S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II - Page 23
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  1. ISO #1101

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you're using meta. lol

    Anything in particular that makes you think Quick ISN'T just daring scum?

    I'm of the opinion that you can get a read from a few posts. Now that you have the bigger picture with everyone having posted (and most having voted), you can go through and place them.

    I gathered it was deliberate. Does that apply to your unwillingness to say that many players are town? (in a game with 10 of them)

    Mate, the problem is that you don't EXPLAIN anything like, ever. Not until someone holds your hand and prods you for such contributions. This is why I am struggling to take you seriously - you are clearly capable of high-level contributions yet you fail to provide them until your neck is on the line.

    Why do you conflate high effort with a townie alignment? Given that scum are perfectly capable of scum-hunting in this setup and would put in effort for that reason, this is an extremely flawed metric for reading players.

    Your description of Unknown can also apply to you, can it not? Much like I am with you, you are using his earlier posts to explain why you are scum-reading him now. What makes these two situations different in your eyes.

    I like how you actually admit that you are inconsistent.
    Mostly my gut and previous observations. If he's daring scum then he'll probably slip up some time and it'll be easy to catch him. Don't see him as a strong lynch candidate atm.

    The choice of No-lynch and my choice to not say that players are town is deliberate, yes. (A bit more on this later)

    I'll discuss this more later on in this post too, but remember my ISO on Shifty? That's because I identified that as what was most important to me today, and I set out every part of my position and justification on why. I put high effort into what I considered to be an important read and important pressure.

    I used to associate the two together and have learned my lesson. Which is another reason that I'm now more hesitant to throw out a townie label willy-nilly. I think a no-lynch label is far more accurate of my intentions toward a slot than "this is town."

    I don't think I've equated or made a comparison between my read on Unknown and your read on me. I think that you make a lot of good points.

    Anyway: since you're driving me to evaluate myself and my own play, I'll say this: I admit that I am lazy on Day 1. I think Day 1 reads are inconsistent, I've not been good at them, there are lurkers who lurk to live to Day 2, shitposters who have the same motivation, no flip yet and associations to consider, no night actions to read and evaluate, etc. These are all reasons for why I am far 'lazier' on Day 1 than I am on other days. Since so much of my scumhunting style relies on intent and motivation, it becomes so much easier on Day 2 and beyond to read those things with the wealth of new information that arrives. So yes, I'm lazy on Day 1 and prefer to focus my attention on the things that catch my attention (i.e. Unknown earlier in the day, Shifty now) rather than providing general reads list that often just end up getting revised after the flip and night, hammer vote, so on. I want to choose good pressure and lynch targets, and the information from Day 1 can then be kept in mind and factored accordingly beyond. Basically: I have some gut feelings and develop some feel for who I'd rather keep alive and who I want to pressure / lynch, and then I move on and adapt my reads to become more defined and reliable with some hard info for reading interactions and stuff.

    This has worked for me, so this is how I've approached this game. If my results get worse, I'm certainly open to changing it.
    Death, yet the Town.
    ~The Town Code

  2. ISO #1102

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Logically Insane View Post
    Ok if some of us passed the test, who else are you town reading? Who are you scum reading? Why?
    Town reads:

    Kovath
    Logically Insane
    God Emperor Trudeau
    Sino
    Unknown1234

    I have way too many nulls to give proper scum reads. But if all my reads are correct I have 1/3 of the players as town reads.

    I think Ducks makes the best lynch today because:
    1) Its going to give us a lot of info going into day 2.
    2) That claim was terribad.
    3) There is a really good chance they are scum.

  3. ISO #1103

  4. ISO #1104

  5. ISO #1105

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Logically Insane View Post
    What currently do you have as scum/town reads?
    Here's where i'm currently at :

    Town
    Duck : I think he wouldn't have claimed beguiler that early if he was scum, he's also not tunneling someone, like he did in WoM

    Logically Insane : You seem to be trying to push the game forward, maybe you don't ask enough questions though

    Borderline Crazy Dealers : I feel they have generated the most content in this game

    Voss : I think he's trying, despite having a bit of a hard time, not knowing anyone

    Leaning town

    Kovath : He was trying to get something done as early as RVS, we have yet to see the logical arguments he made during WoM, but i hope we'll see them later

    Unknown1234 : It looks like he's scumhunting a bit now

    Shifty : I don't agree with people scumreading him because of his early post, yes, he's been lurking and hasn't posted that much, but i don't get a scum vibe about him

    Fatalis : He did explain some of his reads, he seems to be town motivated

    Null

    powerofdeath : Nothing from him for now

    Scum

    Rurouni Kenshin : All those "reaction tests" don't help the town, he attacks people on their votes, but where has his content been ?

    G4slight : I still feel like he was just looking for a cheap reason to get a wagon starting on someone

    God Emperor Trudeau : This is purely meta based, but mesk hasn't soft claimed anything yet
    [23:19:33] DarknessB: Sino is Mass Murderer -- I don't care if there isn't one in the setup!
    [23:19:39] DarknessB:
    -vote Sino

  6. ISO #1106

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurouni Kenshin View Post
    Town reads:

    Kovath
    Logically Insane
    God Emperor Trudeau
    Sino
    Unknown1234

    I have way too many nulls to give proper scum reads. But if all my reads are correct I have 1/3 of the players as town reads.

    I think Ducks makes the best lynch today because:
    1) Its going to give us a lot of info going into day 2.
    2) That claim was terribad.
    3) There is a really good chance they are scum.
    why are you reading these players as town then?

  7. ISO #1107

  8. ISO #1108

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Kovath View Post
    Mostly my gut and previous observations. If he's daring scum then he'll probably slip up some time and it'll be easy to catch him. Don't see him as a strong lynch candidate atm.

    The choice of No-lynch and my choice to not say that players are town is deliberate, yes. (A bit more on this later)

    I'll discuss this more later on in this post too, but remember my ISO on Shifty? That's because I identified that as what was most important to me today, and I set out every part of my position and justification on why. I put high effort into what I considered to be an important read and important pressure.

    I used to associate the two together and have learned my lesson. Which is another reason that I'm now more hesitant to throw out a townie label willy-nilly. I think a no-lynch label is far more accurate of my intentions toward a slot than "this is town."

    I don't think I've equated or made a comparison between my read on Unknown and your read on me. I think that you make a lot of good points.

    Anyway: since you're driving me to evaluate myself and my own play, I'll say this: I admit that I am lazy on Day 1. I think Day 1 reads are inconsistent, I've not been good at them, there are lurkers who lurk to live to Day 2, shitposters who have the same motivation, no flip yet and associations to consider, no night actions to read and evaluate, etc. These are all reasons for why I am far 'lazier' on Day 1 than I am on other days. Since so much of my scumhunting style relies on intent and motivation, it becomes so much easier on Day 2 and beyond to read those things with the wealth of new information that arrives. So yes, I'm lazy on Day 1 and prefer to focus my attention on the things that catch my attention (i.e. Unknown earlier in the day, Shifty now) rather than providing general reads list that often just end up getting revised after the flip and night, hammer vote, so on. I want to choose good pressure and lynch targets, and the information from Day 1 can then be kept in mind and factored accordingly beyond. Basically: I have some gut feelings and develop some feel for who I'd rather keep alive and who I want to pressure / lynch, and then I move on and adapt my reads to become more defined and reliable with some hard info for reading interactions and stuff.

    This has worked for me, so this is how I've approached this game. If my results get worse, I'm certainly open to changing it.
    So you don't have any specific posts on hand that strike you as "too scummy to be scum"? He's used the justification of "it's a reaction test" to explain most of his behaviour; what makes you think it'll be easy to catch him if he IS scum?

    If your Shifty ISO was you presenting to the class what you think the most important things are, then you would have presumably applied similar logic to your other scum reads, yes? Can you show us in detail how you've been doing this?

    You "used" to? You've literally conflated the two in this very game with your reads, so what gives with the past tense? Do you not have any other ways of identifying town motivation? This is extremely flippant in a game where almost everyone is town at the moment; you should have more than 2-3 town leans/ reads.

    Day 1 is still important because it's where the townies are the LEAST informed and the scum (Lucianos in this case as they know 2/3 scum already) are the MOST informed. You seem to like using logic gaps to scum-hunt and it's certainly applicable here.

    You do realise that by not providing your thoughts, you just make it harder for town to read you? Which is what you are complaining about with lurkers. I wouldn't say that being active but chary with your thoughts is a great improvement over a lurker.

  9. ISO #1109

  10. ISO #1110

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sino View Post
    And do you really think i wouldn't ask them if you didn'tvote me during RVS ?


    No I think my rvs vote is irrelevant. I'm not saying my rvs vote impacted you one way or the other. I'm confused as to why you think I did. Also that still doesn't validate the efficacy of your questions either way.

  11. ISO #1111

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Kovath View Post

    Scum:
    Shifty- Explained.
    Unknown- Explained earlier, along with potential reservations.
    GET- Not seeing the same type of play I've begun to expect from Mesk recently. Lot more crap than usual. Scum motivation for relying on previous perceptions of shitpost to get by?

    Null / Not much:
    LI- I need to look more closely into this one a lot more. Priority for me.
    G4- Can't distinguish between town and scum from this slot. Not enough produced yet to draw intent reads. Has done some analysis on different players, unlike tunnel and disappearance in Classy. Need to see more from this.
    Voss- See above.
    PoD- Looked back at PoD's post just now (or what there exists of them). Seeing no scum or town motivation, just shitposts and lurking. Sheeped Shifty. zzz. Don't like using meta but have seen this from this player multiple times now.

    No-Lynch for today:
    Fatalis- Townie vibes. Lone wolf read on me is one that's wrong objectively but one that I am beginning to understand the justification for.
    Kenshin- Scummy but doubt he is scum (ignoring players? massive troll face? really?). May just be personal disagreements with playstyle.
    BCD- Too much useful content / perceptive analysis for me to lynch with not enough possible scum motivation either.
    Duck- Has claimed.
    Sino- Asks a lot of questions which could be slight scum ping for me, but again- not enough scum motivation and am seeing some usefulness in questions for town motivation.
    Here was the one I provided earlier.
    Death, yet the Town.
    ~The Town Code

  12. ISO #1112

  13. ISO #1113

  14. ISO #1114

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurouni Kenshin View Post
    Town reads:

    Kovath
    Logically Insane
    God Emperor Trudeau
    Sino
    Unknown1234

    I have way too many nulls to give proper scum reads. But if all my reads are correct I have 1/3 of the players as town reads.

    I think Ducks makes the best lynch today because:
    1) Its going to give us a lot of info going into day 2.
    2) That claim was terribad.
    3) There is a really good chance they are scum.
    Just because someone is playing badly doesn't necessarily mean they are scum. What about Duck's claim is scum-motivated to you?

  15. ISO #1115

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  18. ISO #1118

  19. ISO #1119

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurouni Kenshin View Post
    Like they could very well be Lucianos. Also could be rolefishing with that claim.
    Could you like, possibly go into more detail? You're throwing up points but not backing them up.

    Yes, he COULD be Luciano. So could everyone else. Not seeing why he is the optimal lynch over Shifty or Kovath.

  20. ISO #1120

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    Could you like, possibly go into more detail? You're throwing up points but not backing them up.

    Yes, he COULD be Luciano. So could everyone else. Not seeing why he is the optimal lynch over Shifty or Kovath.
    Same exact play his hydra partner did in charmander revenge. Tunneled a town for no reason, did not consider ANYBODY else. He got culted the next day so I cant tell you what his next course of action was, but he is just a bad player, very myopic doesn't reevaluate. (He was town that game on day1)

    @DF You want the reads from the flip yet if I am a luciano I have already tailored myself and I will show what I intended to show, sadly I am town and you will need to beg for your life while trying to convince them that I tailored myself as beguiler.

    -DucK

  21. ISO #1121

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    Could you like, possibly go into more detail? You're throwing up points but not backing them up.

    Yes, he COULD be Luciano. So could everyone else. Not seeing why he is the optimal lynch over Shifty or Kovath.
    Let me put it this way: what happens if he is scum looking for a CC? The claim is coming out of nowhere IIRC. No mention of doing it for reactions. Like I expect you (you specifically) to look at that and go "what the actual fuck?!?!"

  22. ISO #1122

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sino View Post
    Here's where i'm currently at :

    Town
    Duck : I think he wouldn't have claimed beguiler that early if he was scum, he's also not tunneling someone, like he did in WoM

    Logically Insane : You seem to be trying to push the game forward, maybe you don't ask enough questions though

    Borderline Crazy Dealers : I feel they have generated the most content in this game

    Voss : I think he's trying, despite having a bit of a hard time, not knowing anyone

    Leaning town

    Kovath : He was trying to get something done as early as RVS, we have yet to see the logical arguments he made during WoM, but i hope we'll see them later

    Unknown1234 : It looks like he's scumhunting a bit now

    Shifty : I don't agree with people scumreading him because of his early post, yes, he's been lurking and hasn't posted that much, but i don't get a scum vibe about him

    Fatalis : He did explain some of his reads, he seems to be town motivated

    Null

    powerofdeath : Nothing from him for now

    Scum

    Rurouni Kenshin : All those "reaction tests" don't help the town, he attacks people on their votes, but where has his content been ?

    G4slight : I still feel like he was just looking for a cheap reason to get a wagon starting on someone

    God Emperor Trudeau : This is purely meta based, but mesk hasn't soft claimed anything yet

    @unknown 123
    TBH, this is pretty much my thought process as of now. Do not hold this set in stone, I will have to consult with my team to see their thoughts later. But I wanted to give you something to chew on.

  23. ISO #1123

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    So you don't have any specific posts on hand that strike you as "too scummy to be scum"? He's used the justification of "it's a reaction test" to explain most of his behaviour; what makes you think it'll be easy to catch him if he IS scum?

    If your Shifty ISO was you presenting to the class what you think the most important things are, then you would have presumably applied similar logic to your other scum reads, yes? Can you show us in detail how you've been doing this?

    You "used" to? You've literally conflated the two in this very game with your reads, so what gives with the past tense? Do you not have any other ways of identifying town motivation? This is extremely flippant in a game where almost everyone is town at the moment; you should have more than 2-3 town leans/ reads.

    Day 1 is still important because it's where the townies are the LEAST informed and the scum (Lucianos in this case as they know 2/3 scum already) are the MOST informed. You seem to like using logic gaps to scum-hunt and it's certainly applicable here.

    You do realise that by not providing your thoughts, you just make it harder for town to read you? Which is what you are complaining about with lurkers. I wouldn't say that being active but chary with your thoughts is a great improvement over a lurker.
    I already pointed to the Ignoring you + Trollface post for this one, for instance.

    Unknown was where I did some similar work earlier in the day, I'm pretty meh on the other one plus the null reads. GET is the strongest among them (not saying much) which is why I'm having them fill in the last scum slot for now. I skimmed over that slot's ISO and there's very little intent that I can read there in terms of hard scum motivation.

    Well, just look at my reads list. I'm not going to hard townread someone for it, at most some townie vibes plus no-lynch status.

    Day 1 is important but where I find its greatest utility is in looking back from later days, where town has gained more information, and better evaluating Day 1 info. It's not like I'm not participating or paying attention at all just because I'm not townreading people, for instance. And my decision to pressure Shifty was obviously built entirely on Day 1 content. But, as town becomes more informed with night actions and flips and all those, town then has better perspective to find logic gaps, then read motivations, and in turn begin to spread that angle out further throughout all content from each day and so on. You can scumread me for disagreeing with you on this, but there's a reason towns usually mislynch on Day 1. I feel like it's more a difference in philosophy atm.

    While I don't provide thoughts on every single player like everyone else, I am always (or usually, at least) very clear about explaining judgments and conclusions that I make. I'm not the most open player on Day 1, true, but nowhere am I ever obtuse about statements that I make. And I'm not the highest poster in most game threads (by far), but I would argue that the content density of my posts is pretty high relatively, so it's not an issue of 'this slot provides no content' either.
    Death, yet the Town.
    ~The Town Code

  24. ISO #1124

  25. ISO #1125

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurouni Kenshin View Post
    Let me put it this way: what happens if he is scum looking for a CC? The claim is coming out of nowhere IIRC. No mention of doing it for reactions. Like I expect you (you specifically) to look at that and go "what the actual fuck?!?!"
    I have a flawless counterargument.

    This is SC2 Mafia dot com.

    People here do stupid things and gambit like crazy all the time. For no good reason. It's a dime a dozen.

    If you're considering the possibility of him baiting a CC, what do you make of the fact that there hasn't been one?

  26. ISO #1126

  27. ISO #1127

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Unknown1234 View Post
    Kovath's words don't match his reads. He completely flipped his opinion on me but is still scum reading me. I don't get it.
    Did you read my paragraph and realize that my point was that I have developed some reservations but still believe that your earlier scumminess outweighs atm?
    Death, yet the Town.
    ~The Town Code

  28. ISO #1128

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by G4slight View Post
    No I think my rvs vote is irrelevant. I'm not saying my rvs vote impacted you one way or the other. I'm confused as to why you think I did. Also that still doesn't validate the efficacy of your questions either way.
    Quote Originally Posted by G4slight View Post
    All those questions seemed forced from my reading
    This is why i brought up RVS, unless i missed something, those "readings of yours" could only be RVS since the that post i'm quoting was the first time i saw you post since RVS

    What readings were you talking about ? i can't really imagine you referring to RVS as "readings"
    [23:19:33] DarknessB: Sino is Mass Murderer -- I don't care if there isn't one in the setup!
    [23:19:39] DarknessB:
    -vote Sino

  29. ISO #1129

  30. ISO #1130

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    I have a flawless counterargument.

    This is SC2 Mafia dot com.

    People here do stupid things and gambit like crazy all the time. For no good reason. It's a dime a dozen.

    If you're considering the possibility of him baiting a CC, what do you make of the fact that there hasn't been one?
    IDK, maybe they aren't stupid enough to do it?

    But lets be realistic here. You saw that flack that POD got for his gambit. Why on earth would people think "yeah, that's something I want to do."

  31. ISO #1131

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Kovath View Post
    Did you read my paragraph and realize that my point was that I have developed some reservations but still believe that your earlier scumminess outweighs atm?
    No you said your reservations weren't existent. Also, if your reading me simply because I defended Shifty (because everyone seems to be) I hope you feel stupid when I die and realize THAT I DEFEND PEOPLE

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  34. ISO #1134

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Kovath View Post
    I already pointed to the Ignoring you + Trollface post for this one, for instance.

    Unknown was where I did some similar work earlier in the day, I'm pretty meh on the other one plus the null reads. GET is the strongest among them (not saying much) which is why I'm having them fill in the last scum slot for now. I skimmed over that slot's ISO and there's very little intent that I can read there in terms of hard scum motivation.

    Well, just look at my reads list. I'm not going to hard townread someone for it, at most some townie vibes plus no-lynch status.

    Day 1 is important but where I find its greatest utility is in looking back from later days, where town has gained more information, and better evaluating Day 1 info. It's not like I'm not participating or paying attention at all just because I'm not townreading people, for instance. And my decision to pressure Shifty was obviously built entirely on Day 1 content. But, as town becomes more informed with night actions and flips and all those, town then has better perspective to find logic gaps, then read motivations, and in turn begin to spread that angle out further throughout all content from each day and so on. You can scumread me for disagreeing with you on this, but there's a reason towns usually mislynch on Day 1. I feel like it's more a difference in philosophy atm.

    While I don't provide thoughts on every single player like everyone else, I am always (or usually, at least) very clear about explaining judgments and conclusions that I make. I'm not the most open player on Day 1, true, but nowhere am I ever obtuse about statements that I make. And I'm not the highest poster in most game threads (by far), but I would argue that the content density of my posts is pretty high relatively, so it's not an issue of 'this slot provides no content' either.
    Okay? You didn't say why you think he'll be easy to scum-read if he is scum.

    "the other one" - Carefully considered scum reads, I see.

