Remove kidnapper blockable kill
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  1. ISO #1

    Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Remove that crap. It's useless, is the constant topic of rage, questions and annoyance.

    It's broken, seems completely random and in no way balanced. The kidnapper loses the kill, it confirms his role in game along with whoever was jailed. It's seriously absolutely crap.
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  2. ISO #2

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJack View Post
    Remove that crap. It's useless, is the constant topic of rage, questions and annoyance.

    It's broken, seems completely random and in no way balanced. The kidnapper loses the kill, it confirms his role in game along with whoever was jailed. It's seriously absolutely crap.
    Need Unblockable to troll v(o.o(<


    v)o.o)^
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  3. ISO #3

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJack View Post
    Remove that crap. It's useless, is the constant topic of rage, questions and annoyance.

    It's broken, seems completely random and in no way balanced. The kidnapper loses the kill, it confirms his role in game along with whoever was jailed. It's seriously absolutely crap.
    With this option on, Kidnapper becomes about as useful as a Mafioso, even less so. Power roles should have benefits, not things that hinder it.

    #freethekidnapper
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    fucketh me in the ass

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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJack View Post
    Remove that crap. It's useless, is the constant topic of rage, questions and annoyance.

    It's broken, seems completely random and in no way balanced. The kidnapper loses the kill, it confirms his role in game along with whoever was jailed. It's seriously absolutely crap.
    this seriously needs to be done -.-
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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Slaol View Post
    thats terrible. they should be the same.
    I don't know why people even select it as an option, all it does is make people shout "KIDNAPPER" and stop trusting jailors.
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    Wow, this game was really easy. I just had to talk dumb shit to survive some days more. :P
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    If sheriff cleared you honestly I would take him out of my town core and put him as scum.

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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Elixir View Post
    I don't think its horrible as an option for some niche set ups.

    The default should be the unblockable kill iirc.

    If that's not the case it should be adjusted.
    It's broken. No know knows how it works, and it negatively effects the kidnapper.
    How is it not a terrible option?
    Cryptonic made this sig

    Quote Originally Posted by HentaiManOfPeace View Post
    gotchu fam

    Attachment 28016

  15. ISO #15

  16. ISO #16

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    I believe I suggested it originally to nerf the Mafia/Triad's ability to kill Neutral Killers. I had suggested at the time something like ignoring heals but not invulnerabilities and whatnot, as that would have let the NK actually survive. I mean, if the NK isn't invulnerable he could just be killed anyways, but vulnerable NKs isn't really a good thing imo.
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  17. ISO #17

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkestLight View Post
    I believe I suggested it originally to nerf the Mafia/Triad's ability to kill Neutral Killers. I had suggested at the time something like ignoring heals but not invulnerabilities and whatnot, as that would have let the NK actually survive. I mean, if the NK isn't invulnerable he could just be killed anyways, but vulnerable NKs isn't really a good thing imo.
    I'm sure it does not work that way. From what I've seen the block is random.
    Cryptonic made this sig

    Quote Originally Posted by HentaiManOfPeace View Post
    gotchu fam

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  18. ISO #18

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJack View Post
    I'm sure it does not work that way. From what I've seen the block is random.
    That's what I'm saying. I originally intended it to not ignore invulnerabilities. But I don't code the game and they... really misinterpreted my suggestion to put it simply.
    None can stand against the coming Darkness...
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    Sometimes, the light can come from the darkest places...

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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Dean Newton View Post
    While we're on the subject, how many night kills does the kidnapper get? One, or more?

    Also, unless it is known that there is a kidnapper, there's no way to know for the kidnapped person that it wasn't actually a jailor, right?
    He only has 1 execution at his disposal. He can fake an execution after he's used his one charge.

    There is no "universal way" of figuring out if you've been kidnapped or jail, no. If you see your jailor typing to someone else or you are left alive after claiming an evil role, chances are it's a kidnapper.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    DUDE, YOURE ONLY LEFT ALIVE BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN EXTRA CHROMOSOME DO YOU NOT SEE THAT

  21. ISO #21

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    The option should only apply to jailor and not kidnapper, IMO
    Makes it so kidnapper faking an execution to still be read as jailor

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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptonic View Post
    The option should only apply to jailor and not kidnapper, IMO
    Makes it so kidnapper faking an execution to still be read as jailor
    No, it should be completely removed from the game. It adds an unnecessary element of RNG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    DUDE, YOURE ONLY LEFT ALIVE BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN EXTRA CHROMOSOME DO YOU NOT SEE THAT

  24. ISO #24

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Never Unlucky View Post
    No, it should be completely removed from the game. It adds an unnecessary element of RNG.
    Oh, I agree. I'm just saying that in the current game state, it's affecting the completely wrong role lol It makes no sense as it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by S-FM Blue Masquerader View Post
    Hey moron. shut the fuck up or I will shut you up, k? I'm not the person your going to insult and live happily ever after. K? Understand that,

  25. ISO #25

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Simpler is better. Why complicate things? If it isn't absolutely needed, it shouldn't be there. I'm not saying to take a hatchet to what we have now, but mods should keep in mind that sometimes less is more. That said, without a firm understanding of the basics, it makes it nearly impossible to make a game that is even remotely balanced.
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    Spoiler : On Site/Universal Total :
    ..Total: 5/9 = 55.6% | 61/104 = 58.3%..
    ...Town: 3/5 = 60% | 42/76 = 55.3%...
    ....Mafia: 0/2 = 0% | 14/23 = 60.9%....
    .....3P: 1/1 = 100% | 3P: 3/5 = 60%.....
    My advice on Mafia play:
    Get the Led Out

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  27. ISO #27

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    If it still consumes the one true charge the Kidnapper has that should be reported as a bug rather than a feature change because that doesnt seem intended.

    A block should prevent the use of an ability and if the ability is blocked it shouldnt consume a charge.

    Could be something to do with the code allowing for the "fake" kill.
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  28. ISO #28

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Elixir View Post
    If it still consumes the one true charge the Kidnapper has that should be reported as a bug rather than a feature change because that doesnt seem intended.

    A block should prevent the use of an ability and if the ability is blocked it shouldnt consume a charge.

    Could be something to do with the code allowing for the "fake" kill.
    Still none the less having a random event decide the outcome of the action is still a terrible idea.
    Cryptonic made this sig

    Quote Originally Posted by HentaiManOfPeace View Post
    gotchu fam

    Attachment 28016

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  30. ISO #30

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    I support Elixir in that it belonging as a niche option is good, and options always trump non-options. However I think Cryptonic's statements about Kidnppaer faking a kill, and Jailor being the weaker of the 2 are very accurate. Mafia Roles > Town counterparts. Options > Non-Options

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    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Gsudi View Post
    What does that unblockable kill even mean? I can't find it in the wiki..
    The "blockable kill" discussed in this thread refers to a kidnapper/interrogator setting that, when enabled, randomly decides whether or not the execution goes through. This also results in the kidnapper/interrogator wasting his only charge of an execution.

    "Unblockable kill" would be the opposite -- jailor kills cannot be prevented (unless roleblocked by an escort). They are not subject to the laws of RNG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    DUDE, YOURE ONLY LEFT ALIVE BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN EXTRA CHROMOSOME DO YOU NOT SEE THAT

  35. ISO #35

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperJack View Post
    Remove that crap. It's useless, is the constant topic of rage, questions and annoyance.

    It's broken, seems completely random and in no way balanced. The kidnapper loses the kill, it confirms his role in game along with whoever was jailed. It's seriously absolutely crap.
    Make all jails blockable.

    Strongman is an entirely seperate role than a communication + kill role.

    From an FM perspective, it's apples to oranges with the mod.

    But really it's this:
    Strongman Scum - assassin/ unblockable kill
    Jailkeeper Scum - essentially a consort
    Jailor Scum - can be blocked and can communicate AND kill

    They're 3 different roles.

    Jailor is op if jailor is unblockable. Not the other way around on Kidnapper being underpowered.

