Register

User Tag List

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 42
  1. #1

    Discussion: Cult

    I believe it's time to address the purple elephant in the room. As per usual, I'll preface by saying anything related to cult or masons will not be pushed in the first update. I've got enough polishing on my plate to do all that. Additionally, this is a discussion thread on everyone's favorite (take that how you will) faction -- please be courteous and keep your posts concise.

    Cult has a bit of a reputation for either being extremely strong, or pretty damn weak. We can generally attribute that variance to how often they can convert and the presence of Masons. Honestly, I don't have many ideas or even much feedback to go off of in regards to how to fix this issue so I'd love some input and ideas. Anyway, this is what I got so far:

    -Cult Leader (Neutral Evil) Can convert town members into Cultists each night: If the Cult Leader dies, all cultists (or half, rounded up) will suicide.
    Why: This allows the cultists to be the same all-consuming entity that some people see as ideal while at the same time putting a check in place to stop it in it's tracks completely. If a Cult Leader chooses to convert you, you get a second chance at a victory on his/her terms.

    -What that means for Witch Doctor: I'd recommend we actually think of comprehensive plan for a new faction and put the Witch Doctor there. Call it The Circle or The Tribe or whatever with it's own unique killers, deception and support roles similar to Mafia/Triad. Let Witch Doctor simply heal like a regular Doctor, but for a different team. Maybe they can have a variant of Electromaniac that places "hexes" on people to kill or something, I dunno.

    Anyway, get creative and fire away.
    Last edited by Frinckles; July 11th, 2019 at 11:06 AM.

  2. #2

  3. #3

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Tauntshaman View Post
    I don't like the idea of making a new faction like mafia/triad...

    Also u need to think about how the old saves will be affected, if u r gonna change a few roles
    Cult is already it's own faction, and was intended to be from the beginning although it was never quite fleshed out. I guess it's important to distinguish between Cult as a faction and the cultist role though. I liked the more traditional idea of the Cult role as seen here: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Cult
    I'm not sure what you mean about old saves.

  4. #4

  5. #5

  6. #6

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    I think Cult should be a more fleshed out faction with a WD maintaining the old cult.

    If you did the Cult Leader dies, whole cult dies, that would be awesome. Where WD would then change to a two part role. Recruiting new members, or protecting the Cult Leader. Not sure what to call this role but it would be good 8 3 3 1.

    8 Town - 3 Triad - 3 Cult - 1 Neut/any random. Or a 7 3 3 2.

    Cult Leader, WD (Protective), Cultists, Farseer (Investigative), Apothecary (Killing).

    Apothecary, just a small idea, could make an antidote for 1 Cult member each night. OR cause one person to accidentally drink with the cultists that killed themselves. It's only a killing role as a way to get a playing field balancer. So if Marshall Lynch's Cult Leader and cult dies and the apothecary poisoned marshal the night before. Marshal is poisoned. and cult is eliminated taking Marshal with them. OR The apothecary uses the antidote on WD. Then WD is saved and can continue on. Converting into Cult Leader or Retaining Role.

  7. #7

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    I think adding more roles for cult members (like support/deception roles) would also serve to better flesh cult out.
    Maybe, instead of having all the other cult members die if the Cult Leader dies, make it so the Cult Leader is the only one who can recruit new Cultists. That would nerf the Cult a bit.
    You'd also perhaps need an investigative role to help the Cult in finding potential convertees.
    Last edited by Magoroth; July 12th, 2019 at 09:53 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkskater View Post
    Polish my nuts and serve me a milkshake. Anyone who uses scum syntax will be lynched.

  8. #8

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Cult is an inherently broken faction.

    The settings vary way too much. There is no way a cult team should be allowed to recruit every night.

    Furthermore, the main cult opposition is a mason leader. There should be some sort of guarantee of masons if cult spawns. Sheriff is not strong enough to deal with cult.

    This faction needs a wholesale revamp so I heartily approve of these initial discussions.


    Cult leader is an interesting idea to help the whack a mole situation that forms, but still, cult should not be able to recruit every day.
    Last edited by renegade; July 13th, 2019 at 05:58 PM.

  9. #9

  10. #10

  11. #11

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Stereo View Post
    I like the idea of Cult being expanded upon and then taken out of the Neutral Evil pool.

    Mafia/Triad with a Neutral Killing has gotten pretty formulaic, it would be nice to see something more unique take Mafia/Triad's spot in traditional setups.
    Issue is, I don't know if a faction that starts out with 3+ members can remain balanced while still having the conversion mechanic. On the other hand, I can see Cultist/Cult Leader (by itself) being a standalone role that can convert each night. At that point though, this new 'faction' we're talking about really wouldn't even be cult -- it'd be something else. I may try to ship the update with an option for the mass-suicide mechanic just so people can try it out. At the very least, it gives the Cult an Achilles heel.

