I brought it up I was trying to put a bit of humor in my post. I called myself a noob as in new player, not as a weaker player. That's what was going through my mind when I wrote the post.

C.Kovath brought up two very solid arguments on this point. First, he is statistically more likely to be town than corrupted. Second, the state attorney and the judge are the two prs that have the most potential to get someone lynched. As town do not have the ability to kill at night, lynching is the only way to get rid of the crooks. Those two roles are very important in that regard.

I will add that the Judge counters the mayor. We really do not have to lynch Eggy if he is a town-read. Even if he is a scum-read we can keep him alive for the entire game and lynch him at the end as long as the judge keeps targeting him.

Your self-meta has been noted.

I can't see many productive avenues for discussion that pursuing this will go, so let's shift onto the players themselves.

Initial impressions on the players please.

[Mesk514]

hey guys, i just want to point out the obvious and say 1 of the congressman is evil :O

[Kovath]

B. I do not think my lack of experience will affect the game. I think it will only affect me in having to look up terms online or trying not to get manipulated and thus sheep.
As I said, when I brought it up I was trying to put a bit of humor in my post. I called myself a noob as in new player, not as a weaker player. That's what was going through my mind when I wrote the post.

C.Kovath brought up two very solid arguments on this point. First, he is statistically more likely to be town than corrupted. Second, the state attorney and the judge are the two prs that have the most potential to get someone lynched. As town do not have the ability to kill at night, lynching is the only way to get rid of the crooks. Those two roles are very important in that regard.

I will add that the Judge counters the mayor. We really do not have to lynch Eggy if he is a town-read. Even if he is a scum-read we can keep him alive for the entire game and lynch him at the end as long as the judge keeps targeting him.

This is the second time you've defaulted to reasoning I've provided (on different questions, true) in first the setup thread and now the game thread. Why are you sheeping my thoughts so hard?

What if the Judge is scum?

[Gyrlander]

I'm playing with you in hope to get reactions that I can analyze, so don't worry. We should focus on Mesk saying that 1 Congressman is evil when there is no confirmation.

[Unknown1234]

Perhaps. Personally, I feel pretty confident in determining Eggy's alignment...he just has to show up for more than three seconds first.

Why bring up the benefits of a lynch over a no-lynch when that was not being discussed?

Governor using their action today was foolish at best. Scum know three roles at the least, maybe more if one of them is a Congressman. If the Governor is town, they'll figure out who they are much quicker than the town will.

States Attorney should have waited in my opinion. Doesn't tell us much about their alignment when they vote for the confirmed role straight off the bat, you know?

I'll just throw it up now that I'd support a policy lynch on Gyrloser if we're fucked for targets a few hours from EOD and if he doesn't attempt to play the game. I don't want to waste more time discussing that because that is what I'll be considering :p

I would agree on the states attorney point. There really is no reason to put a vote on someone day 1, I'd assume highly that the States Attorney is scum, and wants the mayor gone. We saw last game how the mayor ended up being the game decider SIMPLY because he had more votes. I think a town states attorney would wait.

[Calix]

hey guys, i just want to point out the obvious and say 1 of the congressman is evil :O

Question. Why is this obvious?

[Unknown1234]

I'm playing with you in hope to get reactions that I can analyze, so don't worry. We should focus on Mesk saying that 1 Congressman is evil when there is no confirmation.

Why does that stick out to you as a scum call?

[Calix]

I'm playing with you in hope to get reactions that I can analyze, so don't worry. We should focus on Mesk saying that 1 Congressman is evil when there is no confirmation.

>says we should focus on X
>does not do anything to put focus on X

Strong.

Follow up please.

[Unknown1234]

Gyrlander shifting away from is comment is noted.

Gyrlander why did you focus your reaction on me?

[Brendan]

oops_ur_dead

[Never Unlucky]

This is the second time you've defaulted to reasoning I've provided (on different questions, true) in first the setup thread and now the game thread. Why are you sheeping my thoughts so hard?

What if the Judge is scum?

I will sheep anyone's thoughts if I agree with them. Don't take this personally. Also, I did add a bit to your argument, so I don't think you can say I'm "sheeping". I'm contributing to your argument.

If the judge is scum, then that is another reason not to lynch the mayor. We cannot afford to mislynch a PR especially when we do not know how many scums there are and how many of them are PRs.

[Calix]

Not even two hours in and I can already sense that "dumb town or scum" is going to form the foundation of a lot of my reads.

[Mesk514]

We should focus on Mesk saying that 1 Congressman is evil when there is no confirmation.

not even 60 posts into game and you're already displaying signs of lack of common sense... what doofus that's town puts a vote on the mayor. Obviously Mayor can be scum, but still... cmon now, use your head.

[Never Unlucky]

hey guys, i just want to point out the obvious and say 1 of the congressman is evil :O

At first glance, it is what I had thought as well. Then I realized that we cannot make this assumption: in this setup, the corrupt players have no garanteed roles unlike other setups. For all we know, the scums could be 2-3 voters...

[Spruance]

wtf this game started already. Weren't the signups like 2 days ago?

[Calix]

not even 60 posts into game and you're already displaying signs of lack of common sense... what doofus that's town puts a vote on the mayor. Obviously Mayor can be scum, but still... cmon now, use your head.

Answer why it's 'obvious' that one Congressman is scum instead of making us repeat ourselves.

[Calix]

At first glance, it is what I had thought as well. Then I realized that we cannot make this assumption: in this setup, the corrupt players have no garanteed roles unlike other setups. For all we know, the scums could be 2-3 voters...

This comment is three sentences long despite it adding nothing to the conversation.

[Mesk514]

Answer why it's 'obvious' that one Congressman is scum instead of making us repeat ourselves.


what doofus that's town puts a vote on the mayor.

vote on mayor is a very untown thing to do.... duh

[Unknown1234]

vote on mayor is a very untown thing to do.... duh

States attorney bro.

[Calix]

vote on mayor is a very untown thing to do.... duh

The States Attorney voted for the Mayor.

Congressmen are the Masons of the game.

Your thought process makes no sense.

[Kovath]

I will sheep anyone's thoughts if I agree with them. Don't take this personally. Also, I did add a bit to your argument, so I don't think you can say I'm "sheeping". I'm contributing to your argument.

If the judge is scum, then that is another reason not to lynch the mayor. We cannot afford to mislynch a PR especially when we do not know how many scums there are and how many of them are PRs.

Well, one of the times you brought me up was from when I discussed the potential of the PRs at MYLO and LYLO from the setup thread - a really specific reference to bring my name in.

So your ultimate stance is that some might want to PL the Mayor, but you don't want to yourself?

[Spruance]

I'm going to read the setup brb

[Firebringer]

I am now here to deal in the evil politics.
I take all kinds of bribes from my politicians for realz.

[Spruance]

So like in overwatch everyone has town roles but there are 2-3 people with scum alignment?

[Firebringer]

With 12 Players alive, it takes 7

28401,2
28243,0
Calix has been pardoned by the Governor, and cannot be lynched today.
[/FONT]
[/COLOR]

Why would Calix be pardoned unless someone wants to kiss her as!?!?!?!?
Must be the obvious decision.

I don't know if pardon is a required thing, but like. Its anti town to take off possible lynches for us?

[Calix]

The fact that Never Unlucky has a tendency of bringing up off-topic points, shoe-horned in that "he's so newb guise" awkwardly, and ignored my request for his reads (preferring to continue a largely irrelevant discussion with Kovath) strikes me as suspicious. It's much easier for scum to talk about theory and hypothetical situations than actual players.

My vote stays.

[Calix]

The fact that Never Unlucky has a tendency of bringing up off-topic points, shoe-horned in that "he's so newb guise" awkwardly, and ignored my request for his reads (preferring to continue a largely irrelevant discussion with Kovath) strikes me as suspicious. It's much easier for scum to talk about theory and hypothetical situations than actual players.

My vote stays.

[Spruance]

The fact that Never Unlucky has a tendency of bringing up off-topic points, shoe-horned in that "he's so newb guise" awkwardly, and ignored my request for his reads (preferring to continue a largely irrelevant discussion with Kovath) strikes me as suspicious. It's much easier for scum to talk about theory and hypothetical situations than actual players.

My vote stays.

#double posted

[Calix]

#double posted

Have any thoughts at all to share or are you just going to state the obvious?

[Spruance]

Have any thoughts at all to share or are you just going to state the obvious?

I'm still thinkin and readin geez

[Spruance]

Firebringer said that he takes bribes which is kind of a suspicious meta maybe. Kovath, neverunlucky and calix all being salty in their own way.

[Calix]

Firebringer said that he takes bribes which is kind of a suspicious meta maybe. Kovath, neverunlucky and calix all being salty in their own way.

'maybe' - So much conviction.

How is being salty alignment-indicative? If it isn't, why bring it up?

[Spruance]

'maybe' - So much conviction.

How is being salty alignment-indicative? If it isn't, why bring it up?

It's annoying

[Kovath]

Why would Calix be pardoned unless someone wants to kiss her as!?!?!?!?
Must be the obvious decision.

I don't know if pardon is a required thing, but like. Its anti town to take off possible lynches for us?

Do you think 'trying to kiss her as' has any bearing on what the Governor's alignment is?

[Calix]

It's annoying

That's nice to hear, child.

Got any actual reads though?

[Spruance]

That's nice to hear, child.

Got any actual reads though?

You are acting like you are confirmed just because a governor pardoned you.

[Calix]

You are acting like you are confirmed just because a governor pardoned you.

That's just my personality, dear. You should try it sometime.

Does 'acting like I'm confirmed' bother you and why?

[Spruance]

That's just my personality, dear. You should try it sometime.

Does 'acting like I'm confirmed' bother you and why?

Just seems overly aggressive.

[Calix]

Just seems overly aggressive.

This is a scum tell to you because...?

Could you just explain yourself more instead of making me waste time and posts on asking you these questions?

Firstly, it shows no initiative on your part. Secondly, you're putting me to sleep here.

[Kovath]

Just seems overly aggressive.

You've played with Calix already and say this...???

:facepalm:

Also you avoided answering whether it bothered you or not.

[Never Unlucky]

Initial impressions on the players please.

So far

Calix: Town-read. Only one so far who's been pressuring players, namely Kovath, Unknown, Gyrlander and myself. She wants to make others talk a fair bit so she can make an appropriate read of them. Theorically, because scums know everyone's alignment, they wouldn't pressure others.

Mesk and Gyrlander: Null-read. Neither are contributing in my eyes, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're scum. Last game I played with them they acted the same way, so I am not too surprised with their behaviour. I need to read more of their posts to get a stronger read on both of them.

Kovath: Lean scum-read. He is answering some of Calix's questions by other questions. Deflecting is a common thing for scum to do. Also, he didn't seem happy that I "defaulted to reasoning he has provided" twice which seemed very strange to me. Why is he concerned that I'm trying to enrich the debate using his arguments as foundations?

Unknown: Null-read. Kind of repeated Calix's arguments, though he did add a bit of his as well. Only pressures Gyrlander - Pressuring is a good thing as I've stated earlier, but only pressuring one person could mean he is a scum wanting to get rid of a person quickly. Only 2 hours in though, he will probably pressure other ppl by the end of the day.


Keep in mind those are reads made after 2 hours of posting. Nothing is definitive. These are just observations.

[Firebringer]

Do you think 'trying to kiss her as' has any bearing on what the Governor's alignment is?

are you worried about my read on the governors alignment?
Like as in you want me to read them a certain way.

[Spruance]

This is a scum tell to you because...?

Could you just explain yourself more instead of making me waste time and posts on asking you these questions?

Firstly, it shows no initiative on your part. Secondly, you're putting me to sleep here.

If you were scum you would hide it very well on day 1. It just seems that you might be trying a little too hard to stay in character.

[Firebringer]

All I know right now calix is doing a good job of doing her "Angry/Annoyed Town" impersonation. Or maybe its genuine.
She can't fake it forever, so maybe she will slip up eventually if she is scum.

Either way she is adorbes right now. I want to pinch her little cheeks.

[Kovath]

So far

Calix: Town-read. Only one so far who's been pressuring players, namely Kovath, Unknown, Gyrlander and myself. She wants to make others talk a fair bit so she can make an appropriate read of them. Theorically, because scums know everyone's alignment, they wouldn't pressure others.

Mesk and Gyrlander: Null-read. Neither are contributing in my eyes, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're scum. Last game I played with them they acted the same way, so I am not too surprised with their behaviour. I need to read more of their posts to get a stronger read on both of them.

