S-FM 292: ★ Silent Night ★ [14P]

[Caustic]

What do you mean, he made a mistake? Do you know his role?

Dose Ozy Inspire you?
When going to fake a claim as Town you expect it to benefit the Process, alternatively it backfires and you end up getting incriminated of both falsely being and by the Parasites.

Then I shall concern myself with what’s most cryptic.
Helping Town isn’t what you do, but how you do it.
It can be perceived in many ways.
He made a mistake and retracted it.
If he does meet his end, it’s life, he made an error in the process and as such small mistakes like those cause Parasites to significantly increase in energy, course this is considering there is no flaw in my analysis.

Or you just answer the question instead of beating around the bush.

I shall now observe as you breath it in.

[blinkskater]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php...ad_of_Analysis
I definitely townread her for the same reason you.
But I want you to reconsider your position on me.
If your previous reason to scumread me was that you trusted aamirus to be correct, then for that same reason you should townread me since I don't think she scumreads me anymore either.

I did have other reasons i scum read you, aamirus came after. I'm leaving it alone today, and i doubt i'll even be alive to have to worry about it tomorrow.

[Kovath]

Oh i understand, for me it was more of the way that aamirus was pushing PTB. It seemed identicle to the way she was pushing ozy here. Ozy and PTB also kind of came into the game with a pre meditated strat that imo had the intent of possibly miss leading town and allowing scum to blanket information. I saw PTB as scummy that game as I saw ozy as scummy this game. And while aamirus was going back and forth with ozzy i found myself agreeing with her logic over ozzys. Same way i felt when she was teeing off on PTB.

idk, reading the start to Vengeful and things seem a bit different

For example, PTB implies that his RQS (random question stage?) is actually systematic and normal for him (I think I might have vague memories of him doing this type of thing actually). PTB's initial reactions in that game also read way scummier to me than what I can remember of Ozy's here (I may need to look at his ISO again). Though, it's been a long time since I've played with PTB so he might have been following his norm.

All-in-all the appeal to Vengeful seems tenuous. I can see Town using these kinds of intuitive remembered associations to help bolster a read. You are probably also drawing on old impressions whereas I am reading the gamethread fresh.

At the same time, a connection I don't agree with doesn't make me feel better about you, and ofc I don't think it supports aamirus being town either.

[DJarJar]

The thing is, blink trusts aamirus to be right again.
Except, this game aamirus doesn't go after me while in that game, she went after ptb until ptb dies as far as I can tell
https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...801#post745801

Technically the way that played out, almost identically to here, I pushed PTB hard at the start of d1. I was very hard reading him as scum but then I moved on from my back and forth with him just as I did with you here. As I pushed other people he slowly moved back into my good graces and you’ve kind of done the same. I actually prevented a d1 lynch in that game (There were no night actions) and eventually in D2 we lynched Stealth who was the one going directly opposite against PTB (but then stealth used his dying ability to shoot PTB). I certainly see the parallels with that game here and it also makes sense that stealth is townreading me cuz he was in that game too. Still, at the moment I’m not interested in lynching you.

I want MM but that seems unlikely with the number of people townreading him. To me anyway his reads seem mostly fake, like he’s pretending that he’s never played with any of us before even though we’ve played countless games together. Anyway, oddly, this is probably the first game where I’ve ever wanted an Efe lynch. As town or scum in the past I’ve always wanted him alive. It feels weird but I had no scum read against him for his early antics or even the town power claiming and etc. but when he panicked and pulled back his claim in fear of death... I mean I’ve only ever seen Efe do that when he feels bad about letting his team down and wants to survive for their sake. He would never do it as a normal townie in my opinion.

[DJarJar]

idk, reading the start to Vengeful and things seem a bit different

For example, PTB implies that his RQS (random question stage?) is actually systematic and normal for him (I think I might have vague memories of him doing this type of thing actually). PTB's initial reactions in that game also read way scummier to me than what I can remember of Ozy's here (I may need to look at his ISO again). Though, it's been a long time since I've played with PTB so he might have been following his norm.

All-in-all the appeal to Vengeful seems tenuous. I can see Town using these kinds of intuitive remembered associations to help bolster a read. You are probably also drawing on old impressions whereas I am reading the gamethread fresh.

At the same time, a connection I don't agree with doesn't make me feel better about you, and ofc I don't think it supports aamirus being town either.

