Night 5

[Slaol]

Begin

[FM La]

I'm switching to the other chat from now on. Sucks that I got White Lotus. Dx

[FM Tui]

yes let's use this chat
i guess we could also use the other chat for discussion and this chat only for confidential information such as disguiser check, my targets.
this way future white lotus could see the discussion
however we'd definitely need to hide our day names in the other chat, afaik the other chat is anonymous and only i know who i targeted. and targets are informed who iroh is. so scum doesn't know who we are i think, even if they disguise pls confirm
i could also share some unconfidential info in the other chat, in case someone gets access to this and we're both dead
but since i cannot recruit in the night i die, the following has to happen so a townie gets access to this chat: you die, i get your roles, i choose student, then i die, then student gets access as he inherits your white lotus. however then i already had a chat with the student

or i recruit someone/choose student and somehow die at day end but i dont think that's possible anymore
and i also doubt aang can create white lotus members

what happens if a scum inherits town roles through professor?
are inherited roles shown in graveyard?
if disguiser disguises as professor, would i still get the roles? would i be informed of getting the roles?

sure if you want you can post your reads.

so do you have the quote list for disguiser checks with solutions? if you have i would recheck everything


also i think it would be pretty beneficial if you try to draw a mafia kill. not only you have no power and can save a TPR, it would definitely also help a lot if i get your roles. the last will ability isn't useful because i dont want to reveal targets anyway. white lotus is also not useful but professor is pretty strong, i could establish a night chat with whoever i want and after my death i could give them citizen and also professor and even bg
confirm i can pass on powers i inherited

[FM Tui]

i forget the conclusion: yes we could use the other chat for unconfidential stuff but since it's not beneficial we dont, because i dont want to switch accounts all the time :D

so aang night actions we know are:
n1 ?
n2 me (bg)
n3 you (prof)
n4 ?

mine are:
n1 yayap (?)
n2 crimson (lookout)
n4 you (white lotus)

so either we had the second vigi/shaman/amne from start on or n1. amne is well possible
for shaman the night actions would be:
n1 none
n2 none
n3 blacksmith however no one claimed to have received a gun. maybe he hid, but then he should use it soon. unless he's dead
n4 vigi (many other options)

but if you look at it, even if it was only a shaman and not an amne, it wouldnt be so bad, for n5 there are so many options that could save us, he could for instance kill using azula (it's risky because he could hit a townie if he interacts with the target) and also that would mean someone probably has a gun that could also help us a lot. he could heal someone, encourage someone, bd someone and even blackmail lol so many options i'd love being this role atm

is there an announcement if amne remembers?
what role would shaman use if the target is tailored or is cleaned

[FM La]

I might have revealed you when I included the bit about Shaman. >.>

I will get the quote list with disguiser checks posted tomorrow - it's almost 5 am here, and I need sleep. There's one in the day chat, though, I think on page 2. As far as everyone's answers, only 2-3 came later in the thread, with Narks being the very last person to post their solution.

In terms of drawing the kill, I'm not really 100% on how to do that, but I was thinking the same thing.

At first, I thought I could just claim you. But I would be CC'd by your targets. I could claim Iroh and then reveal that I visited, for example, Crimson on Night 1, without revealing the other targets. But then the remaining targets would think Crimson and I were just scum buddies, and would CC.

I could try to claim some type of power role, but it seems like it would be a pretty transparent lie at this point in the game. I feel like scum would be wary of Aang/Iroh giving someone Veteran or a similar role, and might stay away.

Any suggestions on that front? I can't really claim Lookout without drawing FoS from the real town, since we have two already. Can't claim BG clearly. Can't claim Vig without risking the actual Vig CC'ing. >.>

As far as my read list goes, I can't really do anything beyond guess when it comes to Goonswarm and oops because they both have posted so little. Oops claimed Citizen right out of the gate (day 1, I think) so I put him under town, assuming he claimed early on and then went idle due to boredom. But yeah, with people just AFKing or barely hitting the minimums (like monster did today - 5 posts, after two days in a row of not hitting the minimum), it's pretty difficult to get good reads. x.x

I also excluded a potential Ozai. If Ozai managed to disguise, I have absolutely no clue who he is.

I'm not 100% on FalseTruth, Rumpel, or oops. But I've had a gut feeling that Rumpel is town (or at least not Mafia) for a few days, and I've flip flopped a lot on FalseTruth (but he did push early on Ganon). I'm prone to agree with Gerik's analysis of Spy. But yeah, excluding night results that prove me wrong, this is where I'm at.

FM Zack - Aang
FM vornksr - Iroh
FM Crimson - Hidden Gaang
FM Narks - Hidden Gaang
FM Ozymandias - Hidden Gaang
FM Yayap - Hidden Gaang
FM FalseTruth - Hidden Gaang
FM Rumpel - Hidden Gaang
FM oops_ur_dead - Hidden Gaang

FM Goonswarm - Hidden Fire Nation
FM Spy - Hidden Fire Nation

FM monster - Combustion Man
FM Severn - Hama

FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha - Cabbage Merchant

[FM Tui]

jailor wouldnt help that much as he can only jail when there is no lynch
only for next day it would be cool

vigi, shaman, amne, blacksmith, technician (all roles that could kill) or mayor would be very useful. but my personal favorite: marshall

[FM La]

i forget the conclusion: yes we could use the other chat for unconfidential stuff but since it's not beneficial we dont, because i dont want to switch accounts all the time :D

so aang night actions we know are:
n1 ?
n2 me (bg)
n3 you (prof)
n4 ?

mine are:
n1 yayap (?)
n2 crimson (lookout)
n4 you (white lotus)

so either we had the second vigi/shaman/amne from start on or n1. amne is well possible
for shaman the night actions would be:
n1 none
n2 none
n3 blacksmith however no one claimed to have received a gun. maybe he hid, but then he should use it soon. unless he's dead
n4 vigi (many other options)

but if you look at it, even if it was only a shaman and not an amne, it wouldnt be so bad, for n5 there are so many options that could save us, he could for instance kill using azula (it's risky because he could hit a townie if he interacts with the target) and also that would mean someone probably has a gun that could also help us a lot. he could heal someone, encourage someone, bd someone and even blackmail lol so many options i'd love being this role atm

is there an announcement if amne remembers?
what role would shaman use if the target is tailored or is cleaned

I dunno if Shaman can use a role that targets twice (like Azula). Also, this bit from his role card:
"You may only manipulate a corpse once."