Kovath: Lean scum-read. He is answering some of Calix's questions by other questions. Deflecting is a common thing for scum to do. Also, he didn't seem happy that I "defaulted to reasoning he has provided" twice which seemed very strange to me. Why is he concerned that I'm trying to enrich the debate using his arguments as foundations?

Unknown: Null-read. Kind of repeated Calix's arguments, though he did add a bit of his as well. Only pressures Gyrlander - Pressuring is a good thing as I've stated earlier, but only pressuring one person could mean he is a scum wanting to get rid of a person quickly. Only 2 hours in though, he will probably pressure other ppl by the end of the day.


Keep in mind those are reads made after 2 hours of posting. Nothing is definitive. These are just observations.

Why make this comment and marginalize your own reads? We all know this is only based on a few hours of posts.

[Spruance]

All I know right now calix is doing a good job of doing her "Angry/Annoyed Town" impersonation. Or maybe its genuine.
She can't fake it forever, so maybe she will slip up eventually if she is scum.

Either way she is adorbes right now. I want to pinch her little cheeks.

That's not the impression I get rip

[Mesk514]

The States Attorney voted for the Mayor.

Congressmen are the Masons of the game.

Your thought process makes no sense.

Ahh then I apologize, I read the setuphigh and again when I woke up, I was under the impression congressmen can place an extra vote,... replace congressman with state attorney then

[Kovath]

are you worried about my read on the governors alignment?
Like as in you want me to read them a certain way.

You think the Governor is trying to kiss her ass, so I asked what you read from that, if anything.

[Calix]

Oh good, finally something substantial.


Theorically, because scums know everyone's alignment, they wouldn't pressure others.

This addition is odd. Scum would be forced to pressure other players because if they didn't, that would make for the most obvious scum tell ever. Use of 'theoretically' and the emphasis you added on it implies that even you realise that this is a flimsy point.


Mesk and Gyrlander: Null-read. Neither are contributing in my eyes, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're scum. Last game I played with them they acted the same way, so I am not too surprised with their behaviour. I need to read more of their posts to get a stronger read on both of them.

You saw some of the queries that players had over these two players - your thoughts on those?

This is also waffling in the sense that it takes you too many words to say "null" but might just be how you type. Shall check out AI overnight and see for myself.


Kovath: Lean scum-read. He is answering some of Calix's questions by other questions. Deflecting is a common thing for scum to do.

What do you make of my accusations that you yourself deflect?


Also, he didn't seem happy that I "defaulted to reasoning he has provided" twice which seemed very strange to me. Why is he concerned that I'm trying to enrich the debate using his arguments as foundations?

Why do you think Kovath's concern over you using his reasoning is 'strange'? How could it be scum-motivated in your eyes?


Unknown: Null-read. Kind of repeated Calix's arguments, though he did add a bit of his as well.

Again, this is what Kovath accused you of, meaning you should agree with Kovath's reasoning for his push on you. Yet you scum-read Kovath somewhat...please explain the differences between the two situations here.


Only pressures Gyrlander - Pressuring is a good thing as I've stated earlier, but only pressuring one person could mean he is a scum wanting to get rid of a person quickly. Only 2 hours in though, he will probably pressure other ppl by the end of the day.


Keep in mind those are reads made after 2 hours of posting. Nothing is definitive. These are just observations.

[Never Unlucky]

The fact that Never Unlucky has a tendency of bringing up off-topic points, shoe-horned in that "he's so newb guise" awkwardly, and ignored my request for his reads (preferring to continue a largely irrelevant discussion with Kovath) strikes me as suspicious. It's much easier for scum to talk about theory and hypothetical situations than actual players.

My vote stays.

I did not ignore your request for reads, I only took my time to write them down.

You are the one who's putting emphasis on me mentioning that I am a noob as a joke. I never used this as an argument to defend myself nor to ask other players not to pressure me. Really, you are cherry-picking my first post and making a big deal with it.

I do not see how any of my posts are off-topic. I've always been replying to yours directly, answering every question/concern you had for me. If my posts are off-topic, your questions are off-topic as well.

[Calix]

If you were scum you would hide it very well on day 1. It just seems that you might be trying a little too hard to stay in character.


That's not the impression I get rip

You don't get to make snarky insinuations when you've provided no evidence for anything, or even gone as far as to say "Calix is a scum-read"

Do you think I am scum or not? Be direct please.

[Spruance]

You don't get to make snarky insinuations when you've provided no evidence for anything, or even gone as far as to say "Calix is a scum-read"

Do you think I am scum or not? Be direct please.

How would I have enough evidence to think you were anything...

[Firebringer]

You think the Governor is trying to kiss her ass, so I asked what you read from that, if anything.
my initial gut says its someone trying to get town points for making a "strong town" unlynchable. That assumes two things though, that the governor is scum and Calix is town.

It could be nothing, and its just a stupid thery of mine right now. But I am not giving any twn points t that poerson.
also my keyboard sucks right now.

[Calix]

I did not ignore your request for reads, I only took my time to write them down.

You are the one who's putting emphasis on me mentioning that I am a noob as a joke. I never used this as an argument to defend myself nor to ask other players not to pressure me. Really, you are cherry-picking my first post and making a big deal with it.

I do not see how any of my posts are off-topic. I've always been replying to yours directly, answering every question/concern you had for me. If my posts are off-topic, your questions are off-topic as well.

Given that you continued to talk with Kovath, it's reasonable to assume that you had ignored them.

Yes, because the way that you did it struck me as unnatural. Call me pedantic all you like but I consider it as a way of mitigating any future scum tells as "just a noob" - of course we'll have to see wherever I am correct in that assumption.

I was referring to your early tendency of making odd remarks that diverted from the original topic at hand. You also state the obvious frequently; Kovath's remark about the last line of your reads is the most recent example of this.

[Firebringer]

if anyone knows any valid method of reading spruance I am all ears, I just always assume he is VI.

[Calix]

How would I have enough evidence to think you were anything...

You don't. Nobody does.

If you think I've said something suspicious, ask me about it. Apply this to all of your other scum-reads/ leans if you have any at the moment.

And if you're not confident about it being me, then answer this. If you had to pick one other person who has posted as being scum, who would you pick and why?

No shame in having flimsy reasons - it's the early stage after all.

[Spruance]

You don't. Nobody does.

If you think I've said something suspicious, ask me about it. Apply this to all of your other scum-reads/ leans if you have any at the moment.

And if you're not confident about it being me, then answer this. If you had to pick one other person who has posted as being scum, who would you pick and why?

No shame in having flimsy reasons - it's the early stage after all.

Idk I probably won't post any reads until everyone has posted.

[Calix]

Idk I probably won't post any reads until everyone has posted.

wut

Why would you need everyone else to post before you give reads? Explain please.

[Spruance]

wut

Why would you need everyone else to post before you give reads? Explain please.

They can change easily? The mafia are on a team together so it is important to analyze people's relationships with each other as well.

[Kovath]

They can change easily? The mafia are on a team together so it is important to analyze people's relationships with each other as well.

Pre-flips inc

:facepalm:

[Calix]

They can change easily? The mafia are on a team together so it is important to analyze people's relationships with each other as well.

The fact that they can change means that you should keep us updated so that we can see how your reads progress and thus tell what your alignment is. Hiding your thoughts is anti-town at best or an attempt at scum at keeping their thought processes hidden at worst.

Pre-flip associations will be weak on Day One. Individual reads please.

[Spruance]

The fact that they can change means that you should keep us updated so that we can see how your reads progress and thus tell what your alignment is. Hiding your thoughts is anti-town at best or an attempt at scum at keeping their thought processes hidden at worst.

Pre-flip associations will be weak on Day One. Individual reads please.

Don't really have any yet rip

[Calix]

Don't really have any yet rip

So you make several comments suggesting that I could be scum, that I am 'being too aggressive' (lmao) and that I am 'acting like I am confirmed just because of the Governor' but that doesn't add up into a read at all?

Feels like backtracking.

[Spruance]

So you make several comments suggesting that I could be scum, that I am 'being too aggressive' (lmao) and that I am 'acting like I am confirmed just because of the Governor' but that doesn't add up into a read at all?

Feels like backtracking.

It's useful but not indicative of alignment without more evidence.

[Calix]

It's useful but not indicative of alignment without more evidence.

The hedging is real.

[Firebringer]

Watching Calix tear down a person who we all knows logic is backwards is funny.
Calix what are you hoping to accomplish?

[Calix]

Watching Calix tear down a person who we all knows logic is backwards is funny.
Calix what are you hoping to accomplish?

I could ask you the same question with that post. All you've done so far is made some namby-pamby comments about me and justified his shitty posts by saying he can't logic his way out of a paper bag.

If you don't like me actually pushing players, feel free to do some work yourself.

[Never Unlucky]

Why make this comment and marginalize your own reads? We all know this is only based on a few hours of posts.
My intent was to prevent those reads to be taken out of context later on. Yes, I did state the obvious by doing so, Calix, but I don't want others to cherry-pick this post and take it out of context to use it against me later on.

A)This addition is odd. Scum would be forced to pressure other players because if they didn't, that would make for the most obvious scum tell ever. Use of 'theoretically' and the emphasis you added on it implies that even you realise that this is a flimsy point.
B) You saw some of the queries that players had over these two players - your thoughts on those?
C) This is also waffling in the sense that it takes you too many words to say "null" but might just be how you type. Shall check out AI overnight and see for myself.
D)What do you make of my accusations that you yourself deflect?
E) Why do you think Kovath's concern over you using his reasoning is 'strange'? How could it be scum-motivated in your eyes.
F) Again, this is what Kovath accused you of, meaning you should agree with Kovath's reasoning for his push on you. Yet you scum-read Kovath somewhat...please explain the differences between the two situations here.
A) Yes, those are my thoughts worded adequately.
B) Well, I honestly think that Gyrlander was simply making a joke by voting you in the first place. In that sense, I disregarded this query of yours being that Gyrlander didn't pay attention to the OP. However, the query about Gyrlander wanting to pressure Unknown but doing nothing to get this player in the heat was valid. As for Mesk, I agree : her thought process makes no sense. The rumor has it that she’s always town though. (It’s a joke, Calix.)
C) Mhh… I try to use the fewest words as I can to get my message through usually.
D) Please tell me when did I deflect your accusations? I always intend to answer directly.
E) It is very strange because nobody who wants the conversation to advance (any townie) wouldn’t want others to use their posts to contribute. The fact that me using his reasoning made him react in such an angry/defensive way really did not seem town-like to me.
F) The differences are that Kovath responded in an angry/defensive way which made me suspect him and that I null-read Unknown. But, yes, his reasoning to push for me is valid.

This comment is three sentences long despite it adding nothing to the conversation.
Boy, I despise this type of post. They are so hypocritical. By making them, you ask another player to add something to the conversation by not adding anything yourself.

[Calix]

My intent was to prevent those reads to be taken out of context later on. Yes, I did state the obvious by doing so, Calix, but I don't want others to cherry-pick this post and take it out of context to use it against me later on.

Wouldn't it be obvious that they were cherry-picking in that scenario? Seems like an odd concern to have, especially one that relates to how you are seen in the thread.


A) Yes, those are my thoughts worded adequately.
B) Well, I honestly think that Gyrlander was simply making a joke by voting you in the first place. In that sense, I disregarded this query of yours being that Gyrlander didn't pay attention to the OP. However, the query about Gyrlander wanting to pressure Unknown but doing nothing to get this player in the heat was valid. As for Mesk, I agree : her thought process makes no sense. The rumor has it that she’s always town though. (It’s a joke, Calix.)
C) Mhh… I try to use the fewest words as I can to get my message through usually.
D) Please tell me when did I deflect your accusations? I always intend to answer directly.
E) It is very strange because nobody who wants the conversation to advance (any townie) wouldn’t want others to use their posts to contribute. The fact that me using his reasoning made him react in such an angry/defensive way really did not seem town-like to me.
F) The differences are that Kovath responded in an angry/defensive way which made me suspect him and that I null-read Unknown. But, yes, his reasoning to push for me is valid.

Boy, I despise this type of post. They are so hypocritical. By making them, you ask another player to add something to the conversation by not adding anything yourself.

A. I'm glad I read your mind so precisely then ;)

B. I am aware of Mesk's "I am town" routine...but she hasn't actually said that in the game yet, so why bring that up? Surely you're not actually using that as a basis for a read, right?

C. lmao

D. What I meant was "you have a tendency of deflecting" but we've already covered this, so not relevant.

E + F. Correct me if I am wrong, but you are arguing that Kovath is angry and defensive because you borrowed his reasoning. Can you explain why this would be scum-motivated and why any scum motivations here would override potential town motivations for such a reaction?

Secondly, why is getting angry/ defensive a scum tell to you?

I was calling you out on a useless post. Initiative is always nice.

[Eggy]

Ok so I just read through everything and I think I have to brush up on the setup again. Im going to make sure that I dont lurk this game because last game I played I got myself mislynched for lurking hardcore lol. Do the scum know who eachother are? If so I cud see calix being scum and being pardonned so he is safe for the night. But his play is kind of towny in my eyes so I doubt it. So far everyone is null for me, except mesk who is always town(no joke played with her several times and I havnt seen her scum once...) which I find kinda strange but thats besides the point. Im going to hold of on placing any votes until I can establish better reads. I not the best day one played I like to wait for the game to play out before I build enough confidence to make more solid reads.

[Calix]

Ok so I just read through everything and I think I have to brush up on the setup again. Im going to make sure that I dont lurk this game because last game I played I got myself mislynched for lurking hardcore lol. Do the scum know who eachother are? If so I cud see calix being scum and being pardonned so he is safe for the night. But his play is kind of towny in my eyes so I doubt it. So far everyone is null for me, except mesk who is always town(no joke played with her several times and I havnt seen her scum once...) which I find kinda strange but thats besides the point. Im going to hold of on placing any votes until I can establish better reads. I not the best day one played I like to wait for the game to play out before I build enough confidence to make more solid reads.

Scum are aware of each other's identities. Pretty sure they also talked during N0 so there's that in terms of associations as the scum are more coordinated on Day One than they usually are.

I have a vagina by the way.

I second not voting early on in case some idiot who didn't read the setup decides to sheep the Mayor or whatever.

Do you have any thoughts on the State Attorney voting for you?

[GameFreak]

hello everybody

Unknown1234

[GameFreak]

I'm playing with you in hope to get reactions that I can analyze, so don't worry. We should focus on Mesk saying that 1 Congressman is evil when there is no confirmation.

Gyr we all know you just sheep

[Calix]

I for one find it curious that Unknown has three RVS votes on him. None of his voters have provided reasoning so I don't know what they're expecting to get out of it other than to vote-park.



Eggy (1 [L-6]): (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/28401)
States Attorney (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628004)
Never Unlucky (1 [L-6]): (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/27959)
Calix (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628005)
Unknown1234 (2 [L-5]): (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/28243)
Kovath (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628006), GameFreak (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628122)
oops_ur_dead (2 [L-5]): (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/2230)
Mesk514 (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628020), Brendan (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628054)
unknown (1 [L-6]): (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/member.php/24092)
Gyrlander (http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php?p=628031)

[Firebringer]

I could ask you the same question with that post. All you've done so far is made some namby-pamby comments about me and justified his shitty posts by saying he can't logic his way out of a paper bag.

If you don't like me actually pushing players, feel free to do some work yourself.

You could, but you would be deflecting the point. You also bring up something irrelevant to the conversation such as "What have you done?" That isn't what we are talking about so its a moot point.

We have both played with SPruance and I think we can both agree his logic is weird if not downright alien. So when you try to pick argument fights with him it looks like you are just trying to find something to latch onto to make sure you can maintain a fake "Calix is angry/annoyed" attitude.

If I were you, I would do same thing if I was known for being irritated at terrible players.

[Firebringer]

My gut says Never Unlucky is completely off btw.
His tone doesn't match his actions if that makes sense.

[Never Unlucky]

Wouldn't it be obvious that they were cherry-picking in that scenario? Seems like an odd concern to have, especially one that relates to how you are seen in the thread.



A. I'm glad I read your mind so precisely then ;)

B. I am aware of Mesk's "I am town" routine...but she hasn't actually said that in the game yet, so why bring that up? Surely you're not actually using that as a basis for a read, right?

C. lmao

D. What I meant was "you have a tendency of deflecting" but we've already covered this, so not relevant.

E + F. Correct me if I am wrong, but you are arguing that Kovath is angry and defensive because you borrowed his reasoning. Can you explain why this would be scum-motivated and why any scum motivations here would override potential town motivations for such a reaction?

Secondly, why is getting angry/ defensive a scum tell to you?

I was calling you out on a useless post. Initiative is always nice.

B) "The rumor has it that she’s always town though. (It’s a joke, Calix.)" :facepalm: Of course I am not using this to make a read... I have Mesk as "null" while the "rumor" is that she's always town.

C) rude :3

E+F Would you word your 1stquestion differently please? I feel like I've correctly answered it twice and would find myself repeating myself if I were to answer it again.
2nd question - to me, using emotions just shows that you either have got something to hide or cannot use arguments to defend yourself so you result in using emotions. This is what Eggy did in AI, and he was scum. Kovath got angry, it alerted my suspicion.

As for being defensive, it is not necessarily a bad thing. I myself act very defensive at times. However, Kovath was defensive for no reason, really. I didn't misrep his reasonings, nor did I simply copy-pasted them. He really made it clear that he did not want me to "sheep" him, and I do not know why.

I called you out on a useless post as well. We're even. :)

[GameFreak]

Idk I probably won't post any reads until everyone has posted.

Spruance , this post is so out of line. It screams i'm scum and need to look town.

[Firebringer]

Spruance , this post is so out of line. It screams i'm scum and need to look town.

Name a post from him that has ever screamed he was town pls.

[Calix]

You could, but you would be deflecting the point. You also bring up something irrelevant to the conversation such as "What have you done?" That isn't what we are talking about so its a moot point.

We have both played with SPruance and I think we can both agree his logic is weird if not downright alien. So when you try to pick argument fights with him it looks like you are just trying to find something to latch onto to make sure you can maintain a fake "Calix is angry/annoyed" attitude.

If I were you, I would do same thing if I was known for being irritated at terrible players.

That's a terrible response and you're still not doing anything but railing on me. You have not even voted, implying that nobody strikes you as suspicious enough to push...

Why are you defending Spruance still? You have not said that you town-read him and you said earlier that you find him hard to read (thus pushing him would be optimal) so this looks like an attempt at buddying/ chainsawing.

I don't agree that he uses 'alien' logic.

You are awfully hung up over me 'faking' my attitude when you have provided no evidence of that and said yourself that genuine was possible. Yet you insist on peddling the less likely narrative with nothing to back it up...and this takes the place of any actual contribution - why?

You cannot even push me properly because I cannot be adequately pressured today due to being pardoned. You are wasting your time. Explain what you get out of this.

[GameFreak]

Ok so I just read through everything and I think I have to brush up on the setup again. Im going to make sure that I dont lurk this game because last game I played I got myself mislynched for lurking hardcore lol. Do the scum know who eachother are? If so I cud see calix being scum and being pardonned so he is safe for the night. But his play is kind of towny in my eyes so I doubt it. So far everyone is null for me, except mesk who is always town(no joke played with her several times and I havnt seen her scum once...) which I find kinda strange but thats besides the point. Im going to hold of on placing any votes until I can establish better reads. I not the best day one played I like to wait for the game to play out before I build enough confidence to make more solid reads.

I have no faith in you.

Irrelevant if you are going to read the setup , what a stupid question even

Contradiction in your first post

Same as Spruance , in doing so you are useless. Any towny should post his thoughts no matter what so we can see your thought process.
I don't care how dumb they are

Your post comes across as a scum being bad at looking town

[Calix]

Name a post from him that has ever screamed he was town pls.

The M-FM, perhaps?

See my comments on you defending him.

[GameFreak]

My gut says Never Unlucky is completely off btw.
His tone doesn't match his actions if that makes sense.

I get the same feeling.

[GameFreak]

Name a post from him that has ever screamed he was town pls.

There are plenty , whats your opinion on somebody saying, oh i withhold my reads till i've read the rest.
I don't care how scummy he looks the argument itself is just bad.

[Calix]

B) "The rumor has it that she’s always town though. (It’s a joke, Calix.)" :facepalm: Of course I am not using this to make a read... I have Mesk as "null" while the "rumor" is that she's always town.

C) rude :3

E+F Would you word your 1stquestion differently please? I feel like I've correctly answered it twice and would find myself repeating myself if I were to answer it again.
2nd question - to me, using emotions just shows that you either have got something to hide or cannot use arguments to defend yourself so you result in using emotions. This is what Eggy did in AI, and he was scum. Kovath got angry, it alerted my suspicion.

As for being defensive, it is not necessarily a bad thing. I myself act very defensive at times. However, Kovath was defensive for no reason, really. I didn't misrep his reasonings, nor did I simply copy-pasted them. He really made it clear that he did not want me to "sheep" him, and I do not know why.

I called you out on a useless post as well. We're even. :)

E+F: I don't follow. Emotions aren't rational - why couldn't Kovath just be legitimately angry at the thought of you copying his reasoning? If you were arguing that it was out of character for Kovath then you might have a point but you didn't.

Furthermore, emotions aren't scummy by themselves. Scum struggle to sustain emotions for long periods of time so a single 'outburst' (for lack of a better term) is insufficient to form a scum-read.

I am not asking for the hell of it, by the by. I personally think he is town myself (if nothing else than because of how he looks compared to everyone else...) and I don't find your current arguments to be convincing.

[GameFreak]

Alright i'm caught up.

Firebringer

To me Spruance and Never Unlucky are in the same boat, yet you respond to them differently. You cannot defend Spruance and attack NU, I can't follow that logic.

[Calix]

Alright i'm caught up.

Firebringer

To me Spruance and Never Unlucky are in the same boat, yet you respond to them differently. You cannot defend Spruance and attack NU, I can't follow that logic.

Just to clarify, you scum-read both Unlucky and Spruance?

If this is the case, and if you think Firebringer is scum, then I'd invite you to reconsider given that this would imply that there are three scum which you have just found on Day One.

While I am here, any town-reads that stick out to you?

[GameFreak]

Just to clarify, you scum-read both Unlucky and Spruance?

If this is the case, and if you think Firebringer is scum, then I'd invite you to reconsider given that this would imply that there are three scum which you have just found on Day One.

While I am here, any town-reads that stick out to you?

No i don't scumread them, i find that if you scumread one you shouldn't go about defending the other.

So far you are not straying from your town meta, I also like Kovath's posts they seem well reasonend.

The rest i'll need more from to form an opinion.

Dislike Eggy's post but 1 post isn't enough.

[Calix]

No i don't scumread them, i find that if you scumread one you shouldn't go about defending the other.

So far you are not straying from your town meta, I also like Kovath's posts they seem well reasonend.

The rest i'll need more from to form an opinion.

Dislike Eggy's post but 1 post isn't enough.

I find both to be suspicious, but Firebringer's defense/ chainsawing of Spruance was so bad and I highly doubt that all three of them are scum. That's just retarded. Going to hold off on reconsidering until I read whatever they post overnight while I am asleep. If anyone reading this is stuck on who to pressure, I recommend these three.

I'll say this though. If one or more of those plebs are town, they need to make themselves more obvious.

[oops_ur_dead]

ya'll should stop being r00d d00ds

night actions don't really tell me anything by themselves

[GameFreak]

I'm off to bed aswell.

Cya tomorrow

[Unknown1234]

I'm the one who can have the most fun, I get to fake vote!

Gyrlander

Stay tuned for Unknowns input.

[Unknown1234]

I'm off to bed aswell.

Cya tomorrow

Damn it, I just missed you dude.

[Spruance]

Spruance , this post is so out of line. It screams i'm scum and need to look town.

Why does it seem like a scream? I didn't use caps lock.

[Spruance]

I guess I'm trying to differ from my strategy for overwatch which was accuse every player (expect hanzo rip) until I made up my mind. If I'm a bit polar opposite this game I don't really mind because it's easier to go too far to find where to readjust to for future games.

[Spruance]

Overwatch kind of destroyed my confidence over reads so I need some time to recover

[Unknown1234]

Overwatch kind of destroyed my confidence over reads so I need some time to recover

No kidding, you said I was confirmed dude.

[Calix]

Why does it seem like a scream? I didn't use caps lock.

This is pedantic as fuck and I'd consider adding it to my signature if I had enough space.


I guess I'm trying to differ from my strategy for overwatch which was accuse every player (expect hanzo rip) until I made up my mind. If I'm a bit polar opposite this game I don't really mind because it's easier to go too far to find where to readjust to for future games.

And what exactly is your current strategy?


Overwatch kind of destroyed my confidence over reads so I need some time to recover

Not old enough to attend the safe spaces at university, got it :)

[Unknown1234]

hello everybody

Unknown1234

Literally, I laugh at this post simply because of the post beneath it.

[Unknown1234]

LUL
Gyr we all know you just sheep

[Spruance]

This is pedantic as fuck and I'd consider adding it to my signature if I had enough space.



And what exactly is your current strategy?



Not old enough to attend the safe spaces at university, got it :)


My new strategy is to hold my vote until someone scumslips.

[Kovath]

Why is this narrative being pursued that I was "angry" at getting my reasoning "sheeped"? I wasn't angry, I was trying to pin down Never Unlucky on possible buddying / "assimilation" by referencing me, especially when he's not townreading me.

Gyrlander and Mesk slipping away after their weird starts *facepalm*

Spruance is being reluctant to provide much with any confidence, but he is avoiding doing his semi-lurk thing so if scumminess persists we can catch him on it.

[Kovath]

My new strategy is to hold my vote until someone scumslips.

...You're seriously going to vote off of scumslips?

That's worked REALLY well in previous games, guise...

[Calix]

My new strategy is to hold my vote until someone scumslips.

Did you learn nothing from Instant Mafia 1.0 about 'scum slips'?

You're also not going to find 'slips' by sitting back and doing nothing.

Scum are not just going to drunkenly waltz into your bedroom and surrender. You have to actually like, find them?

[Spruance]

Did you learn nothing from Instant Mafia 1.0 about 'scum slips'?

You're also not going to find 'slips' by sitting back and doing nothing.

Scum are not just going to drunkenly waltz into your bedroom and surrender. You have to actually like, find them?

When I am done with them they will be begging for mercy don't worry.

[Never Unlucky]

I find both to be suspicious, but Firebringer's defense/ chainsawing of Spruance was so bad and I highly doubt that all three of them are scum. That's just retarded. Going to hold off on reconsidering until I read whatever they post overnight while I am asleep. If anyone reading this is stuck on who to pressure, I recommend these three.

I'll say this though. If one or more of those plebs are town, they need to make themselves more obvious.

This makes no sense.

I don't get why I'm in such hot waters tbh. In my eyes, I'm the most obvious town along Calix in here. I've given my reads, I haven't lurked not lurking, I've done my best to contribute, and I've been responsive to the queries concerning me. If someone could give me a summary of the scummy-looking things in my play, it would be appreciated.

[oops_ur_dead]

In my eyes, I'm the most obvious town along Calix in here.

same

[Calix]

This makes no sense.

I don't get why I'm in such hot waters tbh. In my eyes, I'm the most obvious town along Calix in here. I've given my reads, I haven't lurked not lurking, I've done my best to contribute, and I've been responsive to the queries concerning me. If someone could give me a summary of the scummy-looking things in my play, it would be appreciated.

Cancerous colour detected. Please use a lighter colour that doesn't blend into the background next time.

I am saying that I find you/ Spruance/ Firebringer scummy. However, you three being the scum team = illogical to me so therefore at least one of you must be town.

You neglect to mention one thing in your contributions - few of them were done using your own initiative. I asked for reads and responding to queries =/= contributing because you are just defending yourself. You lack any spontaneity.

Contribution =/= town. Not lurking =/= town.

Try pushing your scum-reads instead of whining over not being instantly town-read a few hours into the game.

[oops_ur_dead]

Cancerous colour detected. Please use a lighter colour that doesn't blend into the background next time.

its gone terminal

[Unknown1234]

its gone terminal

I hope you don't continue this.

[Firebringer]

I need more votes on me if I am going to become president.

[Firebringer]

I find both to be suspicious, but Firebringer's defense/ chainsawing of Spruance was so bad and I highly doubt that all three of them are scum. That's just retarded. Going to hold off on reconsidering until I read whatever they post overnight while I am asleep. If anyone reading this is stuck on who to pressure, I recommend these three.

I'll say this though. If one or more of those plebs are town, they need to make themselves more obvious.

What I find humorous is Calix didn't even question "Town meta" on herself. Just kind of rolls with it. Odd...

Also how am I chainsawing? I literally can't lynch you. I don't think you know what a chainsaw is darling.
I am defending him, cause I see him as a low hanging fruit.

Please, have some more salt though. ;)

[Firebringer]

...You're seriously going to vote off of scumslips?

That's worked REALLY well in previous games, guise...

Probably because people mistake what a real scum slip is, and its rare if ever actually there.

[Firebringer]

same

oops_ur_dead
Town needs to get lynched.

[Brendan]

"namby-pamby" :EleGiggle:

[Eggy]

Scum are aware of each other's identities. Pretty sure they also talked during N0 so there's that in terms of associations as the scum are more coordinated on Day One than they usually are.

I have a vagina by the way.

I second not voting early on in case some idiot who didn't read the setup decides to sheep the Mayor or whatever.

Do you have any thoughts on the State Attorney voting for you?

Duly noted lol. And Im assuming it was either scum knowing that im town and am the only real identofied TPR or it was town trying to go for a policy lynch people were talking about (which I dont really understand) I dont think the night one night actions will give us to much info

[Eggy]

I have no faith in you.

Irrelevant if you are going to read the setup , what a stupid question even

Contradiction in your first post

Same as Spruance , in doing so you are useless. Any towny should post his thoughts no matter what so we can see your thought process.
I don't care how dumb they are

Your post comes across as a scum being bad at looking town

How am I contradicting myself lol? Im said that calix could he scum based off the pardon, but based off her play I doubt it, that is literally offering my thoughts like you are saying every town should do later in your same post. Where did I say I am not going to post my thoughts? I only said I am going to hold my votes? And I warned people that I like to let the game play out before I form solid reads(which makes a lot of sense) I can tell you are going to be annoying and try to read into things that are not actually there.

[Unknown1234]

oops_ur_dead
Town needs to get lynched.

Are you seriously building an early train based on nothing?

Firebringer

Pretend my vote is there.

[Eggy]

Why is there 3 votes on oops already? And what gas brendan posted so far other than a vote? Didnt even notice his presence when I read through the thread.

[Eggy]

Theres no doc and scum kno im TPR the chance of me surviving the night are extremely slim.. I dont rlly understand that :/

[Eggy]

How am I supposed to counter that? Or is the mayor just destined to die before the second day starts?

[Brendan]

Why is there 3 votes on oops already? And what gas brendan posted so far other than a vote? Didnt even notice his presence when I read through the thread.

LUL

[Eggy]

Am I missing something? I havnt seen u post anything sonce the game started. Maybe I didnt see something but I dont feel like reading through again. Just correct me if im wrong

[Firebringer]

Eggy (1 [L-6]):
States Attorney
Never Unlucky (1 [L-6]):
Calix
Unknown1234 (1 [L-6]):
Kovath
oops_ur_dead (3 [L-4]):
Mesk514, Brendan, Firebringer
unknown (1 [L-6]):
Gyrlander
Firebringer (1 [L-6]):
GameFreak, Unknown1234

Is the VC fucked up or just me?
I only have 1 vote but two people are on me.

EXPLANATIONS!!!

[Firebringer]

ohhh
Unknown1234 is the mayor with 0 votes.

LOL, Unknown got stomped in the pregame. That is hilarious.

[Calix]

What I find humorous is Calix didn't even question "Town meta" on herself. Just kind of rolls with it. Odd...

Also how am I chainsawing? I literally can't lynch you. I don't think you know what a chainsaw is darling.
I am defending him, cause I see him as a low hanging fruit.

Please, have some more salt though. ;)

You're attacking me for scum-hunting...meanwhile doing absolutely none of your own...Jesus Christ, why the fuck did you sign if you're just going to be as useless as everyone else?

Chainsawing is attacking someone's accuser which is exactly what you're doing.

I don't know how this flew over your head but almost everyone in the game is a low-hanging fruit. Defending Spruance for this reason does not add up.


oops_ur_dead
Town needs to get lynched.


Why is there 3 votes on oops already? And what gas brendan posted so far other than a vote? Didnt even notice his presence when I read through the thread.

Oops train, much like Unknown's, is shit. Can't even read Oops because all he's done is troll. Hell, can't read half the players because they are not playing.

Brendan is also refusing to post any content. Has he posted anything outside of emoticons? Given that Brendan tends to troll as scum, I find this more notable. (Charmander's Revenge, anyone?) I would policy lynch him at the moment. No point 'pressuring' it as it will just be ignored.

[Firebringer]

You're attacking me for scum-hunting...meanwhile doing absolutely none of your own...Jesus Christ, why the fuck did you sign if you're just going to be as useless as everyone else?

Chainsawing is attacking someone's accuser which is exactly what you're doing.
.

Incorrect, I am not attacking you for "scumhunting" I am scumreading you because I think you are trying to fake town style of your own. Very different, I like how you say I am not doing anything, apparently questioning and trying to probe your mind isn't participatory or "scumhunting"

Are you blind?

Anyways, you are right many are not participating in this game, are you saying we should policy everyone of them?

[Unknown1234]

ohhh
Unknown1234 is the mayor with 0 votes.

LOL, Unknown got stomped in the pregame. That is hilarious.

I laugh at you. Hah.

[Unknown1234]

Firebringer you remind me of a doorknob.

What makes Calix "faking Yœ " opposed to naturally playing town?

[Unknown1234]

Firebringer you remind me of a doorknob.

What makes Calix "faking town " opposed to naturally playing town?

What the hell...

[Calix]

Incorrect, I am not attacking you for "scumhunting" I am scumreading you because I think you are trying to fake town style of your own. Very different, I like how you say I am not doing anything, apparently questioning and trying to probe your mind isn't participatory or "scumhunting"

Are you blind?

Anyways, you are right many are not participating in this game, are you saying we should policy everyone of them?

You still have not given any evidence for me 'faking' my town style, thus you are not scum-hunting. You are flinging shit at a wall and calling it a day. Last game you were scum, you deliberately dredged up your grudge against BananaCucho in the form of that shitty 1v1. You also did this in Decisions. Why shouldn't I read your posts as an attempt at doing something similar?

Focusing on me, someone who cannot be pressured today, and actively ignoring my attempts to get you to discuss other players = scummy.

I like how you don't disagree with my logic about chainsawing. In fact, you cut out the comment where I say "I don't know how this flew over your head but almost everyone in the game is a low-hanging fruit. Defending Spruance for this reason does not add up."

Not only do you implicitly admit that you were chainsawing Spruance, you go out of your way to avoid explaining this discrepancy.

I would hope that the replacements would take over the slots of the most useless players first, but if that doesn't happen, then yes.

[Calix]

Firebringer you remind me of a doorknob.

What makes Calix "faking Yœ " opposed to naturally playing town?

Hello hi, can you try and be less useless and give your own thoughts on players?

Also what does "remind you of a doorknob" even mean? lmao

[Firebringer]

You still have not given any evidence for me 'faking' my town style, thus you are not scum-hunting. You are flinging shit at a wall and calling it a day. Last game you were scum, you deliberately dredged up your grudge against BananaCucho in the form of that shitty 1v1. You also did this in Decisions. Why shouldn't I read your posts as an attempt at doing something similar?

Focusing on me, someone who cannot be pressured today, and actively ignoring my attempts to get you to discuss other players = scummy.

I like how you don't disagree with my logic about chainsawing. In fact, you cut out the comment where I say "I don't know how this flew over your head but almost everyone in the game is a low-hanging fruit. Defending Spruance for this reason does not add up."

Not only do you implicitly admit that you were chainsawing Spruance, you go out of your way to avoid explaining this discrepancy.

I would hope that the replacements would take over the slots of the most useless players first, but if that doesn't happen, then yes.

Can you cut your argument down to like 2-3 sentences please? or don't and I will just ignore them.

Anyways, no I didn't "implicitly admit that I was chainsawing" Chainsawing means voting a person that is voting your ally. If you want to rewrite the definition to your stupid new definition. Sure. W/e. You win your own semantic game of redefining words.

I am not going to go grab every game town game of you to show you what I mean, and its not "Throwing shit at the wall" You seriously need to get out of your own ass with this kind of logic. Like seriously, get out of it, you aren't as good as you think you are.