You’re looking at PTB in there when you’re supposed to be looking at me. The question is really if the way I’ve pushed ozy and MM is normal for me as a townie or not. I would say the game they’re talking about is a good example of a game where i played the same way I’ve played here and I was town in that game. Ozy might not be the same as PTB but that was only half of what Blink was saying

[Kovath]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php...ad_of_Analysis

The fact that you posted this, ignoring my last line, is a big mis-portrayal.

Are you re-evaluating your reads or are you just reading all my new posts in the context of your old scumread

[Kovath]

You’re looking at PTB in there when you’re supposed to be looking at me. The question is really if the way I’ve pushed ozy and MM is normal for me as a townie or not. I would say the game they’re talking about is a good example of a game where i played the same way I’ve played here and I was town in that game. Ozy might not be the same as PTB but that was only half of what Blink was saying

Personally, I don't see Mafia as one-dimensional game around an ISO. A push on someone I consider scummy is different, in my eyes, than the exact same push on someone I consider towny.

I take your point about Blink's argument though. I'll look at your ISO and see if I can understand his perspective

[OzyWho]

@Frinckles
After the game I want a reward in my profile for figuring the game out ;)

Though I idk who the neutrals are
1 is prob efe

[DJarJar]

So what separates chip and caustic from mag and Yagami since you have those 4 as ?s

[OzyWho]

So what separates chip and caustic from mag and Yagami since you have those 4 as ?s

Those 4 I had to guess, everyone else I feel sure about.
Those 4 purely instinctive guesses.

[DJarJar]

Hi mag, how do you feel about people saying that despite your high post count, you’re basically an afker in this game? Care to give some reads when you’re finished catching up?

[Kovath]

Oh i understand, for me it was more of the way that aamirus was pushing PTB. It seemed identicle to the way she was pushing ozy here. Ozy and PTB also kind of came into the game with a pre meditated strat that imo had the intent of possibly miss leading town and allowing scum to blanket information. I saw PTB as scummy that game as I saw ozy as scummy this game. And while aamirus was going back and forth with ozzy i found myself agreeing with her logic over ozzys. Same way i felt when she was teeing off on PTB.

Yeah well i feel less strongly that shes right now, but still feel strongly that she was honest and valid for the strong push on you, i went over that in my wall post.

From my first read: I think the two pushes ended up being different in foundation - in Vengeful, aamirus continued to push strongly on the RQS and PTB's defensive reactions to that and the initial joke scumread. This game seems to stem from the "day chat" thing and reactions to that.

I now understand the vibe/tonal thing though. I can't say whether her scum games are any different, so if anyone can, that would be appreciated.

[Kovath]

-vote Solid D.

This slot needs a push, I don't get the gut town reads on it

[DJarJar]

From my first read: I think the two pushes ended up being different in foundation - in Vengeful, aamirus continued to push strongly on the RQS and PTB's defensive reactions to that and the initial joke scumread. This game seems to stem from the "day chat" thing and reactions to that.

I now understand the vibe/tonal thing though. I can't say whether her scum games are any different, so if anyone can, that would be appreciated.

Did you honestly read past the day chat thing? We went on for a couple hundred posts about completely different things..

[DJarJar]

Hi mag, how do you feel about people saying that despite your high post count, you’re basically an afker in this game? Care to give some reads when you’re finished catching up?

Meh. Saw his name at the bottom for about 10 minutes but I guess it’s not fair to do that.

[Kovath]

Did you honestly read past the day chat thing? We went on for a couple hundred posts about completely different things..

I focused on the start of the push since I believe that's around when Blink first made the association to Vengeful

[DJarJar]

I have to proctor a final tomorrow which starts at 11:30am and goes to 2:30. But then the small portion of students who get double time will go all the way until 5:30. So I’m not sure if I’ll be around, I should be able to post whilst totally ignoring the students but we shall see

[Ganelon]

Hi mag, how do you feel about people saying that despite your high post count, you’re basically an afker in this game? Care to give some reads when you’re finished catching up?

from my perspective I completely disagree with this assessment of me, I should be more townread than I usually get in-gamees, though I suppose it's possible people don't look at what I'm actually doing in-game (I feel I've been more active this game than in any other game, and I'm not talking just about post count)
also my reads:

MM, sb16, kira, you and ozy are town in my book
blink, varcron, efe, Huey should be under FoS today

[DJarJar]

I focused on the start of the push since I believe that's around when Blink first made the association to Vengeful

I wish to take a show of hands how many people have read every post so far. I know >1000 is a lot but I’m genuinely curious. I feel like it’s only 3 or 4 out of 14 who have done so

[Ganelon]

also I'll be going off very soon because I'm very, very tipsy and can barely post rn

[DJarJar]

from my perspective I completely disagree with this assessment of me, I should be more townread than I usually get in-gamees, though I suppose it's possible people don't look at what I'm actually doing in-game (I feel I've been more active this game than in any other game, and I'm not talking just about post count)
also my reads:

MM, sb16, kira, you and ozy are town in my book
blink, varcron, efe, Huey should be under FoS today

I can guess your reasons for most of them, care to elaborate on varcon? I feel like I haven’t seen enough of him to decide

[Ganelon]

I agree with Kovath (not sure 100% if Kovath is saying this btw, don't want to take his words out of context so be sure to read his posts first) in that PTB claims that his weird questions are not AI; in fact, I would myself argue that PTB would do that as either town or scum (I remember reading a game where PTB did that and if I remember correctly he was sheriff or something that game; I remember Cryptonic was also in that game but nothing else)

[Varcron]

I wish to take a show of hands how many people have read every post so far. I know >1000 is a lot but I’m genuinely curious. I feel like it’s only 3 or 4 out of 14 who have done so

I haven't, I'm just keeping up the most recent stuff at this point, moves too damn quick with my activity for me to read everything all the time.

[Ganelon]

I can guess your reasons for most of them, care to elaborate on varcon? I feel like I haven’t seen enough of him to decide

It's mostly gut, but I feel varcron is being too cautious today and that none of his opinions/actions have gone against the tide, indecisiveness is NOT a towny trait

[Ganelon]

I'm working through these vote trains on Light and Efe. If both are scum this is god-awful play; the most likely scenario is that at least one is town.

Both train were hard-pushed at end by the same general cast of people (incidentally, both were also derailed by Mag but idk how to feel about that).

The Efe train is particularly weird since SB's stated intent was to read Efe at L-2/L-3, and it seems independently within the span of 10 minutes multiple people voted him while apparently not noticing that the others were. After L-1 was declared the train rapidly collapsed, and SB had to try and appeal to re-drum vote pressure. [see posts in range 650~820]

idk about meta but my hunch is that Efe is not scum here, too many people are ok with liberally applying votes for me to be comfortable

Interesting take on things, I've hosted a game where Efe was scum and he almost got lynched d1 (multiple people were voting him relatively early on, and he was trying really hard)
that being said lemme lay down some reads:-
I feel Efe's being honest to some extent this game in the sense that he is indeed trying to be more helpful this game, I noticed even his OOG personality has changed to some extent

[Ganelon]

Mag is basically full null; he's just spam-posting, giving light reads on meta-targets, and parroting agreement with posts (as he did when quoting a post of mine about the direction of conversation and then doing nothing with that)

SB I want to hear in your words the functional difference between Efe's claim and softing TPR to bite bullets

don't agree at all, Im not parroting arguments and in-fact I've been more towny this game than in any other game

[Ganelon]

If mag was here i'd vote him rn and tell him he's pinging my scumdar tbh

and I'd tell you you're also pinging my scumdaar and omgus you ttbh

[DJarJar]

don't agree at all, Im not parroting arguments and in-fact I've been more towny this game than in any other game

But how? I mean if you iso yourself, I just don’t see much more there than someone like Kovath himself who probably has 1/4 of the posts

[Ganelon]

Benevolent Variable


Magoroth - Seems to be providing rather interesting content.
Blinkskater - Admirable with Self Amusement Yet also provides self strategy
Varcron - A Concern insect willing to solve the inevitable will such passion
Marshmallow Marshall - Fair Judgement with high Cooperation and good Content.
Efekannn02 - No Liability, No Low or High Volume either. This seems Miraculously probable to be Town.
Stealth Bomber 16 - Seems to have good intentions and concerns that forwards the process

Unknown Variable
Chip Skylark - Ah the I haven’t read my rolecard excuse. Remarkable.
aamirus - this a Very Concerning Insect.
Definitely doesn’t lack confidence but provides unknown intention.
Light - Lacking Inspiration to take solid accusations
Huey The Long - I am still deciding my conclusion regarding this Variable

Parasites
Kovath - An Insect resisting Determination, content lacking enthusiasm and amusement.
OzyWho - Appears to jump to conclusions rather consistently
Solid D. - Lacks Ambition and Motivation
Deliberately neutralizing the correct strategy causing a burden to the process

ya know maybe Caustic wouldn't be a bad Lynch either

[Ganelon]