    To your second point, the idea of Mafia / Triad roles that are unique only to their own faction did pop up. It's a different conversation for a different time but making the gang-war type setups a bit more interesting sounds fun.

  12. #12

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Frinckles View Post
    Issue is, I don't know if a faction that starts out with 3+ members can remain balanced while still having the conversion mechanic.
    If they can't kill at night (or have limited [1~2] kills) then I think it works out. The game is driven less by people dying and more by how people act with what goals they are trying to achieve.

    Then probably a no conversion on night 1 option for the converter.

    On the other hand, I can see Cultist/Cult Leader (by itself) being a standalone role that can convert each night. At that point though, this new 'faction' we're talking about really wouldn't even be cult -- it'd be something else.
    To be honest I'd rather Cult become their own thing. As a neutral evil it isn't fun that you lose because a 1.3% chance spawned in game with no masons. As they are now, they are among the least fun to play against and as.

    I may try to ship the update with an option for the mass-suicide mechanic just so people can try it out. At the very least, it gives the Cult an Achilles heel.
    I dig.

    To your second point, the idea of Mafia / Triad roles that are unique only to their own faction did pop up.
    To be honest I thought that was where this thread was headed.

  13. #13

  14. #14

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    I think the general cult members should have some kind of "pray" ability where, if they all target cult leader, the CL is healed.

    Imo having the entire cult die when CL dies makes them very fragile with not much incentive - for me personally - to play and enjoy.

    Edit: And yes, invest would see them all congregating onto him/her

  15. #15

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by MaShY View Post

    Imo having the entire cult die when CL dies makes them very fragile with not much incentive - for me personally - to play and enjoy.

    Edit: And yes, invest would see them all congregating onto him/her
    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkskater View Post
    Polish my nuts and serve me a milkshake. Anyone who uses scum syntax will be lynched.

  16. #16

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    I just see it as high risk, high reward. Converting a person each night is pretty ridiculous. Couple that with the status quo including the possibility of a witch doctor. I think it might reward good play/misdirection from teammates and cult leader but we'll have to see.

    At any rate, it can just be an option to try out for the meantime while we think something else.
    Last edited by Frinckles; July 16th, 2019 at 02:22 PM.

  17. #17

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    That reminds me. Whilst a little-known strategy, in a cult game with no Neutral Killers and a Mayor, the Mason Leader can keep visiting the Mayor every night, thereby preventing conversion. This guarantees at least 3+ votes for the town throughout the game (this would be the optimal play for the Masons in such a scenario). I feel like this ability might be a bit too strong, perhaps we should consider removing the Mason Leader's ability to protect the Mayor from Conversion? Or perhaps limit it in some way.
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkskater View Post
    Polish my nuts and serve me a milkshake. Anyone who uses scum syntax will be lynched.

  18. #18

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Magoroth View Post
    I feel like this ability might be a bit too strong, perhaps we should consider removing the Mason Leader's ability to protect the Mayor from Conversion? Or perhaps limit it in some way.
    I've noticed this and if there's no other kill capable evil aligned roles in the game, Town wins.

    Perhaps protecting unique Town Government roles eats a conversion? This doesn't stop the Mason Leader from committing suicide, but it does give cult a 1 night opportunity to convert Mayor if they feel so inclined.

  19. #19

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Stereo View Post
    I've noticed this and if there's no other kill capable evil aligned roles in the game, Town wins.

    Perhaps protecting unique Town Government roles eats a conversion? This doesn't stop the Mason Leader from committing suicide, but it does give cult a 1 night opportunity to convert Mayor if they feel so inclined.
    Yes! That would be one way of solving this issue
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkskater View Post
    Polish my nuts and serve me a milkshake. Anyone who uses scum syntax will be lynched.

  20. #20

    Re: Discussion: Cult

    Quote Originally Posted by Stereo View Post
    I've noticed this and if there's no other kill capable evil aligned roles in the game, Town wins.

    Perhaps protecting unique Town Government roles eats a conversion? This doesn't stop the Mason Leader from committing suicide, but it does give cult a 1 night opportunity to convert Mayor if they feel so inclined.
    then you give the mason leader a little bit (more) of an investigative ability. not sure that's the right approach

    FM XVII: Bonney Jewelry (Journalist)
    FM XVIII: Kalou (Savage Godfather)
    FM XX: Joseph Bertrand (Marshall)
    FM XXI: USA (Escort)
    FM XV: Whiskey (Whore)

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •