S-FM 207 Island Conflict

[Spruance]

Apparently, Spruance is the new Town leader? Too bad he's as good as dead having outed himself as the Town Killing role.

Not as good as dead as you lol

[MiniZed]

I don't think MiniZed has scum-slipped in the conventional way.

He just keeps talking like someone who isn't town under pressure, which thus makes him a steady scum-read even if he hasn't done anything that damning.

Tone Read?

[MiniZed]

Not as good as dead as you lol

Why do people give Spruance killing roles?

[Spruance]

Why do people give Spruance killing roles?

Why don't you answer my question

[Kovath]

Kovath, you'd better have some wall-post to explain why you're doing jack shit, pal.

Just ate dinner and have about 15 minutes before I have to pop out for several hours.

[DarknessB]

I don't think MiniZed has scum-slipped in the conventional way.

He just keeps talking like someone who isn't town under pressure, which thus makes him a steady scum-read even if he hasn't done anything that damning.

Sure, legitimate scum slips are extremely rare / almost unheard of. It takes something like Paladin referencing something that took place in a scum only chat to constitute a legitimate scum slip. That having been said, I agree that MiniZed seems allergic to pressure this game. I wasn't great so myself though, so I dunno if that is AI or just Unknown's normal playstyle. However, I don't recall making half the level of odd comments that he has though.

[Calix]

Your cockiness is irritating. Especially when you are wrong about me, and I assume Darkness as well.

That's my reasoning, not really expecting it.

If I'm lynched and I flip town, I seriously hope town doesn't overlook Calix and Simple Joy.

Cockiness is not a scum tell so who gives a fuck?

Again, state a proper scum-read on either of us or GTFO. Simple Joy actually posted - want to comment on those? Want to say how I am scum at all?

Tone Read?

I'm calling it gut, actually. Similar to Never Unlucky in Politico. Even though there wasn't anything overtly scummy with his posts, I had this uneasy feeling about him that made me keep pushing him.

[MiniZed]

Who are your biggest scum reads?

Kovath and Simple Joy were, but I like Kovath more now, if SimpleJoy is scum I'd lean towards Calix. If Simple Joy isn't scum then I'd probably say NU and Kovath. Just by the way they've taken advantage (mostly) of the lack of pressure and how they've been playing.

Kovath+Never Unlucky I'd really have to look over because that's just my glance at things right now.

Calix and Simple Joy is more probable.

[Calix]

So you know, I am going off precedent here.

[DarknessB]

Cockiness is not a scum tell so who gives a fuck?

Again, state a proper scum-read on either of us or GTFO. Simple Joy actually posted - want to comment on those? Want to say how I am scum at all?



I'm calling it gut, actually. Similar to Never Unlucky in Politico. Even though there wasn't anything overtly scummy with his posts, I had this uneasy feeling about him that made me keep pushing him.

You know, I actually prefer the gut Calix reads to the "based on a pile of minor points in quotes" Calix reads sometimes. At the very least, sometimes it's preferable to just make a psychological read vs. a textual one.

[Calix]

Kovath and Simple Joy were, but I like Kovath more now, if SimpleJoy is scum I'd lean towards Calix. If Simple Joy isn't scum then I'd probably say NU and Kovath. Just by the way they've taken advantage (mostly) of the lack of pressure and how they've been playing.

Kovath+Never Unlucky I'd really have to look over because that's just my glance at things right now.

Calix and Simple Joy is more probable.

Were you not criticising me for pre-flip associations earlier?

What has Kovath done that makes you more inclined to town-read him?

Why do you scum-read Simple Joy?

You say that Kovath, Simple Joy WERE your biggest scum-reads...what are your CURRENT scum-reads?

[MiniZed]

Cockiness is not a scum tell so who gives a fuck?

Again, state a proper scum-read on either of us or GTFO. Simple Joy actually posted - want to comment on those? Want to say how I am scum at all?



I'm calling it gut, actually. Similar to Never Unlucky in Politico. Even though there wasn't anything overtly scummy with his posts, I had this uneasy feeling about him that made me keep pushing him.

So Cockiness isn't a scum-tell but apparently picking at you is?

Simple Joy said close to nothing in his ISO other then quotes on NU he liked. I still find his play is hiding back while you somehow lead the town again to a MIS lynxh. The lack of contribution isn't JUST a PL though, especially at this point in the game in a 6v2v1. You completely disregarded this.

[DarknessB]

Kovath and Simple Joy were, but I like Kovath more now, if SimpleJoy is scum I'd lean towards Calix. If Simple Joy isn't scum then I'd probably say NU and Kovath. Just by the way they've taken advantage (mostly) of the lack of pressure and how they've been playing.

Kovath+Never Unlucky I'd really have to look over because that's just my glance at things right now.

Calix and Simple Joy is more probable.

LOL -- you'd make me pick between lynching you and lynching Kovath? Friggin' difficult choice...

[DarknessB]

LOL -- you'd make me pick between lynching you and lynching Kovath? Friggin' difficult choice...

Never mind -- I misread your post as your current scum reads. Why would you tell us about your past ones?

[MattZed]

-vote Kovath

I'm parking my vote here for now. The only part of this game I've read closely is D1, and I didn't like Kovath's approach. From my partial ISO on MiniZed, it seems the first 200-ish posts of this game were just Calix and Kovath digging into MiniZed for some pretty NAI stuff, namely choosing to use RP and having an OMGUS vote in RVS. MiniZed was given far more pressure than anyone in his position was warranted. I suspect Kovath was trying to set MiniZed up to flail, and to make himself look good for simply asking questions, even if those questions wouldn't lead to clues on alignment. I don't know why he's on the Joy train now, but being on today's biggest train, and having his train earlier die down, suggests to me that he's scum trying to defend himself by crucifying low-hanging fruit.

[Calix]

So Cockiness isn't a scum-tell but apparently picking at you is?

Simple Joy said close to nothing in his ISO other then quotes on NU he liked. I still find his play is hiding back while you somehow lead the town again to a MIS lynxh. The lack of contribution isn't JUST a PL though, especially at this point in the game in a 6v2v1. You completely disregarded this.

How are the two things (cockiness and picking at me) even remotely similar? This reeks of a "YOU TOO!" comment. Such a child.

Explain the scum motivation in what he has actually done please.

What? Are you seriously using contribution at this point in time to scum-read players, when Joy has made attempts to contribute?

Where did I disregard ANYTHING you've said?

[MiniZed]

Were you not criticising me for pre-flip associations earlier?

What has Kovath done that makes you more inclined to town-read him?

Why do you scum-read Simple Joy?

You say that Kovath, Simple Joy WERE your biggest scum-reads...what are your CURRENT scum-reads?

Criticizing you for commenting on others using pre-flip when you did it yourself.

I'll comment on his latest post and outline why in a bit.

Just recently stated in my first post, but his vote seems wrong and the lack of contribution tips me off.

I guess it's based on pre-flip associations. I'd say either way I tink Simple Joy is scum, but depending on what he flips really does impact my deiosion on you. There is A LOT on you so apologies if I haven't done a fead on you yet, this is partially laziness but I hate reading long posts because I get bored so I normally don't. I'm also busy a rough amount here and there.

[DarknessB]

-vote Kovath

I'm parking my vote here for now. The only part of this game I've read closely is D1, and I didn't like Kovath's approach. From my partial ISO on MiniZed, it seems the first 200-ish posts of this game were just Calix and Kovath digging into MiniZed for some pretty NAI stuff, namely choosing to use RP and having an OMGUS vote in RVS. MiniZed was given far more pressure than anyone in his position was warranted. I suspect Kovath was trying to set MiniZed up to flail, and to make himself look good for simply asking questions, even if those questions wouldn't lead to clues on alignment. I don't know why he's on the Joy train now, but being on today's biggest train, and having his train earlier die down, suggests to me that he's scum trying to defend himself by crucifying low-hanging fruit.

Holy shit, this just got interesting. Might be one of the first times I've ever been pleased to see a MattZed post...

[Calix]

Vote Count

Consolidated wagons...this is curious indeed

• MiniZed (3 [L-2]):
  Simple Joy, Spruance, Calix
  

  ---

  Simple Joy (3 [L-2]):
  Never Unlucky, Eggy, Kovath
  

  ---

  Kovath (2 [L-3]):
  DarknessB, MattZed

[Calix]

Criticizing you for commenting on others using pre-flip when you did it yourself.

I'll comment on his latest post and outline why in a bit.

Just recently stated in my first post, but his vote seems wrong and the lack of contribution tips me off.

I guess it's based on pre-flip associations. I'd say either way I tink Simple Joy is scum, but depending on what he flips really does impact my deiosion on you. There is A LOT on you so apologies if I haven't done a fead on you yet, this is partially laziness but I hate reading long posts because I get bored so I normally don't. I'm also busy a rough amount here and there.

No, my point was that you criticised me for using them, yet you are using them yourself, thus making you look like a hypocrite.

Contribution =/= alignment.

If you don't have an explanation for why he's scum outside of "doesn't contribute enough", I swear to fucking God.

You have evaded giving a read on me on MULTIPLE occasions and said "I don't care" when I asked you about it. Why the fuck did you keep doing that instead of just saying "lol lazy and too many posts" when I first brought it up? Looks like a cop-out to me.

You read Kovath and NU just fine but somehow I am too much for you to handle? Bullshit.

Oh, bringing in those RL excuses too now that we're getting serious. Scummy.

[MiniZed]

How are the two things (cockiness and picking at me) even remotely similar? This reeks of a "YOU TOO!" comment. Such a child.

Explain the scum motivation in what he has actually done please.

What? Are you seriously using contribution at this point in time to scum-read players, when Joy has made attempts to contribute?

Where did I disregard ANYTHING you've said?

I didn't say they were similar, but in the sense of neither of them seeming to be a scum tell IMO I don't get what you are getting at.

His vote, his lack of justification in his town-reads and the fact that he's been overtly silent and was signed for a replacement then claims "busy" as a liable claim. Don't replace if you are busy, that shouldn't be said.

He's said 5 posts, and yet they feel very empty. He made one post that shows slight effort, but other then that he hasn't shown effort. Unless I'm forgetting something.

You disregard the fact that Simple Joy has done very little, and seem to believe him to be a high contributor out of nowhere.

[Kovath]

Too much content recently to work on adequately, I'll catch up if I can get some time before I go to sleep, otherwise I'll do so tomorrow morning.

Off for now.

[MiniZed]

No, my point was that you criticised me for using them, yet you are using them yourself, thus making you look like a hypocrite.

Contribution =/= alignment.

If you don't have an explanation for why he's scum outside of "doesn't contribute enough", I swear to fucking God.

You have evaded giving a read on me on MULTIPLE occasions and said "I don't care" when I asked you about it. Why the fuck did you keep doing that instead of just saying "lol lazy and too many posts" when I first brought it up? Looks like a cop-out to me.

You read Kovath and NU just fine but somehow I am too much for you to handle? Bullshit.

Oh, bringing in those RL excuses too now that we're getting serious. Scummy.

Never said pre-flips were bad, I said you criticizing people for using them whe. You've done it yourself is bad.

Contribution doesn't, sure, but if you think that saying that is going to get people to contribute, you are highly mistaken.

I've said more, try reading. Other then that he's really given nothing else, which is a problem no?

Why would Me saying laziness be any better? If I don't want to it doesn't need to be justified another way.

They don't say as much, and usually I can find how I feel about them in certain posts. Not lying so this is a dumb argument.

Ooh vote me and see that my RL excuses aren't an excuse. Fuck you and your horrible reading skills.

[Calix]

I didn't say they were similar, but in the sense of neither of them seeming to be a scum tell IMO I don't get what you are getting at.

His vote, his lack of justification in his town-reads and the fact that he's been overtly silent and was signed for a replacement then claims "busy" as a liable claim. Don't replace if you are busy, that shouldn't be said.

He's said 5 posts, and yet they feel very empty. He made one post that shows slight effort, but other then that he hasn't shown effort. Unless I'm forgetting something.

You disregard the fact that Simple Joy has done very little, and seem to believe him to be a high contributor out of nowhere.

You compared the two of them by the way you worded it (you don't consider X scummy but Y is? = comparison), but now you are denying that you compared them?

Ah yes, let's see who Joy is voting...ah right, you. Funny, you seem to get touchy every time you get a vote. Sensitive, hun?

You just claimed 'busy' in your last post - don't sign up for games if you're busy ;) Again, you are using contribution to determine alignment when there isn't any indication that it's a scum tell.

Effort...also not AI.

Where the actual fuck did I call him a 'high contributor'? Quote the post or admit that you made a strawman out of my argument.

[Calix]

Never said pre-flips were bad, I said you criticizing people for using them whe. You've done it yourself is bad.

Contribution doesn't, sure, but if you think that saying that is going to get people to contribute, you are highly mistaken.

I've said more, try reading. Other then that he's really given nothing else, which is a problem no?

Why would Me saying laziness be any better? If I don't want to it doesn't need to be justified another way.

They don't say as much, and usually I can find how I feel about them in certain posts. Not lying so this is a dumb argument.

Ooh vote me and see that my RL excuses aren't an excuse. Fuck you and your horrible reading skills.

Again, that wasn't what I was arguing and your insistence on pushing this is just making you look worse.

My intentions with calling contribution levels NAI isn't to get people to contribute, so what about it?

Try explaining if you actually cared about getting people to follow you. Oh wait.

Show me where you've tried to prompt him into contributing more, please, otherwise your concerns over him 'not contributing' are empty.

Giving a full reads list and missing out one player (who got attacked by the mafia that night) is not something that can be dismissed and 100% deserves a justification.

Fuck you and your horrible defense and fake bravado, ooh!

[MiniZed]

You compared the two of them by the way you worded it (you don't consider X scummy but Y is? = comparison), but now you are denying that you compared them?

Ah yes, let's see who Joy is voting...ah right, you. Funny, you seem to get touchy every time you get a vote. Sensitive, hun?

You just claimed 'busy' in your last post - don't sign up for games if you're busy ;) Again, you are using contribution to determine alignment when there isn't any indication that it's a scum tell.

Effort...also not AI.

Where the actual fuck did I call him a 'high contributor'? Quote the post or admit that you made a strawman out of my argument.

That's not even the point of it. Why would I care enough to deny comparing it? I don't see why one would be considered scummy over the other one.

That was their second vote, and it was poorly justified. If you think it was justified, fine by me.

Sure, I'm busy, I'm still around enough to talk and contribute which is something you don't consider. I'm saying don't expect me to be around constantly.

When you say "he's shown effort" in as a defense towards him, you certainly think his contributions are worth something.

Didn't you just tell me Effort isn't AI by the way?

[MiniZed]

Again, that wasn't what I was arguing and your insistence on pushing this is just making you look worse.

My intentions with calling contribution levels NAI isn't to get people to contribute, so what about it?

Try explaining if you actually cared about getting people to follow you. Oh wait.

Show me where you've tried to prompt him into contributing more, please, otherwise your concerns over him 'not contributing' are empty.

Giving a full reads list and missing out one player (who got attacked by the mafia that night) is not something that can be dismissed and 100% deserves a justification.

Fuck you and your horrible defense and fake bravado, ooh!

You are saying I said pre-flips were bad, which is what you said. This is certainly what the argument is about.

Because why wouldn't you want someone who you think is town to contribute? What are you saying?

Because given its been mentioned a few times in the last few posts, if you aren't seeing it you just aren't reading.

Not him in particular because he isn't around! The one time he spoke was when I wasn't around, and when he came back he said something and left again.

Confirming yourself as "attacked by Mafia" when there is another plausible theory is really dumb. You can't confirm that if you are town, so just looks like you are trying to implement the idea that you are somehow confirmed.

It's not fake, but congratulations at "figuring it out"

[MattZed]

Too much content recently to work on adequately, I'll catch up if I can get some time before I go to sleep, otherwise I'll do so tomorrow morning.

Off for now.

Going off right when a train on you starts to build, really? We only have 20 hours of day left.

But when you get back, two questions:

• Why did you even bother asking MiniZed to explain his RV?
• Why are you so set on the Joy train now, even as you have Spruance, DarknessB, and Calix, players with various forms of mechanical clears/future clears, disagreeing with you?

[MiniZed]

Meh I don't see a point in continuing this, Calix is too manipulative and I feel as if stuff is being ignored/repeated. I've got stuff to do.

[Calix]

That's not even the point of it. Why would I care enough to deny comparing it? I don't see why one would be considered scummy over the other one.

That was their second vote, and it was poorly justified. If you think it was justified, fine by me.

Sure, I'm busy, I'm still around enough to talk and contribute which is something you don't consider. I'm saying don't expect me to be around constantly.

When you say "he's shown effort" in as a defense towards him, you certainly think his contributions are worth something.

Didn't you just tell me Effort isn't AI by the way?

I don't know. I'm not the person who compared the two and then denied it. Why can't picking on people be a scum tell? Why would cockiness being a scum tell necessarily mean that picking on people would also be considered one? Why do both have to either be scum tells or NAI, is my point.

Pretty sure Joy voted for you at the start of the day for potential (if incorrect) TMI.

Uh no, if you think it's a shit vote, explain to the rest of the class why it's shit.

You keep saying "something you don't consider" as if this automatically makes me look bad, lmao. You are also detracting from the main point which is that contribution isn't indicative of alignment. If you thought that, why did you not scum-read Gyrlander and Spruance on Day 1, hm? You null (slight-town lean) read one of them and town-read the second one.

Again, where did I say that...? I said "he's contributed, do you want to give comments on that?" which was in response to you scum-reading him for not contributing. Your explanation does NOT explain why you jumped to you thinking I said "high contributor"

Yes, did I stutter?

[Calix]

Meh I don't see a point in continuing this, Calix is too manipulative and I feel as if stuff is being ignored/repeated. I've got stuff to do.

Yes yes, keep throwing up baseless accusations that you cannot back up with evidence.

[MiniZed]

Yes yes, keep throwing up baseless accusations that you cannot back up with evidence.

Not. Even. True. I don't know if you seriously think you've caught a scum and your reads are just that bad, or if you are going all out so you can justify a miss lynch when the next day starts.

[Calix]

Not. Even. True. I don't know if you seriously think you've caught a scum and your reads are just that bad, or if you are going all out so you can justify a miss lynch when the next day starts.

You haven't explained how I am manipulative so my point holds.

You also haven't explained how those scummy non-town things you've said make sense for a town to say.

[MattZed]

Wait... when I signed on, there were like 9 people browsing the thread, most of them players in the game. Now it's just Calix and I? Where did everyone go? Everyone get scared off by the MiniZed-Calix feud?

[MiniZed]

You haven't explained how I am manipulative so my point holds.

You also haven't explained how those scummy non-town things you've said make sense for a town to say.

It doesn't make sense, it was a pick at you. There's generally nothing else to say about that.

[Calix]

It doesn't make sense, it was a pick at you. There's generally nothing else to say about that.