But how? I mean if you iso yourself, I just don’t see much more there than someone like Kovath himself who probably has 1/4 of the posts

perhaps I have a poor way of expressing myself this game but unlike most games I'm actually reading people snd trying to figure out alignments, sure most of my posts have a trolling tone to them but if you go past that I'm definitely towny
also ya, Kovath isn't too bad reads-wise

[Kovath]

I agree with Kovath (not sure 100% if Kovath is saying this btw, don't want to take his words out of context so be sure to read his posts first) in that PTB claims that his weird questions are not AI; in fact, I would myself argue that PTB would do that as either town or scum (I remember reading a game where PTB did that and if I remember correctly he was sheriff or something that game; I remember Cryptonic was also in that game but nothing else)

Huh? You might want to quote where actually you think this is coming from

Interesting take on things, I've hosted a game where Efe was scum and he almost got lynched d1 (multiple people were voting him relatively early on, and he was trying really hard)
that being said lemme lay down some reads:-
I feel Efe's being honest to some extent this game in the sense that he is indeed trying to be more helpful this game, I noticed even his OOG personality has changed to some extent

Then tell us about that game. Is it just "Efe was trying really hard so we voted him"? And, was he being bussed / voted by his scummates?

[Ganelon]

Huh? You might want to quote where actually you think this is coming from



Then tell us about that game. Is it just "Efe was trying really hard so we voted him"? And, was he being bussed / voted by his scummates?

I would have to check, brb, don't remember that game much except he nearly got lynched

[Kovath]

I would have to check, brb, don't remember that game much except he nearly got lynched

I mean my post

[Kovath]

I mean my post

Whoops, completely misread your post. For some reason I thought you were answering about the PTB part. Ignore.

[Ganelon]

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ku-Jidai/page6
link to the game
I think Efe was FM-Toshikazu, or Sorai

[Ganelon]

oh yeah sorai was efe

[Caustic]

Hi mag, how do you feel about people saying that despite your high post count, you’re basically an afker in this game? Care to give some reads when you’re finished catching up?

The only people considering that are people who lack intelligence.

[Caustic]

ya know maybe Caustic wouldn't be a bad Lynch either

Care to elaborate?

[DJarJar]

The only people considering that are people who lack intelligence.

I appreciate that instead of responding to the people who are confused with your posts with some kind of explanation, you just call all of us stupid. Lol

[DJarJar]

Frinckles idk if this guy is your friend or whatever, but it seems an almost universal consensus that he’s... a bot. Do we have any reserves? And yes I vastly prefer Efe over this nonsense

[DJarJar]

I don’t like how it looks like we will never get anything from that slot this game.

[Caustic]

I appreciate that instead of responding to the people who are confused with your posts with some kind of explanation, you just call all of us stupid. Lol

From my perspective, Meg had the best intentions to the process.
While I still suffer to determine yours.
Where may your intentions lay? What Methods are you using?
What strategy do you use? How will you benefit the process?

I’m still deciding the Conclusion to those questions.

[Caustic]

I don’t like how it looks like we will never get anything from that slot this game.

That is false.
I am a Variable like everyone else.
I Engage, State my mind, fit in with the Process.
As everyone else does.
You concluding otherwise is rather. Remarkable.

[Caustic]

-vote aamirus

Time to produce pressure to this Variable.

[Caustic]

I see potential failures in my analysis I must resolve.
I may switch Kovath with aamirus depending on the outcome.

[DJarJar]

That is false.
I am a Variable like everyone else.
I Engage, State my mind, fit in with the Process.
As everyone else does.
You concluding otherwise is rather. Remarkable.

Cool I’m glad you’re at least contributing even if it’s a vote against me. Feel free to add in some more posts that anybody else in the game can actually understand. So far this is just an OMGUS. Feel free to explain why I should be lynched

[Chip Skylark]

hi this is naz im dedicating like 30 mins to this game

who should i ISO? efe is at L-4 but i really would rather not read that

[Chip Skylark]

the next 30 mins **

gonna start clicking on random pages and reading

[Solid D.]

wow. so i just caught up, good and questionable stuff? lol
gonna hit the shower an make some soup! lets have a conversation and root some stuff out

btw @Frinckles is a very shitty zelda and a very shitty king k. rool. TERRY BOGARD FOR LIFE

i frend with Frinckles <3

[Chip Skylark]

wow. so i just caught up, good and questionable stuff? lol
gonna hit the shower an make some soup! lets have a conversation and root some stuff out

btw @Frinckles is a very shitty zelda and a very shitty king k. rool. TERRY BOGARD FOR LIFE

i frend with Frinckles <3

wut up dude

why haven't you voted anyone yet?
what do u think about kovath's vote on u??