Does that mean Shaman can only use his ability once, or he can only target each dead player once?

I really don't think it's a Shaman, though. My guess is that Yayap learned Vig from you, but has waited to fire until we had a clearer idea of who the scum are (like Zuko should have done to begin with). Of course, if the Yayap-being-Magician theory works out, then who knows? And without knowing Zack's targets N1 or N4, it makes things difficult.

Have you thought about giving Zack a new role? I know it's risky to visit him with MM around. It would be really awesome if he could join us in White Lotus chat, and I feel like him being a member is likely for balance reasons - I don't really see the hosts giving him three power roles.

[FM La]

jailor wouldnt help that much as he can only jail when there is no lynch
only for next day it would be cool

vigi, shaman, amne, blacksmith, technician (all roles that could kill) or mayor would be very useful. but my personal favorite: marshall

That's why it would be cool, imo. >.>

I feel like next night is going to decide the game (if tonight doesn't). Yeah, Marshall would be the very best, I think. I really wish I'd gotten Marshall (or anything other than White Lotus).

[FM La]

I wonder if Yayap might be Hama who started as Parolee before getting Magician from you.

Do you remember what day AscendedOne claimed that he got the feedback his target should have received?

[FM La]

Flip side for Yayap:

Double Vig kill happened Night 2. We all assumed it was Nurse charging, but what if Yayap got Vig from you and shot the next night? He hits town, and decides to wait to shoot again until he knows for sure who the scum are.

[FM Tui]

case 4: now assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he repelled from himself, would philie and yayap appear on narks feedback (as all 3 are visiting the target of yayap)
Enchantress only repels one person at a time. So no.
i worded that wrong
assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he narks repelled from himself, would yayap appear on narks feedback (as narks would be on yayaps lure target)

[FM La]

Order of Operations:
8. Kills
a. Gun Items, Bodyguard, Technician, Vigilante
b. Fire Nation Factional Kill, Associate, Bruiser, Disguiser
c. Phoenix King, Butcher, Crown Princess, Mass Murderer, Overlord, Parolee, Toxicologist

Do all items in each category happen at once, or is it broken down by letter? For example, John has a blacksmith gun. He shoots Jim, the Vigilante. Jim shoots John the same night. Do they both die, or does the blacksmith gun shoot first, killing the Vig before he can complete his night action?

Same scenario, but what if John has blacksmith gun and Jim is instead Disguiser?

If the blacksmith gun happens before the Vig kill, then I would say Yayap is definitely Vig, since Divemaster was killed by blacksmith gun on Night 3 - the same night that MrSmarter was killed by Vig. That would mean that Yayap's night actions here:

N1: ???/None
N2: Shot either Slaol or Raiden
N3: Shot MrSmarter
N4: Shot Philie

Though thinking about it, I guess it would also mean that Philie could not have charged Procyon again (unless some other role higher up in the order - like Witch - forced her somehow, or unless Hama/Combustion Man is also Electromaniac).

If a player is charged once by a Crown Princess, and then later by an Electromaniac, what would the kill look like in the first day post? Who would get credit for the kill?

[FM Tui]

I wonder if Yayap might be Hama who started as Parolee before getting Magician from you.

Do you remember what day AscendedOne claimed that he got the feedback his target should have received?

ascended one actions:
n1 possibly encouraged vigi
n2 2 vigi kills happened
n3 ascendedone is killed

could only be n2 so claimed d3

[FM Tui]

*encouraged means gave shot of adrenaline, in earlier avatar fms sokka's action was called encourage

[FM La]

case 4: now assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he repelled from himself, would philie and yayap appear on narks feedback (as all 3 are visiting the target of yayap)
Enchantress only repels one person at a time. So no.
i worded that wrong
assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he narks repelled from himself, would yayap appear on narks feedback (as narks would be on yayaps lure target)

I don't think Enchantress would work that way.

All the below speculation assumes Narks is indeed Lookout, has not been disguised, and is telling the truth about his results. Those assumptions might be dangerous ones to make, but Narks seems to be working in the town's interest right now.

The Facts:
Narks watched Yayap

Narks saw Philie visit Yayap

Yayap did not die, despite claiming he was charged earlier.

Possible reasons:

1. Yayap is Magician. Yayap picked Procyon as target and repelled from himself. Narks visited Yayap, was repelled, and visited Procyon instead. Philie charges Procyon and Yayap. Narks sees Philie visit "Yayap," but is actually seeing Philie visit Procyon twice.

In the above scenario, would Narks, the Lookout, see Philie visit Procyon twice? As in, would he see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie and FM Philie"? Or would he only see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie"? Would he be informed that he was repelled?

2. Yayap is Enchantress. Yayap lures Procyon, and repels Narks. Philie charges Procyon and another unknown player (maybe the MM or Hama?). Narks targets Yayap, but is repelled onto Procyon. He sees Philie visit Procyon. Procyon visits Yayap, but is Citizen, and so nothing happens.

Do the targets of an Enchantress receive feedback? I would assume no, since there is nothing in the feedback thread about it.

3. Yayap is Vigilante. Yayap lied about being charged earlier, for reasons unknown. I don't like this one; it doesn't seem like something a Vig would lie about.

4. Yayap is Vigilante. Hidden Mafia #1 is Consort, Hidden Mafia #2 is Drug Dealer. Drug Dealer targeted Yayap earlier in the game, and made him think he was charged, possibly to discourage him from visiting town members. Not sure about this one either, since no one else has had bogus feedback that we know of.

5. Yayap is Vigilante. A Hidden Gaang is Armorsmith, either as a primary role or an aquired secondary role from you or Zack. Yayap was given armor, and he used it to prevent death from Philie's charge. Narks is telling the truth, and did indeed see Philie visit Yayap. Yayap does not want to reveal Armorsmith, and other townies who have received armor (Zack?) have kept it quiet to lure Mafia into wasting night kills. This one seems far fetched.