No no, a 'pick' would be similar to a discredit.

There's a difference between a discredit and then saying "well I don't really scum-read her but she's said plenty of scummy comments just like everyone else which I could find if I wanted to"

Your lack of a town motivation behind such a line (even admitting that "not everything I do is pro-town, wah") just makes me more convinced.

[MiniZed]

No no, a 'pick' would be similar to a discredit.

There's a difference between a discredit and then saying "well I don't really scum-read her but she's said plenty of scummy comments just like everyone else which I could find if I wanted to"

Your lack of a town motivation behind such a line (even admitting that "not everything I do is pro-town, wah") just makes me more convinced.

Essentially then you believe this is a slip. So you think I'm scum based on a slip.

Apparently everything I say has to be flawless.

[Calix]

Essentially then you believe this is a slip. So you think I'm scum based on a slip.

Apparently everything I say has to be flawless.

It's not a scum slip. It's just not something that town would say and you have done it on several different occasions. Difference.

You haven't explained why you said it and why we shouldn't scum-read you for it, but nice attempt with the sarcasm.

[MiniZed]

It's not a scum slip. It's just not something that town would say and you have done it on several different occasions. Difference.

You haven't explained why you said it and why we shouldn't scum-read you for it, but nice attempt with the sarcasm.

Well then I guess I'm starting a trend. I DID explain it and that it was to pick at you. Are you that stupid or are you just being ignorant.

Nah not even being sarcastic. My posts seem to be often described as slips way too often.

[Calix]

Well then I guess I'm starting a trend. I DID explain it and that it was to pick at you. Are you that stupid or are you just being ignorant.

Nah not even being sarcastic. My posts seem to be often described as slips way too often.

And the town motivation behind such a move is...what exactly?

"stupid or ignorant" - What was that about 'being too hostile' again? Have you dropped any scum motivations for me pushing you like this? Neither of those two things are AI, after all.

"Apparently everything I say has to be flawless."
"lol nice sarcasm you evasive SOB"
"Wasn't being sarcastic "

Legit

[MiniZed]

And the town motivation behind such a move is...what exactly?

"stupid or ignorant" - What was that about 'being too hostile' again? Have you dropped any scum motivations for me pushing you like this? Neither of those two things are AI, after all.

"Apparently everything I say has to be flawless."
"lol nice sarcasm you evasive SOB"
"Wasn't being sarcastic "

Legit

I've dropped respect and swapped to frustration at your reading skills.

Once again, I don't need to say town motivated posts constantly. Once again, people expect me to be flawless. I hope I'm lynched so people can see how misguided Calix is.

[Calix]

So MiniZed, heard you were scum-reading Simple Joy because he wasn't contributing enough.

Want to explain these posts, hm?

Yes, but this can be reversed. If you are throwing scum-reads on them because they aren't contributing, why would this make them anymore inclined to contribute? Look at MESK for example? She's literally done nothing since being pressured except say "I AM ALWAYS TOWN YOU ARE MAKING A MISTAKE".

Yes, not contributing is anti-town, Darkness. But at some point you need to realize:

1.) People naturally don't try.
2.) The number of people not trying are too high for all of them to be scum
3.) this one is specific to this situation. Most of us will be picked off. If we aren't, it suggests something. My point is that if we are scum, we will participate. If they are scum, they likely won't either way.

The only real way to put this is that using lurking/contribution shouldn't be a scum/town tell.

It's good to know you are giving free town points to whoever talks, if I was scum id be jumping for joy right now.

[Calix]

I've dropped respect and swapped to frustration at your reading skills.

Once again, I don't need to say town motivated posts constantly. Once again, people expect me to be flawless. I hope I'm lynched so people can see how misguided Calix is.

Nice to see that you've low-key abandoned that 'scum-read' of me once everyone else moved on.

[Eggy]

Im going to sleep Ill be back on in around 10 hours. I shouldnt have to say this but no one hammer early.