Sure, I went after banana with some vendettas as scum. Are you saying i vendettas with you? Cause, like....this would be first I would be hearing about it.

"
Focusing on me, someone who cannot be pressured today, and actively ignoring my attempts to get you to discuss other players = scummy." So because I can't lynch you, you should be free and clear and I should push other people. Got it, miss her majesty says I can't try to read her guys.

Guys I gotta go!

[Firebringer]

Firebringer you remind me of a doorknob.

What makes Calix "faking Yœ " opposed to naturally playing town?

Ehhh it could be her town game, not going to rule that out.
I just don't instantly hand that out to her, because everyone else 90% of the time does it.

Her "scumhunting" so far has been picking on weak arguments and things that I know would piss her off. So it seems like she intentionally is doing that to make sure she seems annoyed and frustrated so everyone reads her as town.

Like, she could be just dumbass who doesn't realize arguing with spruance is pointless, but I have a higher opinion of her than that. NOt much higher, but a little higher.

[Firebringer]

I am going to say, I think Gamefreak is town. Its mostly a gut thing though.

My scum pool right now is: Never Unlucky, Calix, Oops Your Dead

Null: Everyone else.

Maybe town: Kovath and Mesk

[Calix]

Ehhh it could be her town game, not going to rule that out.
I just don't instantly hand that out to her, because everyone else 90% of the time does it.

Her "scumhunting" so far has been picking on weak arguments and things that I know would piss her off. So it seems like she intentionally is doing that to make sure she seems annoyed and frustrated so everyone reads her as town.

Like, she could be just dumbass who doesn't realize arguing with spruance is pointless, but I have a higher opinion of her than that. NOt much higher, but a little higher.

"things that I know would piss her off" - Stop right there, go to Jail, don't collect £200. You do not know shit.

"I don't town-read her because everyone else does it" - Strong.

Again, you have not done any of your own and if you're not going to bother then I'm not going to sit around and prod you anymore than I have. Tearing on someone else's work while doing none yourself = scummy. Simple as that.


I am going to say, I think Gamefreak is town. Its mostly a gut thing though.

My scum pool right now is: Never Unlucky, Calix, Oops Your Dead

Null: Everyone else.

Maybe town: Kovath and Mesk

You actually have a reason for scum-reading Oops?

[Calix]

Can you cut your argument down to like 2-3 sentences please? or don't and I will just ignore them.

Stop being a lazy fucktard.


Anyways, no I didn't "implicitly admit that I was chainsawing" Chainsawing means voting a person that is voting your ally. If you want to rewrite the definition to your stupid new definition. Sure. W/e. You win your own semantic game of redefining words.

I am not going to go grab every game town game of you to show you what I mean, and its not "Throwing shit at the wall" You seriously need to get out of your own ass with this kind of logic. Like seriously, get out of it, you aren't as good as you think you are.

Either MS has made you a worse player or you're doing this on purpose. This entire paragraph is full of passive-aggressive behaviour and salt, which I am noting, but you don't actually refute my points.

This is the same thing you were complaining about in the M-FM. Why do it now...?


Sure, I went after banana with some vendettas as scum. Are you saying i vendettas with you? Cause, like....this would be first I would be hearing about it.

Yes, you have a tendency of going after me with poor logic as scum just like you do with Banana.


So because I can't lynch you, you should be free and clear and I should push other people. Got it, miss her majesty says I can't try to read her guys.

Guys I gotta go!

Again with mocking the idea of pushing other players.

Question. How am I supposed to respond to your 'read' in a productive when you give nothing for me to respond to?

"Oh she SOUNDS fake" - GTFO with that.

[Firebringer]

Do you honestly think you will get me to react to this in the way you want?

I can tell you just want to piss me off sweatheart. I ain't taking the bait ;)

[Calix]

Do you honestly think you will get me to react to this in the way you want?

I can tell you just want to piss me off sweatheart. I ain't taking the bait ;)

Is that really all you are going to say in response?

As a side note, I can see Brendan's lurking away in the thread. I'm sure he's diligently taking notes.

[Firebringer]

Stop being a lazy fucktard.



Either MS has made you a worse player or you're doing this on purpose. This entire paragraph is full of passive-aggressive behaviour and salt, which I am noting, but you don't actually refute my points.

This is the same thing you were complaining about in the M-FM. Why do it now...?



Yes, you have a tendency of going after me with poor logic as scum just like you do with Banana.



Again with mocking the idea of pushing other players.

Question. How am I supposed to respond to your 'read' in a productive when you give nothing for me to respond to?

"Oh she SOUNDS fake" - GTFO with that.
1) Naah being lazy is more fun. And it annoys you, two bonuses bae.
2) Read my signature, I am the worst next to banana love. Nice attacks, try again :)
3) Can you go pull up a game of me pushing you as scum? Cause I don't remember any, maybe that game as Serial Killer in Cold Wars? Not sure. Don't think thats a "Common" thing. But I can believe yu think this of yourself.
4) I am not mocking yur pushing other players, I am pointing out you push players that aren't going to give you solid reads so it looks like you atrying to keep busy. Can you stop misreping my argument and argue how you plan to read spruance well through this argument you had with him?

Cause you dodging, misrepping, and trying to do personal attacks. Really really scummy. And honestly, kind of beneath you.

[Firebringer]

You actually have a reason for scum-reading Oops?
I actually do! It has many reasons, that I can't go into, because if I do so. Well, it won't work in the future.

[Calix]

1) Naah being lazy is more fun. And it annoys you, two bonuses bae.
2) Read my signature, I am the worst next to banana love. Nice attacks, try again :)
3) Can you go pull up a game of me pushing you as scum? Cause I don't remember any, maybe that game as Serial Killer in Cold Wars? Not sure. Don't think thats a "Common" thing. But I can believe yu think this of yourself.
4) I am not mocking yur pushing other players, I am pointing out you push players that aren't going to give you solid reads so it looks like you atrying to keep busy. Can you stop misreping my argument and argue how you plan to read spruance well through this argument you had with him?

Cause you dodging, misrepping, and trying to do personal attacks. Really really scummy. And honestly, kind of beneath you.

1. Great logic.

2. See #1

3. Return to Normalcy, where you tried and failed to lynch me as Executioner. That Cold War game as you said. Koopolitics.

4. That makes no sense. Most players are 'not going to give solid reads' - something you haven't disagreed with - so does that mean that you disagree with pushing them as well...? If you dislike my strategy then how do you propose that we form reads on players? Because you have criticised me pushing Spruance but offer no viable alternative.

The argument with Spruance, if you wish to call it that, led to knowing about how he claims he's going to approach the game + absolute refusal to give any reads until 'everyone has checked in' + how people reacted to him + your defense of him which led to this conversation. Stop trying to paint it as useless please.

Meta attacks with no backing. Trying to claim that personal attacks are AI. Claiming that 'dodging' (???), 'misrepresenting' what you are doing is 'really really scummy' which is either a massive exaggeration or you overstating your confidence in that read.

[Calix]

I actually do! It has many reasons, that I can't go into, because if I do so. Well, it won't work in the future.

Given that you have given Oops nothing to respond to, how do you expect your read of him to progress? Not that I think he would respond anyway but you haven't even given him the chance to.

He's also done nothing but shit-post. Unless you are using meta, I see no in-game reason to vote him that would be detrimental to reveal.

Why does everything you say sound like something lifted from the M-FM?

[Firebringer]

Did you quote a game where I was Exectuioner and my target was you as an exmple of me pushing you as scum?

LOLOLOLOLOL

[Firebringer]

Given that you have given Oops nothing to respond to, how do you expect your read of him to progress? Not that I think he would respond anyway but you haven't even given him the chance to.

He's also done nothing but shit-post. Unless you are using meta, I see no in-game reason to vote him that would be detrimental to reveal.

Why does everything you say sound like something lifted from the M-FM?

1) Oops isn't going to respond to it, cause I know he won't, but he gave a pretty good scum tell.
2) Meh
3) I did lift everything I have said from the M-FM, can you guess where and which quotes?

[Firebringer]

Post 182 is not worth commenting on.
So, I want oops lynched.

Everyone should ocme in here and lynch him, using lynching vote pwers.

Ill see you in the morning, I am off to sleep.

[Calix]

Did you quote a game where I was Exectuioner and my target was you as an exmple of me pushing you as scum?

LOLOLOLOLOL

Ignoring the rest of my post to comment on a meta reference. Brilliant.


1) Oops isn't going to respond to it, cause I know he won't, but he gave a pretty good scum tell.
2) Meh
3) I did lift everything I have said from the M-FM, can you guess where and which quotes?

1. Helpful. If you're town, you're doing an A* job at persuading people to vote with you.

3. Are you being serious right now?

Pre-edit: Let me take a look at that now...

[Mesk514]

Okay, so I start by answering this:

, but I don't want others to cherry-pick this post and take it out of context to use it against me later on.
As for Mesk, I agree : her thought process makes no sense. The rumor has it that she’s always town though. (It’s a joke, Calix.)


I choose to answer this first because it is not a joke, it is a fact and it of course applies to this game. Also, I understand that my first 3 posts made no sense as Congressman does not have the ability to add the extra vote, only the States Attorney. Sorry, misinterpretation... upon looking back I can't even understand my own thought process for getting the two confused.

However, I think setup speculation is actually important in a game like this as all findings are read based. The actions presented at the beginning should actually be thoroughly looked into by all of us... which as of yet has not been done by everyone yet. It is important to understand the motivation behind certain actions, i.e, the State Attorney, The Judge & Governor.

At this moment I'm going to put my money on our Mayor being town. This has nothing to do with setup speculation. This is based off Eggy being a town lean for me right now, which I will get too shortly.

I'm going to address the setup as I think that mechanically somethings make more sense than others. I'm sure there's some sort of balance in the setup. I'm also going to say that there's 3 scum, this is just the easier thing to think. So with that being said I think the setup has 5 possible ways it could go.

1- Mayor, x3 Congressman, x5 Voters, Judge, States Attorney, Governor
2- Mayor, x2 Congressman, Governor, x5 Voters,Judge, States Attorney, x1 Congressman
3- Mayor, x3 Congressman, Governor, x4 VotersJudge, States Attorney, x1 Voter
4- x3 Congressman,Governor, Mayor, Judge, States Attorney, x5 Voters
5- x3 Voters, x2 Voters, x3 Congressman, Judge, Governor, Mayor, States Attorney



Of course these are all surrounding the fact that I believe Eggy is a non scum Mayor. At this moment I believe that the Judge and the Governor are variables. I think the anonymous vote on Eggy is very blatantly Scum trying to get a mislynch just like that. Therefore, I am reluctant to believe that States Attorney is scum. Setup 4&5 seem like an unlikely blood bath designed to make us go crazy... But hey this is Mafia, right?


Okay so now reads...


Calix : She comes off with that aggressive approach which as a fellow individual with a vagina, I can understand where this comes from. I don't believe this to be a reason for her to be Scum as it's probably her just being confident and stern with her so far reads. Her behaviour makes sense from a town point of view.



Governor pardoning me was stupid - all it does is confirm that I am not the Governor and thus reduces the number of players that can be. I don't consider the move to be alignment-indicative one way or another as I have yet to be lynched on Day One. I agree that they probably assumed that it wouldn't do much harm.
States Attorney voting right at the start for the confirmed role is moronic and it means we have less leeway with shifting votes.


I agree that the Governor pardoning her from Day 1 lynch is odd, when has Calix ever been lynched Day 1? this leads me to believe that the Governor was either trying to buy town "town cred" with the "oh i prevented the genius of the game from being lynched Day 1" which is rather stupid, but sounds like a Noob Never Unlucky thing to do... Or even a Kovath thing to do with another inevitable attempt to kiss Calix's British butt.



I am surprised that the Judge neutered Unknown - of all players - instead of the Mayor on N0. The double-voter seems like the obvious target for a supposedly-uninformed Judge.

I think scum were aiming for a Mayor mislynch Day 1. He is most likely going to die tonight and if he doesn't it's possibly an attempt to frame him but to me it only makes sense that the vote placed on Eggy is Scum aligned. I believe this because the Mayor is a very serious proponent for town if he's not Scum. If the States Attorney were Innocent, wouldn't they want to at least give the Mayor benefit of the doubt? Surely town still has majority even if the Mayor is Scum, so why rush into it? The vote literally screams scum aligned to me.





I'll just throw it up now that I'd support a policy lynch on Gyrloser if we're fucked for targets a few hours from EOD and if he doesn't attempt to play the game. I don't want to waste more time discussing that because that is what I'll be considering :p

I agree with this... Every game I play in I will always advocate Gyrlander is the best person to lynch when you're truly stumped. But this is not the case at the moment.

Calix is a Town lean.


Kovath: this is what I have when it comes to you...



Judge on Unknown: No idea what the purpose of this was. Not sure neutering the mayor was the obvious choice, though, since it would make lynches more difficult...
States Attorney on Eggy: Probably just slapped it on the only known PR.
Governor on Calix: Seems more like a placeholder, Calix probably doesn't get lynched D1 over others. Or the Governor just really wants Calix to live.



therefore I have pretty much nothing... Good start... I would think you would come into this game with strong and powerful convictions but you came out weak... just like your flirting game ;)

Kovath is a Meh, but i'll lean more with scum for now... he can do better.


GameFreak : another person with..... basically nothing... wow, much to work with...


I have no faith in you.

Irrelevant if you are going to read the setup , what a stupid question even

Contradiction in your first post

Same as Spruance , in doing so you are useless. Any towny should post his thoughts no matter what so we can see your thought process.
I don't care how dumb they are

Your post comes across as a scum being bad at looking town

Although stated after that you do not scum read him, this strikes me as a not so subtle attempt to throw shade on our Mayor. I find it rather shady that out of everything that was said, THAT ONE AND ONLY POST that Eggy made was what you decided to analyze.


Unknown :


Eggy having a vote on him makes me feel like he's town and the States Attorney is scum. Not much to input on this but why would a town immediately put a vote on the mayor day 1?

Me not having a vote makes me think it's someone who is either 1.) Dumb 2.) Faking Dumb. 3.) Knows I have good judgement. So MESK/Calix/Kovath is where I'd start looking for the judge. Very quick observation but the only thing that has really led me is my vote. I've been slacking in the past games.

kiddo over here somewhat follows my theory... I know I am not scum, and you should know I'm not scum BECAUSE I AM ALWAYS TOWN so that narrows it down to Calix and Kovath... but this is assuming you didn't target yourself right?

Unknown is a literal "Null" until he he gives a Kovath Vs. Calix read. I shall explain why after said read.


Never Unlucky :

, but I don't want others to cherry-pick this post and take it out of context to use it against me later on.


For some reason this strikes me as an obnoxious thing to say... "oh well i don't want anyone bothering me about it later so I said it now" hmm okay buddy



As for being defensive, it is not necessarily a bad thing. I myself act very defensive at times. However, Kovath was defensive for no reason, really. I didn't misrep his reasonings, nor did I simply copy-pasted them. He really made it clear that he did not want me to "sheep" him, and I do not know why.


"I'm being defensive but look at Kovath" lol what a n00b for real though...

I think Kovath is more scummy than Never Unlucky at the moment but if Kovath were to die and Flip not scum i'm going after Never Unlucky first probably.

Spruance :

Don't really have any yet rip
Lord have mercy....


Eggy:

Ok so I just read through everything and I think I have to brush up on the setup again. Im going to make sure that I dont lurk this game because last game I played I got myself mislynched for lurking hardcore lol. Do the scum know who eachother are? If so I cud see calix being scum and being pardonned so he is safe for the night. But his play is kind of towny in my eyes so I doubt it. So far everyone is null for me, except mesk who is always town(no joke played with her several times and I havnt seen her scum once...) which I find kinda strange but thats besides the point. Im going to hold of on placing any votes until I can establish better reads. I not the best day one played I like to wait for the game to play out before I build enough confidence to make more solid reads.

lol I said I would get to this, but after pondering about this for a while I'm starting to get tired so It's not going to be an as extravagant explanation as I planned it to be in my mind. I think a Scum Mayor would actually want to try and take action to convince town that at least he could direct one mislynch before town raging at him the next day. Eggy is also most certain he is going to die tonight, and that seems to be his only concern LOL, sounds like town noob that just wants to play and win because he has a leading role.



Gyrlander :
Brendan :
oops_ur_dead:

^^^^^

LOL so so sad. I've got nothing... they're probably voters.


Anyways, long shpeel short... I think Kovath and GameFreak are two good people to look at.
kbye

[Calix]

I'm going to address the setup as I think that mechanically somethings make more sense than others. I'm sure there's some sort of balance in the setup. I'm also going to say that there's 3 scum, this is just the easier thing to think. So with that being said I think the setup has 5 possible ways it could go.

1- Mayor, x3 Congressman, x5 Voters, Judge, States Attorney, Governor
2- Mayor, x2 Congressman, Governor, x5 Voters,Judge, States Attorney, x1 Congressman
3- Mayor, x3 Congressman, Governor, x4 VotersJudge, States Attorney, x1 Voter
4- x3 Congressman,Governor, Mayor, Judge, States Attorney, x5 Voters
5- x3 Voters, x2 Voters, x3 Congressman, Judge, Governor, Mayor, States Attorney

Of course these are all surrounding the fact that I believe Eggy is a non scum Mayor. At this moment I believe that the Judge and the Governor are variables. I think the anonymous vote on Eggy is very blatantly Scum trying to get a mislynch just like that. Therefore, I am reluctant to believe that States Attorney is scum. Setup 4&5 seem like an unlikely blood bath designed to make us go crazy... But hey this is Mafia, right?

I also agree that Eggy is likely town at the moment. His complaints over dying early as Mayor feel genuine to me and if he was scum, why would he draw attention to the fact that the scum would want to take out a town-aligned Mayor early?

I actually think Setup 4 is possible, or a setup where 2 Congressmen are scum. If they removed the town Congressman, it would essentially give the scum a day chat. Having all/ most of the scum have that role would also give them an incentive to TPR hunt.

This is 100% setup spec as nothing can be proven blah blah blah but I also think at least 1 Voter is likely scum.

Your read on me seems based on agreeing with you about the roles and the Mayor. I don't see any faults in your reasoning for scum-reading the States Attorney although I think that the States Attorney's personality if they reveal should be taken into consideration.

Question. Your post gives me the impression that you think Kovath/ Unknown cannot be TvT. Can you go into more detail here or is that part of your Unknown 'can't explain why until Unknown gives reads' idea?

GameFreak posted after Eggy had made the one post. Not sure if that would affect your read as it sounds like you think GF deliberately chose that one Eggy post after he had posted more. Or you thought that talking about Eggy and nothing else was scummy. Not clear there.

I decided to read some of AI and I saw that Unlucky used the "lol I did this but so did X so why not focus on them" logic so not sure if that is alignment-indicative with him. Would have to check.

Also sounds like you think Unlucky vs Kovath is TvS. Can you explain more here?

If you think Kovath/ GF are good targets, why not vote for one of them?

Mesk514

[Calix]

Also you forgot to talk about Firebringer.

Guess you can do that when you wake up or whatever.

[Never Unlucky]

My new strategy is to hold my vote until someone scumslips.

Who do you think scumslipped?

I think Mesk's post about the "obvious scum congressman" is the closest we've got to a slip.

[Brendan]

There's probably at least 1 scum congressman. I wouldn't call that a slip.

[Brendan]

I don't see a reason for killing mayor right away like Eggy is crying about. He could be corrupt and the longer they hold off on killing him the more likely that is. He can also do more damage than good and allow a quick scum train.

[Brendan]

I'm gonna sleep but I'll read everything and post some thoughts after I get up.

[Brendan]

I feel like corrupt mayor is definitely something Jeff would do just FYI.

[Never Unlucky]

Me neither, but it's still the closest we've got to one.

[Calix]

Me neither, but it's still the closest we've got to one.

Question. Where are you going with this line of thought about scum slips? Your first post back asks Spruance if he thinks anyone has scum-slipped (even though he's not voting), you bring up Mesk's 'close to a slip' yet you don't actually think it's a slip.

So what compelled you to ask/ talk about it?

[Never Unlucky]

A)I think the anonymous vote on Eggy is very blatantly Scum trying to get a mislynch just like that. Therefore, I am reluctant to believe that States Attorney is scum.

B)Unknown is a literal "Null" until he he gives a Kovath Vs. Calix read. I shall explain why after said read.

C) Never Unlucky :

"I'm being defensive but look at Kovath" lol what a n00b for real though...

A) What should have done the judge/states attorney/governor in your opinion?

B) You didn't explain why.

C) Misrep. I meant that he is being defensive, but that doesn't make him scum. Unknown had the same concern for me in AI.

[Never Unlucky]

Question. Where are you going with this line of thought about scum slips? Your first post back asks Spruance if he thinks anyone has scum-slipped (even though he's not voting), you bring up Mesk's 'close to a slip' yet you don't actually think it's a slip.

So what compelled you to ask/ talk about it?

Spruance hasn't given his opinion about this game. I'm just genuinely trying to pressure him to talk according to his play of voting whoever slipped.

[Calix]

A) What should have done the judge/states attorney/governor in your opinion?

B) You didn't explain why.

C) Misrep. I meant that he is being defensive, but that doesn't make him scum. Unknown had the same concern for me in AI.

B was Mesk saying that she wouldn't fully explain her read on Unknown until he had given her a read on Kovath and myself.


Spruance hasn't given his opinion about this game. I'm just genuinely trying to pressure him to talk according to his play of voting whoever slipped.

>Talks about pressure
>Says he is 'genuinely trying'
>Is not voting

Legit.

While I'm here, your three strongest scum-reads?

[Never Unlucky]

Updates on my reads.

Firebringer: Null/lean-scum. His play is incoherent. He says that my actions don't match my "tone" and that he scumreads me, yet he proceeds to vote oops ur ded a couple posts later. His actions don't match his words. Plus he didn't share his reasoning as to why oops would be scum. Him defending Spruance is beyond me.

Spruance: Null/lean-scum. He absolutely refused to contribute, or even attempt to contribute. I also disliked how he talked about how Overwatch mined his self-confidence. I felt like it was off-topic and didn't excuse him from giving reads. His posts are illogical, but that's not indicative of alignment. Only thing holding me from a scum-read is his meta. From my experience, he semi-lurks and only slightly contributes as town.

Brendan: Scum or nuisance to town. In brief, him trolling shows he doesn't want to contribute. Policy lynch target.

Oops: Null. He is sort of trolling like Brendan. But, the fact that he has 3 votes on him for what seems to be no reason makes me think that he isn't scum. I'd like him to post actual content though.

Eggy: Lean-town. This read is mostly based on gut. Asked this stupid question, "Do scum know each other?" and is too preoccupied to get killed at night to contribute. ThePaladin would discredit me for this, but I think he's too dumb to be scum.

Mesk: Null. I liked her latest post minus some arguments that were flimsy to me. She really caught up for her post about the "obvious scum congressman." I would be inclined to town-read her, but I don't understand why she has her vote on oops when she never said in her reads that she scumreads oops. It's shady to me.

Unknown: No strong feeling on him. A remark: From my experience with Unknown, he's a major contributor to the town. Only this time, he's not contributing in the slightest (because he has no votes? That doesn't excuse him.)

GameFreak: Lean-scum. Like FB, he thinks my actions don't match my tone, but doesn't vote me. I did not like this quote from him, "I like Kovath's [posts], they seem reasoned." He was talking about his reads, so I assume that this meant that he town-reads Kovath. By saying so , he's implying that the scums' posts lack reasoning... Moreover, I feel like the reason behind his vote on FB is lacking. FB attacking me and defending Spruance only seems wrong to him because he thinks me and Spruance are in the same boat. He's using pre-flip as a reason to vote FB.

[Never Unlucky]

While I'm here, your three strongest scum-reads?

GameFreak, Brendan, [Spruance/Kovath/Firebringer].

[Never Unlucky]

I will cast my vote on Brendan for now.

Brendan

[Calix]

Updates on my reads.

Firebringer: Null/lean-scum. His play is incoherent. He says that my actions don't match my "tone" and that he scumreads me, yet he proceeds to vote oops ur ded a couple posts later. His actions don't match his words. Plus he didn't share his reasoning as to why oops would be scum. Him defending Spruance is beyond me.

The fact that the two of you are scum-reading each other for "actions not matching words" is interesting, especially as I find both of you suspicious myself.

I agree with you that not sharing reasons for your SCUM READS is beyond retarded. Town's job is to lynch scum. You can't get that shit done by refusing to share your reasoning.


Spruance: Null/lean-scum. He absolutely refused to contribute, or even attempt to contribute. I also disliked how he talked about how Overwatch mined his self-confidence. I felt like it was off-topic and didn't excuse him from giving reads. His posts are illogical, but that's not indicative of alignment. Only thing holding me from a scum-read is his meta. From my experience, he semi-lurks and only slightly contributes as town.

What about his posts strikes you as illogical? This was a criticism that I recall FB having of Spruance's posts so I'd like your take on that.

I don't consider using previous games to inform your play this game as off-topic. What makes you think that?

Given that two of your scum-reads and a null are voting for Oops, at least your read of him is consistent.

Which arguments by Mesk did you find flimsy?

With regards to Unknown, since when has he EVER been a 'major contributor' to the town? How high are you exactly?


GameFreak: Lean-scum. Like FB, he thinks my actions don't match my tone, but doesn't vote me. I did not like this quote from him, "I like Kovath's [posts], they seem reasoned." He was talking about his reads, so I assume that this meant that he town-reads Kovath. By saying so , he's implying that the scums' posts lack reasoning... Moreover, I feel like the reason behind his vote on FB is lacking. FB attacking me and defending Spruance only seems wrong to him because he thinks me and Spruance are in the same boat. He's using pre-flip as a reason to vote FB.

Scum-reading GameFreak for saying Kovath's posts are "reasoned" (which clearly means 'well-reasoned') is a massive stretch. Also seems unusually nit-picky for you compared to some of your other reads where you are less specific.

GameFreak also clarified that he doesn't scum-read you/ Spruance, just that he disliked how FB responded differently to both of you when he views you two as similiar.

I asked you for a second reads list because I thought you weren't being suspicious enough of others. Turns out the opposite is true. You also have way too many and a lot of them are either flimsy (e.g., Kovath, GameFreak) or can be attributed to bad play. Eggy and myself are your only legit town-reads from what I remember.

Pre-edit: Also you are voting for the one player you labelled as a policy lynch target this early? Why?

[Gyrlander]

I'm sorry, but I read everything and my head couldn't process all the info. From the possible setups that Mesk posted, I can at least prove that 1 is wrong ;)

I see that oops and brendan are zzz players. Interesting.

Were roles randomed or handpicked?

[Never Unlucky]

A)What about his posts strikes you as illogical? This was a criticism that I recall FB having of Spruance's posts so I'd like your take on that.
B)I don't consider using previous games to inform your play this game as off-topic. What makes you think that?
C)Which arguments by Mesk did you find flimsy?
D)With regards to Unknown, since when has he EVER been a 'major contributor' to the town? How high are you exactly?
E)Scum-reading GameFreak for saying Kovath's posts are "reasoned" (which clearly means 'well-reasoned') is a massive stretch. Also seems unusually nit-picky for you compared to some of your other reads where you are less specific.
F)GameFreak also clarified that he doesn't scum-read you/ Spruance, just that he disliked how FB responded differently to both of you when he views you two as similiar.
G)Pre-edit: Also you are voting for the one player you labelled as a policy lynch target this early? Why?
A)
If you were scum you would hide it very well on day 1. It just seems that you might be trying a little too hard to stay in character. No?

You are acting like you are confirmed just because a governor pardoned you. No?

How would I have enough evidence to think you (Calix) were anything...
She’s made thost posts?

Why does it seem like a scream? I didn't use caps lock.
:facepalm:
B) Last game was last game. You performed poorly? Cool. Do better this time. It’s a new game.
Previous games only matter when it comes to meta imo.
C) “Eggy is also most certain he is going to die tonight, and that seems to be his only concern LOL, sounds like town noob that just wants to play and win because he has a leading role.” I agree with this argument, but it’s flimsy nonetheless. Eggy could very easily be a scum acting as a town.

“I think Kovath is more scummy than Never Unlucky at the moment but if Kovath were to die and Flip not scum i'm going after Never Unlucky first probably.” Assuming one of us is scum and the other is town when both her reads on us are scum. o.O

“so that narrows it down to Calix and Kovath... but this is assuming you didn't target yourself right?” Mesk literally implies that only herself/unknown/calix/kovath could have neutered Unknown’s vote. There are way more possibilities.

“I find it rather shady that out of everything that was said, THAT ONE AND ONLY POST that Eggy made was what you decided to analyze.” Calix did the same thing for me at first, but you neglected it.

“Kovath is a Meh, but i'll lean more with scum for now... he can do better.” Because Kovath didn’t meet Mesk’s expectations, he is lean-scum. Doesn’t make sense.

“the vote placed on Eggy is Scum aligned. I believe this because the Mayor is a very serious proponent for town if he's not Scum. If the States Attorney were Innocent, wouldn't they want to at least give the Mayor benefit of the doubt? Surely town still has majority even if the Mayor is Scum, so why rush into it? The vote literally screams scum aligned to me.” The same can be said about the opposite. If the mayor’s scum, he’s a serious proponent for the scum.

D) Lol. In the only other game I played, Unknown was very talkative. He was a major contributor in my eyes.
E) His post marked my attention more than others. It screamed suspicion.
F) I never said otherwise.
G) To pressure him to stop trolling and to contribute.

[Calix]

I'm sorry, but I read everything and my head couldn't process all the info. From the possible setups that Mesk posted, I can at least prove that 1 is wrong ;)

I see that oops and brendan are zzz players. Interesting.

Were roles randomed or handpicked?
Gyrlander


So your brain is so fried that you can't even answer the simple question of "why did you scum-read Unknown to begin with before you 'reaction-tested' him" or even correct/ change your vote?

I'll take unnecessary soft-claim of your role for £200, Alex.

[Unknown1234]

Gyrlander

Fix your vote.

[Unknown1234]

I'm sorry, but I read everything and my head couldn't process all the info. From the possible setups that Mesk posted, I can at least prove that 1 is wrong ;)

I see that oops and brendan are zzz players. Interesting.

Were roles randomed or handpicked?

Why are you being stupid and soft claiming?

[Calix]

C) “Eggy is also most certain he is going to die tonight, and that seems to be his only concern LOL, sounds like town noob that just wants to play and win because he has a leading role.” I agree with this argument, but it’s flimsy nonetheless. Eggy could very easily be a scum acting as a town.

This is always a possibility and unless you have evidence for this argument, the only purpose I can see in mentioning it right after you affirm your agreement is to cast doubt on that town read.


“I think Kovath is more scummy than Never Unlucky at the moment but if Kovath were to die and Flip not scum i'm going after Never Unlucky first probably.” Assuming one of us is scum and the other is town when both her reads on us are scum. o.O

Where does she assume that? She said that she would suspect you if Kovath flipped town. I see no assumptions made here, only conditionals.


“so that narrows it down to Calix and Kovath... but this is assuming you didn't target yourself right?” Mesk literally implies that only herself/unknown/calix/kovath could have neutered Unknown’s vote. There are way more possibilities.

She used meta to conclude that. I don't see how this is alignment-indicative.


“I find it rather shady that out of everything that was said, THAT ONE AND ONLY POST that Eggy made was what you decided to analyze.” Calix did the same thing for me at first, but you neglected it.

Firstly, using "SHE DID IT TOO" logic is weak.

Secondly, that's not even correct. I said that I was scum-reading you based on your opening post. Mesk was arguing that since GF's only contribution at that point in time was to 'discredit the Mayor' that this made GF suspicious.


D) Lol. In the only other game I played, Unknown was very talkative. He was a major contributor in my eyes.
E) His post marked my attention more than others. It screamed suspicion.
F) I never said otherwise.
G) To pressure him to stop trolling and to contribute.

E. It SCREAMED suspicion? This seems overstated.
G. You think Brendan is going to feel the pressure of "I'll place my vote here for now"? You make it sound like a placeholder vote, now you call it a pressure vote...which nullifies the pressure.

[Calix]

I thought the mayor was the person who was most likely going to be policy lynched on D1 because that is what the people who critiqued Crypt's setup had predicted. I remember Kovath making a post about the power of the mayor's role in a mylo/lylo situation. It is an opinion I somewhat share, but I'd rather base my lynches on my reads than policies.


Firebringer: Null/lean-scum. He says that my actions don't match my "tone" and that he scumreads me, yet he proceeds to vote oops ur ded a couple posts later. His actions don't match his words. Plus he didn't share his reasoning as to why oops would be scum. Him defending Spruance is beyond me.

Brendan: Scum or nuisance to town. In brief, him trolling shows he doesn't want to contribute. Policy lynch target.


I will cast my vote on Brendan for now.

Brendan

Case in point. The disconnect between what you say and what you do is amazing.

Never Unlucky

I just want to emphasise that you need six more votes than you currently have.

I'd also like to add that you only voted after I called you out for talking about pressuring players without voting anyone and you didn't acknowledge the call-out or explained why you hadn't voted earlier or whatnot.

Conformity is a scum tell.

[Unknown1234]

I am going to say, I think Gamefreak is town. Its mostly a gut thing though.

My scum pool right now is: Never Unlucky, Calix, Oops Your Dead

Null: Everyone else.

Maybe town: Kovath and Mesk

Saying 'gut' doesn't mean you shouldn't say anything else.

You think Calix is bussing Never Unlucky?

Do you agree with Calix's points on Never Unlucky? Or do you have more you haven't said?

"Maybe town" sounds like you don't want to call people town. Why not just say "town for right now" or "town leaning-null" Aside from that what makes you think they aren't null, but also aren't enough to be a town read?

[Unknown1234]

1) Oops isn't going to respond to it, cause I know he won't, but he gave a pretty good scum tell.
2) Meh
3) I did lift everything I have said from the M-FM, can you guess where and which quotes?

And yet you won't tell us. Are you expecting us to follow you on a blind lynch when we don't know the information/background you have for oops?

[Unknown1234]

Post 182 is not worth commenting on.
So, I want oops lynched.

Everyone should ocme in here and lynch him, using lynching vote pwers.

Ill see you in the morning, I am off to sleep.

Are you teasing me?

[Gyrlander]

I'll claim whenever my ass tells me so.

Also, I said that I was just checking your reactions and I didn't really scum read Unknown but he's a fucking dick for the way he has treated me right now.

Unknown1234

[Calix]

I'll claim whenever my ass tells me so.

Also, I said that I was just checking your reactions and I didn't really scum read Unknown but he's a fucking dick for the way he has treated me right now.

Unknown1234

"I don't really scum-read him but he's an asshole (because fee-fees) so I'll vote him."

It doesn't take a fucking scientist to figure out what you just claimed...for reasons.

[Unknown1234]

Mesk514 why have you ruled out the Mayor as scum for all scenarios? Regardless of the current situation, there should be somewhere where the Mayor being scum makes sense.

Why is the Governor only in one group? Is that just a feeling based on the role, or on the current action?

3 Congressman's is the same as two night chats. The game would be dull and wouldn't have any conflict/deception.

Same with 3 voters. If all the TPR's are town, then scum would have nothing to do and would seem unbalanced.

Side note, why do you assume there are 3 scum? If you don't, how do you KNOW there are 3 scum?

[Never Unlucky]

C) This is always a possibility and unless you have evidence for this argument, the only purpose I can see in mentioning it right after you affirm your agreement is to cast doubt on that town read.

Where does she assume that? She said that she would suspect you if Kovath flipped town. I see no assumptions made here, only conditionals.



She used meta to conclude that. I don't see how this is alignment-indicative.



Firstly, using "SHE DID IT TOO" logic is weak.

Secondly, that's not even correct. I said that I was scum-reading you based on your opening post. Mesk was arguing that since GF's only contribution at that point in time was to 'discredit the Mayor' that this made GF suspicious.



E. It SCREAMED suspicion? This seems overstated.
G. You think Brendan is going to feel the pressure of "I'll place my vote here for now"? You make it sound like a placeholder vote, now you call it a pressure vote...which nullifies the pressure.

C) You're taking my post out of context. I was enumerating the flaws Mesk's post had as you asked me, not finding out what Mesk's alignment was nor giving my opinion. Huge misrep.
E) It is overstated.
G) You are right, that will not pressure him at all.

[Unknown1234]

I'll claim whenever my ass tells me so.

Also, I said that I was just checking your reactions and I didn't really scum read Unknown but he's a fucking dick for the way he has treated me right now.

Unknown1234

My bad, I forgot soft claiming was a smart strategy -_-

[Unknown1234]

There's probably at least 1 scum congressman. I wouldn't call that a slip.

There's a difference between a theory and sounding so sure that you're right. MESK has done that a lot this game.

[Unknown1234]

I don't see a reason for killing mayor right away like Eggy is crying about. He could be corrupt and the longer they hold off on killing him the more likely that is. He can also do more damage than good and allow a quick scum train.

Are you suggesting the States Attorney who planted a vote on him is town? If so, why do you think a town member would want to put a vote on a possible mayor?

[Calix]

C) You're taking my post out of context. I was enumerating the flaws Mesk's post had as you asked me, not finding out what Mesk's alignment was nor giving my opinion. Huge misrep.
E) It is overstated.
G) You are right, that will not pressure him at all.

C. What? I said that a) you were casting doubt on Mesk town-reading Eggy and b) asked you to show me where Mesk made the assumption that you said she did and c) noted that a comment that you made didn't seem alignment-indicative.

Nowhere am I taking it out of context. If anything, you just misrepresented my answer by calling it a "huge misrep"

E. Thanks for supporting my point.

G. Good to know that your vote is useless.

[Unknown1234]

I don't like seeing Spruance wait to give reads on everyone, he doesn't normally give reads in general. Makes me feel like he's more scared of being lynched then usual.

Spruance

[Never Unlucky]

C. What? I said that a) you were casting doubt on Mesk town-reading Eggy and b) asked you to show me where Mesk made the assumption that you said she did and c) noted that a comment that you made didn't seem alignment-indicative.

Nowhere am I taking it out of context. If anything, you just misrepresented my answer by calling it a "huge misrep".

You are misinterpreting my post. I was only pointing out Mesk's weaker arguments.This is what you asked me to do because I said some of her arguments were flimsy in my reads. I have no doubt that Mesk town-reads Eggy, 40% of her post is based off of this read. I was not trying to make a alignment-indicative comment neither.

[Calix]

Are you suggesting the States Attorney who planted a vote on him is town? If so, why do you think a town member would want to put a vote on a possible mayor?

Flagging this up for "possible mayor" lmao


You are misinterpreting my post. I was only pointing out Mesk's weaker arguments.This is what you asked me to do because I said some of her arguments were flimsy in my reads. I have no doubt that Mesk town-reads Eggy, 40% of her post is based off of this read. I was not trying to make a alignment-indicative comment neither.

You noted that Mesk made some flimsy arguments in your read, thus I assumed that the flimsy arguments were hindering you from fully town-reading you (alongside the unexplained Oops vote)

I wasn't saying that Mesk doesn't town-read Eggy. My argument was that your comment about why her town-read is flawed (you said that "Eggy could be scum pretending to be town" or something to that effect) was doubt-casting because it throws uncertainty on a town read but does not back this up with evidence. Fear-mongering, almost.

No fix of that vote, hm?

[Calix]

Unknown, where are you currently at with your reads? Scum reads especially :)

[Never Unlucky]

You noted that Mesk made some flimsy arguments in your read, thus I assumed that the flimsy arguments were hindering you from fully town-reading you (alongside the unexplained Oops vote)

No fix of that vote, hm?

It's not the case. I said that I liked Mesk's post minus the flimsy arguments. The flimsy arguments aren't what's hindering me from town-reading here. It's the vote on oops.

A switch of vote would have no impact realistically. You've discredited my vote.

[Calix]

It's not the case. I said that I liked Mesk's post minus the flimsy arguments. The flimsy arguments aren't what's hindering me from town-reading here. It's the vote on oops.

A switch of vote would have no impact realistically. You've discredited my vote.

I wasn't aware that I had revealed myself as the Judge and neutered your vote.

In all seriousness, you're saying that I've "discredited" your vote...so you're just not going to bother voting?

:huh:

[GameFreak]

I'm home and reading, i see 3 votes on oops so i hope to find an actual reason

[Cryptonic]

Were roles randomed or handpicked?

Yes, they were.

[GameFreak]

This makes no sense.

I don't get why I'm in such hot waters tbh. In my eyes, I'm the most obvious town along Calix in here. I've given my reads, I haven't lurked not lurking, I've done my best to contribute, and I've been responsive to the queries concerning me. If someone could give me a summary of the scummy-looking things in my play, it would be appreciated.

Ah see thats the thing , people here are so useless that just being useful isn't a towntell.

[GameFreak]

I hope you don't continue this.

You continue to only respond to off topic questions. Do i have to remind you that last time you did this you were scum.

[GameFreak]

What I find humorous is Calix didn't even question "Town meta" on herself. Just kind of rolls with it. Odd...

Also how am I chainsawing? I literally can't lynch you. I don't think you know what a chainsaw is darling.
I am defending him, cause I see him as a low hanging fruit.

Please, have some more salt though. ;)

Bullshit reason fire , NU is even more low hanging than Spruance. I just see you befriending somebody you know is town, while discrediting the even lower fruit.

[GameFreak]

How am I contradicting myself lol? Im said that calix could he scum based off the pardon, but based off her play I doubt it, that is literally offering my thoughts like you are saying every town should do later in your same post. Where did I say I am not going to post my thoughts? I only said I am going to hold my votes? And I warned people that I like to let the game play out before I form solid reads(which makes a lot of sense) I can tell you are going to be annoying and try to read into things that are not actually there.

Why i don't like this is because then , if you are scum, you can simply make up your reads in the moment. Demanding reads now requires effort to put yourself in town shoes and make up valid reasoning and half the people in this game can't do that as scum. Thats why i want reads now, hold you vote if you must.

[GameFreak]

Incorrect, I am not attacking you for "scumhunting" I am scumreading you because I think you are trying to fake town style of your own. Very different, I like how you say I am not doing anything, apparently questioning and trying to probe your mind isn't participatory or "scumhunting"

Are you blind?

Anyways, you are right many are not participating in this game, are you saying we should policy everyone of them?

No i just hope they fuck off and don't participate in a game where you need to be participating, i hate it even more to see their names are Red

Yeah fucking top kek m8, even if in your mind Calix is "pretending" to be useful town, thats more than you are doing and you call yourself a towny

[GameFreak]

I am going to say, I think Gamefreak is town. Its mostly a gut thing though.

My scum pool right now is: Never Unlucky, Calix, Oops Your Dead

Null: Everyone else.

Maybe town: Kovath and Mesk

Its nice that you town read the guy starting the train on you, you think you could also respond to my questions then ?

Your scum pool is garbage and without reason

[GameFreak]

Game Freak:
Although stated after that you do not scum read him, this strikes me as a not so subtle attempt to throw shade on our Mayor. I find it rather shady that out of everything that was said, THAT ONE AND ONLY POST that Eggy made was what you decided to analyze.


Your setup spec is cute but overall worthless , you don't take in the fact that eggy might be corrupt and you are apparantly certain there are 3 scums ? Nice

Yeah guess what , he only made that post and disappeared at the time. Sorry that i'm annoyed at him and want him to say shit since last game he got lynched as BG while making 1 post the entire game or something.

But i'm happy to see a read list

[GameFreak]

Who do you think scumslipped?

I think Mesk's post about the "obvious scum congressman" is the closest we've got to a slip.


There's probably at least 1 scum congressman. I wouldn't call that a slip.

Oh look Brendan you said something, a fucking miracle !
Too bad its immediately in defense of somebody else.
Scummy as fuck.

[GameFreak]

I don't see a reason for killing mayor right away like Eggy is crying about. He could be corrupt and the longer they hold off on killing him the more likely that is. He can also do more damage than good and allow a quick scum train.


I'm gonna sleep but I'll read everything and post some thoughts after I get up.


I feel like corrupt mayor is definitely something Jeff would do just FYI.

So you throw shade at the mayor, then go to bed, but you just had to throw some more shade in there didn't you.

You are turning into a top scum read

[GameFreak]

I'm sorry, but I read everything and my head couldn't process all the info. From the possible setups that Mesk posted, I can at least prove that 1 is wrong ;)

I see that oops and brendan are zzz players. Interesting.

Were roles randomed or handpicked?

A a softclaim how nice gyr , now that Duck is banned you take over his strat ?

Also you are a zzz player aswell, actually worthless.

[GameFreak]

Case in point. The disconnect between what you say and what you do is amazing.

Never Unlucky

I just want to emphasise that you need six more votes than you currently have.

I'd also like to add that you only voted after I called you out for talking about pressuring players without voting anyone and you didn't acknowledge the call-out or explained why you hadn't voted earlier or whatnot.

Conformity is a scum tell.

If this was any other person i'd jump on this train because its plain bad, if you want a scumslip NU, thats what it generally looks like.

pedit too much quotes

[GameFreak]

I'll claim whenever my ass tells me so.

Also, I said that I was just checking your reactions and I didn't really scum read Unknown but he's a fucking dick for the way he has treated me right now.

Unknown1234

Stop signing up for games if you won't play

[Calix]

I'd like to present these posts by Firebringer. Both are examples of him stating something and then following up on it with zero progression in his read/ thought process.


All I know right now calix is doing a good job of doing her "Angry/Annoyed Town" impersonation. Or maybe its genuine.
She can't fake it forever, so maybe she will slip up eventually if she is scum.

Either way she is adorbes right now. I want to pinch her little cheeks.

Right off the bat, he implies that I am "impersonating" my town meta although he doesn't go as far as to say that I am faking it as scum. He leaves the possibility open. Also doesn't explain how it comes across as fake or why he thinks that's likely over the simpler explanation of "Calix is town"

Later on, he attacks me for "pretending to be my town meta" (whatever the fuck that even means) after I scum-read Spruance.


if anyone knows any valid method of reading spruance I am all ears, I just always assume he is VI.

Implies that Spruance is the town idiot. This was before I pushed him if I recall correctly. He later chainsaws Spruance when I push him.

Feels like he's already prepared how he is going to go about treating everyone, like he coordinated it in a night chat.

I think that was why he expressed irritation over the fact that I couldn't be lynched today - he was planning on accusing me like he's doing now. (this would assume that the Governor is town, however)

[GameFreak]

I don't like seeing Spruance wait to give reads on everyone, he doesn't normally give reads in general. Makes me feel like he's more scared of being lynched then usual.

Spruance

I know your vote doesn't count but this is just useless Unknown

you also keep asking people for their opinion but you fail to give your own.

[GameFreak]

Calix yeah i dislike Fire this game, he is not even trying to read people this game.

But how can i even say thats a scumtell when half you guys don't.

[GameFreak]

Updates reads list would be

Town: Calix, Kovath

Scum: Bredan, Fire , NU

I don't think they are all scum, but there is scum in there.

Useless : Oops , Gyr

Null: Mesk:
So far some nice lengty posts that i like, but alot of it was fluff or stuff that everybody already knew and just makes you appear more active than you are.

Unknown: you form no opinions of your own, just keep asking people what they think, almost feels like you don't want to form bad opinions

can't even think of the rest

[Calix]

Updates reads list would be

Town: Calix, Kovath

Scum: Bredan, Fire , NU

I don't think they are all scum, but there is scum in there.

Useless : Oops , Gyr

Null: Mesk:
So far some nice lengty posts that i like, but alot of it was fluff or stuff that everybody already knew and just makes you appear more active than you are.

Unknown: you form no opinions of your own, just keep asking people what they think, almost feels like you don't want to form bad opinions

can't even think of the rest

I appreciate that 'useless' is a separate category :')

I agree wholeheartedly with your scum-reads. I find it weird that FB/ Unlucky have the same issue with being inconsistent with their words/ actions and FB's play has tanked in recent games, probably because of RL, but those are the only things making me pause at the moment.

Going to be out for ~1 hour. Hope that Eggy, Kovath and Unlucky actually do something using their own initiative in the meantime ;)

[Eggy]

I wrote something and tried to post it from my phone but looks like it didnt work. Im currently scum reading brendan because he has done nothing all game except troll. and when he did show up all he did was try to emphasize me being scum mayor but provided no reasons as to why and no pertinent information. I can only see two reasons for him to do so
1. He was bitter because I called him out for not participating what so ever other than placing a random vote on oops
2. He is scum trying to get a mislynch on the town mayor(which is what I think scum would be going for)
for the opposite reason I think calix is town. If she was scum I think she would be speculating on why I might be scum more than she is.
for these reason I am willing to vote brendan( Even if he flips town I think its a good policy lynch) I cant comment on his meta because I havnt played with him enough times to notice a pattern.
Brendan

[Eggy]

On a side note I believe brendan is a considerably better train than oops in terms of who should be lynched today.

[GameFreak]

I'm off to work,

I agree with you Eggy , his throwing shade 2 times at you in following posts is scummy