6. Yayap is Beguiler. Philie visited Procyon and Yayap. Narks visited Yayap. Yayap picked Procyon as his target, and used a Charm charge. Narks and Philie were charmed onto Procyon, and Narks saw Philie visit Procyon instead of Yayap (but received no feedback about the Charm).

7. Yayap is Executioner. He completed his assignment to get his target, Ganondorf, lynched, gaining night invulnerability. Philie did visit Yayap both times, but he was immune. Narks saw the second visit.

8. Yayap was jailed by a hidden Jailor. Very unlikely.

9. Yayap is Survivalist. He was able to withstand Philie's double charge.

10. Yayap is Mass Murderer and an unknown Evil Neutral role. Instead of spree killing, he used his unknown role's night action last night (or went on a spree against a target who was not home and was not visited by anyone). He is night immune, and thus was indeed charged by Philie twice, but survived.

[FM La]

ascended one actions:
n1 possibly encouraged vigi
n2 2 vigi kills happened
n3 ascendedone is killed

could only be n2 so claimed d3

In this case, Yayap got Magician night 1 from you, or started as Magician and got another, unknown role.

He repelled from himself and onto AscendedOne on night 2. AscendedOne was encouraged night 2, and claimed his feedback day 3. Night 3, AscendedOne was killed by Mass Murderer.

So in this case, Yayap's night actions were:

N1: ???/unknown
N2: Repel, target AscendedOne
N3: ???/unknown
N4: Repel, target Procyon

[FM La]

K, it's 5:50 am. I'm going to bed. I'll see your responses when I wake up and talk to you tomorrow night. xD

[FM Tui]

Order of Operations:
8. Kills
a. Gun Items, Bodyguard, Technician, Vigilante
b. Fire Nation Factional Kill, Associate, Bruiser, Disguiser
c. Phoenix King, Butcher, Crown Princess, Mass Murderer, Overlord, Parolee, Toxicologist

Do all items in each category happen at once, or is it broken down by letter? For example, John has a blacksmith gun. He shoots Jim, the Vigilante. Jim shoots John the same night. Do they both die, or does the blacksmith gun shoot first, killing the Vig before he can complete his night action?

Same scenario, but what if John has blacksmith gun and Jim is instead Disguiser?

If the blacksmith gun happens before the Vig kill, then I would say Yayap is definitely Vig, since Divemaster was killed by blacksmith gun on Night 3 - the same night that MrSmarter was killed by Vig. That would mean that Yayap's night actions here:

N1: ???/None
N2: Shot either Slaol or Raiden
N3: Shot MrSmarter
N4: Shot Philie

Though thinking about it, I guess it would also mean that Philie could not have charged Procyon again (unless some other role higher up in the order - like Witch - forced her somehow, or unless Hama/Combustion Man is also Electromaniac).

If a player is charged once by a Crown Princess, and then later by an Electromaniac, what would the kill look like in the first day post? Who would get credit for the kill?

what if jim is instead crown princess?
in disguiser role card it says disguiser is the slowest kill, why is it then before c

[FM Tui]

I might have revealed you when I included the bit about Shaman. >.>

I will get the quote list with disguiser checks posted tomorrow - it's almost 5 am here, and I need sleep. There's one in the day chat, though, I think on page 2. As far as everyone's answers, only 2-3 came later in the thread, with Narks being the very last person to post their solution.

In terms of drawing the kill, I'm not really 100% on how to do that, but I was thinking the same thing.

At first, I thought I could just claim you. But I would be CC'd by your targets. I could claim Iroh and then reveal that I visited, for example, Crimson on Night 1, without revealing the other targets. But then the remaining targets would think Crimson and I were just scum buddies, and would CC.

I could try to claim some type of power role, but it seems like it would be a pretty transparent lie at this point in the game. I feel like scum would be wary of Aang/Iroh giving someone Veteran or a similar role, and might stay away.

Any suggestions on that front? I can't really claim Lookout without drawing FoS from the real town, since we have two already. Can't claim BG clearly. Can't claim Vig without risking the actual Vig CC'ing. >.>

As far as my read list goes, I can't really do anything beyond guess when it comes to Goonswarm and oops because they both have posted so little. Oops claimed Citizen right out of the gate (day 1, I think) so I put him under town, assuming he claimed early on and then went idle due to boredom. But yeah, with people just AFKing or barely hitting the minimums (like monster did today - 5 posts, after two days in a row of not hitting the minimum), it's pretty difficult to get good reads. x.x

I also excluded a potential Ozai. If Ozai managed to disguise, I have absolutely no clue who he is.

I'm not 100% on FalseTruth, Rumpel, or oops. But I've had a gut feeling that Rumpel is town (or at least not Mafia) for a few days, and I've flip flopped a lot on FalseTruth (but he did push early on Ganon). I'm prone to agree with Gerik's analysis of Spy. But yeah, excluding night results that prove me wrong, this is where I'm at.

FM Zack - Aang
FM vornksr - Iroh
FM Crimson - Hidden Gaang
FM Narks - Hidden Gaang
FM Ozymandias - Hidden Gaang
FM Yayap - Hidden Gaang
FM FalseTruth - Hidden Gaang
FM Rumpel - Hidden Gaang
FM oops_ur_dead - Hidden Gaang

FM Goonswarm - Hidden Fire Nation
FM Spy - Hidden Fire Nation

FM monster - Combustion Man
FM Severn - Hama

FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha - Cabbage Merchant

ah yes there you revealed me. so if you get disguised i need to lynch you right away

to draw the kill well just make everyone believe you are very protown and are very important for the town
i dont recommend to claim iroh though. sure, it could work if i write that i buy the claim, because if they put 2 and 2 together they realize you're white lotus but that would require everyone who knows me to be smart and the risk is pretty big someone ccs it and then he is outed and he could even out me too
claiming any other pr you didnt exclude could work. but you cant really just claim and also it could backfire if they catch the lie
best would probably be to leave an obvious softclaim of bg or doc
bg is definitely not a bad option to fake (unless you claim outright, then they'd wonder why not yesterday). but you did push for the northstar lynch iirc so it makes sense that you didnt want to out. and town doesn't know i am actually bg

[FM Tui]

also if i write i buy your iroh claim the maf could assume i got pr from iroh and kill me

another good idea is if you just claim that you were visited by iroh n4 and aang n3 or hint at it

[FM Tui]

I dunno if Shaman can use a role that targets twice (like Azula). Also, this bit from his role card:
"You may only manipulate a corpse once."

Does that mean Shaman can only use his ability once, or he can only target each dead player once?

I really don't think it's a Shaman, though. My guess is that Yayap learned Vig from you, but has waited to fire until we had a clearer idea of who the scum are (like Zuko should have done to begin with). Of course, if the Yayap-being-Magician theory works out, then who knows? And without knowing Zack's targets N1 or N4, it makes things difficult.

Have you thought about giving Zack a new role? I know it's risky to visit him with MM around. It would be really awesome if he could join us in White Lotus chat, and I feel like him being a member is likely for balance reasons - I don't really see the hosts giving him three power roles.

yayap vigi is possible. yayap neutral is also possible. i don't think narks lied about his feedback, it would be stupid to fake feedback about such semi confirmed town like yayap (bm, charge, pushed for auckmid). doesn't mean that narks isn't tracker though. but well narks pushed ganon from start, so...
shaman can manipulate each corpse once i guess. shaman is definitely very possible but might aswell be amne/second vigi. i guess we will see tonight
also i think once divemaster hinted that he was only responsible for one shot. i'll have to reread this
i also think shaman could use azula, but the answer will be in faq
yayap pushed for someone on d3, do you remember who it was?
zacks n4 target is moot for this speculation, it can act first time this night

i thought about giving zack a new role yes, but first he already has a good power, second mm, third no i dont think he'd get white lotus because of RP reasons and also it would be kind of op if aang and iroh had a chat (definitely more op then 3 powers, as he can use only one each night), and last he will probably not survive very long
but if i dont find a better target might aswell go for him. there's still a chance he gets immunity, mayor, marshall or something

[FM Tui]

I wonder if Yayap might be Hama who started as Parolee before getting Magician from you.

other than the possibilities i already mentioned, it could of course also just be that yayap is simply mm and faked rb or he is hama who started with some immune role or received it n1 in addition to magician

[Forum Mafia GM]

Youre doing it again slaol. Getting mad over simple questions. I cant leave your bullshit uncommented
maybe you should reread fm 20. The whole town was literally frustrated because the afk guys werent modkilled. And why? Only because they were mafia. It was obvious the host was biased which ruined the game and lost it for town. Of course the whole town ecpected the modkill and didnt want to deal with them. And i tell you what, they were right. They shouldve been modkilled and no one wants to deal with afks... thats not the point of the game. I feel like lurking/afking is now a general accepted scum "tactic" and that is one of the reasons games arent fun anymore and tgat i want to leave this site. And i also hate hosts not enforcing their own rules, earlier gerik stated there was no way someone with 0 posts isnt modkilled. Guess that is only true for townies... but even if such person is town a modkill would still be better in the current situation
so surely the "lets leave them for the host" mentality isnt wrong bc thats how it should be. The "lets lynch them bc they werent modkilled meaning they must be scum" mentality is only right if the hosts are idiots. And it is just plain out sad that this mentality is already part of this sites meta. This proves how fucked and dead the site actually is. I dont really have to comment on the "lets not modkill cuz theyre scum, it would hurt the scum team abd also its only natural for scum to afk to win..."

And no you cant make me shut up by threatening i have freedom of speech
but whatever if you want to see another scum afk their way to victory and dont get modkilled because the host was biased then go ahead. But then this FM will probably be the last big this site has ever seen

If we had been rigid about our posting requirement, a third of the players would have been modkilled on day one, which would heavily impact the balance of the game. So we are being a bit lenient on it. So far we have only modkilled people who have not made a single post and a gamethrower. We are monitoring activity levels and will modkill again if necessary. Please stop asking about it.



however we'd definitely need to hide our day names in the other chat, afaik the other chat is anonymous and only i know who i targeted. and targets are informed who iroh is. so scum doesn't know who we are i think, even if they disguise pls confirm



what happens if a scum inherits town roles through professor?
are inherited roles shown in graveyard?
if disguiser disguises as professor, would i still get the roles? would i be informed of getting the roles?

confirm i can pass on powers i inherited
They will inherit the role's powers, but not its win condition.

PMs are wiped before disguisers take a new account.

Yes.



is there an announcement if amne remembers?
what role would shaman use if the target is tailored or is cleaned
No announcement for amnesiac. Shaman is unaffected by tailoring/cleaning. Shaman would still use the power of the target's original role.

I

Does that mean Shaman can only use his ability once, or he can only target each dead player once?

Each once.

case 4: now assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he repelled from himself, would philie and yayap appear on narks feedback (as all 3 are visiting the target of yayap)
Enchantress only repels one person at a time. So no.
i worded that wrong
assuming yayap is an enchantress, if he narks repelled from himself, would yayap appear on narks feedback (as narks would be on yayaps lure target)

Yes


Do all items in each category happen at once, or is it broken down by letter? For example, John has a blacksmith gun. He shoots Jim, the Vigilante. Jim shoots John the same night. Do they both die, or does the blacksmith gun shoot first, killing the Vig before he can complete his night action?

Same scenario, but what if John has blacksmith gun and Jim is instead Disguiser?


If a player is charged once by a Crown Princess, and then later by an Electromaniac, what would the kill look like in the first day post? Who would get credit for the kill?
All items in a category happen simultaneously. In your example, both would die.

The disguiser is a special case because it mimics earlier in the OoO (special kills) so that is the point at which it takes over the account of its target, the target just doesn't officially die until the "Kills" phase of night. So in your scenario the blacksmith gun would shoot at the recently abandoned corpse of the disguiser's old body.

The person doing the second charge would get credit since that's the one that kills.



Do the targets of an Enchantress receive feedback? I would assume no, since there is nothing in the feedback thread about it.
Nope.

what if jim is instead crown princess?
in disguiser role card it says disguiser is the slowest kill, why is it then before c
CP kill goes at the same time as other kills, so there would be no difference.

[FM Tui]

If we had been rigid about our posting requirement, a third of the players would have been modkilled on day one, which would heavily impact the balance of the game. So we are being a bit lenient on it. So far we have only modkilled people who have not made a single post and a gamethrower. We are monitoring activity levels and will modkill again if necessary. Please stop asking about it.

i'm not saying you should modkill those who didnt hit the minimum of 5 posts. but those who don't post at all shouldnt be part of the game anymore imo (unless they have something in RL going on for a short time)
so how many days does one have to afk until he gets modkilled. what if he posts in night chat only? what if it is a scum?

you forgot to confirm that the white lotus chat is anonymous

also you didnt answer if inherited roles are shown in graveyard
also what if mafia inherits town roles, how is this shown in graveyard, simply the name of the town roles? will there be a way to differ between first, second, third and inherited roles?

if disguiser disguises as professor, would i still get the roles? would i be informed of getting the roles?
PMs are wiped before disguisers take a new account.
that wasn't the question, i wanted to know what happened if disguiser killed my professor

All items in a category happen simultaneously.
what is a category here? 8. or b. if it's 8, why then even differ between a, b and c


if one guy is charged by azula and another guy by EM and they run into each other, who did the kill?

[FM Tui]

I don't think Enchantress would work that way.

All the below speculation assumes Narks is indeed Lookout, has not been disguised, and is telling the truth about his results. Those assumptions might be dangerous ones to make, but Narks seems to be working in the town's interest right now.

The Facts:
Narks watched Yayap

Narks saw Philie visit Yayap

Yayap did not die, despite claiming he was charged earlier.

Possible reasons:

1. Yayap is Magician. Yayap picked Procyon as target and repelled from himself. Narks visited Yayap, was repelled, and visited Procyon instead. Philie charges Procyon and Yayap. Narks sees Philie visit "Yayap," but is actually seeing Philie visit Procyon twice.

In the above scenario, would Narks, the Lookout, see Philie visit Procyon twice? As in, would he see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie and FM Philie"? Or would he only see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie"? Would he be informed that he was repelled?

2. Yayap is Enchantress. Yayap lures Procyon, and repels Narks. Philie charges Procyon and another unknown player (maybe the MM or Hama?). Narks targets Yayap, but is repelled onto Procyon. He sees Philie visit Procyon. Procyon visits Yayap, but is Citizen, and so nothing happens.

Do the targets of an Enchantress receive feedback? I would assume no, since there is nothing in the feedback thread about it.

3. Yayap is Vigilante. Yayap lied about being charged earlier, for reasons unknown. I don't like this one; it doesn't seem like something a Vig would lie about.

4. Yayap is Vigilante. Hidden Mafia #1 is Consort, Hidden Mafia #2 is Drug Dealer. Drug Dealer targeted Yayap earlier in the game, and made him think he was charged, possibly to discourage him from visiting town members. Not sure about this one either, since no one else has had bogus feedback that we know of.

5. Yayap is Vigilante. A Hidden Gaang is Armorsmith, either as a primary role or an aquired secondary role from you or Zack. Yayap was given armor, and he used it to prevent death from Philie's charge. Narks is telling the truth, and did indeed see Philie visit Yayap. Yayap does not want to reveal Armorsmith, and other townies who have received armor (Zack?) have kept it quiet to lure Mafia into wasting night kills. This one seems far fetched.

6. Yayap is Beguiler. Philie visited Procyon and Yayap. Narks visited Yayap. Yayap picked Procyon as his target, and used a Charm charge. Narks and Philie were charmed onto Procyon, and Narks saw Philie visit Procyon instead of Yayap (but received no feedback about the Charm).

7. Yayap is Executioner. He completed his assignment to get his target, Ganondorf, lynched, gaining night invulnerability. Philie did visit Yayap both times, but he was immune. Narks saw the second visit.

8. Yayap was jailed by a hidden Jailor. Very unlikely.

9. Yayap is Survivalist. He was able to withstand Philie's double charge.

10. Yayap is Mass Murderer and an unknown Evil Neutral role. Instead of spree killing, he used his unknown role's night action last night (or went on a spree against a target who was not home and was not visited by anyone). He is night immune, and thus was indeed charged by Philie twice, but survived.

here is also an unanswered question

[FM Tui]

we can rule out most of the cases in my last day chat post because host said there would have to be someone else on narks feedback.
possible are only operator targeted narks but i doubt we have one. or an enchantress lured narks. also unlikely to have one
additionally those roles are all town and what townie would fuck with our lookout

[FM Tui]

If we had been rigid about our posting requirement, a third of the players would have been modkilled on day one, which would heavily impact the balance of the game. So we are being a bit lenient on it. So far we have only modkilled people who have not made a single post and a gamethrower. We are monitoring activity levels and will modkill again if necessary. Please stop asking about it.

i'm not saying you should modkill those who didnt hit the minimum of 5 posts. but those who don't post at all shouldnt be part of the game anymore imo (unless they have something in RL going on for a short time)
so how many days does one have to afk until he gets modkilled. what if he posts in night chat only? what if it is a scum?

you forgot to confirm that the white lotus chat is anonymous

also you didnt answer if inherited roles are shown in graveyard
also what if mafia inherits town roles, how is this shown in graveyard, simply the name of the town roles? will there be a way to differ between first, second, third and inherited roles?

if disguiser disguises as professor, would i still get the roles? would i be informed of getting the roles?
PMs are wiped before disguisers take a new account.
that wasn't the question, i wanted to know what happened if disguiser killed my professor

All items in a category happen simultaneously.
what is a category here? 8. or b. if it's 8, why then even differ between a, b and c


if one guy is charged by azula and another guy by EM and they run into each other, who did the kill?

in case it wasnt clear, the grey text are all quotes

[FM Tui]

who claimed charged n3 apart from auckmid?

[FM Tui]

I don't think Enchantress would work that way.

All the below speculation assumes Narks is indeed Lookout, has not been disguised, and is telling the truth about his results. Those assumptions might be dangerous ones to make, but Narks seems to be working in the town's interest right now.

The Facts:
Narks watched Yayap

Narks saw Philie visit Yayap

Yayap did not die, despite claiming he was charged earlier.

Possible reasons:

1. Yayap is Magician. Yayap picked Procyon as target and repelled from himself. Narks visited Yayap, was repelled, and visited Procyon instead. Philie charges Procyon and Yayap. Narks sees Philie visit "Yayap," but is actually seeing Philie visit Procyon twice.

In the above scenario, would Narks, the Lookout, see Philie visit Procyon twice? As in, would he see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie and FM Philie"? Or would he only see, "Your target was visited by FM Philie"? Would he be informed that he was repelled?

2. Yayap is Enchantress. Yayap lures Procyon, and repels Narks. Philie charges Procyon and another unknown player (maybe the MM or Hama?). Narks targets Yayap, but is repelled onto Procyon. He sees Philie visit Procyon. Procyon visits Yayap, but is Citizen, and so nothing happens.

Do the targets of an Enchantress receive feedback? I would assume no, since there is nothing in the feedback thread about it.

3. Yayap is Vigilante. Yayap lied about being charged earlier, for reasons unknown. I don't like this one; it doesn't seem like something a Vig would lie about.

4. Yayap is Vigilante. Hidden Mafia #1 is Consort, Hidden Mafia #2 is Drug Dealer. Drug Dealer targeted Yayap earlier in the game, and made him think he was charged, possibly to discourage him from visiting town members. Not sure about this one either, since no one else has had bogus feedback that we know of.

5. Yayap is Vigilante. A Hidden Gaang is Armorsmith, either as a primary role or an aquired secondary role from you or Zack. Yayap was given armor, and he used it to prevent death from Philie's charge. Narks is telling the truth, and did indeed see Philie visit Yayap. Yayap does not want to reveal Armorsmith, and other townies who have received armor (Zack?) have kept it quiet to lure Mafia into wasting night kills. This one seems far fetched.

6. Yayap is Beguiler. Philie visited Procyon and Yayap. Narks visited Yayap. Yayap picked Procyon as his target, and used a Charm charge. Narks and Philie were charmed onto Procyon, and Narks saw Philie visit Procyon instead of Yayap (but received no feedback about the Charm).

7. Yayap is Executioner. He completed his assignment to get his target, Ganondorf, lynched, gaining night invulnerability. Philie did visit Yayap both times, but he was immune. Narks saw the second visit.

8. Yayap was jailed by a hidden Jailor. Very unlikely.

9. Yayap is Survivalist. He was able to withstand Philie's double charge.

10. Yayap is Mass Murderer and an unknown Evil Neutral role. Instead of spree killing, he used his unknown role's night action last night (or went on a spree against a target who was not home and was not visited by anyone). He is night immune, and thus was indeed charged by Philie twice, but survived.

reason 1: no, yayap would have been on narks feedback
similar question, if azula visits someone twice, how is the feedback on lookout
reason 2: no, yayap would have once again been on narks feedback. also procyon visiting yayap would have triggered an explosion
is it possible to force a citizen to visit someone by witch, enchantress, operator, etc
reason 3: youre right it makes no sense
reason 4: yes i also doubt we have a drug dealer, because nothing shows the opposite. also you forgot to mention that drug dealer would have to target yayap again n4 and prevent the charge feedback
reason 5: yayap would just say he had an armor. no need to reveal the armorsmith and town knowing there is one wouldnt be bad, even if maf knows too. same for doc etc
reason 6: also impossible because yayap wasnt on feedback
reason 7: yayap didnt push for ganon. he pushed for someone else, i dont remember though. other than that possible, though yayap could reveal to avoid confusion but instead he even clearly assured he got no feedback
reason 8: yes there being jailor is super unlikely as we'd know that. also yayap could tell
reason 9: possible. yayap could reveal, see 7
reason 10: so the rb is fake? btw what happens if mm got another role, uses it and is rbed in the same night? would he kill rber though not using mm? though the answer is irrelevant to this point because the rb was n1 where he didnt have another role

some other possible theories i added in one of my previous posts, like tailor (unlikely) or hama (enchantress) combined with some immune neut evil (pretty likely)

[FM Tui]

In this case, Yayap got Magician night 1 from you, or started as Magician and got another, unknown role.

He repelled from himself and onto AscendedOne on night 2. AscendedOne was encouraged night 2, and claimed his feedback day 3. Night 3, AscendedOne was killed by Mass Murderer.

So in this case, Yayap's night actions were:

N1: ???/unknown
N2: Repel, target AscendedOne
N3: ???/unknown
N4: Repel, target Procyon

possible apart from n4 action as stated above

[Forum Mafia GM]

If we had been rigid about our posting requirement, a third of the players would have been modkilled on day one, which would heavily impact the balance of the game. So we are being a bit lenient on it. So far we have only modkilled people who have not made a single post and a gamethrower. We are monitoring activity levels and will modkill again if necessary. Please stop asking about it.

i'm not saying you should modkill those who didnt hit the minimum of 5 posts. but those who don't post at all shouldnt be part of the game anymore imo (unless they have something in RL going on for a short time)
so how many days does one have to afk until he gets modkilled. what if he posts in night chat only? what if it is a scum?
night chat doesn't count. There are no players alive that have been completely afk.
you forgot to confirm that the white lotus chat is anonymous
Sure, why not.
also you didnt answer if inherited roles are shown in graveyard
also what if mafia inherits town roles, how is this shown in graveyard, simply the name of the town roles? will there be a way to differ between first, second, third and inherited roles?
They are. I've said this many times.
Haven't decided yet. Don't choose mafia as a student and maybe it won't be an issue.
if disguiser disguises as professor, would i still get the roles? would i be informed of getting the roles?
PMs are wiped before disguisers take a new account.
that wasn't the question, i wanted to know what happened if disguiser killed my professor
yes, you would get the roles and be informed
All items in a category happen simultaneously.
what is a category here? 8. or b. if it's 8, why then even differ between a, b and c
"8. Kills" is the category. The lettered subsections were originally meant to be separated by faction, though this may not be the case any longer since we have edited it a few times.

if one guy is charged by azula and another guy by EM and they run into each other, who did the kill?