    So you only have two legit scum reads, one that you're wishy-washy on (Unknown) while the third is someone who you say you can find "little hard scum motivation" for in their posts. After this many posts and THAT'S all you have to show for it?

    Never said you had to hard town-read anyone, just that you are being way too stingy with reading players as town despite the obvious advantages to town-clearing today. Comes across as you wanting to keep your options open.

    Fourth paragraph is generic "Day 1 is useful on Day 4" commentary. Why did you feel the need to tell me all of that?

    Is that bracketed part an admission that you are not being clear with your thoughts this game? Y/N

    High post count =/= town and I never said otherwise. I didn't accuse you of not providing any content either. This reads as an attempt to exaggerate and simplify my argument before countering it.

  35. ISO #1135

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sino View Post
    Here's where i'm currently at :

    Town
    Duck : I think he wouldn't have claimed beguiler that early if he was scum, he's also not tunneling someone, like he did in WoM

    Logically Insane : You seem to be trying to push the game forward, maybe you don't ask enough questions though

    Borderline Crazy Dealers : I feel they have generated the most content in this game

    Voss : I think he's trying, despite having a bit of a hard time, not knowing anyone

    Leaning town

    Kovath : He was trying to get something done as early as RVS, we have yet to see the logical arguments he made during WoM, but i hope we'll see them later

    Unknown1234 : It looks like he's scumhunting a bit now

    Shifty : I don't agree with people scumreading him because of his early post, yes, he's been lurking and hasn't posted that much, but i don't get a scum vibe about him

    Fatalis : He did explain some of his reads, he seems to be town motivated

    Null

    powerofdeath : Nothing from him for now

    Scum

    Rurouni Kenshin : All those "reaction tests" don't help the town, he attacks people on their votes, but where has his content been ?

    G4slight : I still feel like he was just looking for a cheap reason to get a wagon starting on someone

    God Emperor Trudeau : This is purely meta based, but mesk hasn't soft claimed anything yet
    This is WRONG. I'm not tow But mafia.

  36. ISO #1136

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    Okay? You didn't say why you think he'll be easy to scum-read if he is scum.

    "the other one" - Carefully considered scum reads, I see.

    So you only have two legit scum reads, one that you're wishy-washy on (Unknown) while the third is someone who you say you can find "little hard scum motivation" for in their posts. After this many posts and THAT'S all you have to show for it?

    Never said you had to hard town-read anyone, just that you are being way too stingy with reading players as town despite the obvious advantages to town-clearing today. Comes across as you wanting to keep your options open.

    Fourth paragraph is generic "Day 1 is useful on Day 4" commentary. Why did you feel the need to tell me all of that?

    Is that bracketed part an admission that you are not being clear with your thoughts this game? Y/N

    High post count =/= town and I never said otherwise. I didn't accuse you of not providing any content either. This reads as an attempt to exaggerate and simplify my argument before countering it.
    Could you give your reads please?

  37. ISO #1137

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurouni Kenshin View Post
    IDK, maybe they aren't stupid enough to do it?

    But lets be realistic here. You saw that flack that POD got for his gambit. Why on earth would people think "yeah, that's something I want to do."
    Because everyone thinks that their gambits are oh-so-amazing and will definitely work unlike those loser plebs who JUST DIDN'T DO IT RIGHT.

    Everyone wants to be the hero who saves the day with some outrageous gambit. This fits in with Duck's arrogant personality and belief that he HAS to live in order for town to win.

    I highly recommend reading Charmander's Revenge or any game thread where he talks about how his Sheriff claim helped town win the game. You may see why I am less surprised at this play.

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  41. ISO #1141

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Logically Insane View Post
    @unknown 123
    TBH, this is pretty much my thought process as of now. Do not hold this set in stone, I will have to consult with my team to see their thoughts later. But I wanted to give you something to chew on.
    Obviously its not a complete mirror because Sino says Ducks is Town and you have your vote on Ducky.

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  46. ISO #1146

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    Because everyone thinks that their gambits are oh-so-amazing and will definitely work unlike those loser plebs who JUST DIDN'T DO IT RIGHT.

    Everyone wants to be the hero who saves the day with some outrageous gambit. This fits in with Duck's arrogant personality and belief that he HAS to live in order for town to win.