[MiniZed]

So MiniZed, heard you were scum-reading Simple Joy because he wasn't contributing enough.

Want to explain these posts, hm?

Good thing you went now out of all times to strengthen your argument in order to defend Simple Joy. Never seen you desperate, then again nobody really tries to argue with you.

1.) Believe it or not, at this point in the game if someone is not contributing, there's no reason to keep them around. MIS lynching here could bring us to a 3v2v1 (Gramted Darkness flips town and the Scum don't kill the neutral, I really do see why you are pushing this miss lynch so hard. You continue to try to discredit everything I've said even if it's early game just because you are defending SimpleJoy. It really makes me laugh to see you try this hard. Regardless, I've lost sympathy at this point in time for people who have not contributed.

No reason for me to suspect Simple Joy doesn't try, is there? That's the funny thing though, you are using a point as if you know they don't try. Pretty sure the only thing they said was they were busy IRL, so don't know why you are using this other then to larger your case against me. Your lucky you're good at debates.

Sure, and I still do believe this. My problem is that from the stuff they DID post, it has been useless and/or scummy. That vote for one thing, the really lazy reads list that doesn't explain or give us a feel, it goes along with the argument you use as "trying to seem helpful when they really aren't". The post shows that they have "contributed by giving input" but doesn't encourage conversation, doesn't ask questions, doesn't even comment on anything else and leaves. They left their first vote that they put on me very early with no new justification, and have said nothing new. Even the reasoning for the first vote was really stupid.

So there, I explained my points. I'm sure you've planned something already and are ready to refute these posts to win the debate. Unfortunately for you, you and Simple Joy have nothing to hide behind when I'm gone, so enjoy it.

-vote Simple Joy

On that note, may not be around for the rest of the day, so will plant my vote. If I get lynched please don't let terrible Calix get away with it.

[MiniZed]

Hi Kovath. I need to sleep soon, but I would love it if you had questions for me, if I can say something before I go I'll be happy.

[Kovath]

Going off right when a train on you starts to build, really? We only have 20 hours of day left.

But when you get back, two questions:

• Why did you even bother asking MiniZed to explain his RV?
• Why are you so set on the Joy train now, even as you have Spruance, DarknessB, and Calix, players with various forms of mechanical clears/future clears, disagreeing with you?

RL is RL, can't do anything about it. 20 hours is a long time and I've shown that I'm around and active - earlier in the day I was at L-2 and still posting in high quantities. That said though, I do have stuff tomorrow so I will do my best to be around and posting in the hours I can scrounge.

I've admitted that was a shitty meta-based point, but I don't think it was necessarily useless point to pursue at the time. Strictly speaking, the RV was a "???" followed by voting the person voting him, so questioning an OMGUS (as it seemed on the surface) was hardly a bad thing to do. The meta theorizing just got rolling after that.

I originally voted the Joy train as a pressure vote though I didn't characterize it as such for obvious reasons. I had early D1 suspicions about Gyrl and wanted to push the replacement for some contributions. The later incongruities in relation with Calix just made me adopt a stronger stance about extracting contribution from Simple.

Speaking of which, Simple's contribution was meager and a large part of the few posts made were just lashing back at DB. Not much to alignment read off, but my first instinct is townie tone, especially in the context of replacing into the game and the surrounding conversations during which Simple Joy was posting. Need to still hear more to solidify a read.

I need to work again through this fking though-chain mess that is Calix vs. MiniZed recently (a large part of which just read as posturing on my first skim).

[DarknessB]

Someone unvote please -- we should not be ending the day early.

[Kovath]

Hi Kovath. I need to sleep soon, but I would love it if you had questions for me, if I can say something before I go I'll be happy.

Thoughts on MattZed's posts so far, and how would you characterize your back and forth with Calix? I haven't dived back into yet but I want to know your (and hers as well, really) perception.

[Kovath]

-unvote