No one. They just die by electrocution.

[Forum Mafia GM]

here is also an unanswered question

He would only see the visit once.

[FM La]

yayap vigi is possible. yayap neutral is also possible. i don't think narks lied about his feedback, it would be stupid to fake feedback about such semi confirmed town like yayap (bm, charge, pushed for auckmid). doesn't mean that narks isn't tracker though. but well narks pushed ganon from start, so...

Yeah, I don't see Narks as Tracker. He pushed too hard on Ganon right out of the gate, when Mafia had nothing to fear.


shaman can manipulate each corpse once i guess. shaman is definitely very possible but might aswell be amne/second vigi. i guess we will see tonight
also i think once divemaster hinted that he was only responsible for one shot. i'll have to reread this
i also think shaman could use azula, but the answer will be in faq
yayap pushed for someone on d3, do you remember who it was?

Yayap was blackmailed d3. In the FAQ, he pushed on Ganon starting at the end of page 3 and going through page 4.


i thought about giving zack a new role yes, but first he already has a good power, second mm, third no i dont think he'd get white lotus because of RP reasons and also it would be kind of op if aang and iroh had a chat (definitely more op then 3 powers, as he can use only one each night), and last he will probably not survive very long
but if i dont find a better target might aswell go for him. there's still a chance he gets immunity, mayor, marshall or something

Yeah, I guess it just depends on who Mafia finds the biggest threat at this point.


who claimed charged n3 apart from auckmid?

Crimson. He didn't claim it until Day 5, though.
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29869-Day-5-The-Day-of-Black-Sun?p=471634&viewfull=1#post471634

N1: Procyon, TheJackofSpades
N2: Ganondorf, Yayap
N3: Auckmid, Crimson
N4: Procyon, ???? (Yayap again, according to Narks)

Going through that thread, I came across this gem:
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29813-Day-4-The-Puppetmaster?p=471104&viewfull=1#post471104

"In order of scummiest to cleanest" with 3 Maf listed last.

Also, I think Zack visited severn at least one night:
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29869-Day-5-The-Day-of-Black-Sun?p=471794&viewfull=1#post471794

If a Magician repels onto a target, and a Lookout targets the Magician (thus going to the Magician's repel target instead), will the Lookout see the Magician visiting the target?

[Forum Mafia GM]

reason 1: no, yayap would have been on narks feedback
similar question, if azula visits someone twice, how is the feedback on lookout
reason 2: no, yayap would have once again been on narks feedback. also procyon visiting yayap would have triggered an explosion
is it possible to force a citizen to visit someone by witch, enchantress, operator, etc
reason 3: youre right it makes no sense
reason 4: yes i also doubt we have a drug dealer, because nothing shows the opposite. also you forgot to mention that drug dealer would have to target yayap again n4 and prevent the charge feedback
reason 5: yayap would just say he had an armor. no need to reveal the armorsmith and town knowing there is one wouldnt be bad, even if maf knows too. same for doc etc
reason 6: also impossible because yayap wasnt on feedback
reason 7: yayap didnt push for ganon. he pushed for someone else, i dont remember though. other than that possible, though yayap could reveal to avoid confusion but instead he even clearly assured he got no feedback
reason 8: yes there being jailor is super unlikely as we'd know that. also yayap could tell
reason 9: possible. yayap could reveal, see 7
reason 10: so the rb is fake? btw what happens if mm got another role, uses it and is rbed in the same night? would he kill rber though not using mm? though the answer is irrelevant to this point because the rb was n1 where he didnt have another role

some other possible theories i added in one of my previous posts, like tailor (unlikely) or hama (enchantress) combined with some immune neut evil (pretty likely)

They see her visit once.
This has already been answered. Yes.
He would be prevented from using his other ability and would instead kill the roleblocker.

[Forum Mafia GM]

If a Magician repels onto a target, and a Lookout targets the Magician (thus going to the Magician's repel target instead), will the Lookout see the Magician visiting the target?

yup.

[FM La]

Not including Gerik since he's dead.


7 612 16121215132618

Lol here is disguiser code.


Sry I was a bit busy yesterday, my code is based on the reversed alphabet. Switch 7+18, 6 + 26, 12 + 13 (13 is supposed to be 14 thought messed that up with N) and 16+15
Then you get 18 2614 151212161267.

18 = I

26 = A
14 = M

15 = L
12 = O
12 = O
16 = K
12 = O
6 = U
7 = T


rbzbdnafactlvz

actual provable code. the previous one was giberrish, but if everyone's doing it. i can do it too.


so gerik's blackmailed

-vote fm northstar


I used cipher method
code = "iamnotmafia"
key = "iamnotneutscum"

i'm sure you can find bonny's old code somewhere in the old fms to verify that my code is true

crypted = "rbzbdnafactlvz"

you can do it manually by adding up the first letter of the code and key, and moding it by 26, and turning that number back into a letter.

which, for anti-mod kill purposes, is how i did it.


I think this is Auckmid claiming Phoenix King.

My disguiser check is: 39 13 15 22 74 10


Whoot not disguised. If you look at my code it's element numbers from the periodic table that spell out an approximation of "Yayap is town"

Can someone collect all the codes? Post your solution so we can find the Phoenix King.


OK, then. My code is 6 10 19 19. Ignore prior code.


My code is the sum of the digits of the first four perfect numbers: 6, 28 (2+8=10), 496 (4+6+9=19) and 8128(8+1+8+2=19).


My disguiser check is: 2281222836168144

It would be weird to disguise as me though. Who would be able to imitate such a badass mofo?


My code 2281222836168144 is actually 228 12 228 36 168 144 which represent the positions of the letters S.A.S.Cnl in the alphabet multiplied by 12 (an arbitrary number that helped keep it secret).


-vote FM Severn


I've been kind of lurky today. I would caution code posters to make a provable code. Two players making two different claims about what a code means, how can the others tell which claim is real?

Here's mine: 132.50.007


My code is a partial of the reverse of the UPC code for Just For Cats brand catnip: 3270005231.

http://www.hartz.com/Hartz_Products/Cat_Products/Toys/Other/3270005231_hartz_wacky_catnip.aspx

[FM La]

I know how I can draw a kill, by the way.

Zack said as his disguiser check that he would say when he visited someone. He never did.

Tomorrow, I will ask him to claim whether or not he visited me, and on what night.

If he was disguised, he will be unable to answer correctly, and we'll know.

If he was not disguised, he will reveal he visited me and gave me a role, and I will draw the Mafia kill.

Win, win, except for the part where I die.

[FM La]

Tomorrow, my first post will start with this:

"Percy Bysshe Shelley was a hack."

If it does not, I am disguised.

[FM La]

Also, thoughts on Severn and his Citizen claim?

[FM La]

Vorn, when you have a second (preferably before 10 pm CST tomorrow), I still want to hear your thoughts on my last 3 posts on page 2 of this thread.

[FM Tui]

@host: if you delete my defense to slaol you also have to remove slaols aggression in day chat as i can't let that uncommented

We will not discuss Modkills in the form of requests, and I should suggest you against annoying the wrath of the Fire Lord. (seriously, don't fucking request modkills, i'm infinitely more likely to modkill those that try to use the host as a weapon. This will potentially serve as a final warning and any request after this may or may not be modkilled themselves. As well, check FM 20 for why that mentality is horrendous to being with)


until the comma is enough

[FM Tui]

Yeah, I don't see Narks as Tracker. He pushed too hard on Ganon right out of the gate, when Mafia had nothing to fear.



Yayap was blackmailed d3. In the FAQ, he pushed on Ganon starting at the end of page 3 and going through page 4.



Yeah, I guess it just depends on who Mafia finds the biggest threat at this point.



Crimson. He didn't claim it until Day 5, though.
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29869-Day-5-The-Day-of-Black-Sun?p=471634&viewfull=1#post471634

N1: Procyon, TheJackofSpades
N2: Ganondorf, Yayap
N3: Auckmid, Crimson
N4: Procyon, ???? (Yayap again, according to Narks)

Going through that thread, I came across this gem:
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29813-Day-4-The-Puppetmaster?p=471104&viewfull=1#post471104

"In order of scummiest to cleanest" with 3 Maf listed last.

Also, I think Zack visited severn at least one night:
http://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showthread.php/29869-Day-5-The-Day-of-Black-Sun?p=471794&viewfull=1#post471794

If a Magician repels onto a target, and a Lookout targets the Magician (thus going to the Magician's repel target instead), will the Lookout see the Magician visiting the target?

sry i meant who yayap pushed for on d2
ah yes crimson thx. explains why i didnt find it
why would zack visit severn?

[FM Tui]

I know how I can draw a kill, by the way.

Zack said as his disguiser check that he would say when he visited someone. He never did.

Tomorrow, I will ask him to claim whether or not he visited me, and on what night.

If he was disguised, he will be unable to answer correctly, and we'll know.

If he was not disguised, he will reveal he visited me and gave me a role, and I will draw the Mafia kill.

Win, win, except for the part where I die.

seems good, i dont see any drawbacks


Also, thoughts on Severn and his Citizen claim?

i wouldnt trust this guy still but he may not be the best lynch target atm


because of lack of time i will postpone all rereads, analysis and posts i still wanted to do to next night
your disguiser check is accepted
mine is
"Good Morning Town,"
with uppercase and ,


i will now see who i'll target
if i should answer anything else tell fast

[FM Tui]

i would actually like to go for oops. it could confirm him as town possibly. but since he afkd on d5 i won't
narks already is lookout. him joining our chat wouldnt help much because he claims all his results anyway
other players have already been visited by me or i dont trust them enough. we have to consider mafia still doesnt know me probably
it's almost like d3, no real good target. but i also don't know who to guard without wasting it. aang would be an option, i doubt mm will perma camp on him but i also doubt he will survive long

i think i will go with rumpel. he is definitely not mafiascum, at worst case he's neutralscum which wouldn't be that bad for me


btw: in addition to your killdraw plan you can add my suggestions above. like softhint bg. this will make the maf afraid of targeting aang

[Slaol]

@host: if you delete my defense to slaol you also have to remove slaols aggression in day chat as i can't let that uncommented

We will not discuss Modkills in the form of requests, and I should suggest you against annoying the wrath of the Fire Lord. (seriously, don't fucking request modkills, i'm infinitely more likely to modkill those that try to use the host as a weapon. This will potentially serve as a final warning and any request after this may or may not be modkilled themselves. As well, check FM 20 for why that mentality is horrendous to being with)


until the comma is enough

I deleted them, I also deleted my own aggro here in this chat, as well as La's response to both you and I. I will not be deleting a post in day chat. That wasn't even directed at you so much as the entire game. Regardless of FM 20 or not, it's a poor attitude to work the host as a weapon, rule oriented or otherwise (like Cryptonic's M-FM when a neutral evil tried to word questions he asked such to confirm himself.) so I am leaving it as is.

[FM La]

I'll soft hint BG to the best of my ability. Rumpel seems like a good choice; I'm fairly certain he is town.

[FM Tui]

Then i will just leave a short response in day chat you can or cannot comment. Id like to know what ozy wrote though

i just hope rumpel isnt disguised

[FM La]

Then i will just leave a short response in day chat you can or cannot comment. Id like to know what ozy wrote though

i just hope rumpel isnt disguised

I basically wrote that you guys should probably PM about this rather than posting it in a chat that will be public after the game. And also that it kind of distracts from our night chat. As far as the issue itself goes, I have no comment. >.>

[FM La]

And we still don't have proof of a disguiser. I just have a bad feeling, since there's nothing else to indicate what the last Mafia is.

[Forum Mafia GM]

Then i will just leave a short response in day chat you can or cannot comment. Id like to know what ozy wrote though

i just hope rumpel isnt disguised

Just keep it to PMs, please. I've had enough of you two arguing. If you're going to do it anyway I'd rather you keep it private and preferably civil.