    I highly recommend reading Charmander's Revenge or any game thread where he talks about how his Sheriff claim helped town win the game. You may see why I am less surprised at this play.
    And your stubborn personality is too much for you to see that my sheriff play DID win town that game. I had all 4/4 scum, and my town circle did not have a single non town in it. Lynching the sheriff was correct in every world.

    Until you can say what else won town that game, my 4 for 4 evil reads and flawless town circle all on day 2 is the reason town won that game. My fake claim was bad, but it caused the cult to slip, out and confirm a town who I had not previously read as town.

    also you stated you did not believe I am beguiler, but you don't instantly scum read me which tells me you are scum. If you think I am a specific role say it, because the theory is false and I want to know it and decide whether to tunnel on you or not.

    -DucK

  47. ISO #1147

  48. ISO #1148

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by SexyDucK View Post
    blah blah blah more bragging to prove my point blah blah blah

    also you stated you did not believe I am beguiler, but you don't instantly scum read me which tells me you are scum. If you think I am a specific role say it, because the theory is false and I want to know it and decide whether to tunnel on you or not.

    -DucK
    That logic makes no sense and I'm not explaining it because that would ruin what I'm doing.

    You've tunneled me twice already. I refuse to indulge you a third time.

    End of discussion.

  49. ISO #1149

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    Okay? You didn't say why you think he'll be easy to scum-read if he is scum.

    "the other one" - Carefully considered scum reads, I see.

    So you only have two legit scum reads, one that you're wishy-washy on (Unknown) while the third is someone who you say you can find "little hard scum motivation" for in their posts. After this many posts and THAT'S all you have to show for it?

    Never said you had to hard town-read anyone, just that you are being way too stingy with reading players as town despite the obvious advantages to town-clearing today. Comes across as you wanting to keep your options open.

    Fourth paragraph is generic "Day 1 is useful on Day 4" commentary. Why did you feel the need to tell me all of that?

    Is that bracketed part an admission that you are not being clear with your thoughts this game? Y/N

    High post count =/= town and I never said otherwise. I didn't accuse you of not providing any content either. This reads as an attempt to exaggerate and simplify my argument before countering it.
    He's kinda maneuvered himself into a spotlight with his play, it'll be easy to catch changes and shifts in it.

    I wasn't lying when I said I thought Shifty was my target for today and about the other aspects of my Day 1.

    Many of the active players are those who I would prefer not to lynch today for reasons I've stated before (whether that's because they've claimed like Duck or because I like the content produced, for instance). The other slots have not produced much at all which is it is extremely difficult to get a read on them or scum intent. Shifty was an exception for me due to the particular content and posting pattern, as I elaborated earlier in my ISO.

    I'm adverse to town-clearing players early after MattZed (this might be an ironic statement, lol). I'll feel better about clearing later in the game. I don't know if we're actually arguing on this point or if we're using different terminology. There are people that I think produce good content that I will listen to, and that I would like to keep alive at the moment. Is there a functional difference besides terminology?

    You gave me a spiel about how Day 1 was super important due to the gap in information, I considered my paragraph an explanation for why I think Day 1 becomes way more useful later on when town has the information it needs to better evaluate those gaps in information from Day 1.

    I am pretty sure I have been clear and transparent with my thought process in this game. So no, that was not a 'slip.'

    Your point was that town has a tough time reading me, my point in return is that my content is still pretty high so townies should be able to read and evaluate what I post. I wouldn't say that I strawmanned your point.
    Death, yet the Town.
    ~The Town Code

  50. ISO #1150

    Re: S-FM 200: Mafia Wars II

    Quote Originally Posted by Borderline Crazy Dealers View Post
    That logic makes no sense and I'm not explaining it because that would ruin what I'm doing.

    You've tunneled me twice already. I refuse to indulge you a third time.

    End of discussion.
    not end of discussion, you are telling me role you think I am.

    You are looking only to lynch the FBI agent today, you think I am luciano, because you said you did not think I was beguiler, yet you are not scum reading me for it.

    I will be tunneling on you this entire game until you tell me.

    -DucK

 

 

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