    *edit* strongman can be roleblocked, not exactly apples to apples but same idea. Unblockable buff is normally only reserved for 3P killer in some setups imo
    Last edited by Frog; September 24th, 2016 at 03:46 PM.

  36. ISO #36

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Elixir View Post
    If it still consumes the one true charge the Kidnapper has that should be reported as a bug rather than a feature change because that doesnt seem intended.

    A block should prevent the use of an ability and if the ability is blocked it shouldnt consume a charge.

    Could be something to do with the code allowing for the "fake" kill.
    Kind of disagree

    Charges if used unsuccessfully are wasted. E.g. X shot sheriff being blocked consumes charges

    Give jailor equal charges instead where charges are concerned.

  37. ISO #37

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Never Unlucky View Post
    The "blockable kill" discussed in this thread refers to a kidnapper/interrogator setting that, when enabled, randomly decides whether or not the execution goes through. This also results in the kidnapper/interrogator wasting his only charge of an execution.

    "Unblockable kill" would be the opposite -- jailor kills cannot be prevented (unless roleblocked by an escort). They are not subject to the laws of RNG.
    Thank you, i always understood it like, the kidnapper cannot decide if he wants to kill his first target or not, like he automatically kill it. I couldn't find it in the description or in the wiki..

    Well, now that i know what it means i must say, i consider it as an pretty unecessary feature too. At least the victim doesn't know if the kill is blocked by an escort.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiki
    The Kidnapper has executions depending on the save settings.
    That isn't true either..

  38. ISO #38

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Never Unlucky View Post
    No, it should be completely removed from the game. It adds an unnecessary element of RNG.
    Agreed.

    They should also make the Kidnapper have the same options as the Jailor, e.g. adjustable number of kills. I personally would keep it as 1 in my save, but there should be the option to change it.

    Possibly the "unblockable kill" option could be reworked to simply mean if it can be blocked by Escort/Consort. Not invulnerabilities, not bus driving, just Escort/Consort's roleblock. If this is implemented, the option should be given to Jailor as well. You could end up with situations like "I blocked him last night but he still executed 1, he's Kidnapper not Jailor" which would add another dimension to the game that fits in with the current game mechanics.
    Last edited by Exeter350; September 28th, 2016 at 02:36 AM.


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  39. ISO #39

  40. ISO #40

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by Reacher View Post
    I just had a blocked kill that confirmed me as kidnapper. I know this is back from September but this is absolutely the worst option to have. RNG shouldn't play a role in any strategy game. You dont see RNG in chess you shouldn't see it in this game as it is chess in a different form.
    Respect for chess.

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  45. ISO #45

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    It's a discussion-based game to good players, a strategy/RNG game to bad players. Good players'll get their red checks by reading what is being said while bad players will rely on the leads the investigative roles have to provide.

    I agree that there is some strategy involved in the gambits and WIFOM situations, but that is secondary to the discussion part of the game.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    DUDE, YOURE ONLY LEFT ALIVE BECAUSE YOU HAVE AN EXTRA CHROMOSOME DO YOU NOT SEE THAT

  46. ISO #46

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    I do this strategy where I claim doctor or sheriff day 1 and watch as none of the protectives heal me as the mafia attack the person who is asking to be doc'ed....

    Claimed godfather one game and got told I was a jester and nobody would lynch me so I won :/

    tldr: I cant even grief properly.

  47. ISO #47

    Re: Remove kidnapper blockable kill

    Quote Originally Posted by PLZLEAVEDUCKK View Post
    I do this strategy where I claim doctor or sheriff day 1 and watch as none of the protectives heal me as the mafia attack the person who is asking to be doc'ed....

    Claimed godfather one game and got told I was a jester and nobody would lynch me so I won :/

    tldr: I cant even grief properly.
    It surprises me how related to the topic this is.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mesk514 View Post
    1-I really and truly believe @Unknown1234 is town. He stuck by me when I needed him
    Quote Originally Posted by Gyrlander View Post
    Wow, this game was really easy. I just had to talk dumb shit to survive some days more. :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    If sheriff cleared you honestly I would take him out of my town core and put him as